Earlier this week, I got the chance to chat with Crissle of The Read as we discussed her journey to graduating with her Master’s degree in Mental Health Counseling. As a special bonus, we also sat down to answer some of your listener letters from The Read, as well as a few inquiries that were sent in by the TBG community. We touched on topics such as feeling like you’re behind in your career, setting boundaries with abusive parents, sharing a therapist with your friends, and more.
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The Therapy for Black Girls Podcast is a weekly conversation with Dr. Joy Harden Bradford, a licensed Psychologist in Atlanta, Georgia, about all things mental health, personal development, and all the small decisions we can make to become the best possible versions of ourselves.
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Welcome to the Therapy for Black Girls podcast, a weekly conversation about mental health, personal development, and all the small decisions we can make to become the best possible versions of ourselves. I'm your host, doctor Joy hard and Bradford, a licensed psychologist in Atlanta, Georgia. For more information or to find a therapist in your area, visit our website at Therapy for Blackgirls dot com. While I hope you love listening to and learning from the podcast, it is not meant to be a substitute for a relationship with a licensed mental health professional. Hey, y'all, thanks so much for joining me for the special bonus episode of the thing Therapy for Black Girls podcasts. We'll get right into our conversation after a word from our sponsors. This July, Therapy for Black Girls is bringing our yearly Minority Mental Health Month celebration in person to Atlanta, Georgia. Join us Thursday July eighteenth and Friday July nineteenth as we shine a light on mental health professionals and all those who dedicated their careers to holding space for others. Our inaugural Holding Space for Healers Therapists Summit will gather some of our favorite voices in the field for workshops, seminars, and opportunities to connect. You don't want to miss this, so secure your ticket to wellness by visiting Therapy for Blackgirls dot com slash Healers. Earlier this week, I got the chance to chat with the one and only Krystal of the Read as we discussed her journey to graduating with her master's degree in mental health counseling. As a special bonus, we also sat down to answer some of your listener letters from the read as well as a few questions that were sent in by members of the TVG community. We touched on topics such as feeling like you're behind in your career, setting boundaries with abusive parents, sharing a therapist with your friends, and more. If something resonates with you while enjoying our conversation, please share with us on social media using the hashtag TVG in Session or join us over in the sister Circle to talk more about the episode. You can join us at community dot Therapy for Blackgirls dot Com. Here's our conversation. So I'm super excited because we are reconvening for another listener letter option. So it was such a thrill to join you in Kidfiury on the read years ago to answer some listener questions, and so I feel like we have a bit of a crossover with some questions that the Therapy for Black Girls community has shared, but also a couple of listener letters from the read that we will share an answer together. So Chris, you will start with a letter from you all?
Okay, I sure will. This one comes from Fiona, who says, I'm a thirty three year old mom who has recently been diagnosed with ADHD after starting therapy. In order to not repeat the bs my parents did to me with my own son eight years ago, I broke up with my son's father after finding out I was pregnant and moved back home. That was when I discovered that my father was homeless. To help him out, I signed a lease for an apartment for him. My dad is a stubborn Caribbean man who doesn't take care of himself and ignores his diabetes. One day, he stepped on a nail, refused to get treatment, and long story short, ultimately lost his leg. Since he is my dad and I didn't have a partner at the time, I bought a house and put my dad's name on it, thinking it would help him since rent was going up and his pension was not enough to sustain him. But now four years later, him just breathing gets on my nerves. When he gets mad, he cusses me out and says that I'm a bad daughter. He'll cuss me out for literally anything like buying a brand of coffee he doesn't like, or accidentally playing the wrong lotto numbers for him. I bought a dog to give my dad something to do, but he's still cussing me out in front of my child. He's probably bored, but I cannot entertain him. I work a nine to five and I have a six year old who also most likely has ADHD. I ask my family on my mom's side, and they all say I should just ignore him, that he's losing his mind, and not to take it personally. My parents divorced when I was thirteen, so that side of the family really does not care what happens to him. My parents neglected me and didn't really have time for me. As a kid, I was alone a lot and learned to find joy in silence and solitude. Now, after all this disrespect and stress from my dad, I just want him out of my house, but he has no means to live on his own. Any advice you can offer is more than appreciated. Thanks again, Fiona. Oo.
