Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. Catch us live weekdays at noon and five pm Eastern on Apple Coarcklay and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business App. Listen on demand wherever you get your podcasts, or watch us live on YouTube.

Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. Catch us live weekdays at noon and five pm Eastern on Apple Coarcklay and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business App. Listen on demand wherever you get your podcasts, or watch us live on YouTube.

Welcome yes to the FED Day edition, the Wednesday edition of Bounce of Power Bloomberg Radio on satellite radio Channel one twenty one and on YouTube, where you.

Welcome yes to the FED Day edition, the Wednesday edition of Bounce of Power Bloomberg Radio on satellite radio Channel one twenty one and on YouTube, where you.

May as well. Dial it up right now.

May as well. Dial it up right now.

Keep this thing going right through two o'clock because we have a lot of news coming your way in the next two hours.

Keep this thing going right through two o'clock because we have a lot of news coming your way in the next two hours.

Yeah, FED Day two pm.

Yeah, FED Day two pm.

Our special coverage starts as always at one thirty pm Eastern Time, as we'll send things back to New York for special coverage, and we'll bring you the news conference. I just bumped into Michael McKees down here in the Capitol and on his way to the.

Our special coverage starts as always at one thirty pm Eastern Time, as we'll send things back to New York for special coverage, and we'll bring you the news conference. I just bumped into Michael McKees down here in the Capitol and on his way to the.

FED right now.

FED right now.

Now, we're not fooling around today. We start with breaking new. It was Redhead on the terminal. If you're with us on YouTube, you see it on the screen. We're just now hearing from Vladimir Zelenski following his phone call with President Trump. Others, of course on the line, Zelensky Trump discussing partial ceasefire in the call, according to his source, talking to Bloomberg, Zelenski backing the proposal to halt energy asset strikes. Remember we told you this late yesterday on the late edition of Balance of Power. President Trump President Putin, of course on the line together, talking about not a full cease fire, but an energy infrastructure cease fire to last thirty days. The bombing and shooting can continue otherwise, that's at least where we are right now.

Now, we're not fooling around today. We start with breaking new. It was Redhead on the terminal. If you're with us on YouTube, you see it on the screen. We're just now hearing from Vladimir Zelenski following his phone call with President Trump. Others, of course on the line, Zelensky Trump discussing partial ceasefire in the call, according to his source, talking to Bloomberg, Zelenski backing the proposal to halt energy asset strikes. Remember we told you this late yesterday on the late edition of Balance of Power. President Trump President Putin, of course on the line together, talking about not a full cease fire, but an energy infrastructure cease fire to last thirty days. The bombing and shooting can continue otherwise, that's at least where we are right now.

Now.

Now.

This call was not as long as the call with Vladimir Putin yesterday. It did conclude we can let you know, and we've heard from Donald Trump since then. President Zelenski was speaking earlier in Helsinki, setting the tone if you will for this call.

This call was not as long as the call with Vladimir Putin yesterday. It did conclude we can let you know, and we've heard from Donald Trump since then. President Zelenski was speaking earlier in Helsinki, setting the tone if you will for this call.

Here's what he.

Here's what he.

Said, should contacts President Trump today, I will have contact with President Trump. We will be talking to him about the details of the next steps. We've had very good meeting and jetta with our teams, and I think everything has been going well, except for Russia, which is always unhappy when something is going in the right direction. We will discuss the details about the next steps, and I think I will hear from him the details of his conversation with Putin.

Said, should contacts President Trump today, I will have contact with President Trump. We will be talking to him about the details of the next steps. We've had very good meeting and jetta with our teams, and I think everything has been going well, except for Russia, which is always unhappy when something is going in the right direction. We will discuss the details about the next steps, and I think I will hear from him the details of his conversation with Putin.

Fast forward.

Fast forward.

The truth social Donald Trump, this is thirty one minutes ago, just completed, he writes, not I or we just completed a very good telephone call with President Zelenski of Ukraine.

The truth social Donald Trump, this is thirty one minutes ago, just completed, he writes, not I or we just completed a very good telephone call with President Zelenski of Ukraine.

Lasted approximately one hour.

Lasted approximately one hour.

Much of the discussion based on the call made yesterday with President Putin in order to align both Russia and Ukraine in terms of their requests and needs. Donald Trump writes, we are very much on track, and I will ask Secretary of State Mark Rubio national Security Advisor Mike Wallas to give an accurate descript of the points discussed. The statement will be put out shortly. Okay, we're waiting for that statement now. And I want to bring in Brett Bruin, the President's CEO the Global Situation Room. This is, of course, a voice of reason on the program and a voice of experience, having spent time as Director of Global Engagement in the Obama White House. Brett, it's great to have you back. The way I'm reading the language, this is very curious. The way this is written makes you wonder if Donald Trump was actually on the call or was he watching Rubio and Waltz talk to Zelenski.

Much of the discussion based on the call made yesterday with President Putin in order to align both Russia and Ukraine in terms of their requests and needs. Donald Trump writes, we are very much on track, and I will ask Secretary of State Mark Rubio national Security Advisor Mike Wallas to give an accurate descript of the points discussed. The statement will be put out shortly. Okay, we're waiting for that statement now. And I want to bring in Brett Bruin, the President's CEO the Global Situation Room. This is, of course, a voice of reason on the program and a voice of experience, having spent time as Director of Global Engagement in the Obama White House. Brett, it's great to have you back. The way I'm reading the language, this is very curious. The way this is written makes you wonder if Donald Trump was actually on the call or was he watching Rubio and Waltz talk to Zelenski.

What do you make of this?

What do you make of this?

Well, it's very Untrumpian and quite frankly, Joe, I think what we witnessed last night, after Trump had built expectations sky high, was you know, a classic walk back. You know, he did not get Putin to sign on to that Jetta ceasefire deal. He did not get Putin to declare that peace was his main objective. In fact, Putin put out what was a pretty alarming list of demands, including that the US the West stop supplying not just military aid, intelligence that Ukraine couldn't even recruit for its military. I mean, this is Putin putting his cards on the table and saying, look, my objectives are the same as when my troops crossed over into Ukrainian territory.

