Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. Catch Just Live weekdays at noon Eastern on Apocarplay and then roud Otto with the Bloomberg Business app. Listen on demand wherever you get your podcasts, or watch us live on YouTube.

Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. Catch Just Live weekdays at noon Eastern on Apocarplay and then roud Otto with the Bloomberg Business app. Listen on demand wherever you get your podcasts, or watch us live on YouTube.

Hayle lines alongside Joe Matthew here in Washington where we really all have many questions today, but one of them particular looming large over Capitol Hill, and that is the question of whether or not we will see in full by sanctioned release the Ethics Committee will sort into Matt Gates. Because remember, if the Committee does not vote to actually release this formally, we could still hypothetically see it leaked.

Hayle lines alongside Joe Matthew here in Washington where we really all have many questions today, but one of them particular looming large over Capitol Hill, and that is the question of whether or not we will see in full by sanctioned release the Ethics Committee will sort into Matt Gates. Because remember, if the Committee does not vote to actually release this formally, we could still hypothetically see it leaked.

Well, that's a good point. There's a big difference between the two.

Well, that's a good point. There's a big difference between the two.

There are different ways to get this information, including by the way, the lawyer of the women involved in this case, those who brought allegations against Matt Gates, has started doing interviews in mainstream media, and we're going to be surrounded by these stories one way or the other.

There are different ways to get this information, including by the way, the lawyer of the women involved in this case, those who brought allegations against Matt Gates, has started doing interviews in mainstream media, and we're going to be surrounded by these stories one way or the other.

But it's happening as we speak.

But it's happening as we speak.

As Kaylee mentioned, the Ethics Committee is gathering right now, and our reporter at the location lets us know that Chairman Michael Guest has arrived. He had little to say as he did arrive. And the top Democrat, Susan Wilde is there as well. So this is happening as we speak. And we're joined now by a Member of Congress, Roger Christian Morphy, the Democrat from Illinois is with us, of course, ranking member, the Democratic leader on the China Select Committee. Congressman, welcome, It's great to have you back here on Bloomberg TV and Radio. I wonder your thoughts on this, if you have any updates for us on whether this report will be released or whether you think it should be released.

As Kaylee mentioned, the Ethics Committee is gathering right now, and our reporter at the location lets us know that Chairman Michael Guest has arrived. He had little to say as he did arrive. And the top Democrat, Susan Wilde is there as well. So this is happening as we speak. And we're joined now by a Member of Congress, Roger Christian Morphy, the Democrat from Illinois is with us, of course, ranking member, the Democratic leader on the China Select Committee. Congressman, welcome, It's great to have you back here on Bloomberg TV and Radio. I wonder your thoughts on this, if you have any updates for us on whether this report will be released or whether you think it should be released.

I don't know what they're going to decide. I think it should be released. I think that there's precedent for this. You know, we know of situations where there were severe scandals, and this is one of them where you know, we're basically having someone being nominated to be the top law enforcement official in the country to enforce the laws who's implicated in breaking so many of them. And I don't need to go through the sordid list, but this is someone who should not have been nominated, let alone confirmed.

I don't know what they're going to decide. I think it should be released. I think that there's precedent for this. You know, we know of situations where there were severe scandals, and this is one of them where you know, we're basically having someone being nominated to be the top law enforcement official in the country to enforce the laws who's implicated in breaking so many of them. And I don't need to go through the sordid list, but this is someone who should not have been nominated, let alone confirmed.

Well, and as we consider the information that Senators will have access to as they decide whether or not to confirm mister Gates. Bloomberg is reporting today, citing sources familiar, that the Trump transition team still has not signed an agreement with the Justice Department and therefore the FBI that would allow the bureau to vet nominees. You, of course, also sit on the Intelligence Committee, Congressman, and I just wonder your thoughts on what it would mean if we don't get full background checks for, frankly, any of these people who could be getting some of the most powerful seats in the American political universe.

Well, and as we consider the information that Senators will have access to as they decide whether or not to confirm mister Gates. Bloomberg is reporting today, citing sources familiar, that the Trump transition team still has not signed an agreement with the Justice Department and therefore the FBI that would allow the bureau to vet nominees. You, of course, also sit on the Intelligence Committee, Congressman, and I just wonder your thoughts on what it would mean if we don't get full background checks for, frankly, any of these people who could be getting some of the most powerful seats in the American political universe.

I think that's all you need to know with regard to some of these nominees. The fact that they're not willing to have a background check of these folks tells you that there are some serious flaws with them, not to mention that they're just ill qualified and ill prepared to do these jobs. And so I'm hopeful that the Senate will have hearings and vote a lot of these down. But I'm even more hopeful that maybe a couple of these will be withdrawn by the incoming president, given how seriously flawed they are.

I think that's all you need to know with regard to some of these nominees. The fact that they're not willing to have a background check of these folks tells you that there are some serious flaws with them, not to mention that they're just ill qualified and ill prepared to do these jobs. And so I'm hopeful that the Senate will have hearings and vote a lot of these down. But I'm even more hopeful that maybe a couple of these will be withdrawn by the incoming president, given how seriously flawed they are.

Well, Congressman no matter what happens here, it sure looks like Republicans and Democrats are going to have to continue working together if anything of any seriousness is going to come out of this Congress. Before you joined us, we were talking about the possibility of a Republican majority of one seat, realizing that's not the most likely scenario, it's still possible with now I believe four races to be called. We just had one called while we were talking. While you were answering that last question, Marcy Captor winning re election in Ohio's ninth congressional district. That is the longest serving woman in congressional history, And so the walls are closing in a little bit more here on this Republican majority. What role will the Democratic minority play in the new Congress? And will you help re elect Mike Johnson as speaker?

Well, Congressman no matter what happens here, it sure looks like Republicans and Democrats are going to have to continue working together if anything of any seriousness is going to come out of this Congress. Before you joined us, we were talking about the possibility of a Republican majority of one seat, realizing that's not the most likely scenario, it's still possible with now I believe four races to be called. We just had one called while we were talking. While you were answering that last question, Marcy Captor winning re election in Ohio's ninth congressional district. That is the longest serving woman in congressional history, And so the walls are closing in a little bit more here on this Republican majority. What role will the Democratic minority play in the new Congress? And will you help re elect Mike Johnson as speaker?

