Pamela Anderson and Rabbi Shmuley Boteach Talk About Sex

Published Feb 14, 2019, 1:00 PM

She’s one of the most famous former Playboy playmates in the world...and he’s a renowned Rabbi and spirituality expert. In this interview, Pamela Anderson and Rabbi Shmuley Boteach sit down to talk with Dr. Oz to talk about - you guessed it - sex.  Do you know how to rekindle intimacy and passion in your relationship?

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And we killed sex. We killed it. Could you believe that now? The perception of men is that men are hormonally driven animals who can't control themselves, who don't out of respect women. That's bad for men, obviously, and it's bad for women as well for them to have this perception. So my argument about marriage and returning to this safe place is not to sanitize sex. It's actually deliberate sex. Everyone. I'm Dr Oz and this is the Doctor Os podcast. She is one of the most famous former Playboy playmates in the world, and our playmates are pretty famous, but this one is the top, and he's a renowned rabbi and spiritual expert. Today they are both here. I believe they're not to talk about Well, everyone must have guessed it by now sex. I'm Pamela Anderson and Rabbi Schmooley Botea teaming up unbelievable. Thank you both for being here so slowly. I must admit, as you sat down and you literally doused your coffee with cream, I wondered about all the conversations we've had, and I'm wondering, do you even listen to what I say when I point out health issues I've always believed in rebellion. I've always believed in being the bad boy. And if I listened to you too much, I would sanitize my personality. I would lose all the jagged edges, and I'd be a bore. Your your your background and Jewish values as taking the edge off a lot of arguments, but it's actually sharpened others. And I want to spend some time talking about sex, not in the context of the salacious stuff that gets caught up in the towboys, but why human beings do things they do in of sex and why we don't actually think about it many times the right way. And you've opened my eyes in so many ways to old arguments that actually had lost their potency because they weren't expressed with the vibrant UH language as you often use. So let's talk to me about about the fact that you guys are sort of unlikely pair. And so if I can pick on you for a second, besides the fact that you're as sexy as Pamela, God bless her, is what is it that attracted two of you together? Well, look, this book is written by two people. One is UH, an author and a public person, and the other is an international sex symbol. And I think that many of the books that Pamela has authored are actually very good. What makes us compatible in writing this book, it's it's astonishing that we actually think of humanity in categories as if Pamela is this sex symbol, who would therefore presumably not believe in more traditional sexual mores or relationship mores. And the truth is that we're all the same. We all kind of want the same thing. We all want passion, we all want intimacy. So we were on the same page from the outset. Uh. She believes in passionate monogamy, She believes in marriage. She talks constantly about her parents decades long marriage. It's what she herself probably aspires to. A let her, of course speak for herself. But I'm talking about giving our conversations on the book. But it doesn't always work out that way, and uh, you need a plan B. You try again for another passionate monogamous relationship. But the idea that we don't want that, the idea that we just want to be casual and our intimate activities with almost anyone, the idea that that Hollywood uh fiction is actually real for people's desires. It's not true. Nobody wants that. Nobody wants the loneliness, but nobody wants uh to wake up to a stranger that doesn't know their name. It's just that we think monogamy is a bore. We think that marriage is kind of an institution, and no one wants to be institutionalized. So the better alternative that she and I both work on in this book and that we promote is a marriage where you can swing from the chandeliers. What happened to marriages that are sinful? What happened to marriages that are erotic? And what happened to marriages that are mysterious? We've lost some of the essential ingredients that could make marriage and sex electrifying. The word sensual comes up a lot in the book, and by the way, you know it's it's fascinating because you've talked about the lust for love, which is the title of the book, Kindling intimacy and passion in your relationship. The word love itself sometimes feels tedious to people. It's so valuable, so important to all of us, and yet because of that it becomes ordinary. But sensuality and lust those are different, and then that often interpreted the way you do. Yeah, we both argue, and we both feel that the sexual revolution was that was a bust. I mean, if the one thing, the one thing, the sexual revolution was supposed to give us with sex, and it gave us not bad sex, but it gave us non existent sex. Married couples have sex for seven minutes uh on national average. That's an actual statistic. Yeah, and that's and that's the couple I always joked and then includes the time that the husband spends begging. But but you know that's those those are the couples that are still having sex. And you and I have talked many times about the sexual famine America. For all the couples who are platonic, one out of three American married couples are not having sex at all. By the way, I do a lot of marital counseling, and usually they're coming because they're arguing or financial disagreements or her mother is too