Explicit

#113 Jason Flom with Herman Atkins

Published Feb 5, 2020, 5:12 AM

Herman Atkins was a disciplined student athlete who enjoyed refurbishing old cars, growing up in the rigid household of a California highway patrolman. On January 25th, 1986, Herman Atkins was paying an auto mechanic for an engine rebuild when an armed robber stepped to the 2 men, grabbed the cash, and fled on foot. Herman grabbed the mechanic’s gun and chased the robber, firing warning shots into the air. The robber turned a corner, and Herman heard more gunshots. When he got to the corner, there were cop cars, and several people had been wounded by gunshots, including 2 police officers. Herman ditched the gun and retreated.

On April 8th, 1986, Herman Atkins is in Texas for the birth of one of his children, when an armed man entered a strip mall shoe store in Lake Elsinore, CA, forced the 23 year old female clerk to perform oral sex on him, ejaculated, leaving semen on her sweater, and stole $130 in cash and the clerk’s jewelry. When authorities caught up with Herman in November of that year while he was visiting family in Phoenix, AZ, Herman was finally made aware that he was wanted for both the January 25th incident and the Lake Elsinore kidnapping, robbery, and rape.

After multiple cross racial eyewitness misidentifications, a jailhouse snitch seeking leniency, and both police and prosecutorial misconduct, Herman was wrongfully convicted, sentenced to 47 years and 8 month in prison, and shunned by his father. After hitting the law books in prison and gaining the support of the Innocence Project, the semen stained sweater was tested for DNA, excluding and exonerating Herman. Despite this and his civil litigation victories, Herman was not truly whole again until mending the rift caused by what he describes as his father’s treason against the father-son relationship.

You can delve deeper into Herman’s story through the documentary “After Innocence” or in his book “Wrongfully Convicted, Rightfully Committed: The Reincarnation of Herman Atkins After 12 Years in Prison,” available soon wherever books are sold. He is also available for speaking engagements on the topics of judicial reform, the aftermath of exoneration, as well as his own story.

https://www.wrongfulconvictionpodcast.com/with-jason-flom

Wrongful Conviction is a production of Lava for Good™ Podcasts in association with Signal Co. No1.

On January in south central Los Angeles, Herman Atkins, a disciplined student athlete who enjoyed refurbishing low rider Chevy's, was paying a local mechanic for an engine rebuild when a robber snatched the money and took off on foot. Herman grabbed the mechanics gun and chased the robber, firing warning shots into the air. The robber turned a corner and Herman heard more gunshots. When he reached the corner, he happened upon another crime scene. There were cop cars and people wounded, and Herman, frightened, ditched the gun and retreated. After blanketing the area and questioning the mechanic, police wanted Atkins in connection with the shooting and wounding of three people, including two police officers, something Herman would be totally unaware of until authorities caught up with him while he was visiting family and Phoenix in November of that year. Fingerprints on the gun found at the crime scene did not match Herman, but with two newborn sons and prosecutors promising a guilty verdict and terribly long sentence if he went to trial, Herman pled no contest to the charges in exchange for a lighter sentence, but this was just the beginning. On April eighth, while Herman Atkins, this picture was being circulated by police in connection with the January incident, an armed man forced a twenty three year old store clerk into the back room of her shop to perform world sex on him in Lake Elsinore, California, a city Herman had never visited. During the rape, the assailant ejaculated and wiped his semen on her sweater, evidence that would later clear Herman's name. The armed robber and rapist fled with a hundred thirty dollars in cash and the victim's jewelry. The victim and two other store clerks in the strip Mall identified Herman as the assailant from his circulating wanted poster. With the prosecution relying on this ultimately mistaken eyewitness identification, an incentivized jailhouse snitch, and misleading prology five, Herman was sentenced to forty seven years plus eight months for a crime he did not commit. This is wrongful conviction with Jason Flamm Welcome back to wrongful conviction everyone. Today you're going to hear a story that has so many layers, so many twists and turns. It's a story that includes mistaken eyewitness identification, bad forensics, police misconduct, and in the end of the day, what it's got is redemption and forgiveness of a type that we have never covered and I've never heard of before. So I hope you're settled in because this is going to be an amazing ride. And uh, and with me is the star of our show, Herman Atkins. So Herman, welcome to the the Wrongful Conviction. Thank you for having me. And like I always say, I'm I'm sorry you're here, but I'm glad you're here. Yeah, yeah, you know. It's Uh, it's been an interesting journey down a long road. It certainly has. And it all started on the morning of April six, a long time ago. Six. That's the year the Mets won the World Series. That's how long