You're listening to a Mother and Mia podcast.

You're listening to a Mother and Mia podcast.

Mama Mia acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters that this podcast is recorded on.

Mama Mia acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters that this podcast is recorded on.

People can judge Anthony Alberanezi or they can judge me. I can only talk from my perspective. I believe that I'm the same person I was when I came into politics. I mean, hopefully I'll mature in a number of ways and different perspectives, etc. But my base being got the same friends from school. I've always been conscious of keeping your feet on the ground.

People can judge Anthony Alberanezi or they can judge me. I can only talk from my perspective. I believe that I'm the same person I was when I came into politics. I mean, hopefully I'll mature in a number of ways and different perspectives, etc. But my base being got the same friends from school. I've always been conscious of keeping your feet on the ground.

For Mama Mia.

For Mama Mia.

You're listening to a special episode of No Filter. I'm your host, kateline Brook. Australian women have a very big choice to make in the coming weeks. The women of Australia will be voting for the next Prime Minister at a time when the world feels unpredictable, where so many people are worried about their futures and the futures of their children. Because our mission here at Mamma Maya is to make the world a better place for women and girls, We've invited both Prime Minister Anthony Albanesi and the Opposition leader Peter Dutton onto No Filter to.

You're listening to a special episode of No Filter. I'm your host, kateline Brook. Australian women have a very big choice to make in the coming weeks. The women of Australia will be voting for the next Prime Minister at a time when the world feels unpredictable, where so many people are worried about their futures and the futures of their children. Because our mission here at Mamma Maya is to make the world a better place for women and girls, We've invited both Prime Minister Anthony Albanesi and the Opposition leader Peter Dutton onto No Filter to.

Speak directly to you.

Speak directly to you.

And because this is No Filter, the conversation you're about to hear isn't only about politics and policy positions, but it's also about the man behind the politics, the person who's asking for us to put our trust in them. Here's my conversation with the leader of the Opposition, Peter Dutton.

And because this is No Filter, the conversation you're about to hear isn't only about politics and policy positions, but it's also about the man behind the politics, the person who's asking for us to put our trust in them. Here's my conversation with the leader of the Opposition, Peter Dutton.

Peter Dutton, Peter Craig Dutton, welcome.

Peter Dutton, Peter Craig Dutton, welcome.

To No Filter. It's great to be here. Thank you.

To No Filter. It's great to be here. Thank you.

I am so.

I am so.

Intrigued by you because you are a contender for the highest job in the land.

Intrigued by you because you are a contender for the highest job in the land.

Is it aside from governor general?

Is it aside from governor general?

Is that side from governor general?

Is that side from governor general?

Aside from governor general? And yet you travel amongst us as almost like a mythical beast because you are a man with no nickname.

Aside from governor general? And yet you travel amongst us as almost like a mythical beast because you are a man with no nickname.

I get to DUTs. That's that's sort of the main thing PC. From my schoolmates from high school.

I get to DUTs. That's that's sort of the main thing PC. From my schoolmates from high school.

Uh, what do you get Peter Craig?

Uh, what do you get Peter Craig?

All right, okay, because then you were a police constable, you were yeah, right, Because you're very intriguing in the sense that if you look at the political landscape, which most of us don't get to do with kind of any you know, microscopic detail. I know the shape of Albanesi who's the Prime Minister. But I do not know the shape of you. And when I speak to are the friends. It's a very common kind of relationship that people have with you. Why do you think that is?

All right, okay, because then you were a police constable, you were yeah, right, Because you're very intriguing in the sense that if you look at the political landscape, which most of us don't get to do with kind of any you know, microscopic detail. I know the shape of Albanesi who's the Prime Minister. But I do not know the shape of you. And when I speak to are the friends. It's a very common kind of relationship that people have with you. Why do you think that is?

I think it's true of most contenders for this office because the public just don't have a day to day interest in politics. It's just it's part of our culture. And when people see it on TV, they flip the channel, or they're annoyed by the discussion, or ones as bad as the other, or it's a boring conversation, not relevant to me. And it's not until people start to sharpen their focus and think about in some cases not until the dying hours of a campaign about who they're going.

I think it's true of most contenders for this office because the public just don't have a day to day interest in politics. It's just it's part of our culture. And when people see it on TV, they flip the channel, or they're annoyed by the discussion, or ones as bad as the other, or it's a boring conversation, not relevant to me. And it's not until people start to sharpen their focus and think about in some cases not until the dying hours of a campaign about who they're going.

To vote for.

To vote for.

So and if you're a reality TV star, as is the case in the US, then I guess you're a household name.

So and if you're a reality TV star, as is the case in the US, then I guess you're a household name.

But here I don't think that's generally the case.

But here I don't think that's generally the case.

I ask because you know, there's the perception of you as being like a formidable kind of like a darkish sort of figure.

I ask because you know, there's the perception of you as being like a formidable kind of like a darkish sort of figure.

Yes.

Yes.

And this amazing thing happened to me last week when I was at the Kylie concert right in Melbourne, and this guy came up to me and he said, I won't say his name, but you'll be able to work out who it is or anyway. And he ended up saying to me he was there with his partner and he said, I'm a politician and I said, oh, that's interesting. My brother's a politician. He goes, I know your brother. My brother's in the Liberal Party in Queensland. And I told him that I was interviewing you, and he said, well, I don't sit on that side of the aisle, but you're going to love Peter Darton.

And this amazing thing happened to me last week when I was at the Kylie concert right in Melbourne, and this guy came up to me and he said, I won't say his name, but you'll be able to work out who it is or anyway. And he ended up saying to me he was there with his partner and he said, I'm a politician and I said, oh, that's interesting. My brother's a politician. He goes, I know your brother. My brother's in the Liberal Party in Queensland. And I told him that I was interviewing you, and he said, well, I don't sit on that side of the aisle, but you're going to love Peter Darton.

And I was like, that was going very bad.

And I was like, that was going very bad.

Second, how bizarre, because I'm like, mate, you are high on Kylie.

Second, how bizarre, because I'm like, mate, you are high on Kylie.

What's going to happen?

What's going to happen?

And then his partner said to me, you said, I'm so left, I'm nearly not even on the same page. But if I was lost, Peter Dutton is the man that I would want looking for me.

And then his partner said to me, you said, I'm so left, I'm nearly not even on the same page. But if I was lost, Peter Dutton is the man that I would want looking for me.

That's very kind.

That's very kind.

Now. That was extraordinary to me only because it was so at odds with what the.

Now. That was extraordinary to me only because it was so at odds with what the.

I'm going to say, the public perception of no I.

I'm going to say, the public perception of no I.

Think it's a fair point, and I think you get painted in a particular way, and sometimes you can be your own worst enemy.

Think it's a fair point, and I think you get painted in a particular way, and sometimes you can be your own worst enemy.

And I've had roles which are pretty tough roles.