Well, I think that. Let me answer the first part, which is I think the Democratic Minority is going to be essential in getting the business of the Chamber done. As you know, on spending bill after spending bill, in terms of making sure the government functions, Mike Johnson and Kevin McCarthy for that matter, relied on Democrats to supply the votes to get the bills passed. I'm not going to be supporting Mike Johnson. I'm going to be supporting Hakeem Jefferies to be Speaker, and I think we'll be unified in that particular vote.

Well, I think that. Let me answer the first part, which is I think the Democratic Minority is going to be essential in getting the business of the Chamber done. As you know, on spending bill after spending bill, in terms of making sure the government functions, Mike Johnson and Kevin McCarthy for that matter, relied on Democrats to supply the votes to get the bills passed. I'm not going to be supporting Mike Johnson. I'm going to be supporting Hakeem Jefferies to be Speaker, and I think we'll be unified in that particular vote.

Well, when we consider the idea that come the next Congress, whenever the new speaker is elected, there could be three vacancies that need to be filled by special elections, and that could provide a bit of leverage for Democrats. Congressman, how easy will it be for the minority to hold up the first one hundred days agenda working with this kind of margin.

Well, when we consider the idea that come the next Congress, whenever the new speaker is elected, there could be three vacancies that need to be filled by special elections, and that could provide a bit of leverage for Democrats. Congressman, how easy will it be for the minority to hold up the first one hundred days agenda working with this kind of margin.

Well, there are any number of issues that require a majority vote, and as you know, some of my colleagues on the other side will not in any case, for instance, vote on spending bills vote for them. I should say, I call them part of the vote no Hope Yes caucus where they are hoping that there are enough Republicans and for that matter, the majority of Democrats supporting that measure to make it go through passage so that they don't have to support it and they can rail against it and rhetorically oppose it. So I think Democrats will absolutely be necessary for a lot of routine business that the incoming present as well as Speaker Johnson need to get done in Congress.

Well, there are any number of issues that require a majority vote, and as you know, some of my colleagues on the other side will not in any case, for instance, vote on spending bills vote for them. I should say, I call them part of the vote no Hope Yes caucus where they are hoping that there are enough Republicans and for that matter, the majority of Democrats supporting that measure to make it go through passage so that they don't have to support it and they can rail against it and rhetorically oppose it. So I think Democrats will absolutely be necessary for a lot of routine business that the incoming present as well as Speaker Johnson need to get done in Congress.

We're hearing about red lines, Congressman, from President She this is something that we talk to you about, of course, because of your perch on the China Select Committee and President she met with Joe Biden at the Apex sum at the end of last week and reiterated his four red lines for when Washington turns over to a new Congress and of course a new administration with Donald Trump in the White House in January, should he.

We're hearing about red lines, Congressman, from President She this is something that we talk to you about, of course, because of your perch on the China Select Committee and President she met with Joe Biden at the Apex sum at the end of last week and reiterated his four red lines for when Washington turns over to a new Congress and of course a new administration with Donald Trump in the White House in January, should he.

Be concerned about what is coming?

Be concerned about what is coming?

What will the Trump second administration mean for our relationship with China? Beyond this idea of across the board tariffs. Will there be a relationship between these two it all?

What will the Trump second administration mean for our relationship with China? Beyond this idea of across the board tariffs. Will there be a relationship between these two it all?

Yeah, I think so. I think there will be some continuity with regard to the policies of the Biden administration going into the second Trump administration, just the same way there was from the first Trump administration into the Biden administration. So, for instance, I'm hopeful that they'll keep the export controls in place with regard to high end semiconductor exports. I'm hopeful that they'll keep the outbound investment restrictions in place. And finally, among other things, we have to do everything we can to repair our military industrial base and also equipp Taiwan and our friends and partners and allies with what they need to deter aggression by the Chinese Communist Party.

Yeah, I think so. I think there will be some continuity with regard to the policies of the Biden administration going into the second Trump administration, just the same way there was from the first Trump administration into the Biden administration. So, for instance, I'm hopeful that they'll keep the export controls in place with regard to high end semiconductor exports. I'm hopeful that they'll keep the outbound investment restrictions in place. And finally, among other things, we have to do everything we can to repair our military industrial base and also equipp Taiwan and our friends and partners and allies with what they need to deter aggression by the Chinese Communist Party.

What about TikTok, Congressman, because apparently the president elect wouldn't like to see it banned. After all, what's its fate in the United States given the legislation that has already passed and become law.

What about TikTok, Congressman, because apparently the president elect wouldn't like to see it banned. After all, what's its fate in the United States given the legislation that has already passed and become law.

You're exactly right. It is the law. It's in the courts. I fully expect that it will be upheld by the courts, and if the incoming president wants to repeal that legislation, he should come back to Congress. Now, you should know that three hundred and sixty people voted in favor of this legislation in the House, not to mention a huge majority in the Senate, and so I think that there's a lot of sentiment in favor of making sure that we protect our national security.

You're exactly right. It is the law. It's in the courts. I fully expect that it will be upheld by the courts, and if the incoming president wants to repeal that legislation, he should come back to Congress. Now, you should know that three hundred and sixty people voted in favor of this legislation in the House, not to mention a huge majority in the Senate, and so I think that there's a lot of sentiment in favor of making sure that we protect our national security.

You know, Donald try up As indicated that Mark Zuckerberg might be a greater threat to the American people than anything posed by TikTok. He says, you get rid of TikTok and you empower Mark Zuckerberg, how would you react to that.

You know, Donald try up As indicated that Mark Zuckerberg might be a greater threat to the American people than anything posed by TikTok. He says, you get rid of TikTok and you empower Mark Zuckerberg, how would you react to that.

I don't think.

I don't think.

I personally think that with regard to anybody in the United States, if the President wants to do something about social media, for instance, which a lot of us believe need to be regulated better, then we need to pursue legislation here in the House and the Senate and get it signed into law by the President. And we can do that. But with regard to a foreign adversary controlling a social media app, they are beyond our loss, they are beyond our rules and regulations. And that's why this particular law, which requires a divestment by byteedance of TikTok, makes sense, and that's why it commanded so much support.

