Hello, mydeas. The Joy Podcast will be taking the holidays off. I hope you can too and have a lovely time however you like to spend it, and with whomever you like to spend it with. We'll be back on January the fourteenth with the Lovely Lisa Lobe. That's more alliteration than I thought I was going to have when I started talking today. But there you are, the Lovely Lisa Lobe on the fourteenth of January, and have a lovely holiday time, my friends. Be careful, stay safe, see you soon. My name is Craig Ferguson. This podcast is called Joy. It's not rocket science. I talk to people I like about their pursuit of happiness.

Hello, mydeas. The Joy Podcast will be taking the holidays off. I hope you can too and have a lovely time however you like to spend it, and with whomever you like to spend it with. We'll be back on January the fourteenth with the Lovely Lisa Lobe. That's more alliteration than I thought I was going to have when I started talking today. But there you are, the Lovely Lisa Lobe on the fourteenth of January, and have a lovely holiday time, my friends. Be careful, stay safe, see you soon. My name is Craig Ferguson. This podcast is called Joy. It's not rocket science. I talk to people I like about their pursuit of happiness.

Here's Tony Hawk, a legend, an icon, maybe the icon of the skateboard world.

Here's Tony Hawk, a legend, an icon, maybe the icon of the skateboard world.

Enjoy. How are you feeling about the way? Are you all right? Like a thank you?

Enjoy. How are you feeling about the way? Are you all right? Like a thank you?

That seemed like a much more loaded question, But no, I yeah, I broke my leg by a year ago. And yes, finally, yes, I went through a false start the first time because I got back too soon and the impact forced my bone to never reconnect.

That seemed like a much more loaded question, But no, I yeah, I broke my leg by a year ago. And yes, finally, yes, I went through a false start the first time because I got back too soon and the impact forced my bone to never reconnect.

Evil, evil shit going on.

Evil, evil shit going on.

I mean, in hindsight, it's regrettable. It's embarrassing, but I also was in denial of it. I thought that I was just going through a harder time. So about eight months into my recovery, I realized that it wasn't getting any better. I wasn't improving in terms of what I could do physically, And I went and got X rays and realized that the bone was actually further apart than it had been post surgery, And went and got it realigned with a specialist and waited, and that was that was the key.

I mean, in hindsight, it's regrettable. It's embarrassing, but I also was in denial of it. I thought that I was just going through a harder time. So about eight months into my recovery, I realized that it wasn't getting any better. I wasn't improving in terms of what I could do physically, And I went and got X rays and realized that the bone was actually further apart than it had been post surgery, And went and got it realigned with a specialist and waited, and that was that was the key.

Just wait, do you have a Do you have a different pain threshold to normal humans?

Just wait, do you have a Do you have a different pain threshold to normal humans?

Have you ever had it tested?

Have you ever had it tested?

No, but it's it's definitely been noted by by others and friends and things, And well, it's funny.

No, but it's it's definitely been noted by by others and friends and things, And well, it's funny.

I watched till the wheels come off, and I was looking at the spells that you were taking or what do you see?

I watched till the wheels come off, and I was looking at the spells that you were taking or what do you see?

I don't know there's right terminology because I'm not spell right.

I don't know there's right terminology because I'm not spell right.

Spell slams? Sure, all right?

Spell slams? Sure, all right?

Or falls or maybe all our peas like I see some of the hurt.

Or falls or maybe all our peas like I see some of the hurt.

You say bail. If you see bail, then that's more intentional. And what you were seeing there was definitely no one was intentional.

You say bail. If you see bail, then that's more intentional. And what you were seeing there was definitely no one was intentional.

Yeah, they were like, but even from the FOA when you were a little kid, like everything just like slamming into this.

Yeah, they were like, but even from the FOA when you were a little kid, like everything just like slamming into this.

Thing over and over and over again, you get immune to it.

Thing over and over and over again, you get immune to it.

Is that it's not immune.

Is that it's not immune.

It's more that there's an acceptance that comes with it, right, that I need to endure this for the sake of progression, and so that that has always been my attitude, and so I didn't I didn't mind it so much. Sometimes it's worse than others, but not that often. I mean, there's there's sort of this I guess it's more like when you you choose a life of skateboarding, there's sort of a level of pain that you know there's always going to be low lying.

It's more that there's an acceptance that comes with it, right, that I need to endure this for the sake of progression, and so that that has always been my attitude, and so I didn't I didn't mind it so much. Sometimes it's worse than others, but not that often. I mean, there's there's sort of this I guess it's more like when you you choose a life of skateboarding, there's sort of a level of pain that you know there's always going to be low lying.

Like all the time. But see, I envy you very much.

Like all the time. But see, I envy you very much.

Not about the money and drugs and famous I've had enough of that.

Not about the money and drugs and famous I've had enough of that.

But but you knew your thing and you have your thing.

But but you knew your thing and you have your thing.

It's not like it was ever in any question because you said right there you chose a life of skateboarding, or you didn't say you chose it, but you used that expression.

It's not like it was ever in any question because you said right there you chose a life of skateboarding, or you didn't say you chose it, but you used that expression.

Do you think you chose you?

Do you think you chose you?

Because like your dad at that point as well, because your dad was heavily involved in there.

Because like your dad at that point as well, because your dad was heavily involved in there.

Yeah, that's a good question. I would say that I chose a life of skateboarding early on, even when it was not there was no path to success because no one had carved that path yet, right, But I love what it provided me, So I just loved skating. But I would say later on there was a sense of skateboarding chose me in that suddenly people were asking me to sort of be the spokesperson.

Yeah, that's a good question. I would say that I chose a life of skateboarding early on, even when it was not there was no path to success because no one had carved that path yet, right, But I love what it provided me, So I just loved skating. But I would say later on there was a sense of skateboarding chose me in that suddenly people were asking me to sort of be the spokesperson.

Yeah, and I was.

Yeah, and I was.

Willing to do it, but it wasn't what I aspire to.

Willing to do it, but it wasn't what I aspire to.

What did you expire to at the beginning?

What did you expire to at the beginning?

Just keep learning new tricks?

Just keep learning new tricks?

It was.

It was.

It was pretty simple.

It was pretty simple.

But it's a funny thing though, because I mean, like you're one of those people that's really difficult to have a conversation with. It's recorded not because you're difficult, but because the people that are into your thing are so messianic about your thing that if I say the wrong word instead of spill, I say or slam, I say spill or like, people get fucking crazy about it.

