The volume. This is Boxing with Chris Manning. Somebody punched him in the face. Anthony Joshua is a composed and ferocious finisher. Wat's This Heavy hosted by s I S Chris Mannix. That was my moments now with interviews, analysis and everything going on in the world of boxing. When you have talent, you are given another chance. Here's Chris Mannix and we are back. Last podcast for the month of July. I can't believe it's almost the end of July already. Where's the summer between Kevin Durant and boxing? Like the summers just evaporated on me. But we are at the end of July. Good fight still ahead of us though, Danny Garcia fighting this weekend. You've got Virgil Ortiz back next weekend. Then a little bit further down the line, Anthony Joshua a huge heavyweight matchup against Alexander usk Uh. My guest this week, keith I Key probably thinks I'm going to talk right off the bat about the flirtation that we saw this week between Jamal Charlo Demetrius Andreid, but keith I promise no discussion of Andreid Charlo. I have exercise that from my mind, and I am not going to get invested, especially since I texted someone that would know something about who said there's nothing to it, So I'm leaving that alone. One one thing I would say is that I was told that after Demetrius andre parted ways with match Room, al Hayman was among the people that his people spoke to, so there was some sort of opportunity there for him to join PC. I don't know how close they came exactly, but he wound up signing with Demitri Selita um and seems like he wants to fight Chris you bank. But if there was ever an opportunity for the fight that you've wanted to see your whole life, Chris Mannox, Yeah, I think it's gone. Don't tease me with that. Demetrius Andrea talked to PBC stuff, Keith. I'm not prepared for that. I'm not just not that this would He's not gonna get Chris Eubank, by the way, Like, I don't know if Chris Eubank connor Ben comes together. UM. I know they're hopeful they can find a way to make a deal over in the UK. But in the event that Chris Eubank does not face connor Ben. He ain't fighting de Metrius Andreid. That's just not happening, So it would be in Andrew Charlo. It would be a good fight for for Demetrius Andrea at this point based on what his options are, because he would make good money to go over there to fight you bank. But and the other thing before we move on to what we're actually supposed to talk about. Uh, I know you bank connor Ben as a you know, as a huge fight in the UK for obvious reasons. That's a pretty tall order for for connor Ben. There was a welter weight moving up to uh you know, I know they'll fight at a catch weight and everything, but Chris Eubank is much bigger than him. I agree. Um, And this wasn't on my list of things to talk about because it's it's not a fight that's been made yet and they still seem to have some obstacles to overcome. But Eddie Hearn I was reading Boxing Scene this week and Eddie hearn had some comments he made over in the UK about how this is not a cash out fight for connor Ben. Sure feels like it, Keith, because connor Ben at one has yet to face a real puncher up until this point his career. So the next move for him is to go to one fifty six and fight a guy who can punch. I don't. I don't really this same the logic other than that there is gobs of money in it for both these fighters if they get into the ring. Only explanation Chris is that there are gobs of money in it because it's a dangerous fight for him, as you said. The thing. The interesting thing too, as it relates to Connor Ben, is it looked like he had shown some progress, right, like he's getting better. He hasn't fought elite level of welterweights or anything, and it would be tough to get someone to come over there, you know, someone like Keith Thurman has been mentioned, is not going to go over there at Connor events experience and and just go lose to Connor Ben. And I'm not saying Thurman lose to Connor Ben at this point, but he hasn't beaten an elite well to where but he's getting better and and there just must be so much money involved in it that he can't turn it down because it's an odd thing to do honestly, based on what his career trajectory has been so far. Yeah, you know, I've talked about Keith Thurman and Cornter Ben a little bit on previous podcasts. Now Keith Thurman and we'll get into this. Keith Thurman may have options later this year if for some reason the Errol Spence Terns Crawford fight falls apart. But if that was, if I'm Keith Thurman, and if that's not on the table for me, I go to the UK and fight Connor Ben, Because again, Carter Ben, while he's very strong and could punch, has not faced a puncher, and Keith Thurman, at least he used to be a puncher um and has still has some power in those hands. That's a winnable fight for Keith Thurman and one that he would make a lot of money to go over there and fight. So if I'm Keith Thurman, who has been doing some belly aching about not being active enough, if I'm Keith Thurman, unless I'm sure I'm gonna get a Spence or a Crawford, uh, I wouldn't dismiss that Connor Ben fight as quickly as it seems they're dismissing it. I think you're right, Chris, But as you said, he's gonna wait out to see what happens here with these Spence Crawford negotiations and then go from there. Yeah. Yeah, that's and I get it. I get it. That's a bigger fight, domestic fight for for him. Um if that, if those two wind up fighting, it could be two thousand twenty three before we see Keith Thurman back in the ring, which would be disappointing. All right, let's move on to a fight we got this weekend. Danny Garcia, the former junior welterweight champion. The former welterweight champion. He is making his debut at a hundred and fifty four pounds when he takes on Jose Benavidez Junior. Garcia has been off since December of two thousand twenty, when he faced and lost to Arroll Spence Junior. About twenty months have passed since we've seen Dan Garcia in the ring, and now he's back and he's doing it at a new weight class. Danny Garcia says he's doing it to become a three division world champion. Keith, do you like Danny Garcia's chances of becoming a three division world champion Chris. I think we'll have a much better idea of this after Saturday night, because you know, the thing that's been mentioned the most since Danny Garcia's plans to move up to a hundred and fifty four pounds have been made public, are that the obvious that he was the small welterweight he wasn't you know, he won some fights by knockout at welterweight, but he wasn't considered a huge, huge puncher at welterway like he was at junior welterweight. But he was a small welterweight. So moving up to a hundred and fifty four pounds while it's more comfortable for him because as you know, he's thirty four years old now, so he's having more difficulty shrinking himself down to a hundred and forty seven pounds over the last last couple of years than he had had before. But just because you're making the weight more comfortably doesn't necessarily mean it's where you belong. It's where you can fight at this point, but whether it's where he belongs, I think we'll have to wait to see how he does on Saturday night to to really have the answer to that question, Chris, because one thing I would say going into this fight, uh Jose Benavidez Junior, and rightfully so to some extent, as being judged solely on his what you could only describe as a poor performance against Francisco Torres back in November. He did not look good in that fight at all. He didn't look like he was in the best of shape. He had lost somewhere around eighty pounds to get down to the middleweight limit for that fight, and he's not really a middleweight. He considers himself a junior middleweight at this point because he too is now thirty years old and doesn't think that he can really get down to the welter weight limit anymore. And why would he Because he's already lost to Crawford. He's not going to get Carrol Spence or anything like that. So um so he's best suited for one now he's bigger than Danny Garcia. The one thing I would say to Chris, I noticed today a little bit at the press conference, and uh Jose Benavidez Junior is listed at six ft tall. I don't dispute that he is. He probably is somewhere around six ft tall, but Danny Garcia is only five eight and he didn't look that much shorter than Benevy. He's shorter, but he didn't look four inches shorter, and I thought the size difference was going to be much more noticeable than when they stood face to face today. Now, Danny Garcia was tilting his head up a little bit, maybe, which made it somewhat deceptive. But he's maybe