Dwyane sits down with bestselling author, podcast host and life coach, Jay Shetty to discuss his time living as a monk, transitioning his learnings to the "real world" and what he does when he is with his friends. The two talk about how to practice stillness in life, spiritual awakening as well as understanding yourself and others. They also get into their passions for movies, video games, pickleball and tattoos.
Very excited to have this guest that I have Leanna to sit next to and be able to spend some time with someone who I got an opportunity, opportunity to go on his podcast two years ago in twenty twenty two.
We had a little Wi Fi situation, but we got through it.
And I'm going to read a little bit of intro, but he don't need an intro.
Really, I think we all know who this gentleman is.
But today we have an ex monk which we would talk about turn life Guru. He's a number one New York Town's bestselling author, award winning podcast host of On Purpose, Chief Purpose Officer of Calm and purpose driven entrepreneur. Everybody please welcome to the y the incredible He's a legend in our household.
Jay Sheddy, thank you man.
Such an honor to be here. I'm so grateful to be here. And that's such a sweet, kind introduction and it means the world to me. Honestly, I could feel in your voice and I received that, and I can honestly say you're a legend in our household that had your wife do and I think it was amazing when you came on the show. Despite the Wi Fi difficulties, the way you came through and the way you connected were so powerful.
So thank you for having me.
No, of course, of course, I just said that you're a legend in this space, like I'm in people households.
Does that feel weird? Does that sound weird? Does it get old?
Like?
Do you understand why?
Like you know, I mean like I'm a legend in people households and that I've never been into.
I mean I should ask you that question. You should be the one answering that question. I feel like I'm just trying to be a spiritual friend to everyone in my community, Like that's my goal. My goal is to be someone in your network, in your world that gives you little reminders, little nudges, pushes you in the right direction, but does it in a friendly, loving, kind, compassionate way. Because I feel we're all so good at being harsh with ourselves, we're all so good at being pressurizing with ourselves, but we're not good at being kind and graceful with ourselves. And I feel like if you have a friend who's that way with you, maybe you'll learn to be that way with yourself. So to me, all I ever aim and aspire to be is everyone's spiritual friend. And if I can be that, then I'm very satisfied here.
I talk well, I speak about that a lot. Right You're at this point in life where one you only want to be associated with people that are willing to give you grace, right Like, just for me in life as I grow older, I'm like, man, I only want to be around people that understand that, you know, there's no perfection here, that is in perfection here, and I need grace just like I'm willing to give grace. And you know, so I always I talk about that a lot.
Man.
That's like a message that me and my guys that we always you know, making sure that we keep you know, the top of mind is, you know, is grace and giving grace and you know, hoping to receive it, you know, from the ones that you want to receive it from.
And so it's really it's really important.
How do you And I might be asking questions that like I want people to ask the fee, but when you go around the world, everyone is pretty much taken from you. And I'm not saying that they don't pour into you because of their ask of what you do, and they love of what.
You do, but everyone is coming to you for a question or to get an answer.
How do you pour into so many people's cup randomly, just everywhere you go.
Yeah, I think going back to your first question, it connects to this one. The real legends are my teachers and my guides, my mentors, the monks that I've spent time with, the people that I get poured into from. And I feel like you can only keep giving and key growing if people keep giving and growing you. And so I think you've always got to remember to be a student. You've always got to remember to go back to the basics. You've always got to remember to go back to the beginning. And I think for me, I'm constantly trying to absorb that energy from my mentors and teachers and guides so that I can channel that. And I think the mistake comes when you feel like you're pouring from yourself. I think if it just becomes about you, we're limited, We're fallible. I'm limited and fallible. I'm imperfect. But when I'm gaining from so many different oceans than I can too be a river. And I think for a lot of us, we're trying to be the ocean, and then you just dry up because you're.
Going to run out.
There's only so many people you can be that way for. And so I have my days. I have days when I'm feeling dry, and I have days when I'm feeling weak, and I feel those are the days when I have to go deeper within myself. I've got to reconnect with the source and then be able to push that back out there. And so I always remind myself when I meet someone, though, that I'm really grateful for the kinds of things people say. You just introduced me to a couple of members of your family and your team here, and I can't not stop pause and be grateful to hear those words and try and share that love back because someone chose And this was my intention when I started, when I started creating what I do today, I never believed in a million years that someone would choose to watch it over a TV show or over something else, but they do. And so I want to honor that soul and be like, you're amazing for making this choice and decision that you chose to watch something that was built to elevate you, even if it wasn't a fun entertainment or fun escape. And so to me, when I hear that, I allow myself to receive it. I think there was a moment in my career early on where I'd be like, oh no, yeah, you shy away from it. You'd be a bit modest. You're like, oh, it doesn't matter, Oh it's cool. Thank you, thank you, thank you. And then you realize, actually, someone's sharing love with you. And the way you keep being able to give love is if you allow yourself to receive it. And so for me, just stopping being present, pausing and taking it in allows me to give it back and share it with others.
Yeah, I think you just said something so important and it's something that I've had to come to grips with it. In the sense is when people do say the things they say to you and they do approach you, whether it's you know, it's something that you've changed their life, You've changed the way they think, and you've you helped someone in there and their family, it's one of their loved ones. However you've done it. It's really this word humble and being humble. Sometimes you can be a little too humble. It's like, no, actually take your flowers, you know, what I mean, don't be so bashful away from trying to be too humble and actually take your flowers, but also understand what it is that you bring to this world, yes, and the impact that you have on this world, because you know, if you understand it and you know it, then it's easier for you to go and do it right and also to receive it right, which is hard for us to receive that kind of you know, acknowledgement about you know something, and so I think it's very important to do that.
I wonder someone you know in your space.
Very similar to me is I've had coaches pretty much my entire life, right, I've had people who help me accountable, have teammates to help me accountable. And as hard as it is to play with others and win with others and follow other.
People rules, it's also easy too.
Because you have people motivating you, pushing you, and people you don't want to let down.
Who are those people outside of your family. Who are the people that you need.
To pour into you and that you reach to and say, hey, I'm depleted, I need something, I need you, I need a Who are those people for you?
The number one answer is definitely my monk teachers. I was literally with one of my monk teachers on Saturday.
So you still, I'm fully connected to.
Them because I feel like they're the ones who keep me grounded, because for them, it's almost like the world I'm in now, it's so disconnected and distant, and they don't value it in the same way. They value what you're saying like they value someone who's rooted and grounded and connected. And so you need someone outside of your world to keep pulling you back to that place. And so I find that they keep me in check. They're honest with me, They're able to notice things inside of me even before I notice them. And then my job is only to be transparent and open enough to receive it from them. And as long as I do that, Okay, that's hard. Sometimes it's the hard part sometimes, right, Look, it's so easy to get carried away. And I find that for me when I'm with my teachers and my mentors, because they've been there for my whole life, like yours, you also have like decades of a relationship there.
There's like a real.
Brotherhood, and so you know that this person is only saying it for your own good. And I think that's been a really important part for me with mentors is I'm surrounded by people who I believe are saying things to me because they want me to be better, and they're not doing it to bring me down or hold me back. They're not doing it because they're envious, scared, fearful, insect cure. They're doing it because they see potential in me that I don't see in myself. And so for me, my monk teachers are definitely a big part of it. I say my wife. I mean, you said no family, but I think you know a part from my parents.
