Hello and welcome to Pit Talk, a Fox Sports and Speed Cafe Formula one podcast. On today's episode, the final for the season, Sergio Perez is out of Formula One, with Liam Lawson promoted from RB to take his place alongside Max Verstappen. In twenty twenty five and we award the most prestigious prize in all motorsports, the Pit Talk Alternative Championship. My name is Michael Lomonado, motorspord writer for Fox Sports Australia. It's great to have your company and the company of my co host from Speed Cafe. You can call it racing balls if you like, but to him, it will always be Minardi. It's Matt Kosh.

Hello and welcome to Pit Talk, a Fox Sports and Speed Cafe Formula one podcast. On today's episode, the final for the season, Sergio Perez is out of Formula One, with Liam Lawson promoted from RB to take his place alongside Max Verstappen. In twenty twenty five and we award the most prestigious prize in all motorsports, the Pit Talk Alternative Championship. My name is Michael Lomonado, motorspord writer for Fox Sports Australia. It's great to have your company and the company of my co host from Speed Cafe. You can call it racing balls if you like, but to him, it will always be Minardi. It's Matt Kosh.

It will always be Minardi. It's fact founded by Gen Klomonardi, based in Fayanza. It's an Italian team. You can put whatever color jeans you like on them, but yeah, it will always be Minardi and all forever long for the days we have Johnny Moore, Bedelli and Taso Marquez. I mean, Gaston Mezkane. How can you go past the goliaths of Formula one qualifying. I'm not sure he ever did.

It will always be Minardi. It's fact founded by Gen Klomonardi, based in Fayanza. It's an Italian team. You can put whatever color jeans you like on them, but yeah, it will always be Minardi and all forever long for the days we have Johnny Moore, Bedelli and Taso Marquez. I mean, Gaston Mezkane. How can you go past the goliaths of Formula one qualifying. I'm not sure he ever did.

Qualify, but if he did, it would have been great.

Qualify, but if he did, it would have been great.

He was, he was I think it was Actually it was Argentinian.

He was, he was I think it was Actually it was Argentinian.

Yes, he was the last Argentine to have raced before Franco Colobinto.

Yes, he was the last Argentine to have raced before Franco Colobinto.

There you go. So you know, dizzying height reached.

There you go. So you know, dizzying height reached.

Historic, historic, and forever we'll be Maybe we should just make a rule now forever we'll be referred to as Minardi from now on, regardless of what happens to the team name, because I'm sure there are many more team name changes in that team's future, considering how many they've had in the last four or five years. It's been a big week in Formula One News will of course get to the topic of the week, Sergio Peris, Liam Lawson and the final red bull seats on the twenty twenty five driver market in just a moment, but let's wrap up what have been some of the more minor stories since the Abu Dhabi Grand Prix and Matt. Let's start with Valtrie Botas and Honor Area Australian, because both he and Mercedes had confirmed what had long beat expected that he will return to brack is the team third driver for twenty twenty five, ahead of an attempted return in twenty twenty six.

Historic, historic, and forever we'll be Maybe we should just make a rule now forever we'll be referred to as Minardi from now on, regardless of what happens to the team name, because I'm sure there are many more team name changes in that team's future, considering how many they've had in the last four or five years. It's been a big week in Formula One News will of course get to the topic of the week, Sergio Peris, Liam Lawson and the final red bull seats on the twenty twenty five driver market in just a moment, but let's wrap up what have been some of the more minor stories since the Abu Dhabi Grand Prix and Matt. Let's start with Valtrie Botas and Honor Area Australian, because both he and Mercedes had confirmed what had long beat expected that he will return to brack is the team third driver for twenty twenty five, ahead of an attempted return in twenty twenty six.

The Mullet and the murk like that. It's yeah, it makes a lot of sense as well. You've got George Russell, who's got a bit of experience but isn't isn't a championship contender. You know, he's never been through that process. You've got a young drive and killing Kimmy Antonelli. You've got then their third driver in Voucheri Botas, who has that experience, knows a team can jump in and do the job if he's ever needed to, so he takes a lot of boxes there. I think that they probably weren't getting from someone like Fred Vesti or or some of the other cats they had footing around, So that makes a lot of sense. But it also just keeps Voucheri's foot in the door for potentially Cadillac or something down the track, although I suspect we might see Sergio end up there.

The Mullet and the murk like that. It's yeah, it makes a lot of sense as well. You've got George Russell, who's got a bit of experience but isn't isn't a championship contender. You know, he's never been through that process. You've got a young drive and killing Kimmy Antonelli. You've got then their third driver in Voucheri Botas, who has that experience, knows a team can jump in and do the job if he's ever needed to, so he takes a lot of boxes there. I think that they probably weren't getting from someone like Fred Vesti or or some of the other cats they had footing around, So that makes a lot of sense. But it also just keeps Voucheri's foot in the door for potentially Cadillac or something down the track, although I suspect we might see Sergio end up there.

Well, it worked well for Mick Schumacher, didn't it pathwell trodden me.

Well, it worked well for Mick Schumacher, didn't it pathwell trodden me.

Well forever Grojeon in fairness and Treddie Racing, having secured an in principle entry to the sport in twenty twenty.

Well forever Grojeon in fairness and Treddie Racing, having secured an in principle entry to the sport in twenty twenty.

Six, has secured Ferrari power units to bridge the gap between its first season and whenever General Motors debuts its first engine at the end of the decade. That's for the press release, and it's also changed its name officially to Cadillac Formula Racing.

Six, has secured Ferrari power units to bridge the gap between its first season and whenever General Motors debuts its first engine at the end of the decade. That's for the press release, and it's also changed its name officially to Cadillac Formula Racing.

This is all to do with the F one entry and all sorts of legal rights that come along with that, because what's happening behind the scenes at the moment is discussing how they formally bring that team into the sport because entries to Formula one don't yet open until for twenty twenty six. Don't you open until sort of mid December next year, so you've got that delay. Then there's also the concord, so they can't actually sign anything to say yes, we're going to enter. So Nita Current was some sort of pre agreement. To have that pre agreement, you have to have all the business names and stuff in order, so it's just admin on the back end of that. But there's lots and lots happening behind the scenes. It's all just it's all very boring and less. You're an accountant and me.

This is all to do with the F one entry and all sorts of legal rights that come along with that, because what's happening behind the scenes at the moment is discussing how they formally bring that team into the sport because entries to Formula one don't yet open until for twenty twenty six. Don't you open until sort of mid December next year, so you've got that delay. Then there's also the concord, so they can't actually sign anything to say yes, we're going to enter. So Nita Current was some sort of pre agreement. To have that pre agreement, you have to have all the business names and stuff in order, so it's just admin on the back end of that. But there's lots and lots happening behind the scenes. It's all just it's all very boring and less. You're an accountant and me.

Maybe an account is a previous life. Let's go over two fians to Minati, where RB has confirmed it will be known as Racing Bulls from next year. Walking back, it's controversially bland RB monica that it used only for this season. That's per the twenty twenty five entry lists published by the FIA recently.

Maybe an account is a previous life. Let's go over two fians to Minati, where RB has confirmed it will be known as Racing Bulls from next year. Walking back, it's controversially bland RB monica that it used only for this season. That's per the twenty twenty five entry lists published by the FIA recently.

The stupid thing is internally the team always referred to itself as Racing Balls. You had the team trying to push this v CARB thing that no one used, even to the point where I remember sitting down and doing an interview with someone at Red Bull and I asked a question about RB, and the comms person Jompeding and said, no, no VCARB, no RB. But they even I mean they had a logo registered as a trademark that had the website URL. All this stuff came out over twelve months ago. And then we get to the entry listeners. Are RB brilliant. It's a meaningless acronym for racing balls. Has some heritage as well. It sort of refers B back to some of the playing collection that dietrich Manaship's collected, the Fighting Bulls, so it's the Racing Bulls to sort of draw parallels with that. So there was some logic and reasoning behind it that made some sense, and then they just completely screwed up the marketing and sale of it, trying to give too much coverage to Visa and cash App. I now expect payment from them for that coverage because yeah, it was just dumb, wasn't it. So three was just the third, fourth, fifth different name in about five years. It was Minarti, Toro Rosso, Alpha Tawi RB Racent was his number five.

