You're listening to a Mamma Mia podcast.

You're listening to a Mamma Mia podcast.

Mamma Mia acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters that this podcast is recorded on.

Mamma Mia acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters that this podcast is recorded on.

Hello and welcome to this glorious mess.

Hello and welcome to this glorious mess.

We are embracing the chaos together, ditching the judgment as always. I'm taking it Tolly, mother of twin girls and big single boy.

We are embracing the chaos together, ditching the judgment as always. I'm taking it Tolly, mother of twin girls and big single boy.

And I'm Anallys Todd, a single mother to two twain boys who could be described this is me not them, as a fairly free range parent and self confessed accidental hot mess. Oh we all, And today we're sitting down with one of Australia's most authentic voices, Constance Hall, a best selling author, entrepreneur and social media phenomenon who's built a community of over one point eight million followers by simply being real about the messy, beautiful.

And I'm Anallys Todd, a single mother to two twain boys who could be described this is me not them, as a fairly free range parent and self confessed accidental hot mess. Oh we all, And today we're sitting down with one of Australia's most authentic voices, Constance Hall, a best selling author, entrepreneur and social media phenomenon who's built a community of over one point eight million followers by simply being real about the messy, beautiful.

Chaos of life.

Chaos of life.

Known for her raw honesty about everything from motherhood to relationships, mental health to body image, and she also happens to be my best friend of over thirty five years.

Known for her raw honesty about everything from motherhood to relationships, mental health to body image, and she also happens to be my best friend of over thirty five years.

Oh I thought you were only twenty one, doll.

Oh I thought you were only twenty one, doll.

I know it's looks can be deceiving.

I know it's looks can be deceiving.

We'll be hearing from Constance about how you can adopt her teflon coat of armor when it comes to judgment from other parents. But first, here's what's happening in my group chat. You're gonna love this one. On lease, I thought of you straight away. I'm like, this is right up her alley. I got sent this article and it made me think of you straight away. So the title of the article, yes, is eleven injured. Oh at hen party during fight for karaoke microfile?

We'll be hearing from Constance about how you can adopt her teflon coat of armor when it comes to judgment from other parents. But first, here's what's happening in my group chat. You're gonna love this one. On lease, I thought of you straight away. I'm like, this is right up her alley. I got sent this article and it made me think of you straight away. So the title of the article, yes, is eleven injured. Oh at hen party during fight for karaoke microfile?

Oh yes, relatable?

Oh yes, relatable?

Were you there and were you one of the eleven? Is my question?

Were you there and were you one of the eleven? Is my question?

Seen her and understood?

Seen her and understood?

No, Well I knew it wasn't you because it actually happened in Dublin.

No, Well I knew it wasn't you because it actually happened in Dublin.

Oh. Oh they're spiritual.

Oh. Oh they're spiritual.

Yes, yes, they like their music.

Yes, yes, they like their music.

Okay, all my favorite bands are more details gave this event. So the hen party of a Dublin woman descended into chaos.

Okay, all my favorite bands are more details gave this event. So the hen party of a Dublin woman descended into chaos.

Oh gosh, she cops and the minutes after the party became aware that there was only time for three bore songs before the bar.

Oh gosh, she cops and the minutes after the party became aware that there was only time for three bore songs before the bar.

Was due to close.

Was due to close.

Oh, that's a very tense time in karaoke. If there's eleven of you or more and only three songs, this is a problem.

Oh, that's a very tense time in karaoke. If there's eleven of you or more and only three songs, this is a problem.

Yes, and there's what one microphone? Oh dear, because the moment it escalated. Yes was over one song. Okay, Kelly Clarkson, since you've been gone.

Yes, and there's what one microphone? Oh dear, because the moment it escalated. Yes was over one song. Okay, Kelly Clarkson, since you've been gone.

There were some broken hearts among some of those.

There were some broken hearts among some of those.

In and possibly arms and legs and jaws from the sounds of things. We will put the article in the show notes you can have a better look.

In and possibly arms and legs and jaws from the sounds of things. We will put the article in the show notes you can have a better look.

This is my favorite thing you've ever brought to this glorious mess.

This is my favorite thing you've ever brought to this glorious mess.

I'm still sure you were an Ireland that night.

I'm still sure you were an Ireland that night.

I love karaoke, and I can actually feel the pain because I would have liked to have sung that song.

I love karaoke, and I can actually feel the pain because I would have liked to have sung that song.

And if there was only that song left to do and that one microphone.

And if there was only that song left to do and that one microphone.

You'd be on the ground.

You'd be on the ground.

Everyone would be.

Everyone would be.

Constance Hall is a best selling author, entrepreneur, and mother of seven.

Constance Hall is a best selling author, entrepreneur, and mother of seven.

I know she puts you to shame.

I know she puts you to shame.