ago that is, um, And I'll just set the stage right. So, sometime around eleven thirty in the morning, a thin, young black man wearing a dark jacket, rebox shoes, and a gold ring went into a shoe store Lake Elson, or California, which coincidentally happens to be places you've never been to. We'll get into that. And he pretended to be interested in some merchandise and then he, being an only customer story, pulled a handgun and forced the clerk to perform moral sex on him, threatened to kill it a horrible crime, horrible crime. During the rape, the assailant ejaculated and he left his seamen on her sweater, so there was plenty of evidence to go on. And he took a hundred and thirty dollars, making it a robbery and a rape. He also took her engagement ringing another ring, so her sweater was preserved as evidence. And that's when things get really crazy, right, because you would seem like a very unlikely guy to be a suspect in this crime or any crime. And that's because of your stepfather. He was a highway patrol officer California, California Highway Patrol officer out of the Torrents Division. He raised me. He raised me in such a way. I grew up in a regiment type upbringing, where there was rules, there were structures, there was high expectations, and there was a lot of pride from him as well as my mother. We lived at the time in south central l A which would be considered middle class at the time, and you were the third of six kids, and you had ideas of becoming a patrol in yourself. Yes, I wanted to follow my father's footsteps. So my father went to the military. You come from Jackson, Mississippi, and you know, it's horror stories after horror stories, racism, the whole chabang when he grew up. So he was one of the first out of eleven kids, nine boys of as girls to leave Jackson, Mississippi. And so given the stories that he told us, I wanted to follow in his footsteps. He left Jackson, Mississippi, went into the military, and then come from the military into law enforcement. So my path was already cut from me. I distinctly remember when the man went through the police academy and how I had to shine shoes and belt buckles and anything that had brass or chrome or silver to it. And you were a star athlete as well. That comes back in the story later in a very unexpected way. Yes, Yes, my whole life long I spent time in sports. He kept me and my brother's will into the community and social activities. He felt that that was contribute to a strong foundation and to give us the opportunity of learning what it means to work as a team, to follow leadership and eventually become leaders. And so I took the sports and excelled at it, from Pop Warner all the way on up to high school football, baseball, the Holestan Bank. Yes. And then this story, like I said, has a really crazy twist right at the beginning of it, actually, because, as I said, you would seem to be an extremely unlikely guy to be a suspect in any crime. You were going to church, graduated high school, doing your thing, never been in trouble. And then one day, January six, a crazy thing happened. I was having a engine rebuilt for a nineteen seventy four K five Blazer, which was the in cars for teenagers at that time, just turned eighteen, and the guy wanted three hundred dollars to rebuild the engine. I had given him a hundred and fifty already when I took the engine to him, and he calls me up a week later and says, hey, the engine is complete. Come when you can't. I couldn't come into at night, and when I went to go pay the money, unbeknown to us, there was an individual watching us from across the street, and he approached to both of us, me and the auto mechanic, and the guy pulls out a gun and tells us we know what time it is, and took the money that I was given to the auto mechanic. He then took off headed or to the corner where two shots was fired, and the police were everywhere because they were up on the corner investigating a car accident. So everybody in the area fled, so that I period shortly after that, I don't think none of it. At the time, I didn't think none of it. Went home, and at that particular time, I was expected to have my first child being born. I had impregnated a young lady who came for the summer and she lived in Texas. So when she announced that the baby was about to be born, I went to Texas and I was there for three months, and while there, my first song was born. And so while I was in Texas, this rate that happened in April transpired, so I wasn't even in the state of California when it had happened. Then I came back and then I went to Arizona to visit family, members there while I was there. They have a project system, and so some guys inside the projects had caused harm to somebody else. Police were called and everybody who was in the area was lined up as usual and names were taken. When I gave him my name, they just ran the name and then came back and said, well, you're wanted in the city of Los Angeles and you're wanted in Lake Elsinore for to council rate two council or copulation, one count of robbery and one kind of kidnapped. And I'm like, wait a minute, yea, I got the wrong guy, stop it, you know. And so they was like, no, we're gonna extradite you back, no problem. They extradited me within days. When I got back to California, I was able to address the robbery incident and what have you. And the mistake I made