Wow, there's a lot going on here, isn't there? Yeah? Hm, So I think I would start by it feels like there is some self compassion likely needed here for Fiona, because it sounds like she was trying to make the best decisions she could to try to help and take care of dead. But it also sounds like she has some regrets now, like her saying, oh, him just breathing gets on my nerves And anytime I hear that, that is like an instant sign that like, boundaries have been crossed and you have not maybe done a good enough job setting clear boundaries for yourself. So I think it's important for her to forgive herself and to be kind to herself, that maybe she did some things to try to help and now she's realizing this is actually no longer working for me, and so she doesn't need to be super critical over herself and trying to figure out, Okay, how do I get out of this maybe, or how do things look different than maybe what I was thinking they would look like?
One of the things that came up a lot in my program was this emphasis on cultural sensitivity cultural awareness, understanding that the United States is a very western, independent and sort of society, whereas a lot of other cultures are more collectivists. And so I want to be respectful of the fact that you all are a Caribbean and maybe in your culture you don't just leave your dad on the side of the road, but that would I also struggle. I struggle with this, doctor Joy when people say my parents abused and neglected me as a child, and now as an adult, I don't know what to do. I'm like, abuse and neglect them right back?
What do you mean?
Like, I really struggle with that as somebody who has you know, I have cut my dad off. I do not speak to him. So if he had nowhere to live, he would just have nowhere to live. You don't get to cuss me out in my home. That's how I feel about it. But then I'm like, oh, well, maybe that's my americanness coming out. I don't care what happens to my parents, and so in this question, that's what it brings up for me, and I guess that's maybe sort of what I would want to ask you about is like, where do you think the line is between advocating for yourself, having boundaries and respecting cultural differences, Because I feel like sometimes the culture is wrong. Sometimes our cultures have attitudes that are harmful.
Absolutely, yeah, that's what I was going to say, Like, I definitely feel like there's a difference between knowing where it comes from and being okay to continue perpetuating it. Right, So we can understand that culturally there is this expectation, but how far are we going to go in the interest of protecting our own mental health, setting our own selves up for failure, continuing in relationships where we are not affirmed and validated in all of these things. And so I definitely think this could be an example of Okay, even though the expectation is one thing, in my own best interest and in the own interests of my child, I may need to do something different and it isn't clearly because you didn't try, right, So, I feel like the cultural expectation was the effort that she's already put forward to take care dad. But you don't have to continue to be denegrated and like abused in this situation when you have some more power now than you did maybe as a child.
Right. That was what was huge for me as a client, was I mean, you know it. You know, you're like, I'm an adult, I don't have to listen to anybody else, but we can feel and be mentally very stuck in a child's place. And so knowing that you're grown versus actually taking control of your own autonomy, there's two very different things. So I have trouble sometimes when listeners are like, I don't know what to do about my parents, because I'll be like, okay, let them suffer, but this person sounds like, you know, she really does not want to do that, despite the fact that she's being verbally abused by her dad and this is happening even in front of her son. So that's where I feel like, for me, the priority is not respecting the cultural differences. It's understanding that you are continuing to tolerate mistreatment that you don't deserve, and like you are supporting this man and you really really do not deserve to be beat up like this by somebody that you are taken care of. So I don't know that my method of having a conversation and saying listen, this is the standard for how I'm treated in my own home, and if you can't do that, then you're gonna have to find somewhere else to go. I don't know that this person, Fiona, would necessarily feel comfortable with doing that, but that would be my suggestion. Let's talk about it. Let's be very clear, lay it out for him. You will not talk to me this way, and if you continue to do so, I hope you have somewhere else to go because I will change the locks. This is my house.
Yeah. I don't think that is a bad thing to consider, especially because it does not sound like there has been that conversation right, Like it feels like she has very much continued in the cycle of where she was as a child, that this is how it is and this is how I'm expected to be because he's my dad. But you can have different conversation now and say, hey, you know, I have continued to support you, but these are the rules for what things look like in my house and if you are wanting to continue staying here, like, these are the things we have to agree to.
See. What if he doesn't, though, and he's like, well then you got it. You can't just make.
It, Yeah, you can't. It can't be like a boundary with no follow through, right, Like it has not about a firm boundary. Yeah, it has to be a boundary, and then once the boundary is crossed, then you have to follow through with the consequence, right. And so that may mean maybe it would be too far to kind of just put him back on the street, but maybe that looks like finding him like an assisted living home or something where you're still supporting him, but it is not in your home, right and if you don't have to deal with the constant abuse in that kind.
