Reliving this episode is nothing short of heaven… from Whitey’s “why basketball matters” speech, to Karen admitting she was going to need help, to the monumental real-life events happening in Wilmington at the time.
Hilarie, Sophia and Joy are feeling all the effects of the power of this episode almost 16 years to the date that it originally aired.
Hi everyone, we heard you. We are so excited to share some exciting news for you. Go ahead, we got We had so many sweet d ms from people saying they weren't going to be able to make it to Drama Queens Live. What could we do? Code to UK, come to Kansas, code to us. Please come to l A Well we are. We are coming to your home wherever you are, because our live stream of the New York show is available to you on October twenty at five pm. Tickets are on sale right now, y'all at Drama Queens o t h dot com. You can get tickets to the live stream. Are amazing team at my Heart has made this globally available because we want you guys to be there with us, whether your butts are in those theater seats or in your most comfortable sea here at Family. We want you with us, and you guys are going to have the best of both shows because we have different guests that each one of our New York City shows. So you were going to get Barbara Allen, Woods, Daphnews and Ega tie R Hilton all four what ty three dollars? Heys do it? It's our lucky number. You know what I mean, that's what I'm saying. Visit Drama Queens o t H dot com to get your tickets to the live stream today. First of all, you don't know we're all about that high school drama. Girl Drama, Girl, all about them high school queens. We'll take you for a ride in our comic girl Cheering for the drama Queens up girl fashion. But you're tough, girl. You could sit with us Girl Drama, Queens, Drama, Queen's Drama, Queen's Drama, drahn MC Queen's Drama Queens Already none of us want to start, Okay. I love this episode. This was one of those episodes where there were a lot of like meaningful sit down, I want to tell you something moments, and so you're all at home, just sit down, We're gonna tell you some stuff. What's gonna happen today. It's a season three episode nineteen I Slept with someone and fallout boy and all I got was a stupid song written about me, which aired April twelve, two thousand six. Sofia tell him what they've won? What was the synopsis? Well, friends, In this episode, Lucas is having a hard time getting back on the court for the Ravens as they forfeit a game, but he finally tells Whitey and Karen about his heart condition. Uncle Cooper is in town and dating a new twenty six year old model, supposedly from Tree Hill. Devi also returns and offers to help Karen get back on her feet. We all burst into tears at that part, and Nathan and Haley take a test to see if they are a compatible couple. Peyton makes a decision about who she wants to be with. Oh my god, chuck full of spicy nuts. I don't know, spicy nuts, spicy this will? You know? Did a great job. This was her directorial debut, I believe on our show. Yeah, I think so, I think just all together, I think this was the first i'm she ever directed anything. Well, um, I I don't really know where to start. I mean, well, our episode begins with with Lucas quoting George Elliott, who we were like, I hope people at home know that George Eliott is a woman. It's a woman, a girl named George, A girl named George. Very apropos for us. I loved I loved that quote. You know, last week we talked about our experiences with grief. And it's not lost on me that that quote talks about the first time you grieve and how hard it can be because you have not yet experienced suffering and then the healing um to have despaired and recovered hope, so you don't know that there's hope on the other side of loss. And to think back on, you know, not just how young these characters are, but what it was like when you experienced your first grief. It's a really profound observation, and it it felt so fitting in that scene between Lucas and Nathan, you know, when they debut the Keith Scott patches and the black jerseys and and everybody's just trying to figure out how to process and carry this experience. I thought it was gorgeous. This feels like this should have been the last episode. Yeah, well joy. That was my initial impulse to just like, wait a second, I thought we had fun last week. And then the more I thought about it, the more I was like, yeah, grief is like the up and down and up and down and up and down. Grief is instability, you know, and so it's not linear. You're going to bounce back and forth between like I'm okay, I'm not okay, And to see Lucas do that. You know, we saw him with his crowd last episode, and this episode begins with him very much by himself, um and more. You know, used the staging of these scenes to show him isolating, and I've done that. I think we've all done that, right, yeah, because you just don't it's so hard to figure out where to put it grief, like where do you where do you put it? What's shelf do you put it on? And you have to keep taking it down to re examine it and put it back on the same shelf, maybe a different shelf. It's like emotionally, we're just kind of it's just so hard to figure out where it goes, how it fits in your new day to day life. Um So I think we see some of that in this episode. I love that his reaction was I respect this game, I respect all of you. Tell me why it matters right now? Like yeah, yeah, I went to a point last year where everybody was dropping dead around me and I nothing mattered, like and I would have to fake it. I would have to be like, no, this job is important or this thing that I have to do is important, or going to this meeting is important, and it was all pretend because your brain is just like what are we doing? Um? So I think it's important when we do heavy subject matter on our show and we're modeling, we're modeling grief for the audience at home that's also trying to figure out how to do it. That's an important question, like why do these things matter? M hmm yeah. And when you're in it, it is very hard to feel anything outside of it, you know. I remember having that feeling when I was in college. My mom got sick and suddenly it was time to take mid terms and I was taking theater classes and creative writing, and I was like, are you all kidding? What does this meant? You want to come to class and take a test? Like everything felt so impossible to care about because one of the people I care about the most was in a period of an uncertain future. And when you're it kind of I remember feeling like I had been picked up and like dropped out of my reality and into a different one. You