David And Severn

Published Feb 8, 2022, 10:00 AM

Meet David Suzuki and Severn Cullis-Suzuki, the father-daughter duo who opened Raffi’s eyes to the greatest crisis of our time.

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Do you think it's time to sing Baby Bluka together? I do have one gripe I want to tell Rafie. I just spent a week with my grandchildren in Victoria. They're two twins three and a half, and I showed them a video of Raffie singing Baby Bluga and my God. They played that so many times it became what do they call it? An earworm? And that's you know. I love this song, but too much is too much? So the complaint is the song is too good and unforgettable. Okay. This is David Suzuki and his daughter Severn Cullis Suzuki. There a father daughter power duo. CBC viewers voted David as one of greatest Canadians of all time, Wayne Gretzky, Alexander Graham Bell and David Suzuki impressive company. He's been a scientist and broadcaster for over fifty years and an outspoken advocate for climate action since the nineteen nineties, and Severn is an environmentalist in her own rank. When she was twelve, she spoke at a conference of global leaders, calling out adults for destroying the planet and challenging them to do better. Thirty years later, A video of the speech has more than thirty two million views on YouTube. She's like the original Greta Tuneberg. David and Severn are Canadian activist royalty. They also happened to be Raphi's former neighbors. Back in the eighties, Raffie was already beginning to think about his legacy. Could he give his audience something more than just sweet, gentle songs. Then a radio program on the CBC would shake Raffi to his core. It was called It's a Matter of Survival and it was hosted by David Suzuki. I'm David Suzuki. We have just over ten years until the end of the century. Those ten years will determine if and how we will exist on this planet. You will make that decision. It's a matter of survival. Both David and Severn would inspire the next phase of Ralphie's career. They taught him what respectful love between a parent and a child truly looked like, where respect means telling them the truth about our world. The thing is, the truth is messy. It can be overwhelming for adults. So how do we talk to our children about the world without scaring the crap out of them, and how do we keep hope alive for ourselves and our kids when the urge to give up is so strong. I'm Chris Garcia and this is Finding Raffie, a ten part series from My Heart Radio and Fatherly in partnership with Rococo Punch about the life, philosophy, and the work of Raffie, the man behind the music. We did our first program for television on global warming. I realized that global warming we called it then, was a real threat. I called it in my script a slow motion catastrophe. I knew that we had to get going on it immediately, so I interviewed a hundred and forty experts and scientists around the world and put together five part radio series on CBC called it a matter of s bival. To economists, growth is the main reason governments, industries, and societies exist. If our economy fails to grow, we call it a recession or a setback. A society that says enough, we've got enough, We've got more than enough, let's just stay at this level is simply inconceivable. Yet global warming says if we continue to grow, we may die. When Ralphie heard this, he got chills. He says it affected every cell of his being, and he became frightened for the future of his niece, his nephew, his young fans, and the world they would inherit. He felt compelled to act. Turns out he wasn't the only one moved by it in Canada. I have to say that the radio is still a very powerful medium of communication. That was especially so back in the eighties, and it got over sixteen thousand letters, and the outpouring of the letters said, look, I heard your show. You scared the hell out of me. I agree with what you're saying, but what can I do? It's a matter of survival. Marked a shift in David's career from scientists to climate activist. David didn't have all the answers his listeners were asking for, but he wanted to find some. He also wanted to learn more about the root of the problem, so in he and his wife Tara Cullis, who Severns mother, started the David Suzuki Foundation, and its first couple of years, David and Tara were basically funding the whole operation themselves. Then Raphie stepped into help. He was two blocks away from us, and he called actually and said David tar could I could I see you for a minute or two? And we were so involved. Gee, Raffie love to see it, but we're just going flat out right now. Could we put it off for well? He called again, could I come and see you again? We were too busy, and finally he said, look, I'll drop by your house and just drop off in an envelope. And it was an envelope with a check for fifty dollars and that was really for a struggling organization. It was a huge aid to get us started at that early age. So Raffie was there and uh, I can never thank Raffie enough for