Hey, guys, welcome to I've never said this before with me, Tommy di Dario. I am so excited to share this conversation with you with one of the most thoughtful and brilliant humans I've had the pleasure of chatting with the very talented actor and singer Ben Barnes is hanging out with me today. So on the acting side, Ben has become known as the King of Fantasy. He starred as Prince Caspian and the Chronicles of Narnia franchise, then he went on to do Dorian Gray, Killing Bono, Westworld, The Marvels, The Punisher, and of course play the fan favorite villain in the wildly popular Netflix series Shadow and Bone. And because his talent can't be contained to just one art form, he is also a brilliant singer and songwriter. His debut album, Where the Light Gets In is out right now, and let me tell you m his lyrics are magical. He connects to the human spirit in such a way that's gonna leave you feeling seen and heard and like your voice, your life journey truly matters. That's the magic of Ben Barnes. And he was so kind to invite me to his New York City performance at Webster Hall where, oh man, the only way I can describe his show is that it was electric. Today we are celebrating all of the things that come together to make Ben Barnes who he truly is, the man behind some of your favorite roles and the man behind the music. So let's see if today we can get Ben to say something that he has never said before. Ben Barnes, how you doing, my man?

Hey, guys, welcome to I've never said this before with me, Tommy di Dario. I am so excited to share this conversation with you with one of the most thoughtful and brilliant humans I've had the pleasure of chatting with the very talented actor and singer Ben Barnes is hanging out with me today. So on the acting side, Ben has become known as the King of Fantasy. He starred as Prince Caspian and the Chronicles of Narnia franchise, then he went on to do Dorian Gray, Killing Bono, Westworld, The Marvels, The Punisher, and of course play the fan favorite villain in the wildly popular Netflix series Shadow and Bone. And because his talent can't be contained to just one art form, he is also a brilliant singer and songwriter. His debut album, Where the Light Gets In is out right now, and let me tell you m his lyrics are magical. He connects to the human spirit in such a way that's gonna leave you feeling seen and heard and like your voice, your life journey truly matters. That's the magic of Ben Barnes. And he was so kind to invite me to his New York City performance at Webster Hall where, oh man, the only way I can describe his show is that it was electric. Today we are celebrating all of the things that come together to make Ben Barnes who he truly is, the man behind some of your favorite roles and the man behind the music. So let's see if today we can get Ben to say something that he has never said before. Ben Barnes, how you doing, my man?

Very well? Thank you for having me.

Very well? Thank you for having me.

I am so happy to have you here. Welcome to New York. I know you've been on a whirldwind tour. You don't even probably know what city you're in right now.

I am so happy to have you here. Welcome to New York. I know you've been on a whirldwind tour. You don't even probably know what city you're in right now.

Yeah, I definitely have almost gone on stage and done that spinal tap reference of Hello Cleveland. We've never been anywhere in Italy, but it has been. It's been really, really fun, magical.

Yeah, I definitely have almost gone on stage and done that spinal tap reference of Hello Cleveland. We've never been anywhere in Italy, but it has been. It's been really, really fun, magical.

Congratulations. We have so much to get into. I was listening to your album the other day and it's fantastic. I'm a sucker for drama and soulful lyrics and real connection in music, and I'm probably one of the rare people who can listen to that type of music in the gym when I'm working out, like I don't need like a banger, I don't need like the beats like I like to envision what I'm listening to and create the story as I'm working out, and your album is very much that.

Congratulations. We have so much to get into. I was listening to your album the other day and it's fantastic. I'm a sucker for drama and soulful lyrics and real connection in music, and I'm probably one of the rare people who can listen to that type of music in the gym when I'm working out, like I don't need like a banger, I don't need like the beats like I like to envision what I'm listening to and create the story as I'm working out, and your album is very much that.

I like, something kind of filmic and.

I like, something kind of filmic and.

I do I do together, I really do. And I thought, I think what you did with that is brilliant. We're going to dive into it. But I find your story so fascinating. So at nineteen, as she began writing music right and kind of started working with producers or your teen years.

I do I do together, I really do. And I thought, I think what you did with that is brilliant. We're going to dive into it. But I find your story so fascinating. So at nineteen, as she began writing music right and kind of started working with producers or your teen years.

I had a very short foray into into music. When I was nineteen, I was I was signed to Simon Fuller, who had created the Spice Girls.

I had a very short foray into into music. When I was nineteen, I was I was signed to Simon Fuller, who had created the Spice Girls.

Yes and name Drop.

Yes and name Drop.

We were working on a well. I mention it only because it kind of provides balance to the story, which is that it only lasted a few weeks and I was recording kind of like jazz standards. I think you thought it might be an interesting idea to have a teenager singing kind of like rap pack music essentially, and there was sort of lots of big ideas for it, but then it just very quickly kind of fell by the wayside as I came to understand a lot of those projects do and over the last twenty years of working in entertainment, I now fully understand how things come and go and they fall apart. But at the time, when you're nineteen and aspirational and every next step you take you think is going to be the step which takes you up the golden escalator to the place that you've dreamed of, I think it was more difficult to accept. I think I think you get better at enduring rejection and enduring not every being the moment as you get on in this career, because it's not a smooth ride.

We were working on a well. I mention it only because it kind of provides balance to the story, which is that it only lasted a few weeks and I was recording kind of like jazz standards. I think you thought it might be an interesting idea to have a teenager singing kind of like rap pack music essentially, and there was sort of lots of big ideas for it, but then it just very quickly kind of fell by the wayside as I came to understand a lot of those projects do and over the last twenty years of working in entertainment, I now fully understand how things come and go and they fall apart. But at the time, when you're nineteen and aspirational and every next step you take you think is going to be the step which takes you up the golden escalator to the place that you've dreamed of, I think it was more difficult to accept. I think I think you get better at enduring rejection and enduring not every being the moment as you get on in this career, because it's not a smooth ride.

For anybody, right, right, And then you kind of transition and had this amazing career and continue to have an amazing career in the acting world, becoming a king of a fantasy and that genre right and really doing it for over two decades. And then suddenly now you're in this beautiful era with your music. So what made you say, Okay, you know what it's time for my music, like, I need to go revisit that at this point in my career.

For anybody, right, right, And then you kind of transition and had this amazing career and continue to have an amazing career in the acting world, becoming a king of a fantasy and that genre right and really doing it for over two decades. And then suddenly now you're in this beautiful era with your music. So what made you say, Okay, you know what it's time for my music, like, I need to go revisit that at this point in my career.

