The Therapy for Black Girls Podcast is a weekly conversation with Dr. Joy Harden Bradford, a licensed Psychologist in Atlanta, Georgia, about all things mental health, personal development, and all the small decisions we can make to become the best possible versions of ourselves.
In today's episode, we'll be digging into how you can create your own definition of a hot girl summer and how therapy might be able to help you in this process. For this conversation, I was joined by Moraya Seeger DeGeare, LMFT and we chatted about what it means to be having a hot girl summer, why it’s so important to embrace and cultivate joy in your life, why so many people feel threatened by things that bring Black women joy, and she shared some books for you to add to your hot girl summer reading list
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M h. Welcome to the Therapy for Black Girls Podcast, a weekly conversation about mental health, personal development, and all the small decisions we can make to become the best possible versions of ourselves. I'm your host, Dr Joy hard and Bradford, a licensed psychologist in Atlanta, Georgia. For more information or to find a therapist in your area, visit our website at Therapy for Black Girls dot com. While I hope you love listening to and learning from the podcast, it is not meant to be a substitute for relationship with a licensed mental health professional. Hey y'all, thanks so much for joining me for Session one sixteen of the Therapy for Black Girls Podcast. If you've been paying any attention this summer, then you've probably heard all of the excitement from another sister proclaiming that she's having a hot girl summer. It has become a rallying cry of swords for sisters to live their life to the fullest and to enjoy every minute of it. Every now and then, a moment like this becomes so palpable that it makes its way into our therapy office. And that's what we'll be digging into today. How you can create your own definition of a hot Girl Summer and how therapy might be able to help you in this process. For this conversation, I was joined by Maria Seeger Digear. Mariah is a licensed marriage and family therapist in both New York and Minnesota. She certified in emotionally focused therapy and is the co founder of BFF Therapy in Beacon, New York. Her work focuses on relationships and intimacy with a specialty and racial identity development, culturally mixed couples, and we are people of color. Mariah and I chatted about what it means to be having a Hot Girl summer, why it's so important to embrace and cultivate joy in your life, why so many people feel threatened by things that bring black women joy, and she shared some books for you to add to your Hot Girl Summer reading list. If you hear anything that resonates with you during our conversation, please share it with us on social media using the hashtag tv G in Session. Here's our conversation. Thank you so much for joining us today, Mariah, Thank you for having me, Dr Joy. I'm just a huge fan and I'm so excited to just be a part of this I mean, it's a whole movement you've created. Thank you, Thank you. Am very excited for you to be with us today as well. So we will be chatting today all about the Hot Girl Summer. So this feels like a movement again, a movement, a song, just like this whole thing that has been created primarily around mega styllion. So she talks about it in her songs, and it just feels like it is just this online thing now that has kind of taken over particularly black women, right, Like just this excitement around living your best life because there's been some confusion around what does it mean and who can have a hot girl summer and all of this stuff. Right. So, actually a few days ago, came up with her own definition and she said, being a hot girl is about being unapologetically you, having fun, being confident, living your truth, being the life of the party, etcetera. So really just living your best life and kind of just doing you know, Hoole's board. And so I was excited for you to come on the podcast to talk about this because you mentioned that this has kind of been a theme in your therapy sessions, right, that women have brought this up and like talking about living their hot girl summer. So I'm curious to hear from you. What are some of the general themes that you think people are talking about when they talk about having a hot girl summer. Yes, so this has been coming up atually a lot. And I see a lot of people of color in my practice, and I see a lot of queer people of color my practice. You know, this comes up. I would say almost half my clients have casually said this in session. It is summer, so confident going into that party, owning yourself, you know, as simple as what you're wearing to that thing. But also there's a really deep work I think that a lot of people are doing. And then you know, hot girl Summer hashtag has given us this permission, slip to talk about it in a much more everyday way than the way we normally talk about and as therapists like in therapy. So it's giving people just this everyday language for confidence. And so I mean I've had clients attached it to coming out to Yeah, and it's been magical in terms of you know, I'm having my hot girl summer and they're going into the party and they're bringing