Get a I'm Laala Berry, nutritionist, author, actor, TV presenter, and professional oversharer. This podcast is all about celebrating failure because I believe it's a chance for us to learn, grow and face our blind spots. Each week, I'll interview a different guest about their highs as well as their lows, all in a bid to inspire us to fearlessly fail. Welcome to the pod. Lee Kilton Smith, teacher and on set acting coach, and I am lucky enough to train with her in Ala as well. I know any actor listening to this will understand when I say it's so hard to find a teacher that lets you as an actor, lets you kind of like really find the truth within yourself and come to a character from that truthfulness and that freedom. And that's Lee's whole jam. Lee literally teaches you curiosity, freedom, being present and kind of like getting out of your own way in a sense. And there's a thing that we do at the start of one of the classes, and that is we write on a piece of paper, stick it on the mirror or on a wall somewhere. You're going to see it all the time. I am just beginning and Lee talks about the importance of having a beginner's mindset. So this episode is for anyone with a dream, anyone with a passion, any creative. I think you will find this so insightful and so helpful. She also has audition Theory coming up, which is a four week course. I've done it and it is a game changer for a creative. So if you just so happen to be in LA, definitely check it out. I'm going to pop all the details in the show notes. Lee, you've flippen wonderful. Welcome to the pod, Lee, Thank you Kilton Smith, teacher and onset acting coach. And can I say, as a student of yours, it is an honor to be sitting opposite you right now.

Get a I'm Laala Berry, nutritionist, author, actor, TV presenter, and professional oversharer. This podcast is all about celebrating failure because I believe it's a chance for us to learn, grow and face our blind spots. Each week, I'll interview a different guest about their highs as well as their lows, all in a bid to inspire us to fearlessly fail. Welcome to the pod. Lee Kilton Smith, teacher and on set acting coach, and I am lucky enough to train with her in Ala as well. I know any actor listening to this will understand when I say it's so hard to find a teacher that lets you as an actor, lets you kind of like really find the truth within yourself and come to a character from that truthfulness and that freedom. And that's Lee's whole jam. Lee literally teaches you curiosity, freedom, being present and kind of like getting out of your own way in a sense. And there's a thing that we do at the start of one of the classes, and that is we write on a piece of paper, stick it on the mirror or on a wall somewhere. You're going to see it all the time. I am just beginning and Lee talks about the importance of having a beginner's mindset. So this episode is for anyone with a dream, anyone with a passion, any creative. I think you will find this so insightful and so helpful. She also has audition Theory coming up, which is a four week course. I've done it and it is a game changer for a creative. So if you just so happen to be in LA, definitely check it out. I'm going to pop all the details in the show notes. Lee, you've flippen wonderful. Welcome to the pod, Lee, Thank you Kilton Smith, teacher and onset acting coach. And can I say, as a student of yours, it is an honor to be sitting opposite you right now.

You're too kind. Thank you.

You're too kind. Thank you.

I don't know where to start, because you've been a joy to interview, to not to interview, shy. I'm hoping I can say that at the end, but a joy to research. Oh my goodness, so many pods out.

I don't know where to start, because you've been a joy to interview, to not to interview, shy. I'm hoping I can say that at the end, but a joy to research. Oh my goodness, so many pods out.

There, crazy right, I can't. I'm always astounded that anybody thinks that I have something to say.

There, crazy right, I can't. I'm always astounded that anybody thinks that I have something to say.

You have so much beautiful wisdom and knowledge to share. But let's rewind a little bit. If you've been in the industry for over thirty five years.

You have so much beautiful wisdom and knowledge to share. But let's rewind a little bit. If you've been in the industry for over thirty five years.

Yeah, closer to forty forty one years if you count my time in New York, and you trained as an actor, originally trained as an actor until I really sort of received the information that I was not an actor. And then I started moving in the direction of coaching and teaching and found that I had a gift for articulating what my teacher at the time could not articulate well enough. He sort of stayed behind the podium in his explanations, and I found that I could sort of cut through the bullshit and deliver it to the students in a different way that made sense. And that was fun. That was fun. I liked acting. I have a certain kind of personality that you would think would lend itself. But I gotta tell you the few times that some director some actors drug me out from behind the camera. Oh it's a shit show. It's devastating. It's just like, sure, I'll do it if you want your movie ruined. No, because I can articulate and see what you guys are up to, and I think I understand the East more than I am the Beast.

Yeah, closer to forty forty one years if you count my time in New York, and you trained as an actor, originally trained as an actor until I really sort of received the information that I was not an actor. And then I started moving in the direction of coaching and teaching and found that I had a gift for articulating what my teacher at the time could not articulate well enough. He sort of stayed behind the podium in his explanations, and I found that I could sort of cut through the bullshit and deliver it to the students in a different way that made sense. And that was fun. That was fun. I liked acting. I have a certain kind of personality that you would think would lend itself. But I gotta tell you the few times that some director some actors drug me out from behind the camera. Oh it's a shit show. It's devastating. It's just like, sure, I'll do it if you want your movie ruined. No, because I can articulate and see what you guys are up to, and I think I understand the East more than I am the Beast.

But you're trying with William Espa right.

But you're trying with William Espa right.

William Asper Bill Esper. My guy, my guy. He beat the shit out of me daily. Really well.

William Asper Bill Esper. My guy, my guy. He beat the shit out of me daily. Really well.

He was just.

He was just.

Honest, and because I had just gotten there from Texas, I really didn't have any point of reference. So all I knew was that he was the hottest acting teacher in town. And I was lucky to be studying with him, and so I did the full two year program and then he he was the one that kind of ignited in me a desire to think about He didn't he never told me I should be a teacher, but he did say you're not an actor. But he made suggestions like, you know, read this book, or you know, talk to me about that. Don't don't don't come into me my office with your actor questions. Asked me about the technique, asked me because he was Meisner through and through and through and through and through. So it was he was. He was my hero, he really was, even though he just brutalized me.

Honest, and because I had just gotten there from Texas, I really didn't have any point of reference. So all I knew was that he was the hottest acting teacher in town. And I was lucky to be studying with him, and so I did the full two year program and then he he was the one that kind of ignited in me a desire to think about He didn't he never told me I should be a teacher, but he did say you're not an actor. But he made suggestions like, you know, read this book, or you know, talk to me about that. Don't don't don't come into me my office with your actor questions. Asked me about the technique, asked me because he was Meisner through and through and through and through and through. So it was he was. He was my hero, he really was, even though he just brutalized me.

I have to share with you how I came to find you, because I was I had just come out of an intense acting training here in LA and I caught up with a beautiful friend for lunch, Ash Brewer. Oh my god right, who I know you love? And she's like, how's everything going. I was like, mate, I got to hang.

I have to share with you how I came to find you, because I was I had just come out of an intense acting training here in LA and I caught up with a beautiful friend for lunch, Ash Brewer. Oh my god right, who I know you love? And she's like, how's everything going. I was like, mate, I got to hang.

The boots up.

The boots up.

I was like, I have been ripped to shreds in this class. And she said, hang on a moment, audition theory is coming up with Lee Kilton Smith. You have to do and I was like, I don't think I can get up on a stage right now. I was like, I just my confidence and my self worth was just at a bit of a law at that stage. And she goes, don't worry, it's audition theory. You get to sit in a theater and hear Lee talk and I go, you mean I don't need to get up on No, She's like absolutely not. Like within twenty minutes of finishing that lunch, she'd sent me the enrollment to enroll and I enrolled on this.