But my wife is a.
Big person who I turn to for advice. I feel like she's so honest with me. I don't know if you have the same experience.
Yeah it could. I don't want you to be that up.
Yeah tell me right, Yeah, I agree with that. There are days and I'm like, yeah, you didn't have to tell me that right now. This is a sensitive time. But I know that she's always going to be honest with me, and that's huge. So I turned to her for sure, and then I'm always searching. I think one of the reasons why I love doing the podcast is because I get to sit down from people and get free advice from the greats. Like I said, like you've been on the show, it's it's an opportunity for me to mind from anyone and everyone and apply. You've had a completely different life experience than I have, completely different background, completely different walks of life. But I know that there are things you've taught me and things that I've learned from me that I can apply in my life. And I think that is the joy of this platform. That is the joy of having conversations with One of my mentors would always say you need to have more open, random, and supportive relationships. He said that as you age, you become more closed, selective and controlling. And he said, if you become more closed, selective and controlling, you actually lose your edge. But he said, what made you who you were in the first place is that you were open, random, and supportive. And so I feel having random conversations the people you never talk to, you never meet, you never bump into on the street, like, those are the kind of conversations that we need more.
Do you feel that every conversation that you enter that someone is that they need a word from you? You know, you do you feel like every conversation you have to be on.
Yeah, so that's a great question.
So there was a time in my life where I felt like if I didn't say something profound, people would walk out the room. Like I was like, I felt that pressure. And what I found is if you have the pressure to say something profound, you rarely will say something profound because all you're doing is being paralyzed by the pressure. And so that stress. Definitely, I had that for a while. And I think as you get more comfortable with yourself, and as you get more comfortable in your space, you start to realize all you can do is be present. And so now instead of pressurizing myself to say something profound, I'm like, just be here, just be present, just actually listen, and then maybe you'll say something that helps someone, and maybe you'll say something that everyone laughs at. And the truth is it doesn't matter because that's all you had to give anyway.
And so I think now.
I would consider myself to be more comfortable in that discomfort and that uncertainty. But I think in the beginning, definitely I felt like a lot of pressure. But now I'm just like, I want to be around people that I can just be around and you know, I like a lot of normal things too. So I think people get surprised when I say, like I like playing NBA two K or I like I like playing Pe. Why do you think that, yeah, the person, Yeah, because people just I think we live in a world like probably similar to you. Like you get bossed. So you're an athlete, you're a basketball player. That means you can't have interest in whatever. I don't know what you can tell me what you get judged about. But for me, it's like, oh, you used to be a monk. Even though now I'm married and we have businesses and we have adventures and we have purpose driven you know, ideas and ideation. You get boxed like oh, this used to be your life, so then you can't have normal interest. And I'm like, no, I love NBA to get I love FIFA. I love sports. It's a massive part of my life. I love movies and massively into movies. I love movies and entertainment. So there's so many normal things. And so now I've realized that I want more relationships where I can flip between playful and profound. So I want to switch with people. I want to be able to talk about the latest game, and then I want to talk about a verse from a scripture that someone hasn't read. And I enjoyed those relationships because that, to me is genuine and authentic and true to who I am, as opposed to just having to play one side of me. So I try and avoid relationships where I feel people can't accept and access all parts of myself. And so for those who listen to my podcast or whatever, they know, I'm addicted to all this other stuff.
So it's good.
Like I'm glad, Yeah, I was, you know, I'm glad you said that I was going on.
I was thinking of.
Like monks right from what from I grew up in the inner city of Chicago, and so you hear about certain people, places and things you may never see them or never experience them. I don't know if you feel this way, but I kind of feel this way. You've given monks a face. You've humanized what most people don't know even you know know of besides what people say of what a monk is and what they do, and and so I feel like you kind of have given you have birth to face to it in society that we're all watching and we're in I'm not saying you know everyone who really knows in.
The community, but the community who do not know. Do you feel that do you feel have you.
Felt the pressure of that, of being the face of you know, of a monk.
That's a great question. Yeah.
I think I really struggle with it when I went through my transition, because it's almost like you had an identity for three years, right, I was among for three years of my life, dedicate service and practice, and then all of a sudden you have to transition, and now the rules of the games have changed in that you're in the real world and different things matter.
And though three years is like, is that the three years you like, did your time and did you move on?
No?
So, I mean some people do it for their whole lives, and some people do it for different periods of time. So I did it for three years, not as a commitment.
I thought I was going to do it for.
The rest of my life, but I only made it three years. I guess there are some people like that in the NBA. They're like, thought they were going to be professional basketball, have an amazing career like you, or they didn't make it right and so so some like my monk mentors have been months for like thirty four years, and so they've done it for like, you know, decades, and then there are people like myself who've done it for a short period of.
Time in a deep way, but then moved on.
And so for me, it's definitely pressure because, like I said, like so much of my life has changed today, and it's also changed while I was teaching and sharing and guiding, and so it's complex because I think we like to think of life as like before and after, but actually life cyclical and it's just constantly moving and changing. So I didn't know when I started this that it would get anywhere, let alone where it is today. And you're kind of living your own life and then you're dealing with the perception change in your own mind, and then everyone else has their perception of you and they're going through that as well, and so I think it's really complex and it's quite layered and complicated and hard. And so I think for me, accepting that I was no longer among but that I could still have certain mindsets that monks have was where I found my happy place and that is still something i'm practicing today. So I'll give it a practical example. So a big part of thinking like a monk, And that's why I wrote a book called Think like a Monk, not.
Live like Absolutely.
Absolutely.
The reason I wrote a book called Think like a monk, not Live like a monk, was because nine percent of people are never going to live like a monk. And even I today no longer live like a monk. But imagine you could learn to think like them. Imagine you could learn to access the piece, the purpose, the intention.
So can everyone live like a monk? No? But can everyone think with intention? Yes? Can everyone live like a monk?
No?
But can everyone think with purpose yes? Can everyone live like a monk?
No?
Can everyone serve with the mindset of thinking about how to benefit improve people's lives?
Yes?
And so that's what I wanted to share with people, was this idea. And so it's it's a daily it's a daily battle for me. It's a daily challenge for me. It's never easy because I left eleven years ago and my life has changed so much. But I'm still trying to live by those ideals internally, even though my external life is different.
Do those ideals do they evolve? Do they change?
Do they grow, or is it the pillars are the same and nothing changes.
Like that's a great question. That's such a great All of these are great questions. By the way, I've never been asked what's brilliant about this is I've talked about this space in my life so much.
I've never been asked these questions. Is a great Let me think that's a really that's a really profound.
You're saying, like, eleven years removed, you're still trying to use the principles you know of a monk and everything you learned, and so I just I guess I kind of say, like, Okay, eleven years removed, is it just still the same principles? Have these principles evolve and the change? Have a new one came in?
Or so?
What I found is that there's no new principles. You just realize the same principle more deeply. So it's not that you're discovering a new idea. It's the same idea, but now you discovered a deeper layer of it. And I find that to be incredible because in one sense, when I lived as a monk, this was all theory, and then when you have to apply it in the real world, it becomes real life.
