When you listen to this month’s interview, you’ll understand why Marco te Brömmelstroet is a true lateral thinker and brilliant communicator.

Marco is Professor in Urban Mobility Futures at the University of Amsterdam. He’s also Academic director of the Lab of Thought and Board Chair of the Urban Cycling Institute.

With approximately a million followers on social media across his personal and organisation accounts, Marco is one of the world's most prominent advocates for liveable cities and is a sought-after keynote speaker for events around the world.

Here are three of the many original ideas that Marco discusses during our conversation.

The Hill of Hysteria ramps up every time a new project is proposed that will involve change such as removing car parking, lowering speed limits or re-allocating a motor vehicle lane for a protected cycling path.

A small but vocal minority of resistance becomes amplified and reaches maximum volume just before the new measure is to be implemented.

Marco and his colleagues have researched this phenomenon and found it to be repeated around the world.

But if elected officials hold their nerve during this critical peak of pressure, they will find that it’s just a hill. The noise quickly goes down once the measure is implemented and people discover that things are actually better.

The importance of language – rather than say, “We need to implement paid parking” say, “We need to stop subsidising parking.” Because all parking comes at a cost, so there’s no such thing as free parking.

Marco also talks about “More meaningful mobility”. Engineers often look at journey time as a pure cost, with no intrinsic utility. But research found that most people who travelled by active modes (walking, cycling, public transport) missed their commute during covid lockdown.

Marco calls this “friction”. The journey has meaning.

These are just three of many highlights in this compelling conversation.

Marco is also the author of multiple books and many academic papers.

Two of his books that we discuss during the interview are:

“Movement – how to take back our streets and transform our lives”

“Mobility Language Matters – how language shapes our cities and lives”

Marco recommended two books by other authors:

“The Anxious Generation” by Johnathon Haidt, warning about the danger of social media for adolescents. The first part of the book addresses the loss of their freedom to roam.

“To Save Everything Click Here” by Evgeny Morozov, questioning that the digital age can fix everything.

 

What’s Up

Towards the end of each episode, Sara and Phil share news of the day and events they’ve been taking part in.

Phil has just returned from a month in the UK and Ireland.

One highlight was cycling all over London and seeing scenes like these:

Phil observed a big jump in cycling activity and noticeably improved infrastructure in the two years since he previously rode around London. If only more other cities could take notice and follow London’s lead!

By the time this episode goes live, Phil and Sara will have just returned from the National Transport Conference in Brisbane, Queensland, Australia – look out for a future episode with one of the keynote speakers!

Sara is currently in the middle or running three marathons in three months! Most recently the Gold Coast Marathon, followed by the Sydney Marathon and to be completed with the Berlin Marathon.

Sara had a great experience running the Sydney Marathon that she said was a great example of enjoying the journey. Plus, Sara and some fellow supporters of Better Streets successfully raised about $15,000 so far for the ongoing advocacy work of this national Australian-based organisation. Their donations page is still open here.

She’s hoping to run a personal best in Berlin of under 3 hours 15 minutes and will report back in a future podcast, so stay tuned!

When you listen to this month&rsquo;s interview, you&rsquo;ll understand why Marco te Br&ouml;mmelstroet is a true lateral thinker and brilliant communicator.
Marco is Professor in Urban Mobility Futures at the University of Amsterdam. He&rsquo;s also Academic director of the <a href="https://thelabofthought.co/">Lab of