involved. Amazingly percent of the time they're also not having sex. They never mentioned that, But maybe they're angry because the mother in laws are all the time. That's why they're not having sex. I mean, the external circumstances could make them not feel like having sex with others in laws there because they're not having sex or Yeah, this lends itself to too many jokes. I'm gonna, I'm gonna. You know, they have this story, this guy who comes to the rabbi and says, you know, my mother in law just died. What's the Jewish law? What do I do with her? The rabb i said, I would create her, bury her, so you can create her, or you can bury and he says, I want, I want first, I want to create it, then I want to burn. Okay, but we okay, because we love our mothers. We do, we do. We love our mothers in law. So um, you may be right, Lisa. There could be all kinds of reasons, but the main reason is that they have no desire. Desire is lost. I'm a great believer in lust. What happened to cosmic lust? What happened to erotic lust? At its course, sex is not about love, It's not about companionship. It is about sheer, raw animal lust. And we have so vulgarized lust, and we have so cheapened lust that it is non existent in our lives. So we must always search for these third party artificial exterior motivations to create lust. Go to a hotel, go go to some Mediterranean club, med vacation. You want to tell me that the average that the average husband his wife takes her clothes off at night or vice versa, and he's watching television, what happened to the that electric magnetism that the body had? And it's almost like we're afraid to ask these questions or we offer these pat simplistic responsive which is what you expect lust to really continue after like four or five years. You expect a man who sees the same body, same breast, same genitalia on a on a nightly basis to still be interested absolutely. Since when do we assume that routine and regularity are the enemies of eroticism? The real enemies of eroticism are different things altogether, which is what we get to into this book. I believe, nice and simple that erotic lust is based on three things mystery, unavailability, and sinfulness and what the take on an iPhone? For example, iPhones are the most successful UH consumer product ever launched because they had those three elements. We learned to lust after a telephone unavailable, you can't buy it when it comes out mysterious. Steve Jobs never talked about what he was working on, always kept the mysterious, and finally sinfulness. This rebellious upstart Apple television commercial at the Super Bowl going up against IBM Big Brother Think Different. They're famous motto, we need rebellious rebelliousness. Once you get it, you're really angry with it and hate it only less after it into it. Then then it freezes on you and and you still it's like your on you. So the sexual revolution actually undid those three principles. It made sex a not unavailable but widely available, which which ironically made us lose interest. Secondly, it removed mystery, and it made everything overly exposed, which again diminished. And finally, I totally disagree with the losing interest with available sex. Ask any eighteen year old boy. They have not it's available, and they have not lost interest. May the fifty year old man, but not the eighteen year old boy. They may have or seek hormonal sex. They're not really interested in the women so much as being pushed by hormones. They're not being drawn to women. They're being pushed by something internal. They're not being pulled from the outside. They're being pushed from the inside, and once those hormones no longer rage, that's when you see these platonic marriages. So, um, if I'm wrong that the sexual revolution, or say, um pornography and and and this kind of openness, as if I'm wrong that it has diminished interest. Why is it that on a porn site you have to click one naked woman and fifty other pictures have to suddenly pop up? Or or so my friends tell me, why is one woman not enough? Why do we need such vast quantity today? Because we're no longer boy is no longer interested in womankind. He's only interested in a kind of woman. And that's why you start having this um uh standardization of female attractiveness. Women are now having to fit into categories of attractiveness, and they're feeling very bad about their bodies. Take for example, how much we insist that women have to lose weight become entirely self conscious about every calorie they consume. Him And I'm not talking about for health reasons the way a moment would argue. I'm talking about for appearances. I love going to the great museums of the world. I love the Prato, and I love the men, and I love the loup, and in all of them, the great masters always painted fleshy, cravaceous women. What happened to them that the male erotic mind just suddenly change? No, it's simple. Back then people used to make love with their hands, and to the hands meat is neat. But now that we make love with our eyes, to the eyes, thin is in. We're very visual age. That's pre Kardashian. Come on, you don't get more curvy, and that is the ideal of beauty today. It's not. It's not totally thin genderly a non feminine think. Think about those Kardashian chicks. Good point. I think the average male to School's point, but has this belief, uh that thinner is better but to stay. And that may be true or not, but I can almost guarantee women. Do you women seem when you get scunier than the guys around them with them to be And that's something entirely different. That's about fashion, not about sex. It's all for men. It's all. You caught me off guard. I ever thought of anything you mentioned