Well, my next guest is not only a Paralympic champion, but she's one of Australia's strongest voices when it comes to disability rights and inclusion. Carnie Ladell is a former world record holding swimmer. She represented Australia at multiple Paralympic Games and she also captained the national swim team at the two thousand Sydney Games. And since she retired from the sport, Carne has led the charge when it comes to the change that we knew we needed, especially on how Australia supports people with disability, and she's helped host rallies that also brought on the NDIS and later she became our Queensland and dis Ambassador overseeing the role out across the state. And she sent me a text after she saw the video that went up on the four PC socials with some of the comments I made earlier this week, and so it makes sense to have her join us to talk about this latest shakeup, this idea of what the reforms could look like and remember who it is that these processes were put in place for and who really rely on it.

Well, my next guest is not only a Paralympic champion, but she's one of Australia's strongest voices when it comes to disability rights and inclusion. Carnie Ladell is a former world record holding swimmer. She represented Australia at multiple Paralympic Games and she also captained the national swim team at the two thousand Sydney Games. And since she retired from the sport, Carne has led the charge when it comes to the change that we knew we needed, especially on how Australia supports people with disability, and she's helped host rallies that also brought on the NDIS and later she became our Queensland and dis Ambassador overseeing the role out across the state. And she sent me a text after she saw the video that went up on the four PC socials with some of the comments I made earlier this week, and so it makes sense to have her join us to talk about this latest shakeup, this idea of what the reforms could look like and remember who it is that these processes were put in place for and who really rely on it.

On afternoons, Nice to talk to you Kennie.

On afternoons, Nice to talk to you Kennie.

Oh hi, Sophie, thank you.

Oh hi, Sophie, thank you.

Yeah, absolute pleasure.

Yeah, absolute pleasure.

So thanks for doing that the other day.

So thanks for doing that the other day.

So I really was lovely to see someone that's embodied.

So I really was lovely to see someone that's embodied.

Speaking about, you know.

Speaking about, you know.

Us people with disabilities, because sometimes it feels like it's just us, you know, we're always the ones fighting, and it gets very tiring for us, especially when we're in it. Like I'm a participant as well, so I'm in the fight of it and very worried and very scared for what's about to happen, and so Cannie.

Us people with disabilities, because sometimes it feels like it's just us, you know, we're always the ones fighting, and it gets very tiring for us, especially when we're in it. Like I'm a participant as well, so I'm in the fight of it and very worried and very scared for what's about to happen, and so Cannie.

I guess you know, I feel like I don't really need to even ask too many questions here. I know that there are stuff that you just want to be able to share. And what I tried to make the point of earlier in the week is I guess you take a step back from it as somebody who is able bodied and who doesn't participate in the scheme and is a taxpayer, And I think to myself, I was really excited for people with disability to have an opportunity to have resources available to them to help them live full and independent lives. You know, there is no Australian who doesn't hear that and go absolutely, we're on board. I think what's happened then is through mismanagement, through poor policy.

I guess you know, I feel like I don't really need to even ask too many questions here. I know that there are stuff that you just want to be able to share. And what I tried to make the point of earlier in the week is I guess you take a step back from it as somebody who is able bodied and who doesn't participate in the scheme and is a taxpayer, And I think to myself, I was really excited for people with disability to have an opportunity to have resources available to them to help them live full and independent lives. You know, there is no Australian who doesn't hear that and go absolutely, we're on board. I think what's happened then is through mismanagement, through poor policy.

I mean, I guess a whole bunch of different things.

I mean, I guess a whole bunch of different things.

We find ourselves in a place where the unfortunate reality is too many headlines are telling us NDS is out of control. There are people ruling the system, and I want to bring it back to you and the people you represent. You need to be in the room to tell us what works and what doesn't, why it's been allowed to get to this point, and how we fix it and fix it quickly.

We find ourselves in a place where the unfortunate reality is too many headlines are telling us NDS is out of control. There are people ruling the system, and I want to bring it back to you and the people you represent. You need to be in the room to tell us what works and what doesn't, why it's been allowed to get to this point, and how we fix it and fix it quickly.

Yeah, that's a big question. Look, eight years ago my son has ate.

Yeah, that's a big question. Look, eight years ago my son has ate.

That's why I know how long ago it was when the NDIS became I guess, like in Queensland rolling it out. Prior to that, someone like me, and now I'm forty six, I've been to say it in forty six years, I was never eligible for any supports and services from the government, state or federal. So before the NDIS came in, someone like me who wasn't eligible or didn't you know, could not possibly live off the discillity support pension. And nobody can live off it. It's like five hundred dollars a week or whatever it is, and.