Tel I probably got three. That's like not even half of what she's got. She's created a movement and community of women who call each other queens. I love that, embracing self acceptance and authentic living and an Alisa. You've got a chance to catch up with your little bestie, did you. I'm so excited to hear you had an intimate chat and I cut wait t hear it.

Tel I probably got three. That's like not even half of what she's got. She's created a movement and community of women who call each other queens. I love that, embracing self acceptance and authentic living and an Alisa. You've got a chance to catch up with your little bestie, did you. I'm so excited to hear you had an intimate chat and I cut wait t hear it.

So Constance Hall, or as I call you, just con welcome to this glorious mess. So a bit of background for those playing at home. We met in nineteen eighty nine, Yes, we are that old, and it was love at first sight? Was for me?

So Constance Hall, or as I call you, just con welcome to this glorious mess. So a bit of background for those playing at home. We met in nineteen eighty nine, Yes, we are that old, and it was love at first sight? Was for me?

Was it?

Was it?

Few?

Few?

Well, so what happens because you don't have a memory and.

Well, so what happens because you don't have a memory and.

You remember everything like an elephant, it's so incriminating.

You remember everything like an elephant, it's so incriminating.

So we're five years old.

So we're five years old.

It was the first day of primary school and missus Kerr, our teacher put us next to each other, and from that moment onwards we've just never been apart. I think your dad was perving on my mum at pickup.

It was the first day of primary school and missus Kerr, our teacher put us next to each other, and from that moment onwards we've just never been apart. I think your dad was perving on my mum at pickup.

Yeah, your mum was and is still very hot.

Yeah, your mum was and is still very hot.

Yeah, so your dad wasn't too bad either. So it's just been how many years? Is that eighty nine? That all five we met in eighty nine?

Yeah, so your dad wasn't too bad either. So it's just been how many years? Is that eighty nine? That all five we met in eighty nine?

Yeah, so that's like, what are you making me do maths on the spot. We're forty two this year?

Yeah, so that's like, what are you making me do maths on the spot. We're forty two this year?

Forty two okay, so thirty seven years oh god, yeah, and my memory is so full on that I'm like, hey, do you remember that thirty one years ago?

Forty two okay, so thirty seven years oh god, yeah, and my memory is so full on that I'm like, hey, do you remember that thirty one years ago?

When?

When?

But you know, you've got like adult step kids, you've got teenagers, you've got tween ages and a little one I've got tweens. I'm about to actually have a teenager.

But you know, you've got like adult step kids, you've got teenagers, you've got tween ages and a little one I've got tweens. I'm about to actually have a teenager.

Mm hmm.

Mm hmm.

It's so different.

It's so different.

Teenage boys are so different to teenage girls as well. They're just so much like less communication, you know, Like I find that anyway, and I think you'll find that with Freddy, just because of the nature of our kids.

Teenage boys are so different to teenage girls as well. They're just so much like less communication, you know, Like I find that anyway, and I think you'll find that with Freddy, just because of the nature of our kids.

Have you found like, as your kids are older and they're teenagers and with you sharing your life and them being in content, like, what do they think about it?

Have you found like, as your kids are older and they're teenagers and with you sharing your life and them being in content, like, what do they think about it?

So that's a good question because I think every child is really different. And this is sort of like a huge theme for me because did I tell you that I was into for that Chow Parntal guidance?

So that's a good question because I think every child is really different. And this is sort of like a huge theme for me because did I tell you that I was into for that Chow Parntal guidance?

Yes you did. You did, and you didn't make the cut and I'm sorry they didn't.

Yes you did. You did, and you didn't make the cut and I'm sorry they didn't.

Well, they were like me.

Well, they were like me.

They were like emailing me, calling me FaceTime, you know, like we want to I can't remember her words, but we want to like move you Usually wouldn't be approving people to weigh down, but we really keen to get you like sort of locked away.

They were like emailing me, calling me FaceTime, you know, like we want to I can't remember her words, but we want to like move you Usually wouldn't be approving people to weigh down, but we really keen to get you like sort of locked away.

And I was like, okay, like I haven't.

And I was like, okay, like I haven't.

Really thought about reality TV, but you know, if any reality TV shows are listening, I would probably do one again.

Really thought about reality TV, but you know, if any reality TV shows are listening, I would probably do one again.

I watch it and wouldn't you.

I watch it and wouldn't you.

But then so she interviewed us, and this is the interesting part. Everyone for reality TV show when it comes to parenting, wants to make you a caricature of the parent that you are. So if you're free range, then they want you to be the most free range, embarrassingly free range parent. Or if you're strict, they want you to be like a absolute militant. So it's like they don't really have that room for the in between, whereas me and Dens, you can't put us in a you know thing, because I said to her, every single one of our children is so different. So every single one of our kids needs different screen times, needs different boundaries, needs different everything, and we just sort of go with the flow and everything changed, and we don't have any set rules. And she was like, so your family doesn't have any set rules, and I was like, I couldn't think of one that applies to everyone.

