The Volume.

The Volume.

Just a reminder that you can catch me recording this podcast live on amp amp with the new Live Radio app. Let you call in and chat with me in person while I'm recording. Get the app on Apple's app store and make sure to follow me at Chris Mannix to get notified when I go live. This is Boxing with Chris Manning. Who's somebody punch him in the face empty? Joshua is a composed and ferocious finisher. Watch this handy re.

Just a reminder that you can catch me recording this podcast live on amp amp with the new Live Radio app. Let you call in and chat with me in person while I'm recording. Get the app on Apple's app store and make sure to follow me at Chris Mannix to get notified when I go live. This is Boxing with Chris Manning. Who's somebody punch him in the face empty? Joshua is a composed and ferocious finisher. Watch this handy re.

Ways this heavy way posted by SI's Chris Mannix. That was my moments now with interviews, analysis and everything going on in the world of boxing.

Ways this heavy way posted by SI's Chris Mannix. That was my moments now with interviews, analysis and everything going on in the world of boxing.

When you have talent, you are given another chance.

When you have talent, you are given another chance.

Here's Chris Mannix.

Here's Chris Mannix.

And we are back Boxing with Chris Mannix, part of the Volume Sports podcast Network. Glad he could be here, Glad he could join. If you're watching on YouTube or listening on the podcast feed, welcome. We appreciate you tuning in. Make sure you subscribe both at YouTube and on the podcast feed, Rate and review the show as well. Lot to get into this week. We had an interesting weekend in boxing with big cards in New York and in Minnesota. We have a good weekend coming up headlined by Jared Anderson, the heavyweight contender returning make me his hometown debut in Toledo, Ohio. It's a fight you can watch on ESPN plus. Jard's going to join me a little bit later in the show to talk about that. But to get into all the news of the week, I want to bring in a friend of the podcast, Corey Erdman, boxing writer over at boxing scene dot com, broadcast his own ESPN, a whole bunch of different places. He joins me here on the show. So Corey, before we look ahead at some of the stuff that is going on this week and some of the news items, we want to look back at last weekend, and let's start in New York where I was with Edgar Berlanga taking on Jason Quickly. And this was the first fight of Edgar Berlanga's Matchroom deal. It's a multi fight deal with Matchroom. He thought it was gonna lead to a Canelo Alvarez fight. That's obviously out the window right now. We'll get to that more a little bit later, but Berlanga taken on quickly. I think a lot of people expected Berlanga just to roll over Jason Quigley. Uh you know, Quickly was last seen at least Stateside, you know, getting just blown away by Demetrius Andrew. I think a lot of people expected Berlanga to do something similar. He doesn't. He does get quickly down four times in the fight, it goes to a decision, he wins wide. Give me your assessment of what you saw from Edgar Berlangan this one.

And we are back Boxing with Chris Mannix, part of the Volume Sports podcast Network. Glad he could be here, Glad he could join. If you're watching on YouTube or listening on the podcast feed, welcome. We appreciate you tuning in. Make sure you subscribe both at YouTube and on the podcast feed, Rate and review the show as well. Lot to get into this week. We had an interesting weekend in boxing with big cards in New York and in Minnesota. We have a good weekend coming up headlined by Jared Anderson, the heavyweight contender returning make me his hometown debut in Toledo, Ohio. It's a fight you can watch on ESPN plus. Jard's going to join me a little bit later in the show to talk about that. But to get into all the news of the week, I want to bring in a friend of the podcast, Corey Erdman, boxing writer over at boxing scene dot com, broadcast his own ESPN, a whole bunch of different places. He joins me here on the show. So Corey, before we look ahead at some of the stuff that is going on this week and some of the news items, we want to look back at last weekend, and let's start in New York where I was with Edgar Berlanga taking on Jason Quickly. And this was the first fight of Edgar Berlanga's Matchroom deal. It's a multi fight deal with Matchroom. He thought it was gonna lead to a Canelo Alvarez fight. That's obviously out the window right now. We'll get to that more a little bit later, but Berlanga taken on quickly. I think a lot of people expected Berlanga just to roll over Jason Quigley. Uh you know, Quickly was last seen at least Stateside, you know, getting just blown away by Demetrius Andrew. I think a lot of people expected Berlanga to do something similar. He doesn't. He does get quickly down four times in the fight, it goes to a decision, he wins wide. Give me your assessment of what you saw from Edgar Berlangan this one.

Yeah, I thought that he was modestly better than how he looked last time out, but he did run into a pretty pesky opponent in Jason Quigley. You know, I didn't think that quickly was necessarily winning a lot of those rounds.

Yeah, I thought that he was modestly better than how he looked last time out, but he did run into a pretty pesky opponent in Jason Quigley. You know, I didn't think that quickly was necessarily winning a lot of those rounds.

Who WHOA whoa Sergio Turgio turn off, Sergio Moore, turn off this portion of the podcast, because I know somewhere in southern California Sergio Mora is still scoring rounds for Jason Quigley somewhere.

Who WHOA whoa Sergio Turgio turn off, Sergio Moore, turn off this portion of the podcast, because I know somewhere in southern California Sergio Mora is still scoring rounds for Jason Quigley somewhere.

Well listen.

Well listen.

And in Sergio's defense, I could see what he liked in what Quigley was doing, because I think Sergio was seeing a lot of the things that brought Sergio to a world ability to nullify a lot of what Mukia was doing. Now the argument, sorry, not Mukia obviously Berlanga, The argument is was he doing enough of that to win rounds or not? But setting that aside, Erlanga had someone in Quigley that was making things difficult for him in each and every round. And you know a lot of people sort of cast Quiggly aside. Uh and they expected him, as you said, to do what Andraid had done. But you know, remember Berlanga is a guy who was, you know, taking heat for the struggles that he had with you know, the Cosirass and demon Nicholson's of the world. So if you don't blast Jason Quiggley out there, who you know, is a guy that fought for a world title and is of had reached a higher level than Berlanga had as professional. To me, that can be acceptable. The problem is that Berlanga is always fighting against not just his opponent, but the expectations that were set upon him. With that knockout streak and the moment that ended for him, everything in comparison to that is obviously going to be less exciting. And you know, Berlanga I still think was missing you know what I would describe as some of that connective tissue in between what he wants to do those big blistering attacks, you know, the big power shots, the big athletic moves that the leaping hooks, that kind of stuff. There's a little bit missing in terms of, well, how can he set that up beyond just brute force or sheer athleticism. Some of that is missing, and that's what Quickly was able to exploit, and that's why he was able to make things difficult. But you know, I wouldn't say I was. I was blown away by the performance, but I also wasn't, you know, totally distraught afterwards, are terribly disappointed.

And in Sergio's defense, I could see what he liked in what Quigley was doing, because I think Sergio was seeing a lot of the things that brought Sergio to a world ability to nullify a lot of what Mukia was doing. Now the argument, sorry, not Mukia obviously Berlanga, The argument is was he doing enough of that to win rounds or not? But setting that aside, Erlanga had someone in Quigley that was making things difficult for him in each and every round. And you know a lot of people sort of cast Quiggly aside. Uh and they expected him, as you said, to do what Andraid had done. But you know, remember Berlanga is a guy who was, you know, taking heat for the struggles that he had with you know, the Cosirass and demon Nicholson's of the world. So if you don't blast Jason Quiggley out there, who you know, is a guy that fought for a world title and is of had reached a higher level than Berlanga had as professional. To me, that can be acceptable. The problem is that Berlanga is always fighting against not just his opponent, but the expectations that were set upon him. With that knockout streak and the moment that ended for him, everything in comparison to that is obviously going to be less exciting. And you know, Berlanga I still think was missing you know what I would describe as some of that connective tissue in between what he wants to do those big blistering attacks, you know, the big power shots, the big athletic moves that the leaping hooks, that kind of stuff. There's a little bit missing in terms of, well, how can he set that up beyond just brute force or sheer athleticism. Some of that is missing, and that's what Quickly was able to exploit, and that's why he was able to make things difficult. But you know, I wouldn't say I was. I was blown away by the performance, but I also wasn't, you know, totally distraught afterwards, are terribly disappointed.

