One of those perennial parenting problems is what do you do when the kids won't go to sleep in their bed? Or what do you do when the kids won't go to sleep and you are exhausted. The number one parenting hack that I have if you want to be a better parent is to get enough sleep, but sometimes the kids won't let you. Hello, this is doctor Justin Colson. Welcome to the Happy Families podcast Real parenting Solutions every day on Australia's most downloaded parenting podcast. I'm just on here with Kylie, my wife and mum to our six kids and Kylie. Every single Tuesday, we answer questions tricky questions on the pod. You can submit your questions via our super simple system at happy families dot com dot you. You just go to the website, scroll out of where it says podcasts and click the record button then start talking. It's really that easy. Or you can send us a voice memo to podcasts podcasts with an s at happy families dot com dot you. All Right, here we go. This is today's question comes through from an anonymous lista.

One of those perennial parenting problems is what do you do when the kids won't go to sleep in their bed? Or what do you do when the kids won't go to sleep and you are exhausted. The number one parenting hack that I have if you want to be a better parent is to get enough sleep, but sometimes the kids won't let you. Hello, this is doctor Justin Colson. Welcome to the Happy Families podcast Real parenting Solutions every day on Australia's most downloaded parenting podcast. I'm just on here with Kylie, my wife and mum to our six kids and Kylie. Every single Tuesday, we answer questions tricky questions on the pod. You can submit your questions via our super simple system at happy families dot com dot you. You just go to the website, scroll out of where it says podcasts and click the record button then start talking. It's really that easy. Or you can send us a voice memo to podcasts podcasts with an s at happy families dot com dot you. All Right, here we go. This is today's question comes through from an anonymous lista.

Hi Justin, thank you for all that you do for all the mamas and the papas out there. I was wondering if you could help me. I'm wondering at what age should I give up the bedtime fights. It has mostly felt like a power struggle every year, every night for years, and I feel like we're chasing them through all the steps, teeth get ready and into bed, lights out, and I feel more like we are micromanaging them, and it's not helping them gain independence and personal responsibility for their life and how their choices affect them, and so we are the bad guy when it's time to wake up or school is the problem, etc. But I don't want to swing in an extreme direction and give them full rain because I still strongly believe that dental health is important and getting enough sleep. But I do feel none of us are having evening routines we feel good about. And one challenge that we share is that they all have to stay in the same room. Sometimes we put one kid to bed in our bed and then move them later on, but it's not really ideal. My ideal goal would be they would be all going to bed in their own room. So thank you so much and take care, Kylie.

Hi Justin, thank you for all that you do for all the mamas and the papas out there. I was wondering if you could help me. I'm wondering at what age should I give up the bedtime fights. It has mostly felt like a power struggle every year, every night for years, and I feel like we're chasing them through all the steps, teeth get ready and into bed, lights out, and I feel more like we are micromanaging them, and it's not helping them gain independence and personal responsibility for their life and how their choices affect them, and so we are the bad guy when it's time to wake up or school is the problem, etc. But I don't want to swing in an extreme direction and give them full rain because I still strongly believe that dental health is important and getting enough sleep. But I do feel none of us are having evening routines we feel good about. And one challenge that we share is that they all have to stay in the same room. Sometimes we put one kid to bed in our bed and then move them later on, but it's not really ideal. My ideal goal would be they would be all going to bed in their own room. So thank you so much and take care, Kylie.

I love those two words. Not ideal. Doesn't that just describe everything when it comes to kids in sleep not ideal.

I love those two words. Not ideal. Doesn't that just describe everything when it comes to kids in sleep not ideal.

So she hasn't given us all the information. We don't know how many children are involved, we don't know how old they are, but the fact that she said they all share the same room would suggest that there's more than two. I could think, but one of them may go to sleep in her room. This is really tricky, and this is a challenge that we with six children and sometimes houses that are too small, we have had to deal with multiple times over.

So she hasn't given us all the information. We don't know how many children are involved, we don't know how old they are, but the fact that she said they all share the same room would suggest that there's more than two. I could think, but one of them may go to sleep in her room. This is really tricky, and this is a challenge that we with six children and sometimes houses that are too small, we have had to deal with multiple times over.