know, when you watch a nature show and like a giant bird picks up a fish and then drops it, Like there are outdoors women Sophia. When I was fly fishing in Montana, I was like, I felt like a fish that had been grabbed by an eagle, and I was no longer in a river that was dying in the rocks. Right. But suddenly you're like where. I don't know how to even get back to where I was? Like where was I? Where am I now? And and it it does matter so much when you can't feel it to have somebody look at you and say, let me tell you what is true, because you will come back to this even if you can't be here now. And Whitey does that for Lucas he serves as that tether two. I don't want to say the real world, but to the connected world. And I thought it was really beautiful, you know, to to zoom out a little bit. Our show was amazing in a lot of ways, but we certainly failed um in terms of accurately representing the diversity or experience of a place like North Carolina. And it was gorgeous to have Whitey tell a story that felt so true. You know, Barry at his age, having lived through the Civil rights movement and you know all of all of these big historical things that we often on the show would just ignore our our historical truths to have him tell a story that is so representative of the fact that it is often sports art music that breaks barriers, that welcomes people in first. However imperfectly. You know, those are often the the arenas where people have been welcomed first. And it I was just really I was really happy to see that we did that. It was a conversation that did kind of feel out of the blue. But when we consider what was going on in North Carolina at the time we were filming this um, there was well so in Wilmington's specifically during the civil rights movement there there was like there were huge race riots in Wilmington's UM in like the sixties, right, and there was a group called the Wilmington's Ten. They had tried to integrate the schools and UM. I would encourage anyone to do a deep dive on this history because it really is astounding. But Wilmington's Ten sent to prison. They were accused of, you know, inciting violence and all these things, UM, when really they were fighting for the freedom of their community. And while we were filming the governor we had at the time, Bev Perdue, finally officially pardoned them. You know, they've been living with like these felonies. And it was also the time period where, um, the eighteen massacre was still being called like the race war, so that difference, it wasn't a race war. Now the language makes such a difference. The language makes a huge difference. And it was when the memorial for that was going up in Wilmington's. So while we were filming our show, it was the first time Wilmington's was really kind of reckoning with their own history and we were surrounded by that, and it was very new, and everyone was very kind of trepidacious about like, what's what's the new language? What do we say? How do we acknowledge this? You know um? Because it is hard to call your parents or your grandparents or just the generations before you on the carpet and be like, hey, you guys, got um. But it's an important thing to do. And so we were living in Wilmington's during a really interesting time in their history. So this conversation feels very you know relevant. If anyone hasn't been on the Wilmington's In Color tour, there's an amazing tour that takes you all over Wilmington's on a bus and shows you all these amazing historic sites that were ignored right up until when we were shooting our show and people started finally paying attention. That's great. I didn't know they were doing that. Yeah, it's really cool. I love that. Will you guys recount a little bit about that conversation that Whitey has with Lucas Um not just for our listeners, but also for me a bit because I went downstairs to make a cup of coffee and I had somebody in the house who was talking to me, and I was trying to listen to the episode, but also and I really want to be a part of the conversation that we're having. But love it. Yeah. So, you know, Whitey, when Lucas says, tell me why this game is important, tells the story of how he got his nickname and talks about being a young boy on a high school team that was called the best team in town, but they knew there was a better team and it's the team who's gym they're playing in that faded logo of the Monarchs. As the story goes, the Monarchs were Entree Hill, you know, lower per our writers, the Black basketball team, and the black players and white players were kept completely segregated and we're not allowed to play each other. And they hosted a game. They essentially, like you know, went outside of the schedule and and hosted a game and played. And I have chills thinking about it. And so there's Barry Corbin as Whitey looking at Lucas talking about how he grew up and what the history was, and that they decided, you know, both teams to cross this barrier and play, and that the coach of the other team looked Barry in the eye and said, I'll take Whitey, and he said that's how I got my nickname. And I thought about it hearing him say it, you know, today watching the episode, because do y'all remember there was a diner in Wilmington's called White And I know the lore was that that's where Michael Jordan's used to like bus tables when he was in his school. YEP. So it all feels like, given the fact that the um truth was being told finally about the history, that that demands to call it what it was, a race massacre, not to call it a riot. You know, like we said, language matters, Um, and even that you know the stories we grew up in Wilmington's hearing about Michael Jordan and where he worked and where he played and all those things. It feels like they figured out a way to, obviously, in our fictional story, um, bring in some things that could make it all make sense for people. So how does that connect with the Lucas is saying, why does this all matter? So essentially what Barry, Barry what white he is saying to Lucas is this is how much basketball matters. We were a segregated state and we and we played together. And he says to him, you know that night, we weren't white players or black players. We were basketball players. And and when I think about, you know what, as I was saying earlier, what sports music, what we do? You know, acting has has meant when you think about the legacy of Jackie Robinson, when you think about um, you know, blues players traveling around America during segregated times, When you think about what it meant for you know, Sydney Potier to become Sydney Pottier like it is. It has often been in sports and