But then so she interviewed us, and this is the interesting part. Everyone for reality TV show when it comes to parenting, wants to make you a caricature of the parent that you are. So if you're free range, then they want you to be the most free range, embarrassingly free range parent. Or if you're strict, they want you to be like a absolute militant. So it's like they don't really have that room for the in between, whereas me and Dens, you can't put us in a you know thing, because I said to her, every single one of our children is so different. So every single one of our kids needs different screen times, needs different boundaries, needs different everything, and we just sort of go with the flow and everything changed, and we don't have any set rules. And she was like, so your family doesn't have any set rules, and I was like, I couldn't think of one that applies to everyone.

That's just a consistent rule, do you know what I mean?

That's just a consistent rule, do you know what I mean?

Like, it was just I don't think that we could give her what she wanted. But I also think that she asked me at the end, she said, is there anything unfamily friendly about you guys? Or your past that might pop up, and I was like, I don't even know you. I'm not going to sit here and tell you the most like personal, like vulnerable moments of my life. They're all public knowledge. Do your research like whatever. So she obviously did a research and didn't call back.

Like, it was just I don't think that we could give her what she wanted. But I also think that she asked me at the end, she said, is there anything unfamily friendly about you guys? Or your past that might pop up, and I was like, I don't even know you. I'm not going to sit here and tell you the most like personal, like vulnerable moments of my life. They're all public knowledge. Do your research like whatever. So she obviously did a research and didn't call back.

But well, that's their loss. Wasn't meant to be because it was their lobody entertaining.

But well, that's their loss. Wasn't meant to be because it was their lobody entertaining.

I think we would have been great. And also like they did all these like challenges with the kids. So I watched a few episodes.

I think we would have been great. And also like they did all these like challenges with the kids. So I watched a few episodes.

You know me, I don't watch TV, and I watched a few episodes to see if we would have been good on it anyway, And they do all these challenges with the children. And how well your children do is you know how you get rated?

You know me, I don't watch TV, and I watched a few episodes to see if we would have been good on it anyway, And they do all these challenges with the children. And how well your children do is you know how you get rated?

Now?

Now?

One thing that you cannot say about me. You can call me a you can call me whatever you want to call me. But I have good kids. And my kids are so well versed because they've been in the public eye for how long, not just in the public eye though, like we haters do you.

One thing that you cannot say about me. You can call me a you can call me whatever you want to call me. But I have good kids. And my kids are so well versed because they've been in the public eye for how long, not just in the public eye though, like we haters do you.

Know what I mean?

Know what I mean?

And they've had to experience that, and so they have the one rule that we do have is the family code, Like we keep everything in house. Nobody you never you never dog on your little sibling or anything. It's just bring it back to me, do not tell anyone else. It's a funny one. We live in a bubble in a bubble, so we have everyone that really does know us. We'll give my kids so much love so they get this unbelievable like Aunties, you know, just going you are. I've followed you since you were a baby, and you're incredible. And Billy Butler, I was asking her recently about, you know what her childhood in the public eye has any effects that it's had, and she's like, Billy's such a no bullshit kids. She's like, oh my god, I'm so sick of these like new age kids that.

And they've had to experience that, and so they have the one rule that we do have is the family code, Like we keep everything in house. Nobody you never you never dog on your little sibling or anything. It's just bring it back to me, do not tell anyone else. It's a funny one. We live in a bubble in a bubble, so we have everyone that really does know us. We'll give my kids so much love so they get this unbelievable like Aunties, you know, just going you are. I've followed you since you were a baby, and you're incredible. And Billy Butler, I was asking her recently about, you know what her childhood in the public eye has any effects that it's had, and she's like, Billy's such a no bullshit kids. She's like, oh my god, I'm so sick of these like new age kids that.

All want trauma mum, because there is no way you could look at it.

All want trauma mum, because there is no way you could look at it.

With your blog and us being in the public eye, could it have ever been.

With your blog and us being in the public eye, could it have ever been.

A negative thing? Like we just get lots of love from a few people.

A negative thing? Like we just get lots of love from a few people.

Most people don't know who we are, and you know there's and there's some like horrible haters out there, but we wouldn't want to know them anyway.

Most people don't know who we are, and you know there's and there's some like horrible haters out there, but we wouldn't want to know them anyway.

Con you're a couple of steps ahead of me and the parenting game and one of the things that you're facing now teenagers. Billy Violet's fifteen, and I've always really admired your honesty and transparency and the way you navigate that tricky stuff like alcohol and sex. You shared a post with some advice that you got from a therapist years ago which really stood out to me. It said, a house full of screaming kids and fighting teenagers and a parent who's being thrown every question and request is a healthy one. To me. It's the silent children, the scared toddlers, the teenagers that don't come home, and the parents who aren't in communication with their children that I worry about. Can you speak to that idea where you want your kids to run to you as they get older, as opposed to run away.