Well, it's very Untrumpian and quite frankly, Joe, I think what we witnessed last night, after Trump had built expectations sky high, was you know, a classic walk back. You know, he did not get Putin to sign on to that Jetta ceasefire deal. He did not get Putin to declare that peace was his main objective. In fact, Putin put out what was a pretty alarming list of demands, including that the US the West stop supplying not just military aid, intelligence that Ukraine couldn't even recruit for its military. I mean, this is Putin putting his cards on the table and saying, look, my objectives are the same as when my troops crossed over into Ukrainian territory.

Do you have, as the diplomat inside of you, Brett, the ingredients for a peace deal.

Do you have, as the diplomat inside of you, Brett, the ingredients for a peace deal.

Here or not?

Here or not?

Well?

Well?

Look, I am always, as you said, Joe, up for diplomacy. I'm always encouraged when people are talking and not just shooting. But at the same time, there is good piece, there is peace that sows the seeds of stability and security, And then there are peace deals that sow the seeds of the next conflict, that worsen existing conflicts, and everything that Trump has been talking about is the latter. He's been talking about seeding ground to to Russia, that incentivizes not just putin, let's be clear about this, but Shijingping, Kim Jong un, and a whole host of other aspiring autocrats to say, you know what, I actually could take some territory from Nepal or from Bangladesh, and that would be really dangerous, really destabilizing.

Look, I am always, as you said, Joe, up for diplomacy. I'm always encouraged when people are talking and not just shooting. But at the same time, there is good piece, there is peace that sows the seeds of stability and security, And then there are peace deals that sow the seeds of the next conflict, that worsen existing conflicts, and everything that Trump has been talking about is the latter. He's been talking about seeding ground to to Russia, that incentivizes not just putin, let's be clear about this, but Shijingping, Kim Jong un, and a whole host of other aspiring autocrats to say, you know what, I actually could take some territory from Nepal or from Bangladesh, and that would be really dangerous, really destabilizing.

Interesting take on this.

Interesting take on this.

You remember the conversation Bread on the campaign trail. I am the only one who can end this war. I will end it on day one Brett. At one point he even said I can do it in an hour. What do you think President Trump has learned in this process so far?

You remember the conversation Bread on the campaign trail. I am the only one who can end this war. I will end it on day one Brett. At one point he even said I can do it in an hour. What do you think President Trump has learned in this process so far?

Well, I can tell you what the American people have learned, and that is that you know, Trump is boastful. He loves to claim that he is the world's best negotiator, and as someone who spent a lot of time in the situation room, a lot of time on the front lines of crises and conflict, it's just not that easy. And Trump should know better. And the American people, quite frankly, shouldn't have known better when Trump was making these claims, because the notion that you can just waltz into the Kremlin and tell Vladimir Putin we're doing a deal, and yes, Putin will do a deal. He will do the deal that is in Russia's interest. He will do the deal that pockets all of the gains that he's gotten, and that at the end of the day is going to be bad not just for Ukraine, not just for Europe, but for the US because Putin then is going to have his eyes on the Baltics, He's going to have his eyes on Moldova and on other prizes which will create more And we've got a you know, business audience here, Joe, So I'm going to put this in economic terms. It is going to make the economies both of Europe but also the US worse. We're going to have tougher time getting high prices for our goods overseas if Europe is at war. So all of these things, you know, hit pretty hard on American businesses.

Well, I can tell you what the American people have learned, and that is that you know, Trump is boastful. He loves to claim that he is the world's best negotiator, and as someone who spent a lot of time in the situation room, a lot of time on the front lines of crises and conflict, it's just not that easy. And Trump should know better. And the American people, quite frankly, shouldn't have known better when Trump was making these claims, because the notion that you can just waltz into the Kremlin and tell Vladimir Putin we're doing a deal, and yes, Putin will do a deal. He will do the deal that is in Russia's interest. He will do the deal that pockets all of the gains that he's gotten, and that at the end of the day is going to be bad not just for Ukraine, not just for Europe, but for the US because Putin then is going to have his eyes on the Baltics, He's going to have his eyes on Moldova and on other prizes which will create more And we've got a you know, business audience here, Joe, So I'm going to put this in economic terms. It is going to make the economies both of Europe but also the US worse. We're going to have tougher time getting high prices for our goods overseas if Europe is at war. So all of these things, you know, hit pretty hard on American businesses.

Can only imagine the conversations being had in the Baltic States right now as we spend time with Brett Bruin. We heard about that call with Vladimir Putin right here on Bloomberg. Earlier today, Steve Whitkoff, the President's envoy to the Middle East who is involved in every apparently region when it comes to diplomacy, talked about the call, described the call as he witnessed it earlier today on Bloomberg Surveillance.

Can only imagine the conversations being had in the Baltic States right now as we spend time with Brett Bruin. We heard about that call with Vladimir Putin right here on Bloomberg. Earlier today, Steve Whitkoff, the President's envoy to the Middle East who is involved in every apparently region when it comes to diplomacy, talked about the call, described the call as he witnessed it earlier today on Bloomberg Surveillance.

Here's what he said.

Here's what he said.

I thought it was epic transformational all. You know, those are the sorts of adjectives that I use about this call. The president and President Trump and President Putin were in sync with one another. The call was outcome oriented.

I thought it was epic transformational all. You know, those are the sorts of adjectives that I use about this call. The president and President Trump and President Putin were in sync with one another. The call was outcome oriented.

Brett epic transformational. The fact of the matter is Vladimir Putin rejected a thirty day truce.

Brett epic transformational. The fact of the matter is Vladimir Putin rejected a thirty day truce.

Isn't that the headline? Yeah?

Isn't that the headline? Yeah?

I think Whitkough is spending a little bit too much time. I'm both drinking the Kremlins kool aid. Last night he suggested that this was a conversation between two great leaders committed to peace, you know, overlooking the fact that Putin has been pretty brutal, that has you know, invaded a sovereign country. And then you know that comment quite frankly, Choe is is just you know him channeling. He is inner Trump, and this seems to be a bit of an affliction for those who go into the administration because at the end of the day, we can look at the result, we can look at what actually came out. Trump went into the call with a ceasefire deal that Ukraine had agreed to for thirty days. He came out of it with essentially a nothing burger. He got thirty days for only not hitting energy infrastructure. That, in diplomatic terms, is an.