But it's a funny thing though, because I mean, like you're one of those people that's really difficult to have a conversation with. It's recorded not because you're difficult, but because the people that are into your thing are so messianic about your thing that if I say the wrong word instead of spill, I say or slam, I say spill or like, people get fucking crazy about it.

And it's kind of say less now than before I understand what you're saying.

And it's kind of say less now than before I understand what you're saying.

Yea, But it was funny.

Yea, But it was funny.

Watched it because I thought that the documentary about you and a lot of your contemporaries.

Watched it because I thought that the documentary about you and a lot of your contemporaries.

Till the wheels come off, that's what it's called.

Till the wheels come off, that's what it's called.

Right till the wheels fall off, till wiels fall off? Right seesad come off fall off.

Right till the wheels fall off, till wiels fall off? Right seesad come off fall off.

I've seen that actually in Prince. Yeah, don't worry about that.

I've seen that actually in Prince. Yeah, don't worry about that.

So, but I was watching it and because I'm not, like, I'm not in that world. I mean I know of it, but I'm not inside it. And the athleticism and the grace and the style and the craziness of all of that.

So, but I was watching it and because I'm not, like, I'm not in that world. I mean I know of it, but I'm not inside it. And the athleticism and the grace and the style and the craziness of all of that.

What you do is obvious.

What you do is obvious.

To anyone, even a casual glance. But what I wasn't expecting to see is first of all, the development of the world. I mean, like you were, that's like being around at the start of golf or something.

To anyone, even a casual glance. But what I wasn't expecting to see is first of all, the development of the world. I mean, like you were, that's like being around at the start of golf or something.

In a lot of ways. And then you, and I.

In a lot of ways. And then you, and I.

Think mulleins as well, a very a very strong sense of I don't really think it's about the board, and it hasn't been about the board for a long time. I feel like it's it's something else. It's like a search for grace. It's like the way guys climb mountains or something.

Think mulleins as well, a very a very strong sense of I don't really think it's about the board, and it hasn't been about the board for a long time. I feel like it's it's something else. It's like a search for grace. It's like the way guys climb mountains or something.

Yeah, I would agree with you there.

Yeah, I would agree with you there.

I think that, especially with Rodney and I, we were so hyper focused on new moves, new tricks, and we didn't know what the goal of that was. It just fed us. So we would we learned new chick and then move on to the next one, move on to the next one. And we didn't really think about that we were creating any sort of movement.

I think that, especially with Rodney and I, we were so hyper focused on new moves, new tricks, and we didn't know what the goal of that was. It just fed us. So we would we learned new chick and then move on to the next one, move on to the next one. And we didn't really think about that we were creating any sort of movement.

We just had to do it.

We just had to do it.

And then as we got older, that became you know, there's an argument that became more of a curse than a blessing because we keep chasing it to our detriment. Where even Rodney, I mean you see him now, Like, let's put it this way. Rodney walks through an airport and people come up with courtesy carts, So do you need a ride?

And then as we got older, that became you know, there's an argument that became more of a curse than a blessing because we keep chasing it to our detriment. Where even Rodney, I mean you see him now, Like, let's put it this way. Rodney walks through an airport and people come up with courtesy carts, So do you need a ride?

Really?

Really?

Yeah, that's the truth.

Yeah, that's the truth.

Do you know what I mean? Like people do that to me too. But skap Forard.

Do you know what I mean? Like people do that to me too. But skap Forard.

Because he walks with with such pain, right, but he will skate for three to four hours every single night on his own.

Because he walks with with such pain, right, but he will skate for three to four hours every single night on his own.

That's interesting. So he's more comfortable skating than walking.

That's interesting. So he's more comfortable skating than walking.

There, Absolutely, yeah, you that way too.

There, Absolutely, yeah, you that way too.

Still, I would say before I got hurt, yes, now I definitely have a little more hesitation in my skating because I should.

Still, I would say before I got hurt, yes, now I definitely have a little more hesitation in my skating because I should.

I'm still on the healing path.

I'm still on the healing path.

But yeah, also, like everybody else, you get older.

But yeah, also, like everybody else, you get older.

You get older, sure, but I feel like I think what wasn't really talked about in that documentary because it's nuanced and it's more my personal thing is that my style has changed quite a bit in the last ten years in that I'm more focused on low impact skating. And I know what you saw there was pretty crazy and I did some crazy stuff and whatever, but really my focus, especially with tricks, has been more technical, and so it's more like board maneuvering and stuff that just is on the top of the ramp as opposed to ten feet above it.

You get older, sure, but I feel like I think what wasn't really talked about in that documentary because it's nuanced and it's more my personal thing is that my style has changed quite a bit in the last ten years in that I'm more focused on low impact skating. And I know what you saw there was pretty crazy and I did some crazy stuff and whatever, but really my focus, especially with tricks, has been more technical, and so it's more like board maneuvering and stuff that just is on the top of the ramp as opposed to ten feet above it.

Right.

Right.

So it's funny because I don't you can see the athlanticism of it, but I don't understand how it's done. It's like you if I watch someone play golf, it swim even you know what I mean. It's like, I know how it's done, but like I've watched what you do and what Mullins does and what all these other guys do. I'm like, I don't even know where you start with that, you know, I mean, but you've you've created I mean, you personally as well with the foundation, have moved into this idea, like expanded it.

So it's funny because I don't you can see the athlanticism of it, but I don't understand how it's done. It's like you if I watch someone play golf, it swim even you know what I mean. It's like, I know how it's done, but like I've watched what you do and what Mullins does and what all these other guys do. I'm like, I don't even know where you start with that, you know, I mean, but you've you've created I mean, you personally as well with the foundation, have moved into this idea, like expanded it.

There's how many parks have you put together now?

There's how many parks have you put together now?

Uh, well, we've helped a fund over seven hundred wow, over the last twenty years. And I mean that's my proudest work. And that stems from my experience at the skate park as a kid, because I got very lucky in that one of the last parks in the US happened to be in San Diego, pretty close to where I lived. And that was never lost on me that I had that place to go and I had that sense of community and I had that support group there. I mean, yes, it was my training ground, but it was also just this place of belonging.

