Best-selling author and journalist Trent Dalton appreciates things most people wouldn’t give a second glance. 

Growing up, Trent had no choice but to see the best in people, because if there wasn’t some light in those he loved, the world would be too dark a place to bear. 

When he sat down to transform that story into his best-selling debut novel Boy Swallows Universe, little did he know his experience would be adapted for the stage and then for Netflix. 

But it was the unexpected death of a treasured friend who left him an old typewriter that sparked his next book. And the stories he tapped out would also ultimately save his marriage. 

Hear how the road to Trent’s success is paved with hard work, looking hard for beauty in the mundane as he taps out love stories on his typewriter with a tonne of enthusiasm.   

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Curveball is the show that leans into life’s messy moments! It’s a production of Deadset Studios.  

Keep up to date with Curveball by following @_deadsetstudios on Twitter and @deadsetstudios on instagram.  

Want to know more about how people thrive in challenging times? Sign up toCurveball’s LinkedIn newsletter! And suggest a Curveball guest by visiting www.curveballshow.com

This episode was produced by Grace Pashley. Executive producers are Rachel Fountain and Kellie Riordan. 

We acknowledge Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples as the First Australians and Traditional Custodians of the land on which this show was made. 

Best-selling author and journalist Trent Dalton appreciates things most people wouldn’t give a second glance. 
Growing up, Trent had no choice but to see the best in people, because if there wasn’t some light in those he loved, the world would be too dark a place to bear. 
When he sat down to transform that story into his best-selling debut novel Boy Swallows Universe, little did he know his experience would be adapted for the stage and then for Netflix. 
But it was the unexpected death of a treasured friend who left him an old typewriter that sparked his next book. And the stories he tapped out would also ultimately save his marriage. 
Hear how the road to Trent’s success is paved with hard work, looking hard for beauty in the mundane as he taps out love stories on his typewriter with a tonne of enthusiasm.   
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Curveball is the show that leans into life’s messy moments! It’s a production of <a href="https://www.deadsetstudios.com/">Deadset Studios</a>.  
Keep up to date with Curveball by following @_deadsetstudios on <a href="https://twitter.com/_deadsetstudios">Twitter</a> and @deadsetstudios on <a href="https://www.instagram.com/deadsetstudios/">instagram</a>.  
Want to know more about how people thrive in challenging times? Sign up to <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/newsletters/curveball-6745938675223425024/">Curveball’s LinkedIn newsletter</a>! And suggest a Curveball guest by visiting <a href="http://www.curveballshow.com/">www.curveballshow.com</a>   
This episode was produced by Grace Pashley. Executive producers are Rachel Fountain and Kellie Riordan. 
We acknowledge Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples as the First Australians and Traditional Custodians of the land on which this show was made.

The human experience is all about adapting. Whether it’s a CEO trying to ride out an international travel crisis, a surfer struggling against a monster wave while his floatation vest fails, or a media star whose whole life changes in an instant, rarely do you get to glimpse what’s really going on during a someone's darkest hour.

In these revealing, personal conversations with a range of successful people, Curveball host Kellie Riordan gets the lowdown on how people grow in extraordinary times. 

Keep up to date with Curveball by following @_deadsetstudios.com on Twitter and @deadsetsetstudios on Instagram. Find out more about the show or suggest a guest by going to www.curveballshow.com

Curveball is also now a LinkedIn newsletter! It's a weekly top-up of the best advice our guests have to help set you on the right path. Subscribing is totally free.

Curveball

Golden-orb weavers, caterpillars, or the look on his mum’s face when he says he’s written a book about his childhood. Trent Dalton sees the beauty in a gloomy world.

Boy-like wonder — Trent Dalton sees the humanity where there's none

“Giving anaesthetic in a muddy cave kilometres underground and under water? I never thought that was a good idea.” 



Experienced cave diver and doctor Dr Richard ‘Harry’ Harris is no stranger to extreme dives in pitch-black, cramped conditions. But when a call came for him to assist retrieving 12 teens and their coach from treacherous conditions inside a cave in Thailand during monsoonal rains? Well, he thought the boys had no hope of being pulled out alive. 



This incredible recovery mission taught him about pushing boundaries and propelled Harry into conversations with other risk takers. Why don’t we take more risks? Why aren’t we letting our kids explore their boundaries, and to deal with the consequences that might eventuate? 



Australian of the Year 2019, Richard Harris, takes you inside this remarkable rescue, but also a heart-breaking one to recover the body of a close diving buddy.  



In the process he illuminates the ways we can all face fear head-on.  



Check out Harry's podcast Real Risk and his new book The Art of Risk. 