Let me say this about my pals. Sergio, who knows more about boxing than I ever will, like, has lived it, won a world championship. His resume speaks for itself. He does have a blind spot, and his blind spot is with guys that move around the ring and use their jab because that's who Sergio was as a fighter. That's the fighter that Dean Campos raised, you know, in the gym and turned into a world champion. So when he sees a guy doing anything that resembles that, he gives it more credit than it deserves. Like there at no point in time was Jason Quigley a threat in my opinion, to win that fight. Like he was not going to get knocked out. That that was relatively clear. Even though he got knocked down. One of those knockdowns early was not really knockdown. He kind of tripped and it was more of a grazing shot that led to a trip. But he wasn't going to win that fight. And Sergio just loves those types of guys that stick and move and stick and move and well, like the copy Bok numbers speak for themselves. And no round did Jason Quiggley outland eger Berlanc egerb Berland and Blanka landed like forty seven percent of his power punches. He he he was landing shots. And while Quigley was certainly moving around the ring well and you can give him credit for a measure of ring generalship, at some point you have to land more punches than the other guy. It's as simple as that. And he'd ever did that at any point in time, didn't or during the fight, I got id want to.

Let me say this about my pals. Sergio, who knows more about boxing than I ever will, like, has lived it, won a world championship. His resume speaks for itself. He does have a blind spot, and his blind spot is with guys that move around the ring and use their jab because that's who Sergio was as a fighter. That's the fighter that Dean Campos raised, you know, in the gym and turned into a world champion. So when he sees a guy doing anything that resembles that, he gives it more credit than it deserves. Like there at no point in time was Jason Quigley a threat in my opinion, to win that fight. Like he was not going to get knocked out. That that was relatively clear. Even though he got knocked down. One of those knockdowns early was not really knockdown. He kind of tripped and it was more of a grazing shot that led to a trip. But he wasn't going to win that fight. And Sergio just loves those types of guys that stick and move and stick and move and well, like the copy Bok numbers speak for themselves. And no round did Jason Quiggley outland eger Berlanc egerb Berland and Blanka landed like forty seven percent of his power punches. He he he was landing shots. And while Quigley was certainly moving around the ring well and you can give him credit for a measure of ring generalship, at some point you have to land more punches than the other guy. It's as simple as that. And he'd ever did that at any point in time, didn't or during the fight, I got id want to.

I did want to point this out there, Chris, I do want to say that, you know, to categorize Quigly's performance, basically, he did about as well as he could possibly have done against that opponent, right like the threats that Berlanga presented. He did everything he could and I do want to give credit. I want to make sure I give credit to Andy Lee for his corner work in and I know to people who are watching on TV, it might have sounded a little bit bizarre at one point because Lee, after a round that day knocked out it won that round, but he won that round. But I understood why he was doing that. I understood that what he was saying, his line of communication throughout the whole night was just effusive praise for his fighter. And part of that might be Andy Lee's communication style. Part of that maybe that's how quickly as a person and as an athlete is motivated. Whatever the reason, I think that Lee was doing the right thing because what he was communicating is that within your skill set and given the opponent that we have right here, you are doing the best that you possibly can. And that was what was right to be communicated at that at that point. And I'm not one of these people who likes to you know, a lot of people like to say, oh, there's no teachers in boxing anymore, and you know that can be You'll get immediate likes. If you say something like that, it sounds like a kind of you know, high minded like appreciation of yesteryear and you know whatever. But there are good trainers out there, and I think that Andy Lee is one of them, and I think that too often what you will see in corners is trainers asking something of their fighter that they just can't actually perform.

I did want to point this out there, Chris, I do want to say that, you know, to categorize Quigly's performance, basically, he did about as well as he could possibly have done against that opponent, right like the threats that Berlanga presented. He did everything he could and I do want to give credit. I want to make sure I give credit to Andy Lee for his corner work in and I know to people who are watching on TV, it might have sounded a little bit bizarre at one point because Lee, after a round that day knocked out it won that round, but he won that round. But I understood why he was doing that. I understood that what he was saying, his line of communication throughout the whole night was just effusive praise for his fighter. And part of that might be Andy Lee's communication style. Part of that maybe that's how quickly as a person and as an athlete is motivated. Whatever the reason, I think that Lee was doing the right thing because what he was communicating is that within your skill set and given the opponent that we have right here, you are doing the best that you possibly can. And that was what was right to be communicated at that at that point. And I'm not one of these people who likes to you know, a lot of people like to say, oh, there's no teachers in boxing anymore, and you know that can be You'll get immediate likes. If you say something like that, it sounds like a kind of you know, high minded like appreciation of yesteryear and you know whatever. But there are good trainers out there, and I think that Andy Lee is one of them, and I think that too often what you will see in corners is trainers asking something of their fighter that they just can't actually perform.

You'll often see you guys say, oh, you know, where are those six punch combinations we saw in the gym? Well, those don't work in this fight.

You'll often see you guys say, oh, you know, where are those six punch combinations we saw in the gym? Well, those don't work in this fight.

Andy Lee knew what his fighter had that worked, that he could actually perform, and he set out I think the best game plan that Quigly could have possibly enacted. So I do want to give a shout out to Andy Lee. I think a lot of people will kind of forget that fight and what he did in that fight, but I think he did a really excellent job with what he had.

Andy Lee knew what his fighter had that worked, that he could actually perform, and he set out I think the best game plan that Quigly could have possibly enacted. So I do want to give a shout out to Andy Lee. I think a lot of people will kind of forget that fight and what he did in that fight, but I think he did a really excellent job with what he had.

I think the game plan was fine. I just don't I don't know that you can never win a fight moving that much and only throwing jabs, and that really was what Quiggly was doing. The power numbers were significantly in favor of Berlanka, and even though Berlanga didn't look great and didn't land a whole bunch of them. He was still landing more than Jason Quigley, and you know those shots tend to count more in the minds of the judges. So at no point I think that Berlanga was in danger of losing the fight. Where I wonder and what I wonder was where was the twelfth round? Where was the Edgar Burlang of the twelfth round during the first eleven? Like, where was that guy? Like you're telling me that Edgar Berlanga in the first, second, or third round could not have turned up the heat. I mean, we know he is trainer, believed he could have mark defeat. Was in the corner saying, hey, let's go, let's go, let's go pick it up, throw the jab more, some faints, all the things we worked on in camp. At no point Corey did did Edgar Berlanga go back to his corner and hear positive reinforcement To contrast what you just said, Jason Quigley was here another positive reinforcement. Edgar Berlanga was hearing, you know, the boxing equivalent of you, you're blowing it, Like that's what he's hearing over and over again. So I just wonder where the Edgar Berlanga was in the twelfth round, why he didn't step on the gas earlier in this fight, because when he did he could be overwhelming. He was far more powerful than Jason Quiggley. That right hand had an effect. I don't know where that version of Berlanga was for the first eleven rounds of the fight. That was my biggest issue with how he fought. Yeah, I think, you know, and I'm just guessing here. I think that one is that Quickly was obviously more tired in the twelve so Berlanga, you know, had a more susceptible opponent. I think that's one thing.

I think the game plan was fine. I just don't I don't know that you can never win a fight moving that much and only throwing jabs, and that really was what Quiggly was doing. The power numbers were significantly in favor of Berlanka, and even though Berlanga didn't look great and didn't land a whole bunch of them. He was still landing more than Jason Quigley, and you know those shots tend to count more in the minds of the judges. So at no point I think that Berlanga was in danger of losing the fight. Where I wonder and what I wonder was where was the twelfth round? Where was the Edgar Burlang of the twelfth round during the first eleven? Like, where was that guy? Like you're telling me that Edgar Berlanga in the first, second, or third round could not have turned up the heat. I mean, we know he is trainer, believed he could have mark defeat. Was in the corner saying, hey, let's go, let's go, let's go pick it up, throw the jab more, some faints, all the things we worked on in camp. At no point Corey did did Edgar Berlanga go back to his corner and hear positive reinforcement To contrast what you just said, Jason Quigley was here another positive reinforcement. Edgar Berlanga was hearing, you know, the boxing equivalent of you, you're blowing it, Like that's what he's hearing over and over again. So I just wonder where the Edgar Berlanga was in the twelfth round, why he didn't step on the gas earlier in this fight, because when he did he could be overwhelming. He was far more powerful than Jason Quiggley. That right hand had an effect. I don't know where that version of Berlanga was for the first eleven rounds of the fight. That was my biggest issue with how he fought. Yeah, I think, you know, and I'm just guessing here. I think that one is that Quickly was obviously more tired in the twelve so Berlanga, you know, had a more susceptible opponent. I think that's one thing.

