Hi, everyone, Sophia Bush here. Welcome to Work in Progress, where I talked to people who inspire me about how they got to where they are and where they think they're still going. I am so excited to share a very special bonus episode with you guys today with someone who is quite literally changing the landscape of food in this country, the incredibly inspiring Mr Jonathan Webb. Jonathan is an entrepreneur and the founder and CEO of app Harvest, a company that is helping to turn his dream of a high tech farming hub in Appalachia into reality. Before founding app Harvest, Jonathan worked with the U. S Department of Defense on one of the largest solar projects in the southeastern United States before returning to Kentucky in where he continues to work high earlessly to make the eastern part of the state the ag tech capital of America. With that Harvest, Jonathan is building some of the largest indoor farms in the world, combining conventional agricultural techniques with today's technology to grow non GMO chemical free produce to be sold to the top twenty five U S grocers. And he happens to be doing this in the place he grew up and loves deeply. Jonathan strives to work alongside the hardest working men and women of eastern Kentucky and build a resilient economy for the future. In my conversation with Jonathan, we discussed his childhood, growing up in Kentucky, his time with the Department of Defense, and the work he's done in the energy world, the Netherlands and its high tech greenhouses, what we can learn from them, innovating the way we source energy, how to better bring people together and improve the agricultural future of our country and our world. Plus will dig into Jonathan's company at harvest and as usual, so much more. Enjoy Jonathan, thanks so much for joining me today. I'm so excited to have you on the podcast. Thank you, Sophia. I really appreciate it. Thanks for facilitating conversations like this and appreciate you. Oh my god, I'm thrilled and I can't wait for the listeners to hear about what you're doing and how you're changing quite literally the landscape of food in this country. UM, I want to just tell them all. You know. You and I got introduced via email about activism around food and climate and support for Appalachia, and then we actually met face to face in Detroit, UM, which is another you know, incredible city and region really of America that I'm passionate about. And um, yeah, I just kind of I kind of knew from that conversation we had that day that I want it the public at large, you know, the listeners of this podcast to be able to hear about what you're doing. And it's really interesting as we as we get ready to have a conversation about you know, changing systems and and really prioritizing the health of the nation through food. We're doing this in in the midst of the first global pandemic in a hundred years, which it's just so surreal. Does does what's happening with COVID make you hopeful that we will take the need to create better systems more seriously? Or or are you feeling a bit despondent right now? Or maybe a little bit of both. So generally speaking, UM, I am I am an eternal optimist, So I do, I do do tend to believe that that, you know, humanity and the planet as a whole has as its best days of us. But we're certainly facing challenging times and you know, look at health, look at energy, food, all of which are becoming more and more complex as as humans have now gotten to what's seventh plus billion on the planet, and we're supposed to get to nine billion and and to be able to support that many people and and have adequate health and adequate energy and adequate food systems. It's it's going to be complex. But you know the good thing, you know, human innovation has has found a way before and as long as we align and and we align on our goals for for people and playing at first, I'm very optimistic that that, you know, we can use innovation and technology to to continue to better the way in which we're building stuff to keep all this going. Did did your passion for agriculture not to use a meta? I realized I just about used a farming metaphor. I was going to say, do you think the seed was planted? Um? And you know during during your childhood because you were born and raised in Kentucky, so were you were you in a rural area? Were you in an agricultural zone? No, you know, there's there's a lot of open land and Kentucky and even getting out and just just being out but but I grew up as a as a very you know what somewhat you know normal, I don't know what you know, normal is relative, but the normal upbringing across what I would say, you know, kind of Middle America. My parents both have high school degrees, you know, come from a very humble background of sorts, and um, you know, we didn't talk about about a lot of this. My my father and mother were just looking at how do they get by that week? And looking back on and now reflecting on it, you know, the challenges they went through to just put food on the table that was enough, not where is that coming from? And how how are we getting it to the table. You know. So I've been very fortunate and privileged to be able to, you know, to take a step back. But I definitely think my roots one being in Kentucky, where coal was very dominant, so one of the largest CULTUS states in the US, a region that's been known to power the US. And then now moving back to Kentucky and hopefully helping transform Central Appalachia into a region that's known for feeding the US. But but definitely my upbringing here is has been able to ground me in sorts while I've kind of gone out to New York and gone to DC and pursued other work, uh and now being able to come back here. So place is very important to me. And I know a lot of people talk about police based investment, but you know, I think tracking back to the source of where we're doing stuff and looking people in the eye and and knowing who's all involved. You know, as as we continue to transform, it's you know, place based investments can continue to play a critical part of rebuilding since some so that that we know the communities were building, and so building here is is incredibly important to me. Growing up here has been fundamental and and shaping certainly the way I think. Well before we move into the work that you're referencing, I do love to hear about how people grew up. I think so often about you know, the impressive folks I get to sit across from and an interview about their current work in the world, and and I wonder how it all started. So, you know, you you mentioned a little bit of your upbringing and a little bit about your parents, who who were you as a kid. You know, what was Jonathan into at eight or ten years old? What what was life for you then, yeah, again, I I was like any other kid that they grew up and and they had good friends and family around me. And and didn't you know, I didn't know too much about the environment or playing it as a whole, but I knew I enjoyed playing in a cree or a stream, or you know, enjoyed, you know, playing playing with my friends in the field. And it didn't think much about it until a little bit later. And and I went to public schools growing up, went to a public university, the University of Kentucky. But it wasn't until I decided to move to New York and pursued a career in in the wind and solar industry. Um and and there there were many steps that kind of got to that point, but uh, you know, really then started to unravel all the stuff that goes on in order to to make sure that there is you know, power that that turns on your lights or or food how does the food get to your table? So for me, I had in a very humble background and childhood that that's been able to ground me in sorts. But you know, this stage, it's more about how do we ensure that those net you know, the kids that are coming up now can enjoy, you know, these these same experiences and that we have clean streams and that we have beautiful mountaintops and that we have the rolling fields. That's that's not a given right now, and it's I think it's very jarring to think about. But you know, we we look at COVID and and see what's what's happening that, you know, we we just feel like all this is is it's a certain thing, like humanity is going to continue because that's just what