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Curveball features revealing conversations with leaders about their challenges and their successes. It’s a production of Deadset Studios. 



Keep up to date with Curveball by following @_deadsetstudios on Twitter and @deadsetstudios on instagram.  



Want to know more about how people thrive in challenging times? Sign up toCurveball’s LinkedIn newsletter!  



This episode was produced by Liam Riordan and Harry Hughes. Executive producers are Rachel Fountain and Kellie Riordan. 



We acknowledge the Traditional Owners of the Country on which this podcast is made, the Turrbal and Jagera people, and recognise Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples as Australia’s first storytellers. 

“Giving anaesthetic in a muddy cave kilometres underground and under water? I never thought that was a good idea.” 
 
Experienced cave diver and doctor Dr Richard ‘Harry’ Harris is no stranger to extreme dives in pitch-black, cramped conditions. But when a call came for him to assist retrieving 12 teens and their coach from treacherous conditions inside a cave in Thailand during monsoonal rains? Well, he thought the boys had no hope of being pulled out alive. 
 
This incredible recovery mission taught him about pushing boundaries and propelled Harry into conversations with other risk takers. Why don’t we take more risks? Why aren’t we letting our kids explore their boundaries, and to deal with the consequences that might eventuate? 
 
Australian of the Year 2019, Richard Harris, takes you inside this remarkable rescue, but also a heart-breaking one to recover the body of a close diving buddy.  
 
In the process he illuminates the ways we can all face fear head-on.  
 
Check out Harry's podcast <a href="https://realriskpodcast.com/">Real Risk</a> and his new book <a href="https://www.simonandschuster.com.au/books/The-Art-of-Risk/Richard-Harris/9781761106774">The Art of Risk</a>. 
+++ 
 
Curveball features revealing conversations with leaders about their challenges and their successes. It’s a production of <a href="https://www.deadsetstudios.com/">Deadset Studios</a>. 
 
Keep up to date with Curveball by following @_deadsetstudios on <a href="https://twitter.com/_deadsetstudios">Twitter</a> and @deadsetstudios on <a href="https://www.instagram.com/deadsetstudios/">instagram</a>.  
 
Want to know more about how people thrive in challenging times? Sign up to <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/newsletters/curveball-6745938675223425024/">Curveball’s LinkedIn newsletter</a>!  
 
This episode was produced by Liam Riordan and Harry Hughes. Executive producers are Rachel Fountain and Kellie Riordan. 
 
We acknowledge the Traditional Owners of the Country on which this podcast is made, the Turrbal and Jagera people, and recognise Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples as Australia’s first storytellers.

Test your instincts — Richard Harris on embracing risk to rescue teens trapped in a Thai cave

Jack Manning Bancroft was 17 when he walked into Australia’s most prestigious college at Sydney University. Think sandstone buildings, young men wearing suits and gowns to the dining hall each evening.  

Jack, a talented athlete and student and a Bundjalung man, had been awarded a scholarship to St Paul’s College. 

The level of privilege he was surrounded by made him angry, but it wasn’t long before he channeled that into establishing the Australian Indigenous Mentoring Experience (AIME), an award-winning mentoring program.  

Jack became one of Australia’s youngest ever CEOs at 19, his program helped thousands of Indigenous teens finish high school, and the unique AIME approach was written up by Harvard Business School and McKinsey.  

Jack Manning Bancroft thinks differently. He leads differently. He draws on his Bundjalung roots (his mother is renowned Aboriginal Australian artist Dr Bronwyn Bancroft) to tell big stories and to develop relationships that are far from purely transactional. 

And now his big ideas are going beyond mentoring. He wants leaders and businesses to adopt Indigenous systems-thinking to revolutionise how we approach markets, capitalism, climate action, and relationships.  Could his new book Hoodie Economics and his radical new virtual world Imagi-Nation unlock powerful new ways to lead your organisation, team, or family? 



MORE INFO:

Some of the resources Jack mentioned or ones you might like to consume about Indigenous issues in Australia include: 

Dark Emu by Bruce Pascoe 

Sand Talk: How indigenous thinking can save the world by Tyson Yunkaporta 

Interview with Brooke Blurton on The Imperfects podcast

The Voice: Information from the Australian Government here, information from Reconciliation Australia here, and the Yes23 campaign here

The Uluru Statement from the Heart

Video explainer by KPMG partner and Arrilla Indigenous Consulting’s CEO Shelley Reys AO 

ABC News coverage of The Indigenous Voice to Parliament referendum. 

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Curveball is the show that leans into life’s messy moments! It’s a production of Deadset Studios.  