I think Whitkough is spending a little bit too much time. I'm both drinking the Kremlins kool aid. Last night he suggested that this was a conversation between two great leaders committed to peace, you know, overlooking the fact that Putin has been pretty brutal, that has you know, invaded a sovereign country. And then you know that comment quite frankly, Choe is is just you know him channeling. He is inner Trump, and this seems to be a bit of an affliction for those who go into the administration because at the end of the day, we can look at the result, we can look at what actually came out. Trump went into the call with a ceasefire deal that Ukraine had agreed to for thirty days. He came out of it with essentially a nothing burger. He got thirty days for only not hitting energy infrastructure. That, in diplomatic terms, is an.

F Wow and f from Brett Bruin.

F Wow and f from Brett Bruin.

Brett, thank you so much for joining us pretty stock today, the President's CEO of the Global Situation Room, which is why we wanted to spend some time with Brett. He's been on phone calls like this, as he mentioned, He's spent a lot of time in the sit room and his insights are important here. Russia apparently not obeying this ceasefire yet, by the way, as they wait to hear from President Zelenski. We're going to have a lot more on this ahead and a very important conversation. We've lined up a series of very experienced voices for you today, and I want you to hear from doctor Rebecca Grant next She's going to be with us right here at the table from the defense programs at the Lexington Institute where she's vice president. Her insights next on military strategy and the next move for Zelenski and Putin.

Brett, thank you so much for joining us pretty stock today, the President's CEO of the Global Situation Room, which is why we wanted to spend some time with Brett. He's been on phone calls like this, as he mentioned, He's spent a lot of time in the sit room and his insights are important here. Russia apparently not obeying this ceasefire yet, by the way, as they wait to hear from President Zelenski. We're going to have a lot more on this ahead and a very important conversation. We've lined up a series of very experienced voices for you today, and I want you to hear from doctor Rebecca Grant next She's going to be with us right here at the table from the defense programs at the Lexington Institute where she's vice president. Her insights next on military strategy and the next move for Zelenski and Putin.

Here on Bloomberg, you're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power Podcast. Catch us live weekdays at noon and five pm Eastern on Apple Cockley and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business App. You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our flagship New York station Just Say Alexa played Bloomberg eleven thirty News for you.

Here on Bloomberg, you're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power Podcast. Catch us live weekdays at noon and five pm Eastern on Apple Cockley and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business App. You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our flagship New York station Just Say Alexa played Bloomberg eleven thirty News for you.

If you were with us.

If you were with us.

At the top of the program, the redhead crossed the terminal. The call has ended between President Trump and Vladimir Zelenski, and we have a little bit of a sense of what they discussed. With more headlines crossing Zelenski. Trump discussed the partial ceasefire and the call that we came out of the Putin meeting with yesterday, Zelenski backing the proposal to halt energy asset strikes. Remember this is the energy infrastructure ceasefire, not the full ceasefire.

At the top of the program, the redhead crossed the terminal. The call has ended between President Trump and Vladimir Zelenski, and we have a little bit of a sense of what they discussed. With more headlines crossing Zelenski. Trump discussed the partial ceasefire and the call that we came out of the Putin meeting with yesterday, Zelenski backing the proposal to halt energy asset strikes. Remember this is the energy infrastructure ceasefire, not the full ceasefire.

That Ukraine had accepted.

That Ukraine had accepted.

Its about an hour long call, a bit of a curious post on Truth Social. It's hard to tell if the president himself, If Donald Trump himself had a lot of interaction with Vladimir Zelensky. As he says in the post on Truth Social, I will ask Secretary of State Marco Rubio and National Security Advisor Michael Walltz to give an accurate description of the points discussed. He says at the top, just completed a very good telephone call with Theleski of Ukraine. No I know we and so I'm curious to hear more. They are promising a statement to read out from the White House, and we'll get that on an official level for you here coming up shortly.

Its about an hour long call, a bit of a curious post on Truth Social. It's hard to tell if the president himself, If Donald Trump himself had a lot of interaction with Vladimir Zelensky. As he says in the post on Truth Social, I will ask Secretary of State Marco Rubio and National Security Advisor Michael Walltz to give an accurate description of the points discussed. He says at the top, just completed a very good telephone call with Theleski of Ukraine. No I know we and so I'm curious to hear more. They are promising a statement to read out from the White House, and we'll get that on an official level for you here coming up shortly.

We'll let you know what's going on here. And it of course follows all of this.

We'll let you know what's going on here. And it of course follows all of this.

As I mentioned the phone call with Vladimir Putin, it was right at this time yesterday we were standing by for the readout on what was a much longer call than.

As I mentioned the phone call with Vladimir Putin, it was right at this time yesterday we were standing by for the readout on what was a much longer call than.

We saw today between Trump and Zelenski.

We saw today between Trump and Zelenski.

Steve Whitkoff, the President's Special Envoy of the Middle East, deeply involved in this negotiation, spoke about it earlier today on Bloomberg Surveillance Listen.

Steve Whitkoff, the President's Special Envoy of the Middle East, deeply involved in this negotiation, spoke about it earlier today on Bloomberg Surveillance Listen.

What was agreed between the two presidents was and it was at President Trump's suggestion that there'd be a cessation of attacks on energy infrastructure from both sides, and civilian infrastructure for that matter, also working towards a black Sea moratorium on hits on naval vessels and freighters carrying grain and things of that sort, and ultimately that would evolve into a full on ceasefire.

What was agreed between the two presidents was and it was at President Trump's suggestion that there'd be a cessation of attacks on energy infrastructure from both sides, and civilian infrastructure for that matter, also working towards a black Sea moratorium on hits on naval vessels and freighters carrying grain and things of that sort, and ultimately that would evolve into a full on ceasefire.

Okay, but what this does not mean is a stop in the fighting between Ukraine and Russia. In fact, it was a hell of a night in Kiev, as we've learned from reporting. Ajas Franz Prince says Russian forces launched six missiles and dozens of drones at Ukraine overnight and a barrage that authorities say killed one person, damaged too hospitals one hundred and forty five drones. The Ukrainian Air Force says it downed seventy two of them. This is where we start our conversation with a real expert on this, and I'm delighted to say that she's at the table with us here.