Of excellent suggestion. I didn't even think of that, But there is a middle ground. I have to remind myself, you don't have to go fully to like kick that man out your life, though she maybe would not be wrong, and that's what she decided, right, Like, we don't get to dictate how we then deal with the abuse from other people, Like they don't get to say you went too far when they've been the one who belong to us. I'm so glad you brought that up, because boundaries without consequences are really just suggestions, and suggestions can be followed or not. But boundaries are supposed to be rules like this is the treatment that I deserve and if you can't do it, then you can't be in my home. Simple as that or as complicated as that?
Really, so right right?
Okay? Well Fiona, hope that helps.
Good luck?
Yeah, what about you, doctor Joy?
Thank you? Okay, So my question, I don't have a name for my person, but how do you navigate the emotional, psychological, and social distress of a career deferred or that hasn't hatched? I earned a PhD and was on track as a budding scholar. A professional riff changed my course, and ten years later, I'm rebuilding my confidence and re establishing my goals. However, when I look around at others I started with, went to school with, and even mentored, I see they're thriving in ways I have not. I don't know how to shake my feelings, even though I take responsibility for my direction and redirection. Now are there others experiencing something similar? How are they moving through it? What are you doing to get on the other side? And where do they pull strength, confidence, and forgiveness.
I really would like to know more about what happened this redirection ten years ago, because it sounds like this person is taking responsibility, almost as if it was their fault. I'm really curious about that. But I also maybe not this exact scenario, but a lot of clients would come to me saying, you know, they feel like they're not doing as well as they should, they feel like they're behind on their peers. That sort of thing, and comparison is the thief of joy. You look around and you see what you think everybody else has, and maybe you're basing that off Instagram, but Instagram is a highlight reel. You know, most people are not on Instagram telling you about how bad things are or the deals that didn't work out or the things that fell through. So it could be that you feel like other people are surpassing you professionally, but maybe you're doing other things that they haven't been able to do, or you know, maybe you've been focused on other aspects of your life. Again, I'm really curious about what happened. But like for me, I definitely since I have been in therapy, have been a lot less focused on professional goals. I've been a lot less focused on my career and doing other things because focusing on my mental health figuring out what was going on with me and getting to a healthier, calmer place was my priority for so long. So yeah, I'm sure there are a lot of other people out there who was like, oh, my podcast is bigger and I'm doing these tours and I'm doing that, and like that is great for you. Run your own race. I really had to take this time out to take care of me, focus on me, get my mental health right. Everybody is moving at different paces. My life is not supposed to look like anybody else's life, and kind of removing that expectation, taking the word should out of our vocabulary mentally when we talk about where we are or where we want to be, this idea of oh I should be doing this might really be holding you back.
I love that so much, Chris, So yeah, I definitely zeroed in on that shoulding all over herself. But this idea that my career was going to be this place and now it's not. It also makes me wonder like what is stopping her from relaunching and kind of like picking up where she started because it feels like maybe she's feeling like the moment has passed. And I think that there are very few things that happen where you can't either get back on the same track or continue on a slightly different path, but like, it's still a continuation of what you were doing, especially in academics, right, Like I'm thinking people usually have some field of study that they are pursuing, and so ten years later, is the research still not valid? Is there not a way to kind of do a pivot in, you know, what you were studying, Because it feels like she's feeling like, Okay, I can't pick up where I started again for some reason, and so I'm wondering what's keeping her stuck there? Yes, that was always confusing to me, is that, like, is your PhD so niche that you fell out with this one person and now you cannot work in this field anymore? Or are you still beating yourself up for something that was relatively minor and you're struggling to maybe decide what else you might want to do with your life or what else.
Your career might look like. It's just not really enough information there to say for sure, but yeah, it could be that this person has lots of career options available to them, but they're stuck on what they thought their life was going to look like, and they're not really able to pivot or adapt to these new circumstances.
Mm hmm. Yeah, it's something that kind of also stuck out with the idea of like rebuilding my confidence, which to your point about her kind of internalizing this like it was her fault that this pivot had to happen, as opposed to it being like the circumstances of the context around her, And so this rebuilding confidence makes it feel like she has internalized something about this when it may not have actually been anything about her that needed to change in the first place. Right, Yeah, Yeah, but I agree with you being open to the idea that your career can be wildly successful in ways that you did not even imagine. Like ten years ago, I definitely was not planning on being like a podcaster and like doing all the things that I'm doing, And so you just never know, like if you are open to the process and keep putting one foot in front of the other, which kind of path you end up walking on that is just beyond your wildest dreams.