One of the things that I always want to say when questions come up about sleep and getting kids to go to sleep and on their own room, and that ideal that we have right, we want the kids to go into bed. We give them the kiss and the cuddle, sing the song, read them a story, say a prayer if you've got a religious background, and then you want to walk out of the room, close the door and breathe. You just want to get your life back and have an hour or two before you've got to hit the hay. Historically, when we look at things anthropologically, across cultures and across time I'm talking millennia, Humans until the last couple of hundred years have generally slept in groups. That's what mammals do. Look at puppy dogs, look at pretty much all mammals. They sleep in groups. And once we started to have ostentatious displays of wealth and build bigger houses, the children started to have their own room, and the more rooms you had, the more wealthier looked. And that's just become part of the culture now. Not necessarily about the wealth, but the kids sleeping in separate rooms, their own rooms, not with their siblings, or definitely not with parents. Now obviously in your case, the kids are supposed to be sleeping together, but they get r right up and they miss their parents and they want to be with you. So historically we're up against it. Biologically, DNA, we're up against it. Nevertheless, I think three principles can get us out of our fix. The first one, in a word, force creates resistance. Okay, that was three words, but you know what I mean. While we're trying to control the situation, we get a whole lot of resistance. And we've done that, we've been there. It doesn't work particularly well. We need to work with our kids.

One of the things that I always want to say when questions come up about sleep and getting kids to go to sleep and on their own room, and that ideal that we have right, we want the kids to go into bed. We give them the kiss and the cuddle, sing the song, read them a story, say a prayer if you've got a religious background, and then you want to walk out of the room, close the door and breathe. You just want to get your life back and have an hour or two before you've got to hit the hay. Historically, when we look at things anthropologically, across cultures and across time I'm talking millennia, Humans until the last couple of hundred years have generally slept in groups. That's what mammals do. Look at puppy dogs, look at pretty much all mammals. They sleep in groups. And once we started to have ostentatious displays of wealth and build bigger houses, the children started to have their own room, and the more rooms you had, the more wealthier looked. And that's just become part of the culture now. Not necessarily about the wealth, but the kids sleeping in separate rooms, their own rooms, not with their siblings, or definitely not with parents. Now obviously in your case, the kids are supposed to be sleeping together, but they get r right up and they miss their parents and they want to be with you. So historically we're up against it. Biologically, DNA, we're up against it. Nevertheless, I think three principles can get us out of our fix. The first one, in a word, force creates resistance. Okay, that was three words, but you know what I mean. While we're trying to control the situation, we get a whole lot of resistance. And we've done that, we've been there. It doesn't work particularly well. We need to work with our kids.

You can really hear it in this mom's voice. There's just an acknowledgement that they really have kind of got themselves into a bit of a rut. There's a bit of a vicious circle going on here. She feels like she's nagging, the kids don't respond, so that whole idea of her efforts to make them go to bed on time is falling on deaf ears and actually pushing and making it worse. And the biggest challenge we have is how do we break that cycle.

You can really hear it in this mom's voice. There's just an acknowledgement that they really have kind of got themselves into a bit of a rut. There's a bit of a vicious circle going on here. She feels like she's nagging, the kids don't respond, so that whole idea of her efforts to make them go to bed on time is falling on deaf ears and actually pushing and making it worse. And the biggest challenge we have is how do we break that cycle.

Your favorite answer whenever we talk about this is that we should all sit down and have a family meeting. Is is that where you're going?

Your favorite answer whenever we talk about this is that we should all sit down and have a family meeting. Is is that where you're going?

Yes? Maybe, if it's not a family meeting, it's a one on one with each child and sitting them down and asking them how they actually feel about night times, What do they love about nighttimes? What do they not love about nighttimes? How would they change it? Understanding what they want out of their experience will help you to navigate this challenge so much better.

Yes? Maybe, if it's not a family meeting, it's a one on one with each child and sitting them down and asking them how they actually feel about night times, What do they love about nighttimes? What do they not love about nighttimes? How would they change it? Understanding what they want out of their experience will help you to navigate this challenge so much better.