Want to know more about how leaders thrive in challenging times? Sign up toCurveball’s LinkedIn newsletter. And feel free to suggest a guest by visiting www.curveballshow.com.

This episode was produced by Liam Riordan. Executive producers are Rachel Fountain and Kellie Riordan. 

We acknowledge the Traditional Owners of Country throughout Australia, and recognise Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples as the land’s first storytellers. 

Jack Manning Bancroft was 17 when he walked into Australia’s most prestigious college at Sydney University. Think sandstone buildings, young men wearing suits and gowns to the dining hall each evening.  
Jack, a talented athlete and student and a Bundjalung man, had been awarded a scholarship to St Paul’s College. 
The level of privilege he was surrounded by made him angry, but it wasn’t long before he channeled that into establishing the <a href="https://usu.edu.au/clubs/australian-indigenous-mentoring-experience/">Australian Indigenous Mentoring Experience (AIME)</a>, an award-winning mentoring program.  
Jack became one of Australia’s youngest ever CEOs at 19, his program helped thousands of Indigenous teens finish high school, and the unique AIME approach was written up by Harvard Business School and McKinsey.  
Jack Manning Bancroft thinks differently. He leads differently. He draws on his Bundjalung roots (his mother is renowned Aboriginal Australian artist <a href="https://www.bronwynbancroft.com/">Dr Bronwyn Bancroft)</a> to tell big stories and to develop relationships that are far from purely transactional. 
And now his big ideas are going beyond mentoring. He wants leaders and businesses to adopt Indigenous systems-thinking to revolutionise how we approach markets, capitalism, climate action, and relationships.  Could his new book <a href="https://www.hardiegrant.com/au/publishing/bookfinder/book/hoodie-economics-by-jack-manning-bancroft/9781743799680">Hoodie Economics</a> and his radical new virtual world <a href="https://aimementoring.com/systems-change-projects/imagi-nation/">Imagi-Nation</a> unlock powerful new ways to lead your organisation, team, or family? 
 
MORE INFO: 
Some of the resources Jack mentioned or ones you might like to consume about Indigenous issues in Australia include: 
<a href="https://www.magabala.com/products/dark-emu">Dark Emu</a> by Bruce Pascoe 
<a href="https://www.textpublishing.com.au/books/sand-talk">Sand Talk: How indigenous thinking can save the world</a> by Tyson Yunkaporta 
Interview with <a href="https://open.spotify.com/episode/6LtNmJFMsAWxexsUx5SYo0">Brooke Blurton on The Imperfects podcast</a> 
The Voice: Information from the Australian Government <a href="https://voice.gov.au/">here</a>, information from Reconciliation Australia <a href="https://www.reconciliation.org.au/reconciliation/support-a-voice-to-parliament/">here,</a> and the Yes23 campaign <a href="https://www.yes23.com.au/">here</a> 
The <a href="https://ulurustatement.org/the-statement/view-the-statement/">Uluru Statement from the Heart</a> 
<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&amp;v=Nla61MfEtiY&amp;t=0s">Video explainer</a> by KPMG partner and Arrilla Indigenous Consulting’s CEO Shelley Reys AO 
<a href="https://www.abc.net.au/news/voice-to-parliament-referendum">ABC News coverage</a> of The Indigenous Voice to Parliament referendum. 
+++ 
Curveball is the show that leans into life’s messy moments! It’s a production of <a href="https://www.deadsetstudios.com/">Deadset Studios</a>.  
Want to know more about how leaders thrive in challenging times? Sign up to <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/newsletters/curveball-6745938675223425024/">Curveball’s LinkedIn newsletter.</a> And feel free to suggest a guest by visiting <a href="http://www.curveballshow.com/">www.curveballshow.com.</a>   
This episode was produced by Liam Riordan. Executive producers are Rachel Fountain and Kellie Riordan. 
We acknowledge the Traditional Owners of Country throughout Australia, and recognise Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples as the land’s first storytellers.

Hoodie economics — How Indigenous systems-thinking could unlock your business potential, with Jack Manning Bancroft

“We bought computers that had never been connected to the internet. Phones were taken out of the room and I unplugged everything, including televisions and fridges. At one point the cabinet secretary pointed out through my window to a block of flats across the water and said, ‘You realise the Chinese will be in there and they’ll have a laser on that tumbler of water, and they’ll have turned it into a microphone. They can listen to what we’re saying now’. So the curtains came down immediately. At home, I did the same. I unplugged everything. And if I wanted to talk to my wife, we went out into the woods. We did all the things that spies are supposed to do.” 

