You're listening to Math and Magic production my heart radio for me, my humanity came out more than ever through the pandemic. And maybe it was the combination of COVID, but also what was happening with George Floyd and kind of the awakening that the world was having to racism. I think I was more myself than I had ever been and bringing my full self to work. I am Bob Pittman, and welcome to Math and Magic. Stories from the Frontiers and Marketing. We explored marketing and business from the analytical side, math and the creative side magic. Today we have someone who stepped into the CMO job just as COVID was beginning to hit and had to reimagine marketing in the pandemic, both the math and the magic. She's the CMO of three m Raymie Kent. Raymie was born in the seventies grew up in Atlanta, influenced by right brain and left brain parents, giving her that special blend of analytics and creativity that makes strong marketers. She has an alum of p And, where she had her first big successes. She has much to share about growing up in environments where she was minority and also where she was the majority, and what we can do in American business to help achieve racial justice and address racial opportunity gaps. She also can share her lessons about marketing through the pandemic and the permanent changes to her craft as a result. She was named one of forty under forty marketers by ad Age, and Savoy magazine named her one of the most influential women in Corporate America. Raymie, welcome. Thank you so much for having me. Bob. I'm truly honored. Well, we are delighted to have you, and we're gonna dig into some meaty stuff. But before we do that, I'd like to do you in sixties seconds. Are you ready? Do you prefer early mornings or late nights, late night? Introvert or extrovert, introvert, Scotch tape or Scotch liquor Scotch tape, meeting or email meeting? Cats or dogs? Dogs? Salty or sweet sweet. It's about to get harder. Smartest person you know, Sundar Ram secret talent. I'm a pretty good writer. Favorite city Atlanta, Georgia. Your first job I was a library page favorite app um, probably the posted app favorite book. I haven't been reading much lately, But I would have to say the Bible, childhood hero, my mom, she could do everything. Let's jump in. I read that when you stepped into the three mcmo job, which was I think January, you were all set to get out, hit the road, go see the markets worldwide. When did you realize that wasn't gonna happen and how bad did you think this was going to be? Well, in January, I think it was just kind of a caution that was thrown out in terms of the pandemics. So I still had plans to visit all of my global counterparts across the world. And then I would say by February, I knew that I was not going anywhere, and I knew that life was dramatically about to change. So I would say by the end of February, it was very clear that we were in this for longer than a couple of weeks. So talk to me a minute about how your job changed as a result of the pandemic. What became your key metrics? Well, Bob our key metrics actually did not change vastly. We still focused on brand awareness, sales, growth, conversion and traffic and engagement it and overall r O I S to make sure that our dollars were being spent effectively and we were driving the right outcomes. But what I think we really did is focused even more deeply on keen understanding of consumers and getting that voice of consumer into our marketers hands. Really understanding the sentiment and how needs were changing post COVID was really really important, and it became our focus area. So that consumer understanding just elevated itself during this time. Three M has in ninety five respirators pandemic hits. Tell me that story. Yeah, so I kind of breathe in as you asked the question, because there's nothing more critical than working at a company that is responsible for in I have mass and we are the number one producer, and there's a pandemic, and mask and PPE are the things that are keeping people safe. It is a tremendous responsibility. I couldn't have been prouder of the company, and especially Mike Roman's leadership in saying we have a responsibility here. This is not about making money, This is not about anything beyond keeping people safe. And he took the creativity and the innovation and then know how of three M R S and he focused it towards production of those masks, and we delivered about two billion mass in. Well, we all thank you because you really did step up. So how did your role as a leader changed during the pandemic. All of us were handling work and home and everything was melding together and people were scared. I think people were going through dramatic changes depending upon what their home lives were a lot of my people have young kids that they had to manage, and so my leadership style, I would say, I consider myself a human centered leader. I had to really really make sure that I showed up that way, and that was making myself more accessible. I tried to be as clear as possible. I tried to remove busy work or excess work that was not focused. I tried to just have real conversations with people and check in and let them know that it was okay not to be okay, and be relatable. That was really important, and so I think that's how my leadership shifted. I think people started to know more about me, and I started to know more about others. I think all of us suddenly found ourselves as a work from home company, which most of us never imagined we would do, and it certainly turned our world upside down. What surprised you about it that you would not have anticipated. What surprised me the most was that for me, my humanity came out more than ever through the pandemic. And maybe it was the combination of COVID, but also what was happening with George Floyd and kind of the awakening that the world was having to racism. I think I was more myself than I had ever been and bringing my full self to work. Do you think as a leader, and you you have had a great career that you before this pandemic that you had to sort of suppress your humanity, put a face on it, put a mask on, and that somehow the pandemic changed that. I think what the pandemic did was, of course, when there is something that is a threat to you or your family or your well being, you really think about what's important. And for me, love is important. People are important, and so that's what brought that to the forefront for me. And I just think that as I've matured as a leader, I know that to be most effective in the magic that I bring to my work, the more I can be more human, be more myself, accept the good and the flaws and fully embrace myself and others. Just the better work I do and the more high performance teams I build, It's more and more people are vaccinated and the economy comes roaring back, And it does look like it's roaring back. How is it changing your priorities and how you work for me? One of my number one priorities and what I lead in my organization is the data and digital transformation and really trying to accelerate e commerce. Um, It's always been there, but I would say that it's super charged. And then I would say the other is really making sure that as we're building our brands, we are getting closer and closer to the consumer. So how are we building those one to one meaningful relationships with consumers and understanding what information really is driving their decision making. So let's go back in time. I want to get some context on you. Let's go to the early years that