Because one thing Berlanga did do well throughout the fight, and I think Sergio even agreed with that. I thought he was cutting off the ring decently, and he was applying good foot pressure all night, making.

Because one thing Berlanga did do well throughout the fight, and I think Sergio even agreed with that. I thought he was cutting off the ring decently, and he was applying good foot pressure all night, making.

You know, I thought, I mean, I thought it was okay.

You know, I thought, I mean, I thought it was okay.

Yeah, sure, you know, but but it was he was. He was applying pressure throughout the night. I think my guess is that Berlanga, throughout this fight, and I'm just kind of taking clues from what he said afterwards, was sort of caught between ideologies a little bit. He said that in the opening rounds. I think he said it to you that he was supposed to start faster. He thought that he was going to start faster, but he wound up trying to negotiate range a little bit more. And I think that that may be the part of his brain that's still kind of with the former trainer and now the new trainer, where he said throughout camp, they basically put a heavy bag against the wall and had him slam it until exhaustion. You know, that kind of like killer mentality is kind of antithetical to maybe how he was thinking before, And I think he tapped into what he needed to be in that twelfth and final round and how I think he now envisions himself as a fighter.

Yeah, sure, you know, but but it was he was. He was applying pressure throughout the night. I think my guess is that Berlanga, throughout this fight, and I'm just kind of taking clues from what he said afterwards, was sort of caught between ideologies a little bit. He said that in the opening rounds. I think he said it to you that he was supposed to start faster. He thought that he was going to start faster, but he wound up trying to negotiate range a little bit more. And I think that that may be the part of his brain that's still kind of with the former trainer and now the new trainer, where he said throughout camp, they basically put a heavy bag against the wall and had him slam it until exhaustion. You know, that kind of like killer mentality is kind of antithetical to maybe how he was thinking before, And I think he tapped into what he needed to be in that twelfth and final round and how I think he now envisions himself as a fighter.

So let's talk about what he does next, because it's pretty obvious the big fight to make for Egarb Berlanga is him Imogia. This is a fight that would be between two young, undefeated one hundred and sixty eight pound contenders who are both high in most of the sanctioning body rankings. It would be a perfect matchup styles new of these guys takes more than a couple of steps backward in fact, they're probably going to go forwards from the opening bell, and it would be a electric type of fight. It would sell a bunch of tickets. Whether you have the fight in Southern California, in Las Vegas, in New York City, it probably sells out the Big Room in New York City. Frankly, Egar Berlanga put about five thousand plus into the theater at the Garden with him MGIA, with his fan base, with the right promotion, that is a MSG sellout, I think, and I don't think that's too much of a stretch. I think him Mungea would take the fight. I think Oscar Lahoya would take the fight. I think Eddie Hearn would make the fight. I'm not convinced that the people around Edgar Berlanga, his management, trainers, would want that fight right now. And that's disappointing because one of the reasons one of the criticisms Edgar Berlanga had when he left Top Rank was, you know, Top Rank officials privately, you know, whispering that Edgar Berlanga didn't want to fight anybody. Remember was Jesse Hart back then? You know, they couldn't make a fight with Jesse Hart. He goes to Mattroom and he gets what was supposed to be a gimme on the first fight of his deal, Jason Quigley, who was a middleweight up until about a year ago. And now it sounds like it seems like anyway that Berlanga wants another gimme or another fight where he is a you know, three to one, four to one, five to one favorite against I don't think there's any value in that. I don't I don't even know who that would be at one sixty eight, Like I don't know who that would be. I don't know who he wants at one sixty eight that represents that type of credible opponent, but not credible enough to be a real threat to Berlanga. I think it's got to be Mungia, and I'd make Mungia a favorite right now. I think he's improved a lot more over the last couple of years than Berlanga has, but I don't make him this overwhelming favorite. I think everything we've seen from Jimi Mongia, including most recently his fight against Sergey Derevin Schenko, shows a vulnerable fighter. I mean Sergey devin Schenko fifth round, Corey fifth round, He had Jimi Mugia on the ropes. He was hurting Hie McGee and Sergei Derevinchenko is a good fighter, you know, much better than his record suggests. But he's a middleweight who's thirty seven years old going into that fight. You're telling me that if you're Edgar Berlanga's management. By the way, his manager, Keith Conley, also represents Sergei derevic Cheneko, so he was sitting there watching what was happening during derevin Chenko Mgia. If you don't believe that your guy can win a fight against himI Mugea, you don't belong anywhere near any of the top guys in the super middleweight division. Look. I understood when they were talking about getting a Canelo Alvarez fight, and that was always kind of the plan for Edgar Berlanka. They said this publicly when that was on the table. I could understand the push to avoid an extremely difficult opponent in that second fight, but Canelo is not an option. He's got a multi fight deal with PBC that's probably gonna keep him tied up on that side of the street. Through September of twenty twenty four, what's Edgar Berlanga gonna do? What's he gonna do? Is he going to take a B level or C level opponent in his next fight and then fight Jimi Mugia. What are we waiting for?

So let's talk about what he does next, because it's pretty obvious the big fight to make for Egarb Berlanga is him Imogia. This is a fight that would be between two young, undefeated one hundred and sixty eight pound contenders who are both high in most of the sanctioning body rankings. It would be a perfect matchup styles new of these guys takes more than a couple of steps backward in fact, they're probably going to go forwards from the opening bell, and it would be a electric type of fight. It would sell a bunch of tickets. Whether you have the fight in Southern California, in Las Vegas, in New York City, it probably sells out the Big Room in New York City. Frankly, Egar Berlanga put about five thousand plus into the theater at the Garden with him MGIA, with his fan base, with the right promotion, that is a MSG sellout, I think, and I don't think that's too much of a stretch. I think him Mungea would take the fight. I think Oscar Lahoya would take the fight. I think Eddie Hearn would make the fight. I'm not convinced that the people around Edgar Berlanga, his management, trainers, would want that fight right now. And that's disappointing because one of the reasons one of the criticisms Edgar Berlanga had when he left Top Rank was, you know, Top Rank officials privately, you know, whispering that Edgar Berlanga didn't want to fight anybody. Remember was Jesse Hart back then? You know, they couldn't make a fight with Jesse Hart. He goes to Mattroom and he gets what was supposed to be a gimme on the first fight of his deal, Jason Quigley, who was a middleweight up until about a year ago. And now it sounds like it seems like anyway that Berlanga wants another gimme or another fight where he is a you know, three to one, four to one, five to one favorite against I don't think there's any value in that. I don't I don't even know who that would be at one sixty eight, Like I don't know who that would be. I don't know who he wants at one sixty eight that represents that type of credible opponent, but not credible enough to be a real threat to Berlanga. I think it's got to be Mungia, and I'd make Mungia a favorite right now. I think he's improved a lot more over the last couple of years than Berlanga has, but I don't make him this overwhelming favorite. I think everything we've seen from Jimi Mongia, including most recently his fight against Sergey Derevin Schenko, shows a vulnerable fighter. I mean Sergey devin Schenko fifth round, Corey fifth round, He had Jimi Mugia on the ropes. He was hurting Hie McGee and Sergei Derevinchenko is a good fighter, you know, much better than his record suggests. But he's a middleweight who's thirty seven years old going into that fight. You're telling me that if you're Edgar Berlanga's management. By the way, his manager, Keith Conley, also represents Sergei derevic Cheneko, so he was sitting there watching what was happening during derevin Chenko Mgia. If you don't believe that your guy can win a fight against himI Mugea, you don't belong anywhere near any of the top guys in the super middleweight division. Look. I understood when they were talking about getting a Canelo Alvarez fight, and that was always kind of the plan for Edgar Berlanka. They said this publicly when that was on the table. I could understand the push to avoid an extremely difficult opponent in that second fight, but Canelo is not an option. He's got a multi fight deal with PBC that's probably gonna keep him tied up on that side of the street. Through September of twenty twenty four, what's Edgar Berlanga gonna do? What's he gonna do? Is he going to take a B level or C level opponent in his next fight and then fight Jimi Mugia. What are we waiting for?