The stupid thing is internally the team always referred to itself as Racing Balls. You had the team trying to push this v CARB thing that no one used, even to the point where I remember sitting down and doing an interview with someone at Red Bull and I asked a question about RB, and the comms person Jompeding and said, no, no VCARB, no RB. But they even I mean they had a logo registered as a trademark that had the website URL. All this stuff came out over twelve months ago. And then we get to the entry listeners. Are RB brilliant. It's a meaningless acronym for racing balls. Has some heritage as well. It sort of refers B back to some of the playing collection that dietrich Manaship's collected, the Fighting Bulls, so it's the Racing Bulls to sort of draw parallels with that. So there was some logic and reasoning behind it that made some sense, and then they just completely screwed up the marketing and sale of it, trying to give too much coverage to Visa and cash App. I now expect payment from them for that coverage because yeah, it was just dumb, wasn't it. So three was just the third, fourth, fifth different name in about five years. It was Minarti, Toro Rosso, Alpha Tawi RB Racent was his number five.

Yes, when was Alpha Tawi twenty twenty?

Yes, when was Alpha Tawi twenty twenty?

Yeah, I reckon that was twenty. Yeah, so it.

Yeah, I reckon that was twenty. Yeah, so it.

Would be three in four years pretty much three and five years. So it's not great, not stable, I think for me, the most difficult part was when they launched RB and CEO Peter Bier said, no, no, it doesn't stand for racing balls. It stands for Red Bull, like that other team we've got cover on.

Would be three in four years pretty much three and five years. So it's not great, not stable, I think for me, the most difficult part was when they launched RB and CEO Peter Bier said, no, no, it doesn't stand for racing balls. It stands for Red Bull, like that other team we've got cover on.

What is this all about, like Ibleipstitch the football team.

What is this all about, like Ibleipstitch the football team.

Yeah, it's just a bit of a mess. At least it's at least that's a name. Now I suppose it on an acronym, but anyway, look, we'll figure out. I guess people will understand how they feel about it once we start using it next year, changing tach completely coinciding with the FIA Prize giving Gala in Rwanda last week. Obviously the inferior prize giving Gala the one that's coming up later in this podcast. The country's president, Paul Kagame, is officially confirmed that the country is bidding to join the calendar with a purpose built circuit outside the capitol Kirgali, which is well would be represent Formul one's return to Africa if this does get off the ground for the first time in decades.

Yeah, it's just a bit of a mess. At least it's at least that's a name. Now I suppose it on an acronym, but anyway, look, we'll figure out. I guess people will understand how they feel about it once we start using it next year, changing tach completely coinciding with the FIA Prize giving Gala in Rwanda last week. Obviously the inferior prize giving Gala the one that's coming up later in this podcast. The country's president, Paul Kagame, is officially confirmed that the country is bidding to join the calendar with a purpose built circuit outside the capitol Kirgali, which is well would be represent Formul one's return to Africa if this does get off the ground for the first time in decades.

And meanwhile, South Africa has done exactly the same thing with the announcement of the formation of a steering committee to host a Grand Prix from twenty twenty seven. So you've now got these two African nations vying for Formula one. It'll go to Rwanda. I'm in the process of writing a story explaining exactly why that will happen. But there's some strong business logic behind the rwand and Grand Prix that you may may not agree with the ethics of, but it's there. Meanwhile, the South African Grand Prix seems to be basically Lewis Hamilton said it'd be a good idea, so it must be. I think there's the entire business case, and there's plants, got great kay Lame and all sorts of stuff to grade one so I could host it. But yeah, they are one to Grand Prix. Don't be surprised if that gets announced. Keep an eye I don't know if I saw it be life by the time the podcast goes live, but keep an eye out for my store and speed Cafe for that because it does go into some of the business side of it, behind it all, and the logic behind it. And there is a strong degree of logic there.

And meanwhile, South Africa has done exactly the same thing with the announcement of the formation of a steering committee to host a Grand Prix from twenty twenty seven. So you've now got these two African nations vying for Formula one. It'll go to Rwanda. I'm in the process of writing a story explaining exactly why that will happen. But there's some strong business logic behind the rwand and Grand Prix that you may may not agree with the ethics of, but it's there. Meanwhile, the South African Grand Prix seems to be basically Lewis Hamilton said it'd be a good idea, so it must be. I think there's the entire business case, and there's plants, got great kay Lame and all sorts of stuff to grade one so I could host it. But yeah, they are one to Grand Prix. Don't be surprised if that gets announced. Keep an eye I don't know if I saw it be life by the time the podcast goes live, but keep an eye out for my store and speed Cafe for that because it does go into some of the business side of it, behind it all, and the logic behind it. And there is a strong degree of logic there.

And I mean at the end of the day, it has what every modern circuit really needs, which is public backing. If it doesn't have some big billionaire, if it's been backed by the president.

And I mean at the end of the day, it has what every modern circuit really needs, which is public backing. If it doesn't have some big billionaire, if it's been backed by the president.

I thought you were going to say, uninspiring desert surrounding it.

I thought you were going to say, uninspiring desert surrounding it.

Well, that's also pretty crucial, as we've learned from And we all look forward to the kidious to join the calendar in the well.

Well, that's also pretty crucial, as we've learned from And we all look forward to the kidious to join the calendar in the well.

Will it be at night? That's my next question, it.

Will it be at night? That's my next question, it.

Asked to me obviously, because you want to what you wouldn't want it to look too different to all the other race tracks, would you by running the day? So we all looked forward to that one. And finally let's conclude with Carlos Science and Ferrari because they've made farewell to each other with the track date Furana a Furano with Carlos Science and Carlos Science of course Senior and Junior cutting laps around the track in the F one seventy five, the team's twenty twenty two cars A. I think this is his final big public official engagement as a Ferrari driver.

Asked to me obviously, because you want to what you wouldn't want it to look too different to all the other race tracks, would you by running the day? So we all looked forward to that one. And finally let's conclude with Carlos Science and Ferrari because they've made farewell to each other with the track date Furana a Furano with Carlos Science and Carlos Science of course Senior and Junior cutting laps around the track in the F one seventy five, the team's twenty twenty two cars A. I think this is his final big public official engagement as a Ferrari driver.

This made me realize that for I really missed a tricky because they've got a bit of a two for one deal by signing Carlos Science, didn't they Yeah, they could have just rotated them through and paid them meet half the money. It's like a free reserve driver, don't even have to change the stickers on the car. But a seriousness this was minder setting is that Fred Besser tem Princi will sort of put this to Carlo Si Senior. It was Vesso's initiative. And how cool would it be your dad's a motorsport legend to jump on track with your dad turn a few laps in a Ferrari at its home track. I just have some fun, no pressure, no expectation, just go out there and have some unabashed fund. I think that sounds like a bloody good idea. I love the video, I love some of the radio exchanges that we've heard. It's just a good wholesome way when they've really shafted Carlo.

This made me realize that for I really missed a tricky because they've got a bit of a two for one deal by signing Carlos Science, didn't they Yeah, they could have just rotated them through and paid them meet half the money. It's like a free reserve driver, don't even have to change the stickers on the car. But a seriousness this was minder setting is that Fred Besser tem Princi will sort of put this to Carlo Si Senior. It was Vesso's initiative. And how cool would it be your dad's a motorsport legend to jump on track with your dad turn a few laps in a Ferrari at its home track. I just have some fun, no pressure, no expectation, just go out there and have some unabashed fund. I think that sounds like a bloody good idea. I love the video, I love some of the radio exchanges that we've heard. It's just a good wholesome way when they've really shafted Carlo.