creative industries where we have pushed boundaries. And again, you know, there's a lot of imperfection there, but it felt so impactful to watch an adult say to a kid, this game that you're trying to reconcile with can be the thing that moves culture. It can heal history. You know that you can be a part of something that's bigger than just showing up and um and playing a game. It's not just a game. Yeah, and Whitey says to Lucas, let the game heal you. That's the perspective that I liked because it's age giving advice. You know, it's the kid who is playing the game, Whitey at seventeen years old, getting that nickname, hanging out in the gym, doesn't know that he's doing something that will matter a lot to him as an old man. He's just playing with a bunch of dudes. And then it's as an old man, he's like, that meant a lot. It meant so much, and so for Lucas. You know, it's it's that advice of just put one foot in front of another and the truth will reveal itself to you in time. The healing will reveal itself to you in time. You just have to go through the motions right now, just do that and and the story will unfold later. Um. That's so, that's such an intrinsic part of healing from grief is just putting one ft in front of the other. And we watch Karen do that in this episode as well as she's finding her way. How do I even just the action of slapping Whitey when he comes in and he says, whose fault is that that you didn't have Keith for longer than five minutes? Um, It's an action. It's like forcing her to do something instead of wander around in her robe and with the clothes all over the apartment and not being, um there for Lucas and not being there. Um. And I'm not I'm not trying to shame Karen's character in any way, but that behavior is very normal for grief. UM. Probably super necessary actually, but at some point you have to step out of it. And I love that he gets to be that voice of reason and love and uplifting and just like, I'm going to force you out of your comfort zone because you have to just keep moving um. And he wouldn't have known that if he hadn't had the life experience of doing that when he was a young man and isn't it funny how the things that we do when we're young that seemed like the hardest choices that we have to make, The things that we do that we think this is impossible, and then years later it actually ends up being some something that has the most impact on other people in our lives and communities because we were able to trailblaze in one area or another. I mean, I've had people in my life who went through things in their youth that trail blazed for me. So it's a huge blessing to be able to have the weight of grief and carry carry yourself and other people through that. Mm hmm. Karen saying I'm going to need some help, Oh dude. That that was the one that got me. That was right now, you just heating it, dude. I felt it in my bones. And then looking at each other that moment, those two women seeing each other, I'm going to need a lot of help. Good, You're going to get it. Yeah. Yeah. It reminded me of running into your the both of your arms after Willie Garson died, because it was just a couple of days after that, we did our drama queens Um live stream and Sofa brought me flowers and Joy had brought me honey, and like, you know, it's difficult for me to admit that I need help. And so I love seeing that female friendship in our show. I love it. It matters. It matters that we help other women value that there's so many opportunities to be combative. We see it with Brooke and Rachel in this episode, and so to see the good soft stuff is so important. Go hug your girlfriends. Yeah, well, And I think it's also it's modeling that learning, you know, because something the three of us have in common is we really like to help the people we love, and we're all not great at asking for help for ourselves. Never never, ever, Oh my gosh. I like that Our love language is I know you're not going to ask me for this, but here's the you know, whether it's a coffee or flowers or a random our text message or whatever like, And it's those it's those acts of love that I think have allowed us to become the friends who can look at each other and say, I do need this, Can you help me here? Will you talk to me now? Whatever it might be, And and I love seeing that. Dev just says I'm going to do it, and whenever she's ready, I'm going to be here. And finally, at the end of the episode, Karen comes in and essentially says, I'm ready now. That is that is a whole love language. It's clear that dev just got through like her boozy therapy or whatever she's been doing has she understands glowing, but she also knows like you can scream at me, I'm not going anywhere. Yeah. Yeah, it's hard. It's so hard to ask for help, even even in grief when it's like, of course it's the most obvious, or in injury, guys. I just I fell through a hole I met. It's a long story, but I really jacked up my foot. It looks like I went and put my foot through a joint garbage disposal, Like it's all sliced up. Where did you fall through a hole in my house? It's a bbe. Do we need to pick around your listen? My point is I've really messed up my foot and I had to travel three airports in two days um two days after afterwards, and it was really deep cuts, like the kind of cut that like when on medical show when they slice open you can like open up the skin and see down and the muscle. It was like a deep but I should have gotten stitches, but I didn't because it was eight o'clock at night and I was like, I'm not, like, I don't want to ask for help. I'm fine, put a band aid on it. Fine, yeah, give me some super glue. I'm fine. Um. And it was healing, but you know, gingerly. And so I had to I had to travel through these three airports with assistance, and it was really hard for me to just like, I just want to do things myself. I don't want to inconvenience anyone. I don't want anybody to feel like I'm uh, I don't know. It's a pride thing, like I want to prove that I can do things myself all the time. Like what is that, Well, it's a it's a don't think it's a mom thing. Don't be a baby, don't be a sister girl, be a tough girl. Maybe that's it. I also think it can be a bit of a reaction to what we do for a living. We show up where people tell us to. When they tell us to, we say what they tell us to. We eat when they say we can we pe when they tell us there's enough of a break to like make it all the way to the bathroom and all the way there. There is very little autonomy. Don't plan a vacation because you can't go on it. If they say you can't go, oh, I'm sorry. You can't go to the dentists until we wrap for this