I think it was a combination of a couple of things. I think initially I found that being on different films and TV shows I was getting itchy to have a little bit more control and a little bit more say, and invest a little bit more of myself in the scripts and in the characters that I was working on. But there has to be an acceptance when you're an actor that somebody else has written this script, somebody else is producing, somebody else's designing the costume, somebody else is directing, and their vision might not be exactly aligned with yours for any particular project. And so I think you can go to the writers you know as often as you want and say I don't think I would say this line exactly this way, and you could switch three words around, but actually it's not garnering any kind of real control. And I think for a lot of creative people, releasing control of a creative project whilst during the midst of it is a very difficult thing. And I think I was yearning to inject something of myself and to sew something of myself into a lot of these characters. But then you know, the last particularly the last six or seven years, I've been playing a lot of psychopaths and murderers and liars, and there wasn't very much room for negotiating myself into these characters, and so I think part of it was realizing that if you have something to say in the world, or you want to share something of yourself in the world, or you want to kind of offer up something into the creative universe, that you have to start with a blank piece of paper and it has to be on your terms. But that means that it's entirely on your shoulders as well, and anything that kind of comes of it that feels successful will be you know, you don't have to credit anybody else. But equally, if it doesn't kind of go the way that you'd hoped, it's nobody's fault but your own. And so I think it's harder to kind of take up that mantle of the blank piece of paper.

I think it was a combination of a couple of things. I think initially I found that being on different films and TV shows I was getting itchy to have a little bit more control and a little bit more say, and invest a little bit more of myself in the scripts and in the characters that I was working on. But there has to be an acceptance when you're an actor that somebody else has written this script, somebody else is producing, somebody else's designing the costume, somebody else is directing, and their vision might not be exactly aligned with yours for any particular project. And so I think you can go to the writers you know as often as you want and say I don't think I would say this line exactly this way, and you could switch three words around, but actually it's not garnering any kind of real control. And I think for a lot of creative people, releasing control of a creative project whilst during the midst of it is a very difficult thing. And I think I was yearning to inject something of myself and to sew something of myself into a lot of these characters. But then you know, the last particularly the last six or seven years, I've been playing a lot of psychopaths and murderers and liars, and there wasn't very much room for negotiating myself into these characters, and so I think part of it was realizing that if you have something to say in the world, or you want to share something of yourself in the world, or you want to kind of offer up something into the creative universe, that you have to start with a blank piece of paper and it has to be on your terms. But that means that it's entirely on your shoulders as well, and anything that kind of comes of it that feels successful will be you know, you don't have to credit anybody else. But equally, if it doesn't kind of go the way that you'd hoped, it's nobody's fault but your own. And so I think it's harder to kind of take up that mantle of the blank piece of paper.

Is historically scary.

Is historically scary.

Yeah, So I think that was the first thing, and the second thing was really I think when the pandemic struck and people were given you know, everyone was given two things. A lot of extra time to muse and to think on what their dreams and goals and aspirations might be for the rest of their life given the opportunity, And I think that second bit was important that everyone was kind of faced with the mortality of themselves and the people that they care about, and there's an insistence that you reprioritize. For me, that meant going back twenty years to the thing that I really wanted to spend a lot of time doing, and the thing i'd all through high school put all of my energy into, which was singing and making music and making music with groups and bands of other people. And coming back to that, and I think i'd just been a very private person through my acting career. I didn't like sharing a lot in interviews. I didn't like giving up like what I deemed to be sort of sacred parts of my own life. You hired behind a character and you pretend to be that. But I actually released some of that, I think during my thirties, and actually doing the music was the final piece of that puzzle to really realize that there wasn't anything to be afraid of. People's judgment is not something to fear, because they're going to do it regardless of what you do spend your time doing so, I think I projected forward to the eighty year old version of myself at the beginning of the pandemic and thought, will that man be proud of the way I've lived my life and the way I've done this. And one of the answers was the fact that you love music so much and you enjoyed doing it so much, and you feel like you have at least some skill in this area and have the opportunity to and you didn't do it for fear of judgment.

Yeah, So I think that was the first thing, and the second thing was really I think when the pandemic struck and people were given you know, everyone was given two things. A lot of extra time to muse and to think on what their dreams and goals and aspirations might be for the rest of their life given the opportunity, And I think that second bit was important that everyone was kind of faced with the mortality of themselves and the people that they care about, and there's an insistence that you reprioritize. For me, that meant going back twenty years to the thing that I really wanted to spend a lot of time doing, and the thing i'd all through high school put all of my energy into, which was singing and making music and making music with groups and bands of other people. And coming back to that, and I think i'd just been a very private person through my acting career. I didn't like sharing a lot in interviews. I didn't like giving up like what I deemed to be sort of sacred parts of my own life. You hired behind a character and you pretend to be that. But I actually released some of that, I think during my thirties, and actually doing the music was the final piece of that puzzle to really realize that there wasn't anything to be afraid of. People's judgment is not something to fear, because they're going to do it regardless of what you do spend your time doing so, I think I projected forward to the eighty year old version of myself at the beginning of the pandemic and thought, will that man be proud of the way I've lived my life and the way I've done this. And one of the answers was the fact that you love music so much and you enjoyed doing it so much, and you feel like you have at least some skill in this area and have the opportunity to and you didn't do it for fear of judgment.

That would not make me proud.

That would not make me proud.

Hmmm.

Hmmm.

So that was like a big motivator as well.

So that was like a big motivator as well.

So would you say when you were ready to release your music and put it out into the world, even though you had been known predominantly as an actor, were you able to push through that anxiety knowing that this would make you happy in the future looking at your future self, or did you still have some anxiety saying, Okay, I'm about to put this all out there.

So would you say when you were ready to release your music and put it out into the world, even though you had been known predominantly as an actor, were you able to push through that anxiety knowing that this would make you happy in the future looking at your future self, or did you still have some anxiety saying, Okay, I'm about to put this all out there.

It was, It was in steps. It was incremental. I think there was more than one aspect to it. I was afraid that people would dig into the songs and the lyrics and try and kind of insinuate things.

It was, It was in steps. It was incremental. I think there was more than one aspect to it. I was afraid that people would dig into the songs and the lyrics and try and kind of insinuate things.

About my life life.

About my life life.

Also, I was afraid that people wouldn't necessarily take me as seriously as an actor if I was also trying to do this thing.

Also, I was afraid that people wouldn't necessarily take me as seriously as an actor if I was also trying to do this thing.

I mean, we grew up.

I mean, we grew up.

You know. I think in the era of watching like a lot of massive pop stars try their hand at acting in movies and stuff to usually pretty disastrous to pretty disastrous effect, And I remember feeling judgment of that, thinking, stay in your lane, like you're like a world superstar at doing this. Why are you pretending that just anyone can be an actor just because they can read? And I think I had concerned that people might feel the same the other way around, but they also might judge the kind of music that I wanted to put out, because you don't really know what kind of music you put out.

You know. I think in the era of watching like a lot of massive pop stars try their hand at acting in movies and stuff to usually pretty disastrous to pretty disastrous effect, And I remember feeling judgment of that, thinking, stay in your lane, like you're like a world superstar at doing this. Why are you pretending that just anyone can be an actor just because they can read? And I think I had concerned that people might feel the same the other way around, but they also might judge the kind of music that I wanted to put out, because you don't really know what kind of music you put out.