at that particular time, I didn't tell them who was the perpetrator in the matter, because I actually knew the guy and it was gonna be one of those street justice things I catch up, which you're gonna give me my money back, that you're gonna get beat up, you know, And so that was what my thought process was so I wind up having to plead no low contender to that whole situation, meaning you can hold me responsible, but I'm not admitting to what she claimed I had done, and what have you. I was the victim in the matter, and so the mere fact that it was a two year of fence clearly tell you the weakness of the matter. So while we were addressing that, they then shipped me off to Riverside, California, where I learned about these charges. And so in April of nine six, a woman called out of Lake else, North California and said that she had just been raped and robbed. There was a police car in the vicinity, and she gave it a quick description of the perpetrator. Young, thin bill, black male, young, about sixteen years of age. He says, his teeth were small. I got big t She said that he didn't have no scars on his hands. I've had that scar on my hand since you see that scar right there. I used to box, you know, prize fight when I was young. I was an athlete, and so I had that scar there that ended the career. And she said that he had a ring on this exact finger, but she didn't describe the scar. She said that the perpetrator of the shoes he had on was actually a pair of rebox because it had a flag on it, and so she was able to identify this person to the nine one one operator who gave that information to the police officer who was raised there on the scene. He was like in the neighborhood. Two minutes he arrived at the scene of the crime. He said that they had combed the neighborhood looking for a mail of this description. And here's the problem in that area, it's all whites, predominant white. An African American man would have stuck out like a sword at eleven thirty in the morning and the out or a strip mall. This is a busy place. They couldn't find an individual. A detective was then called out. The detective took the young lady to the hospital where DNA rape kit was formed. They gathered all of the evidence and then they took her to the police station for further investigation. When they got her there, coincidentally, the one poster in the l A situation, the robbery incident where I was robbed, was laying on the table and she looked at it and said, this is the guy that raped me right here, and it was like, are you sure? She said yes, I'm real sure. And so when they were able to get me into the courtroom where I had an arrayment in Lake Elson, North California, a place I had never been in, never knew anything about. I was born and raised in south central Los Angeles until this very day. I knew nothing about this city. And having me to come there for arrayment, I am brought out into the courtroom with nothing but white guys. I'm gonna only black guy on his chain of white guys. But that the part that got me. He is is we're in a jury box, right and the d a's desk is about maybe three ft away from me. I mean, I can hear conversations being held with the d A and his party it's assistant, and they called my name up and an arrayment had taken place. Plead not guilty and what have you. He said, well, Mr Akin's attorney is not here yet, and so we'll put him on the back end and we will proceed further. And so once the judge decided to do that, he then got up went right into the audience. I'm looking at him. Sits next to a woman and says, do you see the man that raped you? She looked right over and said, yeah, that's him right there. I'm the only black guy. Now. You got de batiff in back of me, and de batiff tell me to look forward or when he gets me back in the back, he's gonna take his billy cub and bust my head if I didn't continue to look forward. And all the while I'm looking at this and I'm like, yeah, okay, So I can't wait for my attorney to get in so I can tell her about this in court identification. And so when she did come in, by then the bill had already been wrong. You can't unwring it. And I want to really dwell on this for a second, because you're the only one a sea of white guys. I mean, you're you're fucked. Yes, yes, And we went on with the arrayment and the date was set for preliminary hearing, at which time I then learned all the ins and out about the case and what have you. Now. Once the preliminary hearing came about, they had stated that they had three witnesses that could put me at the scene of the crime. They had a informant who allegedly stopped the detective as he was leaving the county jail and said, hey, I heard your addressing a rape case and and Lake Elsinore. I know something about it. I can help you with it. So the detective pulls this guy out and lo and behold, this informer was supposed to told him he knew me, that I had relatives in Lake Elsinore, and I was in Lake Elsinore around about the time that this rape had taken place. Then this is what the informant had told him, told him what kind of car I drove, told him where I actually came from, which was in the city of Los Angeles, and that he had relatives in Los Angeles, and that's how he was able to know me as well. Then when the detectives had came to l A County to see me for the first time, they had taken items that was in my