Okay, but what this does not mean is a stop in the fighting between Ukraine and Russia. In fact, it was a hell of a night in Kiev, as we've learned from reporting. Ajas Franz Prince says Russian forces launched six missiles and dozens of drones at Ukraine overnight and a barrage that authorities say killed one person, damaged too hospitals one hundred and forty five drones. The Ukrainian Air Force says it downed seventy two of them. This is where we start our conversation with a real expert on this, and I'm delighted to say that she's at the table with us here.

At Bloomberg and Washington.

At Bloomberg and Washington.

Doctor Rebecca Grant, Vice president the Defense Programs at the Lexington Institute, Welcome back.

Doctor Rebecca Grant, Vice president the Defense Programs at the Lexington Institute, Welcome back.

It's great to see you.

It's great to see you.

I've got a lot of questions for you about what this deal might bring forth. But the reality at the start here is that we do not have a ceasefire, and even this energy infrastructure hasn't been signed, and so the fighting at this moment continues.

I've got a lot of questions for you about what this deal might bring forth. But the reality at the start here is that we do not have a ceasefire, and even this energy infrastructure hasn't been signed, and so the fighting at this moment continues.

Yes it does. I think we are on the way to a ceasefire. And the continual pulse of shuttle diplomacy, plus the European discussions about peacekeepers and all that, and the involvement of Steve Whitkoff such an important back channel that tells me there is progress here. But this was a big set of attacks all across Ukraine last night.

Yes it does. I think we are on the way to a ceasefire. And the continual pulse of shuttle diplomacy, plus the European discussions about peacekeepers and all that, and the involvement of Steve Whitkoff such an important back channel that tells me there is progress here. But this was a big set of attacks all across Ukraine last night.

What do you make of them?

What do you make of them?

The sort of last gasp opportunity that Vladimir Putin might take.

The sort of last gasp opportunity that Vladimir Putin might take.

Well, Putin still has a taste for war, and remember the Russians say they don't care if it takes till twenty twenty six, Zelensky saying strong as well. Ukraine's air defenses are superb. They did a great job. But at this point neither side is really going to back off militarily until somebody signs on the dotted line, even to do that temporary ceasefire. Now it sounded to me like what Russia did last night was a little bit in violation of what they talked about on the Putin and Trump phone call.

Well, Putin still has a taste for war, and remember the Russians say they don't care if it takes till twenty twenty six, Zelensky saying strong as well. Ukraine's air defenses are superb. They did a great job. But at this point neither side is really going to back off militarily until somebody signs on the dotted line, even to do that temporary ceasefire. Now it sounded to me like what Russia did last night was a little bit in violation of what they talked about on the Putin and Trump phone call.

Is it?

Is it?

So, do you assume that when you a call like that ends that the other party is going to make good on the deal about to be signed? Or did Putin say you let me know when Zelenski has the pen in his hand.

So, do you assume that when you a call like that ends that the other party is going to make good on the deal about to be signed? Or did Putin say you let me know when Zelenski has the pen in his hand.

Probably something like that, because I can't imagine Putin couldn't call the Russian Air Force and go, hey, back.

Probably something like that, because I can't imagine Putin couldn't call the Russian Air Force and go, hey, back.

Off, sure, right, exactly.

Off, sure, right, exactly.

Okay, So with that said, he wants a cessation, he wants all US military aid to Ukraine to stop. He's indicated that that is a condition for him to sign the full ceasefire, the full thirty day truce.

Okay, So with that said, he wants a cessation, he wants all US military aid to Ukraine to stop. He's indicated that that is a condition for him to sign the full ceasefire, the full thirty day truce.

What are we actually sending right now?

What are we actually sending right now?

Oh, we are sending a lot ammunition, of course, And don't forget, we're also doing the support that's so vital. Ukraine's F sixteen's, they get constant electronic warfare updates. NATO and the US help Ukraine in cyber defense. We do some space assistance to them, so that that's why it can be kind of turned on and turned off. And then of course all the ammunition, whether it's from hei Mars to the smaller weapons type one continues.

Oh, we are sending a lot ammunition, of course, And don't forget, we're also doing the support that's so vital. Ukraine's F sixteen's, they get constant electronic warfare updates. NATO and the US help Ukraine in cyber defense. We do some space assistance to them, so that that's why it can be kind of turned on and turned off. And then of course all the ammunition, whether it's from hei Mars to the smaller weapons type one continues.

They're receiving Kaimar's replacement interceptors and so forth on a daily weekly basis.

They're receiving Kaimar's replacement interceptors and so forth on a daily weekly basis.

That's right, the pipeline is going. Trump has to keep that going because Ukraine has to stay strong. And actually Trump said himself that no, he wasn't going to back off on eight. He did not promise Putin to stop any aid.

That's right, the pipeline is going. Trump has to keep that going because Ukraine has to stay strong. And actually Trump said himself that no, he wasn't going to back off on eight. He did not promise Putin to stop any aid.

Right.

Right.

Well, so there are two things here, And it's funny the way you write headlines.

Well, so there are two things here, And it's funny the way you write headlines.

Yesterday it was.

Yesterday it was.

Putin commits to energy, infrastructure ceasefire. You could also write Putin rejects full cease fire. You could also write Donald Trump and I think you just said it refuses to end US military aid to Ukraine.

Putin commits to energy, infrastructure ceasefire. You could also write Putin rejects full cease fire. You could also write Donald Trump and I think you just said it refuses to end US military aid to Ukraine.

Which one's the most important here?

Which one's the most important here?

I think right now keeping that military aid to Ukraine. I do think that there's progress. It's going to be slow. Putin is going to haggle every inch of the way. But as Sexuary Rubio said a couple of weeks ago, you know this, What we have to do now is get Putin to the table metaphorically, and there's a little bit of progress there. But Trump keeping the AD up is super important to getting a good resolution.

I think right now keeping that military aid to Ukraine. I do think that there's progress. It's going to be slow. Putin is going to haggle every inch of the way. But as Sexuary Rubio said a couple of weeks ago, you know this, What we have to do now is get Putin to the table metaphorically, and there's a little bit of progress there. But Trump keeping the AD up is super important to getting a good resolution.

I'm sure he was asked by Vladimir Putin to stop right during that phone call, to stop the shipments.

I'm sure he was asked by Vladimir Putin to stop right during that phone call, to stop the shipments.

Who on Earth knows, Yes, who on Earth knows who asks for a lot of things.