It's like training versus the real game. Right when you're in training, you can.
Practice your free throw, your three point or whatever it is, and then in the real game, all of a sudden, you've got two guys in front of you. You got it whatever, right, So I think for me, what I learned in those three years was almost theory. And then when I came into the real world and I put it in to practice, it worked, and I was like, wow, this is real, Like these powers are real. And so for me, I've gained more faith, more determination, more belief in what I learned in that time because I've seen it play out in the real world. And so I don't think I've learned new principles, but the principles have deepened and become more realized. And I think that was something we always talk about, which is applied wisdom is so much better than just academic wisdom. Like this idea of anyone can repeat averse from scripture or quote something, but it's like when you actually have to live it in the real world with real precious that's when you test the idea.
We could tell it, we could tell people what to do all day.
Yeah, exactly when we have to do them. And that's how I felt.
That's how I felt in the last eleven years since I've left, that I actually have to live the principles and they worked.
Yeah, I agree with that.
I mean, just as you were saying that, I just went back to, like before I got to the biggest stages and the work behind the scenes that I was told from my coaches that I needed to do. I didn't know that I needed needed to do these things, but I listened to my coaches. In the same time, I roll my eyes, I'm like, I don't need to do this. You know, you don't know if it's going to work. You just kind of you know, the shades are closed, the doors are locked, you know, no one's around you, and you're working, but you don't know if it's really going to work until you have to go put it into practice, right, and then that first moment when you put it into practice and you see that the work that you put in is actually it actually works. Now it becomes you become a fiend to like, oh, like, what else what else can I work on? What else can I actually put into play that works? So this feels good?
Yeah.
So Think Like a.
Monk is an incredible book, and it was something you said in here and I wanted to to read it. It said, monks can withstand temptation, refrain from criticizing, deal with pain and anxiety, quiet the ego, and build lives that brim with purpose and meaning. First of all, I was like, ain't that what we all trying? Shouldn't we all try to do that?
Right?
And so when I when I read that and the way that it was put, I never thought to myself, oh, I want to practice being a monk, or I know I want to be a monk. But I looked at that and I said, well, I want to be that, right, Like those are those are the pillars in life, like I'm trying to strive to be able to like, how do you refrain from criticizing that? You know how hard that is for people to refrain from criticizing. And so I just thought that was that was very telling and I wanted to read that for people out there that may not understand. You know, if no one has really not even just looked up anything they can find on social about a monk, but actually know someone or actually have practice themselves, then they don't understand what the real meaning of these words are. And this is true meaning, this is true power of yourself. I feel to be able to refrain from certain acts. It's one of the hardest things to do.
Absolutely, absolutely, and I really appreciate you sharing that and the fact that your reaction was I want that.
That's that was my hope because I think, you.
Know, like I would grow up in the world, you see the rich list being published, and then you've got people looking up to that going, oh, I want to be on that list one day. And so imagine if people had a character list where you go, I want to be that one day, right.
Like, it's a totally different thing.
And so I think when you think about if someone wanted to learn how to play basketball, if they came to learn from you, chances are that they're going to learn at a mastery level. And so the reason why we turn to monks is because all they care about is mastering those things you just read. That's why you turn to them, because that is their occupation, that's what they're dedicated to. And this isn't about my life, Like when I wrote the book Think like a Monk, It's not about my life. It's about the lives and the studies of monks from all different traditions, And so to me, the fact that for decades they've just focused on mastering criticism, chances are you'll be able to learn that from them. So one of the things, one of the practices we used to do, which I loved, was every time you wanted to criticize someone, you first had to think of ten good things about them, and you had to rack your brain to write down ten things you actually admire about them. And that was a practical challenge, but it was a good one. And if you had to do that every time, all of a sudden you start going, oh, everyone's actually gray.
Right right. You have this, you have this idea that like someone is just good or just bad.
And then when you start doing that exercise, you start going, oh, like, people are far more layered, people are far more complex, people are far more new ones. And by the way, I only think they're bad because I'm looking at it from this angle. But maybe if I turned it around that way, then maybe they'd feel the same way about me. And so I think that was a huge principle. Another thing I loved. Every time we try and criticize someone was before you did that, you had to see where that hypocrisy or that characteristic existed within you, and.
So where is that?
So if you're judging someone for judging someone, then you just realize you're judging someone to where can you pause and go, well, wait a minute, where does that exist? Now that doesn't mean it doesn't exist in them, and this doesn't This is not about creating space for bad behavior. That's not the point of it. The point of it is to ask yourself so that you can also uproot it within yourself, because chances are the reason you see it in someone so clearly is because you've seen it before. There's a familiarity you have with it, which is why it even triggers you in the first place. And that was the third step, which is like, if something about someone triggers.
You, ask yourself, why is that?
Right?
Does it remind you of a parent? Does it remind you of someone who treated you badly early on your life? Does it remind you of an ex And where is that coming from?
Because do you believe the things that you believe?
Yeah?
Exactly, And so to me, just even that one tiny area can be such a rich beautiful conversation. And you know, there's a I think it's Eleanor Roosevelt that has that quote that says, big minds discuss ideas, average minds discuss events. Small minds discuss people in the negative sense. And so I always say to people, you have two choices. When you're talking about people. You're either talking in criticism and envy, or you're talking in understanding and study. So if you're talking about people and you're talking about understanding and study, you're winning. If your conversation about people is criticism and envy, then then you're creating a lose lose for everyone.
Oh what's social media about to go down there?
Wall?
This is such a great conversation.
And you actually kind of stole my my thunderworld about the because I you have this perception of what a monk is or what you think a monk is growing up, you know from especially where we're from. So when I found out you were that kind of I'm like, WHOA, that's that's so cool. Now these years, since you stop practicing as a monk in eleven years, does it get harder to keep that up for you?
Because the further you are from doing it, you getting deeper.
Deeper layers, but the world is still getting bigger or smaller, however you look at it.
Yeah, is it get harder.
Yeah, I think at one point. I mean I think the honest answer is, of course it gets harder, but it also gets more powerful. And what I mean by that is, once you've practiced and trained at one point, you have to go out into the battlefield, and in the battlefield you get wounded, but the wounds remind you of how much more you need to focus on the practices. So every time you go out you get hit, you know it's a flaw. You know it's the ego still arising. You notice yourself being critical of someone else, You recognize you lost your self awareness. Now all of that reminds you to take deeper shelter and practice more deeply. And so I think it's harder because you almost are exposed more and you notice your flaws and weaknesses more. But the point of knowing seeing that more is to practice more. And as the same way in a game, right Like to me, it's like if you go into the game and someone just you know what the.
Floor with you, chances are you're good.
After that, you're going to go back and go, all right, I need to work on this, this and this right right, And so I think it's the same mindset of I feel today. I see my weaknesses more clearly, but that makes me want to work on myself more as opposed to feel weaker or give up.
And so there's a.
Pain in the fact that it gets harder, but there's a joy in the fact that I'm getting stronger and more self aware and know what I need to work on. And I think we were always taught to relish the battle. That was the that was the idea that I think sometimes in life we're looking for freedom from the battle, but that actually doesn't exist. That's like saying, was there ever a game where you went out there and it wasn't a fight?
Right?
I don't know.