Con you're a couple of steps ahead of me and the parenting game and one of the things that you're facing now teenagers. Billy Violet's fifteen, and I've always really admired your honesty and transparency and the way you navigate that tricky stuff like alcohol and sex. You shared a post with some advice that you got from a therapist years ago which really stood out to me. It said, a house full of screaming kids and fighting teenagers and a parent who's being thrown every question and request is a healthy one. To me. It's the silent children, the scared toddlers, the teenagers that don't come home, and the parents who aren't in communication with their children that I worry about. Can you speak to that idea where you want your kids to run to you as they get older, as opposed to run away.

It's so true.

It's so true.

And you know what, that same woman told me that when she meets a child and that child is flipping out and screaming and climbing the walls, she said, I'm just like, You'll be fine.

And you know what, that same woman told me that when she meets a child and that child is flipping out and screaming and climbing the walls, she said, I'm just like, You'll be fine.

She said.

She said.

It's the kid that's trying to disappear that you know, that is that you barely see in the room because they've become so good at disappearing. She said, they're the ones that you need to worry about because their trauma and their behavioral issues are all so far buried down, whereas the roomies that are screaming and having the big tantrums, theirs are on the surface. You can deal with them. You're right, they're still coming to you. That's isn't that just the most important thing?

It's the kid that's trying to disappear that you know, that is that you barely see in the room because they've become so good at disappearing. She said, they're the ones that you need to worry about because their trauma and their behavioral issues are all so far buried down, whereas the roomies that are screaming and having the big tantrums, theirs are on the surface. You can deal with them. You're right, they're still coming to you. That's isn't that just the most important thing?

Yeah?

Yeah?

Yeah, you.

Yeah, you.

Since I've known you for have we discovered was thirty seven years, you are the most resilient person I think I've ever met my life. Like even like people just probably know you know, obviously you've been heavily, heavily trolled online, but some of the things that have happened in your life that you've survived, that you've come through. One of the most beautiful things is that you just you don't care what other people don't think unless you care about the people. It's obviously your friends and your family. You care what we think. But if a stranger says something to you like you literally are like teflon, like it doesn't even like you just how like a lot of people would be struggling they feel that parent shame. There's so many like, oh, you've got to be a gentle parent. You've got to be a lighthouse parent, you've got to build emotional resilience coaching and all of the noise that we sort of get bombarded with and people feel bad, people get shaming comments and they don't have that teflon Like what would your advice be of how to move through it?

Since I've known you for have we discovered was thirty seven years, you are the most resilient person I think I've ever met my life. Like even like people just probably know you know, obviously you've been heavily, heavily trolled online, but some of the things that have happened in your life that you've survived, that you've come through. One of the most beautiful things is that you just you don't care what other people don't think unless you care about the people. It's obviously your friends and your family. You care what we think. But if a stranger says something to you like you literally are like teflon, like it doesn't even like you just how like a lot of people would be struggling they feel that parent shame. There's so many like, oh, you've got to be a gentle parent. You've got to be a lighthouse parent, you've got to build emotional resilience coaching and all of the noise that we sort of get bombarded with and people feel bad, people get shaming comments and they don't have that teflon Like what would your advice be of how to move through it?

Well, firstly, I think not caring what people think, but care a lot about how people feel. How you've made someone feel is the sort of key, you know what I mean? Like, I really do care about how it made people feel, and if I've made them feel excluded or crap about themselves, I'll stay awake until three and worried about that.

Well, firstly, I think not caring what people think, but care a lot about how people feel. How you've made someone feel is the sort of key, you know what I mean? Like, I really do care about how it made people feel, and if I've made them feel excluded or crap about themselves, I'll stay awake until three and worried about that.

Whereas what people think.

Whereas what people think.

The reason that I've had that I've learned to not care is because this isn't about me, Like, it's just not your.

The reason that I've had that I've learned to not care is because this isn't about me, Like, it's just not your.

Reaction to me. You know, there's that book It's not you.

Reaction to me. You know, there's that book It's not you.

Your mum's a narcissist and they teach you to put on the lab coat and just like observe people's in behave yea rather than engage with it. And I think that to me, if I write a post and someone comes at me about like a kid with a full nappy or about like whatever it is, I honestly don't think this is about me. If you were to say that to me, I would think it was about me, because you know me through and through. But I honestly, I've really learnt that everybody's opinion of you is just a reflection of something that's going on with them if they don't know you at all and they're just throwing out at you. But I also think it's got a lot to do with really dropping the ego and having to humble yourself. And when you have as many children as I do, you really need to do that because you literally going, can you hold my baby for a second, because I need to do, you know, And so you can't have that facade.