It'll do something else as well. Whether you have a family meeting you talk about what's working, what's not, and what we're going to work on this week, or whether you do one on ones, which I actually prefer in this situation. So I didn't quite get it right. What I like about either of those two options, though, is that your child now feels like, Oh, your children now feel like they have a voice. They feel like they're in the driver's see a little bit of their own lives, which means that as they say, well, we could do this or I'd like that, and as you start to work to warkards those as goals so long as their reasonable requests and expectations, what this means is the kids are going to buy into the direction that you're heading, You're much more likely to get a result. Giving them a voice is so powerful, so helpful.

It'll do something else as well. Whether you have a family meeting you talk about what's working, what's not, and what we're going to work on this week, or whether you do one on ones, which I actually prefer in this situation. So I didn't quite get it right. What I like about either of those two options, though, is that your child now feels like, Oh, your children now feel like they have a voice. They feel like they're in the driver's see a little bit of their own lives, which means that as they say, well, we could do this or I'd like that, and as you start to work to warkards those as goals so long as their reasonable requests and expectations, what this means is the kids are going to buy into the direction that you're heading, You're much more likely to get a result. Giving them a voice is so powerful, so helpful.

So the reality is if you've got a child in there who wants a ten thirty bedtime and they're five years old or even seven or eight years old, and it's completely not only inappropriate, but just not possible.

So the reality is if you've got a child in there who wants a ten thirty bedtime and they're five years old or even seven or eight years old, and it's completely not only inappropriate, but just not possible.

Yea're not going to happen.

Yea're not going to happen.

You can acknowledge that that would be awesome, wouldn't it if you could stay up every night?

You can acknowledge that that would be awesome, wouldn't it if you could stay up every night?

Yeah, give them in fantasy what they can't have in reality till ten thirty.

Yeah, give them in fantasy what they can't have in reality till ten thirty.

And you know, when you're a big boy, you can have that. But right now your body needs lots more sleep than that would give you. So what do you think would be a good bedtime.

And you know, when you're a big boy, you can have that. But right now your body needs lots more sleep than that would give you. So what do you think would be a good bedtime.

From time to time, I've had conversations with parents where I've said, just give them full freedom here and just say, so long as you get up on time, you can choose. And what most of those parents have told me dealing with kids from about five or six through to about fifteen or sixteen, is that the kids think it's wild and crazy for the first night or two, and by about day three or four they're pretty grumpy. In the house is not very nice. But by about day five or day six, the kids are like, I'm tired and I'm going to bed. Like they learned to regulate themselves. They just want to have a level of control after the break. Two more principles to help navigate the bedtime routine where everyone's going to sleep and the toothbrushing stuff. Okay, so force create's resistance. We want to give kids a voice. Kylie, my second principle, you put much better words around this than the words that I had for it. I just said, you got to do what it takes. I don't know if that's exactly what I meant. You said.

From time to time, I've had conversations with parents where I've said, just give them full freedom here and just say, so long as you get up on time, you can choose. And what most of those parents have told me dealing with kids from about five or six through to about fifteen or sixteen, is that the kids think it's wild and crazy for the first night or two, and by about day three or four they're pretty grumpy. In the house is not very nice. But by about day five or day six, the kids are like, I'm tired and I'm going to bed. Like they learned to regulate themselves. They just want to have a level of control after the break. Two more principles to help navigate the bedtime routine where everyone's going to sleep and the toothbrushing stuff. Okay, so force create's resistance. We want to give kids a voice. Kylie, my second principle, you put much better words around this than the words that I had for it. I just said, you got to do what it takes. I don't know if that's exactly what I meant. You said.

It's about a change in perspective.

It's about a change in perspective.

That's so much better than what I said.

That's so much better than what I said.

You know, I love those snuggles that you have with young children. And our grand baby she's eighteen months old, and every now and again I need to babysit her, and I have the pleasure of having to put her to sleep.

You know, I love those snuggles that you have with young children. And our grand baby she's eighteen months old, and every now and again I need to babysit her, and I have the pleasure of having to put her to sleep.

Not need to get to.

Not need to get to.