I think, unless you're sort of.

I think, unless you're sort of.

Plagiarizing something, you don't really know what kind of music you put you're going to put out until you finished it, right Because with my music, for example, I'm obsessed with with kind of nineteen seventies music, soulomotown, a lot of those kind of like rock bands from that era, and I think all of those things that I've listened to have kind of infused everything that I want to make. But it's all passed through the filter of my experience, and it's passed through it's passed through my vocal cords, and it's passed through the fingers of the people playing on the album and everything that they've ever listened to, and so it becomes this completely different and new thing, no matter how hard you try to make it sound like something that you love. And so I think I had fear that I wouldn't maybe even like what I ended up making.

Plagiarizing something, you don't really know what kind of music you put you're going to put out until you finished it, right Because with my music, for example, I'm obsessed with with kind of nineteen seventies music, soulomotown, a lot of those kind of like rock bands from that era, and I think all of those things that I've listened to have kind of infused everything that I want to make. But it's all passed through the filter of my experience, and it's passed through it's passed through my vocal cords, and it's passed through the fingers of the people playing on the album and everything that they've ever listened to, and so it becomes this completely different and new thing, no matter how hard you try to make it sound like something that you love. And so I think I had fear that I wouldn't maybe even like what I ended up making.

And then where would I be?

And then where would I be?

And also I knew that, you know, if I put on a show, even if I put it on in a place where there was only one hundred people, there would be one hundred phones filming it and it would end up.

And also I knew that, you know, if I put on a show, even if I put it on in a place where there was only one hundred people, there would be one hundred phones filming it and it would end up.

Online and you know, millions of people would see it.

Online and you know, millions of people would see it.

So I think I think there was I definitely put pressure on myself, But that's something that I've spent the last few years trying to work on doing differently anyway to release myself of that pressure in that judgment, because in the end, we're all floating through space on a rock, So what does it really matter? But I think, you know, I'm someone to whom everything has always mattered pretty hard.

So I think I think there was I definitely put pressure on myself, But that's something that I've spent the last few years trying to work on doing differently anyway to release myself of that pressure in that judgment, because in the end, we're all floating through space on a rock, So what does it really matter? But I think, you know, I'm someone to whom everything has always mattered pretty hard.

Yeah, yeah, Well what I love is that you did it. You didn't let that dissuade you and say, you know what, Ah, I'm just going to keep acting and stay in that lane, and you followed through. And I know you had an EP of about five songs a few years ago, and this is your debut album, and you followed through and you did it. And I'm very interested with humanity and with people. You know, when you reach a certain point in your life. I just turned thirty nine, and people think that, you know, you hear forty, and it's like, oh, no, you can't do something new, or you can't do something you're not known for. And yes, I'm a host, I'm an interviewer, but there are other things outside of this that I'm trying to do and get made and happen that is not related to this. And so many people would look at that and say, well good luck, bro, Like you're gonna be forty next year. You think you can just do something in a totally different world than the one you're known for, and it's like, fuck, yeah you can, Like, yes you can, and why not go for it? And I like that you have that mentality too. You're like, I'm granted you have a background, but you know you didn't say to the point you just made Nope, I'm not going to do it because the world might not want it, or I have success in one lane like you're doing it.

Yeah, yeah, Well what I love is that you did it. You didn't let that dissuade you and say, you know what, Ah, I'm just going to keep acting and stay in that lane, and you followed through. And I know you had an EP of about five songs a few years ago, and this is your debut album, and you followed through and you did it. And I'm very interested with humanity and with people. You know, when you reach a certain point in your life. I just turned thirty nine, and people think that, you know, you hear forty, and it's like, oh, no, you can't do something new, or you can't do something you're not known for. And yes, I'm a host, I'm an interviewer, but there are other things outside of this that I'm trying to do and get made and happen that is not related to this. And so many people would look at that and say, well good luck, bro, Like you're gonna be forty next year. You think you can just do something in a totally different world than the one you're known for, and it's like, fuck, yeah you can, Like, yes you can, and why not go for it? And I like that you have that mentality too. You're like, I'm granted you have a background, but you know you didn't say to the point you just made Nope, I'm not going to do it because the world might not want it, or I have success in one lane like you're doing it.

How do you feel about forty outside of professional endeavor, Like.

How do you feel about forty outside of professional endeavor, Like.

Oh, I think it's young, Like for me, I'm not. I think age is such an interesting person because I'm at the age now where I'll be sitting across from somebody and my age will come up and they'll be like, you're thirty nine. No, I'm like, well, you know, you saying that implies that that's like some ancient age, Like I know you mean well, And I don't take it personally, but it's just such a funny concept to me, because you know, it's just the implication of that. And probably when I was twenty eight I thought that too, you know.

Oh, I think it's young, Like for me, I'm not. I think age is such an interesting person because I'm at the age now where I'll be sitting across from somebody and my age will come up and they'll be like, you're thirty nine. No, I'm like, well, you know, you saying that implies that that's like some ancient age, Like I know you mean well, And I don't take it personally, but it's just such a funny concept to me, because you know, it's just the implication of that. And probably when I was twenty eight I thought that too, you know.

So I remember being thirty nine and having this kind of like cold dread of forty hit it. And then I remember to about two days after my fortieth birthday, I had an audition and I walked into a room and the casting director sort of chatted to me for a minute, and then she looked down at my resume or whatever she was holding, and she was like, oh, oh, you're forty, right, And this sort of smile crept across my face because I realized that the character that I was going in for was like a really interesting character, and you could tell there was a sort of a level of, I don't know if quite respect is quite the right word, but a level of a level of appreciation of lived experience that maybe I might have it in me too to be this. And then and after that moment, I sort of never look back about the aging. And every night on stage I have a song called called Someday on the album about sort of not allowing people to hold you back from your dreams. But it's a really sort of head Noddy Dancy kind of song, and I play it last on tour and I talk about, you know, I talk to the audience saying, if you take one thing away from this show, don't let people stand in the way of spending your precious time on this planet doing the things that you love to do.

So I remember being thirty nine and having this kind of like cold dread of forty hit it. And then I remember to about two days after my fortieth birthday, I had an audition and I walked into a room and the casting director sort of chatted to me for a minute, and then she looked down at my resume or whatever she was holding, and she was like, oh, oh, you're forty, right, And this sort of smile crept across my face because I realized that the character that I was going in for was like a really interesting character, and you could tell there was a sort of a level of, I don't know if quite respect is quite the right word, but a level of a level of appreciation of lived experience that maybe I might have it in me too to be this. And then and after that moment, I sort of never look back about the aging. And every night on stage I have a song called called Someday on the album about sort of not allowing people to hold you back from your dreams. But it's a really sort of head Noddy Dancy kind of song, and I play it last on tour and I talk about, you know, I talk to the audience saying, if you take one thing away from this show, don't let people stand in the way of spending your precious time on this planet doing the things that you love to do.

