Our highest listened to episode (published 12th October 2023, titled Only Human). It's been almost 3 years since the film dropped and these two things stand out for us: 

Creator/creature theme: In 2026, AI personhood and consciousness is a live legal and theological debate, giving this creator-creature discussion fresh relevance.

Euthanasia theme: Voluntary assisted dying is actively expanding across Australia in 2026, making this Ecclesiastes-death exchange a current pastoral conversation.

 

Enjoy the conversation! 

 

In light of the Barbie movie phenomenon, our hosts take stock of Greta Gerwig's divisive blockbuster, ponder its themes on humanity, and whether it will become an essential existential text.

Old Testament expert Dr George Athas then joins the show to discuss the film, its relationship to the book of Ecclesiastes, and how death plays a role in our understanding of being human.

 

Key Takeaways:
Existential Themes in "Barbie": The movie tackles deep questions of identity and mortality, using the narrative of a doll to explore what it truly means to be human.
Ecclesiastes' Pessimism: Dr. George Athas highlights the pessimistic yet honest portrayal of life's transient nature and inequities in Ecclesiastes, drawing parallels with modern existential storytelling.
Death as a Central Theme: Both "Barbie" and Ecclesiastes focus significantly on death, pondering its implications on how we perceive and live our lives.
Complexity of Human Existence: The discussion reveals the intricate layers of living with awareness of mortality, suggesting a profound connection between biblical and contemporary explorations of existence.
Constructive Theological Engagement: Dr. Athas emphasizes the importance of listening to existential despair as expressed in texts like Ecclesiastes, allowing it to inform a compassionate, gospel-centered response.

Notable Quotes:
"Ecclesiastes sees death as the unavoidable destiny of every person. It's the great leveler." – Dr. George Athas
"In a world in which sin is entered, you don't want access to the Tree of Life. It's not a good thing." – Megan Powell du Toit
"The person who wrote Ecclesiastes, I call him Qohelet, he is very upset with the way that the world works and he doesn't hold out much hope for it." – Dr. George Athas
"We have the science to extend life indefinitely, but not the wisdom to know when actually that's pointless." – Michael Jensen
"Death brings everything to an end. It's dehumanizing in Ecclesiastes' view." – Dr. George Athas

 

Our highest listened to episode (published 12th October 2023, titled Only Human). It's been almost 3 years since the film dropped and these two things stand out for us:&nbsp;
Creator/creature theme: In 2026, AI personhood and consciousness is a live legal and theological debate, giving this creator-creature discussion fresh relevance.
Euthanasia theme: Voluntary assisted dying is actively expanding across Australia in 2026, making this Ecclesiastes-death exchange a current pastoral conversation.
&nbsp;
Enjoy the conversation!&nbsp;
&nbsp;
In light of the&nbsp;Barbie movie phenomenon, our hosts take stock of Greta Gerwig's divisive blockbuster, ponder its themes on humanity, and whether it will become an essential existential text.
Old Testament expert Dr George Athas then joins the show to discuss the film, its relationship to the book of Ecclesiastes, and how death plays a role in our understanding of being human.
&nbsp;
Key Takeaways:
<ul>
<li>Existential Themes in "Barbie": The movie tackles deep questions of identity and mortality, using the narrative of a doll to explore what it truly means to be human.</li>
<li>Ecclesiastes' Pessimism: Dr. George Athas highlights the pessimistic yet honest portrayal of life's transient nature and inequities in Ecclesiastes, drawing parallels with modern existential storytelling.</li>
<li>Death as a Central Theme: Both "Barbie" and Ecclesiastes focus significantly on death, pondering its implications on how we perceive and live our lives.</li>
<li>Complexity of Human Existence: The discussion reveals the intricate layers of living with awareness of mortality, suggesting a profound connection between biblical and contemporary explorations of existence.</li>
<li>Constructive Theological Engagement: Dr. Athas emphasizes the importance of listening to existential despair as expressed in texts like Ecclesiastes, allowing it to inform a compassionate, gospel-centered response.</li>
</ul>
Notable Quotes:
<ul>
<li>"Ecclesiastes sees death as the unavoidable destiny of every person. It's the great leveler." &ndash; Dr. George Athas</li>
<li>"In a world in which sin is entered, you don't want access to the Tree of Life. It's not a good thing." &ndash; Megan Powell du Toit</li>
<li>"The person who wrote Ecclesiastes, I call him Qohelet, he is very upset with the way that the world works and he doesn't hold out much hope for it." &ndash; Dr. George Athas</li>
<li>"We have the science to extend life indefinitely, but not the wisdom to know when actually that's pointless." &ndash; Michael Jensen</li>
<li>"Death brings everything to an end. It's dehumanizing in Ecclesiastes' view." &ndash; Dr. George Athas</li>
</ul>
&nbsp;

Less aggro, more conversation. 