Alan Rusbridger was the editor of The Guardian newspaper when a whistle blower called Edward Snowden reached out with documents suggesting the National Security Agency (NSA) in the US was spying on its own civilians. The extraordinary claims landed them in hot water with governments in both the US and the UK, and ultimately forced Snowden into exile in Russia where he remains today, more than a decade on. 

So what’s it like when you’re the one responsible for hitting publish on the most explosive story of the decade? One that involves spies and spooks, encrypted messages, and an international hunt for both the source of the story and the journalists who broke it? 

Alan Rusbridger is now the editor of Prospect Magazine, the chair of the Reuters Institute for the Study of Journalism, and a member of Facebook’s Oversight Board. He’s been at the forefront of journalism’s transition to the digital and social world – all while juggling this century’s most complex stories in news. 

Rusbridger also describes the time he played Chopin in a deserted hotel in Libya while waiting for officials to negotiate the release of a missing Guardian journalist, why he believes Wikileaks founder Julian Assange should be released from prison, and the legacy of media mogul Rupert Murdoch.  

+++ 

Curveball features revealing conversations with leaders about their challenges and their successes. It’s a production of Deadset Studios.  

Keep up to date with Curveball by following @_deadsetstudios on Twitter and @deadsetstudios on instagram.  

And friends, don’t forget you can also sign up toCurveball’s LinkedIn newsletter! And we’d love you to suggest a Curveball guest by visiting www.curveballshow.com

This episode was produced by Liam Riordan. Executive producers are Rachel Fountain and Kellie Riordan. 

We acknowledge the Traditional Owners of the Country on which this podcast is made, the Turrbal and Jagera people, and recognise Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples as Australia's first storytellers. 

“We bought computers that had never been connected to the internet. Phones were taken out of the room and I unplugged everything, including televisions and fridges. At one point the cabinet secretary pointed out through my window to a block of flats across the water and said, ‘You realise the Chinese will be in there and they’ll have a laser on that tumbler of water, and they’ll have turned it into a microphone. They can listen to what we’re saying now’. So the curtains came down immediately. At home, I did the same. I unplugged everything. And if I wanted to talk to my wife, we went out into the woods. We did all the things that spies are supposed to do.” 
Alan Rusbridger was the editor of <a href="https://www.theguardian.com/uk">The Guardian</a> newspaper when a whistle blower called Edward Snowden reached out with documents suggesting the National Security Agency (NSA) in the US was spying on its own civilians. The <a href="https://www.theguardian.com/world/interactive/2013/nov/01/snowden-nsa-files-surveillance-revelations-decoded#section/2">extraordinary claims</a> landed them in hot water with governments in both the US and the UK, and ultimately forced Snowden into exile in Russia where he remains today, more than a decade on. 
So what’s it like when you’re the one responsible for hitting publish on the most explosive story of the decade? One that involves spies and spooks, encrypted messages, and an international hunt for both the source of the story and the journalists who broke it? 
Alan Rusbridger is now the editor of <a href="https://www.prospectmagazine.co.uk/">Prospect Magazine</a>, the chair of the Reuters Institute for the Study of Journalism, and a member of Facebook’s <a href="https://www.oversightboard.com/">Oversight Board</a>. He’s been at the forefront of journalism’s transition to the digital and social world – all while juggling this century’s most complex stories in news. 
Rusbridger also describes the time he played Chopin in a deserted hotel in Libya while waiting for officials to negotiate the release of a missing Guardian journalist, why he believes Wikileaks founder Julian Assange should be released from prison, and the legacy of media mogul Rupert Murdoch.  
+++ 
Curveball features revealing conversations with leaders about their challenges and their successes. It’s a production of <a href="https://www.deadsetstudios.com/">Deadset Studios</a>.  
Keep up to date with Curveball by following @_deadsetstudios on <a href="https://twitter.com/_deadsetstudios">Twitter</a> and @deadsetstudios on <a href="https://www.instagram.com/deadsetstudios/">instagram</a>.  
And friends, don’t forget you can also sign up to <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/newsletters/curveball-6745938675223425024/">Curveball’s LinkedIn newsletter</a>! And we’d love you to suggest a Curveball guest by visiting <a href="http://www.curveballshow.com/">www.curveballshow.com</a>   
This episode was produced by Liam Riordan. Executive producers are Rachel Fountain and Kellie Riordan. 
We acknowledge the Traditional Owners of the Country on which this podcast is made, the Turrbal and Jagera people, and recognise Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples as Australia's first storytellers.

Boy-like wonder — Trent Dalton sees the humanity where there's none

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