Who on Earth knows, Yes, who on Earth knows who asks for a lot of things.

That's right.

That's right.

A maritime ceasefire would mean what for the Black Sea and for the outcome.

A maritime ceasefire would mean what for the Black Sea and for the outcome.

Of this war.

Of this war.

Oh, this was so interesting because it's part of the possible offer. Ukraine has dominated the Black Sea. They've destroyed forty percent of Russia's Black Sea fleet. Russia had to move their navy headquarters off a Crimea back to someplace safer and with a lot of maritime drones and help from the West, they really run the Black Sea. So this is very much an advantage for Russia if Ukraine would agree to stop, you know, shooting down Russian helicopters over the Black Sea and all that they've been able to do with a lot of help from their friends in the West.

Oh, this was so interesting because it's part of the possible offer. Ukraine has dominated the Black Sea. They've destroyed forty percent of Russia's Black Sea fleet. Russia had to move their navy headquarters off a Crimea back to someplace safer and with a lot of maritime drones and help from the West, they really run the Black Sea. So this is very much an advantage for Russia if Ukraine would agree to stop, you know, shooting down Russian helicopters over the Black Sea and all that they've been able to do with a lot of help from their friends in the West.

To mention attacking that bridge, Ama, we're spending time here with the doctor and some news that I didn't think we'd be talking about here with Rebecca Grant. The President just took the truth social talking about the Houthis in Yemen. We're just reading this together for the first time. Reports are coming in that while Iran has lessened its intensity on military equipment and general support to the Houthis, they are still sending large levels of supplies. The President rights, Iran must stop the sending of these supplies immediately. Let the Houthis fight it out themselves. He says, either way they lose, but this way they lose quickly. Tremendous damage inflicted upon the Huthi barbarians, he writes, and watch how it will get progressively worse. It's not even a fair fight, never will be. They will be completely annihilated exclamation point. Just yesterday he said that anything fired by the Houthis, We're gonna treat like it was fired by Iran.

To mention attacking that bridge, Ama, we're spending time here with the doctor and some news that I didn't think we'd be talking about here with Rebecca Grant. The President just took the truth social talking about the Houthis in Yemen. We're just reading this together for the first time. Reports are coming in that while Iran has lessened its intensity on military equipment and general support to the Houthis, they are still sending large levels of supplies. The President rights, Iran must stop the sending of these supplies immediately. Let the Houthis fight it out themselves. He says, either way they lose, but this way they lose quickly. Tremendous damage inflicted upon the Huthi barbarians, he writes, and watch how it will get progressively worse. It's not even a fair fight, never will be. They will be completely annihilated exclamation point. Just yesterday he said that anything fired by the Houthis, We're gonna treat like it was fired by Iran.

What are we in.

What are we in.

For here, Well, that tells me that the USS Harry S. Truman, our craft carrier in the region, is loading ordinance, possibly to do additional strikes. We know Central Command has more targets available, and Trump is said all along that this campaign can go on as long as necessary. But there's another message here. Because Iran supports the Hoodies, but so does Russia. We know there has been Russian intelligence used by the Hoodies to target our US Navy ships and global shipping traffic. So don't forget the hoody message goes to Iran, but it also goes to putin.

For here, Well, that tells me that the USS Harry S. Truman, our craft carrier in the region, is loading ordinance, possibly to do additional strikes. We know Central Command has more targets available, and Trump is said all along that this campaign can go on as long as necessary. But there's another message here. Because Iran supports the Hoodies, but so does Russia. We know there has been Russian intelligence used by the Hoodies to target our US Navy ships and global shipping traffic. So don't forget the hoody message goes to Iran, but it also goes to putin.

This is huge.

This is huge.

This had to have come up yesterday. And now you start. When you crack the door on something like that, you remind us of how much we do not know about what happened in that conversation, how many layers we're talking about here, how one deal can lead to another, the triangulation that the White House might be involved in. What does this mean for a potential attack against Iran.

This had to have come up yesterday. And now you start. When you crack the door on something like that, you remind us of how much we do not know about what happened in that conversation, how many layers we're talking about here, how one deal can lead to another, the triangulation that the White House might be involved in. What does this mean for a potential attack against Iran.

Well, it means that I think we should see possibly more strikes against the hoodies, and I'd like to see them debilitated. We've done it too hamas to hustle law, but against the hoodies at first. Now, do Iranian targets become legit? You know, there was an Iranian ship that sits in the Red Sea giving targeting information. Is that a legitimate military target? Maybe? What about their oil terminal down in the South. I think it's possible that we might see something, but I would expect to see first a step up against some of the hooty legitimate military targets.

Well, it means that I think we should see possibly more strikes against the hoodies, and I'd like to see them debilitated. We've done it too hamas to hustle law, but against the hoodies at first. Now, do Iranian targets become legit? You know, there was an Iranian ship that sits in the Red Sea giving targeting information. Is that a legitimate military target? Maybe? What about their oil terminal down in the South. I think it's possible that we might see something, but I would expect to see first a step up against some of the hooty legitimate military targets.

Okay, I can't imagine that that's a terribly tall order for our military, our navy and Air force conducting those strikes. What happens if you sink a ship flying under an Iranian flag?

Okay, I can't imagine that that's a terribly tall order for our military, our navy and Air force conducting those strikes. What happens if you sink a ship flying under an Iranian flag?

Well, interesting question. If it's a legitimate Iranian military target, then you know that's probably within the rules of the road. If they're assisting in strikes legit target.

Well, interesting question. If it's a legitimate Iranian military target, then you know that's probably within the rules of the road. If they're assisting in strikes legit target.

You know what people say, though, that's we're starting to talk about World War three. This is what we have always learned growing up. If you attack Iran, what are you unleashing? Or did we learn better when Iran tried to strike Israel last year?

You know what people say, though, that's we're starting to talk about World War three. This is what we have always learned growing up. If you attack Iran, what are you unleashing? Or did we learn better when Iran tried to strike Israel last year?

Well, and I think the other thing we've learned is we can't appease Iran, and we know that we can defend against what Iran sends.

Well, and I think the other thing we've learned is we can't appease Iran, and we know that we can defend against what Iran sends.

Out Back to where we started, we've gone a little bit far afield here. And that is, of course the call today with Trump and Zelenski. What's the next move? Is it a Trump putin meeting? Is it all three of these people talking right?