property. At the time, I was off into hip hop, you know, rapping and things of that nature, and so quite naturally I fit the bill of what New York will call a b boy or what have you. With the big gold chain, the Rebok tennis shoes, I had a nugget ring. And so they took all of this and took it to the victim and showed it to the victim. The victim told him, no, none of that, He didn't have none of that. But what they did was is they put it all in the bag, and when we went to trial, they used it just saying we took this from Mr Atkins, this is what he had, This is what the victim originally said that the perpetrator had, and it's here in the bag, and so it was used as evidence. So they mixed your clothes with the clothes that might look like what she would have remembered. Yes, that's the police misconduct part of it. Then there was the prosecutorial misconduct of it, where Prosecutor Richard Bentley lines up with a prologist and manipulated numbers to tell the juries that I couldn't have been excluded from the crime, when in actuality I could have. They said that I had a rare blood type, and this blood type only five of the nation had this blood type, and because I fit into that five percent of the nation blood, I couldn't have been excluded, when in the actuality it was the other way around. I was in that could have excluded me right there from the spot. And that's all that Richard Bentley had to do was to be truthful with the matter instead of manipulating the matter. Because what the sorologists had done. It was proven in a civil trial that he had in fact conspired with Richard Bentley to misquote these numbers. And in the civil trial, which I loved, that came, you know, almost two decades later, and found that Danny Miller, the lead detective, was liable for his role that he played my being wrongfully convicted. Richard Bentley got to hide behind the badge of immunity where he couldn't be held responsible for what role he played in it. And James Hall, who was the horologist, he was able to escape because of an issue that the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals released him on. Yeah, that's I was shocked to see how the pieces to the puzzle that came about as a result that led to my being wrongly convicted. I realized that there was in fact a conspiracy. I realized that there was prosecutorial misconduct, there was police misconduct, there was misidentification, there was a junk science involved that all led to my being wrongly convicted. First of all, before we even get to the jury and the verdict, there's an important thing which hurts me to even talk about it, and I can't imagine how it feels for you. But your father during this time, who you obviously looked up to tremendously. You wanted to follow in his footsteps, and he taught you so much, but he didn't stand by you. He took the side of the police over his own son. In his exact words, quote unquote, I went with the evidence instead of the love of the child. And on top of everything else that you were going through, I can't imagine how a young person like yourself at this time, barely out of your teenage years can process that um abandonment. It was an act of treason too, a father son relationship. The jury goes out, did you have any hope that you would be found innocent after you had watched this whole thing take place in front of your eyes? You were living in it, right. Did you think they were gonna come back and plind you guilty? No? I thought that the Yeah, the truth. See, my grandmother had a scene she said, a lie die, but the truth always live on and so I applied that to that situation. Unfortunately it didn't happen. Then it happened later on, but everything my father had ever taught me about the justice system it went out the window. Herman, America got the best justice system. It's not the worst in the world, but it needs a lot of improvement. And as I have grown and have matured and have walked through this journey, I realized what the justice is nothing wrong with Americans justice system. It's the people that work within the justice system that has given it a bad name. Right because in your case, if they would have followed the rules, you would have been examting, would have even been brought to trial. Yes, nobody would have proceeded this. They would have kept looking, they come back in and find you guilty on all counts. So that moment must have been the worst moment of your life. Oh yeah, can you imagine here in a sentence, we give you forty seven years and eight months in prison. I was devastated. I mean you have to understand. At the time, although I was aged twenty one, I was one of them late bloomers, So I still five eleven, I weighed maybe a hundred and forty five pounds wet. And when I went back to the sale while being housed at there was a police officer. He believed in me. And although I never talked to him about or anybody for that matter, about the case, he knew that I didn't commit that crime because he came on his shift and he had found out what had happened, and he racked the door and he said, I can, you know, step out, and he took me out, and he put me in a padded cell and gave me a roll of toilet paper and he said, I'll be back to check on you. And when he put me in that cell, I cried like a baby. I that's when I realized you can lose your you know, emotions, and just it just three hours. I just I just