Yes, absolutely be open to what else might be out there. For sure, I thought I was going to be a lawyer. Ha ha.
You we're glad that didn't work.
Out.
Ooh, but thank you so much for this letter, and I appreciate you. Waying in Chrystal. More from our conversation after the break. Why do friendship breakups sometimes hurt more than romantic ones? How do I make friends in a new city? Is it true that women can't actually be good friends to one another? I'm exploring all of these questions and so much more in my book, Sisterhood Heels, now available in paperback at your local independent bookstore or at sisterhood Heels dot com. Grab a copy for you and your girls, and let's talk about it.
I have a quick one here from Jesse, who says, my best friend just got a great new therapist and I want her to be my therapist. Is that possible or is that a conflict of interest?
Ooh? I love these questions because I feel like it's such an interesting debate for like friend groups around sharing a therapist, so to speak. And I think some therapists have very strict rules about not seeing multiple people in a system because does it complicate confidentiality? But the truth is that a lot of us live in places where that kind of thing is unavoidable. Right if you're in a small town or whatever, And so I think one asking your friend if they are okay sharing that information, because sometimes friends are like, I just want this for myself and I really would prefer you not to talk with my therapist. I can maybe help you find somebody else. But if they're okay with sharing it, then I think having a conversation with your therapist. Now, the therapist, if they're ethical, is not going to even acknowledge that they are your friend's therapists, right, but they can have a conversation with you about how they protect your confidentiality, how they protect everybody's confidentiality. I know in previous times, when I've had supervisors who saw people in systems, they would be very careful about the scheduling so that you're not running into each other in the waiting room. Now virtually, now you know, they're probably not as big of an issue. But therapists are aware of those kinds of things and usually can be very creative and scheduling and making sure they're not conflating who said what during a session and bringing up a fight that your friend told them about but it's actually your session. Like, usually therapists are good at keeping track of all that. Yeah, I agree.
I think this was something that I didn't really consider. I was like, of course, your therapists should not be seeing your friends or your boyfriend or anybody you know. But this came up on the show a couple of years back, where it was like, we live in a small town, my mom is the only black therapist in town, and so my friends are seeing my mom, you know, and it's weird for me. And so yeah, that does happen, and it can be that you and your friend can see the same therapists. I fully agree with doctor Joy about talking to your therapists about it, seeing if they're even down, because they might not be. But when this came up for me, when my client was like, ooh, my grandma could really use a therapist. Can I give her your number? I said, you can, and I would be happy to help your grandma find a therapist. But you are my client. You're my priority, and I don't want to take on somebody where that might cause me some sort of conflict in regards to how I treat you. I think she really needed to hear that, you know that, like she was the priority, and I'm glad that you're looking out for the other people in your life. But you know, we're in New York City, so I could throw a rock and hit five hundred black therapists. But I do think that there's something different in the dynamic of a family member versus a friend, right, because it could be a friend that you only talk to, you know, once every quarter, and like there isn't even a lot of overlap and content versus somebody that you were under the same roof with, right, and now, therapist definitely will see families and maybe even break out individually, but it all is in the interests of the family, and so there's no secrets with any particular family members. So maybe I have a conversation with mom, I have a conversation with dad, then we all come together to talk about what individually was shared.
That definitely happens. But I do think therapists are probably more likely not to take on family members because then it does become difficult to kind of hold the partiality for one client over the other.
Yes, yeah, especially because you know you've talked to me about how your grandmother abused you. I don't need to be going into therapy mad at this lady, right, right, So you know, let me find her somebody else. So, yeah, that's a great point about the difference between seeing family versus friends. Friends. Probably not as sticky of.