Whatever those are, it doesn't matter.

Whatever those are, it doesn't matter.

And if I can stand up here at forty three and sort of be near the beginning of a pop, you know, pop music career, then you two can get out and do whatever the thing is that you've been dreaming about doing, and it doesn't have to be on some grand scale. And it's interesting how that was clearly not something I set out to do to make people feel like they could have space or opportunity or permission to go and do creative things or physical things or intellectual things that they have put off doing. But in response to the EP that I put out, I think I do tend to write songs that are essentially about hope. I think all actually all great art in terms of like films, TV shows, whatever, essentially when you distill them down.

And if I can stand up here at forty three and sort of be near the beginning of a pop, you know, pop music career, then you two can get out and do whatever the thing is that you've been dreaming about doing, and it doesn't have to be on some grand scale. And it's interesting how that was clearly not something I set out to do to make people feel like they could have space or opportunity or permission to go and do creative things or physical things or intellectual things that they have put off doing. But in response to the EP that I put out, I think I do tend to write songs that are essentially about hope. I think all actually all great art in terms of like films, TV shows, whatever, essentially when you distill them down.

There really about hopefulness.

There really about hopefulness.

But I find it very difficult not to write about that thematically. And I think that one of the upshots of putting out the EP, which I really hadn't seen, was lots of people saying this song made me want to go and do this, And then you realize, once you put music out into the world, it immediately becomes not about you. And people always used to say that to me about films, and I've said in interviews many years ago that I think, you know, a film is basically just a collection of scenes edited together until someone who has had nothing to do with the film watches it, and then it becomes a film because then there's an organic and true reaction to what someone has made. Then it's really a film when you've given it over to someone else. But I didn't really think about it with music until I was putting it out. But I think it's even more true and strong when it comes to a song because you think of all the songs that you've ever loved. You're not thinking about the experience of the sing out. You're not thinking about the experience of the songwriter. You're thinking about how that music affects you, how it connects to you.

But I find it very difficult not to write about that thematically. And I think that one of the upshots of putting out the EP, which I really hadn't seen, was lots of people saying this song made me want to go and do this, And then you realize, once you put music out into the world, it immediately becomes not about you. And people always used to say that to me about films, and I've said in interviews many years ago that I think, you know, a film is basically just a collection of scenes edited together until someone who has had nothing to do with the film watches it, and then it becomes a film because then there's an organic and true reaction to what someone has made. Then it's really a film when you've given it over to someone else. But I didn't really think about it with music until I was putting it out. But I think it's even more true and strong when it comes to a song because you think of all the songs that you've ever loved. You're not thinking about the experience of the sing out. You're not thinking about the experience of the songwriter. You're thinking about how that music affects you, how it connects to you.

How it relates to your life.

How it relates to your life.

You know, when I try to think of a different example when I talk about this, because I've had this conversation with bandmates and friends and people I've written songs with. But you know, if you listen to Prince sing I just want your extra time and your kiss, You're not thinking whose extra time does Prince want?

You know, when I try to think of a different example when I talk about this, because I've had this conversation with bandmates and friends and people I've written songs with. But you know, if you listen to Prince sing I just want your extra time and your kiss, You're not thinking whose extra time does Prince want?

You're thinking whose extra time do I want?

You're thinking whose extra time do I want?

Right?

Right?

Whom?

Whom?

Who comes into my mind when I listen to this song? And I think it's so immediate when you're singing songs, particularly when you're singing live for someone, and the reaction is so immediate. They're looking up at you and they're having their own experience that is not yours. And I have to remind myself. I get very nervous before shows because it feels like when you've got a thousand, two thousand people watching you see songs that you wrote alone in a room, it feels quite raw. But then I remind myself what it feels like to go to a concert and how I have no judgment or expectation of what's about to happen on a stage. I just think, oh, hope it's good, and then I'm in my own emotional experience of listening to a song. You know, I've definitely like cried at concerts before where where.

Who comes into my mind when I listen to this song? And I think it's so immediate when you're singing songs, particularly when you're singing live for someone, and the reaction is so immediate. They're looking up at you and they're having their own experience that is not yours. And I have to remind myself. I get very nervous before shows because it feels like when you've got a thousand, two thousand people watching you see songs that you wrote alone in a room, it feels quite raw. But then I remind myself what it feels like to go to a concert and how I have no judgment or expectation of what's about to happen on a stage. I just think, oh, hope it's good, and then I'm in my own emotional experience of listening to a song. You know, I've definitely like cried at concerts before where where.

I'm in my own head about my own stuff.

I'm in my own head about my own stuff.

But there's something about the core progressional a particular lyric that it's like struck me.

But there's something about the core progressional a particular lyric that it's like struck me.

It's got nothing to do with a person who's delivering it.

It's got nothing to do with a person who's delivering it.

Like I said earlier, this album, man, I mean, it's just the lyrically. It's beautiful. I think it's just beautiful. It's your debut album.

Like I said earlier, this album, man, I mean, it's just the lyrically. It's beautiful. I think it's just beautiful. It's your debut album.

I mean so much.

I mean so much.

You just say that in particular because I don't let anyone else write obviously lyrics.

You just say that in particular because I don't let anyone else write obviously lyrics.

I do do get music.

I do do get music.

I did get music support on the album because I'd written all the songs myself with the EP, and musically, I think it's a really good thing to kind of collaborate, But songs feel like babies, and if you let someone else sort of mess with the lyrics, it feels like it's maybe not yours anymore. I know a lot of people don't feel that way, but for me, yea, words have always been my main tool. And I think for all the things I was afraid of in putting out something new creatively, there was also rewards to be found along the way in terms of finding things that you're I think it's hard to learn new things in your thirties and forties, but to find those little things that you are sort of organically good at that you didn't necessarily know you were, it was like a real, really unexpected reward of this kind of process. And I would find that I would write songs with people and they would help me so much, and they would understand things that I never have a hope of understanding in terms of music itself. But then afterwards they might say that was great, can you help me with the lyrics for this song that I'm writing? And you know, I realize I have a facility with that, and like a real passion a real passion for like finding little lyrical hooks for songs that sound like phrases or idioms or sayings or whatever, but are actually fresh and new to you. And it's something that I've discovered that I really really love to do.