not as small as people think going into this fight in comparison to Benavidez. But Benavidez is better at look. The shooting took a lot out of him, right. His leg is never gonna be at at full use for him for the rest of his career. But he's better than he looked against Francisco Torres. That was his first fight in over three years. He hadn't fought since Terence Crawford stopped him in the twelfth round in October two thousand eighteen. And what was it? Not an easy fight for Crawford. He was ahead comfortably on the score cards, but Crawford himself will tell you that Benavitez his size and gave him some trouble in that fight. So I think I'm not saying benevite is going to win on Saturday. But I don't think this is, by any stretch of the imagination easy fight for Danny Garcia. No, I don't think it's an easy fight either, And I think how I think you're right, how Garcia looks in this fight will tell us a lot. Um. It's not just to me anyway, It's not just about Garcia winning. I think he's got to win convincingly, whether that's a knockout or a lop side of decision, to make me believe that Garcia has a chance against someone like Jamal Charlot. That's what we're talking about, right. I mean, you've probably heard the same thing I have out of people around PBC that look, they'd love to make Charlo versus Danny Garcia at some point next year. That's a fight that's makeable in the PBC universe and one that's marketable to boxing fans nationwide. Um, if for some reason Garcia struggles with Benevitez, who's not, despite his size, is not a full fla edge junior middleweight Versus Jarmal Charlo, who is who's been a junior midway for a long time, is the undisputed champion at right now, if he struggles with him. If I'm Danny Garcia, I'd go back down. I'd look for for opportunities there because quite frankly, Keith, there are other opportunities for Danny Garcia at one seven. It's not like the cupboard is bear. I mean, there's still interest in a rematch between Keith Thurman and Danny Garcia, which was a razor thin fight, uh several years ago. Um, we don't know what's gonna happen. As we say at the top of this with Terence Crawford and Errol Spence, It's possible Crawford, who's a free agent, could wind up looking for a different dance partner. Danny Garcia could emerge in that mix as well, you know, the younger guys. I doubt we'll see Danny Garcia against Boutennis or Virgil Orties, but those are options as well. I just think if it looks like the way and the size of one fifty four is too much, Danny should not go into that chart, look, because that could be career rending. You know, if Jamal Charlo beats you up, that could be career rending for you. You know, Chris, I'm not really sure that I want to no matter what happens against Jose benevite Is, unless he blue Benevitez out in some way, which I which I don't foresee happening. But um, I'm not sure that I want to see Danny Garcia fight Jamal Charlo anyway. As you said, it's a uh, it's a marketable fight because they're both well known BBC fighters. Uh, you know, it's a higher profile fight than some of the other title defenses available to Jamal Charloe at a hundred and fifty four pounds, But I don't know. I mean, Charlo just seems too big and too strong for Danny Garcia. I'm not sure that I would want to see that. But a couple of when I interviewed Danny Garcia a couple of weeks ago, Chris, he said a couple of interesting things to me. He did mention the Thurman rematch, which at fifty four would be too welterweights moving up to fifty four, so they'd kind of be on And and I don't think Thurman is all I don't think he's taller than Danny Garcia at all, or you know, it doesn't really have any kind of size advantage, so they would be evenly matched. I would think at fifty four, So I would be fine with that. And that's also a marketable fight. As you said, Danny Garcia barely lost to split decision to Keith Thurman. They were both undefeated welterweight champions at the time, so I think there would be some interest in that type of fight if they can't get the types of fights that they want moving forward. Um, he mentioned to fight against aris Landi Lara, meaning Garcia mentioned to fight against aris Landi Lara. I don't know what the public interest is and that exactly, and of course Lara is fighting at one sixty right now. Um, Charlo also will have to you know, besides all of what I just said, Charlo has so many mandatories that he's going to have to make if he wants to maintain, you know, if he wants to keep the four titles one. It costs a lot of money in his sanctioning fees to at least one of them. His IBF mandatory defense against back ram Mar mart Marta Daliev or whatever his name is. Who Who's who's really good with that? Who's really going to correct us if it's if it's incorrect, right um. At the same time, no one wants to see that he is the mandatory for the ib F. He's twenty and oh with fifteen knockouts. I've seen him fight on several under cards. I'm sure he's a nice person. He has absolutely zero chants in my opinion, to beat Jamal Charlo. Uh. He did win an eliminator, and he has been the mandatory for quite some time. He's taken step aside fees several times too for Jamal Charlo to twice fight Brian castaniol entitle unification fights, and it looks like that will happen again here when he makes his mandated defense of the w b O title against Tim Zoo. So Merchan DaLie has waited a long time for the opportunity, so maybe he will get it, or Charlo will just say, look, you know, I'm going to be a you know, forty to one favorite against this guy. I'm just gonna give up the IBF belt because I don't think Jamal Charlo, having become the undisputed one and fifty four pound champion, I don't think he's looked at as a devalued product if he doesn't technically own all four titles yet stays in that division because he can fight Zoo, and he can fight Sebastian Fundor and there would be interest in that fight. So those are the types of fights I see maybe coming together for Charlo next So I don't know that Danny Garcia, even if he wins on Saturday, would be in position to fight Charlo any sooner than I don't know the end of next year. Um. But your point is well taken, Chris, because I'm not I'm not sold on him as a hundred and fifty four pounder. A lot of big guys from Charlo to Fondura, Tim Zoo. I mean, this is a big weight class. UM. For Danny Garcia to be stepping at a Keith Thurman rematch, uh makes a lot of sense, whatever weight class, UH it may be. And I agree with you on Charlo, like, once you become the undisputed champion, there's the feather in your cap. It makes no sense to fight on interesting fights just to defend your titles, and while you're doing it, fork over an ungodly amount of money to these sanctioning bodies. UH. The right to defend their titles. If I'm Jamal Charlo, I just pick one, like whatever belt he likes the most, whatever sanctioning body he respects the most. Maybe it's the WBC because he and his brother can have titles um with that sanctioning body. Maybe decides that, and then everybody else go do your thing, every nose. I'm still the top dog at There's no reason for me to have belts to reinforce that. All right, I want to talk about a fight that's sure not to happen and sure to disappoint us. That would be Tank Davis and Ryan Garcia. We are a couple of weeks removed Keith from Ryan Garcia's knockout win over Javier for Tune. A tremendous performance by Ryan Garcia dominated for Tuna from start to finish. Four Tuna had been beaten in previous fights before, he had never been beaten up quite like Ryan Garcia did to him in mid July, and afterwards, the attention, unsurprisingly all focused on Tank David's been some public back and forth. Floyd Mayweather came out and said we'll do the fight at d and thirty five pounds. Ryan Garcia responded Okay, I'll go back to hund thirty five pounds and take that fight. Oscar de la Hoya is suddenly out there throwing flowers at Floyd Mayweather. He is talking about what a pioneer Floyd Mayweather is. I don't know what that was all about, but he's doing it. Um. There seems to be some rhetoric that is, you know, creating a sliver of optimism that a fight between Ryan Garcia and Tank Davis can get done. Um, what is your level of optimism that we could see Ryan Garcia versus Tank Davis this year? It's low, Chris. I would like to be more optimistic, to be honest with you. But I do think that, uh, I don't doubt at all that Ryan Garcia genuinely wants to fight, although I was a little surprised at his demand for it to be at one forty, however temporary that might have been. I was a little surprised by that, But I do think