Nancy Grace and Sheryl McCollum discuss the complexities of Brian Kohberger's murder trial, focusing on the recent decision for a change of venue. They explain how this impacts both the prosecution and the defense, and why such a move could be critical in preventing appeals. Nancy and Sheryl also share personal experiences from past murder trials, adding context to the challenges and emotional toll that legal proceedings take on victims' families, prosecutors, and even witnesses. 

Show Notes:
(0:00) Welcome! Nancy and Sheryl introduce this week’s crime roundup   
(0:10) Latest on the Bryan Kohberger murder trial 
(1:00) The challenges of venue changes 
(6:30) International media's impact on the case 
(10:00) Fred Tokars case 
(14:00) Scott Peterson trial and other challenges
(15:00) The consequences of moving a trial 
(18:00) Nancy shares insights on the Duke Lacrosse case 
(21:00) Kohberger’s defense strategy under scrutiny
(22:30) Trial Delays and family reactions  

---

Nancy Grace is an outspoken, tireless advocate for victims’ rights and one of television's most respected legal analysts. Nancy Grace had a perfect conviction record during her decade as a prosecutor. She is the founder and publisher of CrimeOnline.com, a crime- fighting digital platform that investigates breaking crime news, spreads awareness of missing people and shines a light on cold cases. 

In addition, Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, a daily show hosted by Grace, airs on SIRIUS XM’s Triumph Channel 111 and is downloadable as a podcast on all audio platforms - https://www.crimeonline.com/

Connect with Nancy: 

X: @nancygrace

Instagram:@thenancygrace

Facebook: @nancygrace

Sheryl “Mac” McCollum is an Emmy Award winning CSI, a writer for CrimeOnLine, Forensic and Crime Scene Expert for Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, and a CSI for a metro Atlanta Police Department. She is the co-author of the textbook., Cold Case: Pathways to Justice. 

Connect with Sheryl:

Email: coldcase2004@gmail.com

X: @ColdCaseTips

Facebook: @sheryl.mccollum

Nancy Grace and Sheryl McCollum discuss the complexities of Brian Kohberger's murder trial, focusing on the recent decision for a change of venue. They explain how this impacts both the prosecution and the defense, and why such a move could be critical in preventing appeals. Nancy and Sheryl also share personal experiences from past murder trials, adding context to the challenges and emotional toll that legal proceedings take on victims' families, prosecutors, and even witnesses. 
Show Notes:
<ul>
<li aria-level="1">(0:00) Welcome! Nancy and Sheryl introduce this week’s crime roundup   </li>
<li aria-level="1">(0:10) Latest on the Bryan Kohberger murder trial </li>
<li aria-level="1">(1:00) The challenges of venue changes </li>
<li aria-level="1">(6:30) International media's impact on the case </li>
<li aria-level="1">(10:00) Fred Tokars case </li>
<li aria-level="1">(14:00) Scott Peterson trial and other challenges</li>
<li aria-level="1">(15:00) The consequences of moving a trial </li>
<li aria-level="1">(18:00) Nancy shares insights on the Duke Lacrosse case </li>
<li aria-level="1">(21:00) Kohberger’s defense strategy under scrutiny</li>
<li aria-level="1">(22:30) Trial Delays and family reactions  </li>
</ul>
---
Nancy Grace is an outspoken, tireless advocate for victims’ rights and one of television's most respected legal analysts. Nancy Grace had a perfect conviction record during her decade as a prosecutor. She is the founder and publisher of CrimeOnline.com, a crime- fighting digital platform that investigates breaking crime news, spreads awareness of missing people and shines a light on cold cases. 
In addition, Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, a daily show hosted by Grace, airs on SIRIUS XM’s Triumph Channel 111 and is downloadable as a podcast on all audio platforms - <a href="https://www.crimeonline.com/">https://www.crimeonline.com/</a>
Connect with Nancy: 
X:<a href="https://twitter.com/nancygrace?lang=en"> @nancygrace</a>
Instagram:<a href="https://www.instagram.com/thenancygrace/?hl=en"> @thenancygrace</a>
Facebook:<a href="https://www.facebook.com/NancyGraceOfficial"> @nancygrace</a>
Sheryl “Mac” McCollum is an Emmy Award winning CSI, a writer for CrimeOnLine, Forensic and Crime Scene Expert for Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, and a CSI for a metro Atlanta Police Department. She is the co-author of the textbook., Cold Case: Pathways to Justice. 
Connect with Sheryl:
Email: coldcase2004@gmail.com
X:<a href="https://mobile.twitter.com/coldcasetips"> @ColdCaseTips</a>
Facebook:<a href="https://www.facebook.com/sheryl.mccollum/"> @sheryl.mccollum</a>

Work a cold case alongside investigator Sheryl “Mac” McCollum, Director of the Cold Case Investigative Research Institute. Every week, Sheryl dives into her cold case files alongside accomplished guests to look for clues into unsolved murders, missing people, and more. This ain’t just a podcast but a war room. Sheryl opens her cold case files, her heart and her little black book! You will quickly realize Zone 7 is not a place but a lifestyle!