Like?

Like?

What are we waiting for? We have been clamoring for years to see Jimi Mngia in a big fight. There's nothing out there for him. You're gonna tell me the Jimi Mungia and Oscar de la Hoya are gonna make a fight against David Benavidez. Bullshit, bullshit.

What are we waiting for? We have been clamoring for years to see Jimi Mngia in a big fight. There's nothing out there for him. You're gonna tell me the Jimi Mungia and Oscar de la Hoya are gonna make a fight against David Benavidez. Bullshit, bullshit.

They're gonna run into that fight like they would be a eight to one underdog in a fight against David Benavidez.

They're gonna run into that fight like they would be a eight to one underdog in a fight against David Benavidez.

They would be a favorite against Edgar Berlanga. That's why De la Hoya and Mongia's team, Fernando Beltron, they're gonna want that fight against Berlanga. Berlanga should want that fight too. That is a winnable fight for him. It's a tough fight, but it's a winnable fight for him. If he wants to get all the people that are on his back off on his back four not fighting the best in his division, He's got to take this fight. And to his credit, he hopped on social media on Sunday when Oscar and Eddie were doing there whatever it is that they're doing with Twitter, he subtweeted it and said, Oscar, bring me that punching bag. Talking about Mongia, so Berlanga is on record saying he wants that fight, his team needs to make that fight. Do you agree.

They would be a favorite against Edgar Berlanga. That's why De la Hoya and Mongia's team, Fernando Beltron, they're gonna want that fight against Berlanga. Berlanga should want that fight too. That is a winnable fight for him. It's a tough fight, but it's a winnable fight for him. If he wants to get all the people that are on his back off on his back four not fighting the best in his division, He's got to take this fight. And to his credit, he hopped on social media on Sunday when Oscar and Eddie were doing there whatever it is that they're doing with Twitter, he subtweeted it and said, Oscar, bring me that punching bag. Talking about Mongia, so Berlanga is on record saying he wants that fight, his team needs to make that fight. Do you agree.

I think it's an awesome fight, and I think it should be the next fight, you know, and I understand, uh, you know, if Berlanga sees the Triple G carrot out there and maybe wants to see if that's a possibility before signing for Mungia. But the better fight, the more entertaining fight for me, is the Mungkia fight.

I think it's an awesome fight, and I think it should be the next fight, you know, and I understand, uh, you know, if Berlanga sees the Triple G carrot out there and maybe wants to see if that's a possibility before signing for Mungia. But the better fight, the more entertaining fight for me, is the Mungkia fight.

I'll grant you that too, Corey, I'll grant you that. Like if if Nadi Gilofkin wakes up tomorrow and says I'd like to fight Edgar Berlanga, make that fight. That's kind of a take. Yes, that's a king making type of fight for Berlin. Yes, But if Glofkin is still waffling and he's into July and August being like, you know, I don't really know what I want to do. Forget it, Go make the fight against Mungia. You beat him, Mongia, you're a money man in in one hundred and sixty eight pound division. You can go to David Benavitzez and say, look, it's a fifty to fifty split, or you can go down the line to Canelo Alvarez and say, auvern a bigger share of the pie. I'm sorry to interrupt you there, but I just no, no, you know, I think that is such a a important fight for Edgar Berlanga that he's got to find a way to take it. If Galofkin's not available.

I'll grant you that too, Corey, I'll grant you that. Like if if Nadi Gilofkin wakes up tomorrow and says I'd like to fight Edgar Berlanga, make that fight. That's kind of a take. Yes, that's a king making type of fight for Berlin. Yes, But if Glofkin is still waffling and he's into July and August being like, you know, I don't really know what I want to do. Forget it, Go make the fight against Mungia. You beat him, Mongia, you're a money man in in one hundred and sixty eight pound division. You can go to David Benavitzez and say, look, it's a fifty to fifty split, or you can go down the line to Canelo Alvarez and say, auvern a bigger share of the pie. I'm sorry to interrupt you there, but I just no, no, you know, I think that is such a a important fight for Edgar Berlanga that he's got to find a way to take it. If Galofkin's not available.

Well, and you know, I don't know what's been discussed behind closed doors, but I do get the sense that Berlanga, as you said, wants that fight. And I actually found his post fight interview with you on the broadcast to be really interesting and really illuminating. You know, it was a very different Edgar Berlanga than the one that we saw kind of during the build up, like the bombast was kind of gone, and he was he was sort of pensive, he was a little bit quiet. But I also found it interesting that Berlanga kind of, even in that interaction with you, sort of let it slip that he kind of almost agrees with a lot of the criticism about him, but he's rationalizing it a little bit differently. You know, he said that the reason basically, in effect, he's saying, the reason that I'm struggling or I look like I'm having difficulty with this level of guys. You know, the Jason Quickley's and below, is because they're not talented enough, so they don't want to engage with me. But I will look better if I face better fighters. But the problem is that my competition hasn't been good enough, and that will make me look better because they'll be trying to knock me out too, just like I will be with them again.

Well, and you know, I don't know what's been discussed behind closed doors, but I do get the sense that Berlanga, as you said, wants that fight. And I actually found his post fight interview with you on the broadcast to be really interesting and really illuminating. You know, it was a very different Edgar Berlanga than the one that we saw kind of during the build up, like the bombast was kind of gone, and he was he was sort of pensive, he was a little bit quiet. But I also found it interesting that Berlanga kind of, even in that interaction with you, sort of let it slip that he kind of almost agrees with a lot of the criticism about him, but he's rationalizing it a little bit differently. You know, he said that the reason basically, in effect, he's saying, the reason that I'm struggling or I look like I'm having difficulty with this level of guys. You know, the Jason Quickley's and below, is because they're not talented enough, so they don't want to engage with me. But I will look better if I face better fighters. But the problem is that my competition hasn't been good enough, and that will make me look better because they'll be trying to knock me out too, just like I will be with them again.

And we've seen we've seen examples of this. I mean, yeah, Lopez looks awful against Sando Martin. He fights against Josh Taylor, Josh Taylor engages with him. Tafimo looks great right now, Regis Progray is dealing with that same stuff. Daddy Lito Zaria dances around the ring for twelve rounds, Pro Grey. Are there weaknesses there? You put Progray in with someone that's gonna bang with him, He's gonna look a heck of a lot better. So it's like I understand where berlang is coming from there.

And we've seen we've seen examples of this. I mean, yeah, Lopez looks awful against Sando Martin. He fights against Josh Taylor, Josh Taylor engages with him. Tafimo looks great right now, Regis Progray is dealing with that same stuff. Daddy Lito Zaria dances around the ring for twelve rounds, Pro Grey. Are there weaknesses there? You put Progray in with someone that's gonna bang with him, He's gonna look a heck of a lot better. So it's like I understand where berlang is coming from there.

Yeah, well, and you know, so to that point, like, I think that he thinks that not only does he want these fights, but I think he thinks he needs them because he feels like he's past the point of gaining anything from that level of fights. The other thing is that objectively, you know, and I don't know who these names are necessarily, but I think that there's a danger for Berlanga if he faces anyone that sits between that quickly and.

Yeah, well, and you know, so to that point, like, I think that he thinks that not only does he want these fights, but I think he thinks he needs them because he feels like he's past the point of gaining anything from that level of fights. The other thing is that objectively, you know, and I don't know who these names are necessarily, but I think that there's a danger for Berlanga if he faces anyone that sits between that quickly and.

Mugil thousand percent, he could live right, couldn't agree more. There is a danger there.

Mugil thousand percent, he could live right, couldn't agree more. There is a danger there.

So objectively, if you're playing matchmaker with this guy, I think it's better off to just go to the fight that not only the fans want, but he seems to wand as well. I don't see a tremendous amount of downside.

So objectively, if you're playing matchmaker with this guy, I think it's better off to just go to the fight that not only the fans want, but he seems to wand as well. I don't see a tremendous amount of downside.

