Thanks for listening to The Herd podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday from twelve to three eastern, nine to noon Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and FS one. Find your local station for The Herd at Fox Sports Radio dot com, or stream us live every day on the iHeartRadio app by searching Herd. You're listening to Fox Sports Radio. Ah, here we go, it's out. We're number two and a Monday live in LA. It's the Herd wherever you may be and however you may be listening iHeartRadio, Fox Sports Radio FS one. I have so much fun. Saturday night went ski and Saturday had a terrible crash, came home, poured myself a bourbon with my neighbor and Jason, and had to watch the Celtics Lakers second half was great and then I'm a stinker yesterday Philadelphia, San Francisco. But I'm sitting there watching sports yesterday, Kansas City, Cincinnati, and my daughter's over and uh, you know, we're making pizza and stuff. And I'm sitting out thinking to myself, how lucky am I? How grateful of I? I do this for a living. I watched sports Bourbon and talk about it is this the best life in the world. It's right up there. I can't complain. Yeah. I was talking to some buddies at a fortieth birthday party over the weekend. They're big fans of the show. Yeah, and I was like, we're not splitting the atom. You know, for three hours we're talking about basketball and football and building teams and fun. It's like so much fun, you know. I was thinking about this that the Jalen Hurts story is pretty cool, and you could look at Jalen Hurts and go, oh my god, I can't believe he ended up being in this position. But as he was standing next to Terry Bradshaw on the stage yesterday, First of all, Jalen's taller than you think. What's funny about pro athletes? If you ever walked up to I'm six two and chiseled, and a couple of times I would run into Steve Nash at my workout club. He lived around here. Steve's significantly taller than me, and I'm taller than almost everybody I'm around at work. Right, Steph Curry six four, and you've been around Steph Curry, Hu, you forget Steph looks like he's tiny because he's around six nine. Guys, So Jalen Hurts is next to Terry Bradshaw. Bradshaw six two. I mean, I think Jalen Hurts is standing next to him and like he's noticeably taller. But it's so it's fascinating that he had to leave Alabama. But think about all the quarterbacks. Now, Joe Burrow had a transfer. Ohio State has a lot of smart people in football. They were like, nah, yeah, and it's not going to work here to Joe Burrow. Mahomes went tenth Texas Oklahoma in the Big twelve, didn't offer a Scully Brady went sixth round. Dak was in the playoff fourth round. Josh Allen didn't get a college scholarship. Finally one to Wyoming. These are the best quarterbacks in the world. The best quarterbacks in the world is about seven of them. Look at all of their routes. So they argument, I look at Jalen Hurts and now I was thinking about it yesterday. Aaron Rodgers went to a junior college. A junior college. That is the route for greatness being doubted. You know, I tell my kids all the time, you can talk about education, you can talk about a lot of areas that create greatness, but through my life the one word that owas it comes back to. I was watching a special on Bill Russell this weekend, just a remarkable life story. It's resilience. Junior College Wyoming, sixth round, fourth round, too short, You're not good enough for Ohio State. You're not good enough. What are the great ones all ev in common? It's not that they were dominant high school players. It's not that they have the strongest arms, it's not that they're all the same size. All of them are resilient. And as we soften our kids up and give them what they want and the best camps and the best this and the best tools, you're not creating resilience. These guys are fighters. Jalen Hurts is a fighter. Burrows a fighter. Mahomes is out there wincing in pain. That's what all these guys share. They've been doubted, they've been hit, their hurt. Resilience that is now not an outlier. Jalen Hurts is actually perfect to be a star quarterback in this league. He's literally perfect, not quite perfect, size, banged up runs too much, has to develop. Doubted and then Nick Sirianni puts his arms around him and says, no, young man, I believe totally in you, and it's jet fuel. And he just works. He outworks everybody. I swear to God. I saw the pictures of Jalen Hurts in camp when he came to camp year, You're all yoked up, and I'm like Lamar Jackson, same thing. Lamar got doubted you're going to be a receiver. And every year you'd see Lamar come to camp and he had traps and he was ripped, and You're like, that is jet fuel. Is being told no. We tell our kids yes for everything. No creates resilience. And that is the story of remaining quarterback brock Purty seventh round, Jalen Hurts too small, Burrow transfer Mahome's tenth pick. It's incredible. I love the Michael Jordan's story. Obviously in high school where he you know, Michael Jordan's been known to fudge things a little bit, like, oh, they doubted me, and Jordan overcame it became one of the best players in NBA history. Like that writ and resilience, there is something there. I don't think it can be taught. I think you've just got to have it deep within you that I'm gonna bounce back from whatever these people say I can't do. I'm gonna do it. Yeah, I'm done doubt in Jalen Hurts. I don't even think he's healthy. I didn't even think he played one didn't it didn't. And two blowout wins in the playoffs. All right, Colin right, Colin wrong in them Monday, here we go where Colin was right. I had said earlier this year that I thought Maholmes and Burrow specifically had moved past Josh Allen. Burrow had moved you get all the greatness without a lot of mistakes. They've met now four times, last second outcomes, second time in the AFC Championship. I didn't think Burrow played particularly well, but you know, the last two years in the playoffs, Joe Burrow is literally running for his life. I think these guys have gotten to a point now where everybody, even the really really talented guys like Rogers and Stafford and Justin Herbert Nollen, you're all looking up at him where Colin was raw. Year after year, the Philadelphia Eagles totally confound me. They fired Doug Peterson. I hated that they moved off Carson Wentz. I didn't get it. They hired Nick Serriani. What are you doing? I gotta say something. Most organizations that make a lot of changes do because they're poorly run. The Eagles are the opposite. Despite a great tradition. They are willing to move off. Coaches, move off quarterbacks, move off systems, and they should be proud of it. There's a lot of bad football in that area of the country, Washington, the Jets, and the Giants over the last ten years, and yet the Eagles, always willing to acknowledge mistakes try something new, are once again the Kings of the Northeast. Where Colin was right, I said, I thought the Mahomes injury was being a little overplayed by the media and wouldn't affect really the game. Well, we had video, he was fine, he was a full participant practice in twenty nineteen. I think it was he had the same injury in the next week through for four hundred and forty yards. I didn't think the injury. I thought there was a couple of instances, and Tony Romo pointed them out where it looked like he just couldn't step into it quite as much. But in the end, Burrow was the better quarterback of the two best quarterbacks on the planet, where Colin was raw well. In my top ten players in this game last week segment, I did not have Hassan Reddick in the top ten. I think I had him eleven. Yeah, he proved me wrong. He was a game wrecker. Two sacks, fumble, recovery, forced fumble. He was just absolutely fantastic. You know, of the many great players Philadelphia has, we probably overlooked him a little bit, but he was a complete game wrecker and good for him where Colin was right. Well, the story's broken now, according to legitimate sources that Aaron Rodgers and the Packers a trade remains viable and very much on the table. We had said last week in the week before that, Aaron continues to ask for concessions. That's fine, but the payoff now is not even making the playoffs. Apparently, the Packers, according to an ESPN story, projected to be more than sixteen million over next year's salary cap. That got to dump people, maybe Mercedes Lewis or Randall Cobb. Aaron doesn't want that. I think at this point, if you're gonna ask for concessions. You got to get to the playoffs in the NFC, and the Packers didn't. Where Colin was wrong. This is a shocker. There's a report that Daniel Jones does have a market. It could be thirty million a year. By the way, do you get Brian Dable with him? What that? I'm way wrong because I don't see much of a market. I think the story is Dable and say Quon Barkley. But according to agents, and maybe agents are just driving it, there is a market for Daniel Jones. I don't get it. I'm apparently way off. I'm not seeing what somebody else is. But the agents report it's up to thirty million dollars annually. Wow. Where Colin was right said last week, I thought Sean Payton should probably pivot away from the Denver Broncos. And it appears to be the case because now Jim Harbaugh's interviewing again. It's nothing against the owners, I'm told it's the lack of cap flexibility in the issues with Russell Wilson. You're stuck with him for three years minimum. Sean Payton, it looks like has pulled out because Harbaugh's back in and in fact, many of the top candidates are moving away from this, which is not a terrible job on the surface, but the GM now doesn't have a ton of power. The coach will report to the owners. Mostly coaches would rather report to gms and not owners. So that's the very latest where Colin was right. I've been the biggest Andy Reid fan for a long time, and I will say this, and I said it a couple of years ago. He is now seventh straight division title, nine playoffs ten years, and another super Bowl, and Belichick couldn't make the playoffs. If offensive rules would have taken place like they have in the last six to seven years fifteen years ago, then we would view Andy Reid as the game's best coach and not Bill Belichick. Belichick grew up in an era where you could grab and mug players, injured quarterbacks drive him into the ground. The league now has pivoted and Reid