happens. It's none of it is certain. We have to will it into existence. And if we don't willfully change, you know, many of the systems that are in place that are that are providing our food or power, water, and and and so on and so forth. You know that it's not a given that you know, the next generation is going to have it better than the last generation. And if you think of the American dream, right that's that's it. Like you know, every every mother and father just just wants to be able to do enough to make sure that their son or daughter has it better than mayhet it. And and we're getting the tipping points that that are gonna be hard to turn back and if we don't move aggressively, Uh, it's gonna be challenging. But I am of call. I mean, you look at the private sector, you look at advocacy, you're looking at investors, you know, you you look at the consumer, and they're voting with their dollar. You know, the next ten or twenty years are critical. But but it's certainly you know, a hopeful time that that we can you know, start to to make a drastic shift and hopefully, you know, if there's a silver lining out of COVID, it's the somehow a guy that galvanizes us together and we can you know, for me, even being in Kentucky, you know, what happens in the capital of China affects Southeast Kentucky in two months. Now. If that doesn't wait, people under up to understand that there's one humanity and that there's one planet and we're all missed together. I really have no idea what will, but but I am hopeful that it does wake people off and then and then we see it now that it doesn't matter. We can't separate ourselves by borders or oceans or whatever it is. We're so interconnected. We have to solve these problems together and then and then hopefully coming out of COVID, there's some of that galvanizing spirit that carries on. Yeah, I I so agree with you, and I find that to be such an inspiring perspective, and I think it's important to hit on the truth that we need to understand that we have we as humanity. We have engineered a global planet. We've chosen this, we've increased travel, We've we've become so enamored by so many aspects of each other's cultures. And yet you also see the politicizing of culture and place in such a strange way. And what I wish we could hold is that two things can be true. We can set global priorities for humanity and we can care about our local community. And and that feels really clear to me in places like you're referencing when we talk about Kentucky, when we talk about Appalachia, because whether anywhere you look, you can see the history of a region. And you know, you mentioned that that your area of Kentucky is is or has been a huge coal producing resource for America. You know, we we powered America on coal for a very long time, and yet we do to your point have to understand that as we evolve, as science evolves, we have to engineer better systems. And when I think about generations, you know, I know your granddad was a coal miner. I I know that there's been devastating impacts of mass job loss across the region. You know, at least to today, eleven coal companies have filed for bankruptcy just since Trump was elected president. And and the job losses are meaningful to people in these areas that have been employed in these companies. And so when I start thinking about innovation, when I start thinking about how we've got to do better to support seven and a half and eventually nine billion people, I think about regions like like the one that you grew up in. And I remember in the last election cycle just thinking, you know, why aren't these big solar companies marching into Kentucky and saying, we're gonna build new solar plants here. We're going to give you better jobs, with better wages, cleaner working environments, less health hazards, you know, great benefits. We we've we've got to we've got to think about all these people in all these places as we think about innovation and change and and I suppose I just say all of that really to offer that it's something that you know, being from California and knowing how the environment has been important to me uh much in the way it was to you playing outside for my whole childhood. I I too think about what I wanted to look like for my eventual kids and their eventual kids, and and I wonder seeing those impacts in your community, do you now trace back? Because it's easy for us right to have conversations in the present and say, this is what we'd like to see differently, and this is how we'd love to invest in people and support economic development in in hard hit you know, regions of the country, and then think about the global impact and all of it. And we have to. But do you think that that came from your seeing the region change throughout your life? Do do you think that's why you took the path that you did in college while you went to Washington. Do you think that those things are all tied together? Yeah? And one absolutely so a couple of things on that for me, and that's where you know, we we so what we're pursuing. I think the very exciting thing about what we're doing is as I do. Look at my background and I try to tell anybody and everybody I meet around here, just one individual, that it comes from a background that's somewhat similar, maybe very similar to many other people around here. And it's somehow leaderships, you know, responsibility at either universities or political or whatever it is to inspire and galvanize youth. Right, so you know, for me, what we're doing, it's it's the largest all cash investment ever made in the eastern Kentucky. We're we're building in the poorest congressional district of the US. And you know, yes, this has been a long process, but I'm just one individual, and frankly, at this point, I could, God willing, I'm here until I'm a hundred, but you know, I could somehow pass at some point, and this thing is going to carry on one way the other. We were moving those momentum, But how do we galvanize you know, youth, I don't know. But but what I do know is the best and brightest from Kentucky don't stay here to rebuild our region. They moved to Boston, moved they moved to l A. They moved to San Francisco. That is a problem, and we got we have got to get our best and brightest to not just sit in San Francisco and build an app, to figure out how we can get tennis shoes faster, and figure out how they go back to their communities and rebuild their communities and reimagine what's possible. But yes, for me, it was you know, moving back to Kentucky happened. There was about a tent there. I lived out of the state for ten years and uh got out of undergraduate. I wanted to build energy projects. Well at the time, you're not going to build a coal plant, You're not going to build natural gas. You know. That was it was merging but not there. So what was happening a lot women solar. So what for me, the sustainability piece really came over time, But it was just a sheer fact that I wanted to build stuff. And at that time what you built was wind and solar. So it was a part of building large scale solar some of the largest in the US. And what I saw happen over that ten year time frame of friends, family, you know, even just seeing local news and what was happening. I go back and I think it's one of the darkest stains in America history. I think we'll look back at how we shut down the minds and whether it's the left or the right, you know, the progressive or the conservative side, it's irrelevant. What we all benefited from was low cost electricity that carried us to be the economic powerhouse of the world. That that cost electricity came from coal. We shut down the minds. Forget the minds, it's the people who powered those minds. Coal is just it's a piece of material in the earth. But the people that actually powered this country with the people of since Ropalachia and the lack of leadership to think through what are we gonna do when we actually shut all these these minds down, when we shut these companies down. And I still sit here and continue to be just shocked at the lack of coordination on what's next. I go back to, you know, I think I'm very biased, but I think it's the hardest working men and women in the country, the people of that region that have powered our country. Uh. And so you know, big picture, I don't