And I've had roles which are pretty tough roles.

And that shapes how people perceive you. And in a six second grab on the TV of a nighttime where you're trying to deliver a blow to your political opponent, that's different than if you're doing a long form interview or you're doing a breakfast TV segment and you're able to joke and show the true side. And I've also been a very private person. I sort of sound strange, but I don't enjoy talking about my childhood and my family and the rest of it. It's a given, it's a must because of this job. You're in the public eye, so you have no choice. But maybe because of that, I haven't sort of opened up enough over the years about you know, my background, who I am, what has influenced me. And more of that story has come out over the last couple of years, and it's amazing how many people have that exact conversation. They stop you at an airport or a shopping center and say, you know, I saw you on this or heard you on that, and just completely different than I.

And that shapes how people perceive you. And in a six second grab on the TV of a nighttime where you're trying to deliver a blow to your political opponent, that's different than if you're doing a long form interview or you're doing a breakfast TV segment and you're able to joke and show the true side. And I've also been a very private person. I sort of sound strange, but I don't enjoy talking about my childhood and my family and the rest of it. It's a given, it's a must because of this job. You're in the public eye, so you have no choice. But maybe because of that, I haven't sort of opened up enough over the years about you know, my background, who I am, what has influenced me. And more of that story has come out over the last couple of years, and it's amazing how many people have that exact conversation. They stop you at an airport or a shopping center and say, you know, I saw you on this or heard you on that, and just completely different than I.

Thought you were.

Thought you were.

And so's it's funny how people can tell it. So I remember in twenty eighteen when we had a leadership change and Malcolm left the Prime ministership. I remember thinking at that stage, if I leave politics now, I'm sort of disappointed because people won't ever truly know who I am.

And so's it's funny how people can tell it. So I remember in twenty eighteen when we had a leadership change and Malcolm left the Prime ministership. I remember thinking at that stage, if I leave politics now, I'm sort of disappointed because people won't ever truly know who I am.

And that's sort.

And that's sort.

Of ad You had the sense of that then.

Of ad You had the sense of that then.

Yes, yeah, yeah, and I thought, you know, people, I'll be recorded in history sort of this dark figure, as you say, and that's actually not who I am. And fortunately since that time, people have been able to see, you know, more of me, more of my views, my background and all of that. So yeah, it's been an interesting transition.

Yes, yeah, yeah, and I thought, you know, people, I'll be recorded in history sort of this dark figure, as you say, and that's actually not who I am. And fortunately since that time, people have been able to see, you know, more of me, more of my views, my background and all of that. So yeah, it's been an interesting transition.

Well, the background that you don't like talking about eldest of five kids, eldest.

Well, the background that you don't like talking about eldest of five kids, eldest.

Of five, least favorite, the youngest.

Of five, least favorite, the youngest.

Right, I have four children, and in our family, the kids will believe the youngest is my favorite, but the eldest often has responsibility heaped upon them. What was your family?

Right, I have four children, and in our family, the kids will believe the youngest is my favorite, but the eldest often has responsibility heaped upon them. What was your family?

Curely has this great theory about your wi my wife about birth order and where you are sort of you know, determines who you are.

Curely has this great theory about your wi my wife about birth order and where you are sort of you know, determines who you are.

Et cetera. So but anyway, that aside, so what does hang on?

Et cetera. So but anyway, that aside, so what does hang on?

What does she say in part.

What does she say in part.

That the firstborn.

That the firstborn.

Believe that they can rule the world or something like.

Believe that they can rule the world or something like.

That, and the real and this and this. I should listen more intently actually to what she's telling me. But but it's it's it basically talks about the you know, the role of the youngest and uh and and and that was I suppose in terms of my experience that it was ten years between me and my youngest sister. So and I, you know, I grew up in a family of five and with dad working with mum.

That, and the real and this and this. I should listen more intently actually to what she's telling me. But but it's it's it basically talks about the you know, the role of the youngest and uh and and and that was I suppose in terms of my experience that it was ten years between me and my youngest sister. So and I, you know, I grew up in a family of five and with dad working with mum.

But what did your dad? Was your dad a building.

But what did your dad? Was your dad a building.

Bricklayer and then was a bright and yeah, work worked really hard, set a good example. And mum was originally a secretary and then took in kids, so did daycare, family daycare morning and afternoon, before and after school before you know, that was a thing. And then she went into child care. And so that that meant, you know, that home, we were all expected to, you know, by the clean up the dishes, clear the plates or so it was a discipline to do the folding or whatever it was or in my case, you know, and I finally remember it. I probably griped about it at the time, but you're changing nappies and feeding you know, the baby who's ten years younger, they're you, et cetera. And you know, lugging her around on your hip. So that was that was my experience. And I've got an amazing siblings, so very proud of.

Bricklayer and then was a bright and yeah, work worked really hard, set a good example. And mum was originally a secretary and then took in kids, so did daycare, family daycare morning and afternoon, before and after school before you know, that was a thing. And then she went into child care. And so that that meant, you know, that home, we were all expected to, you know, by the clean up the dishes, clear the plates or so it was a discipline to do the folding or whatever it was or in my case, you know, and I finally remember it. I probably griped about it at the time, but you're changing nappies and feeding you know, the baby who's ten years younger, they're you, et cetera. And you know, lugging her around on your hip. So that was that was my experience. And I've got an amazing siblings, so very proud of.

Them, you know. It's and then you became a copper, yes, and you became a copper when you were quite young.

Them, you know. It's and then you became a copper, yes, and you became a copper when you were quite young.

When I was about nineteen.

When I was about nineteen.

Yeah, And how did that idea occur to you?

Yeah, And how did that idea occur to you?

Well, there's a great photo I think when I was at kindy and fully dressed in the police uniform with a.

Well, there's a great photo I think when I was at kindy and fully dressed in the police uniform with a.

Gun on the side.

Gun on the side.

And so I think I'd always had an interest or a fascination at a young age. But Mum convinced me rightly that I should go to UNI. No one had been to UNI in the family. And I did that for about for two years, and then I deferred and I came back and finished at part time as a Bachelor of Business degree.

And so I think I'd always had an interest or a fascination at a young age. But Mum convinced me rightly that I should go to UNI. No one had been to UNI in the family. And I did that for about for two years, and then I deferred and I came back and finished at part time as a Bachelor of Business degree.

But I'd always wanted to go into the police.

But I'd always wanted to go into the police.

I never sort of thought of myself as sitting in an office nine to five, and I liked the idea of policing and that it was fast moving. You didn't know what the next radio corp would be, didn't know what was on the other side of that door, and so I felt that that was for me.

I never sort of thought of myself as sitting in an office nine to five, and I liked the idea of policing and that it was fast moving. You didn't know what the next radio corp would be, didn't know what was on the other side of that door, and so I felt that that was for me.

There's more to my conversation with Peter Dutton coming up. He tells me about what he saw as a police officer that has shaped his politics and what he can do about.