sex off by creative thought. I got distracted now you were you were saying another point, I would and not a teenage boy. So I don't know for a fact, but you you said that, um, that this this needing to click multiple women. I think that's biologically driven the male. The male, if you go back thousands of you know, thousands of years in millennia, the male is programmed to inseminate as many women as possible. The man's desire is to multiplicity, not to a single woman. You know, it's trapped into it. Biseex and I've debated some of the world's leading evolutionary biologists, Richard Dawkins or great atheists like uh, um help me, some of the Hitchens, Christians Chris Richards and I you you moderate, You moderated our debate on the afterlife, me and Christian Richards. I've heard the argument that men are basically animals who seek to inseminate as many partners as possible. I actually don't believe that to be true. I think men are intimacy seekers. I think the men who are womanizers wake up and suddenly they feel like they've lost their identity. They want something better. Why do they quote settle down if they're If it's true that marriage is only a social construct and it's nurture, rather than nature. How has it persisted in every culture and every religion and every ethnicity throughout the world. Social anthropology would seem to argue against the man as inseminator, and much more as the man as the domestic partner. The last part with that cave, But first a quick break. Hey, Pamma, how are you. I'm good, I'm glad. I love listening to smoothly he gives me hope, Pama, let me if I can't ask you about why you picked the sex symbol schooley to work with? And what is it about his beard? Is yama? God? Is I love good beard? I loved so? Um Well, it's a funny. Well I met him a few years ago and he just had the best advice, and I told him he should write a book. And then he told me he was so surprised about my um my philosophy that he said I should write a book. And we thought, well, we should write a book together. Would that be funny? So here it is, so share with us a little bit of your advice, because a lot of folks think of your you know, playmate actress uh, a woman who in many ways defined by her sexuality. You have very interesting views that I think the artists love to hear on this podcast. Obviously had the blessing of having you on the show, and so I understand some of your wisdom, But it still is remarkable that you could process it this way. I know, it isn't that funny Sometimes, Well, you know, there's a lot of perception, I guess, a lot of projection and perception that I'm you know, people are the way they are because of whatever the media portrays them as. But we're all human beings, and I think we're all intimacy seecause and we're all ultimately happier when well, I love, and I think we're much stronger in pairs, and especially in this time, I we need to remember that because we have so much that we're facing as a species and as a the world, and I think that it's nice to have somebody else, somebody there to kind of do the checks and balances with us, and to do that is hard work, or at least two acknowledge and be grateful for that other person instead of this very um desensitized kind of time when we think we can do it all for ourselves and and and when I think, I think a lot of these um, kind of gimmicky self healthy things where it was you know me me first, Um I am. If I love myself, I can love other people. I think people are ultimately I think they're they're more depressive, they can't help others. I think that that it's kind of an empathy. It's really really were looking at empathy and in our relationships, but are also in our friendships, in the world and living life romantically, not just in our relationships. Well, when there's a strong sexual relationship tip over and become objectification. Well, there's so much access to you know, imagery and more imprinting ourselves every day with what we look at, we listen to, And I think we have to just do our own checks and balances with ourselves. And it's ry. I know, it's hard to ask somebody else for more attention, and it's hard to, um, you know, to say, look, I'm here, I'm a human being and you'd rather play with the computer or you know, these things are difficult to talk about in our relationship. So I think the only thing we can do, the best thing we can do is just monitor ourselves. Just making me happier. Am I replacing the love in my life? With um, you know, on my on my phone too much, and I on Instagram too much? Am I doing my Instagram full of temptation? And and people that you know, sexual imagery that either I can't live up to as a woman or that I'm interested in men. I just mental fidelity is so is the biggest thing I think that I'm smoothly really ingrained in me. And it really made perfect sense because I think I was struggling with this my whole life. But to really just say, okay, I'm responsible for me. It's all economic control myself. So maybe if I do this, then the other person will do that too. And that kind of goes back to what my father used to tell me. You know, relationship even there and if you're if you're okay with the other person doing what you're doing, then do it. But if you're not, then don't you know you're don't going to kind of thing. Yeah, you didn't hold back in the book about how objectification affected your relationships? Are we able to overcome them? How have you evolved in address your divorce? You know, sometimes that's inevitable and sad situations, but you know, any come, but you know, and I do look back in some of my situations, I probably could have worked through a lot of things, but you can't work