season? Are you sorry? Like there's no time for you to go business hours? And so I think there's really something too they, especially for independent people like the three of us, to like I can do it, I can do all of it. I got it, don't touch it, leave me alone. I'm fine. I think we we crave being able to do things ourselves because so much of our work life is so far outside of our control. So it can make I mean you, I mean the collective you, but certainly me how I'm raising my hand at this whatever anonymous meeting we're at like, I'm like, I got it, don't touch it. And sometimes people I love are like, are you okay? Why are you doing that? I'm like, I'm sorry. That is so interesting. So we've we've developed control issues because of the circumstance. I think job that is so interesting because that makes me think of when I'm on set. How you know how much actors hate a line reading when anybody interfered. I don't generally, I've kind of gotten over it at this point. I'm like, yeah, just tell me how you want me to say it. However, I'll make it my eye. Everybody wants to go home, just tell me what to do. But especially when you're young and you're finding your way and your artist's voice and you just want to yeah, when somebody else tells you how to And I used to get so worked up about it. It It was like, don't tell me where to stand, don't tell me how to say it. I'm going to do it my way because it was the only space that I had to just be free. So I was very protective over my free spaces. And I think that is really interesting that maybe why it's a lightbulb moment. Sophia, thank you any time I've I've thought about this a lot, and and it is really interesting, right, like the fact that nothing in your life when you are on set can you not only can you control, can you have any input on at all? Except your work. I mean when the cameras start rolling, then you're free. When the curtain goes up, you're free, yes, but I just mean the circumstances of your life, Like you cannot make a decision about when to leave your home. Somebody's there telling you where where you live. Like it's all it's so much of it is dictated for us. And so I think it's why we can be very territorial or protective about our autonomy because there's just not a lot of avenues for it. Is that every job though, Like if you work, if you're an accountant, if you work a desk job and you're like labeling blood samples at the medical whatever facility, like, don't you still have to you have hours, you have to show up. You have to you know, sometimes your job is location specific, Um you still have to. Uh, I don't know, there's lunch breaks. Yeah, but Joy, all these all these young kids are quiet quitting now, you know, Like the youngsters aren't following those rules anymore. God bless, they're just like we quit all those rules that you like Gen X millennials follow, don't be ridiculous. Yeah, it's interesting. I have like one person who's not in our industry that I get to talk to about this. My one of my best friend's sisters works in a corporate job where every year she has to move because of the track she's on for training because she's going to have like a very high powered, important job soon. And she's like, oh my god, I have no one I convent to about this. I'm like, well, you need more actor friends, babe, because we'll get We'll go to a meeting, and it's like, okay, well, in six days, you're moving to Canada and you have to figure it out, you know. So, yes, of course everybody has parameters, but not everybody's parameters or as batshit crazy as her industry. And there exactly, it's like you're going, sorry, oh, for the next six weeks, you're just going to be awake only at night. Good luck to you. Like girl, it just is what it is, okay. Well. I also think some of the aspect of the control is that when you are on set and someone is brushing your hair and someone was doing your makeup, and someone is putting clothes on you and maneuvering those clothes in between every take so that it matches the take before and you're being handled all the time, it can be I say, masculating, but but for women too. It takes your power away and it makes you feel pretty and like like a baby, you know, And I want so badly to prove that I can do it all. I can do it. So on my show that I do for Sunday, there's no hair and makeup team, there's nobody that's like holding cue cards from it. Like I was just like I could do it all myself, and I look terrible and I am wearing awful clothes that are right out of my closet, and I keen love it because I did it myself. And so it's like it's like a kindergartener that's like, no, I can dress myself. I realized that I'm my four year old daughter. That's like, what was that character on Mad TV Stewart? I can do it. I can do it. Do you remember that? Well, speaking of like evolving as a human, we have to address the Rachel storyline because it's an evolutionary thing. I feel very conflicted about Um, it's conflicting because of the bts on our show. It's not like I appreciate that any I mean, I'm always conflicted about somebody who wants to change who they are because it's who you are, but if you I also appreciate that, like if a girl's like I don't know, she wants to get a nose job, get a nose job, if it makes you feel better about yourself, like I don't know, I mean joy, I agree. It's a context of what's going on behind the scenes and knowing the whole thing with our boss and like the way like that's kind of I think where the conflict for me mostly lies. Did it have to be a wait thing? Like what if Rachel had like a big mole removed, or what if she had like teeth that she didn't like or like it just always boiled down to wait with our boss. And it's such a cheap card to play, and it's inappropriate it and it could have been handled in such a beautiful way where you see a girl who's actually looks great and healthy and fine and she has this I'm spitballing. I don't know. I mean, maybe I'll go off track, and I hope I won't, but um, you know, if she she goes you know, we see Daniel who's beautiful and you know, has this amazing health about her as well. Um, but who talks about like why did I the way that I saw myself in the mirror. I went through all of this transformation. I went through so much pain because I didn't accept who I was and love who I was, And so I tried to love myself by changing myself in all these ways instead of just loving who I am. Um. I feel like that would be such an interesting journey to watch. I think it would be really interesting for someone to say, oh, I thought if I changed myself physically, i'd feel different. I feel the same. I just looked different that