I did get music support on the album because I'd written all the songs myself with the EP, and musically, I think it's a really good thing to kind of collaborate, But songs feel like babies, and if you let someone else sort of mess with the lyrics, it feels like it's maybe not yours anymore. I know a lot of people don't feel that way, but for me, yea, words have always been my main tool. And I think for all the things I was afraid of in putting out something new creatively, there was also rewards to be found along the way in terms of finding things that you're I think it's hard to learn new things in your thirties and forties, but to find those little things that you are sort of organically good at that you didn't necessarily know you were, it was like a real, really unexpected reward of this kind of process. And I would find that I would write songs with people and they would help me so much, and they would understand things that I never have a hope of understanding in terms of music itself. But then afterwards they might say that was great, can you help me with the lyrics for this song that I'm writing? And you know, I realize I have a facility with that, and like a real passion a real passion for like finding little lyrical hooks for songs that sound like phrases or idioms or sayings or whatever, but are actually fresh and new to you. And it's something that I've discovered that I really really love to do.

Yeah, I mean the messages and the lyrics on this album you speak about so much. I love the title of the album too. I think it's so fantastic and and just poetic and very on theme with you know what you write in the collection you put together Where the Light Gets In, of course is the name for everybody listening. You talk about everything from anxiety to letting go to you know, being loved and the right to be loved and be loved as you say, and in the so much you cover in such a collection of music. So for you, what was the main thing you were hoping to achieve with this album collectively?

Yeah, I mean the messages and the lyrics on this album you speak about so much. I love the title of the album too. I think it's so fantastic and and just poetic and very on theme with you know what you write in the collection you put together Where the Light Gets In, of course is the name for everybody listening. You talk about everything from anxiety to letting go to you know, being loved and the right to be loved and be loved as you say, and in the so much you cover in such a collection of music. So for you, what was the main thing you were hoping to achieve with this album collectively?

I think I wanted it to feel honest and authentic to my lived experience. And I think that goes all the way from very exciting kind of fizzy feelings that you have when you first meet someone in a romantic way, all the way through to like considering the mortality of your parents and trying to wrestle with the idea of them not being around at some point through to you know, kind of nostalgically looking back at friendships that have been fallen by the wayside and you're not quite sure why, or regretting that you didn't love someone in a certain kind of way, or wishing you could have loved them differently. All these all these different kinds of things that make us, that make us who we are, and all those decisions that you have made your life that have led you to where you are, and kind of like I think it was aligned very much with where I was in my life a few years ago, trying to just sort of accept all those things and realize that every decision you've ever made has brought you to where you are, and if you don't regret where you are, I shouldn't regret those decisions. And I think that once i'd written that song where the Light Gets In, which I wrote that's the only song I wrote with two of the band members of Maroon five, because I had this little hook lyrically already, but I just I didn't have an idea of what it sounded like. I had some other songs in my head that were had the warmth that I wanted that song to have, but I didn't know where to go with it, and they very graciously agreed to help me write that one song, and once I'd written, I knew it had to be the title of the album. But then it started me thinking about the Japanese are of Kincigi, where if you break something, if something ceramic breaks, you fix it using gold.

I think I wanted it to feel honest and authentic to my lived experience. And I think that goes all the way from very exciting kind of fizzy feelings that you have when you first meet someone in a romantic way, all the way through to like considering the mortality of your parents and trying to wrestle with the idea of them not being around at some point through to you know, kind of nostalgically looking back at friendships that have been fallen by the wayside and you're not quite sure why, or regretting that you didn't love someone in a certain kind of way, or wishing you could have loved them differently. All these all these different kinds of things that make us, that make us who we are, and all those decisions that you have made your life that have led you to where you are, and kind of like I think it was aligned very much with where I was in my life a few years ago, trying to just sort of accept all those things and realize that every decision you've ever made has brought you to where you are, and if you don't regret where you are, I shouldn't regret those decisions. And I think that once i'd written that song where the Light Gets In, which I wrote that's the only song I wrote with two of the band members of Maroon five, because I had this little hook lyrically already, but I just I didn't have an idea of what it sounded like. I had some other songs in my head that were had the warmth that I wanted that song to have, but I didn't know where to go with it, and they very graciously agreed to help me write that one song, and once I'd written, I knew it had to be the title of the album. But then it started me thinking about the Japanese are of Kincigi, where if you break something, if something ceramic breaks, you fix it using gold.

I'm sure you've seen those.

I'm sure you've seen those.

Like cracked gold cera mixed before, and that notion, that concept that something could break and then you could fix it and make it more precious than it was before you broke it. I think that's just every person I know over the age of twenty. It's the story is that you go through things, and you make choices, and things happen to you, and you can either let those weigh you down or you can fight through to a point where those things actually make you, know, make you who you are, not necessarily harder or stronger, but just who you are. And sometimes sometimes strong is about acceptance rather than fight.

Like cracked gold cera mixed before, and that notion, that concept that something could break and then you could fix it and make it more precious than it was before you broke it. I think that's just every person I know over the age of twenty. It's the story is that you go through things, and you make choices, and things happen to you, and you can either let those weigh you down or you can fight through to a point where those things actually make you, know, make you who you are, not necessarily harder or stronger, but just who you are. And sometimes sometimes strong is about acceptance rather than fight.

Sometimes strong is about acceptance rather than fight.

Sometimes strong is about acceptance rather than fight.

This is what happens there.

This is what happens there.

I just said that, and I haven't said that before, and now I feel like I want to write it in my phone in case it's.

I just said that, and I haven't said that before, and now I feel like I want to write it in my phone in case it's.

Yet him and.

Yet him and.

Somebody wrote that down. Example of how how my songs start.

Somebody wrote that down. Example of how how my songs start.

By the way, that's a that it's usually just chatting with friends or other musics or whatever, and someone something, either I say something or someone else says something three words and you're like, wait, but see, you've just shown me that you could be a lyricist because your eyes went up and left and you went wait.

By the way, that's a that it's usually just chatting with friends or other musics or whatever, and someone something, either I say something or someone else says something three words and you're like, wait, but see, you've just shown me that you could be a lyricist because your eyes went up and left and you went wait.

No.

No.

The way that you listen is like so it's like such a huge part of being able to make things.

The way that you listen is like so it's like such a huge part of being able to make things.

Yeah, yeah, no, I heard immediately that that resonates with me. That's that's pretty cool. That's that's going to be something mark my words. Oh yeah. There's so many songs I love on this I I particularly love slow it Down. I think as a little bit of a hopeless romantic I connected with that.

Yeah, yeah, no, I heard immediately that that resonates with me. That's that's pretty cool. That's that's going to be something mark my words. Oh yeah. There's so many songs I love on this I I particularly love slow it Down. I think as a little bit of a hopeless romantic I connected with that.

I was about to say, you can tell what kind of a person someone is by which almost I should start. Actually, I should do like a like a quizz thing online, you know, like one of those like personality quizzes. You listen to the songs and then you pick your favorite. It tells you what kind of person you are, because if slow It Down your favorite song on the record. You're definitely hopeless romantic because it's the only like pure love song. It's the only song with no tension in it.

I was about to say, you can tell what kind of a person someone is by which almost I should start. Actually, I should do like a like a quizz thing online, you know, like one of those like personality quizzes. You listen to the songs and then you pick your favorite. It tells you what kind of person you are, because if slow It Down your favorite song on the record. You're definitely hopeless romantic because it's the only like pure love song. It's the only song with no tension in it.