Out Back to where we started, we've gone a little bit far afield here. And that is, of course the call today with Trump and Zelenski. What's the next move? Is it a Trump putin meeting? Is it all three of these people talking right?

Next move is back to Saudi Arabia. I think Steve Wikoff will be going to that. And hey, the real news out of that call is it took place and Trump was happy. What a change from the Oval Office meeting before right, and so the main purpose of this call would have been for Trump and his team Rubio and Waltz to backbrief Zolenski on what was discussed with Putin, choosing what items to talk about, and then seeing where Zelenski stands.

Next move is back to Saudi Arabia. I think Steve Wikoff will be going to that. And hey, the real news out of that call is it took place and Trump was happy. What a change from the Oval Office meeting before right, and so the main purpose of this call would have been for Trump and his team Rubio and Waltz to backbrief Zolenski on what was discussed with Putin, choosing what items to talk about, and then seeing where Zelenski stands.

We only have a minute left with Rebecca Grant. What is the one thing that Ukraine could do to inflict the most pain against Russia right now?

We only have a minute left with Rebecca Grant. What is the one thing that Ukraine could do to inflict the most pain against Russia right now?

Oh?

Oh?

While to continue holding out in the Korusk region is certainly painful for Putin. He visited himself and Putin hates it when they attacked the Courage Bridge. I don't know what their plans are, but it's Kursk, yes, except for the kurch straight and down by the seas is off. But the number one thing is for Ukraine to remain sovereign, to remain close to the West, and to be a viable country going forward. Bluten's gonna hate that.

While to continue holding out in the Korusk region is certainly painful for Putin. He visited himself and Putin hates it when they attacked the Courage Bridge. I don't know what their plans are, but it's Kursk, yes, except for the kurch straight and down by the seas is off. But the number one thing is for Ukraine to remain sovereign, to remain close to the West, and to be a viable country going forward. Bluten's gonna hate that.

Wow, well, those are very much in doubt at the moment. I guess we'll see where we are.

Wow, well, those are very much in doubt at the moment. I guess we'll see where we are.

Would you come back to talk to us again soon anytime?

Would you come back to talk to us again soon anytime?

Really great to spend time with you here on Bloomberg doctor Rebecca Grant of course Lexington Institute. As I mentioned here on Bloomberg, I'm Joe Matthew in Washington, the fastest show in politics with our Political panel.

Really great to spend time with you here on Bloomberg doctor Rebecca Grant of course Lexington Institute. As I mentioned here on Bloomberg, I'm Joe Matthew in Washington, the fastest show in politics with our Political panel.

Next.

Next.

Stay with us here on the radio and on YouTube search Bloomberg Business News Live.

Stay with us here on the radio and on YouTube search Bloomberg Business News Live.

I'll have a lot more ahead.

I'll have a lot more ahead.

You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. Catch us live weekdays at noon and five pm Eastern on Apple Cocklay and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business App. Listen on demand wherever you get your podcasts, or watch us live on YouTube.

You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. Catch us live weekdays at noon and five pm Eastern on Apple Cocklay and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business App. Listen on demand wherever you get your podcasts, or watch us live on YouTube.

I'm also interested to see Joe when we get chime in from perhaps more hawkish congressional Republicans who have long been supportive of Ukraine. When do those voices on Capitol Hill actually start to weigh in? Because at this point this is happening at the executive levels.

I'm also interested to see Joe when we get chime in from perhaps more hawkish congressional Republicans who have long been supportive of Ukraine. When do those voices on Capitol Hill actually start to weigh in? Because at this point this is happening at the executive levels.

Buy in large and of course lawmakers in their home districts avoiding town all meetings in many cases. So imagine how different that conversation would have been if Congress was in town here.

Buy in large and of course lawmakers in their home districts avoiding town all meetings in many cases. So imagine how different that conversation would have been if Congress was in town here.

It's a great point.

It's a great point.

Yeah, Well, of course they return next week, and it's going to be an interesting return for the Democratic Party, especially which has had some deep divisions exposed in the effort to keep the government funded beyond the deadline of midnight last week, and of course was in part because of a change of heart of the Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer, who decided it was less painful to keep the lights on than to avert a shutdown or to have a shutdown that puts some resistance on Trump and congressional Republicans. He's obviously Cotton got a lot of flak for that, including from House leadership or those who used to be yeah, in House leaders.

Yeah, Well, of course they return next week, and it's going to be an interesting return for the Democratic Party, especially which has had some deep divisions exposed in the effort to keep the government funded beyond the deadline of midnight last week, and of course was in part because of a change of heart of the Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer, who decided it was less painful to keep the lights on than to avert a shutdown or to have a shutdown that puts some resistance on Trump and congressional Republicans. He's obviously Cotton got a lot of flak for that, including from House leadership or those who used to be yeah, in House leaders.

Pretty tough words from Nancy Pelosi as the walls start to close in he had to cancel the book tour.

Pretty tough words from Nancy Pelosi as the walls start to close in he had to cancel the book tour.

Yep, and it's pretty tough stuff.

Yep, and it's pretty tough stuff.

She was at a news conference at Children's Hospital in San Francisco. Get a sense of what the former speaker had to say.

She was at a news conference at Children's Hospital in San Francisco. Get a sense of what the former speaker had to say.

I myself, don't give away anything for a non ding. I think that's what happened the other day. We could have in mind who perhaps gotten them to agree to a third web, which was a bipartisan cr for two four weeks in which we could have had bipartisan legislation to go forward.

I myself, don't give away anything for a non ding. I think that's what happened the other day. We could have in mind who perhaps gotten them to agree to a third web, which was a bipartisan cr for two four weeks in which we could have had bipartisan legislation to go forward.

So in summary, Nancy Pelosi felt that there was another way out here, a third way that Chuck Schumer did not take. But the quote I don't give away anything for nothing, that's right. And this is where we begin with our political panel. Mar Gillespie is with us Bluestack Strategies founder and Republican strategist, alongside Democratic strategist Roger Fisk, former special advisor to President Barack Obama. Welcome to you both. Roger, as the Demoocrat, we have to start with you, did Chuck Schumer give away something for nothing? And he's certainly getting a whole lot of something in return for that decision he is.