Your mum's a narcissist and they teach you to put on the lab coat and just like observe people's in behave yea rather than engage with it. And I think that to me, if I write a post and someone comes at me about like a kid with a full nappy or about like whatever it is, I honestly don't think this is about me. If you were to say that to me, I would think it was about me, because you know me through and through. But I honestly, I've really learnt that everybody's opinion of you is just a reflection of something that's going on with them if they don't know you at all and they're just throwing out at you. But I also think it's got a lot to do with really dropping the ego and having to humble yourself. And when you have as many children as I do, you really need to do that because you literally going, can you hold my baby for a second, because I need to do, you know, And so you can't have that facade.

Of I've got it all sorted out.

Of I've got it all sorted out.

And I think that's what the whole parenting classification thing does is it gives us a place to belong and to say to the rest of the world, I've got it all sorted out. You might not understand me, but I'm in this niche so you don't need to. And it keeps us sort of protected in some way. So when you break all that down and you realize how much everyone else is struggling and everyone knows that you're struggling.

And I think that's what the whole parenting classification thing does is it gives us a place to belong and to say to the rest of the world, I've got it all sorted out. You might not understand me, but I'm in this niche so you don't need to. And it keeps us sort of protected in some way. So when you break all that down and you realize how much everyone else is struggling and everyone knows that you're struggling.

And everyone's kind of really cheering you on.

And everyone's kind of really cheering you on.

At the end of the day, they want to see you do well, especially if you're open and vulnerable and honest about the fact that you're not half the time, then that's when you see the amount of people that turn around and go.

At the end of the day, they want to see you do well, especially if you're open and vulnerable and honest about the fact that you're not half the time, then that's when you see the amount of people that turn around and go.

Like, I want you to do well.

Like, I want you to do well.

You're doing so well, you're you know, they're becoming your cheerleaders, Whereas if you're facing the world with your front, people naturally get defensive and they kind of do like bring you down.

You're doing so well, you're you know, they're becoming your cheerleaders, Whereas if you're facing the world with your front, people naturally get defensive and they kind of do like bring you down.

So I get it.

So I get it.

It's been a combination of caring less about opinions that don't actually matter or mean anything, and finding a way to communicate with other women that has broken down those sort of judge barriers because I know that they're just a symptom, a patriarchal symptom that's actually not who women are. And yeah, so that's but I was also sort of blessed with this, you know mentality. I remember when me and you had a conversation someone was leaving her husband and you said, she doesn't want to, she's just scared. She wants to leave them, but she's worried about what her family and everything, And I was like, and this is her life, she's only living once, Like, who cares what her family thinks? And you said to me, con it's not like everyone doesn't think like you, Like you're lucky that you wouldn't care what your family.

It's been a combination of caring less about opinions that don't actually matter or mean anything, and finding a way to communicate with other women that has broken down those sort of judge barriers because I know that they're just a symptom, a patriarchal symptom that's actually not who women are. And yeah, so that's but I was also sort of blessed with this, you know mentality. I remember when me and you had a conversation someone was leaving her husband and you said, she doesn't want to, she's just scared. She wants to leave them, but she's worried about what her family and everything, And I was like, and this is her life, she's only living once, Like, who cares what her family thinks? And you said to me, con it's not like everyone doesn't think like you, Like you're lucky that you wouldn't care what your family.

Thought if you got divorced at to but like.

Thought if you got divorced at to but like.

She does and a lot of people would. And you just need to accept that. And it was a bit of an eye opener for me that, like, it's not wrong or better or worse, it's just that everybody is different, and being sensitive to what other people think of you is actually it can be a beautiful thing as long as it's not hurting you. And it's beautiful because you care about what they think, you know, it just shows that you have that humility.

She does and a lot of people would. And you just need to accept that. And it was a bit of an eye opener for me that, like, it's not wrong or better or worse, it's just that everybody is different, and being sensitive to what other people think of you is actually it can be a beautiful thing as long as it's not hurting you. And it's beautiful because you care about what they think, you know, it just shows that you have that humility.

So it's an interesting one. I can't full circle all the time. I don't have any real opinions.

So it's an interesting one. I can't full circle all the time. I don't have any real opinions.

I like the distinction when you said you don't care what other people think, but you care about how you made them feel, Like that's I think that's important.

I like the distinction when you said you don't care what other people think, but you care about how you made them feel, Like that's I think that's important.

And because I am that drain and that will send a message and then not get a message back, and then reread it four times and go oh, and then another one. I hope you didn't think that I meant by this, you know, I really do. But yeah, of course, isn't that like, isn't that what life's about?

And because I am that drain and that will send a message and then not get a message back, and then reread it four times and go oh, and then another one. I hope you didn't think that I meant by this, you know, I really do. But yeah, of course, isn't that like, isn't that what life's about?

So you have given so much beautiful advice. You've given brilliant advice to me, Like you know, especially at the end of my marriage, like I can't even I can't even talk about it without tearing up. I couldn't have got through it without you and the advice that you have given to millions of women. But I wanted to ask you what is the best piece of advice that you've ever been given and who gave it to you? I'm putting on this.