I personally think that with regard to anybody in the United States, if the President wants to do something about social media, for instance, which a lot of us believe need to be regulated better, then we need to pursue legislation here in the House and the Senate and get it signed into law by the President. And we can do that. But with regard to a foreign adversary controlling a social media app, they are beyond our loss, they are beyond our rules and regulations. And that's why this particular law, which requires a divestment by byteedance of TikTok, makes sense, and that's why it commanded so much support.

Congressman, we were all a bit puzzled yesterday when the announcement dropped from the President elect nominating Howard Lutnik to be Commerce Secretary. Also included in that announcement saying that he is now going to have direct oversight of the Office of the US Trade Representatives, which typically reports directly to the President. And I wonder as we consider the relationship with China, specifically, knowing the battle that is likely to come over tariffs. What you make of that move in this kind of operational structure.

Congressman, we were all a bit puzzled yesterday when the announcement dropped from the President elect nominating Howard Lutnik to be Commerce Secretary. Also included in that announcement saying that he is now going to have direct oversight of the Office of the US Trade Representatives, which typically reports directly to the President. And I wonder as we consider the relationship with China, specifically, knowing the battle that is likely to come over tariffs. What you make of that move in this kind of operational structure.

I'm not sure you know. All I can say is that the substance of the policies that they're talking about across the board, tariffs of twenty percent on all goods from everywhere in the world, would be severely disruptive, be super inflationary. From my constituents. It would hurt my exporters in Illinois, including our farmers in Illinois. And then it would, you know, basically divide us from our friends, partners, and allies whom we need encountering aggression from China.

I'm not sure you know. All I can say is that the substance of the policies that they're talking about across the board, tariffs of twenty percent on all goods from everywhere in the world, would be severely disruptive, be super inflationary. From my constituents. It would hurt my exporters in Illinois, including our farmers in Illinois. And then it would, you know, basically divide us from our friends, partners, and allies whom we need encountering aggression from China.

All right, Congressman, we always appreciate you joining us live from Capitol Hill and in your district as well. When you are there. Congressman Raja Krishna Murphy, the Democrat from Illinois Live on Bloomberg TV and Radio.

All right, Congressman, we always appreciate you joining us live from Capitol Hill and in your district as well. When you are there. Congressman Raja Krishna Murphy, the Democrat from Illinois Live on Bloomberg TV and Radio.

You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast Ken Just Live weekdays at noon Eastern on Applecarplay and then royd Otto with the Bloomberg Business App. You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our flagship New York station, Just Say Alexa Play Bloomberg eleven thirty.

You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast Ken Just Live weekdays at noon Eastern on Applecarplay and then royd Otto with the Bloomberg Business App. You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our flagship New York station, Just Say Alexa Play Bloomberg eleven thirty.

The House Ethics Committee is gathered now at an undisclosed location as they weigh whether or not to release their report looking into now former Congressman Matt Gates, who of course resigned just days ago after Donald Trump nominated him to be Attorney General. Matt Gates, as we speak, is on Capitol Hill as well with the Vice President elect jd Vance for meetings with a handful of Republican Senators, knowing it will take many Republican votes, more than fifty of them to get Gates confirmed, as well as members of the House are looking for more information on Gates to be revealed, as we've heard from Congressman Sean Caston who joined this program yesterday, as well as a number of Republican voices on the Hill yesterday.

The House Ethics Committee is gathered now at an undisclosed location as they weigh whether or not to release their report looking into now former Congressman Matt Gates, who of course resigned just days ago after Donald Trump nominated him to be Attorney General. Matt Gates, as we speak, is on Capitol Hill as well with the Vice President elect jd Vance for meetings with a handful of Republican Senators, knowing it will take many Republican votes, more than fifty of them to get Gates confirmed, as well as members of the House are looking for more information on Gates to be revealed, as we've heard from Congressman Sean Caston who joined this program yesterday, as well as a number of Republican voices on the Hill yesterday.

The Ethics Committee has the authority to release that report. And I think what scares a lot of us is that we saw the last time that the Trump was in the White House that he not only surrounds himself with sexual predators, people who are credibly accused of sexual assault, but suppresses that information.

The Ethics Committee has the authority to release that report. And I think what scares a lot of us is that we saw the last time that the Trump was in the White House that he not only surrounds himself with sexual predators, people who are credibly accused of sexual assault, but suppresses that information.

I think I'm safe and saying that President Trump would like to see him have his confirmation hearing and get a shot.

I think I'm safe and saying that President Trump would like to see him have his confirmation hearing and get a shot.

His chance to respond will be a confirmation hearing.

His chance to respond will be a confirmation hearing.

I think that if they want a speedy consideration of this nomination, there's.

I think that if they want a speedy consideration of this nomination, there's.

We've got to have as much transparency as we can.

We've got to have as much transparency as we can.

We're creating a false crisis because the reality is all that information is going to be on display at the hearing.

We're creating a false crisis because the reality is all that information is going to be on display at the hearing.

Thank Brett Kavanaugh.

Thank Brett Kavanaugh.

I'm going to hold my folks to the same standard I would hold Democrat nominees.

I'm going to hold my folks to the same standard I would hold Democrat nominees.

A false crisis.

A false crisis.

Quite a few voices we've heard from on both sides of Capitol Hill in the past couple of days. Here as we assemble our political panel, Genie Shanzeno is with us Bloomberg Politics contributor, Democratic Analysts and political science professor at Iona University, alongside Maura Gillespie, founder Bluestack Strategies Republican strategist Mora. I'll start with you as our Republican. Having worked for John Bahner in the Speaker's office, you appreciate the traditions and conventions of the House of Representatives. Should the Ethics Committee release.

Quite a few voices we've heard from on both sides of Capitol Hill in the past couple of days. Here as we assemble our political panel, Genie Shanzeno is with us Bloomberg Politics contributor, Democratic Analysts and political science professor at Iona University, alongside Maura Gillespie, founder Bluestack Strategies Republican strategist Mora. I'll start with you as our Republican. Having worked for John Bahner in the Speaker's office, you appreciate the traditions and conventions of the House of Representatives. Should the Ethics Committee release.

This report, I think they should. It's not unprecedented. You know, after Mark Foley left, they also released Theatic investigation into him, So I think there's president to do so. And again, if we're talking about a position for the cabinet level of you know, Department of Justice, Attorney General, this is huge and the Senate needs to have of the materials and everything possible to properly vet, and this report is important to that aspect, I think. Regardless, I believe Tom Tillis and a couple other Senator Kramer people I've said, you know, regardless of whether the Committee decides to release it, it probably will get out. But I think that for the integrity of the institution, if you go to the proper channels, then I would like to see the Ethics Committee release that report. Well.