You can tell me, yeah, somebody you watch the fluid, So who is that?
There was a couple of teams.
With these these things that meaning you just.
Go, look, there's the things at the bottom of the conferences.
But you get the point of making definitely the idea of like, the fight is going to be there, and so all you can do is learn to relish the fight. You can't hope that the fight will end tomorrow. There's always going to be a battle within, there's going to be a battle without. And so if we live in this world of I want to be in a place where there's no battle, you could be waiting forever, you know, And and I think that's that's that's the challenge, is waiting for the day for it to be over, not realizing that actually, let's learn to reliship. Let's learn to let's learn to find our strength in that.
And one thing I love and I think I've discovered it's something about by doing these podcasts interviews, and it's really the ones I've done that has not been athletes necessarily, is just the commonality that we all have and that we all share, you know. And it's like you you just said, it's very similar to an athlete.
You know.
That's why even me as a you know, if someone played you know, I had a mother recent the other day asked me to talk to her son because he wanted to play basketball and she wanted to be a lawyer.
You know.
She had the idea is She's like, I wanted to be a lawyer. I want him to focus on school. And you know, can you talk to him and tell him the importance of school and and so on. One end, I'm sitting there like, yeah, like okay, Like the kid may feel like you don't believe in his dreams, like, you know, is he going to be an NBA player?
I mean the.
Chances are very slim, right, we all know that. But I think I went into that way. I said, well, what sport teaches you, mom, It's all the things that he's going to need in life. So let's not look at it like, oh, yes, he has a dream of making it to the NBA. All young kids and they enjoy sports. They want to make it to the you know, play against the best. But let's talk about what sport teaches you and all the things that he's going to learn by playing this game of sport when it comes to teamwork, when it comes to being able to communicate with people that are from different walks of life, don't speak the same language, and all these things, right. And I can just see after I got there speaking to her, because I didn't speak to him. I spoke to her about maybe a little bit of how your mindset when you're trying to talk to him about playing sports. How about you you know, you understand or you push him to play sports to get the best out of the sport, and even if he isn't the best athlete, he's going to walk away with all the tools that he needed to be successful, you know in life.
That's great advice. And so that's really great advice. How did she take it?
She like she took a good at the end of the night.
Yeah, and so it resonated with her and it was, you know, it was really like, let me just let me, let me talk to you and maybe give you a think, a different way of thinking about it. Because he's he's thirteen years old. He might need this structure, right, he may need this in his life. And you know he's gravitating to a sport for some reason.
And so see what that reason is.
Maybe you can use that reason and something else that he's going to gravitate to next.
And so yeah, I love that.
That's great. That's great advice.
Hardest question, I mean not hardest question, easy question, I guess, but hard to do. How do you practice stillness? Like, you know how hard it is to be still, not just your body, your mind, your thoughts. How do you practice stillness?
I'd say One of my favorite practices is called the five four three two one method. And the reason I like this is because it makes stillness accessible and practical to everyone. So we learned it during our training, but you'll also learn it in therapy today. It's a practice that it's quite accessible, and like I said, you don't have to learn something in order to practice it, which is why I like it. So, wherever you are, all you have to do is look around and take note of five things you can see, and you want to look at them more closely then you would ordinarily. So you want to look at colors, shapes, shades, and try and really immerse in the five things you can see. This is beautiful if you do it outdoors in nature, but you can do it anywhere. And I always say to people that stillness to me is like a mental picture. So if you look at a picture, it's still, and we call them stills for a reason. And so this is how you take a mental picture, which means this is how you find mental stillness. So five things you can see, four things you can touch, So feel the things around you, feel the textures, the temperatures. Notice the difference between my jacket and this chair, this microphone, this table, your own skin, four things you can touch, three things you can hear, can hear some white noise and chatter. I can hear my breath, I can hear you, two things you can smell, and one thing you can taste. And so for at any moment you're struggling to find stillness, focus on the five things you can see, the four things you can touch, the three things you can hear, the two things you can smell, and the one thing you can taste. And if you do that, you'll immediately access stillness because stillness simply means I am here right now in mind, body, consciousness, spirit, and so it brings it all together. Stillness is not experienced when your mind feels ahead of your body. So sometimes you wake up in the morning and your mind is racing and your body's like, I just want to stand there, and so you don't experience stillness, you're experiencing friction.
So people think the opposite of stillness is movement. It's friction.
It's like forces kind of battling against each other. Or you wake up in the morning and your mind is settled where your body's active. Your body's like I gotta do this, got to do that, gotta do that, and the mind's just like.
So is that being present? Like your stillness being present?
I believe that that's the beginning point of Yeah, I think it's the beginning point if you really ask me how to be still. How to be still is to be rooted in clear intention and purpose. That's real stillness, right, Like, would we consider mind Luther King still? We'd consider him extremely still because you couldn't move him from his purpose and his dedication and his determination. That's real stillness. We think of stillness is not moving your body, moving your mind. Yes, real stillness is a tree like that tree is rooted and grounded in growing, giving shade, giving fruits, giving love and you know, shelter to birds and plants and all of this kind of stuff. That tree is still, but it's not still because it doesn't move. It's still because it's rooted in its purpose. And so to me, that's real stillness. But that comes from starting off with presents.
Did you what did your friends say when you came back with this, with this stillness, with this like mindset, Like would they clowning you?
Like?
Yeah, definitely?
Well, you know I think I disconnected from a lot of friends. I stayed in touch with a lot of friends.
When you went off, you had to, you had to.
Yeah, there was a bit of both. There was a bit of boats.
Like you were, there were sometimes when you were completely disconnected, sometimes when you were a bit more connected. But there are certain friends that are still in my life since before and still to this day, and definitely they clowned me for sure, for sure. Like you know, I think banter is a big thing in England. British banters like roasting each other. We call it banter. It so in England, at least, the more you can roast someone, the closer you are to them. And I assume it could be similar and.
It's very similar.
Yeah, yeah, so that's what it's like in London where I grew up, and so my friends would roast me hard like it was.
It was gosh, it was. It was the worst.
But I think even even when I first started doing all of this, like my friends would rostary.
But I think that was a sign of love.
It was a sign of closeness and it was a sign of we're always going to treat you the same. And I love that because I think that's what real friendship is is we're always going to treat you the same.
We're always going to be the same.
And you know, don't think you're that enlightened, like you know, see if you can tolerate this roast, and then we'll know whether you're that enlightened.
So yeah, they still do it now.
Yeah, they were challenging you on your practice exactly exactly.
That's when you realize how not humble you are. Right, it's easy.
Feeling humble when you're around the monks and everything, and then you're back with your friends and they don't care.
And so yeah, they definitely cloud me.
So I mean, you know, obviously being a public figure, you know, I don't know if that's what you set out to become, but you have become one of the biggest public figures in our world, and you hold a you know, I would say a space in it in something that is very important. Because we live in a world we're all trying to find the way to something quick, whether it's we're trying to find a way to our destination quick, or we're trying to find a.
Way to lose weight fast. Whatever it is, we're trying to get there.
And so when it comes to our mental health, you know, where you sit and helping us, you know, in the space of learning, meditation and learning stillness and learning all these things.
We want that information, right, But.