cried. I didn't have anybody to console me. My father wasn't there to say, you know, hey, with that motivational speech. My mother wasn't there too, you know, with her solutions to every problem, none of that. I was just you know, stepped down to nothing. That was just me right there. And I knew that at that moment I was about to go on the journey. I was right, but I didn't know what to expect, but it was just it just tore me apart. It and my father. When I was young, I was always willing to help people and whatever your My father star always say herman, you have a soft heart, but that's all right. Life were hardened it for you. And what he said he was right, because my heart became instantly hard. I developed hatred. Hatred in my heart. When I got to prison, my attitude was, I'm in here for something I didn't do. I'm gonna give you a reason to kill me because I don't see a way out. And so my attitude was when it came from an authority figure, I can you need to let fuck you? Actin as you need to fuck you, I can come in. I became what's called a management problem. I can honestly say I kind of checked out mentally and emotionally. And you had grown by now into a big, tough guy. Um. I grew over a period of time. You know that by the time I had did uh my seventh year and a shoe program. Later, by the end, I'm six one and I'm winning every bit of two hundred pounds. I did a sixteen months shoe program and yeah, segregating housing unit and where you stayed in the sale twenty three hours out of a day, thirty minutes for shower and thirty minutes for yard. And seldom did you get both doing that right there and talking to a guy that was over in the sale who was doing an indetermined shoe program. He had been there eight years already, and he and I used to talk to event about that like that right there, except it was on the wall, and he told me something that was just registered to me. He said, if what you're telling me is true, then you need to get back out on the main line, get into the law books and figure out what happened to you and get up out of here. Made sense to me. I stayed up, did the shoe program, hit the main line, and kind of stayed to myself other than working and then law library and from there, I mean it took another five years to get out. What led you to that? Is this project? How did you get out? Okay? Well, in n when I got out of the shoot program, I went to the law books. I hit him hard. I studied everything that had to do about a rape case. And there was a guy who had came in he was doing a violation he did, like a nine month violation. He had been watching me from a distance, you know. He said, look, man, you're kind of young to be in the law books the way you you are, you know, And he said, what are the issues that you're fighting whatever? Because I know a little bit something about law, and in prison, you know, rapists and a child molest they're treated lower than the dirt they walk on. So I never told nobody about, you know, what I had been in for. But it was a calmness about this guy, and I told him. He said, well, what are the issues? And I told him that. He said, well, it seems as though that you have chopped down a tree and you're still dealing with the stump. He said, there's an organization that could help you get out of here. It's called an Innocent Project, and I'm more than sure if you, you know, asked them to help you, they'll take your case. You can be out of here in months. I went in, wrote a thirteen page letter, and Barry Scheck and Peter knew Felt sent me a letter saying we would be interested in your case. Can you send us your sentencing transcript to Sir Rod's report in your trial transcripts, and me and my family got together. We sent these documents. About two weeks after we had sent it off, I got a letter from Barry check Peter new Felt again telling me that they not only would they accept my case, they broke down how the Innocent Project work and the fact that a student would be assigned in my case and what the student job was, and if they were successful at finding the evidence for DNA testing, then it would be turned over to an in house attorney and that person would go and represent me. Now, from the time they told me that in the evidence was found in nine the problem was is that the Innocent Project was a fairly new organization and so they didn't have attorneys around the nation willing to do the work that they were doing, especially for a pro bono like they have now. And so took him another two years, with the assistance of my family as well, to find an attorney, and they found one guy named Douglas Myers. He stepped up. He argued successfully to have the evidence released and it was released in October, at which time it was tested and it proved that I was factually innocent of these crimes. The d A They just did not want to concede on the matter, so they wanted to be slick and asked very second courts to have a second DNA testing. They wanted to send everything to Berkeley, California for another testing and what have you, which would have cost me to be there even longer. But Barry said got smart and told him and said, let's get the FBI involved. And they sent it to the FBI. And while Barry Scheck and Peter Newfield, they had wrote a book and they were on the book tour, the FBI found out what the results were and tried to make it seem like they discovered