Just a good wholesome way to end. On's a pretty disappointing in the relationship. Leave it on a somewhat positive note. At least his ending on a positive note is Carlos science in a weird way. The ending of Sergio Pairs at Red Bull Racing a little bit more complicated, certainly a little bit messier, but it has been confirmed at least a week and a bit nearly two weeks after the season ending race in Abu Dhabi, the Sergio Pairs will not be racing for Red Bull Racing in twenty twenty five. Depending on whose press release and comments you'd want to believe, he's either decided he wants to sabbatical or he's taken the money and walked. I guess in between there you could kind of see both of them being accurate, because he's chosen to walk because he's been paid off. But in any case, it's clear that Red Bull Racing has not wanted him there for a little while now, and he will be replaced by Liam Lawson with all eleven Grand Prix of experience under his belt across two seasons, of course, and he'll be the least experienced Red Bull Racing driver since vid Antonio Liuzzi made his debut for the team in two thousand and five, and then after him Robert Dornboss. It's not an interesting that, isn't it something we all have seen coming now for I don't know a month or so, maybe more, but it's now finally been confirmed, and like, well, let's out with Surjo Paris before we talk about the Liam Lawson angle. In fact, let's give him his due. I suppose disappointing way for him to end his Red Bull Racing career, but I think there's at least some sincerity. Dare I say it in the team's comments that he has been a valuable member of that team for three of the four seasons. At least he has contributed to constructors championships and at least to one driver's championship in twenty two. So how do you think, in totality will reflect on Paris's career at Rebel Racing.

Just a good wholesome way to end. On's a pretty disappointing in the relationship. Leave it on a somewhat positive note. At least his ending on a positive note is Carlos science in a weird way. The ending of Sergio Pairs at Red Bull Racing a little bit more complicated, certainly a little bit messier, but it has been confirmed at least a week and a bit nearly two weeks after the season ending race in Abu Dhabi, the Sergio Pairs will not be racing for Red Bull Racing in twenty twenty five. Depending on whose press release and comments you'd want to believe, he's either decided he wants to sabbatical or he's taken the money and walked. I guess in between there you could kind of see both of them being accurate, because he's chosen to walk because he's been paid off. But in any case, it's clear that Red Bull Racing has not wanted him there for a little while now, and he will be replaced by Liam Lawson with all eleven Grand Prix of experience under his belt across two seasons, of course, and he'll be the least experienced Red Bull Racing driver since vid Antonio Liuzzi made his debut for the team in two thousand and five, and then after him Robert Dornboss. It's not an interesting that, isn't it something we all have seen coming now for I don't know a month or so, maybe more, but it's now finally been confirmed, and like, well, let's out with Surjo Paris before we talk about the Liam Lawson angle. In fact, let's give him his due. I suppose disappointing way for him to end his Red Bull Racing career, but I think there's at least some sincerity. Dare I say it in the team's comments that he has been a valuable member of that team for three of the four seasons. At least he has contributed to constructors championships and at least to one driver's championship in twenty two. So how do you think, in totality will reflect on Paris's career at Rebel Racing.

I think he was solid enough obviously twenty twenty four didn't get a plan. There was a wobble in twenty three as well, which he was able to recover from. But we've got to put almost this year to the side a little bit like we did Daniel Riccardo sort of from when he left Reno. You know, he's almost sort of two careers, like the Michael Schumacher return thing compartmentalized twenty twenty four and look at the first three years, and he was pretty solid. He helped the team win constructive championships, finished second in the championship himself, giving Red Bull its first one to two in that competition in its history. That's a pretty good thing given that, you know, Mark Webber wasn't able to do that obviously, Daniel Ricardo and said, we weren't able to do that because the car just wasn't there to win championship. So that's that's quite an achievement to finish second, you know, to get to a Formula one I've said this before, you have to be a phenomenally good racing driver to then finish as the next best guy in the championship. Yes, he had a significant car advantage, but you still have to be able to maximize that, and he did enough so I think from that element alone, we should reflect kindly on his career and his time at Rebelm more specifically. But the big point that everyone is forgetting is let's go back six seven years. It was about twenty seventeen, twenty eighteen something like that. He saved seventeen what is now Astamat the Force India had gone bust. He put it into administration and doing so, he saved four hundred people's jobs. That's you know, yes, he was out of the job himself effectively, but he saved four hundred people's jobs, four hundred people who were far less well off than his. That deserves to be applauded massively because he didn't have to do that. He could let the team sink, but he didn't know. I thought that that was extraordinary. He's a six time Grand Prix winner. You know, that's a pretty bloody good career. There are world champions who have won less Grand Prix than Sergio Perez, so let's keep it in active. Twenty twenty four didn't go to plan, but everything up to that point was pretty positive, I think for Sergio.

I think he was solid enough obviously twenty twenty four didn't get a plan. There was a wobble in twenty three as well, which he was able to recover from. But we've got to put almost this year to the side a little bit like we did Daniel Riccardo sort of from when he left Reno. You know, he's almost sort of two careers, like the Michael Schumacher return thing compartmentalized twenty twenty four and look at the first three years, and he was pretty solid. He helped the team win constructive championships, finished second in the championship himself, giving Red Bull its first one to two in that competition in its history. That's a pretty good thing given that, you know, Mark Webber wasn't able to do that obviously, Daniel Ricardo and said, we weren't able to do that because the car just wasn't there to win championship. So that's that's quite an achievement to finish second, you know, to get to a Formula one I've said this before, you have to be a phenomenally good racing driver to then finish as the next best guy in the championship. Yes, he had a significant car advantage, but you still have to be able to maximize that, and he did enough so I think from that element alone, we should reflect kindly on his career and his time at Rebelm more specifically. But the big point that everyone is forgetting is let's go back six seven years. It was about twenty seventeen, twenty eighteen something like that. He saved seventeen what is now Astamat the Force India had gone bust. He put it into administration and doing so, he saved four hundred people's jobs. That's you know, yes, he was out of the job himself effectively, but he saved four hundred people's jobs, four hundred people who were far less well off than his. That deserves to be applauded massively because he didn't have to do that. He could let the team sink, but he didn't know. I thought that that was extraordinary. He's a six time Grand Prix winner. You know, that's a pretty bloody good career. There are world champions who have won less Grand Prix than Sergio Perez, so let's keep it in active. Twenty twenty four didn't go to plan, but everything up to that point was pretty positive, I think for Sergio.