This report, I think they should. It's not unprecedented. You know, after Mark Foley left, they also released Theatic investigation into him, So I think there's president to do so. And again, if we're talking about a position for the cabinet level of you know, Department of Justice, Attorney General, this is huge and the Senate needs to have of the materials and everything possible to properly vet, and this report is important to that aspect, I think. Regardless, I believe Tom Tillis and a couple other Senator Kramer people I've said, you know, regardless of whether the Committee decides to release it, it probably will get out. But I think that for the integrity of the institution, if you go to the proper channels, then I would like to see the Ethics Committee release that report. Well.

Weigh in on this integrity question, Genie, because of course the House Ethics Committee is unique in that it's equal representation from both parties here, it does require a certain amount of bipartisan cooperation because of that, and I wonder if the Committee does not in fact rule to release this but it gets out anyway, if that is going to create problems for investigations that could come in the future where you would hope bipartisanship would be still the name of the game.

Weigh in on this integrity question, Genie, because of course the House Ethics Committee is unique in that it's equal representation from both parties here, it does require a certain amount of bipartisan cooperation because of that, and I wonder if the Committee does not in fact rule to release this but it gets out anyway, if that is going to create problems for investigations that could come in the future where you would hope bipartisanship would be still the name of the game.

Yeah, I mean, that's In fact, the concern and the Democrats have that Republicans have that it does threatened the integrity of the committee. As more mentioned, it has happened in the past that they have released. You know, one of my favorite sort of ideas that we've heard in the last twenty four hours is somebody takes a page from the Pentagon papers, goes onto the House floor and reads the report into the record, so they wouldn't face any legal repercussions or the challenge of leaking to reporters. That would certainly make for a fascinating look at the congressional record after that, But I don't know if anybody will do that. You know, you also have somebody like wild on that committee, the ranking member, who has nothing to lose since she lost reelection. But it all does raise challenges about how the committee operates going forward.

Yeah, I mean, that's In fact, the concern and the Democrats have that Republicans have that it does threatened the integrity of the committee. As more mentioned, it has happened in the past that they have released. You know, one of my favorite sort of ideas that we've heard in the last twenty four hours is somebody takes a page from the Pentagon papers, goes onto the House floor and reads the report into the record, so they wouldn't face any legal repercussions or the challenge of leaking to reporters. That would certainly make for a fascinating look at the congressional record after that, But I don't know if anybody will do that. You know, you also have somebody like wild on that committee, the ranking member, who has nothing to lose since she lost reelection. But it all does raise challenges about how the committee operates going forward.

Well.

Well.

Donald Trump prefers to not use the FBI, at least this time around, to vet his nominees, and there is now a standoff with senators demanding that they see those who will be involved in the confirmation process more that they see the FBI file on Matt Gates. Is that not fair game for someone who could be running the Department of Justice.

Donald Trump prefers to not use the FBI, at least this time around, to vet his nominees, and there is now a standoff with senators demanding that they see those who will be involved in the confirmation process more that they see the FBI file on Matt Gates. Is that not fair game for someone who could be running the Department of Justice.

It's absolutely a fair game. You want to be the person who's running the entire department, you need to go through every proper channel that we have. And this is where it gets frustrating. I think that for a lot of people who have worked on Capitol Hill or have encountered the former congressman, I believe he now a former congressman having resigned, it's not surprising, unfortunately about these reports. And so for those who are pretending as if this is shocking news, they're just being misleading because the stories about Matt Gates and what he has showed other members and other members have shared with us in the past does amount to a concern. And that's putting it lightly about him having this position, and to think that he would just skate through or go through a recis appointment is really concerning and it doesn't bode well to kick off your administration, to go back into the White House and have this hanging overhead. I just don't think it's a smart move.

It's absolutely a fair game. You want to be the person who's running the entire department, you need to go through every proper channel that we have. And this is where it gets frustrating. I think that for a lot of people who have worked on Capitol Hill or have encountered the former congressman, I believe he now a former congressman having resigned, it's not surprising, unfortunately about these reports. And so for those who are pretending as if this is shocking news, they're just being misleading because the stories about Matt Gates and what he has showed other members and other members have shared with us in the past does amount to a concern. And that's putting it lightly about him having this position, and to think that he would just skate through or go through a recis appointment is really concerning and it doesn't bode well to kick off your administration, to go back into the White House and have this hanging overhead. I just don't think it's a smart move.

Well, we're getting some more moves or reports of from the Trump transition. CBS News is now reporting that Trump is expected to name for the Office of Management and Budgement budget excuse me, Ross Vogue, who of course served in that role during his first term. He also is one of the author's genie of a section of Project twenty twenty five. And this is not the first time we have seen a name put out that didn't have affiliation with Project twenty twenty five. And I wonder what this is revealing to you about just how closely we should expect that blueprint to be followed in this incoming White House.

Well, we're getting some more moves or reports of from the Trump transition. CBS News is now reporting that Trump is expected to name for the Office of Management and Budgement budget excuse me, Ross Vogue, who of course served in that role during his first term. He also is one of the author's genie of a section of Project twenty twenty five. And this is not the first time we have seen a name put out that didn't have affiliation with Project twenty twenty five. And I wonder what this is revealing to you about just how closely we should expect that blueprint to be followed in this incoming White House.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I mean it's such a good point because we've seen a number of these nominees so far, some of whom authored parts of the report, and there were hundreds of people on that report, so it's, you know, to be expected. But you know, I think it is going to impact the policymaking going forward and is guiding what the Trump administration incoming administration hopes to do. And I think what's most concerning about that is we are often told that Donald Trump is authentic, he's not afraid to say the quiet part out loud, and yet he stood during the campaign and said he has nothing to do with Project twenty twenty five. It'll have no impact on how he governs. And yet these nominees tell a different story. So I think he does owe it to the American people to say what is the affiliation there, how much of that is going to guide especially considering we got a nominee yesterday of Linda McMahon for education and a big part of that report is focused on dismantling the education department.