So you have given so much beautiful advice. You've given brilliant advice to me, Like you know, especially at the end of my marriage, like I can't even I can't even talk about it without tearing up. I couldn't have got through it without you and the advice that you have given to millions of women. But I wanted to ask you what is the best piece of advice that you've ever been given and who gave it to you? I'm putting on this.

You could have given me some time for this one, right. You know my Auntie Lisa. Everyone knows my Auntie Lisa, and you know Monte Lisa, but she always gives me fantastic advice. And I think as women, especially during divorce and during baby making years, during you know, when or when you're thinking about divorcing, as women, we have this fundamental fear of losing our security and that drives so many of our decisions, and they're not always great decisions. We make decisions to stay because we're scared or it always comes down to where am I going to live my basic needs? How am I going to meet my kids' basic needs? Even women who I know whose husbands and their network together is like ten million dollars, they will still be saying to me, I can't leave him because I'll be on the streets like this is just a thing that women have.

You could have given me some time for this one, right. You know my Auntie Lisa. Everyone knows my Auntie Lisa, and you know Monte Lisa, but she always gives me fantastic advice. And I think as women, especially during divorce and during baby making years, during you know, when or when you're thinking about divorcing, as women, we have this fundamental fear of losing our security and that drives so many of our decisions, and they're not always great decisions. We make decisions to stay because we're scared or it always comes down to where am I going to live my basic needs? How am I going to meet my kids' basic needs? Even women who I know whose husbands and their network together is like ten million dollars, they will still be saying to me, I can't leave him because I'll be on the streets like this is just a thing that women have.

And it is.

And it is.

And it's also like just a fear of the unknown, you know. I definitely remember thinking that, And now that I have been divorced and separated for years, I'm like, it's really actually not scary at all.

And it's also like just a fear of the unknown, you know. I definitely remember thinking that, And now that I have been divorced and separated for years, I'm like, it's really actually not scary at all.

You wish that you could go back and say to your younger self, it's going to be okay, because you're always okay. So I am constantly like, man, it's just me, like you are always okay. It has been so many times in your life where you've thought, no, this time, I'm not going to be okay. But voila, you are. But I remember Lisa said to me, she goes you. Women, women need to stop thinking of money as our security, because you know, for thousands of years it hasn't been, and this is where the fear comes from. And we need to remember she goes, your bank might go bankrupt tomorrow. Your house might burn down while the insurance company goes bankrupt. These things happen to people, and you will end up with nothing. And I was like, that's great. She goes, it could happen to anyone. There is nothing you can do to make sure that you will always be secure, because I was saying to her, I just want a house mortgage free. I just want you know what I mean, Like, I just want to got this. Then I'll stop. Then I'll stop.

You wish that you could go back and say to your younger self, it's going to be okay, because you're always okay. So I am constantly like, man, it's just me, like you are always okay. It has been so many times in your life where you've thought, no, this time, I'm not going to be okay. But voila, you are. But I remember Lisa said to me, she goes you. Women, women need to stop thinking of money as our security, because you know, for thousands of years it hasn't been, and this is where the fear comes from. And we need to remember she goes, your bank might go bankrupt tomorrow. Your house might burn down while the insurance company goes bankrupt. These things happen to people, and you will end up with nothing. And I was like, that's great. She goes, it could happen to anyone. There is nothing you can do to make sure that you will always be secure, because I was saying to her, I just want a house mortgage free. I just want you know what I mean, Like, I just want to got this. Then I'll stop. Then I'll stop.

She says me.

She says me.

The only security that you will ever have is me, is analys is the people that you are like fully connected with, because.

The only security that you will ever have is me, is analys is the people that you are like fully connected with, because.

You know that your mother, we will never let you not be okay.

You know that your mother, we will never let you not be okay.

And nothing could ever stop that, like nothing, no amount of you know of global disasters could stop us from doing that for you. And so I've always thought about that because I just thought, what a beautiful way of looking at life. You're the people that love and that love you are your security. And it's really difficult when you're marrying and you're divorcing and you're having babies, whatever you're doing in this bizarre sort of twenty year gap that we go through, it's really really hard to make the right decision. If you're constantly focused on your own security, it's like kind of keeps you in the potato picking kind of rolled, you know what I mean, Like you never get to dream bigger because you're always freaking out that well, no, I have to play the game because I've got to keep the roof over the head.

And nothing could ever stop that, like nothing, no amount of you know of global disasters could stop us from doing that for you. And so I've always thought about that because I just thought, what a beautiful way of looking at life. You're the people that love and that love you are your security. And it's really difficult when you're marrying and you're divorcing and you're having babies, whatever you're doing in this bizarre sort of twenty year gap that we go through, it's really really hard to make the right decision. If you're constantly focused on your own security, it's like kind of keeps you in the potato picking kind of rolled, you know what I mean, Like you never get to dream bigger because you're always freaking out that well, no, I have to play the game because I've got to keep the roof over the head.