There's more to my conversation with Peter Dutton coming up. He tells me about what he saw as a police officer that has shaped his politics and what he can do about.

The housing market. Do I go anywhere?

The housing market. Do I go anywhere?

I read this thing once that if you look at the sort of socioeconomic background of cops, it often resembles criminals. So it's really that they come from very similar backgrounds on the segment, they've just chosen diametric opposed paths.

I read this thing once that if you look at the sort of socioeconomic background of cops, it often resembles criminals. So it's really that they come from very similar backgrounds on the segment, they've just chosen diametric opposed paths.

When you're a cop, what did you learn from it that you've brought with you? Now?

When you're a cop, what did you learn from it that you've brought with you? Now?

I led a very happy childhood growing up, so I'd never experienced drug use or I'd never seen domestic violence. That that wasn't you know, our environment. So I grew up I think naively, and you know, my eyes were like sources and first shift and seeing you know, some of the horrific things that you see, delivering death messages, the domestic violence, the motor.

I led a very happy childhood growing up, so I'd never experienced drug use or I'd never seen domestic violence. That that wasn't you know, our environment. So I grew up I think naively, and you know, my eyes were like sources and first shift and seeing you know, some of the horrific things that you see, delivering death messages, the domestic violence, the motor.

Vehicle accents, the kids, all of that.

Vehicle accents, the kids, all of that.

I think, I think you just grow up overnight and as a nineteen twenty year old being exposed to all of that, and I'd also, yeah, I'd wanted to stay in Brisbane, had a friend in Brisbane, but when I graduated from the academy, I got posted to towns Or, which is sort of traumatic at the time but fantastic because it made me.

I think, I think you just grow up overnight and as a nineteen twenty year old being exposed to all of that, and I'd also, yeah, I'd wanted to stay in Brisbane, had a friend in Brisbane, but when I graduated from the academy, I got posted to towns Or, which is sort of traumatic at the time but fantastic because it made me.

Grow up being away from home and yeah, it's confronting.

Grow up being away from home and yeah, it's confronting.

So I think you still you carry that experience, those images with you and it's part of the reason that I really concentrated, particularly in the Immigration and Home Affairs portfolios, on protecting women and children, and that was important to me. When I first came into Parliament, I was really passionate about a case where a young baby had been abducted in Queensland and it's sort of quite a famous case, Didrew Kennedy abduction, And I'd worked with Fay, her mother, and there was a great, great injustice in that family, and I'd worked on that job just very briefly as a surveillance officer, and I was very passionate about that and changing that law and ended up getting the law modernized in relation to DNA technology. And I think it's probably in part what caught John Howard's eye early on, because I was fortunate enough to be promoted into the ministry after just one term and still quite young and still yeah, I was thirty three, I guess something like that. And so yeah, I mean I've always felt passionate about that. I just I believe with kids, and young girls in particular, that robbing that innocence of their childhood and not allowing them to, you know, to enjoy their childhood their development. I just I always found that very horrific really, and similarly for women going into it. I remember going into countless domestic violence scenes and you know, blood everywhere, kids clinging onto mom's legs or even dad's legs. All of that is you know, I mean, you can't help but be affected by that. And that's not something that I grew up with.

So I think you still you carry that experience, those images with you and it's part of the reason that I really concentrated, particularly in the Immigration and Home Affairs portfolios, on protecting women and children, and that was important to me. When I first came into Parliament, I was really passionate about a case where a young baby had been abducted in Queensland and it's sort of quite a famous case, Didrew Kennedy abduction, And I'd worked with Fay, her mother, and there was a great, great injustice in that family, and I'd worked on that job just very briefly as a surveillance officer, and I was very passionate about that and changing that law and ended up getting the law modernized in relation to DNA technology. And I think it's probably in part what caught John Howard's eye early on, because I was fortunate enough to be promoted into the ministry after just one term and still quite young and still yeah, I was thirty three, I guess something like that. And so yeah, I mean I've always felt passionate about that. I just I believe with kids, and young girls in particular, that robbing that innocence of their childhood and not allowing them to, you know, to enjoy their childhood their development. I just I always found that very horrific really, and similarly for women going into it. I remember going into countless domestic violence scenes and you know, blood everywhere, kids clinging onto mom's legs or even dad's legs. All of that is you know, I mean, you can't help but be affected by that. And that's not something that I grew up with.

And I just thought for.

And I just thought for.

A woman in particular, not feeling safe in that home environment that had been the refuge for me and my safe space growing up. If you don't feel safe there where could you feel safe? And And so yeah, I mean that's that's been a lifetime passion of mine and it's one of the areas if I am fortunate enough to become Prime Minister that I really want to concentrate on it.

A woman in particular, not feeling safe in that home environment that had been the refuge for me and my safe space growing up. If you don't feel safe there where could you feel safe? And And so yeah, I mean that's that's been a lifetime passion of mine and it's one of the areas if I am fortunate enough to become Prime Minister that I really want to concentrate on it.

I just don't think we do well enough in our country.

I just don't think we do well enough in our country.

Do you. So a lot of these issues that lead to domestic violence, for instance, become systemic, so you know, poverty, or a whole lot of you know, drug abuse, et cetera. How there's a there's a reliance on the government to correct faults that lie at a at a for merely level, or at a relationship level. And yet the Liberal Party is not generally the party that people think of that are compassionate in that area.

Do you. So a lot of these issues that lead to domestic violence, for instance, become systemic, so you know, poverty, or a whole lot of you know, drug abuse, et cetera. How there's a there's a reliance on the government to correct faults that lie at a at a for merely level, or at a relationship level. And yet the Liberal Party is not generally the party that people think of that are compassionate in that area.

Well, it's funny. I think that's probably a fair conclusion.

Well, it's funny. I think that's probably a fair conclusion.

But when you look at what we did when we were in government, the programs that we funded, particularly over COVID, where we were really concerned about people being stuck at home together in relationships that probably work because both parties are working for long hours and not spending every working hour together. And so we put a lot into that, into programs that into NGOs and provided support around housing, around support for women in those situations. So, yeah, I made a particular focus on canceling visas when I had that responsibility of people who are perpetrated domestic violence, pedophiles, people who had sexually assaulted women and children, you know, drug dealers and others, and I remember each of those cases as you're looking at it, there are six or eight victims before you're dealing with the case, and you think, if this decision had been made earlier, you know, those Australian citizens wouldn't have fallen prey to that pedophile or that individual. And there's a sense of satisfaction in doing that, even though it's a tough decision to make to deport someone from the country, but particularly when they've got their own family. But you also do it with the knowledge that they're not going on to offend against the next girl and against the next woman, et cetera, et cetera.