that an innocent man was imprisoned, and they were the ones that pressed for my immediate release. And so the minute order came down February seventeenth of two thousand, demanding my immediate release because I have been proven by way of post conviction. Then they testing that I was factory innocent of the charges some twelve years later, but it was a total of fourteen because the moment they put handcuffs on you, that's when the clock starts. Yes, so it's a total of fourteen years. So fourteen years. Never received an apology from Richard Mentley and Hanny Miller, James Howe Norther victim for that matter. But in coming home, you can actually see me. Go to YouTube type in Herman Atkins DNA testing, and you're gonna see a video of my immediate release. What was it like walking out? Everything was new to me. I had lost touch with society. I had been gone over a decade. But as far as coming home, I was excited about that because I did make plans while I was in there. I knew one day you're gonna have to let me go, and they did. And so you walked out with the first thing you did when you it out. As far as eating, well, the first thing I did. My mother and my sister and her husband, and an auntie and my one of my sons who had been born before I went in. He was one years old when I went to prison. He was fourteen years old when I got out. And so we all stopped at ihop and one of the things I noticed is is I had eight prison food so alone, I couldn't keep nothing on my stomach. So we bypassed that and I had to actually go to a dollar store in California and buy stuff that they sold in the in the canteen, I had to make prison spreads in order to eat and survive out here for at least a month. And then they took me to a hometown buffet and something about their food set on my stomach. So I malled they food and we would drink coffee up in there, like four fold, just coffee. I went to Starbucks and brought some coffee from there. I stayed up for three days, literally three days. My sister so hermy, what's wrong with you? You're not are you all right? You're not what I said, yeah, start, but got some strong coffee. I don't mess with Start, but coffee did this very day because the prison coffee was so weak. I'm gonna that's gonna stick with me a long time. Everybody you eating prison food after you got out for a month, that's crazy. Um. And then so you went to college. Yeah, when I came home, work was not an option. I needed to be educated. I already had a high school diploma. I went and rolled in college, and once I got there, I went to the head coach and told him, hey, this is my story. I want to play football. And so when I came home, I still had that twenty one year old mentality, and I looked like I was about at best. And so although I was thirty four years of age, he said, well, if you can make the team, ye end. So spring training came around. It was a lot of conditioning, running, and we had to do this final test and then I made the team. And when I once I made the team, they gave us a helmets, show the paths, all of that, and I was able to show him what I was made up physically. At age thirty four, I was out there rocking these eighteen and nineteen year old kids who was coming out of high school, all American defensive end, all American linebacker, you know, and what happened And I'm like, yeah, okay. When I was out there tearing them apart, and I had hit a guy so hard one time, I knocked myself out and and Soda the coach, took my helmet, which was my prize possession. I had to sit out for a week for concussion purposes and what have you. But we got back at and I played college football for two years at that particular college. And then and then one of the more extraordinary things about what I'm gonna say about your story, but really about you is the aspect that deals with your father and how you dealt with this betrayal, this treason, active treason, Yeah, which is you know, as someone who I grew up, you know, my father was my hero and you know, and I can't even imagine on any level how empty and horrible that must have felt. But you did something that I think is extraordinary. And can you talk about that? I mean, what happened with you and your dad when you got out. Yes, it's one of the situations where like when I remember coming up and my father always demanded an explanation as to why I done something, and so all I remember during that time and coming home is that this man never came to visit me. He never wrote me, he never sent me money packages and none of that. So he was like he turned his back on me. But he did always tell us, you know, I don't go visit people in jail. I put people in jail. I'm like, okay. So that that was my thought then, and it wasn't until we did the documentary After Innocence with Mark Simon and Jessica Sanders, and they interviewed him, but they never told me what he had told them until the documentary was complete and it was down on the big screen, and I'm sitting in this theater and I'm watching him. And when they did his interview, out of his mouth came the explanation as to why he did what he did. He said, I went with the evidence instead of the love of the child. And I immediately got up after that registered with me. I got up why the documentary were still going. I went to the hallway. I called my father and I said, you know, I always wondered why you did what you