I was like, I have been ripped to shreds in this class. And she said, hang on a moment, audition theory is coming up with Lee Kilton Smith. You have to do and I was like, I don't think I can get up on a stage right now. I was like, I just my confidence and my self worth was just at a bit of a law at that stage. And she goes, don't worry, it's audition theory. You get to sit in a theater and hear Lee talk and I go, you mean I don't need to get up on No, She's like absolutely not. Like within twenty minutes of finishing that lunch, she'd sent me the enrollment to enroll and I enrolled on this.

I didn't know that.

I didn't know that.

Yeah that was last year. And then I went back because I do a lot of training when I go back to Australia. And I went back to my teacher and I said, oh, my goodness, a and I've found it. And he goes, what And I said, finally a teacher that makes me feel free when I'm working on a scene or and he goes to tell me what's different, And I said, I feel like we're inspired to lead from a place of curiosity, and I feel like that's one of your hallmarks.

Yeah that was last year. And then I went back because I do a lot of training when I go back to Australia. And I went back to my teacher and I said, oh, my goodness, a and I've found it. And he goes, what And I said, finally a teacher that makes me feel free when I'm working on a scene or and he goes to tell me what's different, And I said, I feel like we're inspired to lead from a place of curiosity, and I feel like that's one of your hallmarks.

Would you say, absolutely? Absolutely? Curiosity is the cure for everything that ails an artist, really, you know, it's it's the I don't understand teachers who feel the need to ask an artist to perform at their very highest level while all the while they are being sad upon or criticized so mercilessly. It's a freedom from me is the key to seeing who you are as an artist. And if I create an environment that the basis of which is freedom curiosity, then I can see who you are and then I can sort of see where we're going or where we might need to go. Right Otherwise, I'm just watching you try to satisfy me, and that's dull as dishwater.

Would you say, absolutely? Absolutely? Curiosity is the cure for everything that ails an artist, really, you know, it's it's the I don't understand teachers who feel the need to ask an artist to perform at their very highest level while all the while they are being sad upon or criticized so mercilessly. It's a freedom from me is the key to seeing who you are as an artist. And if I create an environment that the basis of which is freedom curiosity, then I can see who you are and then I can sort of see where we're going or where we might need to go. Right Otherwise, I'm just watching you try to satisfy me, and that's dull as dishwater.

I have to say. I was I checked that I was allowed to use this.

I have to say. I was I checked that I was allowed to use this.

Quote about you. Oh my gosh, the.

Quote about you. Oh my gosh, the.

Beautiful m Kreta says she's a spark. She teaches freedom as opposed to teaching acting.

Beautiful m Kreta says she's a spark. She teaches freedom as opposed to teaching acting.

Oh wow, right, going to make me cry.

Oh wow, right, going to make me cry.

But it's so true. And I think as an actor that has always held on to the training so hard like. And I've always been one of those ones' like, look at all the hard work I've done. He goes like, here's the hard work I've done. And I think a lot of actors do it because it makes us feel weirdly a little bit more secure in our works, even though it's all bas and this feeling of like letting go and trusting the preparation and then just being in a state of like connection and presence. I feel like, this is what I've learned from being a student of yours.

But it's so true. And I think as an actor that has always held on to the training so hard like. And I've always been one of those ones' like, look at all the hard work I've done. He goes like, here's the hard work I've done. And I think a lot of actors do it because it makes us feel weirdly a little bit more secure in our works, even though it's all bas and this feeling of like letting go and trusting the preparation and then just being in a state of like connection and presence. I feel like, this is what I've learned from being a student of yours.

Oh my god, you thank you. I hope, so, I hope. So it seems to me that if we can, if we can embrace the art form without losing the information of the individual, it's a better art form. And I think that what happens a lot of times in people whose teachings and guidance are a little bit stuck in the past. I feel like, you just don't you don't get to know who that artist is. And I feel like freedom. I'm so grateful that Emily said that, that's so sweet. I people come to me, Lola, and they want to know my technique, and they want to know you know, point A and how that leads to be inhabit and they want to make it mathematic. And I say to people, listen, there are a lot of teachers out here who have formulated the art of acting, and they can give you points, a through point and you can sit there and do all those exercises. But with my life being an on set coach, I think I'm a different kind of teacher because I see what's called for on these sets, and what's called for on these sets is not how your to your fabulous boutique training went for you. You know, we could give two shits less. It's like it's two o'clock in the morning. Everybody wants to go home and you got to get this take. And so for me, I do pride myself on teaching something a little different. Freedom, absolutely curiosity. You know, in the class that we've just finished, there are people that still come to me who want the formula of it, and I you know, they wind up being very disappointed because they're sort of standing there kind of even though they're not chill, but they're standing there saying, I did all the work, mom, Why why aren't you like what I've seen? What I've done, and it's so hard to drag them away from their desire to be right, to do right versus to be truthful and do truthful.

Oh my god, you thank you. I hope, so, I hope. So it seems to me that if we can, if we can embrace the art form without losing the information of the individual, it's a better art form. And I think that what happens a lot of times in people whose teachings and guidance are a little bit stuck in the past. I feel like, you just don't you don't get to know who that artist is. And I feel like freedom. I'm so grateful that Emily said that, that's so sweet. I people come to me, Lola, and they want to know my technique, and they want to know you know, point A and how that leads to be inhabit and they want to make it mathematic. And I say to people, listen, there are a lot of teachers out here who have formulated the art of acting, and they can give you points, a through point and you can sit there and do all those exercises. But with my life being an on set coach, I think I'm a different kind of teacher because I see what's called for on these sets, and what's called for on these sets is not how your to your fabulous boutique training went for you. You know, we could give two shits less. It's like it's two o'clock in the morning. Everybody wants to go home and you got to get this take. And so for me, I do pride myself on teaching something a little different. Freedom, absolutely curiosity. You know, in the class that we've just finished, there are people that still come to me who want the formula of it, and I you know, they wind up being very disappointed because they're sort of standing there kind of even though they're not chill, but they're standing there saying, I did all the work, mom, Why why aren't you like what I've seen? What I've done, and it's so hard to drag them away from their desire to be right, to do right versus to be truthful and do truthful.

It is so fascinating.

It is so fascinating.

Love.

Love.

I love that when we do scene study we get to then order all these other amazing scenes. But it is also beautiful when you get to see an actor just be so open as well. Yes, and like when you give us these beautiful notes to just kind of like play with and try on, you can see those actors that are just like hungry and it's so fun to watch and then see them the next week have like devoured all of those and just like they're just playing and trying it on. And so I think, and that's a testament to you creating this space where we feel safe to do that. And another thing that you have taught me that I want to hear you unpack a little is this beginner's mindset. I remember our first week of audition theory. You were like, you've got home, guys, go home. Put a sticky note on a mirror or in the bathroom or on your bedroom door that says, I'm just beginning.

I love that when we do scene study we get to then order all these other amazing scenes. But it is also beautiful when you get to see an actor just be so open as well. Yes, and like when you give us these beautiful notes to just kind of like play with and try on, you can see those actors that are just like hungry and it's so fun to watch and then see them the next week have like devoured all of those and just like they're just playing and trying it on. And so I think, and that's a testament to you creating this space where we feel safe to do that. And another thing that you have taught me that I want to hear you unpack a little is this beginner's mindset. I remember our first week of audition theory. You were like, you've got home, guys, go home. Put a sticky note on a mirror or in the bathroom or on your bedroom door that says, I'm just beginning.