And I think what it demonstrates is actually, I mean, obviously he to use a phrase that's in vogue now in Formula one, probably exceeded his shelf life at Red Bull Racing, But I think that reflects a bigger story really, which is he was originally brought into Red Bull Racing essentially as a stop gap solution. He wasn't meant to be a permanent, long term driver, who was meant to be there, arguably for as little as a year or a couple of years, let's call it a nice round three seasons, and for three seasons he was productive enough to use that word again enough In twenty twenty one, his contribution in Abu Dhabi won Max for staff and the Driver's Championship. I think that's something people sometimes also gloss over the fact that the only reason Lewis Hamilton was in a not totally dominant position when that safety car came out was because of that battle with Sergio Peris in the middle of the race. In twenty twenty two, he did enough to win the Contructor Championship, and then twenty twenty three, as he said, he got that one too with the team, which had never before been achieved. So despite those form slumps that occurred in all of those seasons to worsening degrees as we went on, made a meaningful contribution over three years when the team wasn't convinced that had an alternative to him, did the job year four. However, when you know, logically in a cycle this long, you would expect a team to have its ups and downs, as Red Bull Racing has had. Probably they didn't expect to have such a down this year after the up of last year, but was found to not be enough for a team at the very front of a very competitive field this year. You know, we had thought we're by many metrics, the most competitive season ever in Formula One, by a number of winners one twos, by team four teams competing for victories, all that kind of thing. And I think it just shows and this is maybe the broader picture at Red Bull Racing, that that in decision over its driver lineup, its lack of security over how it wants to use its four cars, over its driver program that in some respects has been superseded by the more targeted driver programs of rival teams that are all picking up some of the most talented drivers of the next generation. It's all been found to be wanting and Sergio pei Is being in the car for this fourth season and having secured a contract for a fifth and a sixth theoretically just shows actually that there's a bigger problem Red Bull Racing has had to address in allowing him to fundamentally overstay his welcome, which I guess kind of brings us to Liam Lawson. I don't want to tar Leeham Lawson with all of the problems Red Bull Racing has had, because he deserves he's shot in Formula One, and he's clearly shown that he's probably quick enough to warrant a shot at the front, even if it's after only eleven Grand Prix over two seasons. But Red Bulls kind of ended up with a solution that I'm not sure anyone's really one hundred percent convinced by, are they, Because not only does it mean Lean Lawson's going to Red Bull Racing, I mean that means Yuki Snod is not going to Red Bull Racing because despite them renewing his contract earlier this year, unilaterally have chosen not to put him at the senior team, which is kind of like, what's the point of being at the junior team? It's going to be Isaac Kadjabin RB. But the team, no one really seems that convinced by him either. You know, they've spoken about him twice really, and it's both of his FP one sessions, and at neither opportunity they really say anything super positive. And that's no slight against him. It's just suggests he's not going to be a generational talent. It's not like they've arrived at the perfect optimal solution whereby all ends are tied up neatly. There's still kind of to me feel like they're in a little bit of this rather just hoping that Liam Lawson might be the circuit breaker.

And I think what it demonstrates is actually, I mean, obviously he to use a phrase that's in vogue now in Formula one, probably exceeded his shelf life at Red Bull Racing, But I think that reflects a bigger story really, which is he was originally brought into Red Bull Racing essentially as a stop gap solution. He wasn't meant to be a permanent, long term driver, who was meant to be there, arguably for as little as a year or a couple of years, let's call it a nice round three seasons, and for three seasons he was productive enough to use that word again enough In twenty twenty one, his contribution in Abu Dhabi won Max for staff and the Driver's Championship. I think that's something people sometimes also gloss over the fact that the only reason Lewis Hamilton was in a not totally dominant position when that safety car came out was because of that battle with Sergio Peris in the middle of the race. In twenty twenty two, he did enough to win the Contructor Championship, and then twenty twenty three, as he said, he got that one too with the team, which had never before been achieved. So despite those form slumps that occurred in all of those seasons to worsening degrees as we went on, made a meaningful contribution over three years when the team wasn't convinced that had an alternative to him, did the job year four. However, when you know, logically in a cycle this long, you would expect a team to have its ups and downs, as Red Bull Racing has had. Probably they didn't expect to have such a down this year after the up of last year, but was found to not be enough for a team at the very front of a very competitive field this year. You know, we had thought we're by many metrics, the most competitive season ever in Formula One, by a number of winners one twos, by team four teams competing for victories, all that kind of thing. And I think it just shows and this is maybe the broader picture at Red Bull Racing, that that in decision over its driver lineup, its lack of security over how it wants to use its four cars, over its driver program that in some respects has been superseded by the more targeted driver programs of rival teams that are all picking up some of the most talented drivers of the next generation. It's all been found to be wanting and Sergio pei Is being in the car for this fourth season and having secured a contract for a fifth and a sixth theoretically just shows actually that there's a bigger problem Red Bull Racing has had to address in allowing him to fundamentally overstay his welcome, which I guess kind of brings us to Liam Lawson. I don't want to tar Leeham Lawson with all of the problems Red Bull Racing has had, because he deserves he's shot in Formula One, and he's clearly shown that he's probably quick enough to warrant a shot at the front, even if it's after only eleven Grand Prix over two seasons. But Red Bulls kind of ended up with a solution that I'm not sure anyone's really one hundred percent convinced by, are they, Because not only does it mean Lean Lawson's going to Red Bull Racing, I mean that means Yuki Snod is not going to Red Bull Racing because despite them renewing his contract earlier this year, unilaterally have chosen not to put him at the senior team, which is kind of like, what's the point of being at the junior team? It's going to be Isaac Kadjabin RB. But the team, no one really seems that convinced by him either. You know, they've spoken about him twice really, and it's both of his FP one sessions, and at neither opportunity they really say anything super positive. And that's no slight against him. It's just suggests he's not going to be a generational talent. It's not like they've arrived at the perfect optimal solution whereby all ends are tied up neatly. There's still kind of to me feel like they're in a little bit of this rather just hoping that Liam Lawson might be the circuit breaker.

Yeah, you're right in that Sergio pais been there for as long as he's been indicates a deeper problem within the Red Bulls structure and one that historically and never had. I mean back to the days of Haimongshwari and Jean rik Vern where it brought two young drivers in and then bones them both two more young drivers in Carlo Science and Max Forstappen and then those guys, So once upon a time there was no problem. And now that other teams have their own junior programs that mirror what Rebull's doing, there's less pool or you know, the pool isn't as deep within that program, but I think it also speaks. So this is a conversation I was having a week or two back with someone was how long can you realistically be Max for Staffen's teammate, and the figure we landed obvious sort of two years, the reason being that the first year can be explained and written off as learning. You're coming into Max's team. He's a generational talent. Everything's built around Max, and you've got to come to terms with that. The second year you're on equal footing, and you've then got to come to terms with the fact that you're going to be decimated by a generational talent, one of the best that Formula one's ever seen. And at the end of that time, your reputation Formula one is probably going to be tarnished because not necessarily because of anything that you as a driver have done, but because who you're competing against. And that's if you look back too. When Daniel Ricardo was promoted to Repel alongside seb said was sort of on his way down, on his way out of Red Bull, as Daniel was on his way in and up and as a result at the end of what was that twenty fifteen, fourteen or fourteen. There we go, I'm showing how bad my memory is. But at the end of twenty fourteen, Daniel's reputation was golden because he'd beaten the world champion, a full time world champion. That's the battle that Liam Lawson is now going to the advantage obviously that Daniel had as he had a season or two in one under his belt with ty Rosso and HRT, he was nowhere near as green as what Liam Lawson is. But that's now the opportunity that Liam finds himself in. If he goes into Red Bull and can even match Max, that's pretty extraordinary. To beat him is unrealistic, wholly unrealistic. I guess in Daniel's favor there was regulation change as well, but if he can go in there and deliver the job. This is something that I actually spoke to Liam shortly after his announcement as a Red Bull driver and it was absolutely bouncing off the ceiling. But one of the points that he made predictably so obviously yes, because yeah, that he looks.

Yeah, you're right in that Sergio pais been there for as long as he's been indicates a deeper problem within the Red Bulls structure and one that historically and never had. I mean back to the days of Haimongshwari and Jean rik Vern where it brought two young drivers in and then bones them both two more young drivers in Carlo Science and Max Forstappen and then those guys, So once upon a time there was no problem. And now that other teams have their own junior programs that mirror what Rebull's doing, there's less pool or you know, the pool isn't as deep within that program, but I think it also speaks. So this is a conversation I was having a week or two back with someone was how long can you realistically be Max for Staffen's teammate, and the figure we landed obvious sort of two years, the reason being that the first year can be explained and written off as learning. You're coming into Max's team. He's a generational talent. Everything's built around Max, and you've got to come to terms with that. The second year you're on equal footing, and you've then got to come to terms with the fact that you're going to be decimated by a generational talent, one of the best that Formula one's ever seen. And at the end of that time, your reputation Formula one is probably going to be tarnished because not necessarily because of anything that you as a driver have done, but because who you're competing against. And that's if you look back too. When Daniel Ricardo was promoted to Repel alongside seb said was sort of on his way down, on his way out of Red Bull, as Daniel was on his way in and up and as a result at the end of what was that twenty fifteen, fourteen or fourteen. There we go, I'm showing how bad my memory is. But at the end of twenty fourteen, Daniel's reputation was golden because he'd beaten the world champion, a full time world champion. That's the battle that Liam Lawson is now going to the advantage obviously that Daniel had as he had a season or two in one under his belt with ty Rosso and HRT, he was nowhere near as green as what Liam Lawson is. But that's now the opportunity that Liam finds himself in. If he goes into Red Bull and can even match Max, that's pretty extraordinary. To beat him is unrealistic, wholly unrealistic. I guess in Daniel's favor there was regulation change as well, but if he can go in there and deliver the job. This is something that I actually spoke to Liam shortly after his announcement as a Red Bull driver and it was absolutely bouncing off the ceiling. But one of the points that he made predictably so obviously yes, because yeah, that he looks.