I think in the middle of in the midst of that, you kind of lose j the public loses who you are, right. We see you as the guru, you know, And so what do you and your homies do?
Like what do y'all like?
Do you get a beer?
Like?
What what do you do when you like when you just j when your hair ain as nice as it is, when it's a little messed up a little bit, Like what do y'all do?
Like?
Yeah, I dressed up for you to be doing, because you're always decked out. If I knew you were chilling, I would have come chilling too. I was like, I was like, Duane is always shop So I was like, you know, I don't want to let him down on his pod.
So I'm gonna, you know, dress up a little bit. And now when I saw you walk in, I was like, I hope he's getting changed. That's the first thing. No, I love it. I love it.
Yeah, but no, I mean so I I still don't drink.
I didn't drink since that time. I don't.
I still don't drink no beer for me, But I'd say video games is massive. So as I said, FIFA, n NBA get together. I love, I mean yeah, and I can. I'm competitive, so I will like headphones or in person, in person, in person. So I love playing with my guys, and I'm the kind of person that wants to do all the trash talk and everything to go along with it. Like I still haven't lost that edge, I think for me, I absolutely love. I do genuinely love being outdoors, whether it's activities, sports, anything like I've been playing a lot of pickleball and tennis, like anything active I'm into. Like I said, I love movies like I love the fact that we live in LA and I couldn't find seats to watch Challenges this weekend when it came out because it was just like you just you know everything, it's just fall.
And I love that.
So I love movies. I really enjoy. I mean yeah, to be honest, it's oh, this is this is a funny one. I love Disney World. Okay, so people are always confused by this one, but I've bought I've drunk the kool Aid. That is the happiest place on earth. Like I love disney World, Disneyland, Disney World, Universal Studios. I love all of that because, to me, the imagination of walking. I'm a big Harry Potter fan. So's my younger sister. So for her thirtieth birthday, I took her to Universal Studios in Orlando. We spent like one day each at each park, and it was one of the best things I've ever done. I'm going to Orlando on Thursday, and I've got a bit of time off, and i was trying to find a friend to fly in just to go to the Universal really, So yeah, So I love just I love entering anything that makes me feel transported, anything that makes me feel like I'm moving into a totally new space and new world that was created from someone's imagination.
And so I love anything. And I like roller coasters a little bit to it.
So I love that I'm listening. I'm into the roller coasters.
I'm the kind of roller coaster rider that when I get to the park, I'm scared of all the ride. Every time it's like it's like the first time, and I'm like, I'm not getting on nothing, and then I get on the one ride and now I'm ready.
I'm that guy.
But I go to the parkment I'm not doing nothing. Yeah yeah, I'm just gonna be there with the kids nicely. You know, I'm screaming. I'm out of control.
I love that. I love that. Yeah.
No, And I think for me, you know, it's I'm always trying to. I try as hard as I can through my work when I meet people to show three sixty degrees in my personality.
But it's hard.
Right, you see a clip on social media, you see a tiny little clip of the podcast, and then you have a perception of someone, and I think, again, like we were talking about earlier, you can have such a limited perception of someone in a thirty second clip, a sixty second clip. I'm always trying to share the most three sixty degree, multifaceted version of who I am because that's what I believe we all are. And I think the hardest thing I've had to do is give myself permission to be all of myself.
But I found.
That that's what what resonates, right. It's like what I realized is the world may not give me permission to be all of myself. But I have to give myself permission to be all of myself because I don't want to live just one dimensionally for the rest.
Of my life.
And by the way, I don't want to be around anyone who lives one dimensionally, And so I'm constantly working on saying.
How can I show up as my full self?
Which is why I let you in My first thought, which is like, why is Dwayne Wade not out today?
You know even I thought that.
Right, So I want to share that with people, so I have normal thoughts, like I'm not sitting here only having and lane thoughts all the time. And we've got to get rid of that identity for everyone because first of all, that's completely inaccessible. It's improbable, and it's impossible for anyone to even try to get to that. So why don't we all just let that down? But I think it's hard when, like I said, I'm trying to be abund spiritual friend, but when everyone wants you to be their teacher that guide it.
That's the challenge.
You know.
It's crazy that we hold people to a higher standard, then we hold ourselves to.
That.
We hold other people to away higher standard, then we hold ourselves to I talk about this. I do another show called The Wine Down where it's just me and the guys. We's kind of evergreen conversations. And I recently just said that exact same thing you said. I just I want to live a full life. And that's my goal. That's my that's the part of my purpose is to live a full life and understanding by living that full life.
Obviously each day ain't gonna.
Be pizzas and cream, right, You're going to experience this all of what life has to offer and to give you.
But I'm here to live a full life.
And you know, I think people when they see you trying to live a full life, they're.
Like, no, no, what you're doing? Why are you trying to live? Hold on?
I need you to do this, not what you're doing. So you know, I love that. I love Let's once again I like minded. You know this, and we just.
Spoke about this recently on the podcast about the full life.
I did have one question as far as the two of you, because you both come from different spaces and obviously Dwayne's basketball playing with all his trophies behind them and everything like that, but you see Jay and you have like your infinities for what he's done, but he sees you and for what you've done. And so what is it like just you now in this space and more and more people like Dwayne are coming to you for all the things, and you comeing to someone else about things that are profound that you're trying to access. How's that exchange usually in the beginning, and how does it develop into anything else more than that?
So I feel for you.
Yeah, what I feel for me is do you want to go first? One?
What I feel for me is that it's really fulfilling because if someone reaches out to me or connects with me, it's because they share a value and so whether the value is purpose or meaning or fulfillment, and so that's what they want to build a relationship around. And I think that's a really beautiful thing, because building a relationship around something as high a value as that is pretty rare in this world.
So I really value it. I love it.
It doesn't matter to me who it is, the fact that someone's saying to me that purpose is one of their top priorities in life and fulfillment, whether that comes from family or legacy or like you were saying, you were advising a mom about her son, like wherever that comes from. To me, that's one of the most rewarding things in my life. No one's reaching out to me for anything else because I don't have anything else to offer, and I'm okay with that, Like I'm at peace with the fact that that's all I have to offer. So if someone wants something else, they're not coming to me, and that's great, Like, you know, it's very clear like this, this is what I'm offering. Yeah, And I think that for me, I have a lot of respect for anyone who's pushed themselves, challenged themselves, developed mindset, still carries themselves with a humility and a consciousness which feels real and authentic, and I gravitate towards that. I think for me, I get attracted to people who have achieved incredible things but still are grounded. To me, that's the most attractive combination in a human being, because to me, it shows that they still believe they can learn, and it shows me that they believe that they've just simply walked in the footsteps of other greats, and that's how I feel. So again, we share a value and then it starts from a place of mutual respect, and so it's evolved into great friendships, it's evolved into great professional endeavors with people, it's evolved into just connection of family. And you know, my wife and I weren't born and raised in LA. We don't have family here. So for us, we found a lot of community through that as well. But it's been a beautiful experience where it's very clear what we stand for. So in one sense, it makes a really good what's do our word. It's kind of like a really easy checking system for people because some people go, oh yeah, Jay don't like drinking late at night, so I'm not going to reach out to him now, right, whatever it is, it's just very clear and I'm good with that. Like I don't need to go to a party or I don't need to. I just want to spend So.