Is it even possible to have a deep discussion without it descending into chaos? Michael Jensen and Megan Powell du Toit think yes, and want to show the rest of us how to do it. 

There’s plenty of things they disagree on: free will, feminism, where you should send your kids to school and what type of church you should go to. But there are also plenty of other things that they have in common. They want to talk about all these things with conviction. But they also want the conversation to be constructive. Tune in to find out if that’s possible.

With All Due Respect

REPLAY: AI, the Creator and Ecclesiastes on Death

For Arguments Sake

Be Our Guest

Through The Wardrobe

This season of With All Due Respect is sponsored by Morling College, a Christ-centred higher-education institution shaped by its Baptist heritage and broad evangelical vision. Morling is committed to rigorous theological study, deep spiritual formation, and learning how to engage faithfully and thoughtfully with difference. Study options include ministry and theology, counselling, chaplaincy, and education. Download a course guide to explore whether Morling is the right place for your next step.

 

Interested in pursuing ministry, counselling, chaplaincy, postgraduate education — or simply eager to dive deeper into God’s Word? Register for Open Night on Thursday, 4 June and discover how your faith and calling can come together at Morling College.

 

About the Guest:

George Gittoes is an acclaimed Australian artist, photographer, filmmaker, and writer known for work centred on conflict zones. For more than four decades, he has documented the realities of war, and he is widely recognised as a leading Australian war artist. He co-founded the Yellow House artists’ collective in Sydney in 1969/70 and later helped establish the Yellow House in Jalalabad, Afghanistan, in 2011. Gittoes has won the Blake Prize for Religious Art twice, the Wynne Prize, and the Sydney Peace Prize in 2015.

Key Takeaways:
Atrocities are deeply rooted in crimes against humanity, involving extreme acts of cruelty and violence that demand global attention and action.
George Gittoes' experiences in conflict zones highlight the power of art to restore dignity and foster peace in war-torn regions.
The episode underscores the significance of understanding human dignity through a theological lens, emphasising creativity over destruction.
The film "Nuremberg" explores the historic trial of Nazi war criminals and the psychological complexity behind such heinous acts.
Discourse around global justice systems reveals both flaws and the essential need for mechanisms to address and prevent future atrocities.

Notable Quotes:
"It's only art that can save humanity." - George Gittoes
"When you dehumanise others, you're actually reducing yourself." - Megan Paul du Trois
"I always believe that the good angels are going to win." - George Gittoes
"The justification is, I assume the actions of the Israeli government make, make the killing of Jews anywhere justifiable." - Michael Jensen
"He's fascinated and attracted as well as repelled by the character who is charming and intelligent and yet deeply evil." - Michael Jensen

Resources:
George Gittoes' Official Website

 