through abuse. And sometimes narcissism is not associated past behavior will dispope to you with two and I think we all have those traits, you know, we want to we need to look at that within ourselves. You've got two sons. How do you talk to your boys about healthy relationships? And they've seen witness some of this in your own life, but they're going to be with women some days. The best thing I've taught them is that you don't put up with abuse. And I've also you know, tell them if they disrespect women, they could respect me. Then they go, WHOA, okay mom. You know they would never disrespect their moms. They never disrespect me. And but Brennan had an interesting come back. He said, well, what if they don't respect themselves? And that comes back to we have to respect ourselves and and and just be a good person for that other person and you and try and create good behavior that we can that you can both have. But you really only control yourselves. And like I said, it's difficult to ask somebody else look at me. You know, I want you to look at me. I don't want you to be on the computer. I don't want you to be playing video games. I'd rather you be with me. This is such an unattractive too. So this is what's so great about the book. And Shmanly has great advice about this forbiddness and you know, a little bit of sinfulness and a little bit how to withdraw a little bit, not not to manipulate, but you just to make sure you have your own life and your own interests and how you grow every day, and how you stay kind of relevant, and how we stay interesting in a relationship. And these are all really great, great, great tips from truly who has you know, worked with a lot of people in relationships and marriage counseling. You know, I wish I knew him a long time ago. I've been trying to help smully, but as I can, it's a full time so let me if I can't. I want to take this concept into a broader theater because so much of how we perceive power in the world and celebrity is based around sensuality and we're not even aware of it. And I'll give you two examples, because you've been in news a lot about them. Julia Sangeen and and putting from uh, you know, from the head of Russia, and I see you have friendships with them and you probably have insights into how they see the world. Do you think that there's an element of that in their appeal power? Obviously it's a sexy quality, um, but to use it in in in positive ways is really important. But confident, you know, especially doing he has so much confidence and so much um. He really he knows what he's doing, he believes in what he's doing. He's um, he's just on that path and he's not gonna bere from it. And I think that's a very sexy equality. Is also very courageous, which is another um sexy equality as well. Um, But he's he's just determined. So I yes, of course it's attraction around people to them, but um, I keep said, it's you're not going to agree on everything with everybody, but powerful people are definitely sexy, and they just don't want them to take advantage of that. Putin maybe the most confident man on the planet. And but I'm just so I see that side of it. I'm just curious as they deal with the the turmoil of being in the eye of the needle. Both of them get attacked a lot because they are confident in what they're saying and they have strong opinions and people disagree with them. But in the middle of all this there's an interesting Again I use the word sensuality because because you've been talking about it in the book, But I'm curious if that makes a political leader Donald Trump another example for a lot of people, and may not be the physical embodiment of sensual nous sexuality, but there's something that people like I feel attracted towards, which is part of how I think about what Jewish full you are discussing in the bo Did you see that? Well doesn't mean the confidence is obviously attractive, and and they definitely in politics is you know that everyone needs Johnny Leaves and and of course it's a powerful thing to be able to be a true person in politics or a sexy person to use that. But again, you just you can't take advantage of it. But men are I mean, I hate to say um, but I'm then because that's not very good. But there's a there's a certain um rawness and um maleness like to call it. But you know, i'd probably get in trouble for that um. But that's there's a femaleness, there's a it's like a missing piece of the puzzle if you want someone to be strong, and it's camp it's it's it's the caveman thing. You know. I always learned a caveman to drag me into a cave, and that's proba it's ever going to get there. It's that's pretty much how it's always happened and how that could. But yes, so I think that's the primitive kind of touches something you know within us that it feels like, okay, there they know what this thing are there, you know, as it's sometimes when you feel lost, you want something to gravitate towards. And I think that's even but you know, that's what's religion, that's with community, that's with those sorts of things and gangs of both young bids that are you know, don't have parents, they're searching for some kind of belongingness. And I think it just it just catches in all of our all the places that we which which you've improved our point even more that we need each other, we need a relationship too, so we don't fall into the trappings of all these other things that could go wrong for us. So morely, just a comment on that, and I'm gonna talk about the big idea what makes some of these people who are so prominent worldwide attractive to a lot of folks. And that was pointing the importance of confidence that almost makes the process a bit more