shaped you. You were born in the mid seventies, born in Atlanta. Can you paint the picture of that time and place and how it impacted you. I was an only child. My father is from Sara Leone, West Africa, and my mother is from Knoxville, Tennessee, and they met in college, and we had a small family. And because my father was from sarah Leone, West Africa, he grew up and came from small beginnings but really had a yearning for more opportunity and saw education as the way to get there. And so what I would say in my younger years, especially with my father's influence, education was really really important to me. So I spent a lot of time studying and reading. What'd you like to read? I almost I feel like I read everything. I mentioned that I my first job was a page in the library, and I would pick up nonfiction, I'd pick up fiction. I loved mysteries. I loved it all. I really love to learn, and so that that means any book is kind of of interest to me. You know, it's a shame that people don't spend more time in the libraries. Now we have this point of connection which I didn't know that I actually worked in the library in my small town in Mississippi, and I saw so many books and discovered so many ideas just from going that looks sort of interesting and opening and thumbing through even a few pages and taking a few of them home. It's one of those jobs you would never think that it would have a value to you, but it's it's funny how it does. UM talk about your early aspirations, you know you were in this environment. Clearly education was important, your parents valued it. They spent a lot of time focused on you. What did you aspire to be and how were they helping you achieve those aspirations. I when I was younger, I really thought that I was going to be a lawyer. I loved English, and I was told that I was pretty persuasive, So that really is where I was tilting. And my parents were just highly supportive. In fact, they never told me what type of occupation I should have. And as I got older, and then when I chose to go to Florida A and M, I saw that, you know, Florida A and M had a program which was an MBA program, and I did the undergraduate piece and I said, oh, you know, I'll focus because English is too limiting. I'll get a business degree and then maybe I'll get an m b A. And then maybe I'll go to law school. And so what I learned as I was getting interested in marketing curriculum, as I was going through school, I felt like I was able to bring the persuasive aspects that I loved about being a lawyer, looking at multiple sides or views of things and then coming to a clear point of view, and then being able to persuade others to that. I really just started to love marketing, and that's the path that I chose. So let's jump on college for a minute. I read that you had first decided you wanted to go to an HBCU and then set out to figure out which one. Talk to us a little bit about your thoughts on the power and value of the HBCUs. And oh, by the way, Florida A and m Useiversity's marching band is unbelievable, world famous, and they were actually featured in our I Heart HBCU homecoming celebration last year. Oh that's awesome. They are fantastic. I really grew up and I felt like I had a lot of experiences where I was the minority. I mostly um went to predominantly white schools, and I moved into a neighborhood that was predominantly black right into high school, and I realized that, you know, I felt like I could use more of the black experience to be totally honest, and so I think my parents thought I was going to go to school at Duke or Emery, and I really decided for myself that I wanted an HBCU. And the way I chose Florida A and M University was that my counselor at the time spoke very highly of the business school, and I said, Okay, I'll go, and it was close to home. It was four hours away, and it felt like it was the right choice for me to really immerse myself with people that looked like me on a daily basis as I matriculated, and it's one of the best choices I've ever made. So you leave college, you have an undergrad degree, you have an m b A. And you land at bell South and that was before it was acquired by A T and T. What attracted you to that business? You know? It was funny. I I definitely always have loved technology, and so when the opportunity came up for bell South number one from family, I really wanted to get back to Atlanta. So that recruitment was great because it allowed me to do so, but then also to be in the technology sphere of things UM at the time, Bell South was really getting into its bundling of your home phone, your internet, your cell phone. That was of interest to me, and so I was only there for a short period of time before I then went to PNG. But it was great to be home and it was great to be UM at a company that was kind of in Atlanta steadfast if you will. Well. PNG is certainly the mecca for marketers, and so many brilliant marketers and business people have done their time at P and everybody wants to get their huge demand for a limited number of jobs. How did you get there and why did you get there? Yeah, I was actually quite different in my route of PNG at the time. Um. This was in two thousand. Really PNG only recruited from schools, so it was either you know, you had an m b A and they took you straight from your m b A. And there were not experienced workers at the time. And my ex husband was actually still at FAM you interviewing with PNG, and he proposed at the same time he was interviewing and really said, Hey, my fiance needs to look at opportunities and she's a great marketer, would love for her to talk to marketing. And I got to take the PNG tests. So I took that and I passed, and I interviewed. I remember interviewing with marketing as well as purchasing, and my purchasing interview was the first day went really well. They gave me the offer at the end of the course of maybe talking to four people. My marketing interview was pretty rigorous. UM, I had some great people that I'm still in contact with today that interviewed me. But at the end I left and they didn't give me the offer. And everybody knew that if you didn't get extended the offer, you weren't getting a job. And so I was checking my voicemail and the HR person was like, you weren't supposed to leave the building. We would like to extend you an offer. And that's how I went into marketing. So it tells us for a second about why PNG is such a great education for marketers. What I would say that PNG does really well is we say it's a great education for marketing, but what it is is really a great education for business leadership and marketing mastery. And so at PNG uniquely brand building. So owning the brand and driving demand for that brand is in concert with owning the p n L and the multi functional leadership that ives that p n L and you orchestrate it like a general manager. And what I think PNG does really well is that it has a growth mindset in its organization, where even if you do really well the year before, it's always about how do you step change your performance? And I think by really driving excellence year on year, training their people in not only the creative aspects of marketing, but the measurement and the analytical aspects of marketing, it just makes you a really great business leader. And I'm thankful for the opportunity more Mathew Magic right after this quick break, welcome back to Math and Magic. Now let's hear more from my conversation with Raymie Kent. So by two thousand and five, you had you had risen to become the