Keith, you know what that was? Keith like to me, that was a pretty smart move by Ryan because he was able to give something up. I think he always knew he was never gonna fight Tank at one forty and to say it. Then he knew somebody in PBC or in this case Mayweather would say no, no, no, we'll do this fight at one thirty five. So we could turn around and say, all right, I'll do what you want. I'll fight it at one five. I don't think he ever really believed that Tag would come up to one to face him. I thought I thought that was a pretty strategic move by him after the fight to declare he's a hundred forty pounder forever. Maybe you're right, but I don't see the point of doing that, because you know they were going to say that, So what is it just kind of wasted a couple of days. But well, whatever the case might be. I mean, he he's willing to shrink himself down to one thirty five or whatever he has to do to get to one. And he is a big kid. I mean he's five ten or whatever. He's a pretty tall kid. On the flip side, as it relates to that Chris, they could have and this is sort of what they were staying. I guess, Well, he fought at a hundred and forty pounds once already. It's not like you're asking him to make his one and forty pound debut. But they do know that Davis is much more comfortable fighting at one thirty five. I'm not gonna say he cherry picked Mario Barrios because I think so disrespectful to barrier say. I understand he's not an A level fighter, but he's a B level fighter, and he was much bigger than Tank, and he gave him, you know, a competitive fight for six or seven rounds before Davis knocked them down twice in the eighth and then stopped them in the eleventh. Um But they know, always a one thirty five pound or so, let's forget he's already agreed to fight a hundred thirty five pounds. That's not the issue. The issue is, and understandably so from both sides showtime to my understanding, and I know you've spoken to Steven Espinos about this as well. They're they're not going to do a joint pay per view with his own I don't think. I don't see that happening. I mean, there have been some discussions internally about them, you know, if they're if it's worth a second fight, the zone gets the second fight, you know, figuring something out along those lines. But while Showtime has been invested in Javante Davis significantly longer than The Zone has been invested in Ryan Garcia. The Zone haw has invested millions of dollars in Ryan Garcia's career. So they're not outgoing to say, well, okay, you guys take the fight and we'll just sit on the sidelines and wait it out. Now, from Showtime's perspective, hey, you guys said we're going out, We're going out of boxing. You're gonna drive us out of boxing. And you were never going to do pay per view fights and now only in the res you know, last few months, you want to do joint pay per view events and pay per view events when you had been screaming death to pay per view for four years, et cetera. UM. I understand that is going to infuriate boxing fans because they could not care less about the corporate politics, UM and all the other things that go into the egos and all the things that go into making these fights. Right. They don't care about any of that. They say, Hey, look, I paid my hundred bucks for my designs Square whatever it is, a hundred twenty bucks from my zogn subscription for the year. I pay my X amount for showtime depending on how you get it bundled and everything. For every month, I'll pay. I'll pay the money. I'll pay the your money. I really want to see Ryan Garcia and Tank Davis. Uh, two of the most you know, polarizing and popular guys in the entire sport. It's one of the biggest. Look, it's not I don't even care if it's a title It's not a real title fight anyway you look at it, because Javante Davis has a secondary five pound championship. Ryan garcias are he said, who cares about the belts and to some degree, especially in this case, he's a thousand percent correct. Just put them in the ring. Fans want to see the fight. They're excited about this. They're salibrating about this. Gavante DAVIDSS fans Ryan Garcia will get not cold by Jivante Davis. Ryan Garcia's fans from nine year old girls and up. He's gonna knock Davante Davis out right. I mean, this is this is a fight that has really captivated not only the imaginations of boxing fans, the interest in boxing fans, but people outside of our normal realm of boxing, The fight should happen, right if people want to see if there's a lot of money involved, what if Floyd may whether they say when he went on fight hype last week, he's like, he goes, We're not damn fools. A lot of money involved this and we're gonna work our best to do it now. Whether that actually happens or not. I'm not blaming this on Floyd Mayweather. I'm just saying I don't think that the fight is going to happen next. Hopefully it happens eventually, but I think this issue with showtime and the zone um and the competing promoters and etcetera. I think this is going to prevent the fight from happening next, and again that is going to be very disappointing and very aggravating for the people who follow this sport on a daily basis. Yeah, I'm less concerned about the promoters because look, you know, Golden Boy, they believe Ryan Garcia can win. Al Hayman, from what I've been told by people that know him, believes that Tank Davis can win and will win, and that's why it's a fight that he'd be willing to do across promotion with to get this fight over the line. I completely agree with you on the network stuff. To me, this comes down too. Will show Time get on board with this? And I I completely understand where Steven Espinoza and Showtime are coming from. The Zone came into the game in two thousand eighteen trying to put everyone out of business, trying to kill pay per view, trying to sign away all these PBC and by extension, Showtime fighters, you know, basically not looking to play nice but use their checkbook to take over boxing. It didn't work, and you know, nobody can really ever take over boxing. Al Hayman's tried at one point. That didn't work. Does own Eddie hern match Room tried that didn't work. Um, So I get the frustration that Showtime has and the bitterness that Showtime justifiably has towards the Zone and and their business model. That being said, there's so much money in it. Like I heard Eddie Hearn, who has nothing to do with this fight say recently that he thought Garcia Tank could be a fight that generates north of six hundred thousand pay per view buys. I can see that, like I really can. The two fan bases a lot of buzz for that fight. If it's made like in December, I can see that the live gate. No, we saw Gavante just do one north of four million dollars at Barclay Center. Ryan Garcia had ten thousand plus paying fans um in l A. They do a huge number, maybe north of ten million for that live gate. Maybe there's a sight fee in Vegas that puts up more money in everybody's pockets. There's just so much money in this. And this is what I've asked Steven Espinoza on this podcast and elsewhere, like what is the threshold to make you kind of all right, you know what, fuck it, we'll do it. We'll get involved, Like what is the number? Because even if it is a co promotion, co broadcast, Showtime might make more money off that then they would a regular Javante Davis fight. Because as I look around, Keith, I don't know about you, but I don't know where Davante turns if he wants to fight before the end of the year. Ryan Garcia, you know Jojoe Diaz is out there. It's a It's a decent in house fight you can make if you're golden boy. I can see that fight being put together. I don't love it, but I can see it. Um. I don't know what Vante's options are. I know they play things close to the vest with PBC. Maybe he'll stun us all and move up to welterweight to fight Keith Thurman. I don't know, But like between one thirty and one forty, there aren't great options for Javonte Davis, certainly not ones that are marketable, that drive pay per views, that generate the kind of interest, even a fraction of the interest that a fight with Ryan Garcia would. So those are the two things that I think, you know, I have to be resolved. Showtimes understandable bitterness towards the zone and its business model, and PBC looking around going they're kind of out of guys here, like can we bring Gary Russell up and have him fight? Well, that's another small guy that Javante would be fighting, and he's coming off a loss. Is there somebody else? I don't know who the guy is for Jervonte to fight next. That's a great question, Chris, because they've been patient, maybe to an