that help. So do you pick up the phone quickly or answer the door quicker when he calls now? Because he said just substantial Yes, No, he's turned out to be a friend. That's amazing and several Do you remember the quesion that it's a matter of survival had on you as as a kid. Well, I was a young child at the time, and I was really impacted by the activism that my parents were involved with with indigenous peoples at the time. So our family actually were able to travel down to southern Para in Brazil and to a kaya Pol village and spent some time there, and for myself, I was about eight or nine years old, it was just this life changing experience to be in a place where the people lived in the rainforest and still lived with the rhythms of the natural world. It just absolutely blew my mind. And when we left the village of oak Ri, which was this Kayapol village, I could see out of our tiny little plane that the forest was on fire, and that had such a huge impact on me. It was about so it was all kind of you happening at the same time. And uh, I was a child, but I've been very lucky to always have been raised with a feeling that I have a voice and I have to use it. So let me let me take it from here. Seve just giving you parents the point of view. She was an activist from very early on, but after the Amazon experience she started this group of of young girls called echo the Environmental Children's Organization. So she came into me in in uh nineteen said Dad, Dad, I hear there's going to be this big meeting in Brazil. Are you going? I said no, no, she's She said, well, I think Echoed should go down there, I said, save, it's going to be a huge meeting. It's going to be a circus. I think you used the term gone show. It'll be a gone show. So I was I was very very discouraging of her. You know, I admit that was a stupid thing on my part, but I was thinking, gosh, what are these children gonna do down in this place? After the break seven David and the big meeting in Brazil Summit was held in Rio de jan Arrow. It was created by the u N so countries could work together on issues like reducing pollution and finding alternatives to fossil fuels. Young Severn and her friends were determined to go. And we heard about this meeting and thought, wow, you know there's going to be all of these old men sitting around talking about our future. Somebody should be there to represent what's truly at stake. So they started fundraising. Well, you know, I got a hand it to your said, she went out and hustled. I think it was four dollars And Raffie was a big supporter of us. Raffie was a major donor to that. Yeah, that's incredible because he speaks about the summit in Rio. It was a huge deal for him, and he says it was a turning point in his career. Do you remember him being there and feeling a support at the conference? He was, absolutely. He was with us every day. I mean he was part of the gang. We were the crew. I have some awesome photos of him with us all and he was he was one of us. Being associated with him, I always think helped him as well. I mean he saw things in a really profound way through that experience with the young kids. Even though David thought the conference was just a quote unquote gong show. Key and Tara went to and any time they attended a meeting or a speech in Rio, they brought along Severn and her friends, always encouraging them to share their thoughts and beliefs. The head of UNICEF heard Severn speak, he was impressed. The next thing they knew, Severn had an invitation to speak to the entire conference. This was it, the moment Severn and her friends had waited for. But would these high powered global leaders really listen to or care about the words of a twelve year old girl. So then, of course it was this frantic Oh we gotta uh, you know, you've got this chance. What are you gonna say? And I remember saying to Seth, Now, Seth, this is what you've got to say. And you turned to me and said, Dad, I know what I want to say. I knew exactly what I was doing and why I was there at school, even in kindergarten. You teach us how to be had in the world. You teach us to not to fight with others, to work things out, to respect others, to clean up our mess, not to hurt other creatures, to share, not be greedy. Then why do you go out and do the things you tell us not to do? What an incredibly powerful statement. Seven you were twelve years old. What is it like to hear that? Now? I can remember exactly what that was like delivering that speech. And even though I've I've heard it many times since in the last twenty nine years, it's been a really long time. I I'm still very connected to the emotion that I had during that time. And yeah, it's just it all floods back. You've grown up, say you love us, but I challenge you, please make your actions reflect your words. Thank you. Seven got a standing ovation. And I remember at the end of the talk, of course, I was scared stiff, you know, like when Sev got up to give it and I was blown away by the way she did it. But when she sat down again, the first person