know where all this goes, but but I definitely feel again very optimistic that there's an opportunity to to continue to reshape and not make it about war. I mean we all say, I mean, what what what does war win? I mean, it doesn't win anything, so you know, whether it's a war on coal or a war you know overseas, it doesn't. But can we sit at tables and find common ground. We don't need to all agree on everything, but we can find what we do agree on and then figure out a path forward. And it's so frustrating that no one came into Central Appalachian. No one sat down with communities, No one sat down with community leaders and said, Okay, we're gonna transition, and you might not agree with that transition, but we're gonna try to transition. Now, what can we agree on? Now, everybody would have been on board, but there would have been a lot And I think if you look at the support we got with our company, people were like, you're gonna get run out of town, you're gonna get No, we didn't everybody, everywhere, anyone We came upon that. The whole reason we're able to do what we're doing is not just because of me, by any stretch of the imagination. It's because communities rallied around what we were doing, and they simply showed up and said, how do we get this done? Uh? And and that to me, you know, if we look at you know, the possibilities that are still ahead of us here even in our own country. I mean, we don't have to go fly around the world to find extreme poverty. And I had when I moved back to Kentucky, in in in the Pikeville area, I had one in three of my neighbors were making less than ten thousand dollars a year. I mean, that's not the best that you know, me and you and everybody else should call this great. You know, this great American dream, it just doesn't exist. And I know you're work in Detroit and there's a big similarity there where you had the decline of the auto industry and in Detroit and there's a bit of a renaissance now. And we've seen the decline of the coal industry and simple Sentra apple Latchia. But I'm hopeful. But we got to figure out how to get our best and brightest to dig in, you know, move back to the middle part of the country and rebuild our communities collectively for for the future. Because if we don't, then then we've got what we've got, and that's you know, a very hard road ahead of us. And it can't be ten people trying to figure it out. It needs to be you know, a slew slup of folks that that have left, you know, for just a few big cities to come back and try to rebuild the middle part of the US. Were you seeing changes like the ones that you're talking about even as a kid, were you conscious of of the way that the region around you was changing? No, not really is a kid? It was again I think I personally now kind of is going through all this. And I had, you know, I had a meeting with the you know, the last president. I've had you know, many meetings at this White House, so high ranking officials on both sides. I continue to scratch my head. You know, Steve Kay's the founder Avail well as our first investor. I continue to scratch my head and I'm trying to figure out, like, why why am I even in the room? What's the battle? And I think the value I've been able to bring to the table, It's just a very simple way to look at it. In my my background is no different than anybody else that might have grown up in any surrounding area in this region, which is you know that somehow transition through early twenties into you know, seeing the macro world. But I think we all get lost and you know, get lost in these echo chambers and get lost in and you know that we were talking earlier before you turned the recording on, you know, about the science and the Walkee s that like, we've got to find a way to just make it resonant connect and I think fortunately we're doing. We found ways to simply message and make it resonant um. And so no, I didn't really have these eye opening experiences when I was younger. I just had a very normal childhood. But when the eye open experiences came later, it's then, you know, how do you connect that back to everyone else who you know, who sees the world in which I did? Um? And I think you know that has been our value that that we've been able to just you know, find you know, common ground where we can find it and try to build on these building box. I mean, we're building what is effectively the largest sustainable project and the hearticle country ever built. And this is part of what makes me excited because to your point, if we could toss the assumption of difference out the window. If we could agree on a couple of things like I always the joke, I always tell us a look, two plus two is always going to equal four. If we looked at science, if we looked at the fact that, to your earlier point, clean air, clean water, clean land should never be partisan, we could we could really get somewhere, and we could realize that you know, in the way that you and I have shared, I grew up in southern California. You grew up in Kentucky, but we have a lot of the same experiences with nature in our backgrounds. People who are told that they're different from other people really aren't. You know, the specific circumstance might look a little bit different, but there are these universal truths we all tap into. And that's what makes me excited about the work that you're doing, is that we're getting back to the reality of, hey, how do we take care of each other? This is important everywhere? And yes, we've got a design reinvestment in certain regions in ways that helps them, that make sure there's not a brain drain happening, that make sure that people can hold onto their communities for generations to come. And and I love that your work eventually took you home, even when it takes you all over the world, because it's certainly the way that my work has taken me everywhere that has made me realize we're all mostly the same. And and I love that those are the truths that we can then bring home with us. Yeah, I mean yes, so we we are not as far apart as we seem at all. I have been even the last eighteen months. UH spoke at Berkeley for their half Earth Days EO. Wilson, working to preserve half the world's land and freshwater for biodiversity. UM, I will go there have great conversations that I don't really need anybody in the room that I can't figure out some way to connect, and then I'll come back where again Eastern Kentucky. I could be wrong, but I think it's roughly nine of the people in Eastern Kentucky voted for the current President Trump. And you would think if I go to Berkeley and I'm having a conversation and then I come here like somewhere there's going to be this big friction point, and there's not, because the reality the ism we do have so much more in common, and I don't want to get to There's a lot of people you could have on your show that will be, you know, much more intelligent than me on this topic. But the only thing I can think of is that again, you know, this partisan politics that we've got, that the partisan media on on left and right, the the you know, social media echo chambers that keeps everybody in the like, that is creating more of a divide than actual people. Like if me and you can have conversations like this, and you can get people string Kentucky having conversations with people from Berkeley, the what they'll find is they like a lot of the same stuff and like their values in life align a lot more than what they what they what they contradict. And the shocking thing for me is we're just not having the conversations. I don't know how we get to a point to where we're more the conversation is more aspiring and more about how we bring people together to a table versus let's just get onto social media and figure out what we don't agree about. And for some reason right now and that's all that's going on. But for me and my experience, I have gone to the farthest left of circles, been in them, and then within eight hours on a plane, I'm back in what some people would say might be some of the more far right circles. And and to me, it's it's a it's just astounding me, like the amount of over and commonalities that I can see in people and I'm just a normal human that how we so divided when you actually here and you hear people talk and we're all trying to say