aggravating degree as it relates to matching Javonte Davis sometimes, but look when when Rolando Romero fell out, they replaced him with Esa Cruz, who was fighting on the You know, we went through all that last year. He was on the undercar and everything he saw, Cruise gave him the toughest fight of his career, right, So, so maybe he falls into an opponent who gives him a tougher fight than they were expecting. But I don't you You're make a good point, and that there's no obvious person for him to be because of course George Cambosis and Devin Haney, which also would require them to work with another promoter and another network and all that the winner of that fight won't be available when Javonte Davis is going to fight towards the end of the year if he wanted to try to become the fully unified lightweight champion, the schedules don't align for that to happen. So there's nothing really obvious for him and his next fight beside Ryan Garcia. And and as it relates to what you said about the showtime to Zone thing, Chris, it's like, you know, it's it's not personal. It is personal to some extent, but it's not personal. It's business because it's because this is all strategic business. I mean Zone the Zone as a competitor for showtime, they don't want to do a joint pay per view with them necessarily to in effect teach them how to how to do pay per views because they don't have a lot of experience. They've only done one right, so they don't have a lot of experience in it, and it takes some trial and error to get it right and everything. So there are a lot of strategic reasons for them not to want to do it, besides the you know, the ego part of it, or the personal feelings that they may have toward each other, because you know, there were a lot of things said and everything, and and you know, sometimes it's not easy to just um dismiss that. Okay, well last year you said you were putting us out of business and and pay per view death to pay per view, and everyone else is doing it wrong and we know how to do it better than everybody else. And no, well, now let's work together. I mean, let's forget all that. So there's that is that is a real thing and a real issue for them to work through. But it's also a strategic thing from a business standpoint, because you if you're trying to keep a leg up on the competition, you don't want to help them in any way either. Now, again, boxing fans don't want to hear that. That's not that's not why they tune in every Saturday or every other Saturday night or whenever the fights are on. That's not why why they do it. They want to see the best fights possible. Uh, no matter which network it's on, which promoters are involved, they don't care about any of that. But unfortunately that is the boxing business. And and look, hardcore boxing fans to some extent or used to all of this, and this is not news to them, um, but there is a point where like people just get tired of it. And that's why the boxing audience. Uh, it's not just network issues that it's a lot of other things, having too many champions and having boxing not beyond free television and readily as readily available as at once. So there's a million reasons why boxing is now forever a niche sport. But you can't keep having that audience dwindle for whatever the reasons might be, because you know, eventually there's just not gonna be enough boxing fans to make the fight to make the sport sustainable at the level uh where networks are investing money to the degree that they are now. You know, it's funny I've been following this live Golf tour and how you know, golfers are saying they're joining live to grow the game Live golf and what's happening with golf eerily reminiscent of boxing. You know, when you have a new player on the game with lots of money, it waters down each side of it. Like, just from a pure golf perspective, it ain't growing the game, that's for sure. And and also you have the political element to that which makes it very different too. I mean, you know it's a but like just from a sport, just from a sports perspective, like, it's not growing the game. It's fragmented, it's any It's about money, right, It's about most other like everything else in life, crisis, right, what it all boils down to ultimately, Although people might not come out and say it is money, I mean the live Golf tournament is a perfect ample that's guys are being paid enormous sums of money. They don't care about the morality of it or anything like that. Yeah, they're ever you're gonna pay me two hundred million or whatever? I mean, yeah, great, you know they'll do whatever money as it always does often talks. So um, I want to talk about kind of a little tug of war going on over at the Zone right now involving Dmitri Beevil. Uh. Be Evil is the w b A light heavyweight champion. He is not going to fight Canelo Alvarez in a rematch this year because Canello is gonna fight Gnadi Glofkin in September. Because of that, be Evil has to find or wants to find an opponent before the end of the year. Golden Boy has zero Ramirez, who is the mandatory challenger for Beavil's w b A light heavyweight title. The w b A has come out and ordered negotiations between Golden Boy or Beavil's team and Zurdo's team for that fight to happen. On the other side of the pond, you've got match Trum, which works closely with be Evil, which would like to pair be Evil a answer Joshua Boozzi before the end of the year. Blots also arising contender at one seventy five high in the rankings. The w b A, though not the mandatory challenger. The way zerdo is, this is quite kind of an an interesting inside baseball game going on right now. Keith, what do you make of the tug of war for Dmitri Bevil? You know, I can see it from both sides, right, I mean, obviously, if you're Gilberto Ramirez and Golden Boy Promotions, well he's the mandatory challenger, so he should fight Dmitri Bival next, no questions asked. Uh, I would say that Gilberto Ramirez has not exactly thought of who's who of light heavyweights to ascend to the mandatory position, so I could see that argument as well. But he is the mandatory challenger, and he's a former Keith, Keith, whoever, whoever put Dominic Bozel at number one, Well that's what I'm saying watch boxing. My bigger problem is like, who are you who put him at number one? Because you can say that about the rankings in almost every division, right, Chris, that was pretty bad particular, I mean that has some baffling, uh rankings, but um, you know, any he I thought he struggled a little bit with Yournski Gonzalez in his previous fight, but he is the mandatory challenger. That's indisputable. He's undefeated, so he has the legitimate argument to to fight Biblo next. Right. From a business perspective, if bomb bival while, I think I'll probably make more money for fighting Joshua Blazzi at O two Arena in London, but you know, because boxing is so popular there, I understand ramire Is is a is a bit of a draw. Um. He's not an enormous star by any stretch of the imagination, and boxing obviously is much more popular in the UK than it is in the U S. So biv All probably, if if I had to guess, would make more money for fighting uh Bolotsi in the UK than he would make for fighting Ramirez in the US. And if you're him, he's maybe not going to decide this entirely. But if you're him, and you're not really getting to capitalize on the biggest win of your career. Because Canelo moved forward with a glove fight, UM, I would want to fight Batsy. I'm not saying it's an easier fight or a harder fight or whatever, but from a business perspective, it might make more sense for him to do that. But Berta Ramires is the mandatory challenger and wants his title shot, so it's gonna be interesting to see how it shakes out. But I would think bive All would want to fight. Honestly, bats has not fought a high level of opposition either. I understand he beat Craig Richards in his last fight. Craig Richards obviously gave bive All a difficult fight, more difficult fight than people were expecting. But you know, he hasn't fought an an elite list of light heavyweights either. But one of them is going to get the shot, right. So, if if it were up to me and I was an arbitrary I would say that GILBERTA Revere I should fight him next because he's the mandatory challenge or get the mandatory defense out of the way. Um. But Eddie Hearn seems to have more poll within the Zone than Golden Boy does, or doesn't seem to he does, so we'll see which way he does. Zone wants to go with it as well. Yeah, I also think and I'm curious to see how much teeth the w b A has here, Like how firmly do they hold this position that be Evil fights