to run up and shake her hands was Al Gore, and Al said, that is the best speech at anyone's given it this meeting. Didn't he say that to you? So he did? And uh and then he shook my hand and sat down, and then you whispered, Hey, do you know who that is? And I was like, uh no, he's like he's Al Gore, he's a senator. He's really good. I can't imagine sitting there and watching my child, my young child, get up there and getting a standing ovation like that. That must have been you. I can't imagine the pride you had in that moment. David. Oh yeah, my chest about exploded. That was that was pretty exciting. And So, David, what drew you to environmentalism? Like, more specifically, I'm curious to know what compelled you to make a shift from scientists to a vocal advocate for the health of the planet. Well, you know, I I never saw myself as an environmentalist. That it's all my life. My great joy has been out camping and fishing. I'm an avid fisherman. You know, I'm a third generation Canadian. In when Japan attack Pearl Harbor, the Japanese Canadians were considered enemy aliens and all of our possessions were confiscated and we were shipped to camps for three years after the war. And where we were shipped was even the heart of the Rocky Mountains. That's really where my bonding, I guess, with the natural world. It's just who I am was based on those experiences in nature. In David's fifty plus year career as a broadcaster, he's interviewed hundreds of people around the globe, including leading experts on the climate crisis, and in those fifty years, he says, one of the most important lessons he's learned is what's at the core of ecological destruction, the disconnection between humans and nature. He remembers interviewing a leader of the indigenous height Of tribe about clear cut logging and I said, look, when the trees are all cut down, you'll still be here. Why are you opposing the logging? And his answer was, well, of course, when the trees are gone, we'll still be here. But then, well, I guess we'll be like everybody else. Now that may seem like what what the heck as he's saying, but as I reflected on that, it was such a profound inside into a different way of seeing our relationship with the world. What he was saying in that simple statement, when the trees are gone, will just be like everybody else, was that the Hida don't see themselves as ending at their skin or their fingertips. That to be hida means to be connected with the land. That the air, the water, the soil, that the trees, the birds and the fish. All of that is what makes the Hida who they are. And when you destroy a part of that, you basically you you diminish the Hida. They've lost a critical part of who they are. And for me, that was the beginning of my education of genuine environmentalism was to see the world through indigenous eyes, which is what is desperately uh Severn. From what I understand, you also have a deep connection to the indigenous communities of Canada. Um, can you tell me about that and how it's changed the way you see the world For me, I Um, I moved to hidea guay. I'm married to hide a person and have had you know, have have my heide of family, have two wonderful little boys. And it's been an absolute privilege for me to be an immigrant to high to Guay, to live on hide of land, in a hide of family, in a hidea way. And following the lead of my husband who was working very hard to learn his language and to um, you know, to really fully realize his his heritage and his identity as a as a hide of person, I started learning Hida as well and discover this incredible magic and the magic as a perspective a worldview. Whenever you speak a different language, and perhaps Chris, you know you might, um you speak your heritage language. Um you know that you suddenly, you know, have a bit of transformation. You become a bit of a different person, and um you can see the world you love, see the world in a different way. And there's a beautiful indigenous academic, scholar, teacher, writer, Robin while Kimmerer who talks about the import of language and how it really shapes how we treat nature and how we treat each other. If we didn't refer to nature, um, you know, animals, plants, natural things as it this kind of lifeless, kind of um, you know, sanitized, objectified things, we would have a very different relationship with the world around us. So through language we really frame the value is of our society. And right now, as we're heading into further into this bottleneck for human survival, we need to call upon all the creativity that's accessible to humanity, all the diverse ways of being in this world in order to navigate and make it through. And indigenous peoples and world views and languages are going to be key to that. A bottleneck of human survival that sounds terrifying. How can I get over my existential dread and tell my daughter about the fight for her future? More in a minute. I really want to talk to you both about climate activism today because to me, I see a direct connection between Severn talking