Can you talk to me? Yeah. It's an old philosophy It's something I stumbled into by helping an actor. She was sitting at my desk here and crying, and I'm looking at this woman who's Tony Award nominated actor, who's done multiple theater productions, is an amazing, incredible actor in television and film, and she just felt like there was no place for her in LA And I could see that the schizophrenia of having an accomplished resume for New York and then not having anything out here, and how that was starting to really she was starting to pay more attention to what she did not have than what she did. And so I at a point where I didn't helicopter landing in my backyard, at the point where I was about to lose my shit, I just caught myself writing a note and sliding it over to her, and it read I am just beginning. And what I said to her was, I've seen these photographs of you when you first got to New York, when you first did your first show, and that light in the eyes, the light in the beginner's eyes is so prevalent. And I think about all the started beginning in process, all the stories that I've heard about you guys, and how you came out here with like, you know, a thousand bucks in your pocket, and you found an apartment for two hundred bucks, and you bought a car for two point fifty and it broke on the way to the audition, and you thumbed your way all the way back to the audition, and you went in hot and sweaty, and you performed your thing, and you gotten back and you were itch hied, like all the shit that y'all go through when you first get out here, that nothing is going to fucking stop you. And that's the beginner's mindset that enchanced me. And I also find that the expert's mind grows dim and scared and starts to only see with limited vision. And it's a natural byproduct of being rejected so much. You start to doubt yourself, and you start to question yourself and you need the validity of an outside source to even tell you that you're okay. A client of mine right now is in a situation. She's brilliant, she's a brilliant actress, but the producers have ridden her so hard that when I go to see her work, it's like watching a bird that has yarn wrapped around its wings. Over and over and over again. It's the saddest thing. And I worry for you guys who face that and start to believe that you're missing something. You're not missing something. They are missing the opportunity to see who you really are and to see what a human being looks like. That's not invented in a fucking writer's room. Most people that are of interest cannot be invented in a writer's room. You hire actors that are fascinating, that are odd, that are quirky, that are unapologetically who they are, and then these characters come to life and we go like, oh my god, that movie hit me, that TV show I'm binging, and it's And yet there are still there are still an old school kind of thought of like I didn't write I wrote that, so could you please do it again this time say the right words and you're like, yeah, could you step in the parking lot and let me run over you? Yeah?

Can you talk to me? Yeah. It's an old philosophy It's something I stumbled into by helping an actor. She was sitting at my desk here and crying, and I'm looking at this woman who's Tony Award nominated actor, who's done multiple theater productions, is an amazing, incredible actor in television and film, and she just felt like there was no place for her in LA And I could see that the schizophrenia of having an accomplished resume for New York and then not having anything out here, and how that was starting to really she was starting to pay more attention to what she did not have than what she did. And so I at a point where I didn't helicopter landing in my backyard, at the point where I was about to lose my shit, I just caught myself writing a note and sliding it over to her, and it read I am just beginning. And what I said to her was, I've seen these photographs of you when you first got to New York, when you first did your first show, and that light in the eyes, the light in the beginner's eyes is so prevalent. And I think about all the started beginning in process, all the stories that I've heard about you guys, and how you came out here with like, you know, a thousand bucks in your pocket, and you found an apartment for two hundred bucks, and you bought a car for two point fifty and it broke on the way to the audition, and you thumbed your way all the way back to the audition, and you went in hot and sweaty, and you performed your thing, and you gotten back and you were itch hied, like all the shit that y'all go through when you first get out here, that nothing is going to fucking stop you. And that's the beginner's mindset that enchanced me. And I also find that the expert's mind grows dim and scared and starts to only see with limited vision. And it's a natural byproduct of being rejected so much. You start to doubt yourself, and you start to question yourself and you need the validity of an outside source to even tell you that you're okay. A client of mine right now is in a situation. She's brilliant, she's a brilliant actress, but the producers have ridden her so hard that when I go to see her work, it's like watching a bird that has yarn wrapped around its wings. Over and over and over again. It's the saddest thing. And I worry for you guys who face that and start to believe that you're missing something. You're not missing something. They are missing the opportunity to see who you really are and to see what a human being looks like. That's not invented in a fucking writer's room. Most people that are of interest cannot be invented in a writer's room. You hire actors that are fascinating, that are odd, that are quirky, that are unapologetically who they are, and then these characters come to life and we go like, oh my god, that movie hit me, that TV show I'm binging, and it's And yet there are still there are still an old school kind of thought of like I didn't write I wrote that, so could you please do it again this time say the right words and you're like, yeah, could you step in the parking lot and let me run over you? Yeah?

Is there also as an actor, I feel like there's this art where yes, you do all this preparation, but you have to be willing to just let go of the whole, the whole, like at any given moment, like especially like on set or in an audition or in a callback where things change on the spot, and just being like so open to like, okay, I did all that work. I remember I went for an audition co hosting a TV show and I was so nervous about the autoc league that I learned it by rope and I was like, well, that way I'm going to feel confident. And as soon as I sat down, they put me next to a comedian and they're like, Lola Limo, we're flipping your scripts and I was like, shit, I've just learned the wrong person. No, right, But it ended up being a beautiful lesson and it got me into acting school because I remember I called up an acting school and I was like, can I get into your TV presenting course? I just need to learn autok And they were like, you should do acting training. The TV presenting one is full and I go, I'd rather swim with sharks and they said great sign And I've never stopped training since. But I think it's this ability of being able to do that preparation because I knew the other person's lines just because I'd learned mine so well anyway, but then also just letting it go and being like look, I know I've done that prayer.

Is there also as an actor, I feel like there's this art where yes, you do all this preparation, but you have to be willing to just let go of the whole, the whole, like at any given moment, like especially like on set or in an audition or in a callback where things change on the spot, and just being like so open to like, okay, I did all that work. I remember I went for an audition co hosting a TV show and I was so nervous about the autoc league that I learned it by rope and I was like, well, that way I'm going to feel confident. And as soon as I sat down, they put me next to a comedian and they're like, Lola Limo, we're flipping your scripts and I was like, shit, I've just learned the wrong person. No, right, But it ended up being a beautiful lesson and it got me into acting school because I remember I called up an acting school and I was like, can I get into your TV presenting course? I just need to learn autok And they were like, you should do acting training. The TV presenting one is full and I go, I'd rather swim with sharks and they said great sign And I've never stopped training since. But I think it's this ability of being able to do that preparation because I knew the other person's lines just because I'd learned mine so well anyway, but then also just letting it go and being like look, I know I've done that prayer.