By the way, he's twenty six. You lose a competitive fight with Jimi Mungia, you're not taking too many steps back. I mean, Derevin Schenko just lost to fight to Jimi Mangia. They're talking about doing a rematch. In fact, I was told that, you know, Golden Boy and Devin Chenko want the rematch. I'm not so sure it his own is interested because understandably do Owne wants Mungia to fight Berlanka. You don't want to put these two guys in with other opponents where they will be would be sizeable favorites. And with due respect to the performance derevin Chenko had, I had kind of a last standish feel off that Cory, Like you know that derevin Chenko dug deep one last time. I feel like, if he fights Mungia again, it's not going to be as competitive this time around because he is on the older side and there's only so many wars you can go through before they he starts to take their toll and you ultimately get stopped.

By the way, he's twenty six. You lose a competitive fight with Jimi Mungia, you're not taking too many steps back. I mean, Derevin Schenko just lost to fight to Jimi Mangia. They're talking about doing a rematch. In fact, I was told that, you know, Golden Boy and Devin Chenko want the rematch. I'm not so sure it his own is interested because understandably do Owne wants Mungia to fight Berlanka. You don't want to put these two guys in with other opponents where they will be would be sizeable favorites. And with due respect to the performance derevin Chenko had, I had kind of a last standish feel off that Cory, Like you know that derevin Chenko dug deep one last time. I feel like, if he fights Mungia again, it's not going to be as competitive this time around because he is on the older side and there's only so many wars you can go through before they he starts to take their toll and you ultimately get stopped.

So yeah, I sort of got the same feeling. And you know, all the respect to him in the world, I wouldn't want to count him out heading into that rematch, but yeah, I felt like whatever he had left, whatever his body had left to give, he might have left it in the ring that night, you know, And there's lots of examples of that, you know, throughout boxing history. I'm thinking away, I'm a very random example. Let's say like Mancini Bramble one, well, Mancini Bramble two, Boom, Boom just didn't have it anymore right like, and that may be the case with dry Vinchenko. He's he's put a lot into this sport and he left a lot in the ring.

So yeah, I sort of got the same feeling. And you know, all the respect to him in the world, I wouldn't want to count him out heading into that rematch, but yeah, I felt like whatever he had left, whatever his body had left to give, he might have left it in the ring that night, you know, And there's lots of examples of that, you know, throughout boxing history. I'm thinking away, I'm a very random example. Let's say like Mancini Bramble one, well, Mancini Bramble two, Boom, Boom just didn't have it anymore right like, and that may be the case with dry Vinchenko. He's he's put a lot into this sport and he left a lot in the ring.

In that fight too. Yeah, I did no question about that. I can't believe you're the second guy in three years to bring up Livingstone Bramble. Brian Kenny did it like years ago, and I thought he was I thought he was making the name up. Honestly. I thought it was like a Dickens character that he just made up. But apparently apparently that's a real person, which I looked up uh later on Also on that card, Adam Kobnowski uh lose his fourth straight fight. Uh, you know, it was a fun fun I as almost all Adam Kobnoski fights are. I think we were done. I think Adam Kobnaskus should call it a career. If he loses to Joekusamano. There's nobody on the higher level of the heavyweight division that he can stand in there and maybe Corey it's a blessing in disguise. If he had found a way to go the distance with Kusamano and squeeze out a win, he was a candidate fight Anthony Joshua in August, and that would have been that would have been ugly. Would have been ugly. That would have been ugly.

In that fight too. Yeah, I did no question about that. I can't believe you're the second guy in three years to bring up Livingstone Bramble. Brian Kenny did it like years ago, and I thought he was I thought he was making the name up. Honestly. I thought it was like a Dickens character that he just made up. But apparently apparently that's a real person, which I looked up uh later on Also on that card, Adam Kobnowski uh lose his fourth straight fight. Uh, you know, it was a fun fun I as almost all Adam Kobnoski fights are. I think we were done. I think Adam Kobnaskus should call it a career. If he loses to Joekusamano. There's nobody on the higher level of the heavyweight division that he can stand in there and maybe Corey it's a blessing in disguise. If he had found a way to go the distance with Kusamano and squeeze out a win, he was a candidate fight Anthony Joshua in August, and that would have been that would have been ugly. Would have been ugly. That would have been ugly.

That's the problem though, And I think that he should call it a career as well. You know, if I'm just sort of objectively playing doctor and matchmaker here, you know, without I can't, I don't have agency over his life in his career. But the difficulty, particularly with heavyweights, Chris, is that there is always money for a returning or an aging heavyweight anywhere in the world. These fights cost more money to make than in any other division, and there's always money out there in Europe, back home and Poland for him to make a return. I mean, Andrew Galotta came back a couple of years ago. Danny Williams still gets booked for fights, Kevin Johnson is still in fights there. There will be offers for Kubnatchki and they will seem appealing. But you see this career arc, and I don't want it to happen to him, But you see this career arc a lot in the heavyweight division, where you just slide further and further down the card until you kind of reach a really sad end and you're losing exhibition fights in Russia. I don't want that fight. I don't want that arc for him, but there will always be the possibility for it, because the money will be there for him, and hopefully he's made enough that that kind of money isn't tempting for him to do that.

That's the problem though, And I think that he should call it a career as well. You know, if I'm just sort of objectively playing doctor and matchmaker here, you know, without I can't, I don't have agency over his life in his career. But the difficulty, particularly with heavyweights, Chris, is that there is always money for a returning or an aging heavyweight anywhere in the world. These fights cost more money to make than in any other division, and there's always money out there in Europe, back home and Poland for him to make a return. I mean, Andrew Galotta came back a couple of years ago. Danny Williams still gets booked for fights, Kevin Johnson is still in fights there. There will be offers for Kubnatchki and they will seem appealing. But you see this career arc, and I don't want it to happen to him, But you see this career arc a lot in the heavyweight division, where you just slide further and further down the card until you kind of reach a really sad end and you're losing exhibition fights in Russia. I don't want that fight. I don't want that arc for him, but there will always be the possibility for it, because the money will be there for him, and hopefully he's made enough that that kind of money isn't tempting for him to do that.

Yeah, I think you know, if I was a betting man, i'd say he fights again. I don't think he fights again in the US because I don't think there is a major promoter that would work with him at this point because he has been knocked out and in a couple of cases badly, in three of his last four fights. He had a broken orbital bone in one of those fights. If you can't beat an opponent on the level of Joe Kusomano, do you really want to see Adam Kovnotski in with some like Jared Anderson for example, like do you really want to see that I'm gonna pass? I don't need to see I'm gonna pass?

Yeah, I think you know, if I was a betting man, i'd say he fights again. I don't think he fights again in the US because I don't think there is a major promoter that would work with him at this point because he has been knocked out and in a couple of cases badly, in three of his last four fights. He had a broken orbital bone in one of those fights. If you can't beat an opponent on the level of Joe Kusomano, do you really want to see Adam Kovnotski in with some like Jared Anderson for example, like do you really want to see that I'm gonna pass? I don't need to see I'm gonna pass?

Well, And it's also hard, you know, not only what happened in the ring, but it's hard for a guy to bounce back after. You know, fans who watched that broadcast seeing that you know and and you you guys were rightfully talking about this should.

Well, And it's also hard, you know, not only what happened in the ring, but it's hard for a guy to bounce back after. You know, fans who watched that broadcast seeing that you know and and you you guys were rightfully talking about this should.

Be the end for him. How you I'll tell you what you know. I get the sense he wants to keep fighting. I've heard some whispers. I'm sure that he wants to keep going. But there were moments where he was competitive, you know, especially in that second and third round when he rallied after the first round knockdown. But again, look at the caliber of opponent, Joe Kuzmano. All credit to him for winning that fight. That's the same guy two fights earlier that was knocked out in the first round by Daniel Dubois. Uh he was Kusumano was gassed after the first round. If you can't beat someone like that, you shouldn't be in with some of these heavyweight killers that are only going to be looking to fight you because of your name, because of the fact that you can sell tickets in New York City. I hope Adam Kovnowski's got the right people around him that says, look, there are other things we can do. We can train fighters, we can do a whole bunch of different things to make money. Instead of putting your health at risk at a young family shouldn't be fighting. You shouldn't be fighting anywhere ever. Again, the other fight over this past weekend I want to ask you about was the middleweight secondary title which will eventually be the full title Carlos A. Damas Julian J. Rock Williams. This was a fight that was highlighted by another questionable stoppage. Showtimes had some bad luck with these questionable stoppage. You had the Ramero Barroso fight a few weeks earlier stop prematurely, and now you had Mark Nelson stopping the Adamis Jay Rock Williams fight a little bit early. I had a different vibe to this cory because look, the Baroso stoppage abhorrent like that should never have happened. That was borderline criminal. Was the Williams fight stopped too early? Yes, I believe it was stopped right as Williams was throwing a punch, So I think that's that speaks volumes in and of itself. But you could see where that fight was going, right like you could see that Adamas was landing the heavier shots, was hurting Williams, which is trainer admitted after the fight. You know, did the referee stop the fight three punches too early instead of one punch too early, probably, But this wasn't a fight that I thought was going to end any other way than Carlos Damas winning it.