That's why I know how long ago it was when the NDIS became I guess, like in Queensland rolling it out. Prior to that, someone like me, and now I'm forty six, I've been to say it in forty six years, I was never eligible for any supports and services from the government, state or federal. So before the NDIS came in, someone like me who wasn't eligible or didn't you know, could not possibly live off the discillity support pension. And nobody can live off it. It's like five hundred dollars a week or whatever it is, and.

Therefore I've always worked.

Therefore I've always worked.

But that meant that I was never eligible in Queensland. So I was like fifty thousand people in Queensland prior to the NDIS that were eligible for support and services like support workers for example, or cares. Now that meant that someone like me, who obviously would have needed help like cleaners and support workers, it was never in my wheelhouse that I could ever have that in my life because without the Disability Support pension, I wasn't eligible. And even if I was, then I would have to wait for to say, Blue Care or whoever it is. I'm not picking on Blue Care, but whoever it was that had the state government contracts would then send out a care to my unit whenever they could, so I would have to be in bed, you know, like any I'm waiting for a care.

But that meant that I was never eligible in Queensland. So I was like fifty thousand people in Queensland prior to the NDIS that were eligible for support and services like support workers for example, or cares. Now that meant that someone like me, who obviously would have needed help like cleaners and support workers, it was never in my wheelhouse that I could ever have that in my life because without the Disability Support pension, I wasn't eligible. And even if I was, then I would have to wait for to say, Blue Care or whoever it is. I'm not picking on Blue Care, but whoever it was that had the state government contracts would then send out a care to my unit whenever they could, so I would have to be in bed, you know, like any I'm waiting for a care.

I didn't know who it was.

I didn't know who it was.

Could be anyone with a kid, could be a male, could be a female. They may not show up and they would come out between nine and three.

Could be anyone with a kid, could be a male, could be a female. They may not show up and they would come out between nine and three.

And that's how it used to happen back in the day.

And that's how it used to happen back in the day.

And someone like me also that has really expensive wheelchairs, So my wheelchairs were it's like thirty grand and if anything happens to my chair, which happens regularly with any technology, or if you get bigger or you know, a corner Spracire wheelchair for example, that's at least one thousand dollars a time, or around about six weeks to six months to a year to get another wheelchair.

And someone like me also that has really expensive wheelchairs, So my wheelchairs were it's like thirty grand and if anything happens to my chair, which happens regularly with any technology, or if you get bigger or you know, a corner Spracire wheelchair for example, that's at least one thousand dollars a time, or around about six weeks to six months to a year to get another wheelchair.

So even if you've got.

So even if you've got.

The money and no one has thirty five grand at their fingertips, then we were always waiting. And again I couldn't even get I wasn't eligible for those sort of things. And my parents, who are now seventy two, they would come down from the Sunshine Coast and clean my unit for me back before the NDIF, and my friends would take it in terms, take my rubbish out, things like factause I've always lived independently in unit away from my parents since the age of nineteen.

The money and no one has thirty five grand at their fingertips, then we were always waiting. And again I couldn't even get I wasn't eligible for those sort of things. And my parents, who are now seventy two, they would come down from the Sunshine Coast and clean my unit for me back before the NDIF, and my friends would take it in terms, take my rubbish out, things like factause I've always lived independently in unit away from my parents since the age of nineteen.

Struggled. But when I became pregnant with my son.

Struggled. But when I became pregnant with my son.

And couldn't walk and couldn't transfer and couldn't drive, I needed support and the NDIS was out and it was actually rolling out, so that's the first time that I was able to access support workers. And if I had to try now to say, for example, tomorrow, that was taken away from me.

And couldn't walk and couldn't transfer and couldn't drive, I needed support and the NDIS was out and it was actually rolling out, so that's the first time that I was able to access support workers. And if I had to try now to say, for example, tomorrow, that was taken away from me.

The way the price guide works.

The way the price guide works.

And this is really hard to explain quickly, but the way the price guide works right now, if everyone wants to figure out why everything's so expensive to go to a psychiatrist or an ot, it's because the NDIS Price Guide has pushed everything to that level.

And this is really hard to explain quickly, but the way the price guide works right now, if everyone wants to figure out why everything's so expensive to go to a psychiatrist or an ot, it's because the NDIS Price Guide has pushed everything to that level.

So if you want to get a support worker in Australia.

