When the finance minister presented his budget speech a year ago the socio-politico-economic environment was inhospitable; if anything, the operating environment this year is even worse. The period of fiscal decline in South Africa coincides with the tempestuous and disconcerting global conditions that have prevailed since 2008/09. We felt the vicious backlash of the 2008/09 financial and real economic crisis. The legacy of this crisis lingered for another decade, only to be followed by the pandemic-induced crash of 2020. Last year, the largest expenditure item in the 2022 Budget and outlined in the MTBPS last year was debt-service costs, at R333 billion per year on average, thus growing more than 12% per year on average. In effect, resources are being redistributed away from public spending to government creditors. Civil society has been cautioning about the choices on how to raise and allocate spending towards debt-service costs is impacting the kinds of public services delivered and how a more appropriate mix is required given the catastrophic levels of poverty and inequality in South Africa. In this conversation, we get a preview of how the budget should be structured and talk about what a people’s budget should look like. Lerato Mbele is in conversation with economist, Professor Andre Roux and Dr Basani Baloyi, programme director at the Institute for Economic Justice.