brand manager of ol A Skincare you lad that brand to remarkable growth with sales up nine and profits up thirty? How did you do that? One of the things that I love is to reimagine brands, and Ola really had been known as kind of your mother's brand. And Michael Krensky at the time was my general manager, and he had this great vision for we are going to reinvent this brand. And so what we really started to look at is what were the superior technologies that we had in anti aging and how do we position those two be very different And so one of the first launches that um I was on the brand for was the launch of Total Effects, and that skincare brand was compared to department store skin care products and you know, at a fract and of the cost. And then we followed with the launch of ol A Regeneras, which I had the responsibility for. We reframed that brand against cosmetic procedures and really we're able to show superior skin results. And so by really understanding the consumer and what was happening in the marketplace, the buying of prestige products, and then we created mass stage with Total Effects and then the move to well I don't want a cosmetic procedure, but I would love to have the results of a cosmetic procedure. By providing products that came close to those gold standards really changed the trajectory of growth on l A. Why does P and G do so much socially responsible and focused community programs? Why is it good for them? And why did they do it so well? Yeah, you know, that's a good question for Mark Pritchard. I really feel like he has led the way um in that and and knowing him, I would say that PNG's brands are when you think of them, they are brands for the people, Right, Tied, Pampers, Allay, these are leaders in the categories. And so at the end, if your goal is to really attract a consumer and build loyalty and love they have, Yes, you want to provide superior products, but you also want to do good while you're doing it. And I think we all have a responsibility with that, and I think what Mark Saul was that, yes, our responsibility is to build brands and sales, but we also can move and change what right looks like for brands and for companies. And I think that they've played a leadership role in that and I've been proud to watch it, and I think what it does is clearly tells consumers that not only is this a brand that's going to meet the utility that I have, but it's also a brand that understands me as a consumer. And I think that's a winning formula. You know, you're you're so right. And by the way, at our company, we've done a lot with P and G and always find them to be a remarkable partner and always willing to go that extra step to do something important for the community and as you say, defining what right is. And by the way, we have Mark Pritchard has been on Mathemagic, So anyone listening right now, you can go back and look at the library there and find the episode with Mark who who does get into these Uh, these topics are very enlightened. Guy in you joined three mst Global Brand and Strategy leader of the Consumer Business Group. Uh. How how did you wind up at three M and what excited you about three M. I actually came to Minnesota with PNG. We had to make a choice for our family to stay in Minnesota, and you know, I had a short list of companies here that I would be interested in, and of course three M has a wonderful reputation of innovation and reliability, and at the time, there was the opportunity to really come and lead the frameworks for the iconic brands that we had, And what I did was spend time really building the brand purpose and a lot of the fundamentals for each of these wonderful brands on their own. But really tightening their equities and making sure that they had a real reason for being, a purpose that would lead them to growth in the future. And that job excited me, like I wanted to work on the brands posted scotch Um, had a passion for them and thought that they were in a place where they could really be reimagined and continue to grow for years to come. So I was honored to take the opportunity. Well, everybody, of course wants to know about post it, because that's got to be the hot brand and the one with that incredible backstory. You were alluding to this how do you keep it relevant? Uh? And can you talk a little bit about how you made it digital? Yeah, So I wish I could say that I came up with that brilliant idea, but I didn't. The post it app launched in two fourteen, but what happened was it launched then we didn't let anyone know about it, so we really did not bring marketing to bear to bring it to life. And so in seventeen I re launched it and really connected it to our physical products, so things like, you know, making sure that people understood that there was an app available when they bought the products, so on the packaging, the posted apps present, really building out the functionality of the app and making sure that not only could you capture the physical note, but creating a digital note and really being able to share that to anybody that you wanted to organize it and then brainstorm over time, um or over space, I should say, with whoever you wanted to. And so it was simply reading through the consumer inputs. When we talk to people. The number one reason that LAPS users stopped using their post it note was because that they were using a digital choice to keep notes. But what they complained about was it didn't have the tactile nature of the three by three the physical They couldn't write things down, which often helped them to remember. And what we saw was the opportunity was to bridge the two. It's not either or. It's not physical or digital, it's both. Let's move You talked about George Floyd earlier, the other big major event of and let's go back there for a minute. UM, I mean an awful murder. It's captured on video. All of America really came face to face with the issue of racial injustice. You're a black woman in a major American Corporation. How did you use your position at three M to make a difference and how did it affect you? This has been interesting and frankly continues to be an interesting daily challenge. So your question of about how did I use my position? Number one? I think I have a responsibility as a black woman to be the voice for others that maybe don't feel heard or don't have the ability to speak up, especially in corporate America, as to how racial injustice shows up for them every day in their workplace, and so really using those moments to listen first hear kind of what our workforce is saying, and making sure that we're talking to those underrepresented people in the workforce, black and Hispanic and really getting their true experience and being willing to listen even when it I think when you talk about racism, often the word just evokes rejection, right. I think people want to say, well, I'm not racist, and so that defense often gets in the way of hearing real life experiences for people. So what I used my role to do is is to definitely speak up myself and then be a conduit for others then actively saying what are we gonna do about it? So I sit on my CEO Advisory Council UM and really really helping to provide input as too. Corporate America has a responsibility here and we need to get our house in order first, right, and so what does that look like? Are we are we clear on the data? Are we disaggregating the data? Are we publishing the data and making ourselves accountable? And so really being a partner in that and frankly being a safe place for