Well, you must be too if you're writing that song.

Well, you must be too if you're writing that song.

No, well that's true, but I also write the all the other ones.

No, well that's true, but I also write the all the other ones.

So all right, right, right, right, true, fair enough, but.

So all right, right, right, right, true, fair enough, but.

Yeah, absolutely no, definitively from from when I was a kid, you know, any sort of really romantic kind of films, novels, poems, I've always definitely kind of gravitated towards that, And yeah, slow It Down is the only.

Yeah, absolutely no, definitively from from when I was a kid, you know, any sort of really romantic kind of films, novels, poems, I've always definitely kind of gravitated towards that, And yeah, slow It Down is the only.

Like put it on a song for everybody listening, put it on for your partner. You will win Brownie points for the next six months.

Like put it on a song for everybody listening, put it on for your partner. You will win Brownie points for the next six months.

I was at a show the other day and I do a thing in the show where I say a quote from a film and try to get people to guess what film it's from.

I was at a show the other day and I do a thing in the show where I say a quote from a film and try to get people to guess what film it's from.

Yeah, do you want to do it?

Yeah, do you want to do it?

Oh my god, oh god, okay, fine, fine, fine, do not judge me if I don't know, help my friend in the corner, and I.

Oh my god, oh god, okay, fine, fine, fine, do not judge me if I don't know, help my friend in the corner, and I.

Felt you can have Okay.

Felt you can have Okay.

When I'm about to play that song, I get someone from the audience to tell me what movie the following quotes from life moves pretty fast.

When I'm about to play that song, I get someone from the audience to tell me what movie the following quotes from life moves pretty fast.

If you don't start to look around once in a while, you might miss it.

If you don't start to look around once in a while, you might miss it.

Oh my god, I should know this. It sounds so familiar that life means pretty fast. If you give me the decade it's from.

Oh my god, I should know this. It sounds so familiar that life means pretty fast. If you give me the decade it's from.

It's from the eighties, from the it is.

It's from the eighties, from the it is.

It's not the Breakfast Club.

It's not the Breakfast Club.

You're very close. It's got some of the same actors.

You're very close. It's got some of the same actors.

It's I feel like it's that. Oh my god, it's not sixteen care Yes, did you look that up online? Actually, because I watched that recently, Oh my god, Okay, And that I.

It's I feel like it's that. Oh my god, it's not sixteen care Yes, did you look that up online? Actually, because I watched that recently, Oh my god, Okay, And that I.

Had all these scratchings from different like honestly, like a couple of lines from a birthday card I wrote someone, a couple of lines from like a poem.

Had all these scratchings from different like honestly, like a couple of lines from a birthday card I wrote someone, a couple of lines from like a poem.

I was sort of muddling with that. I never really did anything with.

I was sort of muddling with that. I never really did anything with.

All these different kind of like I had like a list of things that made it into the lyrics of those.

All these different kind of like I had like a list of things that made it into the lyrics of those.

Songs.

Songs.

I think I'd written like share your baby names with me, stand up family graves with me, and I'd written like that as a little couplet of like, you know, the most romantic thing you can do and then the most kind of you know, the two things the two different ends of the spectrum of like what you would want a partner to be there for you with be there with you four.

I think I'd written like share your baby names with me, stand up family graves with me, and I'd written like that as a little couplet of like, you know, the most romantic thing you can do and then the most kind of you know, the two things the two different ends of the spectrum of like what you would want a partner to be there for you with be there with you four.

I've been sleeping on a bus and then I couldn't find the hook for the song. And then I.

I've been sleeping on a bus and then I couldn't find the hook for the song. And then I.

We watched Fresh Buder's Day Off, and life Moves pretty Fast was just those words. I was like, that's what it is. So I just kind of borrowed those few words, and then life moves pretty fast with you, I think finally found someone to slow it down.

We watched Fresh Buder's Day Off, and life Moves pretty Fast was just those words. I was like, that's what it is. So I just kind of borrowed those few words, and then life moves pretty fast with you, I think finally found someone to slow it down.

I think you're making everybody listening to this episode swoon with these lyrics.

I think you're making everybody listening to this episode swoon with these lyrics.

Well, it's just such a I like they're beautiful, they are. I like songs.

Well, it's just such a I like they're beautiful, they are. I like songs.

I like songs that I like feel really specific, and I think that's such a specific feeling. It's not like I hope I find someone with whom I fall, you know, ahead of heels and love and feel fireworks or you know. I it's it's a very specific thing. I hope I'm you know, I hope I find someone, and I hope I'm in a position to appreciate that when I meet someone with whom time feels just that bit slower because life just racist past you two to realize that that is like equally important, if not more than someone with whom you know.

I like songs that I like feel really specific, and I think that's such a specific feeling. It's not like I hope I find someone with whom I fall, you know, ahead of heels and love and feel fireworks or you know. I it's it's a very specific thing. I hope I'm you know, I hope I find someone, and I hope I'm in a position to appreciate that when I meet someone with whom time feels just that bit slower because life just racist past you two to realize that that is like equally important, if not more than someone with whom you know.

It feels like the fireworks all the time.

It feels like the fireworks all the time.

Yeah, yeah, no, it's it's a stunning song. Every song is is stunning for a different reason. I know you have a video dropping very soon for one minute more. Oh yes, which I got to say see early it was beautiful. So this song is an interesting one. It's coming out of Valentine's say the video correct, And that one is I referenced earlier about letting go a little bit, right, So talk to me about that that one.

Yeah, yeah, no, it's it's a stunning song. Every song is is stunning for a different reason. I know you have a video dropping very soon for one minute more. Oh yes, which I got to say see early it was beautiful. So this song is an interesting one. It's coming out of Valentine's say the video correct, And that one is I referenced earlier about letting go a little bit, right, So talk to me about that that one.

Yeah, it's interesting because sometimes you start writing a song about one thing and then it sort of feels like it starts to be about something else, but you kind of keep it a secret. And I think, yeah, it's it's a sort of deeply romantic song on one level about being very in love with someone and them not being in a position or having the tools to love you back how you need to be loved, and so you both know on some level that you have to say goodbye to it, and maybe you've already had the conversation but you just haven't quite decided to say and you're just you're dragging you're dragging your feet essentially because because you know, there's been something wonderful about it. So on the surface, it was about that. But then as I started kind of toying with it more, I was thinking about it from other perspectives, about how all the different relationships in my life I think being quite transient as an actor as well. Sometimes, you know, you work with people very intently for months on end, and then the months go by really quickly. And even being on this tour right now, you know, we're almost finished with the American leg of the tour, and I'm so grateful that we have the Europe leg of the tour coming, because if you told me that it was the very last show tomorrow, then I would be just short because it's felt such precious time and I just like, just one more show, just one more moment together doing this thing because it feels precious. And then I sort of extrapolated it further to like, you know, honestly, I was thinking, you know, my mum has been navigating cancer for a decade, and she's like an extraordinary human being, but there are times when we when we were kind of told that, you know, some of the treatments she was having were going to be difficult, and there was maybe some hard conversations to have in advance of having those surgeries or those treatments, and.