You don't need to invite, You don't need like some people just need to invite, even though no.
Oh yeah, I want to be where I'm where I feel purposeful, like I always say, like I always someone said to me one like, Jay, you always seem comfortable wherever you go, And I said, I feel comfortable because I know why I'm there.
Going back to the why, right, It's like.
If I know why I'm there, then I'm comfortable. But if I don't know why I'm there, then I probably shouldn't be there. So I think, for me, whether I am showing up to an event, or I am showing up to a party, or I am showing up to being here today, I feel like I'm clear on my why. And if I'm clear on it, then that's great. But if I'm not, then I won't go. And so then the invite doesn't solve it because the invite is more of a moment for me to question whether I need to be there or not.
I should have went first. I shouldn't let my own podcast.
I'm going to answer the question away that I think that I want to explain it. I think for me, you know, in this space, right, like when I was a kid, and you have a dream, your goal is to you want to be the best.
Right.
I wanted to play basketball and I wanted to be the best, right, and I wanted to and to be the best, you have to win. So I wanted trophies, I wanted rings, I wanted champagne baths. I wanted to feel that. And I'm so thankful that I've been able to feel that. But I think in the midst of that, if the feeling is so fleeting, it's really the moment the day after the parade, and then it's kind of like it's gone.
And I worked my entire life, I've lost sleep for this moment.
So why someone like Jay, you know, you look at where I am and I'm like, oh, I need.
I need.
What Jay has is because I'm trying to find purpose that I thought this was my purpose. I thought my purpose was to be a great athlete and to win, and you know what they tell you, and then you get out here and you're like, well, I did that, I have this, I have that, and I still I still I don't feel anything. And so I'm trying to find what my purpose is. And so when I see someone who is purpose driven and it can teach me about purpose and even defining what purpose is and appointment and direction, I'm all in because it is. I feel like my journey now is to really live in purpose. I've lived and and did everything I dreamed I wanted to do from the sport I lived in and I was like, oh wait, life still.
Goes right here like nothing else happens.
And so that's kind of been my journey since I retired is really it's been very intentional and very purposeful of the things I do, the places I show up, the people I have around me, because I'm trying to find, at the.
End of the day, what is my purpose on this earth?
We all are here for a reason, and in my seasons i'm here, I want to be purposeful. And so that's why you go out and you find people who you perceive as gurus and who you perceived are the best because they can help clear it for you. You know, they can move the trees out the way and you know, and they can clear it for you. So that's a reason why someone like me reaches for someone like Jay.
Yeah.
Yeah, And I love One thing I wanted to add to that was and I love reminding people that often when we get to that place where you've got everything you haven't or you haven't got everything you wanted, we often feel like, oh, my life's been a waste or everything up until now doesn't have purpose, And actually it completely has purpose because it's what really led you to asking the question, what is my purpose or what do I want to focus on? And so nothing's a waste of time. No moment or career path is ever a wasted journey because it brought you to that exact point similarly as mind did. And so I don't know how much you guys like movies or how much you're watch them, but yeah, so you everyone. Have you seen the Liam Neeson movie Taken?
Right? The old school right? So Taking is a.
Great example of what I mean by this. So he loses his daughter's attention and love because he's too busy being a security guy right on along those lines. But then it's those same skills that win his daughter back. And so in the same way, as you've developed all these skills and mindsets that led to all of this greatness, at one point it kind of feels what was it all for? But it's going to be the same skills, the same mindsets, the same platform that's going to help you live your purpose and win your daughter back in that in the purpose sense.
And so it's like this really beautiful trade off.
Like how we think it's a oh no, no, no, I need a hone new set of skills and I need to hold it. I'm like, no, no, no, Actually it's using those same skills that you've owned, and just we directing them this way.
So much opens up.
So I love that you're right.
That right makes sense.
I mean it kind of goes back to something recently we talked about on one of my podcasts, Regret, Right, we talked about regretting. We all have our different versions and you know, places that we have regret at. But then you come back and you ask the question, well would you change anything? And sometimes like, well no, I wouldn't change it. And it's like, well, what do we regret it if you're not willing to go back and now if you could change it, Because a lot of reasons why you won't change it is because you are where you are because of exactly the sacrifices that was made to you know, allow that regret to creep in. Because normally regret keeps saying because you're not able to be something for others or someone that they need or that you want to be, and so you have regret.
But yeah, yeah, yeah, regret is just regret, is just reflection that's still stuck in pain. And so when you start shifting from that pain to purpose, then that regret turns into healthy reflection. So regrets, just reflection, still stuck in pain and stress and trauma and pressure. And when you rise out of it, like you said, you realize I'm here because of all of that.
Yeah, how do you handle highs versus lows? Like I would I be able tell if you are at a high or you at a low? Like do you show it on your face? Respression?
Like I would say that the people who spend a lot of time with me and know me well, they would tell for sure, for sure, like I don't think. I think In the past, I used to see hiding it as a strength, and now I see hiding it as a weakness because I found that if I'm not willing to show the people that love me deeply that I'm human, then who will I show? And then that circle just gets smaller and smaller and smaller and smaller, And now you can't even show yourself that you're human. And that feels really lonely. And I don't want to feel lonely. And that's what I've realized that the reason why a lot of people feel lonely is because we don't show our pain to the people that love us, and therefore we don't feel heard, seen, understood by those people, and that's what it means to feel lonely because I never let you in. I never showed you that weakness. So whether it's my chief of staff on my team, or I'm really close to and she's been with me for a long time, whether it's obviously my best friends from back at home, or whether it's my wife who I've been with for eleven years now. Like those people, whether it's professional or personal, they can see it. And I think if we spend more time together, you'd see it too, because I want you to see it, and I want you to see it not because I'm trying to teach or make a point. I want you to see it because I think that's when we can truly say we're getting to know each other. And of course I don't think everything's for everyone to see either. I think we live in a world today where vulnerability means somehow that you have to tell everyone everything and show everyone everything you have. Yeah, And I don't think and I think that's too extreme too. Like so one extreme is I'm not going to show anyone anything, and the other extreme is I'm going to show everyone everything.
Life has rarely lived well in.
Either extreme, and so I'm going to show some people some things and I'm going to show other people other things based on their role and their part in my life and the way I handle highs and lows.
That was your question.
So the way I've done that poorly in the past with low's as I've hidden it, and the way I've done it poorly in the past with highs is I just moved on to what's next.
And I used to just move on. And I'm sure you've felt that way.