Be the end for him. How you I'll tell you what you know. I get the sense he wants to keep fighting. I've heard some whispers. I'm sure that he wants to keep going. But there were moments where he was competitive, you know, especially in that second and third round when he rallied after the first round knockdown. But again, look at the caliber of opponent, Joe Kuzmano. All credit to him for winning that fight. That's the same guy two fights earlier that was knocked out in the first round by Daniel Dubois. Uh he was Kusumano was gassed after the first round. If you can't beat someone like that, you shouldn't be in with some of these heavyweight killers that are only going to be looking to fight you because of your name, because of the fact that you can sell tickets in New York City. I hope Adam Kovnowski's got the right people around him that says, look, there are other things we can do. We can train fighters, we can do a whole bunch of different things to make money. Instead of putting your health at risk at a young family shouldn't be fighting. You shouldn't be fighting anywhere ever. Again, the other fight over this past weekend I want to ask you about was the middleweight secondary title which will eventually be the full title Carlos A. Damas Julian J. Rock Williams. This was a fight that was highlighted by another questionable stoppage. Showtimes had some bad luck with these questionable stoppage. You had the Ramero Barroso fight a few weeks earlier stop prematurely, and now you had Mark Nelson stopping the Adamis Jay Rock Williams fight a little bit early. I had a different vibe to this cory because look, the Baroso stoppage abhorrent like that should never have happened. That was borderline criminal. Was the Williams fight stopped too early? Yes, I believe it was stopped right as Williams was throwing a punch, So I think that's that speaks volumes in and of itself. But you could see where that fight was going, right like you could see that Adamas was landing the heavier shots, was hurting Williams, which is trainer admitted after the fight. You know, did the referee stop the fight three punches too early instead of one punch too early, probably, But this wasn't a fight that I thought was going to end any other way than Carlos Damas winning it.

I thought it was either going to end by some kind of violent stoppage or Adamas would have won even wider than he did on the scorecards at the time of the stoppage. Yeah, and you know, I want to be fully transparent here that I've only seen the closing sequence of this fight, because presently Showtime does not have a broadcast or streaming deal in Canada, so when I have to watch the Showtime fights, I mean, I don't know what the statute of limitations is here, but I have to find less than legal means or like get a copy of it after the fact. But I have seen the closing sequence, and I agree with you, Chris, it looked to me like a fight that I mean, there's a big difference between the Barosso stoppage, which is one where you cannot put yourself in the headspace of the referee and how they arrived at that conclusion, and one like the Jay Rock stoppage, where you could see how the referee has seen some things that made him want to stop it a little bit earlier, and yeah, maybe stopped at a punch or two too early, but might have saved a more violent ending.

I thought it was either going to end by some kind of violent stoppage or Adamas would have won even wider than he did on the scorecards at the time of the stoppage. Yeah, and you know, I want to be fully transparent here that I've only seen the closing sequence of this fight, because presently Showtime does not have a broadcast or streaming deal in Canada, so when I have to watch the Showtime fights, I mean, I don't know what the statute of limitations is here, but I have to find less than legal means or like get a copy of it after the fact. But I have seen the closing sequence, and I agree with you, Chris, it looked to me like a fight that I mean, there's a big difference between the Barosso stoppage, which is one where you cannot put yourself in the headspace of the referee and how they arrived at that conclusion, and one like the Jay Rock stoppage, where you could see how the referee has seen some things that made him want to stop it a little bit earlier, and yeah, maybe stopped at a punch or two too early, but might have saved a more violent ending.

I think that there's a big gap between those things.

I think that there's a big gap between those things.

But within that gap, I think there is space to call this, you know, a premature stop page and if you're on Jay Rock side, to have the anger that you do and to think that it should have that it should have continued, but also one where you can look at the refereency.

But within that gap, I think there is space to call this, you know, a premature stop page and if you're on Jay Rock side, to have the anger that you do and to think that it should have that it should have continued, but also one where you can look at the refereency.

Okay, I get how you arrived at this conclusion. Yeah, I'm sure in Mark Nelson's mind he thought he was saving Julian Williams from something far worse, something that was coming, something that he could see coming. You know. Give Jay Rock credit. I mean there was I think it was the fourth round. He just took a savage beating and just rallied from it. But this was going the way of Carlos and Damas, and one way or the other, he was going to win that fight and hopefully, look hopefully a Damas gets elevated to full middleweight title. Older he has been active out there, fighting semi regularly, pretty regular, I should say, while Jamal Charlow has been off waiting for this exact opportunity to come around with Canelo Elfres. I mean, let's be real, why the reason Jamal Charlo is still the WBC Middleweight Champion is because the WBC on September sixteenth wants to say it's the WBC middleweight Champion versus the WBC super middleweight Champion. That's the reason he has not been stripped of that title. I don't want to hear about the WBC being compassionate for all that Charlo's going through. I feel for what Charlo's going through. That doesn't mean you get to hold onto that title indefinitely, especially when a guy like a Damas is out there fighting, winning significant fights. You know, I would wager that come September seventeenth that Carlos A Damas is the full fledged middleweight champion at one point sixty for the WBC, So a good win for him, tough loss for Julian Williams. Speaking of Charlo and that fight coming up against Canelo, we talked a little bit about this last week. In the immediate aftermath of Canelo choosing the deal, the multi fight deal with PBC, Canelo opting for the Charlo fight over one with David Benavitez, and I said at the time, and I stand by it that I'm fine with this fight for Canelo. Charlo is not what he was three years ago. He has not fought in more than two years. His last fight he looked very average Againstjuanmacius Montielle. But he still is undefeated, he still is officially a title holder. He still is a big mouth and a big name that will undoubtedly have a lot to say during the build up to this fight. I just all that being said, I can't say this being competitive. I can't. I mean, maybe Canelo isn't what he once was, but Canelo, this version of Canelo, is still a lot better than this version of Charlo. Because we have not seen Charlo in the last couple of years. When we have seen him, it hasn't looked like he's been in training the entire time. He's been dealing with a lot outside the ring. He's been dealing with injuries that have obviously impacted his career over the last couple of years. I just don't see this being a competitive fight. I don't. I think it's you know, maybe Charlo can go the distance. He's got a good job. Maybe he used that to keep Canelo of him. He'll obviously be up for this fight because it's career defining for him. But Jamal Charlo has not been a high level guy since one p fifty four. You know, he hasn't fought anybody at one Sixty's best win came over Serge Dervinchenko, and that was the dervin Chenko that had gone twenty four rounds with Daniel Jacobs and Gannati Gilofkin. So I don't know, am I wrong? Are you seeing this as a fight that Jamal Charlo can be I don't want to say. Look, the word competitive can be viewed many different ways, but is this the fight Jermal Charlo can win? Let's put it that way.