zerdo or presumed Bleed have to vacate the title. Um, you know, I know Eddie Hearn and Matt Room have or are going to apply for an exemption for be Evil to fight. Yeah, I've asked a few people. I don't know how that's gonna work. Like I think now the fight has been ordered, I don't know that applying for the exemption is going to work at this stage of the process. Will the w b A, which operates the beat of its own drummers sometimes, will they enforce the mandatory because then Bevil has to do it right. Like I mean, I guess he could vacate his title and go and fight Joshua Batzi and maybe beat Boatsi, collect a check and then be still undefeated when he faces Canello, and he could maybe think that Canello only wants to fight him for revenge, although I think Cannello also wants that one pound belt as well. You can also argue that Boatzi maybe wouldn't want to fight Bevil if he doesn't have a title. Bats He has wanted that title shot for for a long time. I think the w b A controls all this because the w b A says, look cut a deal or we're going to purse bid. To me, that's the ball game. The other variable in this Keith, and you mentioned what does the zone want? Like, Look, I think that be Evil. I think people will be a favorite against either Zero or Boats. I think Zero is a tougher fight, maybe because it's so big, like he was hydrates like over two hundred pounds when he gets in the ring with guys Um, So that's a tough fight. But I would favor be Evil and that fight as well, And at least in the US there'd be more eyeballs on it. Then there would be a Bowatsi fight. And if you're building towards a Canela rematch, don't you want as many eyeballs on Bevo as possible. Like not to say that bevil Zerdo is a guaranteed classic and people are gonna be talking about it, but there will be some pre fight buzz to Beavl versus Zerdo. It will probably happen in l A or Anaheim or one of these areas that Zero sells some tickets. He did a pretty decent crowd against Dominic Bows. I was surprised how many people were there for that fight. So he'd probably do a very good crowd for a Bevil fight in that region of the country. Don't you want as many North American American eyeballs on Bevo as possible? Because if Bible goes out, performs incredibly well against Zero, beats him, maybe knocks him out, whatever, that's only going to increase the interest in a third in a rematch with Canelo next year, Whereas if you fight Batzi, some people will watch in the U S. Lots Bell watching the UK, but some people watch the u S. But it's not as marketable in the US as a fight against Zero would be. Honestly, I think when you talking business, it makes better business sense to do be Evil against Zero that it does Bevil against Buatzi. You know, I could see it on the flip side as well, Chris and that they're trying his zone is trying to grow its business in the UK, and obviously that's a bigger fight in the UK than UH, than Zero and UH and Bival as it relates to Canelo fighting Bival next assuming he beats triple g Uh in September. I don't know that it I don't know that it matters in my opinion. I I don't know that it matters all that much which one he fights, as long as he just wins the fight, you know, because I think people are going to be just as interested in him fighting Cannelo. Whether he were to beat Bival in between, I mean, whether he would beat Bats in between, or whether he would beat Erdo in between. I don't know. I don't know that it matters all that. I think they're kind of comparable in the level of challenge that they would present. For Bival, maybe maybe he's Zerdo is a little tough for fight because as you said, he's bigger and he so south call and everything. But um so maybe it's a little tougher fight. But but again, from a business standpoint, as I mentioned earlier, um it does. I think it does pretty big business in the UK. And uh, they are trying to grow the Zone brand out there. But um counting on the w b A to do the right thing. I mean, what are we talking about, right? I mean, you know, it's like, as long as wherever the w b A can get the largest sanctioning fee and walk walk away from it with the most money, I think is what they would do. Um, but how do you declare someone the mandatory and then say that it doesn't need to be enforced. Now, they do a lot of crazy things that don't make any sense to normal people, so that I I guess it's possible that they won't do that, but it's what they should do. Just get Zero's title shot, and I think Biball beats him and then hopefully we see the Canelo rematch. I guess. I mean, because assuming Canelo beats Triple G in the third fight, where else does Canello go? Besides that, if biballs undefeated, so as reb a title one thing, I don't think he would do Chris, as you mentioned earlier. I don't think under any circumstances Dmitri Biball gives up his title because that's all of his leverage really, and like you said, Canela will want to avenge his loss, but it would also mean more to him if he still has the w b A light heavyweight title. And then let's say he beats either Zerdo or Boats and then goes and beats Canelo again, Well, he would need his w b A title to get the fight that he ultimately wants. Although it is worth less money than the Canelo rematch, he wants to become the fully unified seventy pound championship and without the belt, obviously he can't do that. And now he wants to go fight uh you know a better BF to do that that ultimately he would need the belt. So I don't see him giving up the title because it's it's just it's just giving away too much leverage for him. So it all comes down w A and will they follow their rules or will they come up with a whacka do excuse not to? Well? Gary Shaw, New Jersey's own Nary Shaws on the case, so I'm gonna come on liating it up out there with the w b A. All right, last thing for you, we are nearing the end of July, and while we seem to have a penciled end date for Terence Crawford against Errol Spence, we've read reports that they're closing in on a deal. You've talked to people that have probably said they're getting there. I've talked to people that have said they're getting there. But here we are headed into August and still no deal between Spence and Crawford. I'm not at the red alert stage Keith on this fight not happening. But if we get through August, that might raise raise the alert level significantly. What what do you make of where we are with Spence and Crawford. Honestly, I think we still have about a month or so a wiggle room to the point where you would get concerned about it, right, because we're not in a world anymore where they're doing five city press tours and all that kind of stuff. So, look, if the deal comes together finally after months and months of negotiations, they'll announce the fight and they'll maybe do one press conference somewhere or wherever that might be. They don't need to go to New York, l A wherever the fight is. That that those days are over, so let's forget about all that, right, But they do need eight nine weeks a piece to train. So if the fight is going to be in November, as we suspect, there are a couple of dates in November that are being thrown around. Um, you know, they would need to go into training camp in the beginning to to the middle of September. We're still a ways away from that yet. So the issues that they're still ironing out, and um, look there's a lot of money at stake here. There's a lot of egos at play here, and Terence Crawford wants as to squeeze as much as he can out of this and he's going into it with not the most leverage that you could have because look, Spence, as we know, Uh, he wants to fight Terence Crawford. Terence Crawford wants to fight Spence. But guys that clearly want to fight, no problem, but they want to be paid at a certain level. Um. And and Crawford is I'm not saying he's in a position of weakness, but PBC is going to to favor to make this fight. They're going to favor Errol Spence, right because Errol Spence has been a PBC fighter and Al Hayman buy his entire career, and Terence Crawford was fighting across the street or whatever you know, wherever we've termed it over the last few years. Um. And he's not a PBC guy. So there, you know, there are some concessions that he's gonna probably have to make. I guess as long as he gets the type of money he's looking for, maybe he will overlook those things. Um. But he's not a PBC guy, right, But he wants to make the fight. And the reason I say he's not really operating from a position of strength is because what is he going to do. He's going to be thirty five years old in September. He really wants this fight. Now he's finally in