Circumstances, exactly, exactly. Yeah, that was a great question, Thank you, chrissel Okay, I have one that's a little longer, well, much longer, Okay. Okay. So recently, my best friend, who is white, deeply hurt me when I ask for financial help. Months ago, I asked for thirty dollars and she gave it immediately, telling me not to worry. She's married with two kids and financially better off. I'm a single mom living paycheck to paycheck with an ex husband who has substance abuse issues. I have full custody of my kids, but only receive part time child support. She knows how much I struggle and have trouble providing basics for my children like new shoes and clothes. Despite our different financial lives. I'm never resentful towards her and genuinely happy for whatever brings her joy because she's beautiful. I love her, and I tell her all the time. A few weeks ago, I only had two dollars in my account with three days until payday. I texted her that I needed help, was low on gas and had no dog food, and that I'd appreciate whatever she could do. She replied, I'm sorry, I have to talk to my husband because we just spent fourteen hundred dollars on plane tickets for vacation. We're taking my mom to dinner for her birthday this weekend, and I need to get the kids new taekwondo uniforms. I responded, no worries, I understand, but felt heartbroken and disappointed. Earlier, I tried asking for help during a conversation, but she kept interrupting. Other friends and even my unemployed sister have helped me financially without asking. Reflecting on her family's lifestyle, I realized she might not understand my struggles. I still find myself hurt because I saved her as a last resort when asking for help for some reason, and instead of saying something like things are tight on my end, but how much do you need, she launched into having to ask her husband. I would never ask her for any amount of money that would require spousal approval. Now I can't help but notice the difference in our financial situations and feel ashamed. I feel embarrassed. And less than and try to pretend everything is normal. But I no longer want to talk to her about things you speak to your best friend about, like life, the good and the bad. Can I get over this? Was I naives to think that she understood me all these years when she didn't trust me enough to tell her what that I needed and didn't ask. I feel like I was blind to the fact that she never really understand what I go through as a single black mom of a twelve year old boy and ten year old girl. And I should have known better and stuck with my black friends. Is it me or is she white? It can be both?
Meeting them at a dance all night? Oh man, huh. I think this person brought up some excellent points about like if I ask you for fifty dollars or whatever and you start telling me how you just spent fourteen hundred on plane tickets and your kids need new karate uniforms, It's like, are you rubbing it in that you have all this money and I'm asking for fifty dollars? Like you could just say, ooh, we've been doing a lot right now, let me check with my husband. I'll get back to you, Like I don't think the details of how she has all this money and where she's spending it was really necessary. But this is something that was so challenging for me. And another of the things that was a huge lesson learned is just how how much therapy does not fix the things that therapy cannot help you with. And a lot of that is, you know, societal problems like money, Like so many of my clients had to see me virtually because they would not have been able to leave work, leave their kids, come to therapy that sort of thing. There's a lot of structural, systemic barriers in place that therapy can't outdo. And so hearing you talk about this really breaks my heart because you sound so ashamed of yourself for circumstances that you shouldn't have to be in in the first place. And this is where I start getting real, like free the world and destroy capitalism. I just don't think in an ideal world people should have to stress out about food, water, clothing, shelter, the things we need to stay alive. So I hate that you are in this position where you're now feeling ashamed and like you're not good enough. But I also don't think that was necessarily, not even just her intention, because intentions aren't all that matter. But I think that might be How do I say this? I don't want to be like, girl, you feel bad because of you, but because that's not it. It's not like you feel bad because of you. But I think the reality of the situation may be bringing up these feelings of shaming you as opposed to her saying or do something specifically to make you feel ashamed. Not sure, but maybe, but yeah, what do you think, doctor Joy?
So I mean, I also feel like, you know, all of these human needs should just be provided for people. So I agree with you there, And it does to me feel like her reaction feels disproportionate to the situation, and anytime that happens, it feels like there's likely something deeper going on. And so if in all these years you haven't questioned before like, oh, is she a good friend or is she white? And she can't actually be a good friend, Like, it's interesting to me that this situation is what has caused you to jump to this place, And so I do wonder what else is going on in the dynamic. And to your point, it could be that you just feel really awful and rightfully so about where you find yourself, and now you're like mapping that on to this response from her, yes, which it doesn't seem like you questioned the friendship before. And so for all of this to come down to forty dollars feels like, Okay, this doesn't really feel like it's about that. So I feel like it may be more going on than we have access to in the letter.
I agree, especially because I think she said something like, I would never ask for an amount of money that would need spousal approval, But you really don't know what other people's relationships are like, you don't know what constitutes a need for spousal approval. I mean, it sounds like they really did just get done spending a lot of money. I don't think she needs to go into the details about that. But you can't say, oh, well, it's not enough money to ask your husband about. How do you know how you know what's enough money for me to ask my husband about? Now? Could that be a cop out? But we don't necessarily know that. I can see how a conversation here would really be useful, and I can also see how that would be difficult to do, especially if you are already steeped in shame about where you are now, your living situation, having to take care of these kids, being a single mom. I can see how it would be really hard to go to somebody who seems like they're in a far more stable position and be like, I feel like you don't understand me or my life or where I'm coming from. But this is your best friend, white or not. I think best friends deserve that consideration, deserve at least the conversation, and if she responds poorly to it, then I think you know how to move from there, because even if she can't provide financial assistance, she can be empathetic. A friend should at least be able to show empathy for your situation. But yeah, I agree, it sounds like you've got some personal stuff going on that's influencing your response to what she said here.