I mean, you know, like our next championship, next, this next ring. Yeah, it's a success mindset, what it's built on. And I think for me in HIGHS, what I realized was that was an opportunity not just to celebrate myself, but to celebrate every person who got me there. To take an opportunity to turn celebration into gratitude to each and every person that got me there, whether it's family, coaches, mentors, teachers, guides. How could I use my success as an opportunity to celebrate others, not just celebrate myself. And I think now, when a success happens, I usually sit down and write who got me here? And I try and think about the in between people. Sometimes there's even people that I know, like we connect and I'm thinking, wait, how do me and Dwayne first connect? Like who is that person? Chances are you forgot that person. I want to find that person and go and thank them because we're sitting here today because someone thought it was a good idea for us to connect to years ago, and maybe even before that, and I've forgotten who they are because maybe it was just an email to a team or someone else like in between. But let me go to find that in between person and thank them because I got to have this wonderful exchange because of them, because someone had an idea long before I did. So that's how I try and handle my highs. I also try and handle my highs is how does everything not have to be higher, bigger, better now? But how can it be deeper, more truthful, more meaningful now? Because I think as humans and as men, we can just want to climb the next big mountain. What's the bigger mountain, what's the biggest step, what's the next hill that we're going to climb? And then you just end up at the top of this hill and the views a bit better, but you're still feeling lonely, disconnected, and now you feel like you can't relate to anyone. So I go, no, how can I actually go deeper into the valley? Right, Maybe we don't need to climb the next mountain. Maybe we need to walk downwards and inwards. And so I try and change the journey from being constantly outwards. And I think that comes from taking risks, it comes from pivoting. I think what you're doing with media and entertainment is a perfect example of that. Right, you could continue in your career path and maybe you become a coach or maybe and there's nothing wrong with that.
That's great too, and maybe you will one day.
But the fact that you decided to pivot, that shows that there's a part of you that's searching for something else, and that's a beautiful thing. And then with my lows, I think my biggest thing that has helped me with my lows is to recognize that I get a lot of one percent experiences in life, and the universal rule and law of balance means I also have to get the one percent experiences of the low. And I can't change that law because I'm not God, I'm not the universe, and I'm not that powerful, and so I get a lot of special, beautiful, wonderful experiences in life that life is given to me. I can accept them greatly, but I also have to allow the balance to exist of the one percent of the things I don't want to experience.
How do you cut it off? Right?
Like, if you get to a place where a lower is looking you in the face and you're now giving in to that low, how do you?
How do you stop it? How do you cut it off? How do you how do you use the practice?
Yes?
Yes, right in the midst of being there?
Yeah, I would say that for me, I have to focus on how I feel about what's happening. And a lot of the time we're worried about what our loved one thinks about what's happening, or what everyone else is thinking about what's happening. So texting our friend and checking what they think about what's going on in our life, we're texting a family member asking what they think is going on, And to me, I have to shut down that noise to be like, well, what do I think about what's going on? Why do I think this is happening? Why do they think I'm going through this and that can be a scary thing because it's so much easier to be comforted by everyone. But for me personally, I find if I'm comforted by everyone, then I don't know what's going on inside here. And so to me, I find sitting in that discomfort and listening and being present and reflecting is so powerful for me because I get to hear my own voice, and I find that most of my stress comes from not listening to my voice, but everyone else's noise.
And so that's step one.
I think Step two for me is, now that I've understood my voice, I want to share that with the people that I love and trust, not in order to get their validation or clarity or agreement, because I think that's what we often do.
We seek that.
It's actually for a chance for me to learn how to explain it in a way that feels authentic to me. So now let me explain my struggle. Let me explain my pain, not so that they go, oh, I fully understand you, but in a way that I feel I've really understood myself. And then the third and final step is something that's been said for years by Kobe, who I love, who talked about what you can change and you can't change. I think for me, it's I make a long list of everything I can control, everything I can change, and then I have to tolerate the things that can't change. Right, Like a tree can move in the direction of the sun, but it can't change the climate that it lives in. But it can choose to move in the direction of the sun. It can choose to deepen its roots and spread out wide and get more nutrients, but it can't choose whether it s noose or rains today. And so to me, some things have to be tolerated and some things have to be transformed. And I get really clear on both of those because most of my stress comes from things I'm tolerating that I should be transforming, or things that I'm trying to transform that actually need me to tolerate them. And so that's where the balance is lost.
Yeah, I cannot wait to listen back to this podcast. I'm going to say. I'm going to learn so many different things.
I did have a question as far as what is it like And obviously you're married as well, Dwayne, but it's like, what is it like now trying to be all these things for everyone? Else, but also be that person for your mate every day and trying to keep that balance because your life it's about balancing.
How do you do that?
That's a great question. I think there's a question my wife wanted to know. Yeh, like, how do you do that? I go first on this one.
It is a great question because I think it's a lot of times where you do a poor job of it.
I do a poor job of it.
Then there's times where I'm giving everything I feel like I need to it, but I definitely feel that a poor job is done often because when I and I say to say, when I retired, right one of the things that I did immediately right away was I decided to like get into therapy. And the reason I decided to get into therapy because I didn't want to dump all the things and all the emotions and feelings that ill ed to you know, be able to express on the court. I want to dump one of the ones closest to me, because that's normally where it goes. In that same token, you know, you're trying to be all for everyone, you know, kids, you mother, father, the world, and in the same breath you forget the person right right next to you and.
Giving them and feeding them you know what they need.
And so sometime it takes a little snapback for me, you know, sometime it takes my wife to be like uh. And it's sometimes you know, it's about the group around Here's the people around you as well that is not pulling you away, that's also helping you and understanding can see at the same time, you know, he hasn't been home, he hasn't had time.
Leave him alone. He needs to put that in.
And so to answer, I would say I've done a poor job at times, a lot of times, and I think at other times I'm you know, obviously I've done an incredible job. But it's something that no one teaches you. No one told me that I needed to be all these things for myself and for my kids and for this and for that and for that. And it's just feeling of I want to be perfect and all I want to be perfect and all of them for everyone, but I'm only giving twenty percent over here, twenty percent over here, twenty percent over here. So sometimes I feel like I'm I need like I need a body.
Double right no time, I feel like I need more.
And I think that more comes from Like you said, it don't come from just you because you get dried up. That more comes from something else, something bigger. And so I think that's when I'm probably my best self, when I'm able to tap into something bigger, when I'm in my meditation, when I'm on my work. IU was like, when I'm on this structure, when I'm home for a month and i can schedule everything and structure my life and do all that, I'm giving it all. But when I'm not and I'm on the road and i'm gone, I do a terrible job. I'm sure of giving more, you know, to my wife, I'm sure.
Yeah, that's a beautiful answer.
Yeah, I was thinking as I was listening to I can agree with I fully agree with everything you're saying. And I feel like I've been very lucky to marry someone very tolerant, very patient, very accepting.
Of who I am.
And I think I think one thing we need to remember is that we think if someone loves us, they should just understand us. And I actually think if you love someone, you should help them understand you. Right, So we think if someone loves us, they should just get us, But if I love them, I should be helping them understand me. And so for me, the times have been my best is when I've actually had the courage to communicate, hey, this week, i'm really stressed out. If I'm a little checked out, it's not you, it's just me dealing with some stuff. I'm sorry I said that yesterday. You know, I just reflected on it and I just walked out of something and I shouldn't have dealt with it that way. When I can communicate why it happened, what happened, for what reason it happened, because I know it was in me. When I can actually take some time to get that, and sometimes I won't because I don't have the time. So some things I realized like three months later, and I'm like, oh god, man, I said that thing three months ago, and now it's too late, and now I don't want to bring it back up because then there'll be another. But it's like the more I can give myself that space to ask myself that question. Like I remember my wife once said to me, she said, I've just had a really hard day, and my response was, tell me about it.
I've just had a really hard month, Oh right, And so I was taking her.
I was taking her moment of vulnerability and making it about me.
But why did I do that?