a position where he's not under contract the top rank. He can go make this fight if he wants to make it. And what is he going to do if he doesn't fight Errol Spence next right, because um, he doesn't have a promotional contract? Uh? Well, he could he fight Virgil Ortiz, sure, but why would he do that? He will make a lot lets There is some risk, but I think Terence Crawford beats Virgil Ortis, even though he's a young, powerful puncher. I think Terence Crawford, at this point, still on the verge of being thirty five years old, still beats Virgil Ortiz. But there's not a ton of money in that fight. It's certainly not as much money as there isn't an Errol Spence Junior fight, So you know it is there is some risk involved, some significant risk. There's not nearly as much reward. And then what else is he going to do besides fight Errol Spence if he doesn't fight Virgil Ortiz, Right, Oh, he could move up to a hundred and fifty four pounds. Well, they fully unified hundred and fifty four pound champion who has all four titles fights for PBC. So that's not you know, that's not an option either. You're in the same position without really having the fight that you actually wanted. So he's in a position, you know, again, not a position of weakness, but not in the strongest position either. So if he's gonna have to make some concessions I think to make the fight. Um, so supposedly he's willing to do that. And look, Chris, this fight is such a high level fight that it's being played close to the vest. Yes, some information is trickling out, but playing pretty much everything close to the vest. They're not leaking out details that This is not a public negotiation by any stretch. Um, what I keep being told, I'm making some progress, you know, some this and that, you know, vague answers. For for the most part, I'm getting vague answers right because they don't you know, and that's generally how the biggest of deals get done. Right. They're not out there talking about everything. You might get some information here and there, but um, not specifics right. So, Um, they're at a point where they still have some time to make the fight. I think both guys want to you know, interestingly, Chris, I've in San Antonio a few weeks ago, Errol Spence promotes for Frank Martin. Frank Martin fought in the showtime opener that day, uh or that night, and I talked Arrow after the fight and he said, look, you know, I don't really want to take the spotlight off of Frank Martin here to promote him. Um, so I don't want to talk about it really on the recorest well, you know, fight, you know, like joking with him, I says, the fight happening or not? He goes, he goes, the fights happening, He goes, you know, the dates and flux a little bit. We'll see which date it actually is, but the but I'm confident the fight's gonna happen. That's exactly that. That was three weeks ago and we're still no closer probably to the fight being done. Um, but that's what he said. That's what Errol Spen said. I haven't spoken to Crawford about it. But uh, from from what I've been led to believe, he's eager to make the fight as well. So we'll just have to keep our fingers across. And I just wanted to mention something, Chris before I forget about it. Um Spence Crawford is a big fight, right, and it's the meaningful fight because it's too undefeated welterweight champions. It's for the full unification and the welterweight division guys who you know this is. It's not the pacil Mayweather level because one because they're not as big as stars, and two because it hasn't been going on quite as long but has been going on for a few years. People really want to see this fight, right. I mean, it's you could argue it's the second biggest fight that can be made in boxing behind josh if Joshua were to win, if Joshua fought Fury or something like that. But I do think, in relation to what you said earlier, I think that the Gravante Davis Ryan Garcia, even in the age of piracy, um and with young people being very savvy about stealing signals and such, I still think that Jervante Davis Ryan Garcia probably does more pay per view buys on Arrow Spence and Terence Crawford. It's crazy, but I think you're right, not a huge amount more, but I think they do a little bit more. I agree with you. Yeah, it's let me tell you. One of the thing about that. I my antenna went up when I saw this WBC rank Keith Thurman as the number one guy at putting aside the absurdity of that. You don't say, you don't say the absurdity. Keith Thurman has fought one time in three years, one time, and that was one win over Mario Barers. He's ranked ahead of Virgil Ortiz, Boots Tennis, even Connor Ben, David Evans and guys like that. Now, why would the WBC do that? Put my Brian win tors hat on. Why would they do that? Why would they rank him at number one? The only thing that that, the only answer I had to that Keith was perhaps it put Thurman into position where he becomes the mandatory for Spence and they order that fight to happen because Thurman Spence. You can sell that as a pay per view. They've had a lot of back and forth. Thurman wouldn't give Spence an opportunity years ago. Spencdn't want to give it Therman opportunity after the Paquia fight. There's bad blood there. I thought that was interesting. I don't know if that piqued your antenna at all, but I thought that was really interesting. The WBC ranked number one. Unlike Wendy's conspiracy theory from a few weeks ago, because I'm not really sure what he was saying, I think you're exactly right. I think that is why he's the mandatory now for Errol Spence. That's a fight that they could make. People will be very disappointed if if we wind up seeing Errol Spence Junior against Keith Thermon, a fight that people wanted to see four or five years ago, maybe three years ago, um before he lost a packet. For sure, people will be very disappointed if that's the fight. But it is a marketable fight, and it is a pay per view fight, right, I mean, it's not a Crawford Spence level pay per view fight, but it is a pay per view fight. And it is not a coincidence that Keith Thurman is now the mandatory challenger for one of Errol Spence Junior's titles. When they're having some um back and forth in the negotiations, I would say, is the best way to phrase it. Right, So now they have a backup plan. And honestly, I think he would have fought Thurman anyway, even if he wasn't, you know, I think that's the backup plan. Even if he warrant the mandatory challenger. I think he was going to fight. That's who we would fight. But um, I imagine after all of this, after your you know, you're trudging along here and you think we're finally getting to Spence Crawford. It's like Lucy with the football, right, I mean, now we're gonna get Spence Thurman. If that, I hope that doesn't happen. And if the fight doesn't happen in November or whenever it might wind up happening, I think we just have to give up hope of it happening because because there's no there's literally no reason why the fight can't happen. Now, they each might have to make concessions financially to make it happen, because what they think the fight is worth in terms of guarantees is probably not reality. Right. Uh, they they're gonna have to bet on themselves a little bit, maybe more so than they want to write on the pay per view buys and all that, which kind of sucks to be honest with you, in the age of piracy, because Chris, I know you and I have discussed it before, but you know it's a real problem, you know, and you know people, I don't want to play the morality police here necessarily, but you are stealing money from the fighters and their families every time to steal a pay per view. Now, people who do it will say, we'll screw them, I'm not paying seventy five bucks. Well, you know, I don't know if that's the way to look at it either, but that is the way some people look at it. But um, but but so I see them wanting to get as high a guarantee as they possibly can. Because if you're leaving hundreds of thousands of pay per view buys on the table because people are stealing it and the industry itself has not figured out a way to prevent that from happening, well, you try to get the most money you can, both guys, as opposed to saying, well, bet on yourself and uh and and take more of an upside percentage to try to get what you want. It's piracy is a massive problem when it comes to pay per view. I mean I I talked to people around Jake Paul all the time, people to put on Jake Paul fights. The thing I hear often is that his live gates are real, like Cleveland, Tampa, probably New York. He sells tickets in these places. The pay per view numbers are not