at the Earth's Summit and Rio and Greta tunberg A resting the un seven years later in what is it like for you both to see kids leading the fight for climate action today? It's very moving to me to see today's generation of young people speak up, take to the streets, take the environmental movement to the next level. It's also quite sad um for me that you know, these kids have to deal with it at the same time. You know, it was always so, We always have depended on our young people to be the warriors of society. And if you look at revolutions around the world, they're always led by younger people, the people who have the clear eyes for what's truly at stake, and that the imagination and the hope and the beauty in believing that things can be different. So I think that this is a continuation of movements throughout our human history. And I'm so proud of Greta. I'm so proud of the thousands of other Greta's out there who have been working for change. The first time that I met Greta, the first thing I said to her was, I am so sorry that you are having to do this, you know, at her age. I feel that young people should be out of exploring the world. You know, they're edging out of the nest and they're making you relationships, finding out things that they really like to do, the things that matter, and that's what young people should be doing. Mom and Dad should be the equal warriors on their behalf. But of course what Greta has done and what Sev did when she was young. She didn't see the world in all of its complexity, and so that the simple truths came out of their their their mouths. And the power of the words of young people is it. It's unalloyed by all of these other priorities that come and impinge on It's simply a straightforward fact. And Greta's message was so powerful that we learned science. And I listened to scientists and they say, if we go on this way, I have no future. Well, oh my god, what what a powerful message. And as Sev says, thousands and thousands of Greta's have sprung up all over the world. And gosh, if we adults can't rally to that, if we don't love our children and hear that message, then what kind of a species are we? Okay? So I am a dad now myself, and I know that at some point I'm going to have to talk about all of this with my daughter Sonny, Like, how, David, how do I talk to her about this? How did you talk about climate change with your kids? I remember when her younger sister was up and coming and seven had gone on to high school, and and Serrica had more or less taken over echo and I said, hey, Serie, this is a great project. You and your gang should do this. And she said why should I? I hear what you and mom are saying. It's too late, and I was just blown away. I mean, here's this child listening to us seven. It prompted her to be motivated to go out and do something. Serrica heard all this and is thinking, well, it's too late. Um. The big problem we face now, and I'm hearing from many many parents of teenagers, is that they're they're very severe uh psychological problems, are having to send their kids for for help. And this is the hard part is if we face the absolute truth of what the scientists are saying, it's a pretty grim It's a grim world. And I think we have to focus on what we're doing at the local level. It will be the sum total of what we are all trying. What about you, Severn, how do you talk to your kids about climate change? Two things when talking to my kids about our ecological crisis. One is as a superhero narrative or a narrative of um, you know, this dramatic story that is unfolding, which is, you know, feels very much like it's a battle between light and dark. It's a battle for life, it's a battle for all that we hold dear. And in that, you know, there is a real need for all of us to use our voices. We all have a voice, you know, my mom saying, hey, why don't you, you know, talk to your friends and see what they could do. You know, maybe together you can do something. You know, and you know, we started with the beach clean up. You know that seemed very um small at the time with what we were learning about. But then when you clean up an entire beach with your friends, the feeling that you have is that you can take on the world. It is so vital that we do not model despair because we don't know the future. We don't know the Greta's that are going to appear to us in the future and who might transform the playing field for the environmental movement. We have to keep that open. And I think right now everybody wants to know, how do you still stay optimistic or what keeps you from despair? Or are you hopeful? Or is it too late? Of course it's not too late, and now we have to roll up our sleeves and get into the fight, and especially as parents, as grandparents, we have to join with our kids and help help them feel empowered because that is what is going to carry us through. If we give up now, well then we're absolutely giving up on our kids. So we have to model that and we have to we have to show them small things to big things that we can all