did, but I just heard your explanation. And it was at that moment I forgave him because I understood that once you become a police officer, you are trained to think a certain way, and now that I'm going to law school, I'm being trained to think a certain way. He was trained to go with the evidence. I'm being trained to go with the facts and make sure that the evidence lines up with the facts. So I was able to forgive him right then and there. And this happened in oh five when I just really got my explanation, and I went to my father and I told him, I forgive you. I get it. I understand. However, since the day I came home, my father has been spending majority of our time, and I've been home in nineteen years. He has been spending the majority of that time trying to make it up to me for the decision that he made. And I've been spending my time showing him I forgive you. You're my father, I love you. I talked to him regularly, I go visiting. But now I have to do it more so now than I have done over the last few years, because now he's dealing with azheimer and it's creeping up on him fast, and and I'm forced to state meeting to the bitter end because my greatest fear is now about to confront me. One day. He's gonna forget who I am. He's gonna forget that decision he made. He's gonna forget every life lesson that he's taught me. He's going to forget everything. Yes, now you have a bunch of grandchildren. Yes, I got seven of them, so that's great. You'd be graduating law school, Yes, awesome. And then, um, California has never compensated you, and that is obviously completely unacceptable. Is ironic because you were one of the people that was really responsible for changing those compensations to California used to be Believe it or not, Ya'll let you tell it. Well, it used to be ten thousand dollars. If you can prove that you were wrong to be convicted, you can get ten thousand dollars. Well, first of all, we didn't even know that law was on the books. Somehow another A c. L. You found it, and a couple of more other sharp attorneys found it, and we went an address and meaning me several other Axonorees Natasha Misker for the A c. L. You, We went before a panel. We were able to get that change from ten thousand total to a hundred dollars a day. And when I double back to apply for it, they told me you get nothing because statue of limitations have ran out on you. I'm like, huh, really, California owe me a half a million dollars. Yeah, And I think even then a hunter holls a day, that's thirty six five a year, And I think you have a hard time going on in the streets and asking people if they want to go into the sixth sy presents a day. You're not gonna get a lot of takers for that they could give me. It would being the best interest to give me my money now, because once I become an attorney, then I'm gonna come get it another way, and I'm gonna keep getting in and getting in. And when they asked me, well, why are you these lawsuits and this that another well, hell, you should have gave me my money, right, and now you're gonna get it on. I'm gonna get it. Yeah, it's ironic, you're being a football player. And then they were moving the goal posts on your right. But that's the way it goes. Um. So everything about your story is extraordinary. I'm really grateful that you shared your story with my audience and with me here on Wrathful Conviction. And then now comes my favorite part of the show. This is a part of the show where I get to actually just thank you as I just did, and then turn my microphone off and just listen, and I leave it to you for the last few minutes for closing thoughts of anything. You want to talk about anything, it's all it's all you. It's your stage. Okay, here's here's the thing. One of the I travel this nation, I speak on judicial reform I work closely with the Innocent Project. I have dedicated my life to the work that they do, and there are some things that I found that contribute to our justice system being seriously flawed. But I first present this to anybody to hear my story. I say, each one, teach one, teach one, each one, and I present that challenge to the person, meaning what you have heard here today, go out and educate the next person. Because awareness is very important to solving any situation, and in this case, people needs to be aware of the fact that we have a seriously flawed justice system. It has accounted for individuals being wrothly convicted. There's a few individuals that has been killed in the justice system as a result of being wrothly convicted and executed. And these are the things that needs to stop now. The solution is is let's start at the base of the problem. See, it's not the justice system. I've come to realize the justice system will work perfectly if we get the right people to operate within it. And the problem comes into play as is when you got corrupt prosecutors who's getting wrong for convictions, are causing growth for conviction because they want to be politicians. They want to be judges, they want to be you know, counselmants and what have you. And because of that, they're willing to do anything to get a conviction. Then you got these corrupt police officers. Lord not to mention how they're just out here killing black males like it is the thing to do, like it's perfectly legal. Okay, we're dealing with a psychological problem the police department. We