people to bounce things off of that. You know, there's the fear of saying the wrong thing, and I wanted to be a person who could have that exchange and hopefully that person walk away better educated. And so it's been tiring, but it has been These conversations have to happen, and I think it's the only thing that leads to change people listening to this episode. How can people have an impact? What can they do that maybe they're not doing now? Yeah, the first thing that I would say is, um, you have to educate yourself on systemic racism. And that can be daunting in itself because it's hard to acknowledge. Wow, maybe I've been a part of this. It hasn't been my intention, but maybe I'm a part of this system, right, And so there are many books out there, there are many talks um, there are many ways to educate yourself without asking another black person, right, And so I say job number one is educate yourself on what exists in this country and the way the country has been built. And it's everything from the education systems to the home ownership, to police to corporate America. It runs deep. And so then I would say it is really about an act. A small act can make a difference. So and when I say small act, when you are at work and you hear someone saying something inappropriate, correct them, have the courage to correct them. And that's a small act. But if everybody just takes on one small act or multiple small acts, that's where change happens. And so you know, my small act is I've brought women together, black and white women, and I am taking the opportunity to have what we call courageous conversations. And it's a intimate setting where we are trying to allow people to say what gets in the way of breaking down racism, what the beliefs are, what the stereotypes might be, what the situations maybe and by allowing those conversations. I am hoping that people learn and then they go out and make a change, And so that would be my advice. Well a song. We're on the subject of advice. Let's let's keep going here. Let's talk about some advice you have as a senior corporate executive. How do you build corporate cultures to support your brand and marketing goals? Bob, This is a good question, and it's an important one, and I am in the midst of it. I I think building culture is one of the most important things we can do as a leader. And I don't know that there is a recipe for it, but I think it starts with being the culture that you want to see and really making sure that that culture is set. But then also, I hate to use the word governance, but I'm going to use it rewarding and recognizing those who exhibit the cultural attributes that you are setting forward and really really bringing visibility to those behaviors broadly. And so I would say that you know there, culture is important. Um when we think about the talent that we want to attract, when we think about the teams that we want to build, when we think about the brands the business that we want to build. I think culture is one of the single most things that we can do that's going to make a difference and set us out to win. So in this when you're building this culture, how do you keep everyone from playing it safe? Especially in a company like yours where you've got these big brands. I'm sure people are scared to death to to to take risk on some of these How do you make that okay so that you can keep innovation going? Yeah, I wish I had a silver bullet on that. I am trying to figure that out myself. I think one of the things that I have seen work effectively is really really putting test and learned dollars and investment and allowing people to try some things at a smaller scale to demonstrate results and then grow with So I would say that that's the number one thing that I've seen have people lean in, especially when they're not having to bet everything on what they're doing. It's a small, calculated risk, and I think people will step into that. Good people will step into that. We end each episode with a shout out to the great marketers of the world. Business people too. We we you've seen many you've studied even more, who is the best if we think we're thinking math and magic now, so as we think about it, who's the best marketer you can think of looking at it from the analytical side, the math, the mathematician, and who do you think is the best from the creative side, the magician if you will mhmm, you know, I will say that, Um, I won't name a name because I think it's a lot of people, but I will say from a mathematicians standpoint, I would say that what Netflix is doing with data and under standing, in their programming, in their customization, in how they delight you with kind of what you need at the right moments, I think it's pretty interesting and so I've been really impressed there. Okay, so give it to us on the creative side, on the magician's side. Yeah, I'm gonna say so. I may tilt this a little bit, but I'm anna same magician, and I don't know if I would call it creative as much, but it definitely is magic by what Amazon has been able to do, and not so much that they are an incredible logistics company and they have. Honestly, I feel like they're taking over the world for sure. What I really love about what they've been able to do is I think, as a consumer and customer of Amazon, when you do not get a package on your doorstep, there is a psychological trigger that's happening that almost feels like something's wrong, that your behavior is not right. Once you've gotten into that kind of fly will of getting packaging whenever you need it with whatever items you need, and when it doesn't happen that way, it feels off. So they're becoming the norm, and I think it's magical. Raymie, thanks for joining us and congrats on all your success. Thank you so much for the opportunity. It's really been fun to talk to you. Here are a few things I picked up in my conversation with Raymie. One, when responding to a crisis, leaders have to consider more than the bottom line. During a pandemic, three M symmetrics for success shifted from growth and innovation to consumer safety, and consequently made the decision to reality a production resources to deliver in ninety five mass to be a human centered leader. When COVID nineteen hit, Raymie's leadership priorities changed. Not only did she make sure she was accessible to her team and created a more flexible work environment, but she also communicated that it was okay to not be okay. Three. The secret to big ideas is often to start small. As Raymie says, one effective way of fostering innovation is to let smaller groups within the company experiment. These tests and learn opportunities create a sense of ownership among employees and lead to accelerated progress. Four. Listen first and then speak up on how injustice shows up at work. Raymy shared that to understand the needs of underrepresented people in the workforce, leaders have to be willing to put down any feelings of defensiveness, listen well, and then take informed action. I'm Bob Pittman. Thanks for listening. That's it for today's episode. Thanks so much for listening to Math and Magic, a production of I Heart Radio. The show is hosted by Bob Pittman. Special thanks to Sue Schillinger for booking and wrangling our wonderful talent, which is no small feed, Merissa Brown for pulling research, our editor, Derek Clements, our producer, Morgan Levoy, our executive producer, Nikki Etor, and of course Gayle Rahul, Eric Angel, Noel Mango, and everyone who helped bring this show to your ears until next time.