Yeah. Yeah, And I really appreciate you kind of underscoring the shame piece because it sounds like it was a big deal for you to even ask, right like I saved her as a last resort, like last resort. Yeah, So it definitely feels like you're feeling really bad, and again, rightfully so for even having to be in this situation, but again to not internalize that as any feeling of your own, but more feeling of the system that has resulted in you being in this place. Yes, and it not really being about her, but around all these systems that are broken. Right.
It's not your fault that you don't have the support that you need, Like you said that your children's father is simply not supporting them the way he should and that's not your fault. But you are doing the best you can with the circumstances that you're living within, and there's no shame in that. Oh, best of luck. That hurts my heart. I hate to hear people talk about feeling bad for things that it's like, this is not a personal failing, you know, this is not your more failing here. So that sort of thing came up a lot as a therapist for me, where I'm like, people are feeling bad for things that are really outside of their control when they should be feeling proud of themselves for doing everything they've been able to do despite everything working against them.
Exactly so exactly. Oh more from our conversation after the break. Okay, well, my last letter is from Annie, who says my best friend recently had a baby, and the way she talks about the baby is starting to concern me. But I don't want to say that outright because I'm afraid she'll stop being honest about how she's doing. I'm really the only person she considers a best friend, and I know she's not as candid with any of our mutual friends or family. She's also not in therapy. My friend and I are both twenty nine. She's been married for about three years, and she's been with her husband since high school. They both went into marriage knowing how the other felt about having kids. My best friend never really cared to have kids, but she was open to having at least one as long as they were financially set up, and she made it clear that she expected her husband to do the heavy lifting when it came to caring for the kid. Her husband just wanted kids, so their compromise was to have one. However, her husband is in the military, so every three or four years they moved to a new state. Last year, they moved to a state that has a lower cost of living than the last, which meant the military cut the husband's salary by a lot. My friend is unemployed and has been for many years, but she claims she does want to find a job. I say claims because every time I ask about the job hunt, she gives me a long list of excuses. Right before she found out she was pregnant, they got noticed that her husband would be shipped overseas. He was gone for most of the pregnancy and only got to come back for ten days to witness the birth and sort out the paperwork. Her expectation was that he would be there to help her with the newborn, but obviously that's impossible given their current situation. He won't get back until the end of this year, and that's only if they don't push his return date again. Luckily, she her parents with her and they take the baby the minute they get home from work and keep her throughout the night. But it seems like it's not enough. I regularly get text from my friend saying that the baby crying is disturbing her and preventing her from watching her shows, which is fair, but it is not really in a playful tone. Apparently, mothers are supposed to pump every two hours or their milk supply will dry up, and she's refusing, not because she's against pumping, but in her words, it's just successive and she don't have time for that. I'm very sensitive to what she may be feeling mentally, emotionally, and physically. I know giving birth is not easy, and raising a newborn without her husband is definitely not what she's signed up for. So I'm trying very hard to affirm her and remind her she's allowed to have whatever feeling she has and to complain about whatever she wants. But I know my friend, I know how she communicates. I know when she's just joking, and this feels more like she truly does not like the child. It's to the point that I keep wondering what will happen once her parents leave and she's the sole caretaker. How would you handle this? I've mentioned my concern to her, but not to the extent of saying that I'm starting to be concerned for the bit baby safety. But I am at a loss. Please help Annie. Yeah, So, as you were talking, my immediate thought was, is there some postpartum depression email going on here? Both in terms of just like the whirlwind that is giving birth, but all of these other factors that are in the background. Right, So her partner is not there. Sounds like she had conflicting feelings about having a baby in the beginning. Now there's a lack of support even though her family is there to help. I definitely think she needs to talk with her maybe obgyn and perhaps a therapist about what's going on. My suggestion would be it sounds like this is a long standing friendship, which means she likely knows the parents, and so my suggestion to Annie would be to maybe talk with her mom and dad about her concerns and just say, hey, I think we may need to talk with her doctors about this to escalate this a bit.