do. So I've got one more question for each of you, and I'll start with you Severn. What have you learned from your dad? What have I learned from this guy? I've learned so much, so much from this man who my whole life long has always been a warrior for positive change in this world, and I continue to learn from him. I'm now in the position of executive director of the David Suzuki Foundation, so clearly I believe in his vision and mission. And it's also you know, it's not just the David Suzuki Foundation, it's also the Tara Cullis Foundation, David's partner in everything, um mom, and the two of them started this this incredible organization. You know, back in when I was a kid, when I was also you know, hey, I started my own tiny organization, me and my buddies. Um. So I've watched how they've always tried. They just never give up. And even today, you know, I mean, Dad's always coming up with new ideas for you know, hey we can try this, well what about this? And now, as an executive director of this organization that is adjacent to him and his work, he's not on the board, he's not legally associated, but he is still our our symbol or our inspiration. He is constantly trying and to me, that is just so inspiring and powerful. And you know, we can never give up. And that's truly what I've learned from David, and I'm grateful for that um that spirit every day. But Sev, you have to also say you've learned from my weaknesses and fallacies or well that way we don't have time to talk about. So you know, take the compliments well again. And David, what have you learned from your daughter's saturing? Well, it's uh, it's just she is part of my commitment into the future. When she called to say, hey, Dad, I'm pregnant, my immediate reaction was, gosh, you know, you've been in this game a long time. You know how how serious the issues are bringing a child. And I know that a lot of young people today are facing this crisis of whether to go on and have a child in a world that is worsening every day, and her response blew me away. She said, this is my movement to the planet. I am committed to the future, and I'm going to do everything I can. My child is my commitment to this planet and the future. I feel any parent or grandparent of young children, you're committed to that future, and you've got no choice but to do everything you can for your child or grandchild's future. Here's something my dad used to say, which means always move forward, don't step back, even to gain momentum. So we pushed forward in the face of despair. This is coming from a man who knew something about despair. He was abandoned by his father at a young age, was a political prisoner who suffered from PTSD, and yet he was a great man, husband and dad. We talk a lot about the anxiety and distress of generational trauma, but seldom do we talk about generational grit and greatness, the spirit of survival, the despair we overcome to continue our family lines, our planet, in our species. It's these traits that I am hoping to pass on to Sunny, just like my parents passed on to me, and that David passed on to his children. My conversation with David and Severn had me thinking a lot about this, how hope starts at home and as we navigate through the trauma of a global pandemic, the climate crisis, and Chris Pratt as Mario, we need to do as my dad said, we need to keep pushing forward. After all, it's a matter of survival. Next time on finding Raffie and the reason I tried it was I felt so passionate about this planet that needed all of us. At the same time, I felt it wasn't a five year olds job to help the Amazon stay intact. You know it's it's not a three year old job, right. If we can show people around the world why nature is valuable to their lives, then they're going to protect it in their own enlightened self interest, which is the best thing we can do. I don't think love alone is enough to actually make anything stick. It's only one step. You also have to value it if it's going to be sticky over the long period of time. Finding Raffie is a production of my heart radio and fatherly in partnership with Rococo Punch. It's produced by Catherine Fendalosa, Meredith Hannig, and James Trout. Production assistance from Charlotte Livingston. Alex French is our story consultant. Our senior producer is Andrea swahe Emily Foreman is our editor. Fact checking by Andrea Lopez Crusado Raphis. Music is courtesy of Troubadour Music Special thanks to Kim Layton at Troubadour. Seven speeches courtesy of the United Nations. The clips from It's a Matter of Survival our courtesy of the CBC, and you can learn more about the David's Zuki Foundation at David Suzuki dot org. Our executive producers are Jessica Albert and John Parotti at Rococo Punch, Ty Trimble, Mike Rothman and Jeff Eisenman at Fatherly and Me. Chris Garcia. Thank you for listening. H

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Raffi Cavoukian is a magical musician. His songs, like “Baby Beluga” and “Down by the Bay,” have wor 
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