their partner with them and they're really embracing this is about showing up completely unapologied adically. You know, I've had a client say, you know, I had a hot girl somewhere, when they're like, yes, I went in and I asked for that raise at work. So knowing your worth and getting paid for it, demanding time and energy even with family members, and doing some healing work. You know, we're going to get into that more around that, and just really truly having your permission slip to own who you are and not trying to fit yourself into a certain box. And I love how you're talking about it as this thing that kind of has given people permission. It feels reminiscent of when Black Girl Magic kind of hit the scene, right this whole absolutely you know moving that was started by Kashaun Thompson about you know, just kind of black women kind of showing up in everyday magic and that so many of the things that we do are magical even when no one knows what's going on behind the scenes. And so to hear it being talked about, is this kind of permission slip. So I want to dig into that a little bit more to kind of hear what you think about this really has given people permission to do some this work. Yeah, So I mean, you know, I'm a little biased because I'm also like, these are people I'm talking to are already doing the work. But I'm absolutely not in the city over the weekend in Brooklyn with my friends who are dancing on the street, you know, and just and having a full Hot Girl Summer. So I think there's this aspect of our internal dialogue. Right, so we have negative self talk, but I think this is really flipping it on the head. So our negative self talk says, don't wear that to the party. Don't you know have these emotions. They're too big, your hair is too big, you're too fat, We're you know, just bringing ourselves down. Hot Girl Summer is giving us, you know, we say permission slip, but it's giving us that sort of internal girlfriend that says you are a badass, you are amazing. You absolutely get to own and carve out this space. And I think a lot of people were so good. You know, we're ingrained and we could talk about you know, society is set up that way in the political aspect of it. But it's this ra a full self acceptance that I get to take up space. I don't have to move out of the way to make someone else more comfortable. That's a great point, Maria, I think, because you know, when we're thinking about like negative self talk, but then this being like if you can't harness that for yourself, so if you're not able to kind of turn off your own negative self talk, then using this as a replacement, right as a positive is flipping that on it tail, like you said, as a positive reframe for them, message like I don't have to give into this, these negative messages that I'm giving myself. I can borrow on this to to kind of you know, cultivate some excitement and some fun and some you know, showing up as fully who I am in the world. Yes, exactly, Yes, it's giving us a reframe in a wrap song, in a you know, a Twitter handle that you know is upping the you know version of a let me be confident. It's like, I think a lot of us didn't have that model as a kid, So just saying be confident, you know who you are. It's like I need something that's tangible and much more accessible to me to know what that actually looks like. And I also love that it is really like it's not prescriptive at all, right, Like everybody everybody is kind of using it for whatever they wanted to mean, right, And so it's kind of like everybody can have their own interpretation of what a hot girl summer looks like. But it does feel like a lot of it kind of comes back to the competence fees. Yes, absolutely, and I think that's a great part for some people. Right you needed a hype song and we all need that in the summer. And for some people it's okay, do I have a lot more work to do around my confidence? And do I have a whole healing journey that you know, this is a catalyst of that. This was the push of what's going to be my journey to start therapy, what's going to be my journey to you know, be confident? And this is that push that like shoves you out the door, shoves you, you know, into the interview, or makes it so that you know, I love some of the things that people are saying, but like texting your crush or you know, just being being honest around who you are. And this is starting that journey. And I think for some people it takes a long time or maybe before you're really at your place with that, because there's a long place between thinking I want to do this and really having the confidence to walk out in the bikini. So you mention, Mariah, you know some people like maybe didn't have confidence developed when they were younger, and so now this is kind of helping them to do some of that work. But what does that work look like? Like you mentioned like it's easy for us to say, like, just go and be confident, but what does that even look like? Like how do you develop confidence if it's something that you're struggling with, So if we really want to look at it, you know, I'm talking about from this really therapeutic lens, but there's a lot of things people are doing in therapy that you can be really carrying into your every day And so one tool that I think is great when I was talking