Because I had not communicated that I was having a hard month. If I had told her that, I would have let her have her moment, and then I would have already had mine. But because I didn't have the courage to expe breast that I was having a tough time, I had to take her moment and make it about me. And so I find that I'm at my weakest when I'm not effectively sharing how I feel, why I feel that way, why I acted that way, because I'm making it either about her or I'm making about something else. And I feel like my most powerful when I can honestly say to her, this is why I am this way, this is what I'm going through, and therefore, just give me some space right be aware of.
Where I'm at.
So I still make mistakes about this all the time, like this is not like a solved thing. But and I find it's when I'm not giving myself the time and space.
I feel like Jay is like a mirror, like he said so many things that I'm like, I'm looking inside of this mirror and I'm like, oh, dang.
I gotta. I got some work to do as we get to the end.
J One question I have was about spiritual awakening. I think I've heard it for so many people. My mom, who's had her own journey, I think she's felt what spiritual awakening is and that moment it taps on your shoulder. Can you explain to me what is spiritual awakening and how do you identify it if it's something that you you know that you receive.
So in order to understand what a spiritual awakening is, we have to understand what materially sleeping is.
Right.
If you think about the term spiritually awakened, the opposite is materially asleep. A materially asleep person is focused on that which is temporary, that which is ephemeral, that which is fleeting and passing how you describe some things. A spiritually awakened person is focused on that which is ever existing, eternal, blissful, that is ever expanding, not ever shrinking. And so to me, a spiritually awakened state is likened to the experience of waking up from a dream. When you're in a dream state, everything feels real, whether someone's chasing you, whether someone broke into your house, whether you are about to fall off the edge of a cliff. Everything feels real. And then when you wake up, you can actually remember that and realize it wasn't real. And now you can actually look at reality. You're in your bedroom, there's the window outside, there's the sun, and you start kind of finding your bearings again, and then you take action in the real world. And so spiritual awakening is like waking up from a dream state. So right now, if we're not spiritually awakened, we're living in a dream state where everything around us feels real and it feels like it matters. It feels fleeting. But the truth is a dream is temporary. It's not real because it doesn't last. And so when you wake up from a dream state, you can actually look at reality. And so to me, spiritual awakening is simply that feeling of And I'm giving another movie of reference because I love movies. You guys, see an inception. Inception is one of my favorite movies of all time, and I love the concept of how an inception they get stuck deep in a dream, within a dream, within a dream. So imagine how many dream states we're stuck into. So spiritual awakening is like, oh, I broke one dream state, all right, broken, now the dream stay Okay, now we broke. Now we got the real kick and woke up from the deepest dream state. And so spiritual awakening is also not a one time thing. It's a consistent, layered process because we're constantly waking up from dreams. And when I say dreams, I don't mean dreams in the sense of what do you want to achieve? I mean dreams in the sense of where are you sleeping in your life and existing in something that isn't real? And I think we've all had that experience. Well, you thought something was real, but then something happened to you a family member, and you were like, no, no, no, that wasn't real.
This is real. Right.
It's like if anyone God forbid, gets a phone call that they don't want to get, it's like, all of a sudden, everything that feels real and stuff that wasn't real. And so I think we've all experienced that, And that's why I like sharing that is what spiritual awakening is, because I think we'll be able to notice that, oh, the things I used to value, I don't value those anymore. All the things I used to think were important, I don't think are important anymore. The things that I used to chase, I don't chase anymore. That is spiritual awakening because I'm being directed to wake up out.
Of the dreams.
It does.
I've been on your podcast, and I'm going to have to come back.
We talked about this, especially after this conversation going on.
We keep doing this. You know, it's so much as being you know, it's being learned. So I thank you for being candidate and open to it. How I end the podcast always is the title of it the why. And you've obviously you've done so much to this point. Obviously, I mean just even reading your book, just even understanding from you know, how early in your life when you decided, you know, to take this turn and go into you know, being a monk and coming out of it after three years and you know, becoming this sensation you know, uh, YouTube and meditation and all the things that you've accomplished to this point.
So as you sit here today and you think.
About once you leave here, you know what you want to accomplish going forward? What is your why and what is your why going forward? Of the things that you want to be to others and you know, be to yourself.
Yeah.
So my wife has always been the same as it has since the beginning, and I feel it's still the same today. The shape looks different, the vehicles look different, but but the why, the root is the same and it's I just really want to help give people access to the ancient wisdom of the world that has either been lost, left behind, feels inaccessible, or irrelevant, but find a way to share it in the most engaging, entertaining, and simple way so that people can actually live it and feel the benefit in their lives. I believe that there are timeless tools and habits and practices that if anyone in the modern world today would take up, that they would experience the shift. And I can say this because I don't have confidence in myself. I have confidence in these tools. They've lasted the test of time. Meditations old, stillness is old. Being in nature is old. Like these things have always been accessible, but if we learn how to do them in an engaging, entertaining, elevating way, our lives will become happier, healthier, and more healed. So my why is how do I use the skills and the gifts that I've been given in order to help the world become more happier, healthier, and more healed. I can't do what you do. I can't do what so many other people do, and those people can't do what other people do. And I think for me, I live in joy knowing that I've just found my little place of what I'm meant to do. And I hope that my purpose can be to help other people find their purpose. Because if everyone just did what they were meant to do in their own way, we'd respect each other more, we'd appreciate each other more, we'd see greatness in others and not feel envious, but feel excited about it. And if we all knew our space and place, then we'd have an amazing impact. We'd be better parents, we'd be better partners, we'd be better people if everyone knew what their purpose was. And so that's what I'm dedicated.
Man.
Last time I seen you, we were both on Kelly Clarkson, Yeah, And I remember telling my team as we were walking out, and I was like, did y'all feel his presence when he walked in the room. It was like everything just got quiet. It was like I felt like I was it felt like I was floating in a sense. It was like you have this way, this touch, this energy to spirit, and so I thought, I was like, man, I like that guy.
But then someone said, do.
You know he has a tattoo of a of a fist and a microphone And I said, oh, really like the Source magazine And I was like, I really really.
It's it's it's actually ironic because my favorite wrapper is eminem and then Benzino owns Source, and but I got the Source tattoo Source logo tattooed on my neck because I loved hip hop growing up, like that was my last.
Because I was told that the next I was told, I don't know.
If this is true anymore because I didn't go as far as I wanted to. But my whole idea when I was growing up was I was gonna have my whole upper body tag. I don't but I was told that the neck was the hardest place because it hurts the most.
I was like, I'm going to.
Start there and if I can do that, then I'll be able to do the rest. And so that was the theory behind it. But I never gone very fast.
I don't know, but yeah, man, yeah, I love wrapping hip hop growing up. It's it's that's my favorite thing.
I love it. I love it.
That's why I do. I go to concerts now. I like to go.
Do you sing all all the lyrics? Like when you're at the council did you lose your voice and just go horse after?
Maybe? We did go to the fifty cent concept last year and I knew everywhere. Yeah everyone.
I like going to concerts where I know the lyrics.
Yeah yeah, ex honored, honored, Thanks for spending this time.
Thanks for driving through traffic to get here.
Everybody on the why everybody please thank Jay said he for coming on and giving us a moment.
I appreciate you, Jay,