has pulled away from Belichick. He drafts, develops, teaches offense at a level Belichick can't and never will. And I could not be happier for Andy Reid, who you know, there's sometimes in life you're waiting for people to get the success they deserve. I think if anybody in the NFL, everybody loves Andy Reid, like you just kept waiting for years and years in Philadelphia. You're like, this guy's great, this guy's great, he just he needs to help. The league actually did him a big favor because of safety concerns. They have made the middle of the field offense. And Andy Reid is now the best coach in the NFL. And there's a lot of sundays it doesn't look particularly close. Sean Payton's around the corner. One more Herd. The Herd streams twenty four hours a day, seven days a week. Within the iHeartRadio app, Search Herd to listen live or on demand whenever you'd like. Start the year with a new wireless deal with Consumer Cellular dot Com Slash Herd. Consumer Cellular dot Com Slash Herd twenty bucks a month. All it takes. Don't have to get rid of your phone, don't have to change your number, no activation fee, Consumer Cellular dot Com Slash the Herd promo code. The Herd got one football game left, then we go into free agency, then we go into the combine and draft. This is a good time. You you were making Jamax joining me. You were making. You had a little bit of a theory. I was saying, to start the show today, Bill Russell eleven titles, Jordan six. We don't just count titles. Robert Ory I think has like seven, Kissy Jones has the late Casey Jones had a lot. But we decided stylistically, athletically that Jordan was the better player than Russell. Could I not make the argument that like Mahomes, Brady he's better than everything with Tom. And now that he's got the feel of the pocket, as he's developed, you know, all these quarterbacks get a little smarter every year. He's just doing stuff that Tom could never do. Everything that Tom's done, Patrick can do things Patrick do now Tom can't do and never could do. Brady also got championships early because of Belichick's defense. You know, he got a championship because of an interception by Butler in the end zone. And I'm not taking anything away from Tom. Tom's the most productive, you know, But when you look at here's a great question to ask, what can Brady do that Mahomes can't Nothing. There's multiple things that Mahomes can do Brady can't. We're not just it's just not about stack and trophies. Dan Marino's one of the ten best quarterbacks in league history, never won a Super Bowl. Dan Marino was insanely talented. He was a bigger, stronger version of Aaron Rodgers. I mean, he was just and just, I mean just maybe the best arm talent outside of a Mahomes I've ever seen play. Doesn't have a championship. Barkley. Charles Barkley could score in the paint, could score in transition, could score from the perimeter. I actually think if he would have had the work ethic of MJ or magic, Charles Barkley is one of the most amazing basketball players I've ever seen. Doesn't have a championship, So your theory was so essentially a lot of people want to say Michael Jordan's six titles the greatest ever. Obviously his six and O in the finals. That's kind of like the casual obvious regular dudes think that when you get a little nuance and think about it, Lebron has accomplished way more. He's a much more complete player. He's a true unicorn. Kobe Bryant came along and was basically a carbon copy of Jordan, right the identical there is no other lebron in nbat's try. You look at Mahomes versus Brady, and Mahomes is still young. I think we would agree. Mahomes, like you said, does everything better than Brady. If you have one final drive, you gotta go eighty yards in sixty s. By the way, and by the way, you're missing two receivers and your own lines. Okay, yeah, it's not close. Well, not only missing two. They got rid of Tyreek Hill and they have a bunch of like b receivers. You were solid and by way, those guys were hurt. Yeah, you were on some guy that had more tackles than catches. He was the number two options. And this is not diminishing Brady. Obviously he's tremendous. But when you just look at everything Patrick Mahomes can do, extending the plays with his legs, some of the creative side art, I mean, he is. We can't just go on awards. Phil Jackson has how many Coach of the Year awards, one or two. That's not silly. He's the best coach in basketball. You know, outside of red arbox. You can make an argument he is the best basketball mentor. Steve Kerr That's why Steve Kerr's great. His tree of people that he's connected with. So I'm just not somebody that goes. I used to work in local TV. A lot of people wanted to win awards, and they build a resume or a tape to win awards. They were never the best people. We can't just go well, they want Emmy's and they were Mahomes is jo. I don't care what it says. Jordan was better than Russell. He was more skilled. Overall, Lebron does far more things than Michael Jordan. He's a bigger, stronger body, He's a thousand times better distributor, he's a better ball handler, he's aged better. He makes everybody around him better. Jordan often took shots away from people. Everybody plays their bass basketball except Russell Westbrook with Lebron James. Yeah, so you know, no, I've never been into this. How many awards didn't you win? My eyes tell me mahomes is the greatest individual talent to ever play the sport. Now. I think he's gonna be up against it with Philadelphia because I think Philadelphia's roster is your early read, and it's early. It's probably Philadelphia. I would agree. Early read has to be filled. That defensive liner reminds me. Do you remember San Francisco dominated the first three plus quarters in that Super Bowl against the Chiefs. Mons could do nothing until the bomb with about eight minutes left to Tyreek Hill that totally flipped the game. San fran was in control of that. I think the Eagles can control the line of scrimmage. Check totally agree, Jamack with the news. No, no, this is the herd line news. All right. Let's stick with Patrick Mahomes battling that ankle sprain to lead the Chiefs. He had another Super Bowl appearance after the win. He spoke about how his ankle was feeling throughout the victory. I try to do whatever I could to win, and obviously there was times where he could see that I wouldn't let me do what I wanted to. But uh, I was able to do enough in that last play to get the first down and get myself out of bounds um and try to give Harrison a chance to win. And obviously we got the flag and he pushed me, pushed me pretty late there. I definitely didn't feel good. I think the worst one was when I fumbled. I try to pick it up, and I was frobably the worst I'll tweaked that I had during the game. But uh, like I said, they got me, they got me closer they could to one hundred percent, and then um, I just battled through and I'll have a few more weeks to get it ready. I love when he fumbled. He went to the sideline and because it was it was like it felt like a turning point in the game. He fumbles, the Bengals get it. He went to the sidelines that he was He told every guy, we're good, don't worry about it. He immediately went I don't know if he apologized, but he's such a verbal player. He has no problem addressing anything controversial. He's just he's everything I want. You gotta own it. You make a mistake, Hey, I fumbled, that's on me. Next up the Eagles. They were the best team in the NFC all season long. Colin struggled down the stretch, but had an easy road to the Super Bowl. They are headed there after wins over Daniel Jones and Brock Purty. Jalen Hurts has been I had to I had to tweak that in there, and Josh Johnson, I forgot to mention that immortal quarterback, so Jalen Hurts has been a big reason for success. After the win, he reflected on the team's journey to the super Bowl. I don't really know how to feel, to be honest, you know, you worked really hard to put yourself in this position, and I'm forever grateful when we experience some painful times and some some tough time who always found a way to overcome. So, you know, you want to be going into it in a situation like this, and you know we have a chance to got a chance to go out there and win it off, so we want to prepare to go do that. Yeah, he's not right. Didn't have a lot of touch on the deep ball. A lot of his underneath stuff felt short. You can tell we talked about Mahome's injury. You can tell Jalen's not right if you go watch October tape and you watch him now. He's just not right. So we got two weeks to get it. You know, if I told you Friday, Jalen Hurts will go fifteen of twenty five for a buck twenty one, and he rushed eleven times for thirty nine yards, you would say Wow, tough night. How bad did the Eagles lose twenty one passing yards? Are you kidding me? All right? Final story, Tom Brady still thinking about his NFL future. One team is reportedly not in the mix to land the goat. Now these reports come fast and furious. The Dolphins are not expected to pursue Brady for twenty twenty three. Instead, they claim they will stick with Tua for at least another year. Colin A, are you buying this? And be like if you're not buying it, let mean come on, I don't know what to make of Miami, To be honest with you, I think was really hard for a front office. You know, Brian Flores was like this isn't gonna work. Mike McDaniel like it is and supported him. Then he got hurt. I think two is one of those situations when you're talking concussions and injuries. It's sensitive, it's nuanced. TA wants to play. They want to protect the organization and to h I don't know. You know a lot of stuff gets out from respected NFL reporters because somebody wants it out. Like why would Harbaugh get out? You could easily get Harbag could easily re engage with the Broncos, and that not get out because he wanted out. I heard a joke once that the Miami Dolphins have more leaks than the Iraqi Navy. Yeah, basically all this stuff is leaking out. That Tom Brady stuff. I don't know if you saw the Vic Fangio stuff. Yeah, apparently that's not a done deal. And now he's saying, well, there may be something else open for me, perhaps San Francisco, so Miami, Stephen Ross, I just I'm not a big How would you like to be a defensive coordinator in the Niners? Call that I get, I get both those linebackers. I get Vosa. That's a good gig. Vix earn it