I mean it's such a good point because we've seen a number of these nominees so far, some of whom authored parts of the report, and there were hundreds of people on that report, so it's, you know, to be expected. But you know, I think it is going to impact the policymaking going forward and is guiding what the Trump administration incoming administration hopes to do. And I think what's most concerning about that is we are often told that Donald Trump is authentic, he's not afraid to say the quiet part out loud, and yet he stood during the campaign and said he has nothing to do with Project twenty twenty five. It'll have no impact on how he governs. And yet these nominees tell a different story. So I think he does owe it to the American people to say what is the affiliation there, how much of that is going to guide especially considering we got a nominee yesterday of Linda McMahon for education and a big part of that report is focused on dismantling the education department.

Well, I want to ask you about that as an educator. You pointed me right to it. Donald Trump, in his statement announcing Linda McMahon says, quote, we will send education back to the States, all caps, and Linda will spearhead that effort. Her job essentially is to dismantle the Department of Education. But she's going to need congressional approval or he will to make that happen. In the meantime, it seems there's some low hanging fruit according to the initial analysis here genie stopping schools from promoting inaccurate and unpatriotic concepts about American history surrounding institutionalized racism. That sounds like critical race theory. Also expanding voucher programs that direct more public funds to parents to spend on homeschooling, on religious schools. Do you see all that happening in the first one hundred days.

Well, I want to ask you about that as an educator. You pointed me right to it. Donald Trump, in his statement announcing Linda McMahon says, quote, we will send education back to the States, all caps, and Linda will spearhead that effort. Her job essentially is to dismantle the Department of Education. But she's going to need congressional approval or he will to make that happen. In the meantime, it seems there's some low hanging fruit according to the initial analysis here genie stopping schools from promoting inaccurate and unpatriotic concepts about American history surrounding institutionalized racism. That sounds like critical race theory. Also expanding voucher programs that direct more public funds to parents to spend on homeschooling, on religious schools. Do you see all that happening in the first one hundred days.

Yeah, I don't see the dismantling for the reason you mentioned. They would need to overcome the filibuster be very hard to do. And I do see her pushing for school choice. She will follow in the tradition of Betsy de Vos who was devoted to that as well. The Senate is thinking on the GOP side of a tax credit in that direction, so I think she may see some movement there. But the issue of this CRT or the critic race theory elimination, the cultural changes they're talking about raise is a really important question. What if the state of Massachusetts decides it wants to teach CRT, are they going to use the department that they're talking about closing then to force the state not to teach it. I think they've got to make a choice. Are they for returning education to the state level the local level or is it only returning it to the state and local level when the state is doing what this Christian nationalist movement in visions should be taught. And that's going to be a big fight about federalism going forward.

Yeah, I don't see the dismantling for the reason you mentioned. They would need to overcome the filibuster be very hard to do. And I do see her pushing for school choice. She will follow in the tradition of Betsy de Vos who was devoted to that as well. The Senate is thinking on the GOP side of a tax credit in that direction, so I think she may see some movement there. But the issue of this CRT or the critic race theory elimination, the cultural changes they're talking about raise is a really important question. What if the state of Massachusetts decides it wants to teach CRT, are they going to use the department that they're talking about closing then to force the state not to teach it. I think they've got to make a choice. Are they for returning education to the state level the local level or is it only returning it to the state and local level when the state is doing what this Christian nationalist movement in visions should be taught. And that's going to be a big fight about federalism going forward.

Well, so more our way in here, What do you think is more likely that they just try to change what actually is mandated by the Department and apply it nationally, or really do attempt to dismantle it and hope that they can get Congress to go along.

Well, so more our way in here, What do you think is more likely that they just try to change what actually is mandated by the Department and apply it nationally, or really do attempt to dismantle it and hope that they can get Congress to go along.

Well, the Genie's point, if they're going to go through making it, returning it to the States, that would be somewhat consistent with what a concern the principle would be, you know, smaller government. But to then enforce their will what they want the States to do, that then is a contradiction and would be entirely hypocritical to then have that stance as well. So you can't have it both ways, you know, pick one or the other. But I think also this idea that they're going to be able to do this in the first hundred days, really they have the two years if you think about it, because there will be a referendum in two years essentially if people are liking the way that the things are going with the Trump administration or not, when we have another round of House voats and they'll get the way in. So it's really a matter of two years essentially to push through as much as they can or would like to get done.

Well, the Genie's point, if they're going to go through making it, returning it to the States, that would be somewhat consistent with what a concern the principle would be, you know, smaller government. But to then enforce their will what they want the States to do, that then is a contradiction and would be entirely hypocritical to then have that stance as well. So you can't have it both ways, you know, pick one or the other. But I think also this idea that they're going to be able to do this in the first hundred days, really they have the two years if you think about it, because there will be a referendum in two years essentially if people are liking the way that the things are going with the Trump administration or not, when we have another round of House voats and they'll get the way in. So it's really a matter of two years essentially to push through as much as they can or would like to get done.

It's time to.

It's time to.

Start running for the mid terms now, or would eliminating the Department of Education moreau be good for America.

Start running for the mid terms now, or would eliminating the Department of Education moreau be good for America.

You know, I can't say that I think just full out dismantling it, but I do think and this is something that you're starting to see people realize there needs to be some accountability across the departments of you know, an audit. A lot of funds have been used in ways that we don't even know about. So having a little more transparency to look into what each department is spending money on. I don't think it's a bad thing, and I think it's something that we as the americ people who are funding a lot of this stuff that through tax payer dollars, should know what's being spent. So I think doing a deep dive on these departments is a positive step and so that we should be okay with as a country that is severely in debt.

You know, I can't say that I think just full out dismantling it, but I do think and this is something that you're starting to see people realize there needs to be some accountability across the departments of you know, an audit. A lot of funds have been used in ways that we don't even know about. So having a little more transparency to look into what each department is spending money on. I don't think it's a bad thing, and I think it's something that we as the americ people who are funding a lot of this stuff that through tax payer dollars, should know what's being spent. So I think doing a deep dive on these departments is a positive step and so that we should be okay with as a country that is severely in debt.

All right, Mara Gillespie and Jeanie Shanzy know our political panel today, Thank you so much for joining us. And we're getting more reporting now out from our team here at Bloomberg about what exactly the second White House could look like and who could be in it, what kind of roles they could be filling. Apparently the President elect and his team are mollly creating the first ever White House crypto role in our vetting people for that post. Keeping in mind, of course that over the course of the campaign, Donald Trump did say he wants to make the US the bitcoin capital of.