So serious in their announcement Instagram. He should have been happier than that.

So serious in their announcement Instagram. He should have been happier than that.

Yeah, that's sort of lean. He doesn't get too carried away as a professional. You're get to get my away from the cameras. And he's awesome, awesome dude, hilarious as well, actually an incredible guitar player for what its worth. Imagine getting him and David Hill on stage. But you know, he said stuff like, there's nobody better learn from. It's an opportunity to become the best driver I can be. There's nobody better for me to go up against, you know, referencing the fact that he's going to be driving alongside a proven career killer in Max with Stafford. You know, he's ended the careers effectively of Daniel Ricardo, Sergio Perry's Pierre Gasoline, Alex Albert obviously guessing albut I've gone on and done other things. But the point stands. So it's a hell of a task. But he's also realistic, you know, obviously, once he said to me, I know, the team goal next year is to be fighting for the championship, and if we're in a position to do that, I'm doing my job. He knows he's not there to win necessarily races or championships, whatever. But he said to score points and do that consistently, which is something that Perees can't do. The challenge that he will have is not only will he be compared to Max Astappen, which is a fair comparison because the teammate, he will also be compared to Sergio Perez, which is a wholly unfair comparison because different cars, different areas, different drivers, different competition, and Yuki Sonoda again for all the same reasons. It's a wholly unfair comparison needs to be judged on his own own merits, not in comparison to others. The Sonoda thing, you know, look that they renewed Sergio in the first place two years ago, whatever it was, I mean that it was done then, wasn't it. Yuki Sonoda has been there to satisfy Honda. Basically, there are clearly issues as to why they don't think he's worthy of a rebel opportunity. I think we've heard some of those. I don't know that we know all of them. But have we heard the same sort of brashness that you know, aggression, fiery temper from Liam No. We heard him being forthright on the radio. Yeah, absolutely, but that's what rebel wants. So yeah, I don't think Yuki has been treated harsh and the running on the wall has been there for two or three years for him. He'll do twenty twenty five with RB and then probably move on with Honda Engines because you know, he clearly now has no value to Red Bull, so I can't see that he will hang around hoping for an opportunity. Conversely, you know we saw Daniel Ricardo. Once Red Bull decides you have no value to the organization beyond the Honda Engines, that is what Yuki Sonoda is. They'll cut and run. They'll find someone else. Ivid limblad amwasa there's a number of kids out there that, yes, it will be a gamble to promote, but they've done that before.

Yeah, that's sort of lean. He doesn't get too carried away as a professional. You're get to get my away from the cameras. And he's awesome, awesome dude, hilarious as well, actually an incredible guitar player for what its worth. Imagine getting him and David Hill on stage. But you know, he said stuff like, there's nobody better learn from. It's an opportunity to become the best driver I can be. There's nobody better for me to go up against, you know, referencing the fact that he's going to be driving alongside a proven career killer in Max with Stafford. You know, he's ended the careers effectively of Daniel Ricardo, Sergio Perry's Pierre Gasoline, Alex Albert obviously guessing albut I've gone on and done other things. But the point stands. So it's a hell of a task. But he's also realistic, you know, obviously, once he said to me, I know, the team goal next year is to be fighting for the championship, and if we're in a position to do that, I'm doing my job. He knows he's not there to win necessarily races or championships, whatever. But he said to score points and do that consistently, which is something that Perees can't do. The challenge that he will have is not only will he be compared to Max Astappen, which is a fair comparison because the teammate, he will also be compared to Sergio Perez, which is a wholly unfair comparison because different cars, different areas, different drivers, different competition, and Yuki Sonoda again for all the same reasons. It's a wholly unfair comparison needs to be judged on his own own merits, not in comparison to others. The Sonoda thing, you know, look that they renewed Sergio in the first place two years ago, whatever it was, I mean that it was done then, wasn't it. Yuki Sonoda has been there to satisfy Honda. Basically, there are clearly issues as to why they don't think he's worthy of a rebel opportunity. I think we've heard some of those. I don't know that we know all of them. But have we heard the same sort of brashness that you know, aggression, fiery temper from Liam No. We heard him being forthright on the radio. Yeah, absolutely, but that's what rebel wants. So yeah, I don't think Yuki has been treated harsh and the running on the wall has been there for two or three years for him. He'll do twenty twenty five with RB and then probably move on with Honda Engines because you know, he clearly now has no value to Red Bull, so I can't see that he will hang around hoping for an opportunity. Conversely, you know we saw Daniel Ricardo. Once Red Bull decides you have no value to the organization beyond the Honda Engines, that is what Yuki Sonoda is. They'll cut and run. They'll find someone else. Ivid limblad amwasa there's a number of kids out there that, yes, it will be a gamble to promote, but they've done that before.

Yeah, I'm sort of a little bit in two minds about all of those things. On the one hand, like we've sort of illustrated this. The former Minati dam used to just be ruthless about the way we deal with its drivers. Yuki Sonoda. Putting aside the Honda connection, I suppose who's clearly quick. He's quick enough to have been a Red Bull backed driver, even though the Honda connections. What got him there. Clearly is talented enough to be there, but would never have survived into what will be a fifth season by now because if that already decided he wasn't going to Red Bull Racing, that would be it. As you say, they would be much more willing to take a punt even on I mean any number of the young drivers' talk about arvadd bad he's gonna have his first F two season next year. There would have been more than enough. You know, he'll have that F two season. Doesn't matter where you'll finish, You'll end up at a racing Bulls or whatever it'll be called in twenty twenty six, which may well be the case, and the same applies for Liam Lawson at the senior team now. Admittedly Red Bull has its history is relatively short, which means it sometimes it's hard to look back at how it behaved in its early years, particularly very early years. Been no resemblance to the team today or even then it's middle success years. You can't just copy and paste, particularly considering Max with staff and is so much at the center of the team, Unlike even Sebastian Vedel in those days. I think the team is much more built around Max and was around Sebastian a couple of different ways, and so I don't think it's a problem to promote Lean Lawson with so relatively little experience, particularly also in a year when Mercedes is taking a punt on Kimi Antonelli who hasn't had any Grand PRIXV experience, and maybe that reflects on their lower ambitions next year. But I think if you ask anyone Mercedes, they would hope that they'll be contending for regular wins and maybe even the championship next season. And if not, he'll still only have one year of racing under his belt in twenty twenty six, when they definitely will hope for that. But on the other hand, Red Bull Racing needs some stability and it's hard to imagine that being achieved with Liam Lawson. But then I guess if you argue that, then you're arguing essentially to go and find someone just like Sergio Peis, because this was the argument raised after Alex Albon's career with Red Bull Racing ended, and they went and found someone who was a safe set of hands, essentially, and that's where they land on. You know, had that thinking prevailed, probably would have ended up with Valtribotas at Red Bull Racing because it feels like he's in exactly the same position to his career Pairs was looking for a drive, So that's kind of it's sort of it's just an interesting position. I find the whole Red Bull program to be and I guess this is sort of like the reverse of growing Pains, where they're trying to return to the format they had maybe five or six years ago, where they had a team dedicated only to drivers who were there for no more ridi than three seasons and they were turfed, and then you just try them at Red Bull Racing. It's just going to be very interesting. I think this next few years at Red Bull's gonna be very interesting. There could be some very hard questions for the team to answer. I hope Liam does well, obviously because I think he deserves a probably quite a long career in Formula One. But I mean, how many times can drivers who are teammates with Maxistaff and get lucky, Because I feel like that that's what they've all been right. Pierre Gasly could have had his career ended, but because he was at the start of that drying up of the pipeline. There was a seat for him back at whatever it was called at that time, Toro Rosso I think, and he was able to rebuild himself Minardi the former Marati team. Likewise, Alex Albot, I mean he was out of the sport for a year but managed to find his way back into William Sergo Perry's may have had his career ended by this. He sort of suggested he wants to remains to be seen, Like you said, maybe the Cadillac team. A lot can change in twelve months, though, what will happen to Liam Lawson if things don't work out in the ideal way and read Bull loses patience again? So I hope he does well enough to avoid that for a least a couple of years and build a reputation that'll see him continue into Formula One for a long time. That's the news for the last week and a half whatever it is technically of the official Formula One season. Let's all pretend everything stops now for a couple of months until racing starts again.