though vis worked hard, he's smart. That that's a good Oh they area, Yeah, I think I'll pick the phone up Jamack with the news. Well that's the news, and thanks for stopping by. Heard we get him back. We're not unhappy with that. I mean, we're wishing him the best if he wants to coach, but we like having him back. Sean Payton is joining us live the farmer Saints coach fifteen years, nine of those years a playoff team. Oh my lord, man, I get a walk in. I usually I'm not used to a walk in. I'm I'm usually sitting down. We've got well, I've got no idea what we're gonna talk about today, and I'm excited. I'm gonna say this though, before we even get started. You know when when a guest arrives here, you get kind of miked up in the back room and you can kind of hear the banter going on. And I'm listening to this Jordan lebron stuff and I'm like, I can't believe what I'm hearing. And I grew up in Chicago, and I'm like, are you kidding me? Are we actually comparing someone to Michael Jordans? And we don't have enough time in this segment, But that's like, we could easily spend an hour on that, and we'll save that for another way. We're always looking for June guests. Yeah, I'll definitely share an hour with Jordan and lebron Um. But no good stuff And obviously a good weekend of football. One game lived up to kind of what we were hoping. I had trouble with both of those games, handicapping them or two things come into play all season I'd been picking Kansas City in San Francisco, So you want to stay with your your your kind of gut. And then as you got closer than there's this conflict for me to win the big show. Bradshaw's got a point on me. And so if I picked the same two teams Bradshaw picks, I can't win. And so he goes Eagles. He want Eagles Chiefs. I want Niners Chiefs. And you know, I ended up watching my team with three different quarterbacks struggling a game. Let's start with that one. Yeah, So you know, and one of the things I've learned from you is that there's a lot of context and nuanced everything. We go to dinner and talk about stuff. You're thinking about everything, you're saying, I'm thinking about the Christmas card, what's the office look like? The idea that you know, you're just going out there and coaching there, doing some practice. And so I said, I figured, if Purdy played well, even if they lost, you come back into next season, I can keep all my guys. And then he gets hurt, and I think to myself, Kyle's sitting there thinking, Garoppolo got hurt, Trey Lance got hurt, brock Purdy got hurt, Joe, and I could see Tom's calling and saying, you know, I don't get hurt. Yeah, this window for this team, as you know, Sean Kittles, a physical player, gets dinged up. McCaffrey is bibo, is trens Old. I don't think this window in San Francisco's four years, no, look, and I don't know that any of us. And I think the myth. You know, there's there's two or three things, you know, halftime adjustments. Uh, they're taking place throughout the game. All right, Number one, this is the this is the wind the windows every year, you know, in other words, or we're gonna build three years from now, we expect to contend. No one's patient enough for that to ever happen. These are like things that I hear. And so it's now and they've got a really, really good team. And I would say, midway through the second quarter their quarterbacks out, it's fourteen to seven. And clearly the comment I made was what was the over under? Because I don't pay attention to that. The Unders looking pretty good. Both defenses are playing well. Yeah, And and just as we were watching that drive, someone we were in the green room, and and they keep a couple of us around in case there's some technical difficulties in Philly. So the big shows in Philly, but let's say something happens to the signal, they can't do a halftime or post game. They can come to LA and there's a group of us that can that can do the highlights. So we're kind of miked up in our suits, but we're really just watching the game and in talking about it. And I remember saying, just you gotta be careful here because it was like what was it one forty eight or two twenty three, or you know, it's like, look any one of these quarterbacks like Brady or Mahomes, you're not You're right into your two minute. You're thinking field goal, maybe touchdown. But you have Josh who's you know when you look at the reps he's had or hasn't had, not many. Yeah, you almost got to be looking at that like I want to be happy at fourteen seven. Yes, and we're gonna find a way to win this game in a different fashion. They rushed the punt, Philly had to punt backed up, and I said, I promise you they're gonna bring all right, all eight here, they're gonna try to create points because it's gonna be hard to find those points in other areas. That turnover touchdown was killer, I think in that game over Yeah, I just think because then you get to this this in fourteen points, you'd say, all right for us for a San Francisco offense, that's not insurmountable, but fourteen points for a quarterback that that now is going to be forced to make some plays. Um. So that was challenging. And and I do think I do think when you look at San Francisco and uh in their defense and they've got a good offensive line, they've got man, good skill. Their their window though is now now how long is that they're one of the teams. I mean when the season ends and we handicap next season, if it was a college team, they would be in the top four. Yeah, if we were you know, next year's NFL rankings, they would be one, two, three or four. Um. And it's because of the roster and they've done a good job with that. Yeah, Philadelphia. You know, one of the things I said this earlier that generally when a team makes a lot of moves, you're like, oh, that's a chaotic organization. They've had four coaches in twenty three years. They've all got winning records, They've had multiple quarterbacks and Super Bowls for as you know, as a proud Eastern city that loves its history, it's sometimes harder than it is for US West Coast people to move off stuff. Yeah, prep school, the churches when I lived out there, they take such pride in their churches. And here are the Eagles. They'll like, you know, Doug Peterson won us the Super Bowl with Nick Foles. We're gonna move off that, And I'm like, what are you doing? But the guy they're gonna face them next week. They moved away from Andy Reid. It's crazy, but you know what, it were a Howie Roseman. They reinvent themselves very uniquely in this league. How did you always view them? Well, my first NFL job was them nineteen ninety seven ninety eight rail Roads was the head coach. I was coaching at the University of Illinois and I had gotten a call they had a quarterback position open, and I never thought all I wanted to do was coach in the Midwest and the Big Ten and become a Big Ten head coach and so I was hired in ninety seven to be the quarterback coach for the Eagles. And on that staff, by the way, John Gruden was the offensive coordinator, Bill Callahan, the offensive line coach, David Shaw. All right, it was a quality control coach. We shared an office. Juan Castile, great coach, Emma Thomas, John Hardball. There was six six coaches, six NFL head coaches, in the basement of Veteran Stadium, grinding away. The facilities weren't great, but there it was a great introduction for me to the NFL and learning from so many people and a passion there. Yeah and yeah, and I lived there for probably, you know, a third of my life growing up, you know, peewee football until I was in eighth grade. We moved to Chicago. So I remember the Flyers in the seventy six ers, Phillies and all those teams, and they are passionate and and you know, going in there, it's a tough place to win. I mean that that is a tough place. In twenty thirteen, we played him in the wild card game, and this was Chip Kelly. Yeh. He had just come on the scene, you know, in other words, and that was the next best thing. And Chip does a great job, of course, and they're the favorites and we're playing him in Philly, and I told our team about, hey, this is this is what the day's going to be like, all right now, when you when you play in the playoffs, Um, your hotel advanced person doesn't have the same six month notice to book hotel. So these teams in the playoffs, you know you might be further away. We were in King of Prussia because there was a conference in the city and their last minute you win a game, They win a game, and you're in the next week you're booking a hotel. But I told him, when we pull off this highway here and you head down past the stadium on the right side, Bus one, you're gonna take six eggs, like as sure as we're sitting here, all right, And you know these little kids will be flipping you the heard a bus two, you'll get maybe three or four. They're gonna reload Bus three, you're gonna get another six. And so you're just preparing your team for the the the the events of the day. And then I went and had our graphics guy put together we have five buses that teams take into the stadium and we put a giant, when I say a giant ten feet by ten feet circle bulls eye on the right side of every bus. And so there was a center red circle, a white circle, a true archery bulls eye, but that was ten That was huge, and all five buses had it. And our players when they got up in the morning and they saw it, they chuckled. And so as we came off the highway that you know, the Eagles fans saw this and there, and it was like I wanted to plant people to throw eggs at our buses because your tea ready, you could just turn and say, everything's going according to plant. Oh that's smart, it's going just how I told you it was gonna go. And we ended up winning big in that game. And that was one of those games where we took two laps around the stadium and then went to the airport. Yeah, it was a little it was a little contentious, you know, because the first time you see the fan after a win there, ah, they're yelling at you. And then when they see you come back around that it's an aggressive move. But I thought they look fantastic. I'll say this all season long the one thing. And I don't think I don't think we've underrated them, But man, do they have a great offensive line. Oh my god. But the angles. There's a there's a touchdown run Philly has in the first half where you guys all saw that. It was like a man block by the guard Kelsey. The center comes around and actually out flanks the weak side linebacker and that linebacker never they do some things in the running game that no one else in our league is doing. And I said this yesterday, and I believe this. I felt like the winner of the NFC Championship game was going to be our Super Bowl winner. And I still believe that I do. I said this morning, I feel like Philadelphia, you can argue take quarterback out because neither one's totally healthy. I think you can argue, Philadelphia, every unit is as good or better every unit. Yeah. Defense, you had the top two defenses playing yesterday, Corners, so I think, um, and look the receiver depth of Kansas City that they did a great job yesterday, right, They thinned out Kelsey, they made they just made enough plays. It was like they were down to if it was a car finishing race. You know, they were down to three wheels. All right, the frame was all you know. It was like they crossed the finish line and then it went and and that's a credit to the team and Andy in that organization, all right. Back in the second Bengals chiefs thoughts after this were Sean Payton Live and la As the Herd. Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays and Noone Easter nine am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio FS one and the radio app two NBA Insiders podcasting twice a week to plug you right into the NBA grape fight, all happening in only one place. This League Uncut, the new NBA podcast with me Chris Haynes and me Mark Stein join us as we team up to expound on everything we're covering, hearing, and chasing. Listen to This League Uncut with Chris Haynes and Mark Stein on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcast. Well, you said the greatest workout you had ever seen was Patrick Mahomes in college. You and the Saints literally saw him and left town quietly because you didn't want anybody to know. One of the things, and explain this to me I said this yesterday and I said it this morning as well to a friend. I said, his ability to see something and how long from that instant until the ball is out of his hands seems less than a second. It's a cognitive He's obviously going a thousand miles an hour upstairs. When you time, you always say it was the most impressive workout. Some of it's just arm but I just there's something about his wheels turning upstairs. Yeah, I think you can. I think you're right. Well, it's a gift, and it's something that um, you know certainly it's it's through practice and hard work, and yet he can process. Uh. And I've used this analogy. Some of us get a brand new car and you've got you know, twenty twenty three model has got all these seat warmers and in sun roofs, And you know, I'm the type by the time I turn that car in, there's a handful of those features I've never touched the same, right, I just I just don't get to him. Yeah, he gets to every one of them. You know, how's your seat in the back left while he's driving and he's left blinkers on and he's making a left all right, that's a gift. Um, we felt like we saw that armed talent on tape. Obviously you see his ability to throw, like like there you know that funny body throw. That was an amazing throw ride. That's the one I went to Twitter after that one. God, mahomes is gifted. That was something to that. And so but when it came to the test or the you're trying to grate, you know, how quickly does he learn? You give him a bunch of stuff the night before, we're gonna fly in in the morning, and then we're gonna cover it with you. And what we had given him was more than we felt that he'd be able to. You know, we want you to look at it all throughout the night, look at it in the morning, and then hey, we'll kind of cover this. And it was two or three days of install, you know, like training camp install day one, installed day two, install day three. It'd probably be seventy four pass route concepts. It'd be maybe six play action concepts, two or three empty concepts. Quite a bit of information. And so the morning started with that and two hours in it was like we were out of questions, like he and so the ability to process quickly is a gift and some of them have it, a lot of them. It's hard. It's hard to it's hard to gauge, but a lot of them don't. And when you listen to the acoustics, the center of the guards have microphones. Now you guys can here's Cadence and it's amazing to hear him. Just you know, there's eight seconds left in the play clock, seven six five and he's like fifty eighth Mike, he changes it. Hey watch him on the run through. It just never stops. Like he's the epitome. And Drew is this way multitasking, you know, where he can All of this is going on, and it's he's comfortable with it, and that's rare. I gotta ask you a coaching question. We can blame the refs, but I mean, Kansas City had more yards, fewer turnovers, better pass protection. Kansas City, to me, is the better team. And I picked Sinsey the punt the sky more so. My takeaway on that was listen, I would have put it out of bound. The minute that thing went off. I went no, no, no, no, no. That kid can run twenty seven yards. It's midfield. My first takes game over what it would you be mad at the special team's coach. Well, I don't know what the plan was. Usually have a plan relative to we were always a directional punt team, yes, and so see if this makes sense, You've got your two outside gunners, and if you directionally pumped the ball, let's say, to the left, then you know you're gonna you're gonna populate that area of the field. And I felt the same way that the problem here was middle field no hang time. That's right, and so middle field no hang time is like fastball over the plate, Like, yeah, middle field no hang time, and then the rest is a problem. M What did you make of Burrow got very little protection early. I don't think Joe had a great game, but again he was the more rush quarterback. Then they made some adjustment so it got better in the second half. Yeah, Well, you saw the nudges and the chips and the you know, the even when the tight end released, there was a little bump before he got out and the backs got out trying to the pressure for Burrow was the internal pressure. You know the problems of Chris Jones. Holy cow, you know, it seemed like the one thing that concerned me, and because I would consider Kansas City a champion. It wasn't too long ago. They so they've got a tradition, they've got a quarterback, a head coach, and man. All week with the Yippinata Cincinnati and then Eli Apple, are you kidding me? So all that going on, and I just kept thinking, you know, all week, and you could see after the game the reaction that was something can't And so I felt like watching many of the audience won't remember fast times at Ridgemont High. But I felt like Chris Jones was the one whose car got smashed and painted and he just said, ah, he's just gonna destroy that. Let me ask you this though, when you watch the game, Cincinnati's offense, you know, became downfield a T. Higgins downfield to Chase. They really didn't consistently move the ball on they took some look the fourth down double move shot played to Chase. Who calls that on fourth down like an in pump into brackets? So they were doubling Chase. You saw they were doubling him, doubling you know. They were playing a seventy seven coverage two over here, two over here, man underneath on the others and uh, and it was more chunk plays. I look, I do, I do agree with you. Kansas City was a better team yesterday, and they played better, and yet we had all the other noise. You know, it wasn't a clean game from an official standpoint. Um, you know that. You it's like anything else, you want the game to end, in my opinion as a fan now, and you don't want to remember who officiated it, and you don't want to remember who announced, and then you probably had a good game, right, But if it becomes too much of the official or too much of whoever's in the booth, then you're like that those are accompaniments or you know something I don't want to I don't want to hear too much. And that's where I think the top Cruise Dance in Rome would do a good job. But but not too much there and not too much from the stripes, and we want to just see the game. I did think in twenty twenty three you can't push. You can't get a quarterback on one leg and bury him into the bench. No, every one of us, that nobody, there's nobody. I don't think that didn't feel that was Yeah, that's a foul day one. Now that's a hard one, though. We got about a minute and a half lest Yeah, you don't think it's hard. No, what do you tell your players on those on those corners, on the sideline plays. Listen, here's what we know. Was there any doubt that he wasn't heading out of bounds? Yeah, all right, And so when he's heading out of bounds, you got a lot of momentum here, just hands off and just you just run behind him, guide him. Yeah, he's running out of bounds. And so you know, Parcels used to say, dumb players do dumb things, and and I meaning at the heat of the moment. Here, this this the hopes and dreams of everyone in Cincinnati and the team. And this was unfortunate because because he played well, he played well throughout the game. But I think going to the sidelines, um, I think certainly with the direction he was going, it was just a mistake he made. And h you know, it's a tough mistake. Yeah. And I also, you know, it is a game of intimidation. And I mean I've heard the old saying you play to the whistle. So I always feel a little bit of sympathy for guys, because playing defense, offense is choreography. Defense is blowing stuff up to Ray Lewis used to say this, It's like part of my job was to make people uncomfortable. Yeah, I want to think too much. Well, we saw Andy there was a penalty called on one of the chiefs offense, the hunting thing. And all you keep talking about is man smart. Just keep thinking about the end game. And so all week you're you're wanting to eliminate things that might be the difference. Keep thinking about the end game here, all right, don't get upset because the lollipops at the bank were great while you're leaving with five hundred million dollars. All right, get out of the bank before you get caught, right, And so understand the main thing, and that's to win and to win and to win and to play in the super Bowl. And so it's difficult, it's difficult. We gotta go our three next. Sean Payton was great as always. The Herd