sensual that Julia Solnge and Vladimir Putin and Donald Trump, they have their truth, they're speaking firmly in its defense and from people criticize them. Did they derive benefit from that? Well? I actually see sensuality in a slightly different way. I think sexuality. Um uh. It captures this idea of muscularity and strength and power. And Henry kissing Her famously said that power is the ultimate effort diziac. And that's what Pamela's referring to about this this confidence, which is sexy, but sensuality evokes a certain vulnerability and an ability to show uh, to not to be strong enough to show weakness, to be strong enough to evoke forgiveness and uh, and to work with those who see things very differently to you. Um yeah, Donald Trump takes it on the chin. A heck of a lot, but then he'll suddenly surprise people and uh, he'll show a certain tenderness to parents who have lost children in a terrible Parkland shooting, and people will want him to follow through with gun restrictions, etcetera. But capture that moment for a second and people don't expect that, and that kind of makes news because we do want to see a certain sensuality in our leaders. I think Putent probably takes a different tech he maybe he feels that that that kind of show of emotion, uh may not play to his people. But well, we're trying to say I think in this book is that the sexual there, all the muscularity, the flex the flexing of muscle, it hasn't always worked, and there's a certain sensuality by which men and women connect and we're not a sensual age. And that means to take Pamela for example. Here you have Pamela speaking, you know, very insightfully about relationships. But she's known to the world as this very beautiful and attractive woman and we started speaking. I was amazed, Uh, you know, intelligence was a given, but but her insights what she had learned along the way, because we we kind of take it for granted that celebrity is a is a red carpet life's style where you're just jet setting from place to place, but you're not absorbing, you're not processing, you're not filtering. But Pamela was doing all of those things. And I knew that any book that we wrote would be utterly incomplete without the power of our insights. That's a sensual thing, not a sexual thing. And and our our society is not sufficiently sensual. And I think women especially are looking for sensuality, and I think they are more drawn today to the sensual men. The last word to come after the break. So again the title of the book, lust for Love, rekindling intimacy and passion in your relationship. Talking to Pamela Anderson Rabbi Bota, so just to follow up on this theme, because if we're living in a society but we don't have enough sensuality, and then we start talking about becoming best friends, which both of you feel strongly about in the book, is a problem. Historically, when I was growing up, our political leaders were trying to be our best friends. Now they're not. They're prutiness, not trying to be your best friend. I don't think Donald Trump has the best friend, so you know, ironically, it's going to the opposite direction, Pamela, it would seem that we're looking for things beyond best friendship. And I wonder why that is. Is Is it because we have a sexual feminine and we're lusting for love, And of course you want to be friends, but if you want to be wild, passionate lovers too, that makes us feel alive and creative and and and vulnerable and all those wonderful things. Um, I don't I sometimes I joke I'm not your friend. No, I'm not sure. I'm not your buddy. I don't want to be spoken to ang. I don't want to be I don't want to be in that category in our in our relationship. I want to see I want this, you know, I want the romance. I want to um to be the girl and I do believe. I used to always say, but this is you know. I used to say, if you were the more masculine you are, the more seminent I can be. I didn't even know what I was talking about, but I kind of thought he's more masculine. But like what Smoothie says, it's I didn't mean exactly caveman. But there has to be essentiality underlying it, because they're only way to be a good lover is to be brave and to be vulnerable and to get to know somebody. And I think this is where all these multiple partners and the experiences and the sexual revolution and tims I know from the who are depressed and they regret it. They regret regret those experiences because it's it's it takes a great person to fall in love and to feel back to layers and especially with secress to everything. You don't have to you don't have to put your heart on a line because you can just break blessing right and I'll go to another city or get you know, this world is so small and it's not like you used to be where what's smaller communities and we find somebody into the love with them forever, like my parents for instance. Um So I think that's we have to just you never want that frame to burn out. And I was going to be you know, ups and downs and you ride the wave of a relationship in the stressful time. Tis time to be there and and be by someone's side and the other way around, and to constantly invoke the relationship with Finn and sexy things. I think it's what makes it exciting. I mean that you want every day to feel like the first day. I know that's hard to do, but yeah, it is hard to do. But the part of the reason I think it's hard to do, and again I love your thoughts on this, is because we have an environment where people get abused by doing the things that make them vulnerable or make them, uh feel brave because other people don't see it that way. And then we have you know, the me Too movement where a lot of bad stuff is being exposed, but