We’re talking about a very famous case this week. In 1984, Bernie Goetz shot four Black teenagers on a subway in Manhattan. He was hailed as a hero in the press, a man who stopped would-be robbers. But as the public learned more about the evidence, and about Goetz himself, the story seemed to shift. Elliot Williams is a CNN legal analyst and former federal prosecutor. And he wrote a book about the case called "Five Bullets: The Story of Bernie Goetz, New York's Explosive '80s, and the Subway Vigilante Trial That Divided the Nation." 

Support this podcast by shopping our latest sponsor deals and promotions at this link: https://bit.ly/4gF2K18 

See more information on my books: katewinklerdawson.com 

Follow me on social: @tenfoldmore (Twitter) / @wickedwordspod (Facebook) / @tenfoldmorewicked (Instagram) 

2026 All Rights Reserved 

We&rsquo;re talking about a very famous case this week. In 1984, Bernie Goetz shot four Black teenagers on a subway in Manhattan. He was hailed as a hero in the press, a man who stopped would-be robbers. But as the public learned more about the evidence, and about Goetz himself, the story seemed to shift. Elliot Williams is a CNN legal analyst and former federal prosecutor. And he wrote a book about the case called "Five Bullets: The Story of Bernie Goetz, New York's Explosive '80s, and the Subway Vigilante Trial That Divided the Nation."&nbsp;
Support this podcast by shopping our latest sponsor deals and promotions at this link:&nbsp;<a href="https://bit.ly/4gF2K18">https://bit.ly/4gF2K18</a>&nbsp;
See more information on my books: katewinklerdawson.com&nbsp;
Follow me on social: @tenfoldmore (Twitter) / @wickedwordspod (Facebook) / @tenfoldmorewicked (Instagram)&nbsp;
2026 All Rights Reserved&nbsp;

Welcome to Tenfold More Wicked Presents: Wicked Words, Kate Winkler Dawson's true crime talk show. On each new episode of Wicked Words, Kate interviews journalists, podcasters and authors about their fascinating behind-the-scenes stories from their investigations in the world of true crime, many of which have never been shared before. 

Kate interviews Patricia Cornwell, the prolific true crime author about her book Portrait Of A Killer: Jack The Ripper – Case Closed, she heads to Texas with veteran journalist Rena Pederson to discuss her coverage of an uncatchable jewel thief during the swinging sixties, chats with podcaster and journalist Mandy Matney from the Murdaugh Murders Podcast and so much more. These are the stories behind the stories. 

Also in this feed is host Kate Winkler Dawson’s true crime limited series, Tenfold More Wicked. 
Season 12 - A Blessing and a Curse
Season 11 - Fire and Brimstone
Season 10 - Entitled 
Season 9 - The Wolf Among Us
Season 8 - The Morphine Murderess
Season 7 - The Annihilator 
Season 6 - The Echo of Murder
Season 5 - Blood Feud
Season 4 - Tiger Woman
Season 3 - Murder in the Court
Season 2 - The Body Snatcher
Season 1 - All That is Wicked

Wicked Words is part of the Exactly Right podcast network that provides a platform for bold, creative voices to bring to life provocative, entertaining and relatable stories for audiences everywhere. The Exactly Right roster of podcasts covers a variety of topics including historic true crime, comedic interviews and news, science, pop culture and more. Podcasts on the network include Buried Bones with Kate Winkler Dawson and Paul Holes, That's Messed Up: An SVU Podcast, This Podcast Will Kill You, Bananas and more.

Wicked Words - A True Crime Talk Show with Kate Winkler Dawson

Welcome to Tenfold More Wicked Presents: Wicked Words, Kate Winkler Dawson's true crime talk show. On each new episode of Wicked Words, Kate interviews journalists, podcasters and authors about their fascinating behind-the-scenes stories from their investigations in the world of true crime, many of which have never been shared before. 

Kate interviews Patricia Cornwell, the prolific true crime author about her book Portrait Of A Killer: Jack The Ripper – Case Closed, she heads to Texas with veteran journalist Rena Pederson to discuss her coverage of an uncatchable jewel thief during the swinging sixties, chats with podcaster and journalist Mandy Matney from the Murdaugh Murders Podcast and so much more. These are the stories behind the stories. 

Also in this feed is host Kate Winkler Dawson’s true crime limited series, Tenfold More Wicked. 
Season 12 - A Blessing and a Curse
Season 11 - Fire and Brimstone
Season 10 - Entitled 
Season 9 - The Wolf Among Us
Season 8 - The Morphine Murderess
Season 7 - The Annihilator 
Season 6 - The Echo of Murder
Season 5 - Blood Feud
Season 4 - Tiger Woman
Season 3 - Murder in the Court
Season 2 - The Body Snatcher
Season 1 - All That is Wicked

Wicked Words is part of the Exactly Right podcast network that provides a platform for bold, creative voices to bring to life provocative, entertaining and relatable stories for audiences everywhere. The Exactly Right roster of podcasts covers a variety of topics including historic true crime, comedic interviews and news, science, pop culture and more. Podcasts on the network include Buried Bones with Kate Winkler Dawson and Paul Holes, That's Messed Up: An SVU Podcast, This Podcast Will Kill You, Bananas and more.

Elliot Williams: Five Bullets

https://api.omny.fm/orgs/e73c998e-6e60-432f-8610-ae210140c5b1/clips/e03b6621-d5e1-44a7-9b81-b3ee014af332/transcript