with another therapist about it this morning, is think about a moment that you feel confident. So, you know, here's a moment, Oh, I feel really confident when I wear this, or when I'm in this kind of meeting, or I get to present this, or when I'm you know, taking care of my kid at the park, and I'm like, yes, I can keep up with them. Okay, so in that moment, what are you thinking to yourself and what are you doing right? And so really harnessing and breaking this down of when I feel confident, even if I only have thirty seconds in a week that you feel confident, what are you doing in that moment? Are there actual words you get attached to that? So when I feel confident, I'm looking in the mirror before I leave the house because you know, my eyebrows right, like, my eyebrows look amazing. I feel confident. And so take that and now let's really slowed down in that and say, okay, my eyebrows look really good. I'm going to sit in that for thirty seconds. I'm going to write that on the post it that I need to have on the back of my phone. When the more classic sents right, lipstick on your mirror. And so I can take in a moment that's authentic to me and carry it into situation that really is kind of scary maybe, And that's one like a tool a lot of clients do you know, And there's a lot of other therapy practices around them, but a really simple thing to harness you have this confident you and you even if it feels really small and tucked away. So it's really looking at where are these transferable skills? Right? So you may not feel confident all the time, but what are those moments of situations where you do find yourself confident and how can you take some of that and move it to a place where you feel less confident? Yes, you know, sometimes it's so humbling and great or just feels more connected to remind yourself. Every single one of us as human beings are insecure. You know. We all have moments that that insecurity shows up. And so it's a universal feeling. So as much as that person might be coming in to the party or this conversation with you that they want to have and you're feeling it like at some point, even the most competent versions of people have these insecurities. I mean, I don't know if you read Michelle Obama's book, right, Like, this is a woman that you know is her life to me is hot girl summer like her in the sense she is just so inspiring. But you read her book and you see all these moments of her questioning herself. But from the outside she has it all together. Mm hmmm. Yeah, and I think that there's something important to kind of dig into also, Maria, this idea of how do you manage maybe presenting confident on the outside but really feeling like you're falling apart inside. And when we look at if we stay with this hot girl summer, right, it's about being on apologetic. So I think there's an aspect of presenting confidence being unapologetic. Of you can be insecure, but the confidence really is in who you are, not in fitting in wearing the perfect clothing or saying the really cool hip thing. And in some ways it feels kind of circular, right, Like the more you put yourself out there and other people maybe perceive you as confident, then you get that feedback dead, Okay, this is an okay way to show up in the world. And so then you continue to behave in those ways, and that's a healing in itself. Right. The more you present in this way, these thoughts and emotions that you thought were so rigid and attached to you are gonna start melting away. Right. You think of yourself as, Oh, I'm not that cool or I'm not that sexy, and then you present yourself in this sexy way and you walk in with confidence, and more people are gravitating towards your energy because you've shifted that that is going to battle that negative self talk that says, you know, don't wear those your thighs are too big, and so it absolutely the more you're able to risk and take, you know, deep scary moments of fear, the more you're able to step through that, the more you can let go of some of this nonsense that we carry with us from childhood. So I want to touch on this whole idea around being unapologetic that you've mentioned, Mariah, and I think even before the Hot Girl Summer, you know, we heard people talking about being unapologetically black and unapologetically this and all of these things, right, being unapologetic just because of who I am. But I also think that that comes up against this world that does not necessarily feel kind and helpful and inviting, especially to black women who show up as all of who they are. Yes, And so I actually have a direct quote that I wrote down that I have permission to share, and because I put on my personal ense of like, let me hear what Hot Girl Summer is to you, and someone who I would say embodies this in every essence of the word. They were talking about how seeing this hot Girl Summer as you know, society can you know, and men so can really see as women being a little bit too free right, and it actually can be quite threatening to people. And so this person is talking about she's now he felt more connected with her identity as a woman of color, especially when she this is her quote, some queer ass leaning individuals who really you know, fan her flame and fire her up. Because this idea, you know, that we get to