Thanks for listening to The Herd podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday from twelve to three eastern, nine to noon Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and FS one. Find your local station for The Herd at Fox Sports Radio dot com, or stream us live every day on the iHeartRadio app by searching Herd. You're listening to Fox Sports Radio. Ah, here we go, it's out. We're number two and a Monday live in LA. It's the Herd wherever you may be and however you may be listening iHeartRadio, Fox Sports Radio FS one. I have so much fun. Saturday night went ski and Saturday had a terrible crash, came home, poured myself a bourbon with my neighbor and Jason, and had to watch the Celtics Lakers second half was great and then I'm a stinker yesterday Philadelphia, San Francisco. But I'm sitting there watching sports yesterday, Kansas City, Cincinnati, and my daughter's over and uh, you know, we're making pizza and stuff. And I'm sitting out thinking to myself, how lucky am I? How grateful of I? I do this for a living. I watched sports Bourbon and talk about it is this the best life in the world. It's right up there. I can't complain. Yeah. I was talking to some buddies at a fortieth birthday party over the weekend. They're big fans of the show. Yeah, and I was like, we're not splitting the atom. You know, for three hours we're talking about basketball and football and building teams and fun. It's like so much fun, you know. I was thinking about this that the Jalen Hurts story is pretty cool, and you could look at Jalen Hurts and go, oh my god, I can't believe he ended up being in this position. But as he was standing next to Terry Bradshaw on the stage yesterday, First of all, Jalen's taller than you think. What's funny about pro athletes? If you ever walked up to I'm six two and chiseled, and a couple of times I would run into Steve Nash at my workout club. He lived around here. Steve's significantly taller than me, and I'm taller than almost everybody I'm around at work. Right, Steph Curry six four, and you've been around Steph Curry, Hu, you forget Steph looks like he's tiny because he's around six nine. Guys, So Jalen Hurts is next to Terry Bradshaw. Bradshaw six two. I mean, I think Jalen Hurts is standing next to him and like he's noticeably taller. But it's so it's fascinating that he had to leave Alabama. But think about all the quarterbacks. Now, Joe Burrow had a transfer. Ohio State has a lot of smart people in football. They were like, nah, yeah, and it's not going to work here to Joe Burrow. Mahomes went tenth Texas Oklahoma in the Big twelve, didn't offer a Scully Brady went sixth round. Dak was in the playoff fourth round. Josh Allen didn't get a college scholarship. Finally one to Wyoming. These are the best quarterbacks in the world. The best quarterbacks in the world is about seven of them. Look at all of their routes. So they argument, I look at Jalen Hurts and now I was thinking about it yesterday. Aaron Rodgers went to a junior college. A junior college. That is the route for greatness being doubted. You know, I tell my kids all the time, you can talk about education, you can talk about a lot of areas that create greatness, but through my life the one word that owas it comes back to. I was watching a special on Bill Russell this weekend, just a remarkable life story. It's resilience. Junior College Wyoming, sixth round, fourth round, too short, You're not good enough for Ohio State. You're not good enough. What are the great ones all ev in common? It's not that they were dominant high school players. It's not that they have the strongest arms, it's not that they're all the same size. All of them are resilient. And as we soften our kids up and give them what they want and the best camps and the best this and the best tools, you're not creating resilience. These guys are fighters. Jalen Hurts is a fighter. Burrows a fighter. Mahomes is out there wincing in pain. That's what all these guys share. They've been doubted, they've been hit, their hurt. Resilience that is now not an outlier. Jalen Hurts is actually perfect to be a star quarterback in this league. He's literally perfect, not quite perfect, size, banged up runs too much, has to develop. Doubted and then Nick Sirianni puts his arms around him and says, no, young man, I believe totally in you, and it's jet fuel. And he just works. He outworks everybody. I swear to God. I saw the pictures of Jalen Hurts in camp when he came to camp year, You're all yoked up, and I'm like Lamar Jackson, same thing. Lamar got doubted you're going to be a receiver. And every year you'd see Lamar come to camp and he had traps and he was ripped, and You're like, that is jet fuel. Is being told no. We tell our kids yes for everything. No creates resilience. And that is the story of remaining quarterback brock Purty seventh round, Jalen Hurts too small, Burrow transfer Mahome's tenth pick. It's incredible. I love the Michael Jordan's story. Obviously in high school where he you know, Michael Jordan's been known to fudge things a little bit, like, oh, they doubted me, and Jordan overcame it became one of the best players in NBA history. Like that writ and resilience, there is something there. I don't think it can be taught. I think you've just got to have it deep within you that I'm gonna bounce back from whatever these people say I can't do. I'm gonna do it. Yeah, I'm done doubt in Jalen Hurts. I don't even think he's healthy. I didn't even think he played one didn't it didn't. And two blowout wins in the playoffs. All right, Colin right, Colin wrong in them Monday, here we go where Colin was right. I had said earlier this year that I thought Maholmes and Burrow specifically had moved past Josh Allen. Burrow had moved you get all the greatness without a lot of mistakes. They've met now four times, last second outcomes, second time in the AFC Championship. I didn't think Burrow played particularly well, but you know, the last two years in the playoffs, Joe Burrow is literally running for his life. I think these guys have gotten to a point now where everybody, even the really really talented guys like Rogers and Stafford and Justin Herbert Nollen, you're all looking up at him where Colin was raw. Year after year, the Philadelphia Eagles totally confound me. They fired Doug Peterson. I hated that they moved off Carson Wentz. I didn't get it. They hired Nick Serriani. What are you doing? I gotta say something. Most organizations that make a lot of changes do because they're poorly run. The Eagles are the opposite. Despite a great tradition. They are willing to move off. Coaches, move off quarterbacks, move off systems, and they should be proud of it. There's a lot of bad football in that area of the country, Washington, the Jets, and the Giants over the last ten years, and yet the Eagles, always willing to acknowledge mistakes try something new, are once again the Kings of the Northeast. Where Colin was right, I said, I thought the Mahomes injury was being a little overplayed by the media and wouldn't affect really the game. Well, we had video, he was fine, he was a full participant practice in twenty nineteen. I think it was he had the same injury in the next week through for four hundred and forty yards. I didn't think the injury. I thought there was a couple of instances, and Tony Romo pointed them out where it looked like he just couldn't step into it quite as much. But in the end, Burrow was the better quarterback of the two best quarterbacks on the planet, where Colin was raw well. In my top ten players in this game last week segment, I did not have Hassan Reddick in the top ten. I think I had him eleven. Yeah, he proved me wrong. He was a game wrecker. Two sacks, fumble, recovery, forced fumble. He was just absolutely fantastic. You know, of the many great players Philadelphia has, we probably overlooked him a little bit, but he was a complete game wrecker and good for him where Colin was right. Well, the story's broken now, according to legitimate sources that Aaron Rodgers and the Packers a trade remains viable and very much on the table. We had said last week in the week before that, Aaron continues to ask for concessions. That's fine, but the payoff now is not even making the playoffs. Apparently, the Packers, according to an ESPN story, projected to be more than sixteen million over next year's salary cap. That got to dump people, maybe Mercedes Lewis or Randall Cobb. Aaron doesn't want that. I think at this point, if you're gonna ask for concessions. You got to get to the playoffs in the NFC, and the Packers didn't. Where Colin was wrong. This is a shocker. There's a report that Daniel Jones does have a market. It could be thirty million a year. By the way, do you get Brian Dable with him? What that? I'm way wrong because I don't see much of a market. I think the story is Dable and say Quon Barkley. But according to agents, and maybe agents are just driving it, there is a market for Daniel Jones. I don't get it. I'm apparently way off. I'm not seeing what somebody else is. But the agents report it's up to thirty million dollars annually. Wow. Where Colin was right said last week, I thought Sean Payton should probably pivot away from the Denver Broncos. And it appears to be the case because now Jim Harbaugh's interviewing again. It's nothing against the owners, I'm told it's the lack of cap flexibility in the issues with Russell Wilson. You're stuck with him for three years minimum. Sean Payton, it looks like has pulled out because Harbaugh's back in and in fact, many of the top candidates are moving away from this, which is not a terrible job on the surface, but the GM now doesn't have a ton of power. The coach will report to the owners. Mostly coaches would rather report to gms and not owners. So that's the very latest where Colin was right. I've been the biggest Andy Reid fan for a long time, and I will say this, and I said it a couple of years ago. He is now seventh straight division title, nine playoffs ten years, and another super Bowl, and Belichick couldn't make the playoffs. If offensive rules would have taken place like they have in the last six to seven years fifteen years ago, then we would view Andy Reid as the game's best coach and not Bill Belichick. Belichick grew up in an era where you could grab and mug players, injured quarterbacks drive him into the ground. The league now has pivoted and Reid