great, and that's largely due to the fact that Jake Paul's fans are among the most Internet sophisticated out there, like they're gonna find a way to steal a signal. They are YouTube fans. So this it's it's a it's a problem, and I don't know what the solution is. My last point, to just jump up and down on a sanctioning body again is like MAURICEO. Suleiman w BC. This is why people don't respect you, because there you have no business putting Keith Thurman as your number one contender. I know he was the WBC champion years and years ago, but since then he has been inactive. Meanwhile, all the guys underneath you have been fighting good, tough fights. Virgil lortis number one contender the w b O fighting good progressively tougher fights. Connor Ben not shouldn't be at the top yet, but he's fighting. Guys are fighting, they're fighting, and Keith Thurman's out there not fighting and talking about how he's not sure when he's gonna get a fight at this point. This is why Mauriceo and the WBC and all you sanctioning bodies that hate the criticism and here the noise and are so upset by it. This is why Keith Thurman doesn't belong as number one contender, simple as that good fighter belongs in a big fight, does not belong as number one contender. Biggest thing, Chris is and and all your arguments are obviously beyond valid as relates to the Therman being a number one contender in the WBC if they would have done it in their rankings right after he beat Mario Barrios. Okay, you might not have agreed with it, but it is what it is. He just beat Barrios, who's a former secondary champion had only lost to Jervonte Davis. Okay, fine, right, but why four months later? What has he done in the four months since that happened? There are five months since that happened that would necessitate you moving him into the number one spot other than what we already discussed. Unbelievable, but we could spend podcast after podcast talking about the UH issues with sanctity bodies. Keith good to talk to him, and I will not be I know you're getting used. I know you're getting used to see me next to your ringside at some of these fights. I've been I've been active in coming to some of these non zone fights. I's an active reporter. It was it was almost for a couple of months. It was almost like Chris Mannix cover boxing. I don't know what happened, but you know, that's the way it seemed for a couple of month. But we might not even be on a perch on you know, because I don't know how many thousand dollar ring side tickets are selling for this fight. Actually would have been better, would have better be right back in the cozy confines of Keith. Enjoy the weekend, man. We'll catch up soon. Thanks Chris. That's good, buddy. Take care when we come back. My conversation with Danny Garcia. Fight fans come out swinging with a no sweat first bet on fan duel sports Book right now. New customers get up to one thousand dollars in free bets if your first bet doesn't win, Just sign up with the promo code boxing bet on who will win, knockouts, when the fight will end, and so much more so. If you haven't tried Fan Duel, now is the perfect time to give it a shot. Just joined now with the promo Code Boxing to get a no sweat first bet that's after one dollars back in free bets if your first bet doesn't win. Exclusively on the Fan Duel sports Book app. Danny Garcia is a two division world champion. On Saturday, he will look to begin his campaign towards a third division title. He takes on Jose Benevidez Jr. That's a fight you can see live on Showtime and Danny joins me here on the show. Danny, this will be your first fight since December of two thousand twenties. So I guess my first question is where you been? Man? What have you been doing? Uh? Just let my body recover and then my body recover. Uh. You know, was a crazy year for everyone. So and I fought two times. I think I'm the only top elite money fighters that fought two times, you know, before the pandemic and during the pandemic. So I felt like I put a lot of harror work in mentally and in rain, and I felt like after the spence Fire, I didn't needed a break. I just needed a break. And it doesn't even it doesn't even feel like it was that long ago to be. I don't know why, because I had so much fun like in between, time went by fast, and it's crazy a couple of days away, I'm fighting again. So you know, I think it all worked out good for me. Yeah, I mean, was it just the year of or was it just that? I mean, you've been in boxing for a long time now. You fought some big fights at one forty, you fought some big fights at seven. Did you just need a break from all that? Definitely, it was definitely a build up, Like it was just like a build up over the years years, you know, constant pressure, um, mental, physical, just fighting the best, wanting to be the best, and ups and downs. Everything about boxing is just it just I just felt like I just needed a break, you know, I just I knew that I needed a break, and it was is no better time to take a break after that, after that fight and all those fights. Actually, like you said, so after spending so much time in training camps as a boxer. I know you're a businessman. I've been down to that Philadelphia area where you have a lot of your businesses. What what what did you do with your time? Like how much? What kind of things did you go get into? So I did a lot of good things all my time. I bought real estate. I bought some real estate in Miami. Um. I helped my sisters with their career, their music career. You know. I hopped a lot of my friends and my family. UM, give a lot of young kids in a boxing gym advice. UM, I've done a lot, you know, be a dad that that that's seven job. So yeah, just trying to keep myself busy and just tapping into everything. But at the same time, still remember that I'm a fighter, jogging here and there, you know, working out, going going to the gym, still and missing the smell of the gym. So when did you get that itch to come back? I would say top of the year, top of the year. In January, I just started to feel like, um, I don't want to waste the last years I have left in my career, so I didn't want to just sit down and waste two or three years of my career. And by the time I come back, I'm thirty six, thirty seven years old, and I wasted three good years of my career where I felt like I could have made a good statement. And um, I've been feeling good. I've been feeling great, And honestly, it doesn't even feel like I like I left when I When I when I first started sparting, I was a little bit whold, like, Okay, this this feels different. But after a while, when I just it just kicked back in and it just felt like I never left. So you are coming back, and you're coming back at a hundred and fifty four pounds. Take me through the decision to move up to junior middleweight. Yeah, definitely. Everything was strategic. Uh. Like I said before, I want to tie it at one forty. I want to tie at one forty of it. And I knew once I took that, once I took that break, I was gonna let my body get bigger and I was gonna kind of refresh mentionally and physically, and I knew I was going to come back at once before. That's another reason why I took the break, because I wanted my body to just to give bigger game more weight, so that way I could build more muscle. You know, you're run at one seven by my coup. There were nine fights as a full fledged welterweight. You went six and three. You want a title. Two of your three losses were razor close decisions to keep Thurman and Sean Porter. When you look back at your run at welterweight, how do you view that experience? It was definitely a great, great experience. Um I fought a lot of tough guys in that in that division, and that's very talented division where everybody styles a different So um I would have I would I would have wished like they gave me one of those decisions because I felt like no out of the Dermini quarter fight. I know it was a close fight, and I just felt like I should have got the of the decisions and I would have been a lot more happier about my runner. I won seven, but at the same time, I did fight the best fighters, and I thought I gave the fans the great fight, and you know, we learned from my mistakes and but I would say it was just, um, it was a greater learning experience. And I really don't regret nothing because you know the Rings, the Leonardsto they all lost, you know, the Todd welter weights, and they came back and finished their career stronger. One four Like, I'm like, I'm trying to do. I mean, you're you're preaching the choir here, Danny with losses, I mean anything, if you fight the best, that's gonna