You're listening to Math and Magic production my heart radio for me, my humanity came out more than ever through the pandemic. And maybe it was the combination of COVID, but also what was happening with George Floyd and kind of the awakening that the world was having to racism. I think I was more myself than I had ever been and bringing my full self to work. I am Bob Pittman, and welcome to Math and Magic. Stories from the Frontiers and Marketing. We explored marketing and business from the analytical side, math and the creative side magic. Today we have someone who stepped into the CMO job just as COVID was beginning to hit and had to reimagine marketing in the pandemic, both the math and the magic. She's the CMO of three m Raymie Kent. Raymie was born in the seventies grew up in Atlanta, influenced by right brain and left brain parents, giving her that special blend of analytics and creativity that makes strong marketers. She has an alum of p And, where she had her first big successes. She has much to share about growing up in environments where she was minority and also where she was the majority, and what we can do in American business to help achieve racial justice and address racial opportunity gaps. She also can share her lessons about marketing through the pandemic and the permanent changes to her craft as a result. She was named one of forty under forty marketers by ad Age, and Savoy magazine named her one of the most influential women in Corporate America. Raymie, welcome. Thank you so much for having me. Bob. I'm truly honored. Well, we are delighted to have you, and we're gonna dig into some meaty stuff. But before we do that, I'd like to do you in sixties seconds. Are you ready? Do you prefer early mornings or late nights, late night? Introvert or extrovert, introvert, Scotch tape or Scotch liquor Scotch tape, meeting or email meeting? Cats or dogs? Dogs? Salty or sweet sweet. It's about to get harder. Smartest person you know, Sundar Ram secret talent. I'm a pretty good writer. Favorite city Atlanta, Georgia. Your first job I was a library page favorite app um, probably the posted app favorite book. I haven't been reading much lately, But I would have to say the Bible, childhood hero, my mom, she could do everything. Let's jump in. I read that when you stepped into the three mcmo job, which was I think January, you were all set to get out, hit the road, go see the markets worldwide. When did you realize that wasn't gonna happen and how bad did you think this was going to be? Well, in January, I think it was just kind of a caution that was thrown out in terms of the pandemics. So I still had plans to visit all of my global counterparts across the world. And then I would say by February, I knew that I was not going anywhere, and I knew that life was dramatically about to change. So I would say by the end of February, it was very clear that we were in this for longer than a couple of weeks. So talk to me a minute about how your job changed as a result of the pandemic. What became your key metrics? Well, Bob our key metrics actually did not change vastly. We still focused on brand awareness, sales, growth, conversion and traffic and engagement it and overall r O I S to make sure that our dollars were being spent effectively and we were driving the right outcomes. But what I think we really did is focused even more deeply on keen understanding of consumers and getting that voice of consumer into our marketers hands. Really understanding the sentiment and how needs were changing post COVID was really really important, and it became our focus area. So that consumer understanding just elevated itself during this time. Three M has in ninety five respirators pandemic hits. Tell me that story. Yeah, so I kind of breathe in as you asked the question, because there's nothing more critical than working at a company that is responsible for in I have mass and we are the number one producer, and there's a pandemic, and mask and PPE are the things that are keeping people safe. It is a tremendous responsibility. I couldn't have been prouder of the company, and especially Mike Roman's leadership in saying we have a responsibility here. This is not about making money, This is not about anything beyond keeping people safe. And he took the creativity and the innovation and then know how of three M R S and he focused it towards production of those masks, and we delivered about two billion mass in. Well, we all thank you because you really did step up. So how did your role as a leader changed during the pandemic. All of us were handling work and home and everything was melding together and people were scared. I think people were going through dramatic changes depending upon what their home lives were a lot of my people have young kids that they had to manage, and so my leadership style, I would say, I consider myself a human centered leader. I had to really really make sure that I showed up that way, and that was making myself more accessible. I tried to be as clear as possible. I tried to remove busy work or excess work that was not focused. I tried to just have real conversations with people and check in and let them know that it was okay not to be okay, and be relatable. That was really important, and so I think that's how my leadership shifted. I think people started to know more about me, and I started to know more about others. I think all of us suddenly found ourselves as a work from home company, which most of us never imagined we would do, and it certainly turned our world upside down. What surprised you about it that you would not have anticipated. What surprised me the most was that for me, my humanity came out more than ever through the pandemic. And maybe it was the combination of COVID, but also what was happening with George Floyd and kind of the awakening that the world was having to racism. I think I was more myself than I had ever been and bringing my full self to work. Do you think as a leader, and you you have had a great career that you before this pandemic that you had to sort of suppress your humanity, put a face on it, put a mask on, and that somehow the pandemic changed that. I think what the pandemic did was, of course, when there is something that is a threat to you or your family or your well being, you really think about what's important. And for me, love is important. People are important, and so that's what brought that to the forefront for me. And I just think that as I've matured as a leader, I know that to be most effective in the magic that I bring to my work, the more I can be more human, be more myself, accept the good and the flaws and fully embrace myself and others. Just the better work I do and the more high performance teams I build, It's more and more people are vaccinated and the economy comes roaring back, And it does look like it's roaring back. How is it changing your priorities and how you work for me? One of my number one priorities and what I lead in my organization is the data and digital transformation and really trying to accelerate e commerce. Um, It's always been there, but I would say that it's super charged. And then I would say the other is really making sure that as we're building our brands, we are getting closer and closer to the consumer. So how are we building those one to one meaningful relationships with consumers and understanding what information really is driving their decision making. So let's go back in time. I want to get some context on you. Let's go to the early years that