has pulled away from Belichick. He drafts, develops, teaches offense at a level Belichick can't and never will. And I could not be happier for Andy Reid, who you know, there's sometimes in life you're waiting for people to get the success they deserve. I think if anybody in the NFL, everybody loves Andy Reid, like you just kept waiting for years and years in Philadelphia. You're like, this guy's great, this guy's great, he just he needs to help. The league actually did him a big favor because of safety concerns. They have made the middle of the field offense. And Andy Reid is now the best coach in the NFL. And there's a lot of sundays it doesn't look particularly close. Sean Payton's around the corner. One more Herd. The Herd streams twenty four hours a day, seven days a week. Within the iHeartRadio app, Search Herd to listen live or on demand whenever you'd like. Start the year with a new wireless deal with Consumer Cellular dot Com Slash Herd. Consumer Cellular dot Com Slash Herd twenty bucks a month. All it takes. Don't have to get rid of your phone, don't have to change your number, no activation fee, Consumer Cellular dot Com Slash the Herd promo code. The Herd got one football game left, then we go into free agency, then we go into the combine and draft. This is a good time. You you were making Jamax joining me. You were making. You had a little bit of a theory. I was saying, to start the show today, Bill Russell eleven titles, Jordan six. We don't just count titles. Robert Ory I think has like seven, Kissy Jones has the late Casey Jones had a lot. But we decided stylistically, athletically that Jordan was the better player than Russell. Could I not make the argument that like Mahomes, Brady he's better than everything with Tom. And now that he's got the feel of the pocket, as he's developed, you know, all these quarterbacks get a little smarter every year. He's just doing stuff that Tom could never do. Everything that Tom's done, Patrick can do things Patrick do now Tom can't do and never could do. Brady also got championships early because of Belichick's defense. You know, he got a championship because of an interception by Butler in the end zone. And I'm not taking anything away from Tom. Tom's the most productive, you know, But when you look at here's a great question to ask, what can Brady do that Mahomes can't Nothing. There's multiple things that Mahomes can do Brady can't. We're not just it's just not about stack and trophies. Dan Marino's one of the ten best quarterbacks in league history, never won a Super Bowl. Dan Marino was insanely talented. He was a bigger, stronger version of Aaron Rodgers. I mean, he was just and just, I mean just maybe the best arm talent outside of a Mahomes I've ever seen play. Doesn't have a championship. Barkley. Charles Barkley could score in the paint, could score in transition, could score from the perimeter. I actually think if he would have had the work ethic of MJ or magic, Charles Barkley is one of the most amazing basketball players I've ever seen. Doesn't have a championship, So your theory was so essentially a lot of people want to say Michael Jordan's six titles the greatest ever. Obviously his six and O in the finals. That's kind of like the casual obvious regular dudes think that when you get a little nuance and think about it, Lebron has accomplished way more. He's a much more complete player. He's a true unicorn. Kobe Bryant came along and was basically a carbon copy of Jordan, right the identical there is no other lebron in nbat's try. You look at Mahomes versus Brady, and Mahomes is still young. I think we would agree. Mahomes, like you said, does everything better than Brady. If you have one final drive, you gotta go eighty yards in sixty s. By the way, and by the way, you're missing two receivers and your own lines. Okay, yeah, it's not close. Well, not only missing two. They got rid of Tyreek Hill and they have a bunch of like b receivers. You were solid and by way, those guys were hurt. Yeah, you were on some guy that had more tackles than catches. He was the number two options. And this is not diminishing Brady. Obviously he's tremendous. But when you just look at everything Patrick Mahomes can do, extending the plays with his legs, some of the creative side art, I mean, he is. We can't just go on awards. Phil Jackson has how many Coach of the Year awards, one or two. That's not silly. He's the best coach in basketball. You know, outside of red arbox. You can make an argument he is the best basketball mentor. Steve Kerr That's why Steve Kerr's great. His tree of people that he's connected with. So I'm just not somebody that goes. I used to work in local TV. A lot of people wanted to win awards, and they build a resume or a tape to win awards. They were never the best people. We can't just go well, they want Emmy's and they were Mahomes is jo. I don't care what it says. Jordan was better than Russell. He was more skilled. Overall, Lebron does far more things than Michael Jordan. He's a bigger, stronger body, He's a thousand times better distributor, he's a better ball handler, he's aged better. He makes everybody around him better. Jordan often took shots away from people. Everybody plays their bass basketball except Russell Westbrook with Lebron James. Yeah, so you know, no, I've never been into this. How many awards didn't you win? My eyes tell me mahomes is the greatest individual talent to ever play the sport. Now. I think he's gonna be up against it with Philadelphia because I think Philadelphia's roster is your early read, and it's early. It's probably Philadelphia. I would agree. Early read has to be filled. That defensive liner reminds me. Do you remember San Francisco dominated the first three plus quarters in that Super Bowl against the Chiefs. Mons could do nothing until the bomb with about eight minutes left to Tyreek Hill that totally flipped the game. San fran was in control of that. I think the Eagles can control the line of scrimmage. Check totally agree, Jamack with the news. No, no, this is the herd line news. All right. Let's stick with Patrick Mahomes battling that ankle sprain to lead the Chiefs. He had another Super Bowl appearance after the win. He spoke about how his ankle was feeling throughout the victory. I try to do whatever I could to win, and obviously there was times where he could see that I wouldn't let me do what I wanted to. But uh, I was able to do enough in that last play to get the first down and get myself out of bounds um and try to give Harrison a chance to win. And obviously we got the flag and he pushed me, pushed me pretty late there. I definitely didn't feel good. I think the worst one was when I fumbled. I try to pick it up, and I was frobably the worst I'll tweaked that I had during the game. But uh, like I said, they got me, they got me closer they could to one hundred percent, and then um, I just battled through and I'll have a few more weeks to get it ready. I love when he fumbled. He went to the sideline and because it was it was like it felt like a turning point in the game. He fumbles, the Bengals get it. He went to the sidelines that he was He told every guy, we're good, don't worry about it. He immediately went I don't know if he apologized, but he's such a verbal player. He has no problem addressing anything controversial. He's just he's everything I want. You gotta own it. You make a mistake, Hey, I fumbled, that's on me. Next up the Eagles. They were the best team in the NFC all season long. Colin struggled down the stretch, but had an easy road to the Super Bowl. They are headed there after wins over Daniel Jones and Brock Purty. Jalen Hurts has been I had to I had to tweak that in there, and Josh Johnson, I forgot to mention that immortal quarterback, so Jalen Hurts has been a big reason for success. After the win, he reflected on the team's journey to the super Bowl. I don't really know how to feel, to be honest, you know, you worked really hard to put yourself in this position, and I'm forever grateful when we experience some painful times and some some tough time who always found a way to overcome. So, you know, you want to be going into it in a situation like this, and you know we have a chance to got a chance to go out there and win it off, so we want to prepare to go do that. Yeah, he's not right. Didn't have a lot of touch on the deep ball. A lot of his underneath stuff felt short. You can tell we talked about Mahome's injury. You can tell Jalen's not right if you go watch October tape and you watch him now. He's just not right. So we got two weeks to get it. You know, if I told you Friday, Jalen Hurts will go fifteen of twenty five for a buck twenty one, and he rushed eleven times for thirty nine yards, you would say Wow, tough night. How bad did the Eagles lose twenty one passing yards? Are you kidding me? All right? Final story, Tom Brady still thinking about his NFL future. One team is reportedly not in the mix to land the goat. Now these reports come fast and furious. The Dolphins are not expected to pursue Brady for twenty twenty three. Instead, they claim they will stick with Tua for at least another year. Colin A, are you buying this? And be like if you're not buying it, let mean come on, I don't know what to make of Miami, To be honest with you, I think was really hard for a front office. You know, Brian Flores was like this isn't gonna work. Mike McDaniel like it is and supported him. Then he got hurt. I think two is one of those situations when you're talking concussions and injuries. It's sensitive, it's nuanced. TA wants to play. They want to protect the organization and to h I don't know. You know a lot of stuff gets out from respected NFL reporters because somebody wants it out. Like why would Harbaugh get out? You could easily get Harbag could easily re engage with the Broncos, and that not get out because he wanted out. I heard a joke once that the Miami Dolphins have more leaks than the Iraqi Navy. Yeah, basically all this stuff is leaking out. That Tom Brady stuff. I don't know if you saw the Vic Fangio stuff. Yeah, apparently that's not a done deal. And now he's saying, well, there may be something else open for me, perhaps San Francisco, so Miami, Stephen Ross, I just I'm not a big How would you like to be a defensive coordinator in the Niners? Call that I get, I get both those linebackers. I get Vosa. That's a good gig. Vix earn it