the same thing, we're doing in different ways. Gosh, I agree with that. I mean, I I think about to your point, we're often told that things are much more disparate than they are, and and when I think about your background, there's there's something that relates to this that I think the audience will really get a kick out of. Because you know, you mentioned you when you went into the energy sector. We're looking at a lot of wind and solar. Now, what people might not expect is that you were developing solar projects for the United States Department of Defense. And I think a lot of people wouldn't necessarily think green energy d O D working together, but they were and they must continue to be again, for for you know, the sort of innovation of the future of the country and our place on the planet. So I'm curious how you wound up working there and and maybe what you studied in college that that got you onto that track. Yeah. So so my my background at the University Kentucky, I call it that I graduated from the gat In College of Business. But it's a birth great school. Uh, you know, it gives you all everything. I feel like, I guess it gives you everything you need because I guess I'm doing um, don't have a master's. And you know, I tell a kid, and we've got a lot of high school programs that that we're funding and sponsoring here in eastern Kentucky, and any young person, I mean, I tried to say, Look, it doesn't matter if you're in Hong Kong, London, New York, or if you're in Pike County, Kentucky. You have the accident, all the same information, and you know we're moving into that world. You know all this, Yes, the the information is flying at as fast and furious, but if you're willing to talk on what you want. So for me, it was self taught. I I was self taught mainly on on how to build when in solar projects. I started UH advising on private sector projects, and then I moved to d C. And so that the work you mentioned it was the last White House that UH set out an initiative to have the U. S Army, UH Air Force, and Navy procure their power from renewals. UH. So I was a part of of leading efforts on on that team, we built seven hundred and fifty acres of solar down in Georgia. UH. It was a long again, a long tenure journey, like anyone that has their tenure journey that that kind of goes ups and downs. But I didn't know the moment I got that position in d C, I would eventually be able to move back to Kentucky, the place I love and and and attract, you know, sustainable capital. There's all that sustainable flying around the world. The one place that wasn't coming was the place that was heavily impacted. You know, there's the declinical and then there's women's soul right up and and somehow we did not that the diversion there couldn't be any more stark. But then the ten election, and again no matter whatever your side you're on, left or right. The election was definitely a statement on the way many people in this country felt. They felt like there's fifteen urban centers or city centers around the country and then there's the rest of the country, and whether you like it or you don't like it, it's irrelevant. And where the you like this president, don't like this president kind of relevant. The fact is there's a divide and and so for me, I just felt immediately compelled to move from d C back to Kentucky. And then it was a matter of months before I ended up quitting my job and when starting this company and was fortunate to get you know, pretty notable early investors. And then now here we are, uh you know, off to the races and a bit even through COVID. But yeah, it's you know, I think for me, any young person that I could possibly talk to is just you know, the open source information that's out there. Uh that you know, a college degree is great, but but at the end of the day, you know, passion in pursuing that passion and finding the information. Uh, it was was you know, it was my story and I hope, you know, we'll see many other young people in Kentucky that you know, come out of the gates in the next five five years or so. But um, you know what if you I guess your your journey, I mean, what what you what led you to act? I mean how did you? How did you? William? And you know, was it self taught at all or was it classes or was it um? It was honestly kind of an accident. I I started doing theater in high school, so let me think about this. No, it was actually eighth grade. So my um my school had this arts requirement and you had to focus on a different art study every semester in middle school, and I just never really thought I cared about theater. I was really sort of science focused. I wanted to go to medical school. I wanted to be a heart surgeon. UM. And I put off the theater requirement until the last semester. So second semester of eighth grade, I thought I was going to be able to weasel my way out of it because I was playing sports and that didn't work. Um, and I had to do this play. And I realized that everything I loved about literature, which was my favorite thing to study in school, was really coming alive on a stage, and that there was this real experience of Catharsis and kind of emotional journeying for every person in the room. And then I got really nerdy and I started studying, UH where these sorts of traditions had come from. And I realized that there was something at the time that felt so sacred to me that as humans, we passed our stories before we had written language, you know, we we had these stories, we had these essentially these plays, and that's where our history came from and our experience came from, and UM, so much culture came from. And I thought, you know, there are ways to have conversations like this that are really meaningful to people, that do things for people, and we can learn about each other, we can learn about other people's experiences, we can humanize each other, UH, and we can do that through tears, through laughter, you know, there's so many ways. And and that really just changed everything for me, and so I really took a pivot, UH, started focusing on theater all through school, and then when I was applying to collegees, I told my parents that I wanted to go to theater school and not medical school. You can imagine how not thrilled they were. But it turned out Okay, well, so the time, so the time there, and one I didn't telling these stories. I mean again, you know what we're doing behind this, I would say, in this very very small circle, behind the scenes, we have a lot of the monts like we're you know, with invest very high profile investors. But when you stay telling these stories and why, you know why? For me, we're trying to figure out who do we connect with and talk to in these next ten twenty years. We have got to find a way with the art forms, whether it's music or or what's on what's on this big screen or whatever it is, how do we weave into the conversation all this weird, complex stuff that we're doing on art. It's very hard for the average working American or average person to to connect with, you know. For us, again, we do not have like a big, big, out there story to the general public. What we do have is a big story behind in different political circles, in different investor world, world, in the tech world. But it's really your world that is ultimately in my you know, my very much opinion, it's gonna shape that next ten or fifteen years, and that we have to realize, you know, the microphone people have to tell stories and inspire, and we then these complex narratives that it's it's that simple. I mean for me, I even look at some of the movies I watched growing up and in ways in which it just told me different things that you know, I didn't learn in a classroom. And and hopefully I hope that whether it's musicians or artists or anyone of the sort areas, that authority understands how much power they truly hold. Because the general public is listening to you all, they're not listening to they're just not doing it. And so it's the world that somehow intersects. But the people telling the stories that that again, how whether it's a sitcom show or anything, finding a narrative that that can have impact and meaning and every one of these stories, I'm hopeful, But again, is that optimist that ten years from now that's just where the world's going, that we're