All right, Mara Gillespie and Jeanie Shanzy know our political panel today, Thank you so much for joining us. And we're getting more reporting now out from our team here at Bloomberg about what exactly the second White House could look like and who could be in it, what kind of roles they could be filling. Apparently the President elect and his team are mollly creating the first ever White House crypto role in our vetting people for that post. Keeping in mind, of course that over the course of the campaign, Donald Trump did say he wants to make the US the bitcoin capital of.

The National Stockpile or reserve. I was curious if this is a cabinet position. Does this fall under the Treasury secretary get.

The National Stockpile or reserve. I was curious if this is a cabinet position. Does this fall under the Treasury secretary get.

To be named?

To be named?

Is it a bizarre We'll have a lot to learn bitcoin. By the way, Gray Scale up one and a half percent.

Is it a bizarre We'll have a lot to learn bitcoin. By the way, Gray Scale up one and a half percent.

This is Bloomberg.

This is Bloomberg.

You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. Catch Just Live weekdays at noon Eastern on Applecarplay and then Rouno with the Bloomberg Business app. Listen on demand wherever you get your podcasts, or watch us live on YouTube as we.

You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. Catch Just Live weekdays at noon Eastern on Applecarplay and then Rouno with the Bloomberg Business app. Listen on demand wherever you get your podcasts, or watch us live on YouTube as we.

Bring you the latest on the transition and on leadership elections on Capitol Hill.

Bring you the latest on the transition and on leadership elections on Capitol Hill.

It's all coming together.

It's all coming together.

Knowing of course that Washington is going to turn red in January, Donald Trump will move into the White House, and a lot of things around here are going to change, some of them changing already. If you take a look at what's happening in the Senate. Look, we talked about the horse race throughout the campaign cycle, right who was up one point, who was down by a half point. It was painful and tedious. Now we're going through the churn of the transition. It's the name game, it's survivor at mar a Lago. And look, this is what keeps the gears turning in Washington. It's a big part of it. But I want to give you a different view into what's happening right now inside the nation's capital. There are a lot of people who help to make this city work. Some of them you don't see and hear from a lot on TV or the radio like this, and that's for a reason, because they're the important ones. They're the ones who move the money and the policy. And that's what we talk about when we consider the concept of K Street here in Washington. It's another one of the estates helping the capital run. And I promised you we'd bring you a titan of K Street with me at the table today. For an important conversation is Rob Waters. He founded the Madison Group, which is an important lobbying firm. I'll call it K Street, even though it's on Pennsylvania Avenue about twenty years ago. Rob spent years as an advisor and an operative in the US House is specialty budgets and appropriations, which we talk about every day here on Balance of Power. Served as a consultant to the Department of Commerce in the US Trade rep and as a long record of working with foreign governments here in Washington helping them find opportunities. He's also a noted wine connoisseur. Rob Waters, Welcome to Bloomberg. It's nice to see you.

Knowing of course that Washington is going to turn red in January, Donald Trump will move into the White House, and a lot of things around here are going to change, some of them changing already. If you take a look at what's happening in the Senate. Look, we talked about the horse race throughout the campaign cycle, right who was up one point, who was down by a half point. It was painful and tedious. Now we're going through the churn of the transition. It's the name game, it's survivor at mar a Lago. And look, this is what keeps the gears turning in Washington. It's a big part of it. But I want to give you a different view into what's happening right now inside the nation's capital. There are a lot of people who help to make this city work. Some of them you don't see and hear from a lot on TV or the radio like this, and that's for a reason, because they're the important ones. They're the ones who move the money and the policy. And that's what we talk about when we consider the concept of K Street here in Washington. It's another one of the estates helping the capital run. And I promised you we'd bring you a titan of K Street with me at the table today. For an important conversation is Rob Waters. He founded the Madison Group, which is an important lobbying firm. I'll call it K Street, even though it's on Pennsylvania Avenue about twenty years ago. Rob spent years as an advisor and an operative in the US House is specialty budgets and appropriations, which we talk about every day here on Balance of Power. Served as a consultant to the Department of Commerce in the US Trade rep and as a long record of working with foreign governments here in Washington helping them find opportunities. He's also a noted wine connoisseur. Rob Waters, Welcome to Bloomberg. It's nice to see you.

Why Joe, thank you. So it is Pennsylvania Avenue.

Why Joe, thank you. So it is Pennsylvania Avenue.

Not it is Pennsylvania Avenue, which means you get away with a lot. So you know where the bodies are buried. You also know where the money is buried. And I just want to start broadly with you. When people talk about K Street and the business of influence in this town, what is changing right now? You're looking at leadership be selected, You're looking at the transition, filling in the blanks. When do you start finding opportunities or are you already when it comes to influence?

Not it is Pennsylvania Avenue, which means you get away with a lot. So you know where the bodies are buried. You also know where the money is buried. And I just want to start broadly with you. When people talk about K Street and the business of influence in this town, what is changing right now? You're looking at leadership be selected, You're looking at the transition, filling in the blanks. When do you start finding opportunities or are you already when it comes to influence?

A lot of the day after the election. So it's awesome.

A lot of the day after the election. So it's awesome.

It's I mean, the game is the game, but it's a numbers game. And you know, a president, any president, has one hundred days of his first day in to really affect policy and process. And it doesn't matter who you are. You are and I'm a Republican, so I'm a pretty happy guy right now.

It's I mean, the game is the game, but it's a numbers game. And you know, a president, any president, has one hundred days of his first day in to really affect policy and process. And it doesn't matter who you are. You are and I'm a Republican, so I'm a pretty happy guy right now.

You are.

You are.

But you know, it is so close to the numbers in the House of Representatives, and you know, if you have under sixty in the Senate, you're gonna need to talk. So as much as everyone says, you know it's a red sweep, it's still very much a bipartisan, more regional I need this guy from here and this guy from here, or this lady from here, this lady from here. So it remains ever the numbers game, yep. Interesting and you won't be new for Mike Johnson. Now what is in store for John Thune.