But when you look at what we did when we were in government, the programs that we funded, particularly over COVID, where we were really concerned about people being stuck at home together in relationships that probably work because both parties are working for long hours and not spending every working hour together. And so we put a lot into that, into programs that into NGOs and provided support around housing, around support for women in those situations. So, yeah, I made a particular focus on canceling visas when I had that responsibility of people who are perpetrated domestic violence, pedophiles, people who had sexually assaulted women and children, you know, drug dealers and others, and I remember each of those cases as you're looking at it, there are six or eight victims before you're dealing with the case, and you think, if this decision had been made earlier, you know, those Australian citizens wouldn't have fallen prey to that pedophile or that individual. And there's a sense of satisfaction in doing that, even though it's a tough decision to make to deport someone from the country, but particularly when they've got their own family. But you also do it with the knowledge that they're not going on to offend against the next girl and against the next woman, et cetera, et cetera.

So when you look at that, and.

So when you look at that, and.

I think it's hard then to reconcile that we're not compassionate or that we don't have a focus as members of the Liberal Party on protecting women or putting in place better arrangements.

I think it's hard then to reconcile that we're not compassionate or that we don't have a focus as members of the Liberal Party on protecting women or putting in place better arrangements.

Because you have a very beautiful family. You have a modern family in the sense that it's well documented that your daughter has it yet that Rebecca has a different mum, but Kiralyi has been a mum to her. You've got two sons. Also, you've done extremely well in business. Your wife has also done well in business. When you come from a position of being extremely comfortable how do you still read the rest of the country. Because politicians love to say Australians are doing it tough without an acknowledgment that the reason that we may be doing it tough is because of things that you have done.

Because you have a very beautiful family. You have a modern family in the sense that it's well documented that your daughter has it yet that Rebecca has a different mum, but Kiralyi has been a mum to her. You've got two sons. Also, you've done extremely well in business. Your wife has also done well in business. When you come from a position of being extremely comfortable how do you still read the rest of the country. Because politicians love to say Australians are doing it tough without an acknowledgment that the reason that we may be doing it tough is because of things that you have done.

That's a fair point.

That's a fair point.

Look, people can judge, you know, Anthony Alberanezi, or they can judge me. I can only talk from my perspective. I believe that I'm the same person I was when I came into politics. I mean, hopefully I'll mature it in a number of ways and different perspectives, et cetera. But my base, you know, being my I've got the same friends from school. I've always been conscious of keeping your feet on the ground and and you know, I've never forgotten growing up in a bigger family or in an environment where you know, there were arguments about money and there wasn't enough money to pay the bills. And Dad was a builder, as I say, worked his guts out, but he could price ten jobs.

Look, people can judge, you know, Anthony Alberanezi, or they can judge me. I can only talk from my perspective. I believe that I'm the same person I was when I came into politics. I mean, hopefully I'll mature it in a number of ways and different perspectives, et cetera. But my base, you know, being my I've got the same friends from school. I've always been conscious of keeping your feet on the ground and and you know, I've never forgotten growing up in a bigger family or in an environment where you know, there were arguments about money and there wasn't enough money to pay the bills. And Dad was a builder, as I say, worked his guts out, but he could price ten jobs.

And get none.

And get none.

And you know, when the economy turned, he could price ten and get ten. And you know, I mean I went to work part time after school every day because I had always, from a young age, wanted to you know, be financially successful and and so I've never forgotten those routes that I never will and I think that's demonstrated in a number of the decisions that I've made and different portfolios. And I would want to bring that to the office of Prime Minister as well.

And you know, when the economy turned, he could price ten and get ten. And you know, I mean I went to work part time after school every day because I had always, from a young age, wanted to you know, be financially successful and and so I've never forgotten those routes that I never will and I think that's demonstrated in a number of the decisions that I've made and different portfolios. And I would want to bring that to the office of Prime Minister as well.

Okay, my slight issue with that is that the times are so different now, and the times are different now because of policies that governments have implemented over the years. For instance, you could buy a house when you were nineteen, correct, whereas many Australians now will never be able to buy a house. So the times are different. You can't work your way, you know. And I have much respect for your work ethic, by the way, and I don't think work probably gets the respect that it deserves and the role that it plays in people's lives.

Okay, my slight issue with that is that the times are so different now, and the times are different now because of policies that governments have implemented over the years. For instance, you could buy a house when you were nineteen, correct, whereas many Australians now will never be able to buy a house. So the times are different. You can't work your way, you know. And I have much respect for your work ethic, by the way, and I don't think work probably gets the respect that it deserves and the role that it plays in people's lives.

But what so.

But what so.

My question is really on a policy level. It seems to me, and you alluded to this earlier, that people don't see a difference between the parties, and in fact UNI party seems to be a prevalent sort of thing. Government loves big Australia, but most Australians don't love big Australia. But Governments love big Australia because it means, you know, more taxes and more growth, and banks love big Australia and building companies love big Australia.

My question is really on a policy level. It seems to me, and you alluded to this earlier, that people don't see a difference between the parties, and in fact UNI party seems to be a prevalent sort of thing. Government loves big Australia, but most Australians don't love big Australia. But Governments love big Australia because it means, you know, more taxes and more growth, and banks love big Australia and building companies love big Australia.

How do you reconcile.

How do you reconcile.

That inclination towards satisfying the business end of town versus what Australians want.

That inclination towards satisfying the business end of town versus what Australians want.

Well, it's a huge issue because a couple of points. One.

Well, it's a huge issue because a couple of points. One.

I don't think we plan well enough in this country for migration movements, and we've got a natural instinct to want to live closer to the coast, and the government's bringing in in their migration program about a population in the same size as Adelaide over the course of a five year period, which is a lot of people. When you stop and think about that, we're not building the extra hospitals and the extra capacity at.

I don't think we plan well enough in this country for migration movements, and we've got a natural instinct to want to live closer to the coast, and the government's bringing in in their migration program about a population in the same size as Adelaide over the course of a five year period, which is a lot of people. When you stop and think about that, we're not building the extra hospitals and the extra capacity at.

Schools and in GP clinics, et cetera.

Schools and in GP clinics, et cetera.

So I think we do plan really poorly in this country and it's part of the reason why this perfect storm has percolated. Because we've got Australians who are lining up to rent a property, paying tweeks or for rent. They can't get a front of their own head. Young people are lining up at auctions and expected to pay five hundred thousand dollars over the reserve price to get a basic house. And so you know, I get that. And the reason that I'm passionate about making sure that we allow people to realize that dream of home ownership again is that I just think with a house, you've got or you're a unit, but with accommodation, you've got stability. I think it's good for a relationship. I think it's good stability when you have when kids come along, you get if you can get to the point where you've paid the houself by retirement, you can enjoy the hard work that you've spoken about, enjoy your life because of the hard work you've spoken about.