telling these complex narratives through all these various forms of medium so that the general public can be on board and find a way to come along from ride. Yeah, yeah, I agree. It's a scientist at a podium. We're all screwed. You were developing, you know, these sustainable energy farms. You know, um, we're talking about stuff with the D O D, we're talking about solar. And then you happened to come across something that was happening in the Netherlands. I had never heard about the agricultural program happening in the Netherlands that you told me about, and I would wager that a lot of the people listening haven't either. They developed a growing procedure which eliminated virtually all agricultural chemicals and yielded thirty times as much food as traditional agricultural methods. You read about it, it changed the course of your life. Can can you explain to our listeners what you learned, what they were doing over there, and and and what kind of light bulb that set off for you? Yeah? So to me, I think this is why I continue to be extraordinarily optimistic on the planet and in us as people on the planet, because the good thing is there are solutions around our world. We just have to quickly adopt those and rapidly bring them to scale. So my work in the energy world, the contrast of being from a region that was seeing heavy decline of coal while we saw wind and solar just rip and roar around the world and take off. So you know, look at energy in that form where you're producing electrons over to energy. That's that's ultimately food and agriculture, right, So you put food in your body, it's another form of energy to power you. Steing, I was in d C and continued to hear about the country of the Netherlands. There's a great article the National Geographic in this tiny country feeds the world. That article came out a little bit after I started at purposed Um, and it really from there started to be this ground swell that was bubbling up. It's a country a third the size of Kentucky and land mats. They have the second most agricultural exports in the world, only behind the US. There are a third the size of one state in the US. So then I'm in d C and I'm going away what I'm surely reading something wrong? What's going on? So after World War Two, when the country could not feed itself because of World War Two, they used government, private sector and education institutions to rebuild their agriculture sector. And they've done it over decades. That has become the most efficient, the most innovative, using technology and just the best idea of winds. I don't know how to describe it. It's not a partisan out of this that and so you know, I I tried to use the word resilient now more than sustainable, building resilient systems for the future. H But looking at the US, what we're the largest agriculture economy in the world. What we've had going for US is abundant land, abundant fresh water, just all these abundant resources, so we haven't had to be wildly efficient. The Netherlands, on complete opposite contrast, they don't have a lot of land, they didn't have a lot of fresh water. They have very little resources and have been able to build systems that, like you said, can use ninety percent less water than open field agriculture, no chemical pesticides, thirty times yield break if we simply adopt solutions there are already available and we equit and and so uh, you know, speaking of of kind of our global stage now Being in Kentucky, we had the UN Security Council come to Kentucky for the first time in our state history a couple of months ago, and we brief them on on what we're doing. Um, but if our If our world adopts these solutions that are already available, we have a totally different world. It's in our fifteen years. We free up man, we free up fresh water. We can let natural ecosystems come back and come to life. It is so it's so frustrating to know that the solutions are right in front of us, other countries are adopting them. But the good thing is is, you know, it's not a left or right conversation I had. I had a long meeting with Secretary Purdue a couple of months ago with him and his team. They've been following what we were doing, and he's a huge fan of this, and so I go back to this concept that left first right. Let's let's no one take credit for it. We don't need credit. Let's not make it about this side or that side. Let's just say, hey, we want to be the most resilient country in the world. We want to promise future general it's a better a better future than what we have. Well, let's all get on the same page. And the energy conversation it was hard. I mean, it was very contentious. There either camps that you're you're on this camp or you're on that camp and and but for food and agriculture, I think there's an opportunity. Food is something we all we all consume food every day, several times a day, and it's something that can bring us together. And I hope the agriculture conversation on how we build agriculture around the world takes a much different tone than how the energy conversation played out, because it doesn't need to be partisan, it doesn't need watiful, it just needs to be their solutions. We can get there and we can work together. And I am optimistic. I think the US and ten or fifteen years, we can utilize technology, build infrastructure, build farming across the US and have a first class twenty one century farming ecosystem in our country and then the world coalesces around us. And again, the exciting thing is it's not Willy Wonka fiction. It's I just send people on a plane and say go to the Netherlands. Here, meet with these universities, meet with these operators, meet with these different facility owners. It's here we just have to catch up. And again, I think for for somebody that our team looking at the problems in the face and seeing about twenty fifty or world needs fifty to seventy more food. So to to feed nine billion people, we need fifty to seventy more food in thirty years. That means if we grew food the way we're growing it out, we need to planet Earth's to have enough land and fresh water to grown up. We're not talking about CNN, Fox News. It doesn't matter. No one is talking about it because no one cares about the year problem. Don't care about leanings, quarterly profits. Can I get elected in two years? And you know, and then and then to be fair, and look at the family I came from. You think about, well, how am I sitting my kid to school? Or how am I putting food on the table. And and there's got to be some shake up to where we are are thinking much more long term. And we have our political leaders and our business leaders and and and consumers are all at the table thinking twenty thirty years down the road. Because if we do that, there's plenty of solutions and we can get there. But as we all know, we're in this short term cycle of thinking. And for some reason, all of this is getting dust under the rug. And look at COVID. I mean, we could have been talking about COVID for two decades and been wildly prepared. But because for in this very short term thinking, we're gonna spend six in the US instead of spending fifty or seventy five billion in preventing all of this from ever being in this circumstance and how he who knows. But but there's the opportunity to make it happen. Yeah, And I mean that that is such a great comparison because it's so frustrating when you look back at the scientists who have been talking about this, who've been talking about a pandemic for decades, you know, even even the fact that there there have been I believe don't quote me on this, but I believe it's eleven labs around the world who have all been studying coronaviruses for years because they knew this was coming. And and yet somehow this is being downplayed in our country while there's a hundred thousand American citizens who have died more than from any war, more than from any you know, anything we've ever been involved in, and and it's being it's being politicized, it's it's being treated as though it's an arguing point for an election rather than a devastating experience that had our pandemic response team not been disbanded, we might have been prepared for. And to me, what you're referencing is a real dereliction of duty to protect and ensure the quality of life. And and that's what ignoring a