Yeah, it's interesting because sometimes you start writing a song about one thing and then it sort of feels like it starts to be about something else, but you kind of keep it a secret. And I think, yeah, it's it's a sort of deeply romantic song on one level about being very in love with someone and them not being in a position or having the tools to love you back how you need to be loved, and so you both know on some level that you have to say goodbye to it, and maybe you've already had the conversation but you just haven't quite decided to say and you're just you're dragging you're dragging your feet essentially because because you know, there's been something wonderful about it. So on the surface, it was about that. But then as I started kind of toying with it more, I was thinking about it from other perspectives, about how all the different relationships in my life I think being quite transient as an actor as well. Sometimes, you know, you work with people very intently for months on end, and then the months go by really quickly. And even being on this tour right now, you know, we're almost finished with the American leg of the tour, and I'm so grateful that we have the Europe leg of the tour coming, because if you told me that it was the very last show tomorrow, then I would be just short because it's felt such precious time and I just like, just one more show, just one more moment together doing this thing because it feels precious. And then I sort of extrapolated it further to like, you know, honestly, I was thinking, you know, my mum has been navigating cancer for a decade, and she's like an extraordinary human being, but there are times when we when we were kind of told that, you know, some of the treatments she was having were going to be difficult, and there was maybe some hard conversations to have in advance of having those surgeries or those treatments, and.

You know, I remember kind.

You know, I remember kind.

Of like wailing to the sky, just just please one, you know, just one more day, one more year, one more you know, and I think, you know, this is when I started to realize that those kind of songs will mean something different to every person who kind of listens to it. And you ask me what I hope it is for the songs. I hope that no one cares what they're about for me. I hope that they start to have meaning for someone else. Doesn't have to be important. Meaning could just be a nice moment of like, oh my, you know, partner and I listened to Slow it Down. We felt really cozy and that was really nice. But it also could be like people come up to IT shows and you realize they've been listening to a song from your EP for years as they're kind of like happy song or whatever it might be, and you know, it doesn't have to be on a Taylor Swift level. It doesn't have to be millions of people in the world doing it can be three hundred people. It could be seven people, you know, And I'm very fortunate that because I've done what I've done as an actor for the last twenty years, that there are people who will show up for me and people support me, and then hopefully when they do that, they're just rewarding it for them.

Of like wailing to the sky, just just please one, you know, just one more day, one more year, one more you know, and I think, you know, this is when I started to realize that those kind of songs will mean something different to every person who kind of listens to it. And you ask me what I hope it is for the songs. I hope that no one cares what they're about for me. I hope that they start to have meaning for someone else. Doesn't have to be important. Meaning could just be a nice moment of like, oh my, you know, partner and I listened to Slow it Down. We felt really cozy and that was really nice. But it also could be like people come up to IT shows and you realize they've been listening to a song from your EP for years as they're kind of like happy song or whatever it might be, and you know, it doesn't have to be on a Taylor Swift level. It doesn't have to be millions of people in the world doing it can be three hundred people. It could be seven people, you know, And I'm very fortunate that because I've done what I've done as an actor for the last twenty years, that there are people who will show up for me and people support me, and then hopefully when they do that, they're just rewarding it for them.

Well, they're also showing up for you because you put out material resonates if you put out garbage. They want to be shown, you know, to be a fair.

Well, they're also showing up for you because you put out material resonates if you put out garbage. They want to be shown, you know, to be a fair.

So that's actually the best answer to that question, which I am going to steal and use in other interviews, But like my hope is that it resonates is a really good word, is that it resonates with people and just they keep a piece of it with them as well.

So that's actually the best answer to that question, which I am going to steal and use in other interviews, But like my hope is that it resonates is a really good word, is that it resonates with people and just they keep a piece of it with them as well.

You know, Ben, I have to say, it's hard to imagine you at a point of your life where you weren't this open and just kind of vulnerable, because I know I was.

You know, Ben, I have to say, it's hard to imagine you at a point of your life where you weren't this open and just kind of vulnerable, because I know I was.

With my you know, I raised by you know, my extraordinary um to talk about is it a psychotherapist, Yeah, my dad's a psychiatrist. I was was very open with them.

With my you know, I raised by you know, my extraordinary um to talk about is it a psychotherapist, Yeah, my dad's a psychiatrist. I was was very open with them.

But I'm sure when you hit the spotlight and you got really big in Hollywood as an actor and suddenly this exposure happened where everybody wants to know something about you and is interested in your life and the spotlight is on you. I imagine that was a bit weird at first.

But I'm sure when you hit the spotlight and you got really big in Hollywood as an actor and suddenly this exposure happened where everybody wants to know something about you and is interested in your life and the spotlight is on you. I imagine that was a bit weird at first.

That was weird, but I think it also started, if i'm really also, I think it started before that as well. And like in school, I didn't really have a lot of friends at school, and I didn't really enjoy school very much, and I felt like if you shared things and were open in that kind of environment, it was it wasn't something that was valued, and it was certainly you know, it's just like can be weaponized. And so I think I was very open with my family and with my friends that I was really close to, and I've always been very open and vulnerable with them. But I think I kind of took the that sort of like school life into when I first started doing films and stuff, and you know, I grew up in the UK and the tabloid press there is like pretty can be pretty acute, and and you know, they started asking questions. In the first few interviews I ever had, I thought, what are you're asking me this for?

That was weird, but I think it also started, if i'm really also, I think it started before that as well. And like in school, I didn't really have a lot of friends at school, and I didn't really enjoy school very much, and I felt like if you shared things and were open in that kind of environment, it was it wasn't something that was valued, and it was certainly you know, it's just like can be weaponized. And so I think I was very open with my family and with my friends that I was really close to, and I've always been very open and vulnerable with them. But I think I kind of took the that sort of like school life into when I first started doing films and stuff, and you know, I grew up in the UK and the tabloid press there is like pretty can be pretty acute, and and you know, they started asking questions. In the first few interviews I ever had, I thought, what are you're asking me this for?

Like what would be an example of that question? I don't know, just like just intrusive.

Like what would be an example of that question? I don't know, just like just intrusive.

Yeah, just just like started with questions about maybe, you know, yeah, what your parents do for a living, or asking about who you're dating or how long you've been together or whatever those things are. And it was just like it just felt like crazy intrusive to ask that stuff before you ask about.

Yeah, just just like started with questions about maybe, you know, yeah, what your parents do for a living, or asking about who you're dating or how long you've been together or whatever those things are. And it was just like it just felt like crazy intrusive to ask that stuff before you ask about.