So yeah, that's something that I am currently thinking about a lot.

So yeah, that's something that I am currently thinking about a lot.

One of the different perspectives I have now. When I think back to, like during my marriage or you know, getting engaged, it's almost this like tick box, like you've got to get engaged, you've got to buy a house, you've got to have a baby, you've got to get married, and it's you kind of tick along, and you almost you're so focused on ticking the boxes that you get swept up in it. And then when the boxes and everything c down, now I'm like, oh my god, none of that stuff matters. You don't need to be married. I'm very happily renting. You don't need a husband, like none of us. So true actually matters. There is no timeline, absolutely true.

One of the different perspectives I have now. When I think back to, like during my marriage or you know, getting engaged, it's almost this like tick box, like you've got to get engaged, you've got to buy a house, you've got to have a baby, you've got to get married, and it's you kind of tick along, and you almost you're so focused on ticking the boxes that you get swept up in it. And then when the boxes and everything c down, now I'm like, oh my god, none of that stuff matters. You don't need to be married. I'm very happily renting. You don't need a husband, like none of us. So true actually matters. There is no timeline, absolutely true.

And recently I was listening to an old song, you know, the.

And recently I was listening to an old song, you know, the.

Glory days songs like the early two Thousand's house music. I mean, every time I put that on my Instagram, every woman that's our age is just like, oh my god.

Glory days songs like the early two Thousand's house music. I mean, every time I put that on my Instagram, every woman that's our age is just like, oh my god.

The dangers.

The dangers.

And when I listen to music that I love, it ignites something in me, and it ignites some sort of dopamine. And I feel this like I sit to DNS. The only way I can describe it as magic, But it kind of reminds me of life before kids and before marriage and all this stuff, and it makes me wonder if this sort of powerful dopamine can come to me through music that makes me feel great, makes me feel like I could do anything. Is our entire life structured in a way that keeps that magic away from us so that we don't so that we believe we have to keep ticking those boxes, Because like, once you start feeling great no matter what, you don't need the shiny car and then anything. You could literally live in a van and be happy and feel connected and feel everything that you want. But we don't live a life that actually encourages any of that stuff. So I just part of me wonders how much of it's been done on purpose?

And when I listen to music that I love, it ignites something in me, and it ignites some sort of dopamine. And I feel this like I sit to DNS. The only way I can describe it as magic, But it kind of reminds me of life before kids and before marriage and all this stuff, and it makes me wonder if this sort of powerful dopamine can come to me through music that makes me feel great, makes me feel like I could do anything. Is our entire life structured in a way that keeps that magic away from us so that we don't so that we believe we have to keep ticking those boxes, Because like, once you start feeling great no matter what, you don't need the shiny car and then anything. You could literally live in a van and be happy and feel connected and feel everything that you want. But we don't live a life that actually encourages any of that stuff. So I just part of me wonders how much of it's been done on purpose?

Capitalism, Yeah, you're spending money on renovating and picking that's it.

Capitalism, Yeah, you're spending money on renovating and picking that's it.

Yes, Yes, so I think we should all go to a rave.

Yes, Yes, so I think we should all go to a rave.

I'm definitely coming to a ray with you. It's been far too long.

I'm definitely coming to a ray with you. It's been far too long.

Far too long. Oh my god, do you know what I mean?

Far too long. Oh my god, do you know what I mean?

We need to be bringing back that playfulness of our youth and doing things experiences that just make us feel great.

We need to be bringing back that playfulness of our youth and doing things experiences that just make us feel great.

Con you had something happen recently that could potentially scare women our age. Certainly would scare the crap out of me.

Con you had something happen recently that could potentially scare women our age. Certainly would scare the crap out of me.

Yeah, I had a pregnancy ski recently and I know, right, maybe like start taking the mini pill, which I've stopped taking because that was just gross.

Yeah, I had a pregnancy ski recently and I know, right, maybe like start taking the mini pill, which I've stopped taking because that was just gross.

No, it gave me weird periods, but anyway, that's a different story.

No, it gave me weird periods, but anyway, that's a different story.

But yeah, it really made me think about babies, and because I was like, billy, everyone, my kid's getting older makes me feel old. And I'll be honest, I do worry about getting old a lot.

But yeah, it really made me think about babies, and because I was like, billy, everyone, my kid's getting older makes me feel old. And I'll be honest, I do worry about getting old a lot.

Not on a superficial facial level or you.

Not on a superficial facial level or you.

Know, wrinkling neck level, but more just I love its life and I don't want it to be over and I don't want to be old. Like you make jokes all the time about your pension and chair that you took down to the beach, and I can't make those jaks because I have to find out what the young people are sitting on and sit on it because I am like, I have a phobia of getting old. And then I was like, no, I don't want another baby, like I'm obviously spread to thin and I think, you know when you're done when the idea of having another baby would take more away from your children, and then it would give them you know what I mean. Cause a lot of people want to give their kids a sibling, and I get that obviously I've done a million times.