But you did that. You did that when you your whole life had prepared you in a certain direction. You'd landed in a place, and then you went to the school and said I want to do TV presenting and they said, nah, go into acting class. And you let that thing go. Yeah, went over here. It's what we do in life when we when we're faced with our biggest adventures. I think we are in a state of trust, or at least curiosity, right, And I do think that, you know, for since I've been teaching since the eighties, it's you know, we put so much emphasis on an actor prepares. There's a book, most famous book, The Actor Prepares. I want to write the next book called the Actor Lets it. The fuck got a book. I have thought about this many a time. Oh my god, you'll have to seize me how But it's it is. We prepare, and we prepare, we prepare. But the thing that's not taught that I'm trying to instill in actors is that the degree to which you prepare is the degree to which you let it go. If you let it go, it's in a place of trust and you're more open not less open. And that's you know, explaining that to directors and producers sometimes where they go like I don't want them making all the decisions. I was like, no, no, no. If they've prepared in the right way and they have a pain in the ass coach like me, I will remind them that now they are to trust all that information and walk in tabula rossa clean slate. Throw it at me. I am so ready for anything, because that is a part of you, guys in your preparation is you're preparing to take notes, You're preparing to be told you're wrong, You're preparing to say to head off in a direction that you didn't anticipate. That's part of the preparation, right. I get in here and I work with some actor and we just this morning, I was working with somebody and we fell in love with a moment and I saw both of us like with hearts shooting out of our eyes, and I was like, oh god, no, stop, stop it. We cannot get attached to this note until your director says that's a great idea, and don't walk onto a set saying my coach and I really think this is a great idea. No, no, no, bad news, bad news.

But you did that. You did that when you your whole life had prepared you in a certain direction. You'd landed in a place, and then you went to the school and said I want to do TV presenting and they said, nah, go into acting class. And you let that thing go. Yeah, went over here. It's what we do in life when we when we're faced with our biggest adventures. I think we are in a state of trust, or at least curiosity, right, And I do think that, you know, for since I've been teaching since the eighties, it's you know, we put so much emphasis on an actor prepares. There's a book, most famous book, The Actor Prepares. I want to write the next book called the Actor Lets it. The fuck got a book. I have thought about this many a time. Oh my god, you'll have to seize me how But it's it is. We prepare, and we prepare, we prepare. But the thing that's not taught that I'm trying to instill in actors is that the degree to which you prepare is the degree to which you let it go. If you let it go, it's in a place of trust and you're more open not less open. And that's you know, explaining that to directors and producers sometimes where they go like I don't want them making all the decisions. I was like, no, no, no. If they've prepared in the right way and they have a pain in the ass coach like me, I will remind them that now they are to trust all that information and walk in tabula rossa clean slate. Throw it at me. I am so ready for anything, because that is a part of you, guys in your preparation is you're preparing to take notes, You're preparing to be told you're wrong, You're preparing to say to head off in a direction that you didn't anticipate. That's part of the preparation, right. I get in here and I work with some actor and we just this morning, I was working with somebody and we fell in love with a moment and I saw both of us like with hearts shooting out of our eyes, and I was like, oh god, no, stop, stop it. We cannot get attached to this note until your director says that's a great idea, and don't walk onto a set saying my coach and I really think this is a great idea. No, no, no, bad news, bad news.

I love that you just mentioned about walking on set though, because you are an on set coach as well, and you told this great story. It's in class where an actor was getting a note and it was about like I think that the note from the director was like you were growing through dirt or something, and the actors like, I have no idea what that means. And I think you said something like kick the dirt, Just kick the fucking dirt.

I love that you just mentioned about walking on set though, because you are an on set coach as well, and you told this great story. It's in class where an actor was getting a note and it was about like I think that the note from the director was like you were growing through dirt or something, and the actors like, I have no idea what that means. And I think you said something like kick the dirt, Just kick the fucking dirt.

Kick the fucking dirt. Say you're learning louder, But.

Kick the fucking dirt. Say you're learning louder, But.

This is the way you can you can speak this language where often there can be there sometimes can be a disconnect because you'll hear of directors that are actors directors, and that feels like a gift, right, oh my gosh. Right, And so I feel like you, like you said at the top of this, like you have this ability to here to like see what's going on, hear the note, and then somehow like make it completely digestible for the actor.

This is the way you can you can speak this language where often there can be there sometimes can be a disconnect because you'll hear of directors that are actors directors, and that feels like a gift, right, oh my gosh. Right, And so I feel like you, like you said at the top of this, like you have this ability to here to like see what's going on, hear the note, and then somehow like make it completely digestible for the actor.

And that's the gig, right, that's the gig. I've never worked with children because for obvious reasons, foul mouth, terrible person. But I've always worked with adults, and the thing that happens all too often with actors, is that either there's a disproportionate amount of fear placed upon the director and the studio and the producers. So now the actor is wanting to get it right, wanting to make sure that they're right. So now they're just basically a trained monkey looking for a banana to be handed over to them. What I say to producers that are thinking about hiring me, I say to them, think about it this way. You have somebody on set that you've paid good money to to make sure this hair stays over on this side. Somebody else to make sure this eyelash has the exact same amount of mascara as the other eye. Somebody else to make sure that them costuming is just perfect. I was like, those are all very specific visions, very specific lenses that people look through to watch the actor do their work. There's nobody on this stage, on the sound stage whose job it is is to watch and know acting me. That's me. So while the director has forty seven hundred things going on all at once, all I'm doing is thinking, was the last take natural? Does it connect with the take before? Are we still tracking the same story? Does the actor feel like they are telling the story they want to tell, and as importantly and possibly more, are they in a state of listening. Those are all things that's stupid acting school shit that I say that not every director is going to be putting forth. And even the good directors that I've worked with, the ones that I would consider actors directors, even them, sometimes they've looked at me and said fix it. And I walk on the soundstage or sidle up next to the actor whisper a few words in their ears, and we usually get what we're looking for. And I love that. I love the duality of making sure the actor is doing work that they're going to be proud of and satisfying the director's vision. You know, totally so fun.

And that's the gig, right, that's the gig. I've never worked with children because for obvious reasons, foul mouth, terrible person. But I've always worked with adults, and the thing that happens all too often with actors, is that either there's a disproportionate amount of fear placed upon the director and the studio and the producers. So now the actor is wanting to get it right, wanting to make sure that they're right. So now they're just basically a trained monkey looking for a banana to be handed over to them. What I say to producers that are thinking about hiring me, I say to them, think about it this way. You have somebody on set that you've paid good money to to make sure this hair stays over on this side. Somebody else to make sure this eyelash has the exact same amount of mascara as the other eye. Somebody else to make sure that them costuming is just perfect. I was like, those are all very specific visions, very specific lenses that people look through to watch the actor do their work. There's nobody on this stage, on the sound stage whose job it is is to watch and know acting me. That's me. So while the director has forty seven hundred things going on all at once, all I'm doing is thinking, was the last take natural? Does it connect with the take before? Are we still tracking the same story? Does the actor feel like they are telling the story they want to tell, and as importantly and possibly more, are they in a state of listening. Those are all things that's stupid acting school shit that I say that not every director is going to be putting forth. And even the good directors that I've worked with, the ones that I would consider actors directors, even them, sometimes they've looked at me and said fix it. And I walk on the soundstage or sidle up next to the actor whisper a few words in their ears, and we usually get what we're looking for. And I love that. I love the duality of making sure the actor is doing work that they're going to be proud of and satisfying the director's vision. You know, totally so fun.

You've obviously collaborated with so many greats and worked on so many incredible movies shows. Is there like a moment or a story where you've been able to like? You shed so many moments and pockets of stories where you've been able to like or an actor's been stuck in something and you've been able to be like, yeah, actually you fucking hate this, Like you know, you've turned the scene on its head a little, and it's just.