Work a cold case alongside investigator Sheryl “Mac” McCollum, Director of the Cold Case Investigative Research Institute. Every week, Sheryl dives into her cold case files alongside accomplished guests to look for clues into unsolved murders, missing people, and more. This ain’t just a podcast but a war room. Sheryl opens her cold case files, her heart and her little black book! You will quickly realize Zone 7 is not a place but a lifestyle!

Zone 7 with Sheryl McCollum

9.13.24 CRU with Nancy Grace: Change Of Venue For The Bryan Kohberger Murder Trial

https://api.omny.fm/orgs/e73c998e-6e60-432f-8610-ae210140c5b1/clips/97be12fc-9a4f-4270-a99b-b1e800f33405/transcript

Dr. Katherine Ramsland is a professor of forensic psychology at DeSales University. Dr. Ramsland has written over 70 books and appeared in more than 200 crime documentaries. Her work includes interviews with notorious criminals, including BTK (Dennis Rader).

Tracy Ullman: A documentary producer and director, Tracy has worked on numerous true-crime series for Discovery and PBS. She is best known for her work on John Wayne Gacy: Devil in Disguise and her recent book with Dr. Ramsland, The Serial Killer's Apprentice.

Resources:

How to catch a killer

The Mind of a Murderer: A glimpse into the darkest corners of the human psyche, from a leading forensic psychiatrist

John Wayne Gacy: Devil in Disguise

The Serial Killer's Apprentice

In this episode of Zone 7, Crime Scene Investigator, Sheryl McCollum, sits down with Dr. Katherine Ramsland and Tracy Ullman, two crime experts who have spent years investigating and documenting the case of Elmer Wayne Henley Jr., the infamous accomplice to serial killer Dean Corll. Together, they explore the complexities of Henley's involvement, his eventual decision to stop Corll, and the psychological and emotional manipulation that Wayne faced as a young teenager.

Wayne himself, joins Zone 7 as a special guest to provide personal insight into his mindset during his time with Corll. Wayne shares his story, from being groomed and manipulated into participating in heinous crimes to his ultimate decision to kill Corll to prevent further murders.

Show Notes:
(0:00) Welcome back to Zone 7 with Crime Scene Investigator, Sheryl McCollum  
(0:20) Sheryl introduces guest, Dr. Katherine Ramsland to Zone 7
(2:00) Sheryl introduces second guest, Tracy Ullman to Zone 7
(3:00) Tracy introduces surprise guest, Elmer Wayne Henley to Zone 7
(5:10) Meeting Dean Corll 
(5:20) "The first thing he said to me was an obscene joke, so I won't repeat it, but it made me feel like, hey, I'm part of this, I'm part of this group." 
(7:45) The blurred line between victim and apprentice 
(10:30) Wayne's future plans derailed
(11:30) Dr. Ramsland discusses the term ‘Murdar’ for victim selection
(13:50) Tracy speaks on building trust with Wayne  
(17:00) Wayne talks about the grooming process
(19:10) Attempting to join the Navy to escape
(24:00) Turning point - Wayne describes the moment he decided to end Corll's killing spree
(30:30) Tracy’s Methodology
(34:00) Correcting the narrative
(36:00) Who Was Dean Corll?
(37:10) “Young people have absolutely nothing in common with an adult. And when they spend time with you, when they make it seem like they do have, it's all a lie.”
(38:00) Advice for younger people from Wayne
(43:10) “I have to accept that any child, because that's what I was, any child could be manipulated given the right buttons were pushed and Dean pushed all my buttons.” -E.W.H
Thanks for listening to another episode! If you’re loving the show and want to help grow the show, please head over to Itunes and leave a rating and review! 