then people don't know where to draw the line. And especially when it comes to sexuality and sensuality, when you want a little bit of that animalistic tension in a relationship, it's hard to harness that so perfectly that you never cross the line. In Sweden, it's very it's a very progressive place. Well, you know, there's certain things, but there's you know, you can if you can really really careful, and it's paralyzing. And the girls I know from that said, look, man, don't first move anymore here on I said, that's no, that's terrible, because they're so afraid of crossing the line and it's been so ingrained and then not to be aggressive. And part of that is okay, I guess we just have to communicate and be communicated the pendulum most wing. And you know, I had to have this conversation with my sons, who how I said, I know you're passionate romantic boys, and you just, you know, you have to be careful to make sure somebody is really that you're you're you're really communicating with someone and you're staying in his relationships and and being you know, monogamous and and and getting to know that person and finding where those lines are because you have to be careful. Well that's a very good point moment, So let's just delve into this. You know, briefly, I only get through the horrible New York winters through two things. I love. Skiing is like little hills. You can't go to the big mountains the New York. But fireplace. I love a real fire. Now, if you have a fireplace, you can put as many logs in as you want, and you can burn it to the highest infernal like heat as long as it's in the fireplace. Sex is the same. You're asking where to draw the lines. The mistake we made in society is that we didn't put sex in the context of a committed relationship where people could be completely sexually liberated, to do anything and everything consensual to each other that gave pleasure and that was exciting. Instead, we we had all of this in relationships that were undefined. It was not the fireplace. We didn't know how hot could it be? What move could I make? And we killed sex. We killed it. Could you believe that now? The perception of men is that men are hormonally driven uh, animals who can't control themselves and don't out of respect women. That's bad for men, obviously, and it's bad for women as wealth threat for them to have this perception. So my argument about marriage and returning to this safe place is not to sanitize sex. It's actually to liberate sex. Let's remember why sex is so pleasurable. Sex is the most pleasurable of all human activities because it is the most liberating. The one thing nobody wants is to be incarcerated. Nobody wants to be jailed, nobody wants to be restrained. Sex is where you put yourself on autopilot. You surrender to raw animal impulse and that can only happen when there's intimacy and trust and purging relationships. Of those things actually made sex mechanical to methodical, to predictable and too scary, and we're having really, really bad sex. And the fact that couples would rather watch TV at night than have sex, go to a movie on a Saturday night than have sex. Sex is really something you kind of watch other people do in an exciting way in some great Hollywood film instead of having it yourself. Um, And it's kind of sad, and we have to we have to rescue it because it is the glue that actually it's the adhesive that keeps the masculine and the feminine always bent in towards each other, and it's what keeps the marriages going. So give me example of how you create the right kind of mystery for the when it's in a safe place. And then what does society do when you've to your point, killed marriage. I'd rather killed sex because marriage itself isn't what it used to be. Okay, that's a great question. Let me give a very simple answer. Our perception, especially because of the very tragic me to actions, um, is that men are out of control, libidinous, hormonal creatures. And women you know, they love sex too, but not as much men are out of control. The truth is women are much sexier than men. They're much more sexually driven than men. They are much more um their fantasies are so much more elaborate. It's just that they understand that sex should have an intimate component. So we know from many studies that when men have these wives have these incredible fantasies about strangers, about other men. But the average wife would never disclose those fantasies to her husband. She will sanitize her fantasy libido because she wants to never hurt her husband. She doesn't know if his frail, fragile, masculine ego can handle it. So one of the things I first advocate is and and and Pam alluded to. This is a sinful marriage. That doesn't mean adultery efercus. Adultery is a devastatingly um uh. It's so painful, and it's so dishonest, and it's so immoral. But wives should be revealing their sexual fantasies to their husbands, and husbands should create that safe space where they can where a woman's full libido could be on full display. So you now have the husband who has to pursue his wife sexually in order to fully retain her again because she can't be fully possessed. Because a woman's libido is it's a it's a whole universe. Take for example that in the Hebrew language, we don't have a word for wife. The word is woman. It's you know, Sarah is the woman of Abraham, and Rebecca is the woman of Isaac, and Rachel is the woman of Jacob. Because you never really marry, you never fully become a wife. And yet women today are playing this this charade where they're trying to show their husband, no, I'm only into you. It's not true. We choose to be a monogamist. That's a beautiful thing. But in terms of the