what I'm That's exactly, you know, like that. I've heard people say that, whether it's about by the way, something cosmetic or even like I colored my hair and I, you know, cut it all off and I did it, and like I don't feel any different. When when people move sometimes they say that, you know, I thought if I moved to X, I would feel different. And turns out like when you take where everything there are, yeah, there you are, you take, you take your belongings, and you take your problems like congratulations. I think it bothered me about this. Again, we're supposed to be sixteen, you know, we were all in our mid twenties. But the paint brush that that man sort of used to paint this storyline. The things that they're talking about, gastric bypass, you know, implants, a nose job, and a bunch of other surgeries. She says, like, these are massive, the massive procedures that carry life threatening risk, and and they talked about them as ignorantly and casually as you know. Lindsay Graham talks about pregnancy like, pregnancy is a miracle. If you want to be a parent, it is what an unbelievable thing, Like, you guys gave birth to some of my favorite humans. They are human beings that are on the planet that didn't exist before you made them, Like, hello, it's a miracle. What drives me crazy is when men talk about pregnancy like it's just a casual stroll to the grocery store. And I'm like, do you want to know that the number one cause of aortic dissection in women under forty, Like, we're literally the largest artery in your body just explodes pregnancy, So let's be clear that the miracle comes with danger. I don't like when we treat like massive things that women go through as casual, and so this irks me in the same way yes, because the way we see ourselves in the mirror is a big thing. Yeah, I'm like, she didn't color her hair. You're saying she like opened up and cut up her body and broke her own bones. And you're acting like she went to the mall and bought a pair of shoes and and she's supposed to be sixteen. Like, can we have a second to to your point, joy, like having a deeper conversation about what society has done to us as girls and women to make us no matter what we look like. I feel like the way we look is wrong. Well, if you notice mouth's hole like diet tribe is I I, I, I I I and Lee God bless him. Sold It did a great job with the subject matter. But rather than focus on the girl who has traumatized herself physically and mentally, it's all about I could have loved that girl, I I I I think you're great. I feel his way. Maybe now that you actually were a nerd or are still a nerd deep inside, you'll like me too. It's all about him, which is how it's so basically the behind the scenes that pisces us off. Is it basically what our boss was saying is I'm mouth. I'm going to speak through mouth. I don't need you to be hot because I know what you know, like average girl, you are inside, and I'll love you even though you are average, and my validation should make you like yourself. You you you you guys like skin crawl. By the way, I would have thought an effective storyline was to see Rachel like, not that different, but she thinks the picture is terrible, Like, oh my god, that's what I'm saying. It's all in her head, That's what I'm saying, because what you see, you know, when you end up with a eating disorder, what you see in the mirror is completely different than what is actually there. It's totally warped. And that would have been interesting to see her mortified by an old photo that doesn't look that different and to understand that that's what body dysmorphia, right right, Oh my god, there's the woman. Where's the woman in the room? Yeah, m well, anyway that said, I love watching like teen shows now because this dumb body stuff is just so different, Like I love I love how different it is for our kids. You know, it's just a much different conversation. So bravo. Yeah, it's you know, it's great that it's great that it's a it's a really an awareness conversation for girls now too that um, you know, I think when we were younger, it was easy for it was like, oh, don't eat that, you'll get fat. It was just said and nobody you know what I mean, and you're like, oh okay, and in everybody. We were reading all those teen magazines and it was all about the language. Again. The language was just so uh unhelpful. It was very black and white. It was just like, of course there's a concern, um, And I've I have my own child and we've gone through our own journey of trying to figure out the healthy ways to eat. And uh, you know how, I know you've got healthy ways to eat and things going on in your house too with your kids. And for girls, because I'm raising a girl, it's become really important that those conversations, especially during the pandemic, we're all sitting around. We were sitting around and getting fat. It was happening. There was like extra fat on our bodies that we didn't need and that was killing our energy. And to be able to like communicate to her, let's get strong let's get healthy, let's have more energy. It has nothing to do with whether you look at what you look like. It has to do with how you feel and how you're energy is on the inside. And I think it's also I can't imagine what it would have been like to be in the moment where in now when we were making our show, where it's like, also, what is your body? Your bodies are built different, Like, you know, It's something that I actually think is very cool. Um. You know, she's a supermodel, but Emily Radatowski talks a lot about this about what people think of her body and the way people think they own her body because her body is part of her work. And and she you know, I read this thing where she talked about how she casts for her swimwear campaigns, and she's like, no, I know what my body is. It's part of my job. Also, I was just born like this. But she casts women and like they'll be women with ten drastically different body types, like thin women and big women, and and they're all wearing the same bikini. And I'm like, thank you, because all the trying ever showed, Yeah, all we were ever shown was like the roxy moss Kate Moss, like it was one kind of body and now it's like, no, if you want to wear this bathing suit, put it on your body, and then it's a bathing suit for your body. You're welcome. I love I love that we're finally and look, I'm not going to pretend the beauty industry isn't like a toxic mess, but I just love that we're finally seeing people just be who they are. Yeah, we've managed I mean in my house, we through that period of suddenly becoming aware of our health, how food affects our body and our energy