So if you want to get a support worker in Australia.

Right now, you're paying sixty two dollars an hour minimum, up to one hundred and ten dollars an hour on Sundays, and that changes according to the time.

Right now, you're paying sixty two dollars an hour minimum, up to one hundred and ten dollars an hour on Sundays, and that changes according to the time.

So do you think about someone.

So do you think about someone.

That's a quadriplegic or someone that needs really big support to be able to live independently and actually not be in hospital. And the reason we brought in the NDIS is because it was way more expensive to have people like myself and don't forget people like myself that would be considered the quadriplegic. So all four ins are infected. There's only four percent of us in the NDS. Four percent of the NDIS distance have a severe physical.

That's a quadriplegic or someone that needs really big support to be able to live independently and actually not be in hospital. And the reason we brought in the NDIS is because it was way more expensive to have people like myself and don't forget people like myself that would be considered the quadriplegic. So all four ins are infected. There's only four percent of us in the NDS. Four percent of the NDIS distance have a severe physical.

Disability sounny for it shouldn't be that here.

Disability sounny for it shouldn't be that here.

Yeah, no, So I've got a couple of questions straight away. One, you talked about the fact that when you first sort of went on the NDS. You said there were some fifty odd thousand people in Queensland who were benefiting from the scheme, right.

Yeah, no, So I've got a couple of questions straight away. One, you talked about the fact that when you first sort of went on the NDS. You said there were some fifty odd thousand people in Queensland who were benefiting from the scheme, right.

And I sorry, I fickt a thousand people that are benefiting on the Queensland state far okay to the end for of the NDA before the INNDOS.

And I sorry, I fickt a thousand people that are benefiting on the Queensland state far okay to the end for of the NDA before the INNDOS.

Now it's probably one hundred thousand, one.

Now it's probably one hundred thousand, one.

Hundred and fifty five kearneye one hundred and fifty five thousand who were benefiting from the scheme as far as I'm aware in Queensland as of March of this year.

Hundred and fifty five kearneye one hundred and fifty five thousand who were benefiting from the scheme as far as I'm aware in Queensland as of March of this year.

Plan Yeah, one hundred and eleven thousand.

Plan Yeah, one hundred and eleven thousand.

That's definitely way too many. That wasn't in the treasury at all, No, and in the budget, no.

That's definitely way too many. That wasn't in the treasury at all, No, and in the budget, no.

And so, and one hundred and eleven thousand of that one hundred and fifty four thousand, and I'm talking about Queensland alone are receiving support for the first time.

And so, and one hundred and eleven thousand of that one hundred and fifty four thousand, and I'm talking about Queensland alone are receiving support for the first time.

So I think again, since since you were a.

So I think again, since since you were a.

Part of it at the beginning when their plan was and the promise was made to look after people like you, is part of the issue here that we are lumping people who need assistance in some way and putting them in the NDS scheme when maybe there should be an alternate way of supporting them. Because you're right, the prices for services have continued to climb, and because it's supply and demand and everyone's trying to make a buck. So the physiotherapist who can just push it up a little bit more because it's the NDIS, seems to have been doing that.

Part of it at the beginning when their plan was and the promise was made to look after people like you, is part of the issue here that we are lumping people who need assistance in some way and putting them in the NDS scheme when maybe there should be an alternate way of supporting them. Because you're right, the prices for services have continued to climb, and because it's supply and demand and everyone's trying to make a buck. So the physiotherapist who can just push it up a little bit more because it's the NDIS, seems to have been doing that.

They're talking about addressing that. I think that's low hanging fruit.

They're talking about addressing that. I think that's low hanging fruit.

We've got the issue of third parties, so people who are either managing ndies for people, they're skimming a bit, they're taking a bit off the top. We've got then these other services that have come into being, most of them outside of the area where the people are living who are providing these services.

We've got the issue of third parties, so people who are either managing ndies for people, they're skimming a bit, they're taking a bit off the top. We've got then these other services that have come into being, most of them outside of the area where the people are living who are providing these services.

You talk about the hourly rate for a health worker.

You talk about the hourly rate for a health worker.

I know people who've worked in the system in that care role who are completely unqualified.

I know people who've worked in the system in that care role who are completely unqualified.

And getting paid sixty six dollars an hour.

And getting paid sixty six dollars an hour.

Yeah, and when I say sixty six dollars an hour, I don't mean so if you then work for the Blue care you're probably getting about thirty dollars an hour, right, that is self managed clients if we pay directly. But what happens is the Genie's out of the bottle?