own our sexuality and we get to own our sexiness and show up in a room and flirt with who you want to flirt with, you know, and talk about sex in public is very threatening to a lot of people, and people really want to push it down. So it it is a very radical act and a political act to actually own this hashtag wow. So that that really brings this connection for me, Mariah, because I do feel like as much excitement as I have seen around the Hot Girl Summer, of course, I've also seen this backlash. And it feels like anytime black women get really excited about something right like hot Grow Summer, anything that Beyonce does you know anything, it feels like that black women really really get excited about people want to try to devalue it. So, oh, well what does this mean? And you know, like do you want to hot girl somewhere or do you want you know, as if it has to be an exclusive kind of thing, like you can't have a hot girl snummer and also be doing whatever else. So so that quote that you just share really kind of brought that to mind. That it feels like people feel very threatened by anything that really brings black women joy. Yes, and right, like you follow their rules and were hated and then you we do what we want and we're even more vilified because misogyny is so real. Because I can't handle you having for your space in this world. There's so much history, right, So we have racism working against us, we have sexism working against us, and really because misogyny so real, man in many ways, like we don't want to like I feel like me saying this out loud, someone's going to come from me, right like, man, in so many ways, like truly like don't want us to embrace all that we are, you know in society, like we can just put it on society. Hockrow Summer is really shifting that culture because if you show up with the extra lashes or you did your hair differently, people just want to maybe now add a different label that's not you, So like you're gonna get called a home possibly you have the confidence to potentially reject someone. You have the confidence to say, this is who I am, but I'm not doing it for your eyes. I'm doing this because I'm loving my body and I'm loving my skin. M h. Yeah. And I also think another point of it that I really love is just the confidence in the hypness that you get from your other sisters when you like embrace this right um, you know, and some of course because not everybody is, you know, on the same page, but it just feels like there is a like, yes, girl, yes do you this siwhere kind of thing happening that I think only further so for this idea that like it is okay to show up as who you are and then be embraced by the community. Absolutely has this been coming up for you like in your communities. It hasn't been coming up necessarily in my sessions, but definitely in like the therapy for black girls, like social media communities, right yeah, yeah, So I mean lots of conversations about what this looks like in people sharing tips. I mean, but I feel like we were doing a lot of this even before like the high Girl Summer hashtag became invented, because I think that there is really a surge of sisters really wanting to kind of reclaim this freeness and to space and to enjoy themselves in every area of their lives, and so sharing tips with one another, and this is what worked for me, and this is what you might want to do, and you know, really providing each other with support and encouragement to kind of live the lives that they want to live. Yes, absolutely, So I want to hear from you, Mariah, because I know that you also do a lot of couples work, and so I think that this just thing right because I think in some ways it feels like a hot girl suwhere is really only like for single girls, right, Like that is only um one set of the community who could participate in that. But I don't think that that's true. So what what might look like to have a hot girl suwhere if you are in a relationship? Yes, so I am certifying emotionally focused therapy. I see a lot of couples um. And so this is coming up just as much as couples. So if you're in a relationship, one of the biggest things where I think people can't translate this to I'm you know, in a relationship, I can't have a hot girl summer. Where they can't translate is are you looking at how secure your relationship is? Because a secure relationship can handle anything you want to wear to that party, can handle you showing up and showing out and owning your space in your time because you're not making space that's bigger than your partner because even when you're at the party or heck, you can jump on a private jeb I don't care, you know what I mean, Like you can go to Paris and have a hot girl somewhere and your partner might be busy back, you know, in New York. And so are you connected with that person? Are you thinking about that person's are the decisions you're making actively in the moment still being respectful to them? And by respect it doesn't necessarily mean, you know, at least in our western ized culture, covering up. It doesn't necessarily mean smaller. So it's keeping them in mind. And if you have a secure, connected healthy relationship. Your partner can know I trust you like you're good, you know what I mean, Like you can take the extra boomerang at the beach