But you know, it is so close to the numbers in the House of Representatives, and you know, if you have under sixty in the Senate, you're gonna need to talk. So as much as everyone says, you know it's a red sweep, it's still very much a bipartisan, more regional I need this guy from here and this guy from here, or this lady from here, this lady from here. So it remains ever the numbers game, yep. Interesting and you won't be new for Mike Johnson. Now what is in store for John Thune.

He's got a wider majority, not by much than Mitch McConnell, but he's also got a very different mandating. He's got Donald Trump on the other end of Pennsylvania Avenue with some high demands.

He's got a wider majority, not by much than Mitch McConnell, but he's also got a very different mandating. He's got Donald Trump on the other end of Pennsylvania Avenue with some high demands.

I mean, listen, nobody can look at the Senate and not say Mitch McConnell wasn't a titan. I mean, just one of the best operators smartest people ever. I've been blessed to know and work with him in his office for many years. Those are big shoes to fill. John Thune has has a different conference. You know, for the first time the majority is actually under fifty five. So it's it's an interesting generational shift that's happening. Amazing and people who have more of a populist view of America first as opposed to you know, that Wilsonian thought process that you know a generation ago had.

I mean, listen, nobody can look at the Senate and not say Mitch McConnell wasn't a titan. I mean, just one of the best operators smartest people ever. I've been blessed to know and work with him in his office for many years. Those are big shoes to fill. John Thune has has a different conference. You know, for the first time the majority is actually under fifty five. So it's it's an interesting generational shift that's happening. Amazing and people who have more of a populist view of America first as opposed to you know, that Wilsonian thought process that you know a generation ago had.

Well, So, how does that change your job when you're dealing with Populis that changes the rules for lobbying?

Well, So, how does that change your job when you're dealing with Populis that changes the rules for lobbying?

Does it not well? Or does it make it more predictable?

Does it not well? Or does it make it more predictable?

Well, we're advocates for American employers, so I think it makes it far better for us. Okay, you know, I mean bringing jobs to America and creating industry in America is what we do, and representing those interests as an honor, and you know, I think it's the mandate that the electorate set is like, look, you know, we don't want to pay two dollars more for eggs or three dollars more for milk. We would like to buy into the American dreams. So how that gets processed is just a new venue.

Well, we're advocates for American employers, so I think it makes it far better for us. Okay, you know, I mean bringing jobs to America and creating industry in America is what we do, and representing those interests as an honor, and you know, I think it's the mandate that the electorate set is like, look, you know, we don't want to pay two dollars more for eggs or three dollars more for milk. We would like to buy into the American dreams. So how that gets processed is just a new venue.

But a populous streak makes things less predictable for you, does it not?

But a populous streak makes things less predictable for you, does it not?

I think the math is the same.

I think the math is the same.

Really absolutely, Talk to me then about the business of relationships. You've got new people coming into Washington. You've had a number of retirements here. Yeah, you never stop. You're the ultimate networker. How do you find me in when you're in a time of transition like this?

Really absolutely, Talk to me then about the business of relationships. You've got new people coming into Washington. You've had a number of retirements here. Yeah, you never stop. You're the ultimate networker. How do you find me in when you're in a time of transition like this?

You know, you help your friends, you support your friends, you listen, you show up, and you know a lot of the people that I am blessed to represent have employment in many districts. And we sit and listen and talk and continue the conversation. That's all it is.

You know, you help your friends, you support your friends, you listen, you show up, and you know a lot of the people that I am blessed to represent have employment in many districts. And we sit and listen and talk and continue the conversation. That's all it is.

Who's calling right now? Is it your existing clients? Is it new business coming in? What's it like in the weeks after the election?

Who's calling right now? Is it your existing clients? Is it new business coming in? What's it like in the weeks after the election?

I mean, you talk to your clients every day. I mean, you know who we represent, so we talk to them every day. And you know, I've had meetings with new people who are looking at opportunities to advance their agenda and create more jobs in America.

I mean, you talk to your clients every day. I mean, you know who we represent, so we talk to them every day. And you know, I've had meetings with new people who are looking at opportunities to advance their agenda and create more jobs in America.

And you can give our listeners and viewers a sense of who you represent, by the way, if you choose to name.

And you can give our listeners and viewers a sense of who you represent, by the way, if you choose to name.

Names fantastic top tier corporations.

Names fantastic top tier corporations.

That's that's very well done. I had a feeling you might answer it that way. So talk to me about the year ahead. Well, extending the Trump tax cuts the biggest job.

That's that's very well done. I had a feeling you might answer it that way. So talk to me about the year ahead. Well, extending the Trump tax cuts the biggest job.

You have to do that. How how do you not?

You have to do that. How how do you not?

I mean a part of listen, I know, build back better and all the things that we did. But what spurred economic growth were the fact that people have more money in their pocket. And honestly, you have to extend those tax cuts. And but that's got to go through K Street the I mean, I think it has to go through the ways and means. I send it for it, I send it Finance House.

I mean a part of listen, I know, build back better and all the things that we did. But what spurred economic growth were the fact that people have more money in their pocket. And honestly, you have to extend those tax cuts. And but that's got to go through K Street the I mean, I think it has to go through the ways and means. I send it for it, I send it Finance House.

But you know that's not going to pass without the help of guys like you.

But you know that's not going to pass without the help of guys like you.

I mean, I don't think it's going to pass without two hundred and eighteen people in the House and fifty one in the Senate.

I mean, I don't think it's going to pass without two hundred and eighteen people in the House and fifty one in the Senate.

You're not taking credit for this. Talk to me about Christmas trees then, because we're going to make about to.

You're not taking credit for this. Talk to me about Christmas trees then, because we're going to make about to.

Buy one right after Thanksgiving. Okay, And you know I prefer white lights online, Well.

Buy one right after Thanksgiving. Okay, And you know I prefer white lights online, Well.

You can put all the white lights you want on this thing. They're called amendments, they're called they're called writers.

You can put all the white lights you want on this thing. They're called amendments, they're called they're called writers.

Yes, absolutely, So you're.

Yes, absolutely, So you're.

Talking about the funding bill.

Talking about the funding bill.

Look the government we run out of money on December twenty.

Look the government we run out of money on December twenty.

We do, and I think it will be a short term pass to allow for more review on government funding.

We do, and I think it will be a short term pass to allow for more review on government funding.

And listen.

And listen.