Uh, well, we've helped a fund over seven hundred wow, over the last twenty years. And I mean that's my proudest work. And that stems from my experience at the skate park as a kid, because I got very lucky in that one of the last parks in the US happened to be in San Diego, pretty close to where I lived. And that was never lost on me that I had that place to go and I had that sense of community and I had that support group there. I mean, yes, it was my training ground, but it was also just this place of belonging.

It was like where the kids went.

It was like where the kids went.

It was I mean it was you found me there at all hours until they closed when school was out. But when I had a sense of success in a way to sort of help I don't know that the industry or the skaters. That was my first go to was I want to provide more skate parks because all these kids feel disenfranchised. They love skating and they're told not to do it because it's on public property or.

It was I mean it was you found me there at all hours until they closed when school was out. But when I had a sense of success in a way to sort of help I don't know that the industry or the skaters. That was my first go to was I want to provide more skate parks because all these kids feel disenfranchised. They love skating and they're told not to do it because it's on public property or.

A pyro property and it's nusance in it and whatever else.

A pyro property and it's nusance in it and whatever else.

But it's like, but they found something it speaks to them, and that I think is a healthy outlet.

But it's like, but they found something it speaks to them, and that I think is a healthy outlet.

What do you think it would have hammed to you if if you hadn't found skating or it hadn't found you.

What do you think it would have hammed to you if if you hadn't found skating or it hadn't found you.

I think I would have just been doing something really tech oriented because I was really fascinated with technology also my teenage years and I mean still to this day. But I was an early adopter, like I had one of the first nonlinear video editing systems, and.

I think I would have just been doing something really tech oriented because I was really fascinated with technology also my teenage years and I mean still to this day. But I was an early adopter, like I had one of the first nonlinear video editing systems, and.

Really I did because I thought, I guess the answer I was kind of expected was that you would have been lost without it, But it doesn't.

Really I did because I thought, I guess the answer I was kind of expected was that you would have been lost without it, But it doesn't.

See, I probably wouldn't have felt as rich for sure, that I wouldn't have felt as validated or or felt like there was something that I could do that really fed what I needed in terms of creativity wise, right, And so maybe doing video projects or something would have touched on that a bit, but I don't think it would have provided the same.

See, I probably wouldn't have felt as rich for sure, that I wouldn't have felt as validated or or felt like there was something that I could do that really fed what I needed in terms of creativity wise, right, And so maybe doing video projects or something would have touched on that a bit, but I don't think it would have provided the same.

It's an interesting form of creativity as well, doing you know, creating tricks on a board. I mean it's like painting with something that nobody's painted with until.

It's an interesting form of creativity as well, doing you know, creating tricks on a board. I mean it's like painting with something that nobody's painted with until.

Orteen seventy or something.

Orteen seventy or something.

Or did you do you think anyone will appreciate it.

Or did you do you think anyone will appreciate it.

Well, yeah, I think people do.

Well, yeah, I think people do.

But I just say, what back then, especially with the creation, like with Rodney and I, when we were doing all these tricks, it was kind of considered a circus act.

But I just say, what back then, especially with the creation, like with Rodney and I, when we were doing all these tricks, it was kind of considered a circus act.

Well, it's got a better that in it, you know.

Well, it's got a better that in it, you know.

I mean when you guys was doing the tours with the you know, standing up in the arena with the you know, the ramps and the motorbikes, and that's a little bit of a travel in circus, isn't it a little bit.

I mean when you guys was doing the tours with the you know, standing up in the arena with the you know, the ramps and the motorbikes, and that's a little bit of a travel in circus, isn't it a little bit.

Of for sure? Yeah?

Of for sure? Yeah?

Absolutely.

Absolutely.

But what I'm saying is is in our world, skating was a pretty small community. We were the outcast of that community because all we cared about was tricks. Everyone else cared about right style and how much air they get. And so Rodney and I were these outcasts, like we were outcasts in an outcast activity, and so we didn't think there was any sort of there would be any accolades in that.

But what I'm saying is is in our world, skating was a pretty small community. We were the outcast of that community because all we cared about was tricks. Everyone else cared about right style and how much air they get. And so Rodney and I were these outcasts, like we were outcasts in an outcast activity, and so we didn't think there was any sort of there would be any accolades in that.

We just love doing it, do you know.

We just love doing it, do you know.

For a while I worked with Mick Jagger on writing a screenplay that never happened. But because I was doing it, I was on tour with the Rolling Stones for a while and I got to see up close how the rolling stones work. And I was watching Keith Richards, who you remind me of a little bit, because he would be quite happy if he was playing that guitar in a shitty blues band in a pub in London, Fine, doesn't matter. Or if he's playing the enormo dome in San Diego, doesn't fucking matter. It's playing the guitar that cats.

For a while I worked with Mick Jagger on writing a screenplay that never happened. But because I was doing it, I was on tour with the Rolling Stones for a while and I got to see up close how the rolling stones work. And I was watching Keith Richards, who you remind me of a little bit, because he would be quite happy if he was playing that guitar in a shitty blues band in a pub in London, Fine, doesn't matter. Or if he's playing the enormo dome in San Diego, doesn't fucking matter. It's playing the guitar that cats.

Yeah. And is that the same for you on the board?

Yeah. And is that the same for you on the board?

Yeah, So even when when you were doing the like when things were nutty, when you're like you have your own playing and you you know, like the crowds are crazy and the money's nuts and stuff like that, was it all still focused on the board.

Yeah, So even when when you were doing the like when things were nutty, when you're like you have your own playing and you you know, like the crowds are crazy and the money's nuts and stuff like that, was it all still focused on the board.

Is that what kept you out of the druggy drinking one?

Is that what kept you out of the druggy drinking one?

Yeah?

Yeah?

Yeah, I believe so.

Yeah, I believe so.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I mean I definitely had my own vices and distractions through the crazy years, but always the priority was skating. And I think that even in my youth, when in the eighties when we thought we were having unparalleled success and we were doing all, you know, we were doing some TV stuff and movie stuff, I was always really focused on the skating because I saw my peers, some of them get distracted and get caught up in the hype and and get hooked on drugs, right, and then they lost their abilities. And it was like that was my very first example, like, don't don't go to that, Right, That's what I thought.

I mean I definitely had my own vices and distractions through the crazy years, but always the priority was skating. And I think that even in my youth, when in the eighties when we thought we were having unparalleled success and we were doing all, you know, we were doing some TV stuff and movie stuff, I was always really focused on the skating because I saw my peers, some of them get distracted and get caught up in the hype and and get hooked on drugs, right, and then they lost their abilities. And it was like that was my very first example, like, don't don't go to that, Right, That's what I thought.