This season of With All Due Respect is sponsored by Morling College, a Christ-centred higher-education institution shaped by its Baptist heritage and broad evangelical vision. Morling is committed to rigorous theological study, deep spiritual formation, and learning how to engage faithfully and thoughtfully with difference. Study options include ministry and theology, counselling, chaplaincy, and education. <a href="https://info.morling.edu.au/l/979923/2023-03-26/5967sq">Download a course guide</a> to explore whether Morling is the right place for your next step.
&nbsp;
Interested in pursuing ministry, counselling, chaplaincy, postgraduate education &mdash; or simply eager to dive deeper into God&rsquo;s Word? Register for <a href="https://info.morling.edu.au/open-night">Open Night</a> on Thursday, 4 June and discover how your faith and calling can come together at Morling College.
&nbsp;
About the Guest:
George Gittoes is an acclaimed Australian artist, photographer, filmmaker, and writer known for work centred on conflict zones. For more than four decades, he has documented the realities of war, and he is widely recognised as a leading Australian war artist. He co-founded the Yellow House artists&rsquo; collective in Sydney in 1969/70 and later helped establish the Yellow House in Jalalabad, Afghanistan, in 2011. Gittoes has won the Blake Prize for Religious Art twice, the Wynne Prize, and the Sydney Peace Prize in 2015.
Key Takeaways:
<ul>
<li>Atrocities are deeply rooted in crimes against humanity, involving extreme acts of cruelty and violence that demand global attention and action.</li>
<li>George Gittoes' experiences in conflict zones highlight the power of art to restore dignity and foster peace in war-torn regions.</li>
<li>The episode underscores the significance of understanding human dignity through a theological lens, emphasising creativity over destruction.</li>
<li>The film "Nuremberg" explores the historic trial of Nazi war criminals and the psychological complexity behind such heinous acts.</li>
<li>Discourse around global justice systems reveals both flaws and the essential need for mechanisms to address and prevent future atrocities.</li>
</ul>
Notable Quotes:
<ol>
<li>"It's only art that can save humanity." - George Gittoes</li>
<li>"When you dehumanise others, you're actually reducing yourself." - Megan Paul du Trois</li>
<li>"I always believe that the good angels are going to win." - George Gittoes</li>
<li>"The justification is, I assume the actions of the Israeli government make, make the killing of Jews anywhere justifiable." - Michael Jensen</li>
<li>"He's fascinated and attracted as well as repelled by the character who is charming and intelligent and yet deeply evil." - Michael Jensen</li>
</ol>
Resources:
<ul>
<li><a href="https://gittoes.com/">George Gittoes' Official Website</a></li>
</ul>
&nbsp;

Exploring Atrocities and Art | George Gittoes

This season of With All Due Respect is sponsored by Morling College, a Christ-centred higher-education institution shaped by its Baptist heritage and broad evangelical vision. Morling is committed to rigorous theological study, deep spiritual formation, and learning how to engage faithfully and thoughtfully with difference. Study options include ministry and theology, counselling, chaplaincy, and education. Download a course guide to explore whether Morling is the right place for your next step.

 

Interested in pursuing ministry, counselling, chaplaincy, postgraduate education — or simply eager to dive deeper into God’s Word? Register for Open Night on Thursday, 4 June and discover how your faith and calling can come together at Morling College.

 

About the Guest:

Dr. Nijay Gupta is a prominent New Testament scholar and the Professor of New Testament at Northern Seminary. He has authored multiple influential books such as "A Beginner's Guide to New Testament Studies," "Paul the Language of Faith," and the forthcoming "Pour for the World: A Grounded Vision for Finding Meaning in this Life, Not Just the Next." Dr. Gupta co-chairs the Pauline Theology Seminar of the Institute for Biblical Research and contributes as a senior translator for the New Living Translation, showcasing his deep engagement with biblical texts and his commitment to accessible theological education.

 

Key Takeaways:


The distinction between salvation gospel and kingdom gospel can unify a holistic view of the Gospel's implications for individuals and creation.


Dr. Nijay Gupta argues for a "grounded vision" of the Gospel, integrating theological insights with real-world applications to combat escapism.


The resurrection is a revolutionary concept impacting both spiritual beliefs and practical approaches to life, highlighting the importance of embodying hope and new creation.


The film "On the Waterfront" serves as a cultural lens through which the sermon of standing against injustice is presented, mirroring Gospel teachings on moral action.


Insights on articulating faith in public spheres emphasize the necessity of adapting Gospel communication to engage effectively with diverse audiences and contexts.

Notable Quotes:
He says, taken together, we can infer from 1 Corinthians 15, 3 to 5, Romans 1, 14 and 2 Timothy 2, 8. The gospel is both about the person and work of Christ. God promised in the scriptures that he would renew creation, restore Israel. The gospel is the good news that God has made these promises good in Jesus, the Messiah and Lord Jesus died and rose for the purpose of atoning for sins. And through faith in him and his work, believers are reconciled to God. The new age has been launched and God has revealed his saving righteousness in the gospel so that he justifies and delivers persons from the penalty and pain, power of sin and death. - Mike Bird definition of the Gospel
"You know, some people think we were made for heaven and not earth, but we were actually made for heaven on earth." — Nijay Gupta
"The resurrection body of Jesus is proof of life, that new creation is coming now." — Nijay Gupta