Yeah, I'm glad you brought that up, because she put in a little PostScript and I do and read it, but now it's relevant. She said, I don't think my friend's parents see what I'm saying because they're so in love with their grandbaby. Plus they're the type to believe that everything can be healed with prayer and they don't really believe in therapy.
Oh so yes, wow, Okay, so maybe mom and dad are not gonna be the route they may be. Yeah. Yeah, so she may have to kind of be a little bit more forthright in staging a bit of an intervention here and say hey, and I don't think you need to jump to conclusions about I'm afraid you're going to hurt the baby. I think she can just say like, I'm really concerned for you, and say say some of the things she just shared right, like, I know when you're laughing, I know when you're joking, and it doesn't feel that way, and I'm really concerned about you because I think a lot of times, you know, it feels like after you have a baby, like all the focuses on the baby, and so having this be like, I'm really concerned about you, my friend, and I want you to be well, and maybe offering to go with her a therapists appointment, are to talk with her obgyn about what she's feeling, so that you know that a game plan can be developed.
Yes, I agree. My first thought was also, oh, this sounds like some postpartums going on here.
And I agree.
I think it's this long standing or long running joke that like, once you have a baby, nobody cares about you anymore. But I think a lot of moms really feel that they are now just this person's milk supply or whatever, and people don't care about them as a human being anymore. So I would definitely I think doctor Joy just gave you some excellent advice, and I would just reinforce the fact that, like I think, you want your friend to feel that you care about her, you are worried about her, You are concerned about her. You can tell when she's joking, and she seemed really down lately. I don't know if you need to say sounds like postpartum, but maybe you could say, you know, like my cousin had a baby and she was feeling blue or whatever, and they found out she had postpartums. She had to talk to her doctor and they did this this this like it could be as simple as just casually suggesting it, just to plant the seed, and maybe she does talk to her doctor about it. But I think more than anything, people need to know that somebody cares about them, and it's not just about this beautiful baby. I'm sure everybody loves this baby, but like we're worried about you. We want you to be good. It doesn't seem like you're good. So as your friend, as someone who loves you, I want to do whatever I can to get you to a place where you're good. Because it sounds like your parents got the baby covered. The baby isn't gonna be fine, right, So let's focus on my friend and getting her to a good place mentally. Of course, doctor Joy knocked that right out the park.
I'm blanking on the name, but I think that there's like organizations of Postpartum Association of America or something like that may even have a crisis line or like a warm line that you might be able to call to get additional support in like how to have this conversation, and maybe even getting her into like a support group in her area or a virtual group of other moms who will also be able to affirm for her why she may be feeling this way, or like, because I think, again there's so much shame with the whole child birth experience. Goal do I not have warm feelings to the child? And so much of that is normal, especially if there is a postpartum depression concern, and so getting her connected to other people who maybe have felt like this could also be helpful. So like looking into some of those resources could probably lead her to some other options that would be good.
Maybe even specifically military moms because of that added component of the dad not being there, being overseas and you know, he might come home in December, and he might not, and there's really nothing you can do about that. So being able to connect with other women who are like, oh yeah, girl gave birth alone and raising these kids by myself. This was not the plan. But here I am. I think people really need to feel like others can relate, So maybe something like that would be helpful. But Annie, you sound like a good friend.
Yeah. I love it. I love that she has you, Annie, Thank you for that. Yeah. Yeah, Well this has been so much fun, Chris, so I really appreciate some questions with you after Joy.
Of course, what I'm honored is like the therapy rock star right here. So I'm just honored to be sharing a screen.
Well, thank you so much for joining me today, Crystal. This has been tons of fun. We appreciate it.
Thank you, doctor Joy, Thank you so much.
I want to thank Cristal again for joining me for these episodes this week. This has been tons of fun to learn more about her and the work she's doing. Be sure to visit the show notes at Therapy for Blackgirls dot com, slash listener letters, and don't forget to text us episodes to two of your girls right now and tell them to check it out. If you're looking for a therapist in your area, visit our therapist directory at Therapy for Blackgirls dot com slash directory. And if you want to continue digging into this topic or just be in community with other sisters, come on over and join us in the Sister Circle. It's our cozy corner of the Internet designed just black women. You can join us at community dot Therapy for Blackgirls dot com. This episode was produced by ELISEE. Ellis and Zaria Taylor. Editing was done by Dennison Bradford. We'll be back with our regular episode next week, but until then, take good care
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