levels and our strength. Um, we've managed to sidestep the whole body dysmorphia issue that we were just talking about where she just has no awareness of it. She's just like happy and chill and like you know she you know, when we talked about eating, She's like, I don't really want those carbs, and I'm like why, She's like, because they slow me down. I don't feel good when I eat him. I want him in the morning. I want a good fat, Like, give me an avocado. It's and it's because it's all about the ingredients, the health, the energy. It's not about what I look like, well, you want that those first conversations to be with you and not some kid at school. Because I a magdeal and Gus's friends. For whatever reason, I have become a mom that other children text, and I take it. I'm the like Jeffrey and I are both getting text messages from Gus's friends at like odd hours, really, and I love it, but it's it makes me nervous because I'm like, am I giving good advice to these kids? And I found out that there's a pack of girls at Gus's school who count their calories at lunch and if you eat more than a hundred calories, you know, like it's like this whole thing. And so I've got them coming there and be like some moms are really tender with it, and they're like, hey, this is bad. You know, we don't do this, and I am more of a hamm mer and I'm just like, that's bullshit. I don't like it. You told the only girls I said it's bullshit. You know, like, I don't know how to handle it necessarily other than to be like angry about it. Um, but it's happening right now with our kids, and you want their first conversations about that to be with a grown up that they trust, Um, Rachel having to talk about it with mouth and and make light of it. So it's to kind of be like, it's fine, I like myself, this is who I am. Um. I didn't like that. He kept being like, you don't like yourself, You don't like yourself. I know you don't like yourself. I see through you. Yeah, that bug me. It was also creepy to me and you you said it. You know, this was a storyline in this episode where our boss was trying to talk to a girl he had a crush on and doing it through another character, and it was gross and it was it was It was a heavy episode for that influence because he also cast himself as Pete Wentz's manager to talk to you on the phone. Yeah, hearing his voice like you guys, I started sweating. I got like nauseous. I haven't had to hear that voice in a long time, honestly, like like I haven't heard that. Um. Yeah, that was gross and that was gross. And it's like you're at five year old dude who's married, So sorry to her, but you know, what are you doing? Like why why are you doing this with a bunch of twenty year old kids that you employ. Like, it's like it's like, you know, but any other show it's fine. It's it's you know, creators do make cameos all the time and shows. It's not a big deal. It's just when they're like, sorry, maybe I know no quiet part out loud. No, that is my point though, the context that's the throwing us off here. Yeah, it's yucky. It does not hold up what else happened in this episode. Hold on, I'm trying because we were. We were did such a nice job directing. I love that scene in the gym where the slow mos stuff slow basketball. Who knew it was gorgeous in that old gym. It was so vintage looking and just and like that beautiful shot. She did this amazing shot of Nathan coming down the court to make that basket, and then it cut to Lucas walking out of the gym, but they were basically walking the same path but like he was. Nathan was still on the court and Lucas was walking out, but they were in a line. That was beautiful, very cool. That must have been so hard to shoot, Like, yeah, to have those double doors open wide up and to be calling action on the inside and have Chad on the outside. And you know, I likeegraphy, the ambitious shots that my too well. And you know, we had guys on the crew with like fishing line pulling those doors open. Chad walked out of them like they just kept opening, and like that was fully a nice little sneak. You also want to talk about Larry's dad moment. Thank you. It was so good, you guys. Literally my post it says Larry is the best dad. I love being parented. I love it so much. I forced myself to go get a facial the other day and this older woman called me my darling and my sweet girl the whole time, and you guys, she had to wipe the tears out of my eyes because I was just like, okay, thank you. So this energy, this Larry energy, like I wish we'd had it all the time. Because the response of Peyton and Brook is like perfect. We've seen these kids doing all this growing up. We're going to bars, we're going to sun kiss parties, we're drinking, we're you know, holding up with rock stars whatever, and then all of a sudden, we're kids. It's again. It just brings it, brings it right back down to earth, and yeah, we're getting curfus and we're getting some instruction. He's talking about what kind of man would be good enough for his daughter, for these girls, what you should be looking for. You know when when when you guys have that final scene and he says he wants you to pick someone because of what he is, not what he does. Oh, it's it's beautiful and and it is the parenting that's been missing for That's that's what got me. It was that's what's been missing because Karen hasn't been able to parent, Barbara has been gone. Keith has always been that voice, that parenting voice everyson, there's a void and we needed that. I was like thirsty for it, and I didn't know it until he said, listen, here's the rules. This is how it's gonna go. And by the way, boundaries chefs kiss him, walking over and opening the closet door and saying, Brook, you need to find another hot dad fantasy and then walking out of the room. Dude, I was embarrassed, so embarrassing, I was like turning red by the way I turned red. But I also was like, Larry, you're still hot. I'm watching you be hot right now. I don't know what you know, spoiler for the end of the episode. It all you know, he gives all those like fabulous speeches and he's like love a guy for the man he is right, and it's just like, okay, daddy. You know, like you can tell that Peyton has a dad thing because the next closest thing to her dad is Jake. The girl Dad's like, it's that dad, It's like but it was no contest. It was like, Yeah, why am I going to go fly to hang out with some rock star who buys me a ticket and expects me a high school or to get on a plane and come hang out and wait for him backstage with his groupies? I mean, when that's what I would have gotten out of it. Why would I do that when there's a perfectly good, exactly