 

This season of With All Due Respect is sponsored by Morling College, a Christ-centred higher-education institution shaped by its Baptist heritage and broad evangelical vision. Morling is committed to rigorous theological study, deep spiritual formation, and learning how to engage faithfully and thoughtfully with difference. Study options include ministry and theology, counselling, chaplaincy, and education. <a href="https://info.morling.edu.au/l/979923/2023-03-26/5967sq">Download a course guide</a> to explore whether Morling is the right place for your next step.
&nbsp;
Interested in pursuing ministry, counselling, chaplaincy, postgraduate education &mdash; or simply eager to dive deeper into God&rsquo;s Word? Register for <a href="https://info.morling.edu.au/open-night">Open Night</a> on Thursday, 4 June and discover how your faith and calling can come together at Morling College.
&nbsp;
About the Guest:
Dr. Nijay Gupta is a prominent New Testament scholar and the Professor of New Testament at Northern Seminary. He has authored multiple influential books such as "A Beginner's Guide to New Testament Studies," "Paul the Language of Faith," and the forthcoming "Pour for the World: A Grounded Vision for Finding Meaning in this Life, Not Just the Next." Dr. Gupta co-chairs the Pauline Theology Seminar of the Institute for Biblical Research and contributes as a senior translator for the New Living Translation, showcasing his deep engagement with biblical texts and his commitment to accessible theological education.
&nbsp;
Key Takeaways:
<ul>
<li>
The distinction between salvation gospel and kingdom gospel can unify a holistic view of the Gospel's implications for individuals and creation.
</li>
<li>
Dr. Nijay Gupta argues for a "grounded vision" of the Gospel, integrating theological insights with real-world applications to combat escapism.
</li>
<li>
The resurrection is a revolutionary concept impacting both spiritual beliefs and practical approaches to life, highlighting the importance of embodying hope and new creation.
</li>
<li>
The film "On the Waterfront" serves as a cultural lens through which the sermon of standing against injustice is presented, mirroring Gospel teachings on moral action.
</li>
<li>
Insights on articulating faith in public spheres emphasize the necessity of adapting Gospel communication to engage effectively with diverse audiences and contexts.
</li>
</ul>
Notable Quotes:
<ol>
<li>He says, taken together, we can infer from 1 Corinthians 15, 3 to 5, Romans 1, 14 and 2 Timothy 2, 8. The gospel is both about the person and work of Christ. God promised in the scriptures that he would renew creation, restore Israel. The gospel is the good news that God has made these promises good in Jesus, the Messiah and Lord Jesus died and rose for the purpose of atoning for sins. And through faith in him and his work, believers are reconciled to God. The new age has been launched and God has revealed his saving righteousness in the gospel so that he justifies and delivers persons from the penalty and pain, power of sin and death. - Mike Bird definition of the Gospel</li>
<li>"You know, some people think we were made for heaven and not earth, but we were actually made for heaven on earth." &mdash; Nijay Gupta</li>
<li>"The resurrection body of Jesus is proof of life, that new creation is coming now." &mdash; Nijay Gupta</li>
</ol>
&nbsp;

Heaven on Earth: The Gospel for Everyday Life | Nijay Gupta

This season of With All Due Respect is sponsored by Morling College, a Christ-centred higher-education institution shaped by its Baptist heritage and broad evangelical vision. Morling is committed to rigorous theological study, deep spiritual formation, and learning how to engage faithfully and thoughtfully with difference. Study options include ministry and theology, counselling, chaplaincy, and education. Download a course guide to explore whether Morling is the right place for your next step.

 

In an age marked by political polarisation, moral confusion, and deep mistrust of institutions, what does it mean to live well together? Are we primarily citizens of the state, autonomous individuals, or something else entirely? Join Michael at the 27th Annual Tinsley Lecture on 21 May as he explores the distinctive political vision offered by Christian faith in Subjects and Citizens – What Christianity Offers a Fractured Public Square.