Yeah, I'm sort of a little bit in two minds about all of those things. On the one hand, like we've sort of illustrated this. The former Minati dam used to just be ruthless about the way we deal with its drivers. Yuki Sonoda. Putting aside the Honda connection, I suppose who's clearly quick. He's quick enough to have been a Red Bull backed driver, even though the Honda connections. What got him there. Clearly is talented enough to be there, but would never have survived into what will be a fifth season by now because if that already decided he wasn't going to Red Bull Racing, that would be it. As you say, they would be much more willing to take a punt even on I mean any number of the young drivers' talk about arvadd bad he's gonna have his first F two season next year. There would have been more than enough. You know, he'll have that F two season. Doesn't matter where you'll finish, You'll end up at a racing Bulls or whatever it'll be called in twenty twenty six, which may well be the case, and the same applies for Liam Lawson at the senior team now. Admittedly Red Bull has its history is relatively short, which means it sometimes it's hard to look back at how it behaved in its early years, particularly very early years. Been no resemblance to the team today or even then it's middle success years. You can't just copy and paste, particularly considering Max with staff and is so much at the center of the team, Unlike even Sebastian Vedel in those days. I think the team is much more built around Max and was around Sebastian a couple of different ways, and so I don't think it's a problem to promote Lean Lawson with so relatively little experience, particularly also in a year when Mercedes is taking a punt on Kimi Antonelli who hasn't had any Grand PRIXV experience, and maybe that reflects on their lower ambitions next year. But I think if you ask anyone Mercedes, they would hope that they'll be contending for regular wins and maybe even the championship next season. And if not, he'll still only have one year of racing under his belt in twenty twenty six, when they definitely will hope for that. But on the other hand, Red Bull Racing needs some stability and it's hard to imagine that being achieved with Liam Lawson. But then I guess if you argue that, then you're arguing essentially to go and find someone just like Sergio Peis, because this was the argument raised after Alex Albon's career with Red Bull Racing ended, and they went and found someone who was a safe set of hands, essentially, and that's where they land on. You know, had that thinking prevailed, probably would have ended up with Valtribotas at Red Bull Racing because it feels like he's in exactly the same position to his career Pairs was looking for a drive, So that's kind of it's sort of it's just an interesting position. I find the whole Red Bull program to be and I guess this is sort of like the reverse of growing Pains, where they're trying to return to the format they had maybe five or six years ago, where they had a team dedicated only to drivers who were there for no more ridi than three seasons and they were turfed, and then you just try them at Red Bull Racing. It's just going to be very interesting. I think this next few years at Red Bull's gonna be very interesting. There could be some very hard questions for the team to answer. I hope Liam does well, obviously because I think he deserves a probably quite a long career in Formula One. But I mean, how many times can drivers who are teammates with Maxistaff and get lucky, Because I feel like that that's what they've all been right. Pierre Gasly could have had his career ended, but because he was at the start of that drying up of the pipeline. There was a seat for him back at whatever it was called at that time, Toro Rosso I think, and he was able to rebuild himself Minardi the former Marati team. Likewise, Alex Albot, I mean he was out of the sport for a year but managed to find his way back into William Sergo Perry's may have had his career ended by this. He sort of suggested he wants to remains to be seen, Like you said, maybe the Cadillac team. A lot can change in twelve months, though, what will happen to Liam Lawson if things don't work out in the ideal way and read Bull loses patience again? So I hope he does well enough to avoid that for a least a couple of years and build a reputation that'll see him continue into Formula One for a long time. That's the news for the last week and a half whatever it is technically of the official Formula One season. Let's all pretend everything stops now for a couple of months until racing starts again.

Let's hope it all stops. I need a break, Yeah, I.

Let's hope it all stops. I need a break, Yeah, I.

Think everyone needs a bit of a break. Christmas is just so close. But of course, our Alternative Championship has not concluded yet. We must wrap this one up. We're going to get to the full rankings in just a moment. But of course, having missed the Abu Dhabi Grand Prix review and now back for the final episode wrapping up the entire season, we do have points to give away. We do have a couple of entries still for the Alternative Championship before we can officially declare a winner. Matt, do you want to start us off with the last six selections of the ALTRA season?

Think everyone needs a bit of a break. Christmas is just so close. But of course, our Alternative Championship has not concluded yet. We must wrap this one up. We're going to get to the full rankings in just a moment. But of course, having missed the Abu Dhabi Grand Prix review and now back for the final episode wrapping up the entire season, we do have points to give away. We do have a couple of entries still for the Alternative Championship before we can officially declare a winner. Matt, do you want to start us off with the last six selections of the ALTRA season?

Yeah, the one where the points don't matter and everyone doesn't know it exists, but they really, really really want it. So my points have been skewed not just by Abu Dhabi, but by the events of the last week or so as well. So there is a bit of a Liam Lawson flavor to the first selection, which is obviously Liam Lawson. I've given him four hundred and thirty seven points because that's a number of points that that Max scored this year. I was tempted to go for given the number of points between Max and Sergio, but I thought I can't be bothering the mass.

Yeah, the one where the points don't matter and everyone doesn't know it exists, but they really, really really want it. So my points have been skewed not just by Abu Dhabi, but by the events of the last week or so as well. So there is a bit of a Liam Lawson flavor to the first selection, which is obviously Liam Lawson. I've given him four hundred and thirty seven points because that's a number of points that that Max scored this year. I was tempted to go for given the number of points between Max and Sergio, but I thought I can't be bothering the mass.

I think you're pretty much just har it don't you, and that you probably get your answer.

I think you're pretty much just har it don't you, and that you probably get your answer.

Yeah, probably it was a third though.

Yeah, probably it was a third though.

Oh yes it was actually wasn't that we talked about that. It was about a third. That's great.

Oh yes it was actually wasn't that we talked about that. It was about a third. That's great.

So it was four hundred and thirty seven points. A third of that is I've got socks on. I can't count that.

So it was four hundred and thirty seven points. A third of that is I've got socks on. I can't count that.

That's too much, very good. I like that, though. I'm going to start some not esoteric, maybe a little bit tenuous of a point score, considering we don't often talk about reserve drivers, especially if they're not knocking on the door for Formula One. I'm taking thirty points off Sauber or the former Sauber team, the former BMW team, and then anyone look at it for describing development drivers Tao Porchet and Zane Maloney as having graduated from their driver academy when really what they're saying is they're severing all ties with them and don't want anything more to do with them. That was beautifully creative language, well I mean creative language warranting points off. Of course, thirty points off. I say thirty because that's ten for each of them, including Carrie Shriner, who at least is sticking with Soubur in a new role, but has also in inverted Commas graduated from the Academy.