Yeah, and when I say sixty six dollars an hour, I don't mean so if you then work for the Blue care you're probably getting about thirty dollars an hour, right, that is self managed clients if we pay directly. But what happens is the Genie's out of the bottle?

Right, So how do I then?

Right, So how do I then?

How does anyone afford a care the NDIS goes away?

How does anyone afford a care the NDIS goes away?

How does anyone afford a physio?

How does anyone afford a physio?

So if I go to a physio that's an NDIS registered or that they know that. So, for example, if I go to Sporting Reeli's Spinal Lives Sir and Pausy League, I'm paying one hundred and ninety dollars for a physio, or two one hundred dollars if I go to Victor pop Off at Queensland Sports.

So if I go to a physio that's an NDIS registered or that they know that. So, for example, if I go to Sporting Reeli's Spinal Lives Sir and Pausy League, I'm paying one hundred and ninety dollars for a physio, or two one hundred dollars if I go to Victor pop Off at Queensland Sports.

Medicine Center, He's one of the best physios in the world.

Medicine Center, He's one of the best physios in the world.

You don't pay that, right, you pay one hundred and ten eighty dollars for a physio. So the price guide is a problem because what's happening is the price guide to support someone like me who needs to be able to access support workers.

You don't pay that, right, you pay one hundred and ten eighty dollars for a physio. So the price guide is a problem because what's happening is the price guide to support someone like me who needs to be able to access support workers.

Now, not because of because I'm a mother and the world isn't accessible.

Now, not because of because I'm a mother and the world isn't accessible.

So there's not a playground in Brisbane I can go to that is accessible to me.

So there's not a playground in Brisbane I can go to that is accessible to me.

So therefore I can't take my son anywhere.

So therefore I can't take my son anywhere.

The karate everything's upstairs, even his school is up three flights of stairs.

The karate everything's upstairs, even his school is up three flights of stairs.

So therefore, what was supposed to happen with the NDIS was is.

So therefore, what was supposed to happen with the NDIS was is.

That we were supposed about his utilized support workers to get around and do life to the point where the world would catch up, Brisbane would catch up, Queensland would catch up.

That we were supposed about his utilized support workers to get around and do life to the point where the world would catch up, Brisbane would catch up, Queensland would catch up.

I wouldn't need a support.

I wouldn't need a support.

Worker because you could get around yourself, because.

Worker because you could get around yourself, because.

I'd be able to get around across the road.

I'd be able to get around across the road.

So there's a problem there.

So there's a problem there.

But also what's also happened is people think that the NDIS is paying for all of it.

But also what's also happened is people think that the NDIS is paying for all of it.

It's not. It's only paying for me.

It's not. It's only paying for me.

To utilize support workers, wheelchairs, repairs and maybe some sort of housing situation.

To utilize support workers, wheelchairs, repairs and maybe some sort of housing situation.

The issue is if you give people.

The issue is if you give people.

This self manage or whatever it is amount of money, it's a lot of money. As you can imagine, it would be around two hundred and fifty thousand to a million dollars to support people because of the price guy. So the price guide isn't low hanging fruit. But I don't know how they could possibly turn it back around because service providers, they have been in.

This self manage or whatever it is amount of money, it's a lot of money. As you can imagine, it would be around two hundred and fifty thousand to a million dollars to support people because of the price guy. So the price guide isn't low hanging fruit. But I don't know how they could possibly turn it back around because service providers, they have been in.

Those rooms and I've been in those rooms.

Those rooms and I've been in those rooms.

Don't forget For the last fifteen years i've heard service rosens. Is not me bashing them, but those service devises. I don't go to Cerverral Palsy League, for example, to get my support workers, and I go on Mabel and get them directly and pay them that money. Therefore, Server Palsy doesn't get any money. Like the business goes under. So they go to the government and they say we're going under.

Don't forget For the last fifteen years i've heard service rosens. Is not me bashing them, but those service devises. I don't go to Cerverral Palsy League, for example, to get my support workers, and I go on Mabel and get them directly and pay them that money. Therefore, Server Palsy doesn't get any money. Like the business goes under. So they go to the government and they say we're going under.

We can't keep the lights on.

We can't keep the lights on.

So then the state government's still funds, they bult fund them.

So then the state government's still funds, they bult fund them.

Then they get other funding, and we've got more people working at Distillity.

Then they get other funding, and we've got more people working at Distillity.