I mean, it's not something you can do when you're high. Is get on a board or is it?

I mean, it's not something you can do when you're high. Is get on a board or is it?

I don't know, maybe for a certain amount of time.

I don't know, maybe for a certain amount of time.

Right, did you ever like, do you ever give demonstrations you ever you know, get on the board and do crazy shit when you were messed up?

Right, did you ever like, do you ever give demonstrations you ever you know, get on the board and do crazy shit when you were messed up?

No? I think, my.

No? I think, my.

It's funny.

It's funny.

I remember the skate PARKY grew up at. People would smoke weed in the parking lot. Not everyone, but some.

I remember the skate PARKY grew up at. People would smoke weed in the parking lot. Not everyone, but some.

Oh come on, everybody, it's California, the whole states.

Oh come on, everybody, it's California, the whole states.

Well I was pretty young too, so I remember one day I was like, Oh, I'm gonna go join the crew, and then I came back to skate and I just couldn't get it together. I couldn't, you know, Everything was my timing was off. I kept almost almost we call hanging out, which means like locking up on the coping where your board sticks, right, And I just thought, Okay, I can't, I can't do that. That doesn't work for me, and drinking is just out of the question, right, and you're skating.

Well I was pretty young too, so I remember one day I was like, Oh, I'm gonna go join the crew, and then I came back to skate and I just couldn't get it together. I couldn't, you know, Everything was my timing was off. I kept almost almost we call hanging out, which means like locking up on the coping where your board sticks, right, And I just thought, Okay, I can't, I can't do that. That doesn't work for me, and drinking is just out of the question, right, and you're skating.

So I think that was I think I'm beginning to figure out why I never get into skateboard. But it's kind of interesting though, because it is that is a real kind of positive thing. If you're talking about all these skate parts for kids, if you can't do it properly when you're twisted on booze and elk or in drugs, right, you're kind of helping people stay away from it a little bit.

So I think that was I think I'm beginning to figure out why I never get into skateboard. But it's kind of interesting though, because it is that is a real kind of positive thing. If you're talking about all these skate parts for kids, if you can't do it properly when you're twisted on booze and elk or in drugs, right, you're kind of helping people stay away from it a little bit.

I mean, I for sure there is the contingent that they equate partying with, of course skateboarding, and they do it, and honestly it's probably more of a short lived thing, but that's their life. I can't I'm not trying to have some just say no campaign skate parts wore that.

I mean, I for sure there is the contingent that they equate partying with, of course skateboarding, and they do it, and honestly it's probably more of a short lived thing, but that's their life. I can't I'm not trying to have some just say no campaign skate parts wore that.

It's more that we want to provide them outlet.

It's more that we want to provide them outlet.

Yeah, because when you started, it was basically it was just dried out swimming pools, right, that was at the beginning.

Yeah, because when you started, it was basically it was just dried out swimming pools, right, that was at the beginning.

Yeah, I got in at the tail end of that.

Yeah, I got in at the tail end of that.

So the Dogtown and Z Boys, I knew of that crew as I started, but they were already as far as I was concerned, much older.

So the Dogtown and Z Boys, I knew of that crew as I started, but they were already as far as I was concerned, much older.

Well as the evolution of it, if you can take me through it a little bit. So that dog Town was is that the very beginning.

Well as the evolution of it, if you can take me through it a little bit. So that dog Town was is that the very beginning.

The beginning has has there's how it began.

The beginning has has there's how it began.

But basically, the first skateboard, it is said, was a roller skate that was dismantled the trucks and wheels were nailed onto a two by four, right, and that was a skateboard. And then a lot of the Southern California people took that as that surfing on a sidewalk, right, So then they started developing actually shaped boards out of fiberglass and wood like surfboards were made, right, And then they were trying to emulate surfing. Once the big drought hit in the seventies in southern California, all these swimming pools were dry, and the surfers saw that, oh, that looks like a wave, and that's how we.

But basically, the first skateboard, it is said, was a roller skate that was dismantled the trucks and wheels were nailed onto a two by four, right, and that was a skateboard. And then a lot of the Southern California people took that as that surfing on a sidewalk, right, So then they started developing actually shaped boards out of fiberglass and wood like surfboards were made, right, And then they were trying to emulate surfing. Once the big drought hit in the seventies in southern California, all these swimming pools were dry, and the surfers saw that, oh, that looks like a wave, and that's how we.

How it got to Do you surf? Do? I do?

How it got to Do you surf? Do? I do?

Yeah? But not as actively.

Yeah? But not as actively.

And the reason I got into skateboarding because my older brother was a hardcore surfer, and so he got into skateboarding by default, because that was if you lived in Southern California, you surfed in the seventies, you started skating and that's how I got my first skateboard. Was his hand me down.

And the reason I got into skateboarding because my older brother was a hardcore surfer, and so he got into skateboarding by default, because that was if you lived in Southern California, you surfed in the seventies, you started skating and that's how I got my first skateboard. Was his hand me down.

Oh wow, he must be very happy for you.

Oh wow, he must be very happy for you.

He's very happy that he can school me in surfing.

He's very happy that he can school me in surfing.

Still, that's what he's happy about.

Still, that's what he's happy about.

Well, it's funny that you're you're a lot younger than your nearest sibling, right.

Well, it's funny that you're you're a lot younger than your nearest sibling, right.

Yeah, he's thirteen years older than me.

Yeah, he's thirteen years older than me.

Right.

Right.

My son, my youngest son, is nine and a half years younger than his older brother. And I was watching the energy of you as a young Kiad. It reminded me very much like my own son is very like that, like a kind of sixty pound psychopath. Really, I mean just like And I had one of those two. Yeah, they're kind of amazing. I think there's something to do with being light as well. See I was a husky little kid. Yeah, so if I fail, it really hard. Right, if you were sixty pounds and you fall, I think it hurts less.

My son, my youngest son, is nine and a half years younger than his older brother. And I was watching the energy of you as a young Kiad. It reminded me very much like my own son is very like that, like a kind of sixty pound psychopath. Really, I mean just like And I had one of those two. Yeah, they're kind of amazing. I think there's something to do with being light as well. See I was a husky little kid. Yeah, so if I fail, it really hard. Right, if you were sixty pounds and you fall, I think it hurts less.