who my dad is talking about man waiting for me. Yeah. And I think it's Larry's speech about who you want to be with and what kind of relationship you want to be in and and what really makes it worth it that makes Payton admit to herself, I'm just trying to move on from Jake. Why don't I just go get Jake. Yeah, he respects her. Jake's always respected Peyton. You know, it's like, oh you like someone else, Okay, cool. But She's like, if I'm about to get on a plane, if I'm actually willing to get on a plane for a guy, who's the guy I'm willing to get on a plane for? It? Like al screwed up? Was it though that she took the Pete went sticket and went to look up with a different dude? Did she get that? No, she totally takes. Like Pete leaves her a ticket at the airport and she just, you know, transfers the plane somewhere else. That's that's such a high school girl move right, Like it don't get me in trouble is my thing. It's like, dude, like, don't get me in trouble. That means that you don't respect me. You don't respect my dad. Like Pete should have called dad and been like, there's gonna be around the whole time and you can come to if you want to. Mr Sawyer up to the house in a limo one in the morning or whatever. Come on, Yet, poor Pete. Did anything else happen in this episode? There was something I'm forgetting right now. There was a thing Nathan and Haley didn't really do anything, laid in bed and your little relation. Oh, I know, it's the Rachel line about her age with Cooper. Cooper says, I'm dating this twenty six year old model. She's back from New York, how sitting for her family? And then it's Rachel, don't don't I loved them together? Um, they had great chemistry. Yeah? Yeah? Well, and also I feel really cheated that we didn't get Cooper in the later years for Brooke to hook up with, because that would have just complicated the whole Rachel Brooke Cooper love triangle. So fine, it would have been so fun. I was ever ever ever Oh my god, he's so cool, but he also has to sit down and have an after school special. Honestly, Brooke got robbed of Cooper and mouse. Yeah. Interesting, they took all your toys and gave them to Rachel. Are you a little bit? Are you just? I mean, I'm mostly upset that that they wanted me in Danille to fight all the time because we had so much fun together. But you know, I couldn't would have shut up. Those are my what ifs. Okay, Rachel Cooper mouth, those are brooks? What ifs? Good? Yeah? Man. Then I definitely lied about my age when I met Jeffrey, So there's a part of me that sympathized you did. I told him I was thirty because I was never going to see him again. I was like, whatever, alright, see you later, boss. And so then when we were together for a couple of months and it was my birthday, Nick, my best friend who you guys know from Wilmington's, was like, twenty seven club and jeffs real funny, what are you gonna be twenty something forever? And I was like, oh no, I messed up. I'm twenty seven for real. Um, which is majorly different than lying and saying you're twenty six when your seventeen. Yeah, a little different. What you know, Rachel's Rachel, Rachel's going to Rachel's going to Rachel girl stuff. I'm glad we have a bad girl. Um yeah, what else did happen? I don't know. I can't think of anything else. Well, you know what is interesting? And I thought that Lee did such a beautiful job with this. We are in this Brooke and Rachel conflict thing, and you know, this terrible writing with these photos trying to I just that bothered me so much. I still get that nauseous feeling that I had when I read it, and I was like, I don't want to do this. I don't want to be you know, this girl bullying another girl. I think that this is horrible, but you know, we don't have control over this. Commit to the material, and you gotta commit. And it really hit me when Mouth yells at Brook and says, did you learn nothing from Jimmy's death? You know this idea that we have to be kinder to each other? And and there is really something I think when you're young and someone has hurt you or betrayed you where you want to you want to get back at them sports And for Mouth to say like, we're supposed to have learned, We're supposed I know she's done all this terrible ship too, it doesn't matter. We're supposed to have learned to not be like this to each other. And you know, I thought that that was beautiful. And for as much as the writing he was given in those scenes with her was very flawed, it definitely makes it so sad when he shows up at our house at the end, and Brooks right, and just like that hit me for for mouth, Brooks definitely right. I mean it was not lost on me that what was going on behind the scenes was, you know, Danielle had started dating her husband, like the super hot, nude, super hot dude that everyone had a crush on, and our boss was like, I will be the girl that brings flowers and you reject me, and everyone's going to be on my side. You're gonna look like real asshole for not picking me. And then we were like, no, that's yeah, I know, and I know that you didn't like that Brooke went down that road for this episode, but I like it for Brooke for the sake of character consistency that she lives out loud, she lives messy, and that's how we learn and grow. No one is perfect. You have to make those kinds of mistakes that are hard and embarrassing and you look back on you cringe. I mean so many moments like that in my life. But I wouldn't have grown if I didn't make stupid mistakes and hurt people's feelings and like do dum well and if people who love you, It's like we all need the mouth in our life. That's like, you mean, an asshole? Yeah, you know, taking it too far? Yeah, because sometimes you need somebody to look at you and say, I get that you're in pain. That doesn't mean you should put your pain on other people. M h. And we we need that and and yeah, enjoy. You're right. It's I think some of the things that were so gringe e to me that Brooke had to do, we're also really important for her to do, because it's not just that we need people to model good things for us. We need people to model bad things for us so that we don't do those things. Yeah, that's right, especially people that we love, Characters that we love who we can see them have flaws just like us. So it's like, Okay, I love her and she messes up. I can love myself because I mess up, but it's all right. Yeah, And you know, let's do a listener question. What do we got? We have one here that says it's from Anne Hi ann. Oh. This is funny because I said this when it came on. I said, oh, it's nice to hear Gavin's voice again. She asks, when you hear Gavin Degrass song, I don't