need to do two things. We need psych evaluation on these police officers, get them out of the way. And those that has caused problems we need to buy way of pictures motions. We need to go into their background, figure out who they are and start protesting to get them up out of there. And when you have a d A that don't want to file a case, when they're clearly there has been a violation of the law on behalf of the police, they don't want to file the case, then we need to start looking at that d A and sht that person down. You know, when it comes down to elections and things of that nature. And we got to always remember who these people are because what you feel to realize is the very people who was hollering back in the eighties and the nineties tough on crime. Yeah, what these people has caused a serious problem to Americans. Justice system is busting at the scenes. Taxpayers is paying for it. And now the taxpayers is looking back on it, and they said, wow, we can't afford to keep inmates. To start letting them out, letting the one is what nonviolent offenses out? This? That another wise, so you can cut the costs. So you should have thought about that when these politicians was hollering tough on crime. So in fact, let's read them individuals out and get rid of them, get them out of office as well. We need to overhaul our justice system by removing the very individuals that are creating the problems. I would like to see laws change. I would like to see when it comes down to compensation, that every state in America follow suit. I like how Texas has set their compensation package up and every state in America should follow that. I think that should be a federal law that all states has to do one thing in all honor of compensation. One of the things that people fail to realize is is that a person who has actually committed a crime can get out in any state and go to government funded organizations and receive all types of helps and resources to acclimate themselves back into society. A person who has been wrongly convicted, such as myself, is told to go back out in society and function the best way you can. There is no conversation package wherever a person has been proven wrong for convicted, where he can go get an education, where he can go and get housing, where he can get transportation, where he can get psychological help, where he could turn around and be a productive citizen in society with some type of employment or what have you. There's nothing set up for that, and so I would like to see that change. I'd like to see laws like that change. But the biggest thing I want to see happen, and I pray to God that I live to see it happen, is have that badge of immunity removed from them. Prosecutors, if you violate the very law that you swore to uphold and protect, then you should be prosecuted by it if you have indulged in the taking of a person's life. Because when you put somebody in prison, be it for a day, be it for or a month, be it for a year, be it for a decade. You have killed that person. You have killed that person, and the person that did it, the people that's involved, be at the prosecutors, be at the police. They all need to be held accountable for their actions. So I want to see accountability. I want to see that badge of immunity removed, not in one state and all states, in all states and all cities, regardless of how big or small, of what have you. And I would like to see society as a whole start focusing on what's going on over in Kansas with this blue sky. Oh my god, that rate there is textbook corruption. And if it went on there, it's just like the same thing that went on in California with the Rampart Division scandal. This stuff right here is common. The only thing that's bringing it to light now is social media, I think God, because the regular media it's not gonna televise what a person holding a camera up to the situation will televis. That means it's a close in person. And I thank God that you have those that hold your camera. I advise that you hold them up high because it is your heart, is your courage in the face of these corrupt police officers that is bringing about the truth in the matter. Thank you dropping a lot of knowledge and if you want to learn more about the loopski, listen to the lamon McEntire episode of Wrongful Conviction. You'll hear all about it. Thank you again for being here, Herman Atkins, and thank you everyone for listening. And I'll see you next week on wrong from Conviction. Don't forget to give us a fantastic review wherever you get your podcasts. It really helps. And I'm a proud donor to the Innocents Project and I really hope you'll join me in supporting this burying partant cause and helping to prevent future wrongful convictions. Go to Innocence Project dot org to learn how to donate and get involved. I'd like to thank our production team, Connor Hall and Kevin Wardis. The music in the show is by three time OSCAR nominated composer Jay Ralph. Be sure to follow us on Instagram at Wrongful Conviction and on Facebook at Wrongful Conviction Podcast. Wrongful Conviction with Jason Flam is a production of Lava for Good Podcasts and association with Signal Company Number one

Wrongful Conviction

Hosted by celebrated criminal justice reform advocate and founding board member of the Innocence Pro 
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