Maybe, But I think the light and fearless is a scary combination.

Maybe, But I think the light and fearless is a scary combination.

Yeah, that's definitely I had.

Yeah, that's definitely I had.

I had one of the We have several children between my wife and I, but there was one that was we called him a pixie. Yeah, but he would try anything, but almost to the point where he had no sense of mortality.

I had one of the We have several children between my wife and I, but there was one that was we called him a pixie. Yeah, but he would try anything, but almost to the point where he had no sense of mortality.

Yeah, well kids are kind of like that a little bit.

Yeah, well kids are kind of like that a little bit.

Yeah, but he was off, he was on a different a little bit.

Yeah, but he was off, he was on a different a little bit.

Do you think that you were more cautious like as a parent because you had gone through all of those injuries and that the creation of.

Do you think that you were more cautious like as a parent because you had gone through all of those injuries and that the creation of.

That world, as that world is forming.

That world, as that world is forming.

I would say that I probably leaned more towards the other side of it in my early years of parenting because I was young. I was I was twenty four when my son was more and and I was just joining him doing stuff and getting him into skateboarding, and you know, he's going down big ramps and I'm pushing him into waves, and it was just more like, oh, I have this friend to do the stuff with. And it wasn't. I was trying to keep him safe as well. But I did think that he had a pretty good sense of his limitations, right, and I was thankful for that. It wasn't until I had other kids that I realized, oh, they don't all have that Alva gene.

I would say that I probably leaned more towards the other side of it in my early years of parenting because I was young. I was I was twenty four when my son was more and and I was just joining him doing stuff and getting him into skateboarding, and you know, he's going down big ramps and I'm pushing him into waves, and it was just more like, oh, I have this friend to do the stuff with. And it wasn't. I was trying to keep him safe as well. But I did think that he had a pretty good sense of his limitations, right, and I was thankful for that. It wasn't until I had other kids that I realized, oh, they don't all have that Alva gene.

Yeah.

Yeah.

It's funny that when you become a parent, and just as you get older as well, because I was different.

It's funny that when you become a parent, and just as you get older as well, because I was different.

From my older boy than I was with the younger one. But they are different too. They are.

From my older boy than I was with the younger one. But they are different too. They are.

Yes, there's a lot of nurture and nature.

Yes, there's a lot of nurture and nature.

Yeah, what do you think, like because your dad was very supportive to you, at least at least I took that for the documentary that you and your dad were closed and he was very supportive. But the world was forming. The competitive Is it competitive? I guess it's competitive, yeah, competitive skateboarding. But when I looked at that, the thing when you first got to do the nine hundred, right or when you finally cracked how many times did you.

Yeah, what do you think, like because your dad was very supportive to you, at least at least I took that for the documentary that you and your dad were closed and he was very supportive. But the world was forming. The competitive Is it competitive? I guess it's competitive, yeah, competitive skateboarding. But when I looked at that, the thing when you first got to do the nine hundred, right or when you finally cracked how many times did you.

Do that that day? That ex game to get to that?

Do that that day? That ex game to get to that?

Now that I think that day was eleven or twelve or something. But it's funny that people focused in on that because there were plenty of other days where I tried it dozens of.

Now that I think that day was eleven or twelve or something. But it's funny that people focused in on that because there were plenty of other days where I tried it dozens of.

Times, right, but did you get it? Though? You didn't get it?

Times, right, but did you get it? Though? You didn't get it?

Why that's why they focused because the day you get it is that's the day right?

Why that's why they focused because the day you get it is that's the day right?

Right?

Right?

But you know what I mean, Like that was a relatively short duration of attimes for as far as I was concerned, Right, So when people say you tried to let tones, like, yeah, there was nothing. I tried hundreds of times before that, like thousands of times.

But you know what I mean, Like that was a relatively short duration of attimes for as far as I was concerned, Right, So when people say you tried to let tones, like, yeah, there was nothing. I tried hundreds of times before that, like thousands of times.

But something like the nine hundred, which I'm not quite sure why it's I don't know why it's called the nine hundred.

But something like the nine hundred, which I'm not quite sure why it's I don't know why it's called the nine hundred.

Why is it called.

Why is it called.

That's the degrees of spin, right, So it goes around and a half two and a half, right, so two and a half times in the air and then land. You envist each that in your head first, and you go through it in your head and you create you like a like a paint or does or a movie director does or.

That's the degrees of spin, right, So it goes around and a half two and a half, right, so two and a half times in the air and then land. You envist each that in your head first, and you go through it in your head and you create you like a like a paint or does or a movie director does or.

Yeah, eventually I did that.

Yeah, eventually I did that.

Yes.

Yes.

When I first started trying it, it was almost ten years prior to that event, and I really didn't know how to spin around that far, how to balance my body so that I could be in the position to get back down on the ramp, So I didn't quite have the vision then. It wasn't until a few years later when I actively started trying it and started figuring out that I could possibly get close. That's when I started visualizing it, and that's when the chase got accelerated, because I was just all in on this trick.

When I first started trying it, it was almost ten years prior to that event, and I really didn't know how to spin around that far, how to balance my body so that I could be in the position to get back down on the ramp, So I didn't quite have the vision then. It wasn't until a few years later when I actively started trying it and started figuring out that I could possibly get close. That's when I started visualizing it, and that's when the chase got accelerated, because I was just all in on this trick.

Right, So you you understood that it was possible for you, Yes, And the idea of as you're falling, as a human being is falling through space and you're still having a twist, and you're going to you have an appointment to make with the board. You're going to have to You're going to have to meet that appointment or it's going to hart or you're going to be embarrassed.

Right, So you you understood that it was possible for you, Yes, And the idea of as you're falling, as a human being is falling through space and you're still having a twist, and you're going to you have an appointment to make with the board. You're going to have to You're going to have to meet that appointment or it's going to hart or you're going to be embarrassed.

Are you just not going to make the trick?

Are you just not going to make the trick?

That?

That?

Does the time slow it down? Can you slow it down and think your way through it? Or is it not possible to consciously go through the trick? Does it have to be you know, like automatic?

Does the time slow it down? Can you slow it down and think your way through it? Or is it not possible to consciously go through the trick? Does it have to be you know, like automatic?

Does it have to be?

Does it have to be?