where you look amazing, because I know, like you're coming home to me. And so when I talk about this with couples, were really doing the work around what is threatening about this, what is scary to you? And then you can do that work and still be able to tell and this is vulnerability and intimacy and tell your partner this is what scares me about it. I'm afraid you're confidence this enemy so big that you're gonna, you know, outcrowing, or you're gonna think I'm not enough for you. Because now everyone's giving you this energy. And so when we're really embracing hot Girl summer, you are shifting your energy actively. But that doesn't have to be energy that says I'm open to everyone in a sexual way. It can be I'm harnessing my sexuality, I'm harnessing who I am. But that doesn't mean you get to come and slide into my d M with love to do all these things. Then I think that's a great point where I are right just because people are having fun and like excited and all of these things. That doesn't mean that there aren't boundaries, right, So I hope that people are not taking this as like a permission slip in the wrong way in terms of like, okay, now people are excited and maybe they're you know, their legs out more or whatever. That that means that it's okay across boundaries of touching people are acting inappropriately with people, because that is not what we're talking about, correct boundarides. I talked about boundaries all day, yes, exactly, And and be willing to have that conversation with your partner around what are boundaries? What are the commitments. You don't need to be married to have commitments around what your relationship stands on. You can make those commitments, you know, as soon as you guys know that you want to be in a relationship together. I think one of the things, or the most important thing that I am taking from this whole Hot Girl Somewhere is that it just feels like people are joyful. It feels like this has given people some excitement. Even though you know there's so much depressing news, so many awful things happening, it feels like the Hot Girl Somewhere has really given people something to be joyful and excited about. And so what are your ideas about how people can cultivate joy in their lives even when awful things are happening? And why is that even important? Yes, it's vital. I mean with everything going on right now, we are, honestly like, as soon as you step out of your space under constant attack, either it's the news or the social media, and there's you know, we have kids in cages in our country in two thousand nineteen. It's constant and so cultivating joy, I think the first thing to do, all of us need to do is meditate every morning and doing a nice guided meditation and coming back and bringing that energy back into you and so that people aren't taking little pieces we talk about like hashtag stealing, you know, stealing our joy. You know, you're taking my joy. People are taking these little pieces of energy. I like to do a guided meditation with my clients where I walk them through their body and we move a ball of light through your body. And then also joy can be you know, Okay, so what brings you joy? So I brought a new you know plant into my office today. Is it? You know? Is it a bath bomb, is it a new body spray? Is it fresh sheets on your bed before you go to bed? Like, I mean that brings me a lot of joy um and so simple simple things. These don't have to be huge things that you're doing every single day to remind you that you have value and you have work. And I think it's important you know that you share some things that don't even cost any money, right Like you know, fresh sheets, are finally getting that laundry folded, or you know something that just gives you space to kind of feel joy even for a moment. Absolutely, yes, I joy. I think is such an everyday purposeful practice to find joy that it actually I don't want to say shouldn't, but like really isn't about a big I feel like we're going into like a self care conversation, right, Like, it's not. It's not really about like a big spot a. It's about these little tangible things that you're doing that you're doing just because they make you smile. But it also might be you know that new track that dropped in terms of music and playing it really loudly in your car in the way to work, Like it might be something like that too. That's a very obvious shifting energy. Yes, I like that. I like that. I think people also, um, you know, and people to be talking about this probably all the time on the podcast or in our three for Thursday chats. Gratitude journaling I think can be really with this too, because it's very easy. I think, especially given everything you know, connected to social media and watching the news and all of this stuff, it's really easy to kind of get so focused on that that you feel like that's the only thing that's happening. But can you pay attention to even the small beautiful things in your everyday life that can kind of keep you connected to feeling grateful. And then there are moments of joy. So you see this beautiful, you know, bush of flowers on your way to work, or you notice a cute kid on the train in the morning, you know, something like that that can really help you to kind of realize like, Okay, these things may be