In this episode of HELLO FUTURE, host Kevin Cirilli continues his conversation with Jason Morales, CEO and co-founder of UNTILL, diving deeper into the practical challenge of changing our relationship with phones and attention. Building on the big-picture discussion of the attention economy, Morales explains how UNTILL aims to create real incentives for people to disconnect and spend more time offline.

The conversation explores what it takes to shift behavior at scale, how a business can be built around helping people spend less time glued to screens, and whether carefully designed rewards and systems can compete with the powerful forces that keep us scrolling. At its heart, the episode asks a deceptively simple question with massive implications: How do you actually get people to put their phones down?