So I think we do plan really poorly in this country and it's part of the reason why this perfect storm has percolated. Because we've got Australians who are lining up to rent a property, paying tweeks or for rent. They can't get a front of their own head. Young people are lining up at auctions and expected to pay five hundred thousand dollars over the reserve price to get a basic house. And so you know, I get that. And the reason that I'm passionate about making sure that we allow people to realize that dream of home ownership again is that I just think with a house, you've got or you're a unit, but with accommodation, you've got stability. I think it's good for a relationship. I think it's good stability when you have when kids come along, you get if you can get to the point where you've paid the houself by retirement, you can enjoy the hard work that you've spoken about, enjoy your life because of the hard work you've spoken about.

I think you've then.

I think you've then.

Got an asset that's grown in value to give to your kids or your grandkids and set them up right. So so housing that's why it's such a.

Got an asset that's grown in value to give to your kids or your grandkids and set them up right. So so housing that's why it's such a.

Love lulture that you think you need to tell me how great did you do?

Love lulture that you think you need to tell me how great did you do?

But I think I think it's important because I think a lot of people when you look at and the sort of a long way of answering your question about there's different views. We've got an amazing migrant population in our country. When you speak to many people from different migrant communities. They say, please, could we bring our parents or you know, the remaining three sisters or brothers from our from our family. And so they want a bigger migration program, and business, as you say, wants to bring more people in because they think they can't get the workforce without that migrant workforce. So we've got to make sure there's supply of housing. We've got to take care of Australians first, including people who have just become Australian citizens, and make sure they don't lose the dream of home ownership. And we've got an aging population like what most Western democracies, so or communities and economies, and so we've got to get that balance right, and we haven't got it right. The supply side of housing have sort of dried up, and you've got this big demand with the migration program. And we've said that we should chill out a bit on that for a couple of years until we can recalibrate the two because otherwise that dream of home ownership is just going to get further and further away.

But I think I think it's important because I think a lot of people when you look at and the sort of a long way of answering your question about there's different views. We've got an amazing migrant population in our country. When you speak to many people from different migrant communities. They say, please, could we bring our parents or you know, the remaining three sisters or brothers from our from our family. And so they want a bigger migration program, and business, as you say, wants to bring more people in because they think they can't get the workforce without that migrant workforce. So we've got to make sure there's supply of housing. We've got to take care of Australians first, including people who have just become Australian citizens, and make sure they don't lose the dream of home ownership. And we've got an aging population like what most Western democracies, so or communities and economies, and so we've got to get that balance right, and we haven't got it right. The supply side of housing have sort of dried up, and you've got this big demand with the migration program. And we've said that we should chill out a bit on that for a couple of years until we can recalibrate the two because otherwise that dream of home ownership is just going to get further and further away.

But you look at.

But you look at.

Every time you jump into an uber or go to a service station of seven eleven or tradees. Now there's a big migrant element to all of that. And they're not people have come from riches. These are people who see the golden ticket of Australian citizenship as an opportunity to create wealth and stability for their kids and grandkids in a way that their grandparents, who were living in a village somewhere could never have contemplated.

Every time you jump into an uber or go to a service station of seven eleven or tradees. Now there's a big migrant element to all of that. And they're not people have come from riches. These are people who see the golden ticket of Australian citizenship as an opportunity to create wealth and stability for their kids and grandkids in a way that their grandparents, who were living in a village somewhere could never have contemplated.

And I think that's part of the.

And I think that's part of the.

Great Australian tapestry and dream and I don't think we should ever lose sight of that.

Great Australian tapestry and dream and I don't think we should ever lose sight of that.

See.

See.

One of the things I don't think we do in our country well enough is talk about the great migrant story, particularly since the Second World War. People came here with literally nothing out of war torn Europe. My parents and came here as tilers, as bricklayers, as teachers, as you know, agricultural workers, whatever. And now their grandkids are doctors and millionaires and you know, radio superstars, you know whatever. I mean, there's we should be holding those examples up as as examples of aspiration. We've got to be proud again of who we are as a people in a country. And people look at Australia and think you are the best country in the world, and sometimes I think we lose sight of that, and we should be embracing it and running with it and helping as many people along the way as we can.

One of the things I don't think we do in our country well enough is talk about the great migrant story, particularly since the Second World War. People came here with literally nothing out of war torn Europe. My parents and came here as tilers, as bricklayers, as teachers, as you know, agricultural workers, whatever. And now their grandkids are doctors and millionaires and you know, radio superstars, you know whatever. I mean, there's we should be holding those examples up as as examples of aspiration. We've got to be proud again of who we are as a people in a country. And people look at Australia and think you are the best country in the world, and sometimes I think we lose sight of that, and we should be embracing it and running with it and helping as many people along the way as we can.

I have more to ask PC, PC donn't After this shortbreak, I will go into the personal life of the opposition leader, his marriage, his self care routine, and just what he has to say to the women and girls of Australia.

I have more to ask PC, PC donn't After this shortbreak, I will go into the personal life of the opposition leader, his marriage, his self care routine, and just what he has to say to the women and girls of Australia.

We'll be right back. What do you love about Australia.

We'll be right back. What do you love about Australia.

I love the fact that we've got choice, We've got freedom of our expression of thought, and that if you start with nothing, you can get ahead and you can create an opportunity. And that might seem hard for some people at different points in their life, but we have an incredible society where we take care of people who are in need can't take care of themselves. But we also have a system where people can work hard, sacrifice and realize and I think we should protect and defend that at every opportunity.

I love the fact that we've got choice, We've got freedom of our expression of thought, and that if you start with nothing, you can get ahead and you can create an opportunity. And that might seem hard for some people at different points in their life, but we have an incredible society where we take care of people who are in need can't take care of themselves. But we also have a system where people can work hard, sacrifice and realize and I think we should protect and defend that at every opportunity.

Your family obviously very supportive of your dreams and your career. But yet, and I know I alluded to the fact that my brother's a politician. When someone in the family decides to become a politician, everyone else.

Your family obviously very supportive of your dreams and your career. But yet, and I know I alluded to the fact that my brother's a politician. When someone in the family decides to become a politician, everyone else.

Is set branded.

Is set branded.

Yeah, everyone else is swept up with that, whether they want to or not. It's a form of selfishness that we have to hope in our politicians is underwritten by a desire for the greater good.

Yeah, everyone else is swept up with that, whether they want to or not. It's a form of selfishness that we have to hope in our politicians is underwritten by a desire for the greater good.

I think that's right. I think it's also true that I mean, you know, in your family, you've got two famous people with pretty identifiable surnames. So any if your cousins or kids or whatever, you know, would automatically get the question are you related.

I think that's right. I think it's also true that I mean, you know, in your family, you've got two famous people with pretty identifiable surnames. So any if your cousins or kids or whatever, you know, would automatically get the question are you related.

To you know? Do you know?

To you know? Do you know?