You've obviously collaborated with so many greats and worked on so many incredible movies shows. Is there like a moment or a story where you've been able to like? You shed so many moments and pockets of stories where you've been able to like or an actor's been stuck in something and you've been able to be like, yeah, actually you fucking hate this, Like you know, you've turned the scene on its head a little, and it's just.

Little pearls little things that come out of that come to me out of the moment. Again, I don't really have a regimented vocabulary and beyond listening and simple as best and you know things like that. But yeah, watching someone who has to cry all day long, and they've just cried on all the master shots. They've cried as the procession is coming into the church with the coffin. They've cried sitting in the house. But now it's time for their coverage and they are dry as a bone. And I know the actor well enough to know that I don't to give them a big monologue, and so I just step in and I squeeze her arms so tight I probably bruised her. And I just said he loved you so much, and she just looked at me and burst into tears. And it just kept going and kept going and kept going. That said, I've also stepped in shit where I've like, you know, said the wrong thing to somebody at the wrong time. But I'm always accountable. You can always trust me to go like, yeah, that wasn't so smart. But I love you, guys. I love you guys, and I have a lifelong debt to repay all actors you were the guys that got me out of my situation in my home in Texas. You were the guys that told me about the world. You were the guys that said that there was a place called New York or you know la. I learned all of this from watching actors on television.

Little pearls little things that come out of that come to me out of the moment. Again, I don't really have a regimented vocabulary and beyond listening and simple as best and you know things like that. But yeah, watching someone who has to cry all day long, and they've just cried on all the master shots. They've cried as the procession is coming into the church with the coffin. They've cried sitting in the house. But now it's time for their coverage and they are dry as a bone. And I know the actor well enough to know that I don't to give them a big monologue, and so I just step in and I squeeze her arms so tight I probably bruised her. And I just said he loved you so much, and she just looked at me and burst into tears. And it just kept going and kept going and kept going. That said, I've also stepped in shit where I've like, you know, said the wrong thing to somebody at the wrong time. But I'm always accountable. You can always trust me to go like, yeah, that wasn't so smart. But I love you, guys. I love you guys, and I have a lifelong debt to repay all actors you were the guys that got me out of my situation in my home in Texas. You were the guys that told me about the world. You were the guys that said that there was a place called New York or you know la. I learned all of this from watching actors on television.

Do you know the first time I saw you, your energy felt so New York to me, like, no bullshit, this is who I am. Take take me or Levy in my suit and my snakes, you know, like you've got this, Like I also think that's the gift of who you are. It's like, this is you and you've said, you've actually said in class like this might not be for everyone, and that's cool too, Like there's something so freeing in that. And I still remember the first time I did see study with you, I was holding on so tight to the work, holding on, holding on and the most I think the moment I came back and did the next round, I was like, all I care about is being relaxed and open and trust and in a space of spaces, because that's how you grow, that's how you k I love the way you talk about discovery and choice and can you share a little bit about that.

Do you know the first time I saw you, your energy felt so New York to me, like, no bullshit, this is who I am. Take take me or Levy in my suit and my snakes, you know, like you've got this, Like I also think that's the gift of who you are. It's like, this is you and you've said, you've actually said in class like this might not be for everyone, and that's cool too, Like there's something so freeing in that. And I still remember the first time I did see study with you, I was holding on so tight to the work, holding on, holding on and the most I think the moment I came back and did the next round, I was like, all I care about is being relaxed and open and trust and in a space of spaces, because that's how you grow, that's how you k I love the way you talk about discovery and choice and can you share a little bit about that.

Sure, Sure. I Basically I teach that every character is walking into a scene to experience discoveries, and that goes for the actor. So the actor is walking the character into the sound stage or into the scene rather ready to make discoveries. And discoveries are everywhere. Discoveries are past the salt to oh my god, I have cancer. Like those are big discoveries and small discoveries. But what I like about that concept is that it moves the character through the paces. So you're never allowed as the actor to start thinking the thoughts of the actor. You have to stay with the thoughts of the character because you are discovering somebody's just passed the salt. You're like, sure, here you go, there's the salt. I have cancer. Oh my god, No, that's a horrible thing. So for me, that is the crux of remaining human in an elevated exchange. It really for me, the power of making discoveries. I always say, like, let the character walk through a world where the chairs are all upside down and there are animals bouncing all over the count across the wall, because it's stay alive, pay attention. And then if I can get an actor into that state and then watch the actor experiencing their own work at the same time, rather than presenting their work. And this is a very fine line that I face all the time, anticipation because the actor knows what's coming up, but the character cannot, must not ever know what's coming up. So that little subtle anticipation where I see that, Oh, you missed a discovery there. You didn't know she was going to say that. Why did you respond so quickly? Just need a moment, just a moment, and to keep people thinking on their toes. I think the best times I've ever had in watching actors work is when they are so so chilled, so relaxed, so in a state of trust that all I see is a human being, comma being human, just like, Oh, look at you, You're experiencing your own work. Oh, delightful, delight.

Sure, Sure. I Basically I teach that every character is walking into a scene to experience discoveries, and that goes for the actor. So the actor is walking the character into the sound stage or into the scene rather ready to make discoveries. And discoveries are everywhere. Discoveries are past the salt to oh my god, I have cancer. Like those are big discoveries and small discoveries. But what I like about that concept is that it moves the character through the paces. So you're never allowed as the actor to start thinking the thoughts of the actor. You have to stay with the thoughts of the character because you are discovering somebody's just passed the salt. You're like, sure, here you go, there's the salt. I have cancer. Oh my god, No, that's a horrible thing. So for me, that is the crux of remaining human in an elevated exchange. It really for me, the power of making discoveries. I always say, like, let the character walk through a world where the chairs are all upside down and there are animals bouncing all over the count across the wall, because it's stay alive, pay attention. And then if I can get an actor into that state and then watch the actor experiencing their own work at the same time, rather than presenting their work. And this is a very fine line that I face all the time, anticipation because the actor knows what's coming up, but the character cannot, must not ever know what's coming up. So that little subtle anticipation where I see that, Oh, you missed a discovery there. You didn't know she was going to say that. Why did you respond so quickly? Just need a moment, just a moment, and to keep people thinking on their toes. I think the best times I've ever had in watching actors work is when they are so so chilled, so relaxed, so in a state of trust that all I see is a human being, comma being human, just like, Oh, look at you, You're experiencing your own work. Oh, delightful, delight.

To cut completely. Oh, I have to ask. One thing that was really hard when I first started training with you is the way we learn our scripts. Wait one, I wrote, right, I am. So it's like script analysis, character development, backstory of the last ten years, you know, like favorite song play, favorite Spotify player. It's like and it's fun as all of that is.

To cut completely. Oh, I have to ask. One thing that was really hard when I first started training with you is the way we learn our scripts. Wait one, I wrote, right, I am. So it's like script analysis, character development, backstory of the last ten years, you know, like favorite song play, favorite Spotify player. It's like and it's fun as all of that is.

All of that can be relevant. Yeah, but this.

All of that can be relevant. Yeah, but this.

The way the freedom that comes with learning by rote and not putting, as you say, emotional fingerprints on the script.

The way the freedom that comes with learning by rote and not putting, as you say, emotional fingerprints on the script.

Absolutely.

Absolutely.

I mean, you can just take it in any direction.

I mean, you can just take it in any direction.