So in summary, Nancy Pelosi felt that there was another way out here, a third way that Chuck Schumer did not take. But the quote I don't give away anything for nothing, that's right. And this is where we begin with our political panel. Mar Gillespie is with us Bluestack Strategies founder and Republican strategist, alongside Democratic strategist Roger Fisk, former special advisor to President Barack Obama. Welcome to you both. Roger, as the Demoocrat, we have to start with you, did Chuck Schumer give away something for nothing? And he's certainly getting a whole lot of something in return for that decision he is.

He's getting a whole lot of incoming fire from his colleagues. But as we all know, the Democrats tend to be that circular firing squad. But thank you so much for having me, and it's great to be here with Mara as well. Whenever I speak with elected officials, I always stress that there's two tracks to look at your potential ascension through. One is leadership, which obviously Senator Schumer has gone on, and the other is kind of national voice, which is where AOC has gone for example, Because if you're going to go leadership in these situations you often have to take very institutionalist, very tough votes that are about sometimes just preventing worse things from happening.

He's getting a whole lot of incoming fire from his colleagues. But as we all know, the Democrats tend to be that circular firing squad. But thank you so much for having me, and it's great to be here with Mara as well. Whenever I speak with elected officials, I always stress that there's two tracks to look at your potential ascension through. One is leadership, which obviously Senator Schumer has gone on, and the other is kind of national voice, which is where AOC has gone for example, Because if you're going to go leadership in these situations you often have to take very institutionalist, very tough votes that are about sometimes just preventing worse things from happening.

Whereas if you go the track.

Whereas if you go the track.

Of trying to establish a national voice, you can then have a little distance from those things and exercise more of a a more of a free voice around them. So that's a dynamic I think you're playing out. And I do think that all of these leadership dynamics are always looking for a moment that is going to crystallize kind of some circumstances that have been churning below the surface. People have been unhappy with the last few Senate cycles, so I think there's going to be an appetite for more leadership. And as you're already seeing, for example with Senator Shats from Hawaii, people are willing to be very out there in terms of talking about their aspirations when it comes to the next generation of leadership of the Democrats in the Senate.

Of trying to establish a national voice, you can then have a little distance from those things and exercise more of a a more of a free voice around them. So that's a dynamic I think you're playing out. And I do think that all of these leadership dynamics are always looking for a moment that is going to crystallize kind of some circumstances that have been churning below the surface. People have been unhappy with the last few Senate cycles, so I think there's going to be an appetite for more leadership. And as you're already seeing, for example with Senator Shats from Hawaii, people are willing to be very out there in terms of talking about their aspirations when it comes to the next generation of leadership of the Democrats in the Senate.

Enter Glenn Ivy, the Democrat from Maryland, the gentleman from Oxen Hill, deep blue right outside of Washington.

Enter Glenn Ivy, the Democrat from Maryland, the gentleman from Oxen Hill, deep blue right outside of Washington.

D C.

D C.

Mora at a town hall last night quote, I think he had a great long standing career, did a lot of great things, but I'm afraid it may be time for the Senate Democrats to get a new leader unquote. How loud will these calls get from other members on Capitol Hill?

Mora at a town hall last night quote, I think he had a great long standing career, did a lot of great things, but I'm afraid it may be time for the Senate Democrats to get a new leader unquote. How loud will these calls get from other members on Capitol Hill?

Will they make a difference?

Will they make a difference?

They should.

They should.

The Democratic Party is in need of leadership, right. They've struggled, you know, as it's just pointed out. You know that first cycle is now without having a strong voice and a strong leadership presence. And I think Dean Phillips during the last election presidential election called this out. He said it's time to pass the torch, and that was refused to do so until June of last year when Joe Biden was forced out of the race by somebody like a Nancy Pelosi, who, by the way, will be eighty five later this month, who has a net worth of almost a quarter of a billion dollars, and she's ruled with an iron fist. She's somebody who has had a long career but is still pulling the string as in leadership, but not necessarily putting herself out there as much, but she certainly picks her moments. I do think the Democratic Party needs to find its own identity again and decide what their fight is about if it's simply to be against Trump, that's obviously not working for them, they need to be for something as well. And I just think that this superiority complex that we've seen play out isn't going to be helpful and it isn't really resonating with voters. So this point, I think the calls for new leadership and new direction is going to be louder and louder well.

The Democratic Party is in need of leadership, right. They've struggled, you know, as it's just pointed out. You know that first cycle is now without having a strong voice and a strong leadership presence. And I think Dean Phillips during the last election presidential election called this out. He said it's time to pass the torch, and that was refused to do so until June of last year when Joe Biden was forced out of the race by somebody like a Nancy Pelosi, who, by the way, will be eighty five later this month, who has a net worth of almost a quarter of a billion dollars, and she's ruled with an iron fist. She's somebody who has had a long career but is still pulling the string as in leadership, but not necessarily putting herself out there as much, but she certainly picks her moments. I do think the Democratic Party needs to find its own identity again and decide what their fight is about if it's simply to be against Trump, that's obviously not working for them, they need to be for something as well. And I just think that this superiority complex that we've seen play out isn't going to be helpful and it isn't really resonating with voters. So this point, I think the calls for new leadership and new direction is going to be louder and louder well.

And this obviously stands in contrast to something Joe was alluding to earlier, which is that you currently have Republican members of Congress who are holding town halls back home in their districts and essentially getting shouted out of these places where they are speaking. We saw that most recently with Chuck Edwards of North Carolina, but there have been numerous other examples. Are Democrats doing Republicans a huge favor here Moura by having an unorganized opposition to something that clearly is a vulnerability for the people currently in the majority.

And this obviously stands in contrast to something Joe was alluding to earlier, which is that you currently have Republican members of Congress who are holding town halls back home in their districts and essentially getting shouted out of these places where they are speaking. We saw that most recently with Chuck Edwards of North Carolina, but there have been numerous other examples. Are Democrats doing Republicans a huge favor here Moura by having an unorganized opposition to something that clearly is a vulnerability for the people currently in the majority.