need to be to be pursued and chased and seduced on the twentieth year of your marriage, as in the twentieth date is still ever present, and we forget that. Watch you. Why can't they be called the wife? Why don't they abra to become a wife, Because the wife means that you now belong to someone, and you belong and you're you're naturally you naturally fit into the exclusivity of a monogamous relationship, and for no woman is that true. Women have an incredible libido and their husbands have to satisfy it constantly by understanding just how sexual they really are, as opposed to the Victorian sanitized model that we have today, where we're looking at of guys as being so crazy about sex and the women, yeah, they kind of like it too, but not as much as ment. That's that's a lie, pama. Do you agree? I agree? I agree. I think it's important for men to understand that they need to pursue their wife or the woman what do you want to call it them, um constantly Because there's some great examples in the book too that Schmorely points out. It's not his counseling sessions where you know, a woman was not getting any attention to my husband and she finds herself, you know, somebody at a grocery store of you know, um saying something about her nails and her getting her nails done, and go into the grocery store a lot. You know, a simple, simple, tiny thing like that. We all want to be pursued and admired and we have to keep doing that in relationships them. What what was the epiphany in your life when did you realize that that you needed to change the where you perceived yourself in relationships? Who? Yes, wow, Well I know my I had. I was raised by wonderful, wild, fun women. You know my mother, it's very colorful, my great aunt, my anti bi um, always sending the table, always having to a beautiful experience when you went to their health And it wasn't about money or anything. It was just about living a very i veful life with what when we and we had a lot and it was really and so I really that's why I feel and when I see some of these girls, and I know I've been in relationships where people have had daughters and I have starlet people's father, and I feel like I want to be that person in their life where I can show them how fun, be sexy, to be a good mom, you can have a great career, and you know you have to be lighthearted about a lot of it and just how fun with it and to be took to be an example and the people's lives was important to me. And because I had that, so I knew from a very young age I had when I was young that were very traumatic to me sexually, and I found with Playboy, I took my power back in a big way. And I looked back, and I see how I did that. I didn't realize at the moment. I was trying to overcome the painful of shyness that was, you know ingrained in me. That was just paralyzing. I hated. It also really talks about sharing the fantasies. I think a lot of women read erotica and just get that language in there and there and start writing stories and writing poetry and and just you can start talking like that or speaking like that in an explicit explicit way, but just to get those romantic words in your mouth and just to and you never regret it. You never fail. Even if you fail, it's funny and it's sexy. So it's just be grave enough to be It's latter. We say, if somebody else can, I can do it. Somebody else has done it, I can. This is what I think we can discuss ourselves to be more creative and have fun. Was like, And let me just add that's the passionate component component. The intimate component is as important because our our book is all about passion and intimacy. Eyes open sex one of the hardest things that a couple can do when we make love. Studies show that women cannot climax unless they close their eyes. And the joke is that Jewish women close their eyes because God forbid they should see their husbands having a good time. But sorry for all the Jewish people out there, but we close our eyes for the same reason that we look at the numbers on an elevator as we go to, like the tenth floor. What did you think and you have to watch six eight nine? Did you think the elevator was gonna take a left turn and you're gonna end up in Topeka? You know, we we look at the numbers because we're in too confined to space. It's too intimate, and we don't want a stranger peering into our soul. But when you make love to your spouse, so the person that you're living with, even then you close your eyes. You don't want someone to appear into your soul. It's so much easier to get physically naked that it is to get emotionally naked, So we close our eyes because it's too honest. That's how distant we are, even when we're flesh pressed against flesh and bone of one bone, eyes open. Sex is electrifying and you can actually feel a current that passes between the two of you. It takes a lot of practice because it's it's so uh, it's so raw, it's so naked. But what it does is it leads not just to the to the orchestration of two halves as a whole physically, be the orchestration that two has as a whole spiritually. And yet couples don't even do these things. And there's so many exercises that could lead to this, this passionate electric charge that we deny ourselves. And by the way, turn the television off while you're making love him watching and thinking, but I haven't seen this episode of Homeland. It just doesn't, you know, Pamela Anderson. Rabbi Shmuley Bote. On that note, thank you very much to beautiful book. Lust for Love is out to pick it up, share it, don't read it while you're having sex. But Harry sexual God bless you both. Thank you. M

AMERICA'S DOCTOR: The Dr. Oz Podcast

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