---

Sheryl “Mac” McCollum is an Emmy Award winning CSI, a writer for CrimeOnLine, Forensic and Crime Scene Expert for Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, and a CSI for a metro Atlanta Police Department. She is the co-author of the textbook., Cold Case: Pathways to Justice. Sheryl is also the founder and director of the Cold Case Investigative Research Institute, a collaboration between universities and colleges that brings researchers, practitioners, students and the criminal justice community together to advance techniques in solving cold cases and assist families and law enforcement with solvability factors for unsolved homicides, missing persons, and kidnapping cases.  

Social Links:
Email: coldcase2004@gmail.com
Twitter: @ColdCaseTips
Facebook: @sheryl.mccollum
Instagram: @officialzone7podcast

Dr. Katherine Ramsland is a professor of forensic psychology at DeSales University. Dr. Ramsland has written over 70 books and appeared in more than 200 crime documentaries. Her work includes interviews with notorious criminals, including BTK (Dennis Rader).
Tracy Ullman: A documentary producer and director, Tracy has worked on numerous true-crime series for Discovery and PBS. She is best known for her work on John Wayne Gacy: Devil in Disguise and her recent book with Dr. Ramsland, The Serial Killer's Apprentice.
Resources:
<a href="https://www.amazon.com/How-Catch-Killer-Capturing-Notorious/dp/1454939370">How to catch a killer</a>
<a href="https://www.amazon.com/Mind-Murderer-glimpse-forensic-psychiatrist/dp/1472268202">The Mind of a Murderer: A glimpse into the darkest corners of the human psyche, from a leading forensic psychiatrist</a>
<a href="https://www.imdb.com/title/tt14111774/">John Wayne Gacy: Devil in Disguise</a>
<a href="https://www.amazon.com/Serial-Killers-Apprentice-Katherine-Ramsland/dp/1613164955">The Serial Killer's Apprentice</a>
In this episode of Zone 7, Crime Scene Investigator, Sheryl McCollum, sits down with Dr. Katherine Ramsland and Tracy Ullman, two crime experts who have spent years investigating and documenting the case of Elmer Wayne Henley Jr., the infamous accomplice to serial killer Dean Corll. Together, they explore the complexities of Henley's involvement, his eventual decision to stop Corll, and the psychological and emotional manipulation that Wayne faced as a young teenager.
Wayne himself, joins Zone 7 as a special guest to provide personal insight into his mindset during his time with Corll. Wayne shares his story, from being groomed and manipulated into participating in heinous crimes to his ultimate decision to kill Corll to prevent further murders.
Show Notes:
<ul>
<li aria-level="1">(0:00) Welcome back to Zone 7 with Crime Scene Investigator, Sheryl McCollum  </li>
<li aria-level="1">(0:20) Sheryl introduces guest, Dr. Katherine Ramsland to Zone 7</li>
<li aria-level="1">(2:00) Sheryl introduces second guest, Tracy Ullman to Zone 7</li>
<li aria-level="1">(3:00) Tracy introduces surprise guest, Elmer Wayne Henley to Zone 7</li>
<li aria-level="1">(5:10) Meeting Dean Corll </li>
<li aria-level="1">(5:20) "The first thing he said to me was an obscene joke, so I won't repeat it, but it made me feel like, hey, I'm part of this, I'm part of this group." </li>
<li aria-level="1">(7:45) The blurred line between victim and apprentice </li>
<li aria-level="1">(10:30) Wayne's future plans derailed</li>
<li aria-level="1">(11:30) Dr. Ramsland discusses the term ‘Murdar’ for victim selection</li>
<li aria-level="1">(13:50) Tracy speaks on building trust with Wayne  </li>
<li aria-level="1">(17:00) Wayne talks about the grooming process</li>
<li aria-level="1">(19:10) Attempting to join the Navy to escape</li>
<li aria-level="1">(24:00) Turning point - Wayne describes the moment he decided to end Corll's killing spree</li>
<li aria-level="1">(30:30) Tracy’s Methodology</li>
<li aria-level="1">(34:00) Correcting the narrative</li>
<li aria-level="1">(36:00) Who Was Dean Corll?</li>
<li aria-level="1">(37:10) “Young people have absolutely nothing in common with an adult. And when they spend time with you, when they make it seem like they do have, it's all a lie.”</li>
<li aria-level="1">(38:00) Advice for younger people from Wayne</li>
<li aria-level="1">(43:10) “I have to accept that any child, because that's what I was, any child could be manipulated given the right buttons were pushed and Dean pushed all my buttons.” -E.W.H</li>
<li aria-level="1">Thanks for listening to another episode! If you’re loving the show and want to help grow the show, please head over to Itunes and leave a rating and review! </li>
</ul>
---
Sheryl “Mac” McCollum is an Emmy Award winning CSI, a writer for CrimeOnLine, Forensic and Crime Scene Expert for Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, and a CSI for a metro Atlanta Police Department. She is the co-author of the textbook., Cold Case: Pathways to Justice. Sheryl is also the founder and director of the Cold Case Investigative Research Institute, a collaboration between universities and colleges that brings researchers, practitioners, students and the criminal justice community together to advance techniques in solving cold cases and assist families and law enforcement with solvability factors for unsolved homicides, missing persons, and kidnapping cases.  
Social Links:
<ul>
<ul>
<li aria-level="1">Email: <a href="mailto:coldcase2004@gmail.com">coldcase2004@gmail.com</a></li>
<li aria-level="1">Twitter: <a href="https://mobile.twitter.com/coldcasetips">@ColdCaseTips</a></li>
<li aria-level="1">Facebook: <a href="https://www.facebook.com/sheryl.mccollum/">@sheryl.mccollum</a></li>
</ul>
</ul>
<ul>
<li aria-level="1">Instagram: <a href="https://www.instagram.com/officialzone7podcast/?img_index=1">@officialzone7podcast</a></li>
</ul>