though vis worked hard, he's smart. That that's a good Oh they area, Yeah, I think I'll pick the phone up Jamack with the news. Well that's the news, and thanks for stopping by. Heard we get him back. We're not unhappy with that. I mean, we're wishing him the best if he wants to coach, but we like having him back. Sean Payton is joining us live the farmer Saints coach fifteen years, nine of those years a playoff team. Oh my lord, man, I get a walk in. I usually I'm not used to a walk in. I'm I'm usually sitting down. We've got well, I've got no idea what we're gonna talk about today, and I'm excited. I'm gonna say this though, before we even get started. You know when when a guest arrives here, you get kind of miked up in the back room and you can kind of hear the banter going on. And I'm listening to this Jordan lebron stuff and I'm like, I can't believe what I'm hearing. And I grew up in Chicago, and I'm like, are you kidding me? Are we actually comparing someone to Michael Jordans? And we don't have enough time in this segment, But that's like, we could easily spend an hour on that, and we'll save that for another way. We're always looking for June guests. Yeah, I'll definitely share an hour with Jordan and lebron Um. But no good stuff And obviously a good weekend of football. One game lived up to kind of what we were hoping. I had trouble with both of those games, handicapping them or two things come into play all season I'd been picking Kansas City in San Francisco, So you want to stay with your your your kind of gut. And then as you got closer than there's this conflict for me to win the big show. Bradshaw's got a point on me. And so if I picked the same two teams Bradshaw picks, I can't win. And so he goes Eagles. He want Eagles Chiefs. I want Niners Chiefs. And you know, I ended up watching my team with three different quarterbacks struggling a game. Let's start with that one. Yeah, So you know, and one of the things I've learned from you is that there's a lot of context and nuanced everything. We go to dinner and talk about stuff. You're thinking about everything, you're saying, I'm thinking about the Christmas card, what's the office look like? The idea that you know, you're just going out there and coaching there, doing some practice. And so I said, I figured, if Purdy played well, even if they lost, you come back into next season, I can keep all my guys. And then he gets hurt, and I think to myself, Kyle's sitting there thinking, Garoppolo got hurt, Trey Lance got hurt, brock Purdy got hurt, Joe, and I could see Tom's calling and saying, you know, I don't get hurt. Yeah, this window for this team, as you know, Sean Kittles, a physical player, gets dinged up. McCaffrey is bibo, is trens Old. I don't think this window in San Francisco's four years, no, look, and I don't know that any of us. And I think the myth. You know, there's there's two or three things, you know, halftime adjustments. Uh, they're taking place throughout the game. All right, Number one, this is the this is the wind the windows every year, you know, in other words, or we're gonna build three years from now, we expect to contend. No one's patient enough for that to ever happen. These are like things that I hear. And so it's now and they've got a really, really good team. And I would say, midway through the second quarter their quarterbacks out, it's fourteen to seven. And clearly the comment I made was what was the over under? Because I don't pay attention to that. The Unders looking pretty good. Both defenses are playing well. Yeah, And and just as we were watching that drive, someone we were in the green room, and and they keep a couple of us around in case there's some technical difficulties in Philly. So the big shows in Philly, but let's say something happens to the signal, they can't do a halftime or post game. They can come to LA and there's a group of us that can that can do the highlights. So we're kind of miked up in our suits, but we're really just watching the game and in talking about it. And I remember saying, just you gotta be careful here because it was like what was it one forty eight or two twenty three, or you know, it's like, look any one of these quarterbacks like Brady or Mahomes, you're not You're right into your two minute. You're thinking field goal, maybe touchdown. But you have Josh who's you know when you look at the reps he's had or hasn't had, not many. Yeah, you almost got to be looking at that like I want to be happy at fourteen seven. Yes, and we're gonna find a way to win this game in a different fashion. They rushed the punt, Philly had to punt backed up, and I said, I promise you they're gonna bring all right, all eight here, they're gonna try to create points because it's gonna be hard to find those points in other areas. That turnover touchdown was killer, I think in that game over Yeah, I just think because then you get to this this in fourteen points, you'd say, all right for us for a San Francisco offense, that's not insurmountable, but fourteen points for a quarterback that that now is going to be forced to make some plays. Um. So that was challenging. And and I do think I do think when you look at San Francisco and uh in their defense and they've got a good offensive line, they've got man, good skill. Their their window though is now now how long is that they're one of the teams. I mean when the season ends and we handicap next season, if it was a college team, they would be in the top four. Yeah, if we were you know, next year's NFL rankings, they would be one, two, three or four. Um. And it's because of the roster and they've done a good job with that. Yeah, Philadelphia. You know, one of the things I said this earlier that generally when a team makes a lot of moves, you're like, oh, that's a chaotic organization. They've had four coaches in twenty three years. They've all got winning records, They've had multiple quarterbacks and Super Bowls for as you know, as a proud Eastern city that loves its history, it's sometimes harder than it is for US West Coast people to move off stuff. Yeah, prep school, the churches when I lived out there, they take such pride in their churches. And here are the Eagles. They'll like, you know, Doug Peterson won us the Super Bowl with Nick Foles. We're gonna move off that, And I'm like, what are you doing? But the guy they're gonna face them next week. They moved away from Andy Reid. It's crazy, but you know what, it were a Howie Roseman. They reinvent themselves very uniquely in this league. How did you always view them? Well, my first NFL job was them nineteen ninety seven ninety eight rail Roads was the head coach. I was coaching at the University of Illinois and I had gotten a call they had a quarterback position open, and I never thought all I wanted to do was coach in the Midwest and the Big Ten and become a Big Ten head coach and so I was hired in ninety seven to be the quarterback coach for the Eagles. And on that staff, by the way, John Gruden was the offensive coordinator, Bill Callahan, the offensive line coach, David Shaw. All right, it was a quality control coach. We shared an office. Juan Castile, great coach, Emma Thomas, John Hardball. There was six six coaches, six NFL head coaches, in the basement of Veteran Stadium, grinding away. The facilities weren't great, but there it was a great introduction for me to the NFL and learning from so many people and a passion there. Yeah and yeah, and I lived there for probably, you know, a third of my life growing up, you know, peewee football until I was in eighth grade. We moved to Chicago. So I remember the Flyers in the seventy six ers, Phillies and all those teams, and they are passionate and and you know, going in there, it's a tough place to win. I mean that that is a tough place. In twenty thirteen, we played him in the wild card game, and this was Chip Kelly. Yeh. He had just come on the scene, you know, in other words, and that was the next best thing. And Chip does a great job, of course, and they're the favorites and we're playing him in Philly, and I told our team about, hey, this is this is what the day's going to be like, all right now, when you when you play in the playoffs, Um, your hotel advanced person doesn't have the same six month notice to book hotel. So these teams in the playoffs, you know you might be further away. We were in King of Prussia because there was a conference in the city and their last minute you win a game, They win a game, and you're in the next week you're booking a hotel. But I told him, when we pull off this highway here and you head down past the stadium on the right side, Bus one, you're gonna take six eggs, like as sure as we're sitting here, all right, And you know these little kids will be flipping you the heard a bus two, you'll get maybe three or four. They're gonna reload Bus three, you're gonna get another six. And so you're just preparing your team for the the the the events of the day. And then I went and had our graphics guy put together we have five buses that teams take into the stadium and we put a giant, when I say a giant ten feet by ten feet circle bulls eye on the right side of every bus. And so there was a center red circle, a white circle, a true archery bulls eye, but that was ten That was huge, and all five buses had it. And our players when they got up in the morning and they saw it, they chuckled. And so as we came off the highway that you know, the Eagles fans saw this and there, and it was like I wanted to plant people to throw eggs at our buses because your tea ready, you could just turn and say, everything's going according to plant. Oh that's smart, it's going just how I told you it was gonna go. And we ended up winning big in that game. And that was one of those games where we took two laps around the stadium and then went to the airport. Yeah, it was a little it was a little contentious, you know, because the first time you see the fan after a win there, ah, they're yelling at you. And then when they see you come back around that it's an aggressive move. But I thought they look fantastic. I'll say this all season long the one thing. And I don't think I don't think we've underrated them, But man, do they have a great offensive line. Oh my god. But the angles. There's a there's a touchdown run Philly has in the first half where you guys all saw that. It was like a man block by the guard Kelsey. The center comes around and actually out flanks the weak side linebacker and that linebacker never they do some things in the running game that no one else in our league is doing. And I said this yesterday, and I believe this. I felt like the winner of the NFC Championship game was going to be our Super Bowl winner. And I still believe that I do. I said this morning, I feel like Philadelphia, you can argue take quarterback out because neither one's totally healthy. I think you can argue, Philadelphia, every unit is as good or better every unit. Yeah. Defense, you had the top two defenses playing yesterday, Corners, so I think, um, and look the receiver depth of Kansas City that they did a great job yesterday, right, They thinned out Kelsey, they made they just made enough plays. It was like they were down to if it was a car finishing race. You know, they were down to three wheels. All right, the frame was all you know. It was like they crossed the finish line and then it went and and that's a credit to the team and Andy in that organization, all right. Back in the second Bengals chiefs thoughts after this were Sean Payton Live and la As the Herd. Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays and Noone Easter nine am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio FS one and the radio app two NBA Insiders podcasting twice a week to plug you right into the NBA grape fight, all happening in only one place. This League Uncut, the new NBA podcast with me Chris Haynes and me Mark Stein join us as we team up to expound on everything we're covering, hearing, and chasing. Listen to This League Uncut with Chris Haynes and Mark Stein on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcast. Well, you said the greatest workout you had ever seen was Patrick Mahomes in college. You and the Saints literally saw him and left town quietly because you didn't want anybody to know. One of the things, and explain this to me I said this yesterday and I said it this morning as well to a friend. I said, his ability to see something and how long from that instant until the ball is out of his hands seems less than a second. It's a cognitive He's obviously going a thousand miles an hour upstairs. When you time, you always say it was the most impressive workout. Some of it's just arm but I just there's something about his wheels turning upstairs. Yeah, I think you can. I think you're right. Well, it's a gift, and it's something that um, you know certainly it's it's through practice and hard work, and yet he can process. Uh. And I've used this analogy. Some of us get a brand new car and you've got you know, twenty twenty three model has got all these seat warmers and in sun roofs, And you know, I'm the type by the time I turn that car in, there's a handful of those features I've never touched the same, right, I just I just don't get to him. Yeah, he gets to every one of them. You know, how's your seat in the back left while he's driving and he's left blinkers on and he's making a left all right, that's a gift. Um, we felt like we saw that armed talent on tape. Obviously you see his ability to throw, like like there you know that funny body throw. That was an amazing throw ride. That's the one I went to Twitter after that one. God, mahomes is gifted. That was something to that. And so but when it came to the test or the you're trying to grate, you know, how quickly does he learn? You give him a bunch of stuff the night before, we're gonna fly in in the morning, and then we're gonna cover it with you. And what we had given him was more than we felt that he'd be able to. You know, we want you to look at it all throughout the night, look at it in the morning, and then hey, we'll kind of cover this. And it was two or three days of install, you know, like training camp install day one, installed day two, install day three. It'd probably be seventy four pass route concepts. It'd be maybe six play action concepts, two or three empty concepts. Quite a bit of information. And so the morning started with that and two hours in it was like we were out of questions, like he and so the ability to process quickly is a gift and some of them have it, a lot of them. It's hard. It's hard to it's hard to gauge, but a lot of them don't. And when you listen to the acoustics, the center of the guards have microphones. Now you guys can here's Cadence and it's amazing to hear him. Just you know, there's eight seconds left in the play clock, seven six five and he's like fifty eighth Mike, he changes it. Hey watch him on the run through. It just never stops. Like he's the epitome. And Drew is this way multitasking, you know, where he can All of this is going on, and it's he's comfortable with it, and that's rare. I gotta ask you a coaching question. We can blame the refs, but I mean, Kansas City had more yards, fewer turnovers, better pass protection. Kansas City, to me, is the better team. And I picked Sinsey the punt the sky more so. My takeaway on that was listen, I would have put it out of bound. The minute that thing went off. I went no, no, no, no, no. That kid can run twenty seven yards. It's midfield. My first takes game over what it would you be mad at the special team's coach. Well, I don't know what the plan was. Usually have a plan relative to we were always a directional punt team, yes, and so see if this makes sense, You've got your two outside gunners, and if you directionally pumped the ball, let's say, to the left, then you know you're gonna you're gonna populate that area of the field. And I felt the same way that the problem here was middle field no hang time. That's right, and so middle field no hang time is like fastball over the plate, Like, yeah, middle field no hang time, and then the rest is a problem. M What did you make of Burrow got very little protection early. I don't think Joe had a great game, but again he was the more rush quarterback. Then they made some adjustment so it got better in the second half. Yeah, Well, you saw the nudges and the chips and the you know, the even when the tight end released, there was a little bump before he got out and the backs got out trying to the pressure for Burrow was the internal pressure. You know the problems of Chris Jones. Holy cow, you know, it seemed like the one thing that concerned me, and because I would consider Kansas City a champion. It wasn't too long ago. They so they've got a tradition, they've got a quarterback, a head coach, and man. All week with the Yippinata Cincinnati and then Eli Apple, are you kidding me? So all that going on, and I just kept thinking, you know, all week, and you could see after the game the reaction that was something can't And so I felt like watching many of the audience won't remember fast times at Ridgemont High. But I felt like Chris Jones was the one whose car got smashed and painted and he just said, ah, he's just gonna destroy that. Let me ask you this though, when you watch the game, Cincinnati's offense, you know, became downfield a T. Higgins downfield to Chase. They really didn't consistently move the ball on they took some look the fourth down double move shot played to Chase. Who calls that on fourth down like an in pump into brackets? So they were doubling Chase. You saw they were doubling him, doubling you know. They were playing a seventy seven coverage two over here, two over here, man underneath on the others and uh, and it was more chunk plays. I look, I do, I do agree with you. Kansas City was a better team yesterday, and they played better, and yet we had all the other noise. You know, it wasn't a clean game from an official standpoint. Um, you know that. You it's like anything else, you want the game to end, in my opinion as a fan now, and you don't want to remember who officiated it, and you don't want to remember who announced, and then you probably had a good game, right, But if it becomes too much of the official or too much of whoever's in the booth, then you're like that those are accompaniments or you know something I don't want to I don't want to hear too much. And that's where I think the top Cruise Dance in Rome would do a good job. But but not too much there and not too much from the stripes, and we want to just see the game. I did think in twenty twenty three you can't push. You can't get a quarterback on one leg and bury him into the bench. No, every one of us, that nobody, there's nobody. I don't think that didn't feel that was Yeah, that's a foul day one. Now that's a hard one, though. We got about a minute and a half lest Yeah, you don't think it's hard. No, what do you tell your players on those on those corners, on the sideline plays. Listen, here's what we know. Was there any doubt that he wasn't heading out of bounds? Yeah, all right, And so when he's heading out of bounds, you got a lot of momentum here, just hands off and just you just run behind him, guide him. Yeah, he's running out of bounds. And so you know, Parcels used to say, dumb players do dumb things, and and I meaning at the heat of the moment. Here, this this the hopes and dreams of everyone in Cincinnati and the team. And this was unfortunate because because he played well, he played well throughout the game. But I think going to the sidelines, um, I think certainly with the direction he was going, it was just a mistake he made. And h you know, it's a tough mistake. Yeah. And I also, you know, it is a game of intimidation. And I mean I've heard the old saying you play to the whistle. So I always feel a little bit of sympathy for guys, because playing defense, offense is choreography. Defense is blowing stuff up to Ray Lewis used to say this, It's like part of my job was to make people uncomfortable. Yeah, I want to think too much. Well, we saw Andy there was a penalty called on one of the chiefs offense, the hunting thing. And all you keep talking about is man smart. Just keep thinking about the end game. And so all week you're you're wanting to eliminate things that might be the difference. Keep thinking about the end game here, all right, don't get upset because the lollipops at the bank were great while you're leaving with five hundred million dollars. All right, get out of the bank before you get caught, right, And so understand the main thing, and that's to win and to win and to win and to play in the super Bowl. And so it's difficult, it's difficult. We gotta go our three next. Sean Payton was great as always. The Herd