going on, but there's also these other things happening in life. And I love gratitude general. I've had claims, you know, because we're always on our phones, actually snap a picture of the thing like the bush of flowers, take a picture, and then have a album in your phone of moments that brought you draw so at the end of the week you can flip or like not or it's a really rough day, and you flip through that album and you're like, my favorite one was when they're like the view out my window and that sunrise and I'm like, what have you taking a picture of it? Do you have it with you when you know you're thinking of doing doing something that's a little more toxic, And they go and they open and they look at that sunrise, you know, and it's those are moments where it's just like there is joy around you, you're witnessing it, but can you make it so that you can hold onto it like days that are harder? Right? Right? I think that is important. I had not heard about the picture album, but I think that that would be great, right because then you have memories of these instances in life where it feels, you know, like joy was happening, yeah, which is different than you know. And as much as I love social media, you know, this is why you and I are connected, which I'm so grateful for. It's a photo album in your phone. We're not doing it for the viewing and consumption of someone else. It's just for you, and that's really the important part, you know, whether it's journaling and all this stuff. We are in a time in life right now where we do so much for other people's consumption and we need to just have more moments in our day where I'm doing it just because I need this for me. Oh No, I think that that's an important point where I and I'm wondering how even the Hot Girls Summer is connected to me because it is very much a viral kind of social media thing. But I think that there is a way that people are also making it very personal, that it's not about just sharing it on social media. Yes, and I think that's when we come back to your I mean, personally, it could just be between you and your therapist, right between you and your partner. But also like the tribe, you know, you know, dr you created this beautiful tribe for us, but in bringing that into your everyday tribe and circle of people that I don't need to put this on blast out there in the world. But just having my girlfriend say you know, hey, I know you're working on this, thank you for talking to me about that. That inspired me. And then you look, my girlfriend this morning personally more texted me have a blast today, you know, I have a busy day. I'm squeezing you into my day, and she's like, I have so much fun, because yes, this is what you want to be doing, right, And that's you know, when we're connection is really the base to so much of this, and so doing in a personal, real connecting way is a piece of the Hot Girl Summer doesn't need to be any bigger than that, right, Right, So I think Marian, probably there are some people who may be listening who won maybe didn't even know what hot Girl Summer was, like what is this thing? But but also some people who maybe feel like, what if I just want like a lukewarm kind of medium kind of of a summer. Right, what are some suggestions that you might have for people who are wanting to, you know, maybe start doing more this kind of being more unapologetic, taking up more space, but don't feel like they're all the way there yet, Like how can they kind of dop their toe? Yes, it's like a little dip their toe. And I would circle back to like, what's that thing you keep thinking about? You know? And so you don't have to do the big show up feeling like you're supposed to have a keyto a camera crew with you. But what is that thing that every morning when you wake up and you're like, oh, I wish I did that, you know. And that might be ordering that book that you've been looking at. That might be getting your nails done. You know. It could be just sort of a simple thing. But I think I could confidently say every one of us has a little thing that we have been putting off. And most of the time, you know, especially as black women, we are putting everyone above us, you know, before ourselves. If we make the list. We're such caretakers and we don't even you know, maybe you're nine or ten on the list. And so it could be A hot girl summer could be as simply as prioritizing yourself in one small choice in your day, um and choosing you know, I know I have twenty things to do for other people, but let me choose something for myself. And it can be that simple. And it doesn't have to be, you know, the big hair, and it doesn't have to be the tiny outfit at the beach, and it could just be I'm choosing my self right now for five minutes. Yeah, so really going back to that permission slip, like just permission for you to embrace your desires, whatever those desires are, like you mentioned m exactly. So I always think it's really cool, um or I how this stuff enters the therapy room, right Like, this feels like this moment was meant for me because I'm all about like pop culture and psychology and how those things intersect. But but I also think that there is something really important about being able to adopt the language and really be dialed into the experiences of our clients. So