shaped you. You were born in the mid seventies, born in Atlanta. Can you paint the picture of that time and place and how it impacted you. I was an only child. My father is from Sara Leone, West Africa, and my mother is from Knoxville, Tennessee, and they met in college, and we had a small family. And because my father was from sarah Leone, West Africa, he grew up and came from small beginnings but really had a yearning for more opportunity and saw education as the way to get there. And so what I would say in my younger years, especially with my father's influence, education was really really important to me. So I spent a lot of time studying and reading. What'd you like to read? I almost I feel like I read everything. I mentioned that I my first job was a page in the library, and I would pick up nonfiction, I'd pick up fiction. I loved mysteries. I loved it all. I really love to learn, and so that that means any book is kind of of interest to me. You know, it's a shame that people don't spend more time in the libraries. Now we have this point of connection which I didn't know that I actually worked in the library in my small town in Mississippi, and I saw so many books and discovered so many ideas just from going that looks sort of interesting and opening and thumbing through even a few pages and taking a few of them home. It's one of those jobs you would never think that it would have a value to you, but it's it's funny how it does. UM talk about your early aspirations, you know you were in this environment. Clearly education was important, your parents valued it. They spent a lot of time focused on you. What did you aspire to be and how were they helping you achieve those aspirations. I when I was younger, I really thought that I was going to be a lawyer. I loved English, and I was told that I was pretty persuasive, So that really is where I was tilting. And my parents were just highly supportive. In fact, they never told me what type of occupation I should have. And as I got older, and then when I chose to go to Florida A and M, I saw that, you know, Florida A and M had a program which was an MBA program, and I did the undergraduate piece and I said, oh, you know, I'll focus because English is too limiting. I'll get a business degree and then maybe I'll get an m b A. And then maybe I'll go to law school. And so what I learned as I was getting interested in marketing curriculum, as I was going through school, I felt like I was able to bring the persuasive aspects that I loved about being a lawyer, looking at multiple sides or views of things and then coming to a clear point of view, and then being able to persuade others to that. I really just started to love marketing, and that's the path that I chose. So let's jump on college for a minute. I read that you had first decided you wanted to go to an HBCU and then set out to figure out which one. Talk to us a little bit about your thoughts on the power and value of the HBCUs. And oh, by the way, Florida A and m Useiversity's marching band is unbelievable, world famous, and they were actually featured in our I Heart HBCU homecoming celebration last year. Oh that's awesome. They are fantastic. I really grew up and I felt like I had a lot of experiences where I was the minority. I mostly um went to predominantly white schools, and I moved into a neighborhood that was predominantly black right into high school, and I realized that, you know, I felt like I could use more of the black experience to be totally honest, and so I think my parents thought I was going to go to school at Duke or Emery, and I really decided for myself that I wanted an HBCU. And the way I chose Florida A and M University was that my counselor at the time spoke very highly of the business school, and I said, Okay, I'll go, and it was close to home. It was four hours away, and it felt like it was the right choice for me to really immerse myself with people that looked like me on a daily basis as I matriculated, and it's one of the best choices I've ever made. So you leave college, you have an undergrad degree, you have an m b A. And you land at bell South and that was before it was acquired by A T and T. What attracted you to that business? You know? It was funny. I I definitely always have loved technology, and so when the opportunity came up for bell South number one from family, I really wanted to get back to Atlanta. So that recruitment was great because it allowed me to do so, but then also to be in the technology sphere of things UM at the time, Bell South was really getting into its bundling of your home phone, your internet, your cell phone. That was of interest to me, and so I was only there for a short period of time before I then went to PNG. But it was great to be home and it was great to be UM at a company that was kind of in Atlanta steadfast if you will. Well. PNG is certainly the mecca for marketers, and so many brilliant marketers and business people have done their time at P and everybody wants to get their huge demand for a limited number of jobs. How did you get there and why did you get there? Yeah, I was actually quite different in my route of PNG at the time. Um. This was in two thousand. Really PNG only recruited from schools, so it was either you know, you had an m b A and they took you straight from your m b A. And there were not experienced workers at the time. And my ex husband was actually still at FAM you interviewing with PNG, and he proposed at the same time he was interviewing and really said, Hey, my fiance needs to look at opportunities and she's a great marketer, would love for her to talk to marketing. And I got to take the PNG tests. So I took that and I passed, and I interviewed. I remember interviewing with marketing as well as purchasing, and my purchasing interview was the first day went really well. They gave me the offer at the end of the course of maybe talking to four people. My marketing interview was pretty rigorous. UM, I had some great people that I'm still in contact with today that interviewed me. But at the end I left and they didn't give me the offer. And everybody knew that if you didn't get extended the offer, you weren't getting a job. And so I was checking my voicemail and the HR person was like, you weren't supposed to leave the building. We would like to extend you an offer. And that's how I went into marketing. So it tells us for a second about why PNG is such a great education for marketers. What I would say that PNG does really well is we say it's a great education for marketing, but what it is is really a great education for business leadership and marketing mastery. And so at PNG uniquely brand building. So owning the brand and driving demand for that brand is in concert with owning the p n L and the multi functional leadership that ives that p n L and you orchestrate it like a general manager. And what I think PNG does really well is that it has a growth mindset in its organization, where even if you do really well the year before, it's always about how do you step change your performance? And I think by really driving excellence year on year, training their people in not only the creative aspects of marketing, but the measurement and the analytical aspects of marketing, it just makes you a really great business leader. And I'm thankful for the opportunity more Mathew Magic right after this quick break, welcome back to Math and Magic. Now let's hear more from my conversation with Raymie Kent. So by two thousand and five, you had you had risen to become the