It's there for you. It's there for the taking. So when you meet the other half of the scene, that's your scene partner, you're emotionally open. You haven't dotted every eye and crossed every emotional t You're actually lining up to experience it yourself. And that's the beauty of it. And yes, there is a structure to scenes and a structure to screenplays, and there are you know, obligations and responsibilities that come into play, but again, the key is to put those in a place where they do not distract from the experience itself. You know, the idea of watching an actor commit to their plan, you know, and they knew how they were going to say it, so now they're just going to say it the same old way. Now they're just going to say it the same old way. And you just go, like take three, you're still saying it the same old way, and you're like, well, that's just not recognizable as anything other than an actor who overworked the material. Emotional fingerprints pre planned are not a good idea. You can have an idea of what you want to listen for and have that emotion stirred up so that it's on call, but if you just pull it out and throw it on the table, it's going to be like a you know, dead fish in the middle of a gourmet dinner.

It's there for you. It's there for the taking. So when you meet the other half of the scene, that's your scene partner, you're emotionally open. You haven't dotted every eye and crossed every emotional t You're actually lining up to experience it yourself. And that's the beauty of it. And yes, there is a structure to scenes and a structure to screenplays, and there are you know, obligations and responsibilities that come into play, but again, the key is to put those in a place where they do not distract from the experience itself. You know, the idea of watching an actor commit to their plan, you know, and they knew how they were going to say it, so now they're just going to say it the same old way. Now they're just going to say it the same old way. And you just go, like take three, you're still saying it the same old way, and you're like, well, that's just not recognizable as anything other than an actor who overworked the material. Emotional fingerprints pre planned are not a good idea. You can have an idea of what you want to listen for and have that emotion stirred up so that it's on call, but if you just pull it out and throw it on the table, it's going to be like a you know, dead fish in the middle of a gourmet dinner.

I'm one thousand percent guilty of doing that because it brings this weird false sense of security, and I think it would have come with a lack of like trusting the work and trusting myself. But definitely was like, well, it's safe for me to do this. I'm just going to intenate at the exact same position.

I'm one thousand percent guilty of doing that because it brings this weird false sense of security, and I think it would have come with a lack of like trusting the work and trusting myself. But definitely was like, well, it's safe for me to do this. I'm just going to intenate at the exact same position.

You're also covering your own vulnerability, which really and honestly, the longer I do this, I believe is the core of the best work. That when the actor is vulnerable, the character is vulnerable and vulnerable to everything around them, vulnerable to be alive, you know. And I think that we get scared. You guys get scared, and I get that because you are literally standing up there painting out of your imagination. But if you memorize lines with emotional fingerprints all over them, chances are good we're not going to be able to break you away from them. And it's akin to you know, a painter, you know, deciding what they're going to paint on the canvas before they're standing there. You know, of course a painter may sketch and you know, do colors and that sort of thing, But if they had none of that, you guys are creating from such a pure childlike place of imagination and putting it into behavior so that the line is not the only aspect of this story that's being told. The dialogue is floating on other ideas and other triggers that are being brought about. As the actor slash character is listening. You know, it's it's fascinating to me. Human behavior is fascinating to me. Oh my goodness, I mean that's the jam right, Oh my god. I have to ask a really selfish question. Tell me everything.

You're also covering your own vulnerability, which really and honestly, the longer I do this, I believe is the core of the best work. That when the actor is vulnerable, the character is vulnerable and vulnerable to everything around them, vulnerable to be alive, you know. And I think that we get scared. You guys get scared, and I get that because you are literally standing up there painting out of your imagination. But if you memorize lines with emotional fingerprints all over them, chances are good we're not going to be able to break you away from them. And it's akin to you know, a painter, you know, deciding what they're going to paint on the canvas before they're standing there. You know, of course a painter may sketch and you know, do colors and that sort of thing, But if they had none of that, you guys are creating from such a pure childlike place of imagination and putting it into behavior so that the line is not the only aspect of this story that's being told. The dialogue is floating on other ideas and other triggers that are being brought about. As the actor slash character is listening. You know, it's it's fascinating to me. Human behavior is fascinating to me. Oh my goodness, I mean that's the jam right, Oh my god. I have to ask a really selfish question. Tell me everything.

You know how much I love comedy. It's my absolute Oh me up, it's my absolute fav But what you have taught me about that comedy needs to be grounded in truthfulness. Yeah, to be funny, it is like a penny was such a penny drop that it's like you're not You're like just sitting in the truth of the moment, and that is what makes things feel funny, right, Yes, Yes, Like.

You know how much I love comedy. It's my absolute Oh me up, it's my absolute fav But what you have taught me about that comedy needs to be grounded in truthfulness. Yeah, to be funny, it is like a penny was such a penny drop that it's like you're not You're like just sitting in the truth of the moment, and that is what makes things feel funny, right, Yes, Yes, Like.

Somebody who pulls out a bag of chips and a scene that takes place in the car. You know that the the how how you pulled out that bag of tricks tells the story bag of tricks, bag of chips, how you how you offer them to the to the person driving, how you look out the window and have a memory. All of that needs truthfulness. It's the moment you start going after a laugh that you're in danger, you're in trouble. And I've been around comedy a lot, especially when I lived in New York because I lived down the street from the Improv Club and be such trying to sleep with all the comedians. I saw so many of them, and it was always a very sad thing when somebody went for the laugh without maintaining their honesty. And it's just it's it's miraculous, that delicate relationship between what happens with comedy. And I do believe that comedy is a bracketed event, that behavior is a bracketed A Matthew Perry is a Matthew Perry is a Matthew Perry. Alisa Kudrou is a Lisa Kudrow is a leader. So there are brackets around these these these personalities. But to keep that truthful and honest, you know, I I it's a it's a task, but it's doable. You just got to know what you want out of the person. You've got to know that you are ahead of the event that the audience can't see it coming. And that's how you that's how you win them over. I think in comedy, I could talk to you about this all day. You're good at comedy.

Somebody who pulls out a bag of chips and a scene that takes place in the car. You know that the the how how you pulled out that bag of tricks tells the story bag of tricks, bag of chips, how you how you offer them to the to the person driving, how you look out the window and have a memory. All of that needs truthfulness. It's the moment you start going after a laugh that you're in danger, you're in trouble. And I've been around comedy a lot, especially when I lived in New York because I lived down the street from the Improv Club and be such trying to sleep with all the comedians. I saw so many of them, and it was always a very sad thing when somebody went for the laugh without maintaining their honesty. And it's just it's it's miraculous, that delicate relationship between what happens with comedy. And I do believe that comedy is a bracketed event, that behavior is a bracketed A Matthew Perry is a Matthew Perry is a Matthew Perry. Alisa Kudrou is a Lisa Kudrow is a leader. So there are brackets around these these these personalities. But to keep that truthful and honest, you know, I I it's a it's a task, but it's doable. You just got to know what you want out of the person. You've got to know that you are ahead of the event that the audience can't see it coming. And that's how you that's how you win them over. I think in comedy, I could talk to you about this all day. You're good at comedy.

Oh, it's my absolute, absolute favorite. I know a lot of the time in class we work on plays for scripts. How like, And I know this is a very hard question to ask someoney, but what would you say? Is like? The real difference is like, and I'm theater trained from Australia before I came here, what you say is the biggest difference between theater because we talk about like vocal residents and energy levels versus acting for camera. Right, you know, you could be in a tie, you know, Like, what would you say is like, because I've heard you talk about the two an actor as an actor, like you can be you can be on a stage and then be on as.