what you think is the importance of of therapists being able to kind of connect to cultural moments like this, Yes, I mean so for me, like my clients are choosing me because I'm very much unapologetic as a therapist as is, right Like, so I'm gonna be upfront and forward. And you know one of my clients the other day who said to me, like my doing therapy or you it's like therapy on warp speed because I'm just honest. And so there's a part of all this that it just feels so true to the work I've always been doing and for therapists though language and for all of us a language. If we don't have language for something, how can we have that experience? Because really us documenting, even just verbally documenting experience, we need language. And so therapist, I think it's vital that you're staying current with language. Now. I don't think every therapist needs to be on social media if it's not authentic and real for you. But staying currently having the current language with your clients, you're going to be able to go so much deeper and further because we all want to be understood, we all want to be validated. And if you know what I'm talking about, you're going to be able to join with me right and really be in this moment and experience with me. And so I don't feel bad when I don't know a certain thing that if I'm talking about because we can't keep up on all of it. But joining in the moment, you know, it's really kind of the base of therapy. And so I think therapists you need to do this work. And when there's a big thing going on that's about being body positive and about you know, having self care and choosing yourself, therapists need to be up on this. M got you, got you? So what are some of your favorite books? Mariah, Like, if you could build us a Hot Girl somewhere reading Liz, what kinds of thing, what kinds of things would you put on it? I have a book club starting up here for queer people of color authors, and so I have like my book is high and narrowed it down. I think I'm reading for the second time and listening on the audio book A Lan's book more than enough embodies everything that is Hot Girl Summer because she has so many moments in her book where she was persistent and going after what she wanted, you know, from making vision boards essentially to just sort of breaking the rules a little bit, and you know, asking for a race. You know, that's a piece that I was just talking about a client. So a lot of my clients are reading that right now. I definitely would say the book Woman of Color is a great book that came out this spring. I love Heart Talk by Cleo Wade doing some poetry is absolutely wonderful. And then Rene's Brown's work and all of her books are so much about shame, so because she's a shame researcher, So I would say Braving the Wilderness would be a really good choice, because that's really us getting past these moments of shame that say I'm not, I can't, I'm less than And so any book around shame would be vital and in the in this library and I'm literally looking at the bookshelf in my therapy off. Okay, can you give me an author for the woman of color bo Yes, it's let's Hanya, your vet and she is a blogger here in Brooklyn and it's about women and fashion and motherhood and really owning your space and healing. Perfect And where can people find you, Mariah? What's your website and any social media handles you want to hear? Yes, so easy. We are BFF Therapy on absolutely everything, and so our website is BF Therapy Everything. You can find us there. And then I'm licensed in New York and Minnesota, so I see a lot of clients online as well as in our office and Beacon, New York, which is in the Hudson Valley. Perfect. Well, we will definitely include all that information in the show notes. Thank you so much for squeezing me into your schedule, where I am so excited and excited to hear you know how people will even embrace this episode and talk about what their own hot girl summer is looking like for them. Yes, I love it. Thank you, You're welcome. I'm so thankful Mariah was able to share with us today and I hope you enjoyed our conversation as well. To learn more about Mariah or to grab the books that she shared on her reading list, visit the show notes at Therapy for Black Girls dot Com slash Session one sixteen. If you love this conversation, go ahead and text two of your friends and tell them to listen, and be sure to share your takeaways with us in your I G Stories or on Twitter using the hashtag TBG in session. If you're searching for a therapist in your area, check out our directory at Therapy for Black Girls dot com slash directory. And if you want to continue this conversation with other sisters who listen to the podcast, come on over and join us in the thrive Tribe, which is the Facebook group for our podcast. You can request to join at Therapy for Black Girls dot com slash Tribe and be sure to answer the three questions that are asked to gain injury, and don't forget to visit our online store at their Prey for Black girls dot com slash shop, where you can find our guided affirmation track, break up journal, and your favorite therapy for Black Girls T shirts and mugs. Thank you all so much for joining me again this week. I look forward to continue in this conversation with you all real soon. Take good care,