brand manager of ol A Skincare you lad that brand to remarkable growth with sales up nine and profits up thirty? How did you do that? One of the things that I love is to reimagine brands, and Ola really had been known as kind of your mother's brand. And Michael Krensky at the time was my general manager, and he had this great vision for we are going to reinvent this brand. And so what we really started to look at is what were the superior technologies that we had in anti aging and how do we position those two be very different And so one of the first launches that um I was on the brand for was the launch of Total Effects, and that skincare brand was compared to department store skin care products and you know, at a fract and of the cost. And then we followed with the launch of ol A Regeneras, which I had the responsibility for. We reframed that brand against cosmetic procedures and really we're able to show superior skin results. And so by really understanding the consumer and what was happening in the marketplace, the buying of prestige products, and then we created mass stage with Total Effects and then the move to well I don't want a cosmetic procedure, but I would love to have the results of a cosmetic procedure. By providing products that came close to those gold standards really changed the trajectory of growth on l A. Why does P and G do so much socially responsible and focused community programs? Why is it good for them? And why did they do it so well? Yeah, you know, that's a good question for Mark Pritchard. I really feel like he has led the way um in that and and knowing him, I would say that PNG's brands are when you think of them, they are brands for the people, Right, Tied, Pampers, Allay, these are leaders in the categories. And so at the end, if your goal is to really attract a consumer and build loyalty and love they have, Yes, you want to provide superior products, but you also want to do good while you're doing it. And I think we all have a responsibility with that, and I think what Mark Saul was that, yes, our responsibility is to build brands and sales, but we also can move and change what right looks like for brands and for companies. And I think that they've played a leadership role in that and I've been proud to watch it, and I think what it does is clearly tells consumers that not only is this a brand that's going to meet the utility that I have, but it's also a brand that understands me as a consumer. And I think that's a winning formula. You know, you're you're so right. And by the way, at our company, we've done a lot with P and G and always find them to be a remarkable partner and always willing to go that extra step to do something important for the community and as you say, defining what right is. And by the way, we have Mark Pritchard has been on Mathemagic, So anyone listening right now, you can go back and look at the library there and find the episode with Mark who who does get into these Uh, these topics are very enlightened. Guy in you joined three mst Global Brand and Strategy leader of the Consumer Business Group. Uh. How how did you wind up at three M and what excited you about three M. I actually came to Minnesota with PNG. We had to make a choice for our family to stay in Minnesota, and you know, I had a short list of companies here that I would be interested in, and of course three M has a wonderful reputation of innovation and reliability, and at the time, there was the opportunity to really come and lead the frameworks for the iconic brands that we had, And what I did was spend time really building the brand purpose and a lot of the fundamentals for each of these wonderful brands on their own. But really tightening their equities and making sure that they had a real reason for being, a purpose that would lead them to growth in the future. And that job excited me, like I wanted to work on the brands posted scotch Um, had a passion for them and thought that they were in a place where they could really be reimagined and continue to grow for years to come. So I was honored to take the opportunity. Well, everybody, of course wants to know about post it, because that's got to be the hot brand and the one with that incredible backstory. You were alluding to this how do you keep it relevant? Uh? And can you talk a little bit about how you made it digital? Yeah, So I wish I could say that I came up with that brilliant idea, but I didn't. The post it app launched in two fourteen, but what happened was it launched then we didn't let anyone know about it, so we really did not bring marketing to bear to bring it to life. And so in seventeen I re launched it and really connected it to our physical products, so things like, you know, making sure that people understood that there was an app available when they bought the products, so on the packaging, the posted apps present, really building out the functionality of the app and making sure that not only could you capture the physical note, but creating a digital note and really being able to share that to anybody that you wanted to organize it and then brainstorm over time, um or over space, I should say, with whoever you wanted to. And so it was simply reading through the consumer inputs. When we talk to people. The number one reason that LAPS users stopped using their post it note was because that they were using a digital choice to keep notes. But what they complained about was it didn't have the tactile nature of the three by three the physical They couldn't write things down, which often helped them to remember. And what we saw was the opportunity was to bridge the two. It's not either or. It's not physical or digital, it's both. Let's move You talked about George Floyd earlier, the other big major event of and let's go back there for a minute. UM, I mean an awful murder. It's captured on video. All of America really came face to face with the issue of racial injustice. You're a black woman in a major American Corporation. How did you use your position at three M to make a difference and how did it affect you? This has been interesting and frankly continues to be an interesting daily challenge. So your question of about how did I use my position? Number one? I think I have a responsibility as a black woman to be the voice for others that maybe don't feel heard or don't have the ability to speak up, especially in corporate America, as to how racial injustice shows up for them every day in their workplace, and so really using those moments to listen first hear kind of what our workforce is saying, and making sure that we're talking to those underrepresented people in the workforce, black and Hispanic and really getting their true experience and being willing to listen even when it I think when you talk about racism, often the word just evokes rejection, right. I think people want to say, well, I'm not racist, and so that defense often gets in the way of hearing real life experiences for people. So what I used my role to do is is to definitely speak up myself and then be a conduit for others then actively saying what are we gonna do about it? So I sit on my CEO Advisory Council UM and really really helping to provide input as too. Corporate America has a responsibility here and we need to get our house in order first, right, and so what does that look like? Are we are we clear on the data? Are we disaggregating the data? Are we publishing the data and making ourselves accountable? And so really being a partner in that and frankly being a safe place for