Services Queens and now than when I shut it. We shut it down eight years ago because it was supposed to go federal. There's a lot of things going on here that people don't really understand, and I really want people to understand it because I can't handle people talking about.

Services Queens and now than when I shut it. We shut it down eight years ago because it was supposed to go federal. There's a lot of things going on here that people don't really understand, and I really want people to understand it because I can't handle people talking about.

Us as if we're fraudsters.

Us as if we're fraudsters.

No, not any of this is going well, not going well for us because we also can't get jobs.

No, not any of this is going well, not going well for us because we also can't get jobs.

Mate still can't get work.

Mate still can't get work.

It all makes it really hard because I want to be not having support workers in my life because it's really full on, but I can't because I have I'm a mom and I need to be able to get around and all that stuff.

It all makes it really hard because I want to be not having support workers in my life because it's really full on, but I can't because I have I'm a mom and I need to be able to get around and all that stuff.

So everyone's going to start being truthful that.

So everyone's going to start being truthful that.

None of us can be because the NDIS has said to me at least three times.

None of us can be because the NDIS has said to me at least three times.

Sophie on the phone recorded that the.

Sophie on the phone recorded that the.

NDIS is not here to pay for me to be a mother. So that is disgusting because what is it supposed to be paying for? What to wipe my bum took me in the shower? Do they want me to lie? So they're pushing us into situations to lie for our three goals that we have to have. You don't have these three goals if you're not walking around going I want to be an independent another, I want to have a job, I want.

NDIS is not here to pay for me to be a mother. So that is disgusting because what is it supposed to be paying for? What to wipe my bum took me in the shower? Do they want me to lie? So they're pushing us into situations to lie for our three goals that we have to have. You don't have these three goals if you're not walking around going I want to be an independent another, I want to have a job, I want.

To participate in the community. That is not your goals.

To participate in the community. That is not your goals.

Your goals, i'm guessing, would be to be successful, to be happy.

Your goals, i'm guessing, would be to be successful, to be happy.

To travel. I can't say that any more of the NDAs. Yeah, that's what I was supposed to about to say, That's what I thought.

To travel. I can't say that any more of the NDAs. Yeah, that's what I was supposed to about to say, That's what I thought.

For now they want me to say these really condescending things. And I can tell you now psychologists and psychiatrists and GPS that's the reason why we've got forty percent of the NDIS with ASD or neurodivergence level two and not level one, because they know if they say level one ASD for their child, they.

For now they want me to say these really condescending things. And I can tell you now psychologists and psychiatrists and GPS that's the reason why we've got forty percent of the NDIS with ASD or neurodivergence level two and not level one, because they know if they say level one ASD for their child, they.

Will not get the support. Yeah, which our data is skewed.

Will not get the support. Yeah, which our data is skewed.

We do have an issue with that, There's no doubt about it. And I've said before and I don't know. I don't have a lived experience with the autism spectrum with a child, and I have no doubt that they require therapy. I just don't know whether or not the I don't Yeah, I just don't think the NDIS is necessarily the place, you know. I don't know whether or not we should have looked at a different option. I will ask you. I mean, you're right. And I've said this before and I'll say it again. The promise of the NDIS was to support people like you with disability so that you would have greater choice and control over your own life, not so that someone would come and wipe your bump. And I think that the frustration that you must feel as someone who has walked down this path has to be the stories you hear about the people who are doing the wrong thing, who are taking advantage of the ability to be able to have stuff paid for them that they would be capable of looking after themselves and that they don't necessarily need, but because they can, they do so. I guess my final question and we are out of time. Is what changes would you like to see to make it stronger and make it sustainable not just for participants like you, but also for the good people I know who are also working and supporting people inside the NDIS every day, and.

We do have an issue with that, There's no doubt about it. And I've said before and I don't know. I don't have a lived experience with the autism spectrum with a child, and I have no doubt that they require therapy. I just don't know whether or not the I don't Yeah, I just don't think the NDIS is necessarily the place, you know. I don't know whether or not we should have looked at a different option. I will ask you. I mean, you're right. And I've said this before and I'll say it again. The promise of the NDIS was to support people like you with disability so that you would have greater choice and control over your own life, not so that someone would come and wipe your bump. And I think that the frustration that you must feel as someone who has walked down this path has to be the stories you hear about the people who are doing the wrong thing, who are taking advantage of the ability to be able to have stuff paid for them that they would be capable of looking after themselves and that they don't necessarily need, but because they can, they do so. I guess my final question and we are out of time. Is what changes would you like to see to make it stronger and make it sustainable not just for participants like you, but also for the good people I know who are also working and supporting people inside the NDIS every day, and.