Oh, it's my absolute, absolute favorite. I know a lot of the time in class we work on plays for scripts. How like, And I know this is a very hard question to ask someoney, but what would you say? Is like? The real difference is like, and I'm theater trained from Australia before I came here, what you say is the biggest difference between theater because we talk about like vocal residents and energy levels versus acting for camera. Right, you know, you could be in a tie, you know, Like, what would you say is like, because I've heard you talk about the two an actor as an actor, like you can be you can be on a stage and then be on as.

Long as it's truthful. You know, there are people, you know, there's a there's a reason these these comedies from the nineties are still being played to great success because the ones that were really good are still relatable. You know, the the Will and Grace. I never saw an episode, but I love that Jack and Karen, you know, I love their relationship. Just think how specific and bracketed they were. And all of the Friends episodes were fantastic, and the Frasiers and the Cheers. You know, there were so many great There was such great character work in there. And yet sometimes, yeah, sometimes I look at those and I think we've got the potential for that, but we've just got to stay the course and have a great story and stupid in truthfulness, right, those those relationships were so honest and truthful that we were like, yeah, we'll follow you anywhere. Just keep telling us, keep telling us what we're doing.

Long as it's truthful. You know, there are people, you know, there's a there's a reason these these comedies from the nineties are still being played to great success because the ones that were really good are still relatable. You know, the the Will and Grace. I never saw an episode, but I love that Jack and Karen, you know, I love their relationship. Just think how specific and bracketed they were. And all of the Friends episodes were fantastic, and the Frasiers and the Cheers. You know, there were so many great There was such great character work in there. And yet sometimes, yeah, sometimes I look at those and I think we've got the potential for that, but we've just got to stay the course and have a great story and stupid in truthfulness, right, those those relationships were so honest and truthful that we were like, yeah, we'll follow you anywhere. Just keep telling us, keep telling us what we're doing.

Relatable to feel like this little chunky yourself in these yeah, you're.

Relatable to feel like this little chunky yourself in these yeah, you're.

Like, oh, I know that part. Oh, I know that.

Like, oh, I know that part. Oh, I know that.

Another rule, not rule, but another thing that I remember the first time you said, look, listen, I'm giving you a play. Read the scene, but try to avoid going home and researching and digging out the whole play now a type personality work Ethick Lola was like, Oh, that's really hard for me, which I still to this day haven't done when I do it scenes with you, because you describe them as a slice of life, like a little slice of pie. And that's what that. Yeah, can you explain that a little?

Another rule, not rule, but another thing that I remember the first time you said, look, listen, I'm giving you a play. Read the scene, but try to avoid going home and researching and digging out the whole play now a type personality work Ethick Lola was like, Oh, that's really hard for me, which I still to this day haven't done when I do it scenes with you, because you describe them as a slice of life, like a little slice of pie. And that's what that. Yeah, can you explain that a little?

Yeah, It is the difference between a play and a teleplay. I very specifically choose plays because I find the writing more dense, and out of five pages of play script there is probably, oh gosh, there's a lot of dialogue and a lot of room. And with a teleplay, most scenes that are long are only like three or four pages, lying in their triple space. What have you? But the thing that I worry with in class, and I will tell people if you've got to read the play, read the play, but just don't bring the play into the scene, because the play that scene is a slice of life. And you know, last month we had this wonderful woman come in and by accident, she'd only gotten the first page of her scenecene. Yes, she's only gotten the first page of her scene. So she thought that the play that she was going to be acting was one page number one, but she also thought that it was. She thought it was like a flirty, flirtatious scene, and I almost leapt out of my chair because I was like, yes, do that now. As she got the rest of the play, she became less and less interested in being flirty. And yet, oh, my gosh, what a great gift you would give this play right to expand that character into that place. So yeah, I will. You know, I've had it happen in New York more than out here, although it has happened here, well in LA where I'll see something in the scene, I'll be like, what is that moment about? Sometimes there's a you know, some chagrin in there, like, well, I looked at the play and it turns out that this is her father, and I'm like, yeah, but I don't give a shit. Now give a shit because I'm looking at this part of her life, this little slice, and that is That's true. If you and I meet at a fancy pants dinner party, we're only going to know each other from that moment, and then we've shut down and we see each other hiking and our grungy, sweaty clothes up and Runyon Canyon, and now we know each other from that slice, and it's you know, if you look in the mirror mirror window of my house one night you see me having a balls to the wall argument with my husband, you'd be like, Oh, what a bitch. So we are all these little slices of our lives. And I think that what's important to me when the actor is getting a scene is that we treated as such, who are they in this moment? Who are they in this moment? I don't need a play to tell me who they should be or yeah, that should word is I hate the should stop shooting all over the play.

Yeah, It is the difference between a play and a teleplay. I very specifically choose plays because I find the writing more dense, and out of five pages of play script there is probably, oh gosh, there's a lot of dialogue and a lot of room. And with a teleplay, most scenes that are long are only like three or four pages, lying in their triple space. What have you? But the thing that I worry with in class, and I will tell people if you've got to read the play, read the play, but just don't bring the play into the scene, because the play that scene is a slice of life. And you know, last month we had this wonderful woman come in and by accident, she'd only gotten the first page of her scenecene. Yes, she's only gotten the first page of her scene. So she thought that the play that she was going to be acting was one page number one, but she also thought that it was. She thought it was like a flirty, flirtatious scene, and I almost leapt out of my chair because I was like, yes, do that now. As she got the rest of the play, she became less and less interested in being flirty. And yet, oh, my gosh, what a great gift you would give this play right to expand that character into that place. So yeah, I will. You know, I've had it happen in New York more than out here, although it has happened here, well in LA where I'll see something in the scene, I'll be like, what is that moment about? Sometimes there's a you know, some chagrin in there, like, well, I looked at the play and it turns out that this is her father, and I'm like, yeah, but I don't give a shit. Now give a shit because I'm looking at this part of her life, this little slice, and that is That's true. If you and I meet at a fancy pants dinner party, we're only going to know each other from that moment, and then we've shut down and we see each other hiking and our grungy, sweaty clothes up and Runyon Canyon, and now we know each other from that slice, and it's you know, if you look in the mirror mirror window of my house one night you see me having a balls to the wall argument with my husband, you'd be like, Oh, what a bitch. So we are all these little slices of our lives. And I think that what's important to me when the actor is getting a scene is that we treated as such, who are they in this moment? Who are they in this moment? I don't need a play to tell me who they should be or yeah, that should word is I hate the should stop shooting all over the play.

I will say working on playscripts feels good because it feels like meaty. You get to stick it in as far as scenes go as well, like you get to sink your teeth into something. There's so many pockets and like little gems that you get to just like dive into sometimes, Like if you're looking at a sitcom script or something like that, it's a whole different experience and it's.

I will say working on playscripts feels good because it feels like meaty. You get to stick it in as far as scenes go as well, like you get to sink your teeth into something. There's so many pockets and like little gems that you get to just like dive into sometimes, Like if you're looking at a sitcom script or something like that, it's a whole different experience and it's.

Its own line d page.

Its own line d page.