That's a really good question. And I don't say that time slows down. It's more that there's a bunch of elements that have to come together, and you know it as soon as you take off that this one has all those pieces.

That's a really good question. And I don't say that time slows down. It's more that there's a bunch of elements that have to come together, and you know it as soon as you take off that this one has all those pieces.

Right, So there you take off, as you take off going to make I would say more often than not, you don't have all those pieces.

Right, So there you take off, as you take off going to make I would say more often than not, you don't have all those pieces.

So you take off immediately knowing this one's not going to work. But you have to go through the motion of it, because to take off in that position with that much speed and not spin all the way through is the most dangerous thing you can do. So you just have to commit to commit to to So what I'm saying is a few times I've done it where it didn't happen that day at X Games, but it happens.

So you take off immediately knowing this one's not going to work. But you have to go through the motion of it, because to take off in that position with that much speed and not spin all the way through is the most dangerous thing you can do. So you just have to commit to commit to to So what I'm saying is a few times I've done it where it didn't happen that day at X Games, but it happens.

It's happened to be before and after that.

It's happened to be before and after that.

If I don't get a hold of my board, I have to commit my body to that full spin because of what I've the position I put.

If I don't get a hold of my board, I have to commit my body to that full spin because of what I've the position I put.

It in on the on the takeoff.

It in on the on the takeoff.

And I learned that the hard way because a couple of times I didn't get my board got away from me and I just stopped and all of a sudden, I was like, oh shit, I'm in space. I have no idea where the ramp is and where is it? And then I hit on my back. Yeah, and then that's the worst case scenario. So I learned that even if it's not gonna work, just go through the motion of it.

And I learned that the hard way because a couple of times I didn't get my board got away from me and I just stopped and all of a sudden, I was like, oh shit, I'm in space. I have no idea where the ramp is and where is it? And then I hit on my back. Yeah, and then that's the worst case scenario. So I learned that even if it's not gonna work, just go through the motion of it.

And does it feel like does it feel like there's anything you can do? Like if you go off and you go no everything to see here? But if I just do then.

And does it feel like does it feel like there's anything you can do? Like if you go off and you go no everything to see here? But if I just do then.

You definitely Yeah.

You definitely Yeah.

I mean there's plenty of there's plenty of that in our cavalier attitude towards tricks, but also in that moment, if you're in competition, you're gonna try to make it no matter what. Right, So that's another we call them hail Mary's. It's like you're gonna just throw it down because this is the time it has to happen. And if you're gonna crash, it should be now, do you know what I mean? Like, if you're ever gonna get destroyed on this trick, because you committed to it, it should be in this format.

I mean there's plenty of there's plenty of that in our cavalier attitude towards tricks, but also in that moment, if you're in competition, you're gonna try to make it no matter what. Right, So that's another we call them hail Mary's. It's like you're gonna just throw it down because this is the time it has to happen. And if you're gonna crash, it should be now, do you know what I mean? Like, if you're ever gonna get destroyed on this trick, because you committed to it, it should be in this format.

Right, so at least stay within the bones of the trick.

Right, so at least stay within the bones of the trick.

Sure, right, yeah, I get it if you had been involved in the sport now, like if you were, like Tony Hawk is twelve years old today and you're getting involved in it does the sport and I say to you, you have to wear this, you have to wear these, this protecularly fit you have.

Sure, right, yeah, I get it if you had been involved in the sport now, like if you were, like Tony Hawk is twelve years old today and you're getting involved in it does the sport and I say to you, you have to wear this, you have to wear these, this protecularly fit you have.

It's still the same as it was.

It's still the same as it was.

No, it's it's so when I was growing up, the only way you could have any sense of success in skateboarding was to compete, right, that's it. There was no YouTube, there's no social media. The magazines were not going to cover you unless you went to this big event and probably did well. Even if you were doing new tricks and not placing. They don't care about that. Right Now, skating is of age it's way more diverse. You can enter skateboarding and never have to compete and still be one of the most successful skaters that's ever been.

No, it's it's so when I was growing up, the only way you could have any sense of success in skateboarding was to compete, right, that's it. There was no YouTube, there's no social media. The magazines were not going to cover you unless you went to this big event and probably did well. Even if you were doing new tricks and not placing. They don't care about that. Right Now, skating is of age it's way more diverse. You can enter skateboarding and never have to compete and still be one of the most successful skaters that's ever been.

Because you can do videos and.

Because you can do videos and.

You could have your you could have your your you know, you could have your big solt, you could be an influencer and a skater and it's just a totally different It is because of how much it permeated mainstream culture in that skateboarding is just more of an accepted form of art or sport or activity, whatever you want to call it.

You could have your you could have your your you know, you could have your big solt, you could be an influencer and a skater and it's just a totally different It is because of how much it permeated mainstream culture in that skateboarding is just more of an accepted form of art or sport or activity, whatever you want to call it.

What is it to you?

What is it to you?

To me, it's yeah, it's it's it's a lifestyle, it's a sport, it's an art form.

To me, it's yeah, it's it's it's a lifestyle, it's a sport, it's an art form.

But to me, it's it's my salvation.

But to me, it's it's my salvation.

That's what I was going to say. It's it's almost like I got I sensed that from you.

That's what I was going to say. It's it's almost like I got I sensed that from you.

I find what you were saying is is like, would you have to conform to some sort of team, sport or uniform or or something like that, well, or equipment if your goals me in the Olympics, Yes, that's your path and that's what you're going to have to adhere to. But you can just do it in your own voice, in your own style and still make a go.

I find what you were saying is is like, would you have to conform to some sort of team, sport or uniform or or something like that, well, or equipment if your goals me in the Olympics, Yes, that's your path and that's what you're going to have to adhere to. But you can just do it in your own voice, in your own style and still make a go.

Of it, right.

Of it, right.

What about the idea if it was an Olympic sport when you were a kid, do you think you would have gone that way?

What about the idea if it was an Olympic sport when you were a kid, do you think you would have gone that way?

Do you think you do? Sure, because that was that was the only.

Do you think you do? Sure, because that was that was the only.

But doesn't that say I don't know how it's graded in the Olympics. Can you bring a new trick to an Olympics? Yes, So it's kind of like gymnastics. You go, here's something nobody's ever done before. Yeah, and people go, okay, wow, you get your tans out of tans?