They're certainly not helping themselves. But yes, I think there is going to be ripe opportunities for Democrats to point out the failures, perhaps of what was promised to them at the twenty twenty four election and what's not being delivered, but instead they can't find that voice, they can't find that path because they don't have leadership. And again, like I said, they've kind of operated from this moral superiority standpoint that isn't resonating and it comes across as arrogant, and so at the end of the day, voters feel very left behind. They feel very very dissatisfied with their government. And I think that you're seeing a lot more people who don't feel as though they belong to either party. And we saw it kind of in the last election as well, this political homelessness that we're watching play out. And I don't know that either party is doing a good job of explaining I'm actually here for you, and here's how I'm going to do that for you. Here's how, here's why, and here's how. We're not seeing that. And I think as we get closer to the midterms, that's going to be a bigger problem for both parties. Truly.

They're certainly not helping themselves. But yes, I think there is going to be ripe opportunities for Democrats to point out the failures, perhaps of what was promised to them at the twenty twenty four election and what's not being delivered, but instead they can't find that voice, they can't find that path because they don't have leadership. And again, like I said, they've kind of operated from this moral superiority standpoint that isn't resonating and it comes across as arrogant, and so at the end of the day, voters feel very left behind. They feel very very dissatisfied with their government. And I think that you're seeing a lot more people who don't feel as though they belong to either party. And we saw it kind of in the last election as well, this political homelessness that we're watching play out. And I don't know that either party is doing a good job of explaining I'm actually here for you, and here's how I'm going to do that for you. Here's how, here's why, and here's how. We're not seeing that. And I think as we get closer to the midterms, that's going to be a bigger problem for both parties. Truly.

Well, let's name names here, Roger, because it's you know, it's easy to talk about kicking somebody out, it's a lot more difficult to replace them with someone who can get the support of the Democratic Caucus.

Well, let's name names here, Roger, because it's you know, it's easy to talk about kicking somebody out, it's a lot more difficult to replace them with someone who can get the support of the Democratic Caucus.

Everyone's looking at AOC.

Everyone's looking at AOC.

This is the whole conversation right now in Washington, which leads me to believe that that may not be very likely. The conventional wisdom is rarely the direction we're going in here.

This is the whole conversation right now in Washington, which leads me to believe that that may not be very likely. The conventional wisdom is rarely the direction we're going in here.

Let's be honest.

Let's be honest.

Chuck Schumer is going to be sitting in that chamber a couple of years from that, wasn't he.

Chuck Schumer is going to be sitting in that chamber a couple of years from that, wasn't he.

I don't know that that's as clear a certainty as you might think. We live in an age and you can look at everything from the Iowa Caucus, for example, which at least on the Democratic side, it's all but completely toppled. Where anyone who thinks that there's some fixed cultural icon that's impervious to the trade winds I think doesn't realize how rapid the change can be in this particular day and age. And so I think it wouldn't take much for someone to come out and declare a candidacy now, for example, and then for concurrent with Senator Schumer being primary as another example, to bring about a situation where he himself shows himself the door. And that's just the era that we live in, the age of cultural icons being able to withstand attack after attack after attack is over.

I don't know that that's as clear a certainty as you might think. We live in an age and you can look at everything from the Iowa Caucus, for example, which at least on the Democratic side, it's all but completely toppled. Where anyone who thinks that there's some fixed cultural icon that's impervious to the trade winds I think doesn't realize how rapid the change can be in this particular day and age. And so I think it wouldn't take much for someone to come out and declare a candidacy now, for example, and then for concurrent with Senator Schumer being primary as another example, to bring about a situation where he himself shows himself the door. And that's just the era that we live in, the age of cultural icons being able to withstand attack after attack after attack is over.

Well, so when we consider the battles that are still ahead, Knowing Congress will be coming back into session next week, Roger, they're expected, at least on the Republican side, to start dealing immediately with budget reconciliation, and that whatever that architecture ultimately is going to look like, what does Chuck Schumer or Democrats as a whole need to do to counter that? Knowing that it's expected to be a party line thing, they don't really have a role.

Well, so when we consider the battles that are still ahead, Knowing Congress will be coming back into session next week, Roger, they're expected, at least on the Republican side, to start dealing immediately with budget reconciliation, and that whatever that architecture ultimately is going to look like, what does Chuck Schumer or Democrats as a whole need to do to counter that? Knowing that it's expected to be a party line thing, they don't really have a role.

Yeah, I mean, being in the minority in either chamber is very, very difficult. There's the there's the performative nature, as we've seen in committees like the Judiciary or Oversight, where, for example, you could make some headway with Chairman Comer being so concerned about Hunter Biden and his connections with China, and then here you have the same Oversight committee absolutely refusing to bring mister Musk in front of it, who's having a much larger material impact on the trajectory of this country and by any measure, has much more business dealings with China than possibly any other human being alive.

Yeah, I mean, being in the minority in either chamber is very, very difficult. There's the there's the performative nature, as we've seen in committees like the Judiciary or Oversight, where, for example, you could make some headway with Chairman Comer being so concerned about Hunter Biden and his connections with China, and then here you have the same Oversight committee absolutely refusing to bring mister Musk in front of it, who's having a much larger material impact on the trajectory of this country and by any measure, has much more business dealings with China than possibly any other human being alive.

So they can make some.

So they can make some.

Headway in those performative levels, but and then and then trying to compile the resistance into some kind of not just an opposition as a as a reactive but weave it into some larger fighting for people in a kitchen table sense, very similar to how Senator Slotkin did the response to the Address to the Nation. That's I think the challenge that's ahead of the Democrats for the remainder of the year and on into next year.

Headway in those performative levels, but and then and then trying to compile the resistance into some kind of not just an opposition as a as a reactive but weave it into some larger fighting for people in a kitchen table sense, very similar to how Senator Slotkin did the response to the Address to the Nation. That's I think the challenge that's ahead of the Democrats for the remainder of the year and on into next year.

That's Roger Fisk. She is Mora A.

That's Roger Fisk. She is Mora A.

Gillespie, great panels today. Thank you so much both for the insights of it. Thanks for listening to the Balance of Power podcast. Make sure to subscribe if you haven't already, at Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts, and you can find us live every weekday from Washington, DC at noontime Eastern at Bloomberg car

Gillespie, great panels today. Thank you so much both for the insights of it. Thanks for listening to the Balance of Power podcast. Make sure to subscribe if you haven't already, at Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts, and you can find us live every weekday from Washington, DC at noontime Eastern at Bloomberg car