happen. Sometimes you come out of the wrong end of decision. But you mentioned them and the Porter losses, which one bothers you the most. I'm not gonna lie the third one her bad because it was my first loss and I was at the Barklays Center. I felt like, you know, this fight is close. They gotta give it to me. This is my home. So but I kind of let that one slip away for whatever reason. But I feel like Porter fight hurt me more because I know I had I know I had better skills than him. I know I'm a better boxing than him. He just awkward. I just knew everything, I did everything better than him, and I knew he was gonna throw more. But I thought that judges were gonna just count clean effective shots. I didn't know what he was just gonna count punches because that's not how you score a fight. So I would say that the Porter one hurt me more because it was my second loss, and I just it just and I knew I was better than him, and I just yeah, that one hurt. That one hurt bad. But what can I do? You were a big punch hurt at a hundred and forty pounds, not quite as big at least when it came to knockout percentage at seven. Now you're at one. How do you think your power is going to be utilized? Will hold up? That's a good question. Um, you know I felt um, I felt strong at seven too. I felt really strong. You know. I had some good knockouts and that you know, knocked out Granados and knocked out Rios and not out a few other guys. So I had my moments with the power with that, especially with the one place knockout power on pretty steven. You know, it was a little hard to knock out top guys. You know, they come ready, just like you. I wish I would have got a knock out one rules just like I knocked out a mirror con but didn't happen. But at one before, I feel good. I feel um. I feel my strength in a different way. I really can't explain it. Like I'm hitting guys and I'm hurting them, but I'm also like absorbing punches better, like physically stronger. And that's one thing I felt like, um my last like when I started to our rounds that like a couple uh a few days ago, when I got out the ring, I checked my wing. I was a hunt at sixty one pounds, but I just felt so much bigger. I felt so much stronger, And I think that's that's one of the ways my strength is gonna show in the fight's body strength. I assume, as you've been preparing for this fight, you've been sparring with some naturally bigger guys. How you felt in there with with bigger people. I felt faster, I felt smarter. They did feel a little bit bigger in the clinch, like when I go to hold or grabbed them, they felt a lot stronger, like so I had to kind of push, like put my legs on the me too push him back. But that was kind of like the only uh that was kind of like the only difference I felt the power those guys. I want guys hit hard in any way class like but Tsa was one forty, but he hit like a middleweek and then you got like Thermany who it's hard and Spencer strong. So I think the power kind of felt the same. So but other than that, UM just that, Yeah, they're bigger guys, so to feel more heavier. Do you look at do you approach this fight thinking look one way or the other I'm a full time one or could you see any scenario where if you don't feel as comfortable as you hoped, you might actually drop back to Yeah, I can. I can definitely still make one forty seven. That's not that's not a question. But I really want what I really wanted to show my dream. I run from my dream and try to be at three division world champion, and if you know, if I get it, I'm so happy. I know I can do it. I just have to put my mind to it and really believe in myself. For me to take a step back to seven, I fought the best fighters and then I want a world tight or there. So I kind of feel like I'm taking a step back and there's another new young guys that I'm excited to see them. Guys do their things like Geron and is Um, which I think he will take over the watchweight division. So I'll leave that up to those guys and see what they can do with the division. So you use the word dream, is there a dream fight for you? I just need to get this win. I got to show the people I really do. I really do like a lot of people and asking me who you want to fight, who you want to do this? Of course I want to fight the best and I proved to the world that I always want to fight the best and to me, you know, Benavidez is tough challenge, so I can't look over him. I know he's hungry, has something to prove. So I gotta get this victory and then Um after that, then you know, the sky is the limit. The sky's the limit. Yeah, there's you know, when I talk to people around PBC, there's obviously a lot of chatter about you against Jamal Charlo at some point next year. Uh, do you feel like you need multiple fights at to be ready for that type of challenge or if things go your way in the Benavitez fight, would that be something you'd be ready to step into next. One thing I learned about boxing, sometimes those warm up fights can really hurt you. Then, uh, because you have to train as hard as you train for a warm up fight, it's the same for a big fight. So sometimes warm fight warm up fights not so called warm up but not big names. I want to say warm up because everyone comes to fight. Um, they take the same amount of work, and especially at my age, I don't want to work so hard and waste it on, you know, just so I'm just gonna go for I mean, every everything I got left, I'm just gonna go for going for the gust though. You know, I read somewhere that Benevitez father was basically saying it's do or die for his son in this one, that he's got to win this fight or else. You know, his future as a top fighter is going to be over with. When a fighter maybe coming into the ring with that kind of attitude or desperation, what do you make of that? Is that a variable for you as you prepare for this fight. You know, I feel the same way. I feel the same way. I feel like I had to um win because they'll be Deva seeing any any other outcome. So I gotta win. But I just gotta stay smart, you know, I gotta stay smart. Let him, let him make the mistakes, and I just just like a true vet and get the job done well. Danny, always fight the best, always have one seven. Looking forward to seeing you back in against the top guys at one. First up Jose Benavidez units a fight you can see over on showtime. Danny, good to talk to you again, man, Good luck on Saturday. Thank you. I appreciate it when we come back. This week's picks brought to you by Fan Duel time not for this weeks picks brought to you by Fan Duel and I hope you have been gambling with me lately. I have been on fire with these picks. Fire Derek to sore underdog wins, Ryan Garcia. You know who's gonna win, told you it was gonna win by knockout. I hope you've been betting with me and winning some money. This week, I'm locked into the hundred and fifty four pound fight between Danny Garcia and Jose Benevidez Junior. Now you lean hard towards Garcia and this one and oddsmakers have adjusted. Accordingly, Garcia is a minus eight fifty favorite to win this fight. I'm taking Danny Garcia. I'm not as confident as so many out there are that he's going to blow through. Benevitez Jr. Benevilla Junior is one loss on his resume. That was the Terence Crawford, one of the top two or three fighters in the entire world. I think he's going to be game in this fight, but I think Garcia wins. So if you're picking a win Garcia, you're gonna have to load up though on just picking him to win of a method of victory. This is where I think you can make a little bit of money. I'm taking Garcia to win by points. He is minus one twenty to win by decision. According to fan duel Uh, Garcia was a power puncher at one forty, but when he moved up to one his punching power at least statistically went down. In four of the nine fights that he fought, four of them by knockout. That was already I was six and three in those nine fights, four wins coming by a way of knockout. It didn't knock into the top tier guys out that he was up against. So going up to I think Garcia is gonna be active enough to win by points. I don't think he's gonna get a knockout. So take Danny Garcia to win, and take him to win by points. Those are my picks, brought to you by Fan Duel. That's it for this week's episode. My thanks to keith Iadec and Danny Garcia for joining the show. As always, subscribe, rate, review this podcast, Talk, Apple, Podcast, Spotify, wherever you download podcast. Next week, I will be in Texas for the Virgil Ortiz Michael Mackinson Fight. I will be joined by Sergio Mora, Ryan Garcia. What do you have to say to Sergio more Sogio? You don't know ship