About the Guest:

Professor Maria O’Sullivan is an Associate Professor at Deakin Law School whose expertise spans public law, human rights law, and refugee law. Her scholarship has been cited by the High Court of Australia and the Court of Justice of the European Union, and her current research includes the law of protest and its human rights implications

Key Takeaways:
Engaging in protests can be seen as a sort of communicative act, and the episode explores how Christians might balance respecting authority with participating in protests.
Professor Maria O'Sullivan outlines the legal landscape of protest laws in Australia, revealing differences in state legislations and their practical implications on the right to peaceful assembly.
The hosts discuss the potential hazards and moral considerations Christians must contemplate when deciding to join or abstain from protests.
The 2014 film "Selma" is explored as a cinematic representation of how strategic, nonviolent protest led by Martin Luther King Jr. played a vital role in progressing civil rights.
Historical and current contexts are evaluated to understand the role that protests play in democracy and societal change.

Notable Quotes:
"It's a moment of voice for the voiceless." - Michael Jensen on the significance of protests.
"There's a difference between something being performative and something being insincere." - Megan Powell du Toit on the nature of protests.
"You have the right to peaceful assembly, but there are exceptions… there has to be some proportionality." - Professor Maria O'Sullivan on the balance between protest and law.
"Protest, sort of the embodied nature of protest, I think, is something that's universal." - Megan Powell du Toit on the fundamental importance of protest.
"Even if a couple of people in a protest are violent, that does not make the whole protest violent." - Professor Maria O'Sullivan on defining peaceful assembly.

Resources:
Deakin Law School
"Selma" 2014 film directed by Ava DuVernay

 

This season of With All Due Respect is sponsored by Morling College, a Christ-centred higher-education institution shaped by its Baptist heritage and broad evangelical vision. Morling is committed to rigorous theological study, deep spiritual formation, and learning how to engage faithfully and thoughtfully with difference. Study options include ministry and theology, counselling, chaplaincy, and education. <a href="https://info.morling.edu.au/l/979923/2023-03-26/5967sq">Download a course guide</a> to explore whether Morling is the right place for your next step.
&nbsp;
In an age marked by political polarisation, moral confusion, and deep mistrust of institutions, what does it mean to live well together? Are we primarily citizens of the state, autonomous individuals, or something else entirely? Join Michael at the <a href="https://info.morling.edu.au/tinsley-annual-lecture">27th Annual Tinsley Lecture</a> on 21 May as he explores the distinctive political vision offered by Christian faith in Subjects and Citizens &ndash; What Christianity Offers a Fractured Public Square.
About the Guest:
Professor Maria O&rsquo;Sullivan is an Associate Professor at Deakin Law School whose expertise spans public law, human rights law, and refugee law. Her scholarship has been cited by the High Court of Australia and the Court of Justice of the European Union, and her current research includes the law of protest and its human rights implications
Key Takeaways:
<ul>
<li>Engaging in protests can be seen as a sort of communicative act, and the episode explores how Christians might balance respecting authority with participating in protests.</li>
<li>Professor Maria O'Sullivan outlines the legal landscape of protest laws in Australia, revealing differences in state legislations and their practical implications on the right to peaceful assembly.</li>
<li>The hosts discuss the potential hazards and moral considerations Christians must contemplate when deciding to join or abstain from protests.</li>
<li>The 2014 film "Selma" is explored as a cinematic representation of how strategic, nonviolent protest led by Martin Luther King Jr. played a vital role in progressing civil rights.</li>
<li>Historical and current contexts are evaluated to understand the role that protests play in democracy and societal change.</li>
</ul>
Notable Quotes:
<ol>
<li>"It's a moment of voice for the voiceless." - Michael Jensen on the significance of protests.</li>
<li>"There's a difference between something being performative and something being insincere." - Megan Powell du Toit on the nature of protests.</li>
<li>"You have the right to peaceful assembly, but there are exceptions&hellip; there has to be some proportionality." - Professor Maria O'Sullivan on the balance between protest and law.</li>
<li>"Protest, sort of the embodied nature of protest, I think, is something that's universal." - Megan Powell du Toit on the fundamental importance of protest.</li>
<li>"Even if a couple of people in a protest are violent, that does not make the whole protest violent." - Professor Maria O'Sullivan on defining peaceful assembly.</li>
</ol>
Resources:
<ul>
<li><a href="https://experts.deakin.edu.au/63718-maria-o'sullivan">Deakin Law School</a></li>
<li><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selma_(film)">"Selma" 2014 film directed by Ava DuVernay</a></li>
</ul>
&nbsp;

REPLAY: AI, the Creator and Ecclesiastes on Death

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