Right, it's a completely different ballgame. I really want to talk to you about self doubt because I don't think any actor kind of gets to maybe some do, but gets to like skip that feeling of like, ah shit, when's my time or why haven't I heard back? When is it going to be yes? Or when are the callbacks going to turn to actual booking? And I think in la sometimes you have these absolute moments where you feel so close, like something will happen and you're like, oh my goodness, I'm just like my toes dipping in the pool, like I'm so there, and then at the same time or in the same day, I'll feel a million miles away. And so that's when self doubt, I think as an artist can can creep in a little bit. Do you have any remedies, because I imagine actors would come to you with a bit of this. I mean.

Right, it's a completely different ballgame. I really want to talk to you about self doubt because I don't think any actor kind of gets to maybe some do, but gets to like skip that feeling of like, ah shit, when's my time or why haven't I heard back? When is it going to be yes? Or when are the callbacks going to turn to actual booking? And I think in la sometimes you have these absolute moments where you feel so close, like something will happen and you're like, oh my goodness, I'm just like my toes dipping in the pool, like I'm so there, and then at the same time or in the same day, I'll feel a million miles away. And so that's when self doubt, I think as an artist can can creep in a little bit. Do you have any remedies, because I imagine actors would come to you with a bit of this. I mean.

One of the remedies that I offer up. It's very simple and not very satisfying, depending upon your mindset. When you are experiencing those self doubts. One of the things I advise all the time is love your life. Have a life to love first of all, and then love that life. And when the doubt hits, when you start to be fearful and worried that you're wasting your life, it's I don't know. It's imperative that I think we all, no matter who we are, look over our shoulder and say, well, have I lived? Have I lived a life? Am I living a life? And then you start to go, well, my job is not particularly satisfying right now, Well, join ninety eight percent of the country, you know, whether you're working at a bank or Starbucks. You know, not everybody's happy with their job. And then you get into the aspect of being an artist in a country that does not congratulate their artists that in fact makes it harder and harder by not having any art programs to help out young artists that are moving along. And and yeah, it's it's it's it's we gather information, Lola, but we don't apply it. So a lot of time self doubt and fear is sitting on our bookshelf in a self help book that we paid a lot of good money for that we probably didn't read. And maybe we don't need to read it, but we need to open it and apply the principles so that you can see what it's like to look at your life from another perspective that you can't access right now. And that's you know, I say to artists all the time. I say, like, if you want to go, if you want to leave LA and you know, say fuck you get on a plane and leave. Do it. But don't do it when you're angry. Do it when you're like sort of happy with your life and you're going like, okay, all right, I'm happy. I don't know if I want to line up anymore at the audition gate and then go ahead. But verily, I will say, unto thee this story, as God is my witness, needs no embellishing, even though I'm a Texan and I love to embellish. Back in August of last year, one of my favorite human beings on the planet came to me and was basically after a long conversation, I realized was asking me if I would give him permission to leave the industry. And when I realized that, I said to him, oh, oh, leave leave. Oh by all means leave, leave if you're done, You're done. I was like, it makes me sad if you leave while you're angry or are disappointed about it, I said, but hear me clearly. The wonderful thing about your life is that it changes with one phone call. One phone call and your life is completely different. I said, so in the process of waiting for that one phone call, don't wait live, and that one phone call will make its way to you anyway. Two weeks later, two weeks later, one of the biggest sitcom producers in the world rings him up, and now he's on a new sitcom.

One of the remedies that I offer up. It's very simple and not very satisfying, depending upon your mindset. When you are experiencing those self doubts. One of the things I advise all the time is love your life. Have a life to love first of all, and then love that life. And when the doubt hits, when you start to be fearful and worried that you're wasting your life, it's I don't know. It's imperative that I think we all, no matter who we are, look over our shoulder and say, well, have I lived? Have I lived a life? Am I living a life? And then you start to go, well, my job is not particularly satisfying right now, Well, join ninety eight percent of the country, you know, whether you're working at a bank or Starbucks. You know, not everybody's happy with their job. And then you get into the aspect of being an artist in a country that does not congratulate their artists that in fact makes it harder and harder by not having any art programs to help out young artists that are moving along. And and yeah, it's it's it's it's we gather information, Lola, but we don't apply it. So a lot of time self doubt and fear is sitting on our bookshelf in a self help book that we paid a lot of good money for that we probably didn't read. And maybe we don't need to read it, but we need to open it and apply the principles so that you can see what it's like to look at your life from another perspective that you can't access right now. And that's you know, I say to artists all the time. I say, like, if you want to go, if you want to leave LA and you know, say fuck you get on a plane and leave. Do it. But don't do it when you're angry. Do it when you're like sort of happy with your life and you're going like, okay, all right, I'm happy. I don't know if I want to line up anymore at the audition gate and then go ahead. But verily, I will say, unto thee this story, as God is my witness, needs no embellishing, even though I'm a Texan and I love to embellish. Back in August of last year, one of my favorite human beings on the planet came to me and was basically after a long conversation, I realized was asking me if I would give him permission to leave the industry. And when I realized that, I said to him, oh, oh, leave leave. Oh by all means leave, leave if you're done, You're done. I was like, it makes me sad if you leave while you're angry or are disappointed about it, I said, but hear me clearly. The wonderful thing about your life is that it changes with one phone call. One phone call and your life is completely different. I said, so in the process of waiting for that one phone call, don't wait live, and that one phone call will make its way to you anyway. Two weeks later, two weeks later, one of the biggest sitcom producers in the world rings him up, and now he's on a new sitcom.

Amazing.

Amazing.

I mean, it's in. That's just an example of like how crazy you guys are in your life. And that's why it hurts me so deeply when people are disrespectful to actors or don't understand the sacrifices that you guys make. It just makes me want to run over him in the parking lot, just go like, so you're an actor, right like I'm a server right now, but I'm going to act like I didn't spit in your food.

I mean, it's in. That's just an example of like how crazy you guys are in your life. And that's why it hurts me so deeply when people are disrespectful to actors or don't understand the sacrifices that you guys make. It just makes me want to run over him in the parking lot, just go like, so you're an actor, right like I'm a server right now, but I'm going to act like I didn't spit in your food.

Yeah, fuck her, I do love. I actually think I got this tip when I was talking about you to dre Andre said that you taught her that after an audition, go and celebrate, and you plan to do something after the auditious and I place to go. Isn't that a I think that is such a brilliant hack in so many ways. But think about it, because you're not putting it's like life exists outside of this audition room.

Yeah, fuck her, I do love. I actually think I got this tip when I was talking about you to dre Andre said that you taught her that after an audition, go and celebrate, and you plan to do something after the auditious and I place to go. Isn't that a I think that is such a brilliant hack in so many ways. But think about it, because you're not putting it's like life exists outside of this audition room.

Wow, you know, yes, I've got an amazing life to get back to. You guys need to see anything else? Okay, well listen, good luck with your project. I think it's amazing, and get the fuck up, get back to your amazing life. Yeah, you know that's where. That's where like doing the Lizzie comes in, where you put notes underneath the people's windshields that are positive and affirming, and you go back out and I can't wait to see who picked up their note. And maybe someone's picking up their note right then. Or go and buy yourself your favorite candy, you know, and just have a moment, sit in a parking lot and go like, yeah, I did did some good work today. That's the thing. We want to be able to know when we've done good work and not wait around for someone to tell us we lay work. To be able to go I did great work. Are they going to hire me beyond my control? Did they like me beyond my control? I did great work? And that's when I came to to La to do. Came here to do some great work. I love it. I love it.