coming food crisis feels like to me as well. Because I'll be honest, I debate at times, you know, when I think about what my future looks like, I really struggle with my desire to be a parent eventually and the state of the world and our our our our kids going to be able to survive if we don't get it together. So when you talk about how if we were investing in the longevity of survival and of you know, better systems with less impact on the planet, because to your point, the planet can't sustain what we're doing to it now, is that where the idea for a harvest came from? Can can you tell the listeners what it's about, because we are having these big macro conversations about food systems and the environment. But but what is your company doing exactly? Yeah, So I've been very fortunate in the last eighteen months. We've raised about a hundred and twenty five million dollars, which, again I think if you look at the American dream, I have somebody who comes from a very humble background and still believe something like this is not possible anywhere else in the world. So I still feel like the US we have a lot of problems and a lot of struggles, but we have a lot of opportunity ahead of us, UH if we can connect the dots and fill the gaps. But we app harvest is raised roughly a DW five million. UH. We're building our first facility UH and and we've set out to to really UH build across central Appalachia and have the largest indoors sustainable produce hub in the US. So if you look at what's happened in the USS, we're growing our fruits and vegetables and drought stricken area California. Let's be clear, I mean it's there's water issues every couple of years up down New Mexico, Texas south of our border. Down in Mexico. We're growing our fruits and vegetables in areas that are running out of water. Kentucky, UH, we had a record amount of rainfall in we keep getting wetter, we have more and more water, so we'll we'll be able to We're building these facilities utilizing technology on the inside, UH to optimize for the plants. So using technology to put nature first and go how do we most efficiently and effectively grow this tomato or cucumber or pepper. And one we take all the sunlight, so we're growing in a glass facility, UH, take all the sunlight. We utilize that the route. It's a sixty acre structure, so about two point eight milling square feet where we'll collect all the rainwater off to the side, pump the water back in with UV, no chemicals, so running our facility completely on recycled rainwater. Because we're a region it's water rich, growing fruits and vegetables utilizing sunlight, but then augmitting technology on top. So in the winter when we don't have as much light, it will be the largest LED installation in the Phillips is providing. We purchased the lights off Phillips so as you can think sunlight coming through, we don't have as much sun so the lighting is augmitting for whatever micromols that the plan is not getting. So we are trying to applies for the plan give it everything it needs consistently year round, to get it all the micromoles, all the water, all the nutrients it needs to grow year round. And then ultimately, why since ripple latcha beyond being from Kentucky and loving the state I'm from, we can get to about sevent the US and a one day drive, So we can get to the east coast, Midwest, and southeast in a one day drive, So reducing trucking. Where if you look at California, if I'm in d C and I buy let us, I'm really buying gasoline with a little bit of let us The majority of the cost of that let us in d C is to simply transport at it from California. In d C. I love, and I think there should be a lot of produce grown, but I do not think our entire country should be fed off of a couple of states. And even look at what's happened when most of our produce is going down south of the border. So being in an area where we have the geographic location to get to major markets, we have access to fresh water. And then you know, the most exciting thing for me is the people. I think again, you know, people look at what's happened here over the last decade. I mean, there are not positive news stories that come out of Cold Country. It is negative news story after negatives. These are men and women that go to work and come home at night and feel like they're destroying the world. What all they're trying to do is make an honest living, put put food on the table. Being able to people here and help lead an agriculture revolution in the US is just the hands down most exciting thing. I mean, it goes well, it's incredible, it's it's passion, it's science, it's purpose and and to your point and what we were discussing earlier, if we want to talk about innovating and changing the way we source energy, we've got to consider the people whose lives are on the line in those jobs as we do it. We can't just talk about changing industries. We have to provide options and opportunity and better opportunity for the folks who have been employed in the industries that we are trying to change. They deserve that. Yeah, and that's you know we've missed you know again, I go back to I still believe the US is and will continue to be the place to make dreams into reality. But we have a lot of acts in our political leadership on left and right, our our business climate, our investment community. But again I'm incredibly hopeful. I mean the fact that app Harvest is around and exists. So we're not only a certified the corps were registered benefit corporation. So what that means is it's very similar to a Sea Corps. But I don't just have Fiducia responsibility to my shareholders. We have a mission that we've set out. So for example, before we started construction on our first facility, we invested nearly a hundred and fifty thousand dollars in high school education, putting ad tech curriculum into schools. If we really are going to do what we're saying we're doing, we've got to inspire the youth that are gonna be here with us. And so having investors, and I'm so fortunate that there are investors are really partners and and I again I you people have these conversations of are the capital markets working, is you know, is the is the business climate you know, destroying the planet. I'm a hopeful that out of self preservation for people in the investor community. If you do not have a company in ten or twenty years that is that adding value to people on planet, you will be stamped out. Consumers are stamping about, regulators are stamping and at a simple self preservation. Some people just have a huge heart and the investors do want to follow the want. They want purpose to lead and profit to follow. But it's getting to a point now if you simply want to be accompanied in twenty thirty years and you were not adding significant value to society, you will get stamped out. And so just at a sheer self preservation, we've seen so many investors that that are maybe don't add the hundred percent viewpoint on the way we see the world, but they think, you know what this is where, this is where we ultimately need to be just to have a safe investment. If if we want to put capital to work and we want to look back in years, is that a safe place a super well for example US, we do have very very smart investors that that are in this all for the right reasons. But even if somebody wasn't on the outside looking in, this is the facility. Will building is going to operate for twenty five third years. So we're making long term vent that twenty years from now, this is where not only what people want today, but this is where the world is going and where consumers are gonna want to be in twenty years and and for any investor out there, and and I've had some really interesting conversations the last year, one of which was the chairman of Procter and Game. Well, I heard him speak. I was in the room, um, and I don't want a quoting word for word, but generally speaking saying, if they don't pivot P and g to be what consumers wanted to be in ten fifteen years, the consumers are just gonna fight back like you had. So whether or not he truly believes in it or doesn't, I have no idea. But what I do know is that the big fortune five hundreds are now waking up, the big investors are now waking up that if they do not align their products with people first and with planet