Okay, I get how you arrived at this conclusion. Yeah, I'm sure in Mark Nelson's mind he thought he was saving Julian Williams from something far worse, something that was coming, something that he could see coming. You know. Give Jay Rock credit. I mean there was I think it was the fourth round. He just took a savage beating and just rallied from it. But this was going the way of Carlos and Damas, and one way or the other, he was going to win that fight and hopefully, look hopefully a Damas gets elevated to full middleweight title. Older he has been active out there, fighting semi regularly, pretty regular, I should say, while Jamal Charlow has been off waiting for this exact opportunity to come around with Canelo Elfres. I mean, let's be real, why the reason Jamal Charlo is still the WBC Middleweight Champion is because the WBC on September sixteenth wants to say it's the WBC middleweight Champion versus the WBC super middleweight Champion. That's the reason he has not been stripped of that title. I don't want to hear about the WBC being compassionate for all that Charlo's going through. I feel for what Charlo's going through. That doesn't mean you get to hold onto that title indefinitely, especially when a guy like a Damas is out there fighting, winning significant fights. You know, I would wager that come September seventeenth that Carlos A Damas is the full fledged middleweight champion at one point sixty for the WBC, So a good win for him, tough loss for Julian Williams. Speaking of Charlo and that fight coming up against Canelo, we talked a little bit about this last week. In the immediate aftermath of Canelo choosing the deal, the multi fight deal with PBC, Canelo opting for the Charlo fight over one with David Benavitez, and I said at the time, and I stand by it that I'm fine with this fight for Canelo. Charlo is not what he was three years ago. He has not fought in more than two years. His last fight he looked very average Againstjuanmacius Montielle. But he still is undefeated, he still is officially a title holder. He still is a big mouth and a big name that will undoubtedly have a lot to say during the build up to this fight. I just all that being said, I can't say this being competitive. I can't. I mean, maybe Canelo isn't what he once was, but Canelo, this version of Canelo, is still a lot better than this version of Charlo. Because we have not seen Charlo in the last couple of years. When we have seen him, it hasn't looked like he's been in training the entire time. He's been dealing with a lot outside the ring. He's been dealing with injuries that have obviously impacted his career over the last couple of years. I just don't see this being a competitive fight. I don't. I think it's you know, maybe Charlo can go the distance. He's got a good job. Maybe he used that to keep Canelo of him. He'll obviously be up for this fight because it's career defining for him. But Jamal Charlo has not been a high level guy since one p fifty four. You know, he hasn't fought anybody at one Sixty's best win came over Serge Dervinchenko, and that was the dervin Chenko that had gone twenty four rounds with Daniel Jacobs and Gannati Gilofkin. So I don't know, am I wrong? Are you seeing this as a fight that Jamal Charlo can be I don't want to say. Look, the word competitive can be viewed many different ways, but is this the fight Jermal Charlo can win? Let's put it that way.

So this is interesting because I think I think I was on here maybe a year and a half ago, maybe before that, and even prior to that, Charlo during that time when Canelo seemed like an absolutely unbeatable monster, and there was there was a period of time and it wasn't that long ago where I looked at the landscape of potential people that Canelo could feasibly fight, and I looked at all the names, and I you know, I was I would say that he would have been a favorite over all of them, but the one name that always jumped out at me as hey, maybe this guy would give him problems. And by the way, I was wrong about I didn't consider Dmitri Bevall, but at the time I always thought that Charlo was one that could give him difficulty, because when I've looked at what is troubled Canelo in the past, you know, you know, set aside in Southpaw stuff lengths a guy that can that can hold his ground the way that people did, the way that Mayweather did. You know Laura didn't do so much of that. But guys who can be powerful and box in the pocket and not con see ground.

So this is interesting because I think I think I was on here maybe a year and a half ago, maybe before that, and even prior to that, Charlo during that time when Canelo seemed like an absolutely unbeatable monster, and there was there was a period of time and it wasn't that long ago where I looked at the landscape of potential people that Canelo could feasibly fight, and I looked at all the names, and I you know, I was I would say that he would have been a favorite over all of them, but the one name that always jumped out at me as hey, maybe this guy would give him problems. And by the way, I was wrong about I didn't consider Dmitri Bevall, but at the time I always thought that Charlo was one that could give him difficulty, because when I've looked at what is troubled Canelo in the past, you know, you know, set aside in Southpaw stuff lengths a guy that can that can hold his ground the way that people did, the way that Mayweather did. You know Laura didn't do so much of that. But guys who can be powerful and box in the pocket and not con see ground.

Uh Galofkin obviously doing that with with that stiff, heavy jab.

Uh Galofkin obviously doing that with with that stiff, heavy jab.

Charlo has those elements and like the best version of Jamal Charlow, I thought at his peak, would have given Canelo a lot of problems. And as this fight gets a little bit closer, I'll probably convinced myself of that once again so that I could get excited about it. But it's hard to ignore the inactivity in the layoff and just looking at how Charlo's life has been over the last couple of years, you know, with the struggles that he has had personally, you know, like it seems to be partying a lot. Not to say that Canelo doesn't have a good time as well, but Charlo seems to be out there a lot more, at least visibly. Then we see a lot of high level fighters, and when you couple all those things in together, you start thinking, well, maybe that is the reason.

Charlo has those elements and like the best version of Jamal Charlow, I thought at his peak, would have given Canelo a lot of problems. And as this fight gets a little bit closer, I'll probably convinced myself of that once again so that I could get excited about it. But it's hard to ignore the inactivity in the layoff and just looking at how Charlo's life has been over the last couple of years, you know, with the struggles that he has had personally, you know, like it seems to be partying a lot. Not to say that Canelo doesn't have a good time as well, but Charlo seems to be out there a lot more, at least visibly. Then we see a lot of high level fighters, and when you couple all those things in together, you start thinking, well, maybe that is the reason.

Why Canelo is taking this fight.

Why Canelo is taking this fight.

Not to know, categorize it as a cherry pick or anything, but there's a reason why he's pretty comfortable taking this fight. And I think that's probably it because the best version of Charlo, the one that I'm imagining, might not be one that he can re establish given.

Not to know, categorize it as a cherry pick or anything, but there's a reason why he's pretty comfortable taking this fight. And I think that's probably it because the best version of Charlo, the one that I'm imagining, might not be one that he can re establish given.

How the past few years have gone for it. Well, if this fight was taking place four years ago, when both these guys were middleway champions, I think it would have been competitive for all the reasons you articulated. Charlo has that excellent jab which has given Canelo problems, whether it's Kennat Klafkin, Sergey Kovlev Dmitri Bievol through a lot of jabs in their fight. That's a weapon that Canelo hasn't quite figured out how to navigate. You know, we all remember the end of the serge Kovolet fight and the spectacular knockout, but up until that point it was pretty competitive. It was a one or two round type of fight. That was because Sergei Kovalev, under the stewardship of Buddy mcgert, through like a thousand jabs in that fight. I thought the twenty nineteen version of Jamal Charlo could have done that. The guy I've seen subsequently. I mean, the last example of Jamal Charlo, the last video we have him was against Wamacies Montiel, who is a journeyman. He's a journeyman and Charlo could not get him out of there. That's the same guy that I think a couple of years earlier, Himan Mungee just pancaked when they faced each other. So four years ago, yeah, would have loved to have seen this fight. Would have been a great fight, both these guys one hundred and sixty pound title holds. But now you have Jamal Charlow, who look, maybe he's saying it for different reasons, but I watched that that Instagram live or whatever it was that he was on with Demetris Andraid and Andreid's like come up to one sixty eight, let's fight, and Charlo's like, no, I never fought at one sixty eight. I'll do it like one sixty three one sixty four. So maybe he's not fully comfortable with fighting at this new weight class, and to do it for the first time against an opponent like Canelo Alvarez, who is sharp. You know, went twelve rounds, but John Ryder wasn't the best of Canelo. But he got that post injury stuff out of the way and now he's back at full strength. I don't know. I think Canelo's gonna find a home for that right hand on the mid section of Charlo's got that really long mid section. I think he's gonna keep him on the back foot for most of the night. I think he'll eventually get to him, and I think he'll eventually stop him. Uh, Charlo's gonna have to do something special, and he's gonna have to keep advancing on Canelo, keep throwing that jab, throw it, you know a lot against Canelo to have an impact where you make Canelo think and change up his game plan and do something maybe a little bit reckless. But even if he does, like you know, Charlot at one fifty four was a big puncher. Charlotte One's sixty has not shown that yet. Uh and at one sixty eight against the guy with one of the best chins in boxing. I just don't see it.