I get to, Yeah, I get to. And there is something just magical about having her fall asleep in my arms and not wanting to give that moment up for anything, to the point where you literally you're there like a still soldier, like a statue. Yeah, like a statue. You don't want anything to change in that moment, and you're like, I can't even breathe because if I breathe, maybe I'll wake her. I love that feeling. And the reality is that time goes so fast.

I get to, Yeah, I get to. And there is something just magical about having her fall asleep in my arms and not wanting to give that moment up for anything, to the point where you literally you're there like a still soldier, like a statue. Yeah, like a statue. You don't want anything to change in that moment, and you're like, I can't even breathe because if I breathe, maybe I'll wake her. I love that feeling. And the reality is that time goes so fast.

Yeah, you've got those adults forever.

Yeah, you've got those adults forever.

But before you know it, they're no longer small enough to be snuggled in your arms. And the reality is this time frame when they're young and they're just full of energy feels like you are running a marathon, and in lots of ways you are. Ye, but it's not going to last. And this is just such a small moment.

But before you know it, they're no longer small enough to be snuggled in your arms. And the reality is this time frame when they're young and they're just full of energy feels like you are running a marathon, and in lots of ways you are. Ye, but it's not going to last. And this is just such a small moment.

Don't you miss it?

Don't you miss it?

Though? I too, God, I do.

Though? I too, God, I do.

But when you're not going through it anymore and you're saying I miss it, and you say that to somebody who is going through it, they look at you and they're like, are you on drugs?

But when you're not going through it anymore and you're saying I miss it, and you say that to somebody who is going through it, they look at you and they're like, are you on drugs?

So let's paint a really clear picture. What we're saying we miss is the nights where I had to sleep on the floor with my hand squeezed through the cot railings so that I could pat my baby off to sleep because she just didn't want me to leave.

So let's paint a really clear picture. What we're saying we miss is the nights where I had to sleep on the floor with my hand squeezed through the cot railings so that I could pat my baby off to sleep because she just didn't want me to leave.

We both did that so many times, and I.

We both did that so many times, and I.

Would be there till midnight and then wake up and go, oh, yeah, I sick. Why am I still here?

Would be there till midnight and then wake up and go, oh, yeah, I sick. Why am I still here?

Or the nights where the baby goes to sleep or the child the six or seven year old goes to sleep, but then they come into our bedroom at two in the morning, and so I get out of the bed and I go sleep in their bed so they can sleep in bed with you, because I don't really care what bed I'm sleeping in so long as I'm sleeping, and I know if I take them back to bed, this might happen two or three more times, whereas I just go to their bed. Problem solved for everybody, right, It just it just works out.

Or the nights where the baby goes to sleep or the child the six or seven year old goes to sleep, but then they come into our bedroom at two in the morning, and so I get out of the bed and I go sleep in their bed so they can sleep in bed with you, because I don't really care what bed I'm sleeping in so long as I'm sleeping, and I know if I take them back to bed, this might happen two or three more times, whereas I just go to their bed. Problem solved for everybody, right, It just it just works out.

Better, and so the reality is twenty six years later, we're not doing that anymore. Yeah, but at the time it felt like a really really heavy load.

Better, and so the reality is twenty six years later, we're not doing that anymore. Yeah, but at the time it felt like a really really heavy load.

Is this ever going to end?

Is this ever going to end?

Yeah? So that idea of changing perspective is just a recognition that this is just a season.

Yeah? So that idea of changing perspective is just a recognition that this is just a season.

You say, change perspective, I say, do what it takes.

You say, change perspective, I say, do what it takes.

And one day you'll look back and realize just how small a moment in time it really was.

And one day you'll look back and realize just how small a moment in time it really was.

I want to summarize with some practical stuff here, Okay, because a lot of that's theoretical. As a parent, maybe you take one child and the other parent takes the other child. If you're doing it on your own, you get a big sibling to help. If one child wants to sleep in one bed, you let them and you sleep in the other bed, or you let them sleep in your bed and then you sneak out and sleep into their bed when the three of them are all sleeping in your bed, like you just do what it takes. That's really what I'm getting at. You're highlighting when you change your mindset and see it as something that you're going to miss one day and you just work on it, know that this too will pass. That's kind of the conglomeration, the practical conglomeration of the prince boy trying to share here, and that's kind of all we've got for the bedtime routine sort of thing. There was only one other thing that came up in this question, and that revolved around toothbrushing.