That's too much, very good. I like that, though. I'm going to start some not esoteric, maybe a little bit tenuous of a point score, considering we don't often talk about reserve drivers, especially if they're not knocking on the door for Formula One. I'm taking thirty points off Sauber or the former Sauber team, the former BMW team, and then anyone look at it for describing development drivers Tao Porchet and Zane Maloney as having graduated from their driver academy when really what they're saying is they're severing all ties with them and don't want anything more to do with them. That was beautifully creative language, well I mean creative language warranting points off. Of course, thirty points off. I say thirty because that's ten for each of them, including Carrie Shriner, who at least is sticking with Soubur in a new role, but has also in inverted Commas graduated from the Academy.

Yeah, yeah, I saw that and it was Yeah, it's some of the most creative public relations I've seen in quite some time. Actually took to Twitter and and sort of made his much because, let's face it, effectively it was a press release to say so long and thanks for all the fish yes, to borrow a hitchhiker's guard to the galaxy reference. It was. Yeah, it was glorious in its ridiculousness. So I wholeheartedly agree with with thirty points off. In fact, I encourage you to reconsider give them more off.

Yeah, yeah, I saw that and it was Yeah, it's some of the most creative public relations I've seen in quite some time. Actually took to Twitter and and sort of made his much because, let's face it, effectively it was a press release to say so long and thanks for all the fish yes, to borrow a hitchhiker's guard to the galaxy reference. It was. Yeah, it was glorious in its ridiculousness. So I wholeheartedly agree with with thirty points off. In fact, I encourage you to reconsider give them more off.

Maybe I should maybe all maybe all times of by ten.

Maybe I should maybe all maybe all times of by ten.

That we're talking three point one hundred points a driver, well, will you've taken three hundred points off? I've given three.

That we're talking three point one hundred points a driver, well, will you've taken three hundred points off? I've given three.

Oh, okay, not enough to balance it out, but to botas okay.

Oh, okay, not enough to balance it out, but to botas okay.

Because he's a third driver, it's message. I think that's a good move for all involved. It's not a brilliant move because that's face that he's not racing, but it's a good move and worthy of three points. And given that we have a history of taking huge numbers of points off, I think even just getting one point in the alternative Championship is pretty seismic.

Because he's a third driver, it's message. I think that's a good move for all involved. It's not a brilliant move because that's face that he's not racing, but it's a good move and worthy of three points. And given that we have a history of taking huge numbers of points off, I think even just getting one point in the alternative Championship is pretty seismic.

Yes, it is a good.

Yes, it is a good.

Yeah, he gets three points for inking a deal would be third driver at.

Yeah, he gets three points for inking a deal would be third driver at.

Me, very good. I've in fact, I've noticed now I'll just let you know in advance. At all, I'm only taking points off. So it's next is one hundred and fourteen points off Red Bull. We've already talked about this for exercising Yuki Sonoda's contract extension calls earlier this year, but still clearly having no interest in promoting him to the senior team, one hundred and fourteen being the total number of races he'll be competing for the brand if he leaves at the end of next season. As I guess, we sort of expect him to. Now. Just tremendous shit housery from Red Bulls driver management program is it. It's got a team that's specifically established to feed Red Bull Racing, and they continue to sign and more. I guess the context of this it was just as he was suggesting there was interest from other teams and if there was no interest from Red Bull Racing, he would consider, uh, you know, stretching his wings, putting his career in the hands of someone else, and Red Bull says no, we've got the contract and that's fine and contractually are allowed to do so. But to have no obligator, to have no even inkling to promote him, just seems like a massive waste of time.

Me, very good. I've in fact, I've noticed now I'll just let you know in advance. At all, I'm only taking points off. So it's next is one hundred and fourteen points off Red Bull. We've already talked about this for exercising Yuki Sonoda's contract extension calls earlier this year, but still clearly having no interest in promoting him to the senior team, one hundred and fourteen being the total number of races he'll be competing for the brand if he leaves at the end of next season. As I guess, we sort of expect him to. Now. Just tremendous shit housery from Red Bulls driver management program is it. It's got a team that's specifically established to feed Red Bull Racing, and they continue to sign and more. I guess the context of this it was just as he was suggesting there was interest from other teams and if there was no interest from Red Bull Racing, he would consider, uh, you know, stretching his wings, putting his career in the hands of someone else, and Red Bull says no, we've got the contract and that's fine and contractually are allowed to do so. But to have no obligator, to have no even inkling to promote him, just seems like a massive waste of time.

If one dispells, you know, the link to Honda and ignores that. But yes, I hardly agree. It does seem a bit rough on. So you take those points away from Red Bull, not from Yuki Sonoda.

If one dispells, you know, the link to Honda and ignores that. But yes, I hardly agree. It does seem a bit rough on. So you take those points away from Red Bull, not from Yuki Sonoda.

No from Red By.

No from Red By.

Yeah.

Yeah.

No, absolutely, he's had enough theoretical points taken off his career. I suppose, hasn't he so after Red Bull?

No, absolutely, he's had enough theoretical points taken off his career. I suppose, hasn't he so after Red Bull?

Well, yeah, that makes that makes a lot of sense, doesn't it. It's it's it's harsh, But that's the game we play, isn't it.

Well, yeah, that makes that makes a lot of sense, doesn't it. It's it's it's harsh, But that's the game we play, isn't it.

So it is. There's no forgiveness. There's no soft points here in.

So it is. There's no forgiveness. There's no soft points here in.

There really aren't there.

There really aren't there.

Very few points at all.

Very few points at all.

In fact, well, you're a better chance of losing them than scoring them in fairness, And on that theme, yes, and sticking with the kicking the ball while it's down. Ye, I'm going to take one nine hundred and eighty five points off of RB slash Racing Bulls slash Alpha TOWI slash uh, Tororosso for besmirching the Minardi name the marketing. The word you used before was magnificent shit housery. That's gone on. Yeah, Minardi entered the sport into Formula one is in nineteen eighty five, and it ran as Minardi pretty much all the way through until it was about two thousand and five. Yeah, two thousand and five, when two thousand and six when Red Bull took it over as Torosso, and then it's had more name changes than hot lunches since then. But yeah, so, nineteen hundred and eighty five points coming off of RB slash Racing bulls slash. Whatever, can we can we preemptibly take points away from next season?

In fact, well, you're a better chance of losing them than scoring them in fairness, And on that theme, yes, and sticking with the kicking the ball while it's down. Ye, I'm going to take one nine hundred and eighty five points off of RB slash Racing Bulls slash Alpha TOWI slash uh, Tororosso for besmirching the Minardi name the marketing. The word you used before was magnificent shit housery. That's gone on. Yeah, Minardi entered the sport into Formula one is in nineteen eighty five, and it ran as Minardi pretty much all the way through until it was about two thousand and five. Yeah, two thousand and five, when two thousand and six when Red Bull took it over as Torosso, and then it's had more name changes than hot lunches since then. But yeah, so, nineteen hundred and eighty five points coming off of RB slash Racing bulls slash. Whatever, can we can we preemptibly take points away from next season?

Yeah? Maybe maybe after we doll out the final championship positions, we can reset the tally as we see fit. Finally, I'm taking eighteen million points off Sergio Perez for in September tweeting a meme that he would not be leaving Red Bull, a tweet scene by eighteen million people only two months later leave red Bull. So good in fact, that the users on x or Twitter as formerly Twitter, to keep with the Minardi theme, have a subjected it to a community note saying no, in fact, he did leave, I think effectively eighteen million times lying about his contract intention. I'm sure, and I'm sure his intention was not to leave. But nonetheless, eighteen million points of that's that's fantastic.