There are plenty of great people and anyone that understands what it's like to be an autistic person level three at all, people like myself who's an electric wheelchair.

There are plenty of great people and anyone that understands what it's like to be an autistic person level three at all, people like myself who's an electric wheelchair.

We're supposed to be.

We're supposed to be.

A really small group, and if it's not a really small group, there's something wrong. There is never going to be a massive group and there shouldn't be, so for the government to say it should be really easy to put their eyes on people like me because there should only be a very small group of us.

A really small group, and if it's not a really small group, there's something wrong. There is never going to be a massive group and there shouldn't be, so for the government to say it should be really easy to put their eyes on people like me because there should only be a very small group of us.

So look at us first.

So look at us first.

Because the really severely disabled people are spending we've got obviously a certain big budget, but we're the ones that you can save the money on quickly because you know who we are. You should know who we are, and if you don't, you should have your eyes on us, and if not, look at us and all the reports. I spent last year ten thousand dollars on reports me to get my supports renewed for another year. Someone like me, I'm forty six, I'm degenerative because I'm also aging as well as just being disabled and aging, I'm not going to get any better. Therefore, don't waste your money. The ten thousand dollars comes out of the NDAs asking people without limbs or people with ASD level three don't waste money on reports.

Because the really severely disabled people are spending we've got obviously a certain big budget, but we're the ones that you can save the money on quickly because you know who we are. You should know who we are, and if you don't, you should have your eyes on us, and if not, look at us and all the reports. I spent last year ten thousand dollars on reports me to get my supports renewed for another year. Someone like me, I'm forty six, I'm degenerative because I'm also aging as well as just being disabled and aging, I'm not going to get any better. Therefore, don't waste your money. The ten thousand dollars comes out of the NDAs asking people without limbs or people with ASD level three don't waste money on reports.

You'll save a lot of money there because your disability.

You'll save a lot of money there because your disability.

What you're saying is your disability is not going to vanish, as won't. Donald's who doesn't have a leg, like he doesn't need to keep reminding him he doesn't have a leg.

What you're saying is your disability is not going to vanish, as won't. Donald's who doesn't have a leg, like he doesn't need to keep reminding him he doesn't have a leg.

It's still not it's not going to go back.

It's still not it's not going to go back.

And it's the amount of money.

And it's the amount of money.

And also if we start looking at ways to make Brison more accessible, then people like me can.

And also if we start looking at ways to make Brison more accessible, then people like me can.

Stop spending that sort of money too. So there's two things.

Stop spending that sort of money too. So there's two things.

But also the price guy and the service provider is being truthful.

But also the price guy and the service provider is being truthful.

Well, look, I'm so happy to have given you a voice.

Well, look, I'm so happy to have given you a voice.

I knew that I was just going to let you run. It's like it's like a racehorse, she's off.

I knew that I was just going to let you run. It's like it's like a racehorse, she's off.

It's really really scary for someone like me to have to say things about being a mother.

It's really really scary for someone like me to have to say things about being a mother.

Federal government agency This is really tough for us, and it's really scary.

Federal government agency This is really tough for us, and it's really scary.

And if you take it away from me and anyone like me, obviously there's a lot more people worse off than I am. We will have to go back to our aging parents.

And if you take it away from me and anyone like me, obviously there's a lot more people worse off than I am. We will have to go back to our aging parents.

My parents can no longer do that, Sophie. I've got no.

My parents can no longer do that, Sophie. I've got no.

One I know, Cannie look and that's why, as I said, I was pleased to be able to let you have the voice that you need to continue to have for yourself and for others that you look after. In that we didn't get a chance to talk about Brisbane and the Games, because I know Paralympics will hopefully be an opportunity for us to be more inclusive as a city and all of those things that you.

One I know, Cannie look and that's why, as I said, I was pleased to be able to let you have the voice that you need to continue to have for yourself and for others that you look after. In that we didn't get a chance to talk about Brisbane and the Games, because I know Paralympics will hopefully be an opportunity for us to be more inclusive as a city and all of those things that you.

Talked about and all those jobs.

Talked about and all those jobs.

I am in big trouble. You should see the way they're looking at me. I've got a zip to a commercial break. We'll talk again. That was Cannie Ladell ndis advocate and also participant in this

I am in big trouble. You should see the way they're looking at me. I've got a zip to a commercial break. We'll talk again. That was Cannie Ladell ndis advocate and also participant in this