And And I talked to my cousins about it, and most of they say, mate, we're really proud of what you do, and we're very very happy to be asked the question and to answer it. And maybe that's just a you know, a brave sort of face that they're putting on it for me, but I'm I'm really conscious of it because, particularly with your own kids, they're not you know. I think it was once anmously said that they're they're conscripts. Right, they're not. Yeah, but they haven't sought a public life. And I suppose for many kids, the family you know, you're born into comes with upside and downside and and but they're yeah, look, they're they're they're balanced and they're good about it.

And And I talked to my cousins about it, and most of they say, mate, we're really proud of what you do, and we're very very happy to be asked the question and to answer it. And maybe that's just a you know, a brave sort of face that they're putting on it for me, but I'm I'm really conscious of it because, particularly with your own kids, they're not you know. I think it was once anmously said that they're they're conscripts. Right, they're not. Yeah, but they haven't sought a public life. And I suppose for many kids, the family you know, you're born into comes with upside and downside and and but they're yeah, look, they're they're they're balanced and they're good about it.

But yeah, that that is a definite downside.

But yeah, that that is a definite downside.

What percentage of your family extended, because I gather you're quite close to your extended family shares your politics.

What percentage of your family extended, because I gather you're quite close to your extended family shares your politics.

I think there would be I think it'd be a maturity.

I think there would be I think it'd be a maturity.

Yeah, right are you Sometimes they're at a family barbecue going I'm not sure about sure.

Yeah, right are you Sometimes they're at a family barbecue going I'm not sure about sure.

Is going to say generally not and generally like in most conversations with your friends as well. I've got a lot of mates who who wouldn't vote, who wouldn't hopefully they will at this election, but it wouldn't vote liberal normally, And you know, we get on like a house on fire. And generally it's a discussion about cricket or goal for family, or Olympics or whatever's in the news, and there's not a heavy conversation around politics, which actually is refreshing because you need to be able to switch off and.

Is going to say generally not and generally like in most conversations with your friends as well. I've got a lot of mates who who wouldn't vote, who wouldn't hopefully they will at this election, but it wouldn't vote liberal normally, And you know, we get on like a house on fire. And generally it's a discussion about cricket or goal for family, or Olympics or whatever's in the news, and there's not a heavy conversation around politics, which actually is refreshing because you need to be able to switch off and.

Just you know.

Just you know.

I think also there is an appetite for people for people with for things not to be so binary. Yes, when people have divergent politics. And I always think someone said this, the bird needs the right wing and the left wing to fly, but that doesn't seem to be the case in the current climate.

I think also there is an appetite for people for people with for things not to be so binary. Yes, when people have divergent politics. And I always think someone said this, the bird needs the right wing and the left wing to fly, but that doesn't seem to be the case in the current climate.

Well, I mean, if you go back to you know, ancient times, I mean the politicians.

Well, I mean, if you go back to you know, ancient times, I mean the politicians.

Were I do go back to back before you.

Were I do go back to back before you.

But it's always been an adversarial It's like a courtroom environment where you've got each side of the argument, the prosecution and the defense, arguing vehemently for their belief I just think as long as it's done in a respectful way, you can have strong views. And as the Prime ministers pointed out, and as I've said publicly, I mean he and I get on well personally. We can have a conversation. If there's an issue around a national security issue that we need to deal with, what we do and we do it respectfully. Neither of us leak the conversation, So you know, I think we act in an honorable way, but we've just got a different pathway of getting to probably the same objective of what's best for our country.

But it's always been an adversarial It's like a courtroom environment where you've got each side of the argument, the prosecution and the defense, arguing vehemently for their belief I just think as long as it's done in a respectful way, you can have strong views. And as the Prime ministers pointed out, and as I've said publicly, I mean he and I get on well personally. We can have a conversation. If there's an issue around a national security issue that we need to deal with, what we do and we do it respectfully. Neither of us leak the conversation, So you know, I think we act in an honorable way, but we've just got a different pathway of getting to probably the same objective of what's best for our country.

I think, touching on what you just said, a lot of people suspect that the seemingly too opposing sides of politics are more aligned with each other than you are with the interests of us.

I think, touching on what you just said, a lot of people suspect that the seemingly too opposing sides of politics are more aligned with each other than you are with the interests of us.

Think well, I think we're more aligned with each other than people realize. But generally that's because there's an obvious answer and you support it. It's a chicken in EG scenario as well, because the media aren't reporting the boring sort of consensus. You know, we found common ground today in Parliament and people were really pleased with the outcome. That rarely makes it onto the news. It's the it's the color and movement and that's what tunes people in. That's what you know, informs the clickbaits, that's what people want to read, the titillating bits and pieces about your property ownership or what you did or what you said, and the mundane stuff where there is agreement, which is probably eighty percent of the time and in the public's best interests. So I do think our stars align with where where the public is.

Think well, I think we're more aligned with each other than people realize. But generally that's because there's an obvious answer and you support it. It's a chicken in EG scenario as well, because the media aren't reporting the boring sort of consensus. You know, we found common ground today in Parliament and people were really pleased with the outcome. That rarely makes it onto the news. It's the it's the color and movement and that's what tunes people in. That's what you know, informs the clickbaits, that's what people want to read, the titillating bits and pieces about your property ownership or what you did or what you said, and the mundane stuff where there is agreement, which is probably eighty percent of the time and in the public's best interests. So I do think our stars align with where where the public is.

That just sort of goes through to the keeper.

That just sort of goes through to the keeper.

People want to draw parallels between Australia and what's happened in America. So you're painted as some kind of down under Trump.

People want to draw parallels between Australia and what's happened in America. So you're painted as some kind of down under Trump.

Well, I'm accused of being not Trump enough to Trump, not Trump like Trump like. I mean, it's just your detractors will say, ah, you look like Trump while you're acting like Trump because they think that that is a way of landing a blow on you. I mean, that's what they're trying to do. I'm a very different person to President Trump. And you know, my biggest influence is in political life have been John Howard and Peter Costello, and I worked as assistant treasurer at Peter Costello. I still, you know, have a conversation with and see John Howard as a mentor. And you know, not that I agree with everything that he said or did or his different approaches, but there was a stability and there was a certainty and a strength in his leadership and character, and I admired that all and still do so. Yeah, Look, I think there will be things that we can agree with the US on and things that will have disagreements. I don't agree with President Trump at all in relation to Ukraine and what's happening there at the moment. I think that I think the incursion, that the invasion, the killing of people by Putin is an abomination, and so I don't like the characterization of that, but that's.

Well, I'm accused of being not Trump enough to Trump, not Trump like Trump like. I mean, it's just your detractors will say, ah, you look like Trump while you're acting like Trump because they think that that is a way of landing a blow on you. I mean, that's what they're trying to do. I'm a very different person to President Trump. And you know, my biggest influence is in political life have been John Howard and Peter Costello, and I worked as assistant treasurer at Peter Costello. I still, you know, have a conversation with and see John Howard as a mentor. And you know, not that I agree with everything that he said or did or his different approaches, but there was a stability and there was a certainty and a strength in his leadership and character, and I admired that all and still do so. Yeah, Look, I think there will be things that we can agree with the US on and things that will have disagreements. I don't agree with President Trump at all in relation to Ukraine and what's happening there at the moment. I think that I think the incursion, that the invasion, the killing of people by Putin is an abomination, and so I don't like the characterization of that, but that's.