first, then the consumers and regulators and governments and whatever else will they be are just gonna push back. And so it is a very exciting time to just be in in kind of what I would call the impact world of because where's all this is gonna go. Is it gonna be foundations, is it going to be nonprofits and governments? Ultimately, I'm a firm believer that if business is not doing good, then we're all This is gonna be a very hard fight. But but we are entering a place where you know, business across all sectors and across all cafe and across big institutional investors, two smaller impact investors. You know, it's shifting. Uh, and and again in ten years from now. You know, hopefully every company has got some type of impact model and they're looking at what the impact is. But but for us, we've been very fortunate that this is not possible ten years ago. And in the world is definitely shifting fast. We're even able to be moving at the speed we're moving right now. Yeah. Well, and to your point, you know, big business is getting behind renewables. They understand that the shift must come. How how is the reception locally? What is your experience? It's great. I mean we had to last governor who is a Republican and this governor who's a Democrat, both of which publicly supportive of what we're doing. We have you know, I mean, look at our look at our our congressional and Senate delegation, and they've been incredibly supportive. So I don't know that this is a left or right conversation. I've had really good conversations with Senator McConnell, and you know, people as I go to New York or wherever else, when I think, oh really, and it's you know, look, how do we find common ground. People want to see business and enterprise and pridect sector succeed. And if we can find a way to show a path where there is so there are solutions, there's economic value. There's not only value for the planet people, but there's economic value we can all create together. And and let's not make this about some esoteric conversation, but there's real, tangible ways we can strengthen communities and build resilience systems. And and for us, we have tons of support, whether I'm at a local coffee shop or a community church gathering, or I'm dealing with some high ranking political official. For us, we've had come in to support on the left and right. Well, and when you talk about you know, making quantifiable, how many jobs do you estimate this will bring to the area. So the first facility will be through hundred, and we anticipate building several more facilities in the next couple of years. And then it's the trickle out from there. It's not just does that partis to have several hundred or a thousand plus employees. It then becomes an ecosystem of are we going to bring lighting manufacturers here? Are we're gonna bring different water technology companies here? And there's an ecosystem that develops around what we're dooming. Uh And it truly we have every university in our region working with us, every university president looking at how they might change curriculum and forgot us again. It's it's much bigger than us as one company. It's how do we develop a well? And the ecosystem is such an important driver of an economy. You know, it's a it's a different conversation, but in my line of work, you know, on average, there's about two hundred people employed on a TV show, between you know, your cast and your whole crew and your writers, and it's a lot of people. And the the estimate, I'll never forget it. It came out when we've finished the TV series show called One Try Hell that I worked on in North Carolina, we were there for nine years. The state released an estimate that our show, which employed about two hundred people, technically brought two hundred and fifty nine million dollars in revenue into the state over the course of nine years because of travel and hotels and restaurant business and and the local you know, boosts to everything from like home depot of clothing stores for supplies for our show, for construction. It was really incredible. And so when I when I think about you guys talking about you know, going from from an initial three hundred into potentially a thousand or more jobs, I think about the multiplier effect, and that is so exciting, you know, for Appalachia or anywhere that is looking to bolster its economy well. And then just the connections and common that there. We're going to offer classes nights and weekends and have these conversations that only happen at some place in downtown Brooklyn. Now we can have those same conversations in the rural community of eastern Kentucky. And and for me, that's the most exciting thing is to see what happens next. Are we gonna, you know, for me, get out of our employee base where everybody is going to have some type of equity and harvest. Who's going to be the automast, What who's coming up with the next night for our region? And how can we support him? And how can I put them in touch, you know, with with somebody in San Francisco and these linkages that just do not occur in our region. Is how do we just make these connections and then let it on and let the ball enroll from there. And I think for me, five ten years down the road, that's the most exciting piece to this is simply having a place in which we can have these conversations, build up this type of camaraderie, and then make the links back and forth where I can set up zoom halls with somebody in San Francisco, in a high school student in in in Round County, Kentucky, and allow them to bounce ideas back and forth. And and for me, that's that's where the most exciting piece, the human element to all this is the most exciting piece to me. Well, and when we consider how to sustain each other quite literally with food, what strikes me is that this could really also be a return to each other in relationship. You know, the platform that you're creating offers us a real way to come home to each other. And I and I think it's such a special time and I'm just excited to see what happens with both the kind of you know, emotional example that you're setting, but also the job market. You know, I think about how prior to coronavirus anyway, where so many people's employment status has changed. Kentucky has the highest unemployment in the in the US and work for with COVID work unemployment, and before that we had some of the highest unemployment. And that's where it again, I mean, it's it's staggering, and that's happening with COVID everywhere, but we have a deep holded dig out of and and we're going to be a small park in that overall picture. But but the linkage is the conversations and the human element of it. That's just where all this needs to go. But when you think about that, that's what excites me is because again to your points, so often we need to see the numbers to be willing to make change. We need to see what's ahead of us. And and you know, I was looking at the stats um on renewable energy and Obviously these are are pre coronavirus because again we're mentioning so many people have been laid off and we're really hoping that when it's safe, everybody gets those jobs back. But but to know that the solar and wind and industries respectively employ over three hundred and thirty thousand and over a hundred and twenty thousand Americans in all fifty states, you know, to to think about how whether it's renewable energy or these renewable food avenues that that you guys are creating with app Harvest, that we are beginning to prove that doing better by the planet will also employ more people and employ them in safer in safer ways, and in and in companies where to your point, they're also being offered these other benefits, you know, education and technology and systems. I'm so excited about the classes that you guys are going to offer and the way that you're going to support your local community, your local students. You know, it feels it feels like that is an incredible way to not only launch a company, create those jobs, but keep expanding and creating new ones. Yeah, and that's again, where do companies go in the next ten to twenty years. But you know, I there's not one publicly traded benefit corporation so b corpus a certification. There's not one publicly trade of benefit corporation. But at some point, again be being