The Serial Killer's Apprentice | The Story of Elmer Wayne Henley Jr.

https://api.omny.fm/orgs/e73c998e-6e60-432f-8610-ae210140c5b1/clips/efce298a-ef3a-4b9a-ac95-b1e6012c47d2/transcript

Get the latest in breaking crime news, trial coverage, and more, every hour on the hour. Hosted by Nancy Grace and the CrimeOnline team. Follow the 'Crime Alert Hourly Update' now on your favorite podcast app and be among the first to get the latest crime news as it happens: https://link.chtbl.com/XACfgnUG

Eight unsealed warrants are giving new insights into the investigation of Sade Robinson’s murder. A confidential informant tells investigators in early March, Anderson spoke of a plan to lure Sade Robinson to his home

Get the latest in breaking crime news, trial coverage, and more, every hour on the hour. Hosted by Nancy Grace and the CrimeOnline team. Follow the 'Crime Alert Hourly Update' now on your favorite podcast app and be among the first to get the latest crime news as it happens: <a href="https://link.chtbl.com/XACfgnUG">https://link.chtbl.com/XACfgnUG</a>
Eight unsealed warrants are giving new insights into the investigation of Sade Robinson’s murder. A confidential informant tells investigators in early March, Anderson spoke of a plan to lure Sade Robinson to his home

Introducing “Crime Alert Hourly Update”

https://api.omny.fm/orgs/e73c998e-6e60-432f-8610-ae210140c5b1/clips/9260aa5d-5c52-45a2-a426-b1e600e2e2c2/transcript

Today, Nancy and Sheryl discuss the heart-wrenching case of Madeline Soto.

The Orange County Sheriff’s Office said Madeline’s body was found off Hickory Tree Road at about 4:30 p.m. on March 1. Police found the body after someone called in a tip, following a press conference.

The discovery was in the area where her mother’s boyfriend, Stephan Sterns, had been spotted earlier in the week when he stopped to change a tire, police said.

Sterns claimed that he dropped Madeline off at school the day she vanished, but Orange County Sheriff John Mina said that wasn’t true and that “she was already dead at the time and that Stephan Sterns moved her body in the early morning hours on that day.

Sheryl and Nancy dissect critical aspects of the investigation, from the disturbing behavior of the suspect, to the patterns of negligence and abuse within Maddie’s household.

They also focus on the importance of recognizing red flags and patterns in such cases, and the role of evidence in bringing justice.

Show Notes:
(0:00) Welcome! Nancy and Sheryl introduce this week’s crime roundup   
(0:45) Madeline Soto Case
(3:30) The unsettling actions of the mother's boyfriend, Stefan Stearns 
(4:00) Nancy gives examples of felony murders 
(6:00) Madeline’s mother’s neglagence  
(8:30) The Timeline of events surrounding Madeline’s birthday party
(13:00) Conflicting statements  
(15:00) Marshaling evidence - building a case 
(18:00) The brutality of the autopsy  

---

Nancy Grace is an outspoken, tireless advocate for victims’ rights and one of television's most respected legal analysts. Nancy Grace had a perfect conviction record during her decade as a prosecutor. She is the founder and publisher of CrimeOnline.com, a crime- fighting digital platform that investigates breaking crime news, spreads awareness of missing people and shines a light on cold cases. 