How I see it.

How I see it.

And I will always act in our country's best interest, and I think in a dynamic relationship like that, particularly with President Trump, you've got to have a Prime minister here in Australia who's prepared to stand up for our national interests, what we believe in, and.

And I will always act in our country's best interest, and I think in a dynamic relationship like that, particularly with President Trump, you've got to have a Prime minister here in Australia who's prepared to stand up for our national interests, what we believe in, and.

That I think is an essential.

That I think is an essential.

I mentioned this is conversation like has the potential to reach a vast sway of Australian women, and I want to give you a chance to speak directly to them.

I mentioned this is conversation like has the potential to reach a vast sway of Australian women, and I want to give you a chance to speak directly to them.

I want to be a prime minister who can govern for our country and for all Australians.

I want to be a prime minister who can govern for our country and for all Australians.

But I strongly believe in.

But I strongly believe in.

Making sure that people have dignity in their lives, women in particular, and that means first and foremost, running an economy where if you're sitting at home pulling your hair out in a garage or the back bedroom with your online business. I want to be a prime minister that creates an environment where you can make sales and that financial independence and success gives you options and opportunities. And I want to be a prime minister that can provide an environment where.

Making sure that people have dignity in their lives, women in particular, and that means first and foremost, running an economy where if you're sitting at home pulling your hair out in a garage or the back bedroom with your online business. I want to be a prime minister that creates an environment where you can make sales and that financial independence and success gives you options and opportunities. And I want to be a prime minister that can provide an environment where.

You can afford to put a roof over your head and.

You can afford to put a roof over your head and.

To recover from a marriage breakdown or a violent relationship. And I want an opportunity where where people can, at different points in their life, feel comfortable about making choices that are right for them and facilitating those choices, and so that I think is important. When I go up to Alice Springs and speak to women in town camps or indigenous elders up there, their view is no different to women in the cities or frankly, a lot of parents are male or female, their instinct is to when you speak to them, what can I do for you? What are the priorities. I want a roof over my head. I want a safe environment. I want to be able to educate my kids. I want to be able to pay the bills. I want a good health system, and I want an environment where my kids, when they graduate from school or from a trade or from a university, can find a job. And they're pretty basic human instincts.

To recover from a marriage breakdown or a violent relationship. And I want an opportunity where where people can, at different points in their life, feel comfortable about making choices that are right for them and facilitating those choices, and so that I think is important. When I go up to Alice Springs and speak to women in town camps or indigenous elders up there, their view is no different to women in the cities or frankly, a lot of parents are male or female, their instinct is to when you speak to them, what can I do for you? What are the priorities. I want a roof over my head. I want a safe environment. I want to be able to educate my kids. I want to be able to pay the bills. I want a good health system, and I want an environment where my kids, when they graduate from school or from a trade or from a university, can find a job. And they're pretty basic human instincts.

And women also want physical autonomy.

And women also want physical autonomy.

Yes, yeah, and again I mean it's people will want to concentrate in the health space. But I'm proud of the fact that I set up the Medical Research Future Fund, which has now got twenty two billion dollars in it provides a lot of research into breast cancer, into ovarian cancer, into brain cancers, cancers for children.

Yes, yeah, and again I mean it's people will want to concentrate in the health space. But I'm proud of the fact that I set up the Medical Research Future Fund, which has now got twenty two billion dollars in it provides a lot of research into breast cancer, into ovarian cancer, into brain cancers, cancers for children.

What was your motivation for that? By the way, what was the impetus for that.

What was your motivation for that? By the way, what was the impetus for that.

Well, again, it's I think there is there's a human dignity element to being able to live in a country like ours and receive the medical attention. We've got some of the best researchers in the world, and I didn't think they had the stability in the money for their research that was required.

Well, again, it's I think there is there's a human dignity element to being able to live in a country like ours and receive the medical attention. We've got some of the best researchers in the world, and I didn't think they had the stability in the money for their research that was required.

And we've had a big brain drain as a result.

And we've had a big brain drain as a result.

Yes, And look, Australia is a market of twenty seven million people, so many of those researchers will automatically, at some stage in their career be attracted to London or to parts of Asia or Europe or the United States wherever. And in many cases that's a great thing because they expand their knowledge and they come back here when they want to raise their kids or when they want to retire, and they contribute to the you know, the health space here or the medical research space.

Yes, And look, Australia is a market of twenty seven million people, so many of those researchers will automatically, at some stage in their career be attracted to London or to parts of Asia or Europe or the United States wherever. And in many cases that's a great thing because they expand their knowledge and they come back here when they want to raise their kids or when they want to retire, and they contribute to the you know, the health space here or the medical research space.

So yeah, I think that's part of that thinking.

So yeah, I think that's part of that thinking.

And you know, and many other things that you can do if you manage the economy well and you've got good economic settings, you've got good revenues coming in, you can start to pay for different programs, and particularly mental health I think is a huge issue where we just haven't got it right in this country yet, and the number of young women presenting with mental health issues and online safety.

And you know, and many other things that you can do if you manage the economy well and you've got good economic settings, you've got good revenues coming in, you can start to pay for different programs, and particularly mental health I think is a huge issue where we just haven't got it right in this country yet, and the number of young women presenting with mental health issues and online safety.

Have you ever had issues like post policing or whatever.

Have you ever had issues like post policing or whatever.

I think, not diagnosed, but I think if knowing what I know now about the impact that it has, even in the way in which you raise your own children, the way that we've been protective of them in a public place, you know, particularly of Rebecca, but the boys as well. Yes, I think, how can that not have an influence on you? And it's how you manage with that and the support you provide. And you know, for me, meditation is a big part of my life as well, which I find.

I think, not diagnosed, but I think if knowing what I know now about the impact that it has, even in the way in which you raise your own children, the way that we've been protective of them in a public place, you know, particularly of Rebecca, but the boys as well. Yes, I think, how can that not have an influence on you? And it's how you manage with that and the support you provide. And you know, for me, meditation is a big part of my life as well, which I find.

That was surprising to me.

That was surprising to me.

I don't know why, but I find it a good reset and I find it a good clearing of your mind. And particularly you know, if you're starting at four point thirty five in the morning and you're not finishing until ten or eleven at night, you're going all day and you do need to take ten or twenty minutes just to reset, I think, and focus on yourself.

I don't know why, but I find it a good reset and I find it a good clearing of your mind. And particularly you know, if you're starting at four point thirty five in the morning and you're not finishing until ten or eleven at night, you're going all day and you do need to take ten or twenty minutes just to reset, I think, and focus on yourself.

And I think unless you're physically and mentally.