people to bounce things off of that. You know, there's the fear of saying the wrong thing, and I wanted to be a person who could have that exchange and hopefully that person walk away better educated. And so it's been tiring, but it has been These conversations have to happen, and I think it's the only thing that leads to change people listening to this episode. How can people have an impact? What can they do that maybe they're not doing now? Yeah, the first thing that I would say is, um, you have to educate yourself on systemic racism. And that can be daunting in itself because it's hard to acknowledge. Wow, maybe I've been a part of this. It hasn't been my intention, but maybe I'm a part of this system, right, And so there are many books out there, there are many talks um, there are many ways to educate yourself without asking another black person, right, And so I say job number one is educate yourself on what exists in this country and the way the country has been built. And it's everything from the education systems to the home ownership, to police to corporate America. It runs deep. And so then I would say it is really about an act. A small act can make a difference. So and when I say small act, when you are at work and you hear someone saying something inappropriate, correct them, have the courage to correct them. And that's a small act. But if everybody just takes on one small act or multiple small acts, that's where change happens. And so you know, my small act is I've brought women together, black and white women, and I am taking the opportunity to have what we call courageous conversations. And it's a intimate setting where we are trying to allow people to say what gets in the way of breaking down racism, what the beliefs are, what the stereotypes might be, what the situations maybe and by allowing those conversations. I am hoping that people learn and then they go out and make a change, And so that would be my advice. Well a song. We're on the subject of advice. Let's let's keep going here. Let's talk about some advice you have as a senior corporate executive. How do you build corporate cultures to support your brand and marketing goals? Bob, This is a good question, and it's an important one, and I am in the midst of it. I I think building culture is one of the most important things we can do as a leader. And I don't know that there is a recipe for it, but I think it starts with being the culture that you want to see and really making sure that that culture is set. But then also, I hate to use the word governance, but I'm going to use it rewarding and recognizing those who exhibit the cultural attributes that you are setting forward and really really bringing visibility to those behaviors broadly. And so I would say that you know there, culture is important. Um when we think about the talent that we want to attract, when we think about the teams that we want to build, when we think about the brands the business that we want to build. I think culture is one of the single most things that we can do that's going to make a difference and set us out to win. So in this when you're building this culture, how do you keep everyone from playing it safe? Especially in a company like yours where you've got these big brands. I'm sure people are scared to death to to to take risk on some of these How do you make that okay so that you can keep innovation going? Yeah, I wish I had a silver bullet on that. I am trying to figure that out myself. I think one of the things that I have seen work effectively is really really putting test and learned dollars and investment and allowing people to try some things at a smaller scale to demonstrate results and then grow with So I would say that that's the number one thing that I've seen have people lean in, especially when they're not having to bet everything on what they're doing. It's a small, calculated risk, and I think people will step into that. Good people will step into that. We end each episode with a shout out to the great marketers of the world. Business people too. We we you've seen many you've studied even more, who is the best if we think we're thinking math and magic now, so as we think about it, who's the best marketer you can think of looking at it from the analytical side, the math, the mathematician, and who do you think is the best from the creative side, the magician if you will mhmm, you know, I will say that, Um, I won't name a name because I think it's a lot of people, but I will say from a mathematicians standpoint, I would say that what Netflix is doing with data and under standing, in their programming, in their customization, in how they delight you with kind of what you need at the right moments, I think it's pretty interesting and so I've been really impressed there. Okay, so give it to us on the creative side, on the magician's side. Yeah, I'm gonna say so. I may tilt this a little bit, but I'm anna same magician, and I don't know if I would call it creative as much, but it definitely is magic by what Amazon has been able to do, and not so much that they are an incredible logistics company and they have. Honestly, I feel like they're taking over the world for sure. What I really love about what they've been able to do is I think, as a consumer and customer of Amazon, when you do not get a package on your doorstep, there is a psychological trigger that's happening that almost feels like something's wrong, that your behavior is not right. Once you've gotten into that kind of fly will of getting packaging whenever you need it with whatever items you need, and when it doesn't happen that way, it feels off. So they're becoming the norm, and I think it's magical. Raymie, thanks for joining us and congrats on all your success. Thank you so much for the opportunity. It's really been fun to talk to you. Here are a few things I picked up in my conversation with Raymie. One, when responding to a crisis, leaders have to consider more than the bottom line. During a pandemic, three M symmetrics for success shifted from growth and innovation to consumer safety, and consequently made the decision to reality a production resources to deliver in ninety five mass to be a human centered leader. When COVID nineteen hit, Raymie's leadership priorities changed. Not only did she make sure she was accessible to her team and created a more flexible work environment, but she also communicated that it was okay to not be okay. Three. The secret to big ideas is often to start small. As Raymie says, one effective way of fostering innovation is to let smaller groups within the company experiment. These tests and learn opportunities create a sense of ownership among employees and lead to accelerated progress. Four. Listen first and then speak up on how injustice shows up at work. Raymy shared that to understand the needs of underrepresented people in the workforce, leaders have to be willing to put down any feelings of defensiveness, listen well, and then take informed action. I'm Bob Pittman. Thanks for listening. That's it for today's episode. Thanks so much for listening to Math and Magic, a production of I Heart Radio. The show is hosted by Bob Pittman. Special thanks to Sue Schillinger for booking and wrangling our wonderful talent, which is no small feed, Merissa Brown for pulling research, our editor, Derek Clements, our producer, Morgan Levoy, our executive producer, Nikki Etor, and of course Gayle Rahul, Eric Angel, Noel Mango, and everyone who helped bring this show to your ears until next time.