optimists here that you know, we have got to shift past this mindset that there's business and there's the private sector, and there's foundations, nonprofits and community so at some point it's all linked together and got a marge, you gotta emerge. And if you want to be a company in fifty years, you got to have healthy communities and you have to have healthy people around here. So what we're doing is is, you know, I hope just become the only the common sense approach for for c e O s in the next ten or twenty years that you know, this is just what you have to do. And if you're not doing it, uh, it's not good for the long term trajectory of of of your own business. So you know, I again, I I think we're on the early kind of scale of of what benefit corporations are are gonna look like, not only in the US but around the world. But you know, again, not just having fiduciary responsibility to your shareholders, but having some larger mission that you've set out for. Uh. So again long term, big picture, you know, you're you're actually taking your organization to a stronger, healthier place, which which again, as as this all shifts and morphs, it's it's going to be, you know, something we're gonna see play out in front of our eyes and over the next decade. But but I am I'm incredibly hopeful me too, And I'm hopeful for when you guys, you know, get this set up in Kentucky and then figure out your next hub out here in calif Bournia. I get excited about, uh and that might be wishful thinking, but I get really excited about the ways we could establish these these greenhouses you know, all over and and feed to your earlier point the country in so much more local ways, you know, do do better by people so they don't have to be chemicals and their food and there doesn't have to be quite as much um pollution that that is created just from trucking all that food around. Nope, and we can get there. The solutions are there. It's going to be leadership, consumers pushing, you know, the public pushing. Obviously, it's political supports needed, But political folks are going to listen to their constituents and what do people are well, So that's that's a great question to ask, you know, when we think about what's in store for the future of app harvest, for the future of high tech farming, is it constituent education that that needs to happen to help make this a success across the country? What? What can everyone who's listening to this today thinking well, I want to advocate for this kind of a of a food system in my community. How how do we do that? What? What what action steps do we need to take? Yeah, I mean be aware and then vote with your dollar. I mean that's you know, we all feel powerless in so many different ways, right, but it's it's not true. And if you can if we can all connect with five or ten people around us and we're all buying goods and products and services that you know that we feel strongly about. You don't vote one four years, stop, you vote every day. And so for us again for app harvest, you know, we want to just be one small player and a bigger picture of the American food conversation. And and again, I mean this is the very active I mean, look at beyond meat, impossible burger, whether you like it or don't like it, again somewhat irrelevant. It's more of this is the kind versations that that are playing out with food and and and figure out where you be aware of what's going on, and then figure out what you support whatever that is. And that could be your local farmer that you know has this type of farming where it's you know, this type of company that's making their product this way. But we all have the power to vote with our dollar, and that alone, you know, that that alone, that's where the we're the largest economic generator in the world right now, we do have the largest we have the largest agriculture economy. And and so if consumers at a whole at large decide to vote with their dollar, this whole ships overnight for us. And we're interested to see how this plays out because we have caught a lot of early attention. We've been fairly influential again behind the scenes, you know, but when it comes to consumers, we will will be producing our fruits and vegetables later this year, and and and then it becomes an active conversation. And is it going to be a slow role with us, maybe where is it going to be something that we can elevate the conversation and people are talking about it and we are voting with our dollar on what food we do and don't buy, what we what we provide to our family. So I'm hopeful, but it's it's going to take leadership at a lot of different levels and activists and artists, with politicians and business leaders, but ultimately it goes down to the everyday person and what do they decided to do with the dollar and and and and that's where you know, we'll we'll see It's it's not a one year process for us. We feel like it's a it's a decade long journey. But but we definitely think the time it's a long game. And how can listeners follow the journey? How how can people keep up to date with what you are doing at the company and the kinds of innovation that you guys are helping to champion. Well, later this year, we'll be selling our tomatoes to the top twenty five grocers in the US mainly on the East coast, Midwest, southeast, so about the population. So go ahead and start asking your grocer app harvest tomatoes because we'll be it will be a many to all of the largest retailers in the country Walmart, Costco, Krober uh. So you can look us up Google app Harvests. There's some great sitting all across the East coastlan here. All right, my friend, my favorite question to ask everyone, and it will be your last, I promise. I'll let you go in a minute. Um. The podcast, as you know, is called work in progress, and I'm curious, from where you sit today, what feels like a work in progress in your life. Yeah, it's it's really for me personally, it's it's trying to enjoy the journey. I mean, there's there's no destination. We all only go one place and that's somewhere we pass away and that's that's it. But you know, it's the journey every day and living in the present moment, not getting caught up in what did I do two years ago or two weeks ago? What am I doing in two years? So, you know, the work in progress for me and even the journey for us as a whole at app Harvest is you know, this is very hard work, it's challenging, and we believe we're tackling very big problems that are important to all of us, and the emotions get there and we all get worked up, but you know, trying to understand that, you know, all we have is the present moment and trying to enjoy that journey. It's it's hard, and it's something we all collectively here on this end try to do every day. But but you know, just being cognizant that it's a journey, and so the work in progress is really you know, just enjoying that present and the journey of all the way requires kind of a at least for me, I feel like that requires a bit of a daily check in of at my present. Am I am I savoring this even even the hard stuff? Am I really? Am? I really in it? And I think that's a really healthy thing to try to institute. Yeah, and that's all we can do, right, So, these big, complex problems that circle the world, and that the fear and anxiety of of of all of it, it can get overwhelming. But I do hope it's the start of a much larger conversation. And do you and friends that they ever want to come hike the Appalachian Trail or visit what we're doing here. We aggward tourism is what our governor. So we we've had a very supportive governor and he's going to be I'm sure it our opening later this year, and we're trying to deem this facility agriturism. So anybody and everybody that wants to come check it out, we'll have we'll have uh, we have two point eight million square feet of beautiful vegetables growing on the inside, So hopefully you and some friends can come check it out. Sometimes. Awesome, Thank you so much, Jonathan. That was great. I'm really really excited about it. Thank you. This show is executive produced by me, Sophia Bush, and sim Sarna. Our associate producer is Kate Linley. Our editor is Josh Wendish, and our music was written by Jack Garrett and produced by Mark Foster. This show is brought to you by Clan Brilliant Anatomy. M h m hm h