I want to summarize with some practical stuff here, Okay, because a lot of that's theoretical. As a parent, maybe you take one child and the other parent takes the other child. If you're doing it on your own, you get a big sibling to help. If one child wants to sleep in one bed, you let them and you sleep in the other bed, or you let them sleep in your bed and then you sneak out and sleep into their bed when the three of them are all sleeping in your bed, like you just do what it takes. That's really what I'm getting at. You're highlighting when you change your mindset and see it as something that you're going to miss one day and you just work on it, know that this too will pass. That's kind of the conglomeration, the practical conglomeration of the prince boy trying to share here, and that's kind of all we've got for the bedtime routine sort of thing. There was only one other thing that came up in this question, and that revolved around toothbrushing.

Dental hygienes. Important.

Dental hygienes. Important.

It is, It matters, and you're right to say that the kids need to brush their teeth otherwise they get gum disease their teeth. Just the whole lot is gross. It's gross, furry teeth. It wants it. I only have one thing to say on this, and that is that if your children are under about the age of eight, you really need to be involved in doing the toothbrushing full stop and a story. Dentists recommend that parents help their children brush their teeth until the age of eight. If they won't do it, you could say, brush your teeth and I'll give you a LOLLI. That was a joke. I'm so glad, so glad you love because that's the funny bit, right, because you've just brush your teeth and then you put some sugar in you. No, don't bribe them, you just you just say, hey, guys, this is what we do. Okay, maybe maybe.

It is, It matters, and you're right to say that the kids need to brush their teeth otherwise they get gum disease their teeth. Just the whole lot is gross. It's gross, furry teeth. It wants it. I only have one thing to say on this, and that is that if your children are under about the age of eight, you really need to be involved in doing the toothbrushing full stop and a story. Dentists recommend that parents help their children brush their teeth until the age of eight. If they won't do it, you could say, brush your teeth and I'll give you a LOLLI. That was a joke. I'm so glad, so glad you love because that's the funny bit, right, because you've just brush your teeth and then you put some sugar in you. No, don't bribe them, you just you just say, hey, guys, this is what we do. Okay, maybe maybe.

Those electrical toothbrushes work to treat without kids love those, yeah, or you've just got a two minute timeerer on them. They know what they've got to do and they can't stop brushing until their toothbrush turns off.

Those electrical toothbrushes work to treat without kids love those, yeah, or you've just got a two minute timeerer on them. They know what they've got to do and they can't stop brushing until their toothbrush turns off.

You just take them to the dentist and get the dentist to explain the importance of it as well, so that you're not the authority figure here and you're just doing what the dentist said. That can be helpful as well.

You just take them to the dentist and get the dentist to explain the importance of it as well, so that you're not the authority figure here and you're just doing what the dentist said. That can be helpful as well.

Ge.

Ge.

We really hope that was helpful, and that's it. That's our very best answer to help in these tricky situations. If you've got a tricky question, we love answering them every Tuesday on the podcast. Send us a voice note to podcasts at Happy Families dot com dot you or visit the website scroll down to where it says podcasts, click the record button and leave us a message. We'd love to know what your name is, and we're sending the message from as well. That always feels next. We just we like you. We want to know more about you. The Happy Families podcast is produced by Justin Roland from Bridge Media for more information and more resources about making your family happier, visit us at happy families dot com, dot you

We really hope that was helpful, and that's it. That's our very best answer to help in these tricky situations. If you've got a tricky question, we love answering them every Tuesday on the podcast. Send us a voice note to podcasts at Happy Families dot com dot you or visit the website scroll down to where it says podcasts, click the record button and leave us a message. We'd love to know what your name is, and we're sending the message from as well. That always feels next. We just we like you. We want to know more about you. The Happy Families podcast is produced by Justin Roland from Bridge Media for more information and more resources about making your family happier, visit us at happy families dot com, dot you