But doesn't that say I don't know how it's graded in the Olympics. Can you bring a new trick to an Olympics? Yes, So it's kind of like gymnastics. You go, here's something nobody's ever done before. Yeah, and people go, okay, wow, you get your tans out of tans?

Yeah, and well, and also the judges are all well versed in skateboarding obviously, right, and for them to see something new is going to probably they're probably going to overscore you for it, right, because they just didn't expect it.

Yeah, and well, and also the judges are all well versed in skateboarding obviously, right, and for them to see something new is going to probably they're probably going to overscore you for it, right, because they just didn't expect it.

Right?

Right?

Does it form like a routine? Like if you I don't know how the sports graded in the Olympics.

Does it form like a routine? Like if you I don't know how the sports graded in the Olympics.

So the format of Olympics is not any different really than what you probably saw in the documentary or in other skate events. You have a time to run and you are judged on your difficulty factor, the speed you kept, how you use the course.

So the format of Olympics is not any different really than what you probably saw in the documentary or in other skate events. You have a time to run and you are judged on your difficulty factor, the speed you kept, how you use the course.

And your consistency. The basic elements of it are all the same.

And your consistency. The basic elements of it are all the same.

It's funny though that talking about it as a spot. I mean, there are guys who were interviewed.

It's funny though that talking about it as a spot. I mean, there are guys who were interviewed.

During the documentary.

During the documentary.

When I watched it, I thought, this guy's with a neck tattoos is never going to go to the Olympics. He doesn't, he's not even interested in watching there.

When I watched it, I thought, this guy's with a neck tattoos is never going to go to the Olympics. He doesn't, he's not even interested in watching there.

And that was in my day.

And that was in my day.

Skating was so counterculture that it was it was akin to punt crop music.

Skating was so counterculture that it was it was akin to punt crop music.

We're not going to fit in. We're doing it our way.

We're not going to fit in. We're doing it our way.

For that's why I always associated with it, that it was like a punk thing.

For that's why I always associated with it, that it was like a punk thing.

Sure, and in that respect, there's extreme versions of that where it's like we don't want to do anything that is considered mainstream or whatnot. But then if you I was so young, I didn't really understand all of that narrative, maybe right, And I just loved what skateboarding was, even though it was different and it made me an outcast at school and you know, it was just not the coolest thing to do. I just love doing it. But also I love the idea that I got to compete with all these people that were that liked the same thing.

Sure, and in that respect, there's extreme versions of that where it's like we don't want to do anything that is considered mainstream or whatnot. But then if you I was so young, I didn't really understand all of that narrative, maybe right, And I just loved what skateboarding was, even though it was different and it made me an outcast at school and you know, it was just not the coolest thing to do. I just love doing it. But also I love the idea that I got to compete with all these people that were that liked the same thing.

Right, And it does seem quite supportive in an odd way that people are you know they're competitive, but not competitive in a way that you want to bring the other guy down.

Right, And it does seem quite supportive in an odd way that people are you know they're competitive, but not competitive in a way that you want to bring the other guy down.

It's just like I can't believe.

It's just like I can't believe.

Yeah, and I think and I also think that shines through in the Olympic coverage, right I saw. I mean, if you're talking about like I got to go to Tokyo and a good example was the women's park event. There was one one girl that was absolutely the favorite to win, you know, without question, if she would have made her whole routine, She's going to win this thing. And she just kept missing this one trick and she finally almost got it at the end, but still missed it. She ended up getting third and when the whole when the competition was over and they gave out the awards, all of the other girls lifted her up on their shoulders and carried her out of the venue.

Yeah, and I think and I also think that shines through in the Olympic coverage, right I saw. I mean, if you're talking about like I got to go to Tokyo and a good example was the women's park event. There was one one girl that was absolutely the favorite to win, you know, without question, if she would have made her whole routine, She's going to win this thing. And she just kept missing this one trick and she finally almost got it at the end, but still missed it. She ended up getting third and when the whole when the competition was over and they gave out the awards, all of the other girls lifted her up on their shoulders and carried her out of the venue.

That's beautiful.

That's beautiful.

I mean, what other sport could you think of at the Olympics where they're, yeah, they're all celebrating the third place person because they thought she was going to be the best.

I mean, what other sport could you think of at the Olympics where they're, yeah, they're all celebrating the third place person because they thought she was going to be the best.

And that she tried. Do you get an amount of attempts and then I.

And that she tried. Do you get an amount of attempts and then I.

Guess just with no, not with that, that's that one.

Guess just with no, not with that, that's that one.

It's a I believe it's a forty second routine, right that forty seconds that's it.

It's a I believe it's a forty second routine, right that forty seconds that's it.

If you fall in the middle of it, you're out.

If you fall in the middle of it, you're out.

So the idea of doing eleven attempts at nine hundred is not going to exist.

So the idea of doing eleven attempts at nine hundred is not going to exist.

And you're never going to see that in the Olympics.

And you're never going to see that in the Olympics.

No, right, no, not at all.

No, right, no, not at all.

But you are going to see the X game still, right, Yes, I hope.

But you are going to see the X game still, right, Yes, I hope.

So, yeah, I hope that format continues.

So, yeah, I hope that format continues.

Are you gonna keep skating until the wheels come off?

Are you gonna keep skating until the wheels come off?

I mean that wasn't my quote, by the way, though.

I mean that wasn't my quote, by the way, though.

Yeah, in a sense, I think that I've definitely gotten a better perspective on my limitations through this last injury I had, and that I don't expect to come back fully one hundred percent and get back to the exact same type of skating I was doing before this happened. But I can find some happy medium there, and I can find something that where I'm still considered a professional. I could still probably put out content or whatever it is, of some sort of progress in skating, but I'm not moving the needle necessarily.

Yeah, in a sense, I think that I've definitely gotten a better perspective on my limitations through this last injury I had, and that I don't expect to come back fully one hundred percent and get back to the exact same type of skating I was doing before this happened. But I can find some happy medium there, and I can find something that where I'm still considered a professional. I could still probably put out content or whatever it is, of some sort of progress in skating, but I'm not moving the needle necessarily.

It's just more of that. There's more personal goals.

It's just more of that. There's more personal goals.

Can you envision the time like you know what I need to do the senior pgator.

Can you envision the time like you know what I need to do the senior pgator.

Sure, that's already that already exists.

Sure, that's already that already exists.

Right, so you get like a yellow jacket. It's funny.