The film you've just made or something. And it just it wasn't you know.

The film you've just made or something. And it just it wasn't you know.

Of course, I realized it can be far worse than that, you know, I know it can be devastating, but it just it just it just shored up the walls of privacy and thought a lot of the actors I really admire don't really you don't really know much about them. There's an element of mystery to them. And I just sort of made this decision that, like, I guess I just won't necessarily share that much. But I realized this is like, this is now completely on my terms.

Of course, I realized it can be far worse than that, you know, I know it can be devastating, but it just it just it just shored up the walls of privacy and thought a lot of the actors I really admire don't really you don't really know much about them. There's an element of mystery to them. And I just sort of made this decision that, like, I guess I just won't necessarily share that much. But I realized this is like, this is now completely on my terms.

Yes, and you have the power.

Yes, and you have the power.

This is the stuff that I am choosing to share, and you can choose to read it however you want or make it about you or whatever whatever it is. But I'm still not you know, I'm still not necessarily sharing like details of how how how I live my life when I'm not working or making something right. But I do feel now that there is nothing. I used to be anxious that people might ask me certain things or whatever, and now I'm not afraid of any question. And actually doing music, releasing music, playing music for people in particular, was one of the really big catalysts for feeling that way and letting go after you know, almost forty years of that kind of fear of fear of judgment, and it's it's and it's it's made its way into my acting too, Like going back on sets and things, I feel less afraid of whether people will.

This is the stuff that I am choosing to share, and you can choose to read it however you want or make it about you or whatever whatever it is. But I'm still not you know, I'm still not necessarily sharing like details of how how how I live my life when I'm not working or making something right. But I do feel now that there is nothing. I used to be anxious that people might ask me certain things or whatever, and now I'm not afraid of any question. And actually doing music, releasing music, playing music for people in particular, was one of the really big catalysts for feeling that way and letting go after you know, almost forty years of that kind of fear of fear of judgment, and it's it's and it's it's made its way into my acting too, Like going back on sets and things, I feel less afraid of whether people will.

Accept a certain character or what if they don't, you know, like the show, or you.

Accept a certain character or what if they don't, you know, like the show, or you.

Know, just wrestling with those things. And I think because some of it has been useful and motivating, some of that self critical thinking has been motivating, but I think I think in the end, understanding that it's been more detrimental than than than than motivating was an important thing too.

Know, just wrestling with those things. And I think because some of it has been useful and motivating, some of that self critical thinking has been motivating, but I think I think in the end, understanding that it's been more detrimental than than than than motivating was an important thing too.

For me to get to.

For me to get to.

Blown away by what you've done musically. I've got to ask you an acting question on behalf of all the fans. When I announced you as my guest, I got a lot of people writing in about one particular thing I wonder if you know what I'm going to.

Blown away by what you've done musically. I've got to ask you an acting question on behalf of all the fans. When I announced you as my guest, I got a lot of people writing in about one particular thing I wonder if you know what I'm going to.

Ask you, well, it's it's it's one of three things.

Ask you, well, it's it's it's one of three things.

It's either.

It's either.

Will there be a third season of Shadow and Bone because I think the people who love fantasy stuff really love fantasy stuff.

Will there be a third season of Shadow and Bone because I think the people who love fantasy stuff really love fantasy stuff.

I often get.

I often get.

Is there would there be another life for the Billy Russo character that I played on The Punisher Marvel Show, because John Bunta, who played the Punisher and that is playing that character again on the Dad Devil Show. And that's definitely one of the characters that I've that I loved playing the most. And really it's just interesting that different kinds of people obviously respond to Marvel and the Punisher has different fans from Narnia.

Is there would there be another life for the Billy Russo character that I played on The Punisher Marvel Show, because John Bunta, who played the Punisher and that is playing that character again on the Dad Devil Show. And that's definitely one of the characters that I've that I loved playing the most. And really it's just interesting that different kinds of people obviously respond to Marvel and the Punisher has different fans from Narnia.

You know, it's no surprise.

You know, it's no surprise.

But and then the third one is that the third thing it's likely to be about, especially if it was on the internet, is like.

But and then the third one is that the third thing it's likely to be about, especially if it was on the internet, is like.

Harry Potter fan casting.

Harry Potter fan casting.

You nailed it. It's the third one third one third one, which.

You nailed it. It's the third one third one third one, which.

Is it's wild to me because the amount of Harry Potter books or or that I've been asked to sign or gryffind or ties that I've been given, and every time I kind of feel the need to.

Is it's wild to me because the amount of Harry Potter books or or that I've been asked to sign or gryffind or ties that I've been given, and every time I kind of feel the need to.

Say you know I'm not in this.

Say you know I'm not in this.

I did an interview I did like a morning show in LA a few months ago for the music and we were about to play a song. She was like, loved you and Harry Potter. Sorry, gonna stop you. That wasn't in Harry Potter.

I did an interview I did like a morning show in LA a few months ago for the music and we were about to play a song. She was like, loved you and Harry Potter. Sorry, gonna stop you. That wasn't in Harry Potter.

Very clear.

Very clear.

But I think it's a fan casting that's been going on for literally decades.

But I think it's a fan casting that's been going on for literally decades.

It must feel good knowing that the fans want that to happen.

It must feel good knowing that the fans want that to happen.

Well, I think I think it started off as something that I've come to understand after because it's been around so many years, that they wanted to do a kind of Marauders prequel Terry pots And they had an idea of like three or four actors they wanted in their heads. I think Andrew Garfield and Aaron Taylor Johnson and myself. They had the idea that that would that those would be the actors to play those characters young. But now we're all the same age that those characters were in the original movies. So yeah, it's sort of twenty years too late for their original for their original plan, but I know they're making a new TV show version of the of those stories. So I mean, I've just always been a fan of read the books and listen to Stephen Fryer read them on tape sometimes so good to.

Well, I think I think it started off as something that I've come to understand after because it's been around so many years, that they wanted to do a kind of Marauders prequel Terry pots And they had an idea of like three or four actors they wanted in their heads. I think Andrew Garfield and Aaron Taylor Johnson and myself. They had the idea that that would that those would be the actors to play those characters young. But now we're all the same age that those characters were in the original movies. So yeah, it's sort of twenty years too late for their original for their original plan, but I know they're making a new TV show version of the of those stories. So I mean, I've just always been a fan of read the books and listen to Stephen Fryer read them on tape sometimes so good to.

Help me go to sleep.

Help me go to sleep.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean it's something that you know, if the opportunity arose. I think there are some really wonderful characters in those in those stories, but you know they've also been told so beautifully already, you know, on film, on audiobook already.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean it's something that you know, if the opportunity arose. I think there are some really wonderful characters in those in those stories, but you know they've also been told so beautifully already, you know, on film, on audiobook already.