want to be which wasn't what I was talking about in this episode was a different song with Heap. Anyway, she said, what is your relationship to the song? How do you feel when the song suddenly comes on the radio. Do you get emotional happy? Sad um? I want to turn it off immediately, do you really? I'm just like, I don't want to think about it. It is like the number one grocery store song, like number one babe, immediately embarrassed. I feel like they're popping us, like when we're going Yeah, when it comes on, You're like, is this happening on purpose? What's going on? Who's who's up there? Who's up there in like the grocery store office looking through that two way mirror, like the one Tree Hill cast members have landed. Play the song now listen. So I was driving Gus to school the other day and there's that pop two KS serious radio station, and they're talking about how they're going to start like playing soundtracks from the two zones and they list like ten things I Hate about You from the like late nineties, two thousands. They're listing all these movies that I'm like, oh, yeah, cool, that's laps cool. Yeah, I'm into this, and then they said what Tree Hill And they were like, our favorite soundtracks and you know you hear like a Little Happened to Grow soundclip. I was like, guys, we made it. We made the Cool Kids soundtrack made it. I like it. It's funny. I can't imagine it being sad. It's definitely context dependent. But sometimes I'm like, oh, that's usually how I feel. It's a little like cutie. Um. I feel that too, But then I want to turn it off. I'm like, but I don't want to listen to the whole thing. It's like when Stars Go Blue comes on, it's like, okay, turn it off. Yeah, I get that. I think if I'm like, if someone sends me a funny, I feel like we send these to each other all the time, like a you know, some Instagram reel or like a TikTok or something, and the song is on it and it's hilarious, Like I can't get enough of I don't think it's amazing. If we're in public, I eat the grocery store immediately, I'm like, is anyone waiting for me? Like? If I see someone looking at me when the song comes on in public, then I'm mortified because I'm like, I don't know what reaction you want for me, and I'm not going to give you the one you want because I can't read your mind and I have to disappear now into the hole in the floor that I'm going to will to appear. But for my exit, what if for arguments sake, from this moment on, we do the exact opposite, Like what if from now on we want to do just air guitar like a flash mob where we are just marching up and down the aisles of the grocery store, singing it loud, bringing in everyone else. I feel like we should just go big or go home at this point, like, yeah, you know the words sitting with me, what can you imagine? Oh my god, can you imagine any other show like the actor hearing their theme song in the grocery store being like, oh my god, I love this song. This is my show. Yeah, we have to have a better sense of humor. Al right. From here on out, I'm gonna we're gonna go Instagram live next time we hear that's it, Instagram Live immediately, no matter what. The grocery store and they're playing our song, it's happening. We maybe upset ourselves up there whale, somebody spin a wheel and I deal with fortune. Most likely to save you from a bad blind date, either of you girls. Honestly, you'd both be really good at it in totally different ways. I've done it. Oh yeah, yes, I feel like I probably I mean, no offense Hillary. I probably would call Sophia. She's better, She's a better liar. Yeah, I just like, you know what it is for me, Like, don't ask me to help you plan a surprise party. I'll screw it up. But if if I can help, like if that's can't counsel mode for me, I'm like, how are you doing? What time is it? Let's make a plan. I'll set an alarm on. This is what I'm going to text you, and if you answer this way, I know you're happy. And if you answer this way, I know it's going badly. And then what I'm gonna do is it's like a choose your own adventure book that we're writing in real time, Like what is more fun than I'm just gonna text you B B D and the name of the restaurant or whatever it is. That's it. I feel like you would have like a helicopter with a rope ladder like within like, you know, fourteen minutes, the restaurant's gonna bring me a phone, a rotary phone, to the table and be like you've got a call. You have a call Mam on the landline? Oh my god. Yes, yeah, it's probably I mean, it's probably also a brook Davis skill set. Um, although like like a twine on is oh good call? Yeah. I mean Antoine put me in my very first Uber ever and that blew my mind. It was like years ago in Paris, and he was like, we have to get you out of this situation. And he was like, I'm gonna order a car on my phone with this new fangled thing called Uber. And I was like, what are you talking about? Like, am I going to get home alive? Yeah? I don't know, but he just like it had gotten overwhelming where we were and next thing you know, I'm like safely tucked into my room and Anson handled it. I love Antoine. Yeah, yeah, you can count on him. Yeah, he's definitely a person that you know you can call he's ready. Yeah, that's it. Um, alright, guys, I feel like this was a good episode. I'm glad we sorted out all the after school special moments in this episode. Next episode, Season three, episode twenty, every day is a Sunday evening. I have no idea. What's coming, do you? Hopefully? I mean a little Jake. Yeah, we're gonna have Jake. We're gonna have a little wedding prep. Yeah, maybe some maybe some Brook and Haley. Uh, I want to design your wedding dress more? Yeah, Oh my god, don't I put you in a dress with like a terrible maleficent caller at some point? Or did I do that already? I feel like maybe you did? You do it because it's just it was a surprise because it was like we got married. Okay, maybe this is it. It's coming up. We're gonna have some amusing fashion maleficent collar now I wish I had. That's my next Halloween costume. I'll mix male efficent hule. All right. I love you guys next week. See you next week. Hey, thanks for listening. Don't forget to leave us a review. You can also follow us on Instagram at drama Queens o t h or email us at drama Queens at I heart radio dot com. See you next time. We all about that high School Drama, Girl Drama, A Girl All about Them high school Queens. We'll take you for a ride in our comic Girl Cheering for the Right Tea Drama Queens. Dreelease my girl, up girl Fashion, but your tough girls, you could sit with us. Girl Drama, Queeze Drama, Quez Drama, Queen's Drama, Drama, Queen's Drama. Queens