And I think unless you're physically and mentally.

Well, it's hard to do jobs like the one i'm in or like the one I'm aspiring to be.

Well, it's hard to do jobs like the one i'm in or like the one I'm aspiring to be.

What do you do physically, by the way, I try and I always stay at a hotel with a good gym, so I try to go to the gym early or go for.

What do you do physically, by the way, I try and I always stay at a hotel with a good gym, so I try to go to the gym early or go for.

A walk, very disciplined.

A walk, very disciplined.

But yeah, honestly, I don't know why, but I'm sure you know, the scientists can explain it better than I can. But I have a really flat start to the day if I don't do exercise, but I feel invigorated if I do. And you know, it means you're tired at the end of the day because you've got up earlier to do it. And sometimes in the guard I just hit the snooze button, sleep in.

But yeah, honestly, I don't know why, but I'm sure you know, the scientists can explain it better than I can. But I have a really flat start to the day if I don't do exercise, but I feel invigorated if I do. And you know, it means you're tired at the end of the day because you've got up earlier to do it. And sometimes in the guard I just hit the snooze button, sleep in.

I'll do it in the afternoon, which of course never never happens.

I'll do it in the afternoon, which of course never never happens.

Nothing, nothing physical.

Nothing, nothing physical.

Happens in the afternoon, not even afternoon to light exactly right.

Happens in the afternoon, not even afternoon to light exactly right.

So yeah, so look, it's for me that that's an important part of the routine. And it also I just think out walking you can listen to a bit of music.

So yeah, so look, it's for me that that's an important part of the routine. And it also I just think out walking you can listen to a bit of music.

Or not with Kira when you get the chance.

Or not with Kira when you get the chance.

Yes, yeah, we do, actually, yeah, which is it's not it's not a substitute for date night, but it is a good time to spend some time together and and you know, just have a chat in a relaxed environment.

Yes, yeah, we do, actually, yeah, which is it's not it's not a substitute for date night, but it is a good time to spend some time together and and you know, just have a chat in a relaxed environment.

What is the secret of having a happy marriage for as long as you two have?

What is the secret of having a happy marriage for as long as you two have?

I don't know, because I had plenty of unhappy relationships before that. Well, it just didn't work right despite your best efforts. So I think it depends on where you are in life. I think your own maturity obviously feeds into it. And you know, I get married way too young and the first time, yeah, and to an amazing person, but but we were just too young and headed in different directions, et cetera. And so so I think it's it's about your perspective on life. And I think not trying to change the other party is important. You can try and sort of smooth a few rough edges. What if they're wrong, Well then that's the that's their prerogative, and they can be wrong. And I think you've got to accept people for for the good and the bad, and you don't if you if you're chasing perfection every time and you want your own way every time, it just doesn't work. And you also need from my experience, and each their own and everyone's got their own formula.

I don't know, because I had plenty of unhappy relationships before that. Well, it just didn't work right despite your best efforts. So I think it depends on where you are in life. I think your own maturity obviously feeds into it. And you know, I get married way too young and the first time, yeah, and to an amazing person, but but we were just too young and headed in different directions, et cetera. And so so I think it's it's about your perspective on life. And I think not trying to change the other party is important. You can try and sort of smooth a few rough edges. What if they're wrong, Well then that's the that's their prerogative, and they can be wrong. And I think you've got to accept people for for the good and the bad, and you don't if you if you're chasing perfection every time and you want your own way every time, it just doesn't work. And you also need from my experience, and each their own and everyone's got their own formula.

But for us, it's not letting things. I never want my head to hit the pillow.

But for us, it's not letting things. I never want my head to hit the pillow.

If you know we've had a disagreement about something, and I just think you should. You should finish each day in a good space, even if you've got to suck it up a bit and swallow a bit of pride, and you know, you might still have the discussion the next day. But I think goat bed at night knowing that the relationship means enough to you to try and resolve those problems.

If you know we've had a disagreement about something, and I just think you should. You should finish each day in a good space, even if you've got to suck it up a bit and swallow a bit of pride, and you know, you might still have the discussion the next day. But I think goat bed at night knowing that the relationship means enough to you to try and resolve those problems.

I also think you've got to spend a lot of time on that, that together time. Like it's sort of.

I also think you've got to spend a lot of time on that, that together time. Like it's sort of.

A sort of a you know, geeky thing to sort of say, or maybe a.

A sort of a you know, geeky thing to sort of say, or maybe a.

You know, a sloppy thing to say.

You know, a sloppy thing to say.

But I just think if you're not able to speak with each other freely and have that discussion, then you've got to work out how you can do that. And it's I don't know, like I've married somebody who is.

But I just think if you're not able to speak with each other freely and have that discussion, then you've got to work out how you can do that. And it's I don't know, like I've married somebody who is.

It.

It.

We're sort of ing and yang in terms of organized so curly. Always when the kids were young, things were packed, lunches were made. She was ready to get out of the door while I was still getting out of the shit. And she's always been well organized like that, and I think that where you can find that in and yang in different parts of your relationship. You compliment each other ultimately, so but you can still have big points of difference.

We're sort of ing and yang in terms of organized so curly. Always when the kids were young, things were packed, lunches were made. She was ready to get out of the door while I was still getting out of the shit. And she's always been well organized like that, and I think that where you can find that in and yang in different parts of your relationship. You compliment each other ultimately, so but you can still have big points of difference.

Okay, I would like to ask you one thing. Should you win the election, do you think you're going to.

Okay, I would like to ask you one thing. Should you win the election, do you think you're going to.

I think we can win the election.

I think we can win the election.

It hasn't happened since nineteen thirty one for a first term government to lose, so it's a huge task and we've got to win about twenty seats, which is a big undertaking. But there's no doubt in my mind that we can win if we work hard, we're disciplined, and we put the policies out that can capture people's imaginations.

It hasn't happened since nineteen thirty one for a first term government to lose, so it's a huge task and we've got to win about twenty seats, which is a big undertaking. But there's no doubt in my mind that we can win if we work hard, we're disciplined, and we put the policies out that can capture people's imaginations.

Well, if you do win, I would like to invite you to come back thank you exactly a year from today. Deal, and I would like to know given the ethos, the mission statement of Mama Maya, which is to improve the world for women and girls.

Well, if you do win, I would like to invite you to come back thank you exactly a year from today. Deal, and I would like to know given the ethos, the mission statement of Mama Maya, which is to improve the world for women and girls.

Yes, I would like.

Yes, I would like.

To discuss with you in that intervening period what you have done to that end.

To discuss with you in that intervening period what you have done to that end.

Well, firstly, an absolute commitment and it should be a conversation that continues on for the year about what we can do to make lives for women and young girls better, and particularly, as I said, a real focus with online and safety online and being able to deal with the transmission of images, and how women and girls can feel safe living a bigger part of their lives online than they ever have. But there are many other issues, housing etc.