In addition, Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, a daily show hosted by Grace, airs on SIRIUS XM’s Triumph Channel 111 and is downloadable as a podcast on all audio platforms - https://www.crimeonline.com/

Connect with Nancy: 

X: @nancygrace

Instagram:@thenancygrace

Facebook: @nancygrace

Sheryl “Mac” McCollum is an Emmy Award winning CSI, a writer for CrimeOnLine, Forensic and Crime Scene Expert for Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, and a CSI for a metro Atlanta Police Department. She is the co-author of the textbook., Cold Case: Pathways to Justice. 

Connect with Sheryl:

Email: coldcase2004@gmail.com

X: @149zone7

Facebook: @sheryl.mccollum

Today, Nancy and Sheryl discuss the heart-wrenching case of Madeline Soto.
The Orange County Sheriff’s Office said Madeline’s body was found off Hickory Tree Road at about 4:30 p.m. on March 1. Police found the body after someone called in a tip, following a press conference.
The discovery was in the area where her mother’s boyfriend, Stephan Sterns, had been spotted earlier in the week when he stopped to change a tire, police said.
Sterns claimed that he dropped Madeline off at school the day she vanished, but Orange County Sheriff John Mina said that wasn’t true and that “she was already dead at the time and that Stephan Sterns moved her body in the early morning hours on that day.
Sheryl and Nancy dissect critical aspects of the investigation, from the disturbing behavior of the suspect, to the patterns of negligence and abuse within Maddie’s household.
They also focus on the importance of recognizing red flags and patterns in such cases, and the role of evidence in bringing justice.
Show Notes:
<ul>
<li aria-level="1">(0:00) Welcome! Nancy and Sheryl introduce this week’s crime roundup   </li>
<li aria-level="1">(0:45) Madeline Soto Case</li>
<li aria-level="1">(3:30) The unsettling actions of the mother's boyfriend, Stefan Stearns </li>
<li aria-level="1">(4:00) Nancy gives examples of felony murders </li>
<li aria-level="1">(6:00) Madeline’s mother’s neglagence  </li>
<li aria-level="1">(8:30) The Timeline of events surrounding Madeline’s birthday party</li>
<li aria-level="1">(13:00) Conflicting statements  </li>
<li aria-level="1">(15:00) Marshaling evidence - building a case </li>
<li aria-level="1">(18:00) The brutality of the autopsy  </li>
</ul>
---
Nancy Grace is an outspoken, tireless advocate for victims’ rights and one of television's most respected legal analysts. Nancy Grace had a perfect conviction record during her decade as a prosecutor. She is the founder and publisher of CrimeOnline.com, a crime- fighting digital platform that investigates breaking crime news, spreads awareness of missing people and shines a light on cold cases. 
In addition, Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, a daily show hosted by Grace, airs on SIRIUS XM’s Triumph Channel 111 and is downloadable as a podcast on all audio platforms - <a href="https://www.crimeonline.com/">https://www.crimeonline.com/</a>
Connect with Nancy: 
X:<a href="https://twitter.com/nancygrace?lang=en"> @nancygrace</a>
Instagram:<a href="https://www.instagram.com/thenancygrace/?hl=en"> @thenancygrace</a>
Facebook:<a href="https://www.facebook.com/NancyGraceOfficial"> @nancygrace</a>
Sheryl “Mac” McCollum is an Emmy Award winning CSI, a writer for CrimeOnLine, Forensic and Crime Scene Expert for Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, and a CSI for a metro Atlanta Police Department. She is the co-author of the textbook., Cold Case: Pathways to Justice. 
Connect with Sheryl:
Email: coldcase2004@gmail.com
X:<a href="https://mobile.twitter.com/coldcasetips"> @149zone7</a>
Facebook:<a href="https://www.facebook.com/sheryl.mccollum/"> @sheryl.mccollum</a>

9.6.24 CRU with Nancy Grace: Patterns of Negligence and Abuse, Maddie Soto Case

https://api.omny.fm/orgs/e73c998e-6e60-432f-8610-ae210140c5b1/clips/35facf08-1866-44d1-88bc-b1e200e507f2/transcript

9.13.24 CRU with Nancy Grace: Change Of Venue For The Bryan Kohberger Murder Trial

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