Yeah? Maybe maybe after we doll out the final championship positions, we can reset the tally as we see fit. Finally, I'm taking eighteen million points off Sergio Perez for in September tweeting a meme that he would not be leaving Red Bull, a tweet scene by eighteen million people only two months later leave red Bull. So good in fact, that the users on x or Twitter as formerly Twitter, to keep with the Minardi theme, have a subjected it to a community note saying no, in fact, he did leave, I think effectively eighteen million times lying about his contract intention. I'm sure, and I'm sure his intention was not to leave. But nonetheless, eighteen million points of that's that's fantastic.

I deeply appreciate that for all sorts of reasons, because it's just the arbitrary application of points.

I deeply appreciate that for all sorts of reasons, because it's just the arbitrary application of points.

That's what we stand for.

That's what we stand for.

That is everything the Alternative Championship stands for. The very foundation of the competition. There is no rhyme nor reason, no logic, often no mass in forced either. And yeah, that's that's I like it. I like it a lot.

That is everything the Alternative Championship stands for. The very foundation of the competition. There is no rhyme nor reason, no logic, often no mass in forced either. And yeah, that's that's I like it. I like it a lot.

Well. That brings us to the end of the Alternative Championship, Matt. They are all of the entries now calculated and tabulated, and we can now reveal the winners well, of course read out all them in reverse championship order. We want to have a bit of hype building up now, Matt. You've been calculating the numbers, so I'm going to leave the top ten to you, but will make our way up from the bottom. There were sixty six entries in the end. Over how many weeks or episodes we've done of this podcast, I'm going to start with number sixty six on negative four Is this in millions? Four hundred and seven million, nice one hundred and seven million, nine hundred and ninety nine, nine hundred and eighty points, So a number as large as it is specific to Ticketmaster last on the Alternate Championship least.

Well. That brings us to the end of the Alternative Championship, Matt. They are all of the entries now calculated and tabulated, and we can now reveal the winners well, of course read out all them in reverse championship order. We want to have a bit of hype building up now, Matt. You've been calculating the numbers, so I'm going to leave the top ten to you, but will make our way up from the bottom. There were sixty six entries in the end. Over how many weeks or episodes we've done of this podcast, I'm going to start with number sixty six on negative four Is this in millions? Four hundred and seven million, nice one hundred and seven million, nine hundred and ninety nine, nine hundred and eighty points, So a number as large as it is specific to Ticketmaster last on the Alternate Championship least.

There is a logic for that, because I never actually gave it a number of points. This is one of my awards, that's right, I remember, and I just decided that it is going to finish last because it has one job and his wholesale failed to deliver. And this sort of relates to tickets going on South the Australian grand Print. The system crashing and they're having to delay it by year by year, by a day. And I got stuck into them because I've got one job and they failed miserably and then tried to blame someone else. Yes, it's like my children, I didn't do it while you're holding that hammer. So yeah, they're they're deliberately at the bottom because their points were a multiplier of whoever finished.

There is a logic for that, because I never actually gave it a number of points. This is one of my awards, that's right, I remember, and I just decided that it is going to finish last because it has one job and his wholesale failed to deliver. And this sort of relates to tickets going on South the Australian grand Print. The system crashing and they're having to delay it by year by year, by a day. And I got stuck into them because I've got one job and they failed miserably and then tried to blame someone else. Yes, it's like my children, I didn't do it while you're holding that hammer. So yeah, they're they're deliberately at the bottom because their points were a multiplier of whoever finished.

Search points next worst.

Search points next worst.

Yes, that's it, that's it.

Yes, that's it, that's it.

I like that a lot. Next worst was Formula one itself on negative two hundred and three million, nine hundred ninety nine, nine hundred and nine points. It was for saying Las Vegas doesn't need a sprint because it's already so fast, and that has nothing to do with a reported sprint hosting. For your four million dollars accrued from every circle that hosts a sprint. Let's look at third last. It's Williams on negative two hundred million points.

I like that a lot. Next worst was Formula one itself on negative two hundred and three million, nine hundred ninety nine, nine hundred and nine points. It was for saying Las Vegas doesn't need a sprint because it's already so fast, and that has nothing to do with a reported sprint hosting. For your four million dollars accrued from every circle that hosts a sprint. Let's look at third last. It's Williams on negative two hundred million points.

Yeah, so that's the the reinvestment that Dalton's made, the over capitalization and not over capitalization, but they're close to over capitalizing on that team. And just it wasn't a great season, lots of crash damage, underwhelming. I thought it was poor to bring Logan Sargent out of the car and the Australian Grand Prix just a few decisions through the year I didn't like, and so when there was an excuse to give it a two hundred million dollar deduction, I took it very good.

Yeah, so that's the the reinvestment that Dalton's made, the over capitalization and not over capitalization, but they're close to over capitalizing on that team. And just it wasn't a great season, lots of crash damage, underwhelming. I thought it was poor to bring Logan Sargent out of the car and the Australian Grand Prix just a few decisions through the year I didn't like, and so when there was an excuse to give it a two hundred million dollar deduction, I took it very good.

Next on the list in sixty thirty Sergio Perez, most of which is his negative eighteen million points from just a few moments ago. James vowed sixty second. I believe I gave him a positive number. Maybe it was just one point because he did because he mentioned that Franco Colin No, not Franco Colinbindo, bigy, pardon who was he talking about? Actually he said it was good mix. Schumacher of course, that he would be good but not great in justifying Franco colobinto being promoted to the team, which I thought was good. But you then subsequently took quite a few points off him.

Next on the list in sixty thirty Sergio Perez, most of which is his negative eighteen million points from just a few moments ago. James vowed sixty second. I believe I gave him a positive number. Maybe it was just one point because he did because he mentioned that Franco Colin No, not Franco Colinbindo, bigy, pardon who was he talking about? Actually he said it was good mix. Schumacher of course, that he would be good but not great in justifying Franco colobinto being promoted to the team, which I thought was good. But you then subsequently took quite a few points off him.

Yeah, for much the same reason as I did with Williams. I didn't agree with some of the decisions, so I found a way to give him a whack and I took a lazy one hundred and sixty eight thousand off him. I mean, I think we said at the time that he needed a big back half of the year. He just didn't deliver, did he.

Yeah, for much the same reason as I did with Williams. I didn't agree with some of the decisions, so I found a way to give him a whack and I took a lazy one hundred and sixty eight thousand off him. I mean, I think we said at the time that he needed a big back half of the year. He just didn't deliver, did he.

No, he just did never really recover from that big blow. In fact, I think the one point it must have been the same week or a similar week as the British Grand Prix, which lost one hundred and sixty eight thousand points. I believe this is to do with the ticket sellout situation. On Sunday there were several tickets still available.

No, he just did never really recover from that big blow. In fact, I think the one point it must have been the same week or a similar week as the British Grand Prix, which lost one hundred and sixty eight thousand points. I believe this is to do with the ticket sellout situation. On Sunday there were several tickets still available.

I think it was this was due to the capacity and claim it was a sellout crowd just like from memory, Qatar.

I think it was this was due to the capacity and claim it was a sellout crowd just like from memory, Qatar.

I mean that's always helps when they're in seats.

I mean that's always helps when they're in seats.

I was going to say, well, there's plenty of seats, but only the very few tickets very hard to come by, not because not because they're in high demand, but because there's only about six of them.

I was going to say, well, there's plenty of seats, but only the very few tickets very hard to come by, not because not because they're in high demand, but because there's only about six of them.

I like that. It's a country of many seats for few tickets. I like that a lot. Sixtieth in the order on negative ten thousand points is Johnny Herbert.

I like that. It's a country of many seats for few tickets. I like that a lot. Sixtieth in the order on negative ten thousand points is Johnny Herbert.

For his comments as a pundit while also being as steward. So his punditary comments on the dishing out of a penalty that he himself dished out yes to Maxim Staffin at the Singapore Grand Prix and then in Mexico as well, and then the inconsistency there because he gave a ten thousand dollars fine. I think it was yes' to char Leclair rather than community service. So I think Johnny should pick up the tab for that one.