I'm enthused about, you know, the president saying that he wants us to look at wasteful government spending. I mean, all due respect, I mean you can cut five percent across the board right now and return it down and lower our debt yield.

I'm enthused about, you know, the president saying that he wants us to look at wasteful government spending. I mean, all due respect, I mean you can cut five percent across the board right now and return it down and lower our debt yield.

I mean you just can do it.

I mean you just can do it.

I think Ida the doughe.

I think Ida the doughe.

The doge with a vivek and yes, yeah, I think it's a good idea.

The doge with a vivek and yes, yeah, I think it's a good idea.

Somebody's got to listen to them, though, and enact it. I think that's when another phone call comes to your office.

Somebody's got to listen to them, though, and enact it. I think that's when another phone call comes to your office.

I think people need to realize, you know, when government agencies can't pass an audit or don't know where the money went five seven years in a row, maybe there's a problem. Maybe there can be cut. So I think President elect Trump is absolutely right that, you know, waste, fraud and abuse exists, and I think they're better ways to spend it.

I think people need to realize, you know, when government agencies can't pass an audit or don't know where the money went five seven years in a row, maybe there's a problem. Maybe there can be cut. So I think President elect Trump is absolutely right that, you know, waste, fraud and abuse exists, and I think they're better ways to spend it.

We could see our first trillion dollar defense budget this year.

We could see our first trillion dollar defense budget this year.

We could do you see.

We could do you see.

That happening and to what extent will that money stay here in the US. This is something that you're going to end up talking about a.

That happening and to what extent will that money stay here in the US. This is something that you're going to end up talking about a.

Lot next year.

Lot next year.

I mean, I think that we are realizing what the true threats facing our country is. And you know, China is an exigent threat. They are looking at our trade routes, violating them in Roe doctrine. In every day of the week, you have Russian trawlers that are cutting internet cables and you know this affects our communication. And I think we need to take a look at how our information flow, our financial tools, and how our commerce tradelines are looked at.

I mean, I think that we are realizing what the true threats facing our country is. And you know, China is an exigent threat. They are looking at our trade routes, violating them in Roe doctrine. In every day of the week, you have Russian trawlers that are cutting internet cables and you know this affects our communication. And I think we need to take a look at how our information flow, our financial tools, and how our commerce tradelines are looked at.

And I am enthused.

And I am enthused.

About a Secretary of State designate Marco Rubio and the team that's coming in there. And I think the economic team that President Trump will name will be well received by the market.

About a Secretary of State designate Marco Rubio and the team that's coming in there. And I think the economic team that President Trump will name will be well received by the market.

It's interesting that we're Bloomberg. So we're obsessing over the Treasury secretary. I think you should be well, it's going to be a pretty big deal. We're also obsessing over some of the names that have been floated that certain senators don't think they can support. Yeah, and to the extent you want to weigh in on the Matt Gates, is the Pete hegseats. They're being walked around by JD. Vans right now. You've seen this process before. Is it different this time or not?

It's interesting that we're Bloomberg. So we're obsessing over the Treasury secretary. I think you should be well, it's going to be a pretty big deal. We're also obsessing over some of the names that have been floated that certain senators don't think they can support. Yeah, and to the extent you want to weigh in on the Matt Gates, is the Pete hegseats. They're being walked around by JD. Vans right now. You've seen this process before. Is it different this time or not?

No, it's the same process. Look.

No, it's the same process. Look.

I was lucky enough to be one of the people who walked around one of the sub cabinets under the first Trump administration. I will be doing that again under this administration.

I was lucky enough to be one of the people who walked around one of the sub cabinets under the first Trump administration. I will be doing that again under this administration.

Incoming President elect is not asking too much of the Senate to clear all these names.

Incoming President elect is not asking too much of the Senate to clear all these names.

I think the president elect has the right to name whoever he wants in the Senate that the Senate has the right to ad buse and consent to that.

I think the president elect has the right to name whoever he wants in the Senate that the Senate has the right to ad buse and consent to that.

So you're not feeling a rubber stamp in the Fune conference when it comes to these.

So you're not feeling a rubber stamp in the Fune conference when it comes to these.

I mean, they may not all pass as I like to say.

I mean, they may not all pass as I like to say.

They all sing from the same hymnals, but they sing the words that they wish.

They all sing from the same hymnals, but they sing the words that they wish.

Okay, So not everyone gets confirmed.

Okay, So not everyone gets confirmed.

That's normal, right, But I mean, show me one administration that everyone has been confirmed.

That's normal, right, But I mean, show me one administration that everyone has been confirmed.

Ever, it just doesn't happen.

Ever, it just doesn't happen.

We have only about a minute with Rob Waters.

We have only about a minute with Rob Waters.

What will be the biggest opportunity when it comes to the business of influence in Washington in twenty twenty five, I.

What will be the biggest opportunity when it comes to the business of influence in Washington in twenty twenty five, I.

Would say drinking wine with you.

Would say drinking wine with you.

That's not an acceptable lance.

That's not an acceptable lance.

It isn't.

It isn't.

No.

No.

As much as I like the sound.

As much as I like the sound.

Of it, I think the economic vision that President Trump has is a good vision, and helping enact that will be one of the best opportunities for America.

Of it, I think the economic vision that President Trump has is a good vision, and helping enact that will be one of the best opportunities for America.

Is this the year that Washington gets religion on tariffs?

Is this the year that Washington gets religion on tariffs?

I think Washington's going to get religion on a few things.

I think Washington's going to get religion on a few things.

Yeah, the Madison Group, don't be a stranger. You'll come back again if you have me. Okay, Rob Waters, the Titan of k Street. We promised here in Washington Life on Balance of Power.

Yeah, the Madison Group, don't be a stranger. You'll come back again if you have me. Okay, Rob Waters, the Titan of k Street. We promised here in Washington Life on Balance of Power.

Great to see you and thank you for the insights.

Great to see you and thank you for the insights.

As always, save me some wine. Thanks for listening to the Balance of Power podcast. Make sure to subscribe if you haven't already, at Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts, and you can find us live every weekday from Washington, DC at noontime Eastern at Bloomberg dot com.

As always, save me some wine. Thanks for listening to the Balance of Power podcast. Make sure to subscribe if you haven't already, at Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts, and you can find us live every weekday from Washington, DC at noontime Eastern at Bloomberg dot com.