Know, wrinkling neck level, but more just I love its life and I don't want it to be over and I don't want to be old. Like you make jokes all the time about your pension and chair that you took down to the beach, and I can't make those jaks because I have to find out what the young people are sitting on and sit on it because I am like, I have a phobia of getting old. And then I was like, no, I don't want another baby, like I'm obviously spread to thin and I think, you know when you're done when the idea of having another baby would take more away from your children, and then it would give them you know what I mean. Cause a lot of people want to give their kids a sibling, and I get that obviously I've done a million times.

But now it's like they've got enough siblings. They just need more mum, really need more mum time. So but yeah, the only.

But now it's like they've got enough siblings. They just need more mum, really need more mum time. So but yeah, the only.

Plus of having a baby that I thought of was it just makes you feel like like if you think about middle age, beginning of life, end of life, it just felt like it was dragging me back to the beginning of.

Plus of having a baby that I thought of was it just makes you feel like like if you think about middle age, beginning of life, end of life, it just felt like it was dragging me back to the beginning of.

Life a little bit more rather than pushing me. Do you know what I mean?

Life a little bit more rather than pushing me. Do you know what I mean?

No, with the amount of kids that you have, you're gonna be a grandma soon, don't worry.

No, with the amount of kids that you have, you're gonna be a grandma soon, don't worry.

I hope. So I really do well.

I hope. So I really do well.

Constance Hall, or as I call you, con thank you so much for coming on this glorious mess.

Constance Hall, or as I call you, con thank you so much for coming on this glorious mess.

Thank you for having me. I'm so proud of you, Analse. Everywhere I go, everyone says to me, you know, what's Analist doing because everyone thinks of me and you was stuck together, and I'm like, oh, you know, she's hosting a podcast, working at mom and Mia like, you're living the dream life. You're slaying it and you're slagh divorce, which is and now you've like, honestly, you're in a healthy relationship with the best mum. And I'm just so frigging if I was your mum right now, I could die happy. You've done such an amazing job.

Thank you for having me. I'm so proud of you, Analse. Everywhere I go, everyone says to me, you know, what's Analist doing because everyone thinks of me and you was stuck together, and I'm like, oh, you know, she's hosting a podcast, working at mom and Mia like, you're living the dream life. You're slaying it and you're slagh divorce, which is and now you've like, honestly, you're in a healthy relationship with the best mum. And I'm just so frigging if I was your mum right now, I could die happy. You've done such an amazing job.

Thank you.

Thank you.

I love you, and I love coming on your show. Can you have me on again?

I love you, and I love coming on your show. Can you have me on again?

Yes?

Yes?

I still can't get over that she's got seven children.

I still can't get over that she's got seven children.

I know, and I always tease you for having too many, and you've got three.

I know, and I always tease you for having too many, and you've got three.

Oh my gosh. Three, it's not oh my gosh. But I really loved it. Was it was great perspective because obviously her kids are quite older than mine, so it's great to hear what's what's going on at that stage of life. But I did love her advice in terms of, you know, just letting that judgment slide right off because you know I'm sensitive Sally over here, so yeah, and she's some nice advice.

Oh my gosh. Three, it's not oh my gosh. But I really loved it. Was it was great perspective because obviously her kids are quite older than mine, so it's great to hear what's what's going on at that stage of life. But I did love her advice in terms of, you know, just letting that judgment slide right off because you know I'm sensitive Sally over here, so yeah, and she's some nice advice.

She's probably the most resilient person I've ever met.

She's probably the most resilient person I've ever met.

Yeah, unoffendable. I love that. I'm in awe.

Yeah, unoffendable. I love that. I'm in awe.

My husband's like that, unoffendable, and I have a couple of friends and I'm like nothing bothers you like it doesn't teflon?

My husband's like that, unoffendable, and I have a couple of friends and I'm like nothing bothers you like it doesn't teflon?

Well, thank you so so much for listening to this glorious mess. We hope you enjoyed the episode, and we'd love it if you left us a rating or review. If you love the.

Well, thank you so so much for listening to this glorious mess. We hope you enjoyed the episode, and we'd love it if you left us a rating or review. If you love the.

Show, please keep sharing with us on the mum and mea family Facebook page and Muma mea family Instagram, or you can leave us a message.

Show, please keep sharing with us on the mum and mea family Facebook page and Muma mea family Instagram, or you can leave us a message.

All the details are in the show notes.

All the details are in the show notes.

This episode was produced by Tom Lyon, with audio production by Jacob Brown. Bye, see you next time.

This episode was produced by Tom Lyon, with audio production by Jacob Brown. Bye, see you next time.