How the past few years have gone for it. Well, if this fight was taking place four years ago, when both these guys were middleway champions, I think it would have been competitive for all the reasons you articulated. Charlo has that excellent jab which has given Canelo problems, whether it's Kennat Klafkin, Sergey Kovlev Dmitri Bievol through a lot of jabs in their fight. That's a weapon that Canelo hasn't quite figured out how to navigate. You know, we all remember the end of the serge Kovolet fight and the spectacular knockout, but up until that point it was pretty competitive. It was a one or two round type of fight. That was because Sergei Kovalev, under the stewardship of Buddy mcgert, through like a thousand jabs in that fight. I thought the twenty nineteen version of Jamal Charlo could have done that. The guy I've seen subsequently. I mean, the last example of Jamal Charlo, the last video we have him was against Wamacies Montiel, who is a journeyman. He's a journeyman and Charlo could not get him out of there. That's the same guy that I think a couple of years earlier, Himan Mungee just pancaked when they faced each other. So four years ago, yeah, would have loved to have seen this fight. Would have been a great fight, both these guys one hundred and sixty pound title holds. But now you have Jamal Charlow, who look, maybe he's saying it for different reasons, but I watched that that Instagram live or whatever it was that he was on with Demetris Andraid and Andreid's like come up to one sixty eight, let's fight, and Charlo's like, no, I never fought at one sixty eight. I'll do it like one sixty three one sixty four. So maybe he's not fully comfortable with fighting at this new weight class, and to do it for the first time against an opponent like Canelo Alvarez, who is sharp. You know, went twelve rounds, but John Ryder wasn't the best of Canelo. But he got that post injury stuff out of the way and now he's back at full strength. I don't know. I think Canelo's gonna find a home for that right hand on the mid section of Charlo's got that really long mid section. I think he's gonna keep him on the back foot for most of the night. I think he'll eventually get to him, and I think he'll eventually stop him. Uh, Charlo's gonna have to do something special, and he's gonna have to keep advancing on Canelo, keep throwing that jab, throw it, you know a lot against Canelo to have an impact where you make Canelo think and change up his game plan and do something maybe a little bit reckless. But even if he does, like you know, Charlot at one fifty four was a big puncher. Charlotte One's sixty has not shown that yet. Uh and at one sixty eight against the guy with one of the best chins in boxing. I just don't see it.

I don't.

I don't.

I don't see the path to victory for Jamal Charlo in a fight like this. Yeah, and Charlo is a he's a very sharp puncher. But you're right. I think there is a question. I mean, the question about can anyone heard Canelo, because you're right, he just has an absolutely granded chin.

I don't see the path to victory for Jamal Charlo in a fight like this. Yeah, and Charlo is a he's a very sharp puncher. But you're right. I think there is a question. I mean, the question about can anyone heard Canelo, because you're right, he just has an absolutely granded chin.

You know. The size discussion is one that's interesting too.

You know. The size discussion is one that's interesting too.

Excuse me, because you know, Jamal, naturally in terms of where they walk around, is bigger than Canelo.

Excuse me, because you know, Jamal, naturally in terms of where they walk around, is bigger than Canelo.

Right, He's taller, he's longer.

Right, He's taller, he's longer.

But also I remember there being like kind of like a YouTube video where Jamal was talking to to Derek James uh and he said, I walk around you know, heavier than you are right now, which said to me that Jamal probably walks around around like one ninety ish. But you know, to your point about him discussing where he's comfortable weighing in at, Canelo has has been a super middle weight now for a little while, and there's a difference between your kind of natural size you walk around weight and what you were athletically comfortable at. And Canelo has become very comfortable as you know, the stocky, muscle bound one sixty eight and so yeah, I think that I would I would predict that he'll handle Charlo's power really that. Yeah, the question is, you know, is Canelo on enough of a slide and can Charlo tap into what do.

But also I remember there being like kind of like a YouTube video where Jamal was talking to to Derek James uh and he said, I walk around you know, heavier than you are right now, which said to me that Jamal probably walks around around like one ninety ish. But you know, to your point about him discussing where he's comfortable weighing in at, Canelo has has been a super middle weight now for a little while, and there's a difference between your kind of natural size you walk around weight and what you were athletically comfortable at. And Canelo has become very comfortable as you know, the stocky, muscle bound one sixty eight and so yeah, I think that I would I would predict that he'll handle Charlo's power really that. Yeah, the question is, you know, is Canelo on enough of a slide and can Charlo tap into what do.

You think do you think do you think is on a slide?

You think do you think do you think is on a slide?

I mean just naturally you know, as an athlete. Yeah, he probably is like declining marginally. That doesn't mean he's on a precipitous decline, right. I think when people hear that, they think that that's some nasty pejorative. But like, of course Canelo is not peeking right now, right, He's on some sort of a decline. The question is can Charlow, who at one point and you know within him has a very special toolbox. This is someone who was an elite fighter is capable of that. Can he make up for those last couple of years. Has he still been able to develop and get a little bit better and can those arcs meet at a place? You know, the Canelo decline and his potential assent. If he's getting better, if he's been able to, can they meet at a place where where Charlo can make this competitive.

I mean just naturally you know, as an athlete. Yeah, he probably is like declining marginally. That doesn't mean he's on a precipitous decline, right. I think when people hear that, they think that that's some nasty pejorative. But like, of course Canelo is not peeking right now, right, He's on some sort of a decline. The question is can Charlow, who at one point and you know within him has a very special toolbox. This is someone who was an elite fighter is capable of that. Can he make up for those last couple of years. Has he still been able to develop and get a little bit better and can those arcs meet at a place? You know, the Canelo decline and his potential assent. If he's getting better, if he's been able to, can they meet at a place where where Charlo can make this competitive.

That's the question. Look at his fights at one sixty, which his careers a middleweight began in twenty seventeen. Horey Hland, he knocked out in the fourth round. Highland, a journeyman, Hugo Centennio knocked out in the second round. That was fine. That's when he won an introversion of the middleway title. Then he goes the distance with Matt Korboff. I thought that fight was a lot closer than some of the scorecards indicate, especially Larry Hazzard's scorecard, which was wild that night. Brandon Adams, he goes the distance with Brandon, obviously a tricky fighter and a lot smaller, so difficult to track down. Dennis Hogan, he knocks out Denshogan really a one fifty four, You know, I didn't think too much of that. Goes the distance with Devin Chenkle, but I thought that was the most impressive win of his run at middleweights, because even though dear Vin Schenko probably wasn't the guy that went twelve with Kalofkin. He he still had I think something left in the tank there. So you know, good win, and that's the one fight that devin Chenko or his team don't contest, like they readily admit they lost that fight. And then you go up to montiel and he beat Montiel wide. But yeah, you know, Montielle is just not all that good. You look at what he's done. You know, previously gets knocked out by Carlos and Damas in his last fight. You know, previous fights gets himI McGee that I mentioned, second round knockout, still a mid level journeyman type guy that that Charlo for whatever reason couldn't get out of there. And I think if he's just gonna he's just gonna have to do something different to be Cano.

That's the question. Look at his fights at one sixty, which his careers a middleweight began in twenty seventeen. Horey Hland, he knocked out in the fourth round. Highland, a journeyman, Hugo Centennio knocked out in the second round. That was fine. That's when he won an introversion of the middleway title. Then he goes the distance with Matt Korboff. I thought that fight was a lot closer than some of the scorecards indicate, especially Larry Hazzard's scorecard, which was wild that night. Brandon Adams, he goes the distance with Brandon, obviously a tricky fighter and a lot smaller, so difficult to track down. Dennis Hogan, he knocks out Denshogan really a one fifty four, You know, I didn't think too much of that. Goes the distance with Devin Chenkle, but I thought that was the most impressive win of his run at middleweights, because even though dear Vin Schenko probably wasn't the guy that went twelve with Kalofkin. He he still had I think something left in the tank there. So you know, good win, and that's the one fight that devin Chenko or his team don't contest, like they readily admit they lost that fight. And then you go up to montiel and he beat Montiel wide. But yeah, you know, Montielle is just not all that good. You look at what he's done. You know, previously gets knocked out by Carlos and Damas in his last fight. You know, previous fights gets himI McGee that I mentioned, second round knockout, still a mid level journeyman type guy that that Charlo for whatever reason couldn't get out of there. And I think if he's just gonna he's just gonna have to do something different to be Cano.

And yeah, which which is the case with everyone who faced like everyone who's facing Canelo basically has to turn in a performance at a level that we've never seen before.