Right, so you get like a yellow jacket. It's funny.

It's funny because they're having a few events in recent years. In fact, there was one in particular called bol Rama in Bondai in Australia.

It's funny because they're having a few events in recent years. In fact, there was one in particular called bol Rama in Bondai in Australia.

And they had this big bowl Evan every year.

And they had this big bowl Evan every year.

They had the Pro division, then they had the Master's division, which is basically older pros, and then they had the Legends division, which is super old pros.

They had the Pro division, then they had the Master's division, which is basically older pros, and then they had the Legends division, which is super old pros.

Like me, but Legends is better than senior.

Like me, but Legends is better than senior.

Well legends, Yeah, I feel like I'd rather be considered legend that I'm master.

Well legends, Yeah, I feel like I'd rather be considered legend that I'm master.

Yeah.

Yeah.

But at the same time, and also the Master's division, like those guys are still pretty much pro skaters, so I wouldn't have wanted to be in that division anyway.

But at the same time, and also the Master's division, like those guys are still pretty much pro skaters, so I wouldn't have wanted to be in that division anyway.

It's like like those guys who are younger and faster, and it's more like I would say, it would be more like the pros are sort of thirty and under, the masters were like thirty to forty five ish.

It's like like those guys who are younger and faster, and it's more like I would say, it would be more like the pros are sort of thirty and under, the masters were like thirty to forty five ish.

Right, and then all of those old legends.

Right, and then all of those old legends.

Yeah. I mean, I love the idea.

Yeah. I mean, I love the idea.

Is there any generational kind of get off my lawn part of it like, do you look at kids who are coming up now and the boards are better and the helmets are better in the.

Is there any generational kind of get off my lawn part of it like, do you look at kids who are coming up now and the boards are better and the helmets are better in the.

I would say there's a sense of jealousy that they have the resources to, let's say, try their first nine hundred into a phone pit.

I would say there's a sense of jealousy that they have the resources to, let's say, try their first nine hundred into a phone pit.

I would have loved that. I didn't have that.

I would have loved that. I didn't have that.

But would you have got to be a legend if you if you landed foam, you're never a line.

But would you have got to be a legend if you if you landed foam, you're never a line.

Yeah, but I would have maybe kept my front teeth.

Yeah, but I would have maybe kept my front teeth.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Did you think you've spent a lot of money on dental bills over the years.

Did you think you've spent a lot of money on dental bills over the years.

Yeah, yeah I did.

Yeah, yeah I did.

Let's say I knocked my front teeth out when I was ten or eleven, that was my first being injury, and then knock them out about five times.

Let's say I knocked my front teeth out when I was ten or eleven, that was my first being injury, and then knock them out about five times.

Since no kind of mouthguard you can wear or something like that, you could.

Since no kind of mouthguard you can wear or something like that, you could.

I mean, I think I've passed that time in my life. Yeah.

I mean, I think I've passed that time in my life. Yeah.

But also the cool thing and I and I say this lot, but the cool thing about getting new teeth that you get.

But also the cool thing and I and I say this lot, but the cool thing about getting new teeth that you get.

To pick the size and the color.

To pick the size and the color.

So where you're losing this wing is yeah, so where do you think it goes?

So where you're losing this wing is yeah, so where do you think it goes?

Now? Then it's a sport. I don't even know if I buy that it's a sport.

Now? Then it's a sport. I don't even know if I buy that it's a sport.

Well, I think it's more than the definition.

Well, I think it's more than the definition.

Sure, if that's if you're looking at the competitive side of it. But also there's just this whole counterculture art form to skateboarding that has no interest in competing. So I feel like it's a it's a big umbrella.

Sure, if that's if you're looking at the competitive side of it. But also there's just this whole counterculture art form to skateboarding that has no interest in competing. So I feel like it's a it's a big umbrella.

It is, I suppose the closest thing.

It is, I suppose the closest thing.

I mean, it's nothing like this physically, but it's kind of like golf in the sense that some people play it and it's really important to them to win, and some people play it and they play against themselves and.

I mean, it's nothing like this physically, but it's kind of like golf in the sense that some people play it and it's really important to them to win, and some people play it and they play against themselves and.

They play or they or just to be social, right, that's who they hang out with, ya. I mean there is there is a whole population of skaters that are like my age that they love to go skate curbs Sunday morning, eight am.

They play or they or just to be social, right, that's who they hang out with, ya. I mean there is there is a whole population of skaters that are like my age that they love to go skate curbs Sunday morning, eight am.

That's their crew.

That's their crew.

They go and skate the grocery store curbs because they're painted red and they can grind and and it's low impact and that. Yeah, but my style is so steeped in what we call transition that I'm pretty clunky on curves, Like it's probably more dangerous for me to skate a curb honestly than the fourteen foot ramp.

They go and skate the grocery store curbs because they're painted red and they can grind and and it's low impact and that. Yeah, but my style is so steeped in what we call transition that I'm pretty clunky on curves, Like it's probably more dangerous for me to skate a curb honestly than the fourteen foot ramp.

And do you still have a ramp at home.

And do you still have a ramp at home.

I have that the ramp that you saw on documentary that side. I was riding that yesterday. Really yeah, so you are by that's my happy place?

I have that the ramp that you saw on documentary that side. I was riding that yesterday. Really yeah, so you are by that's my happy place?

Oh yeah, absolutely So like if you have you have a ride with your wife or something, you're like a you go out there.

Oh yeah, absolutely So like if you have you have a ride with your wife or something, you're like a you go out there.

And I would say, it's definitely my way to center myself.

And I would say, it's definitely my way to center myself.

Yes, what happens if you can't get on the ramp, you can't go on the board.

Yes, what happens if you can't get on the ramp, you can't go on the board.

We'll let you know when I get there.

We'll let you know when I get there.

He's never going to happen.

He's never going to happen.

I'm sure it'll happen. Maybe they'll Maybe I'll just get a smaller.

I'm sure it'll happen. Maybe they'll Maybe I'll just get a smaller.

Ramp, get a smaller ramp, or maybe just start wearing more foam where.

Ramp, get a smaller ramp, or maybe just start wearing more foam where.

To get foam suit? That might be a good look.

To get foam suit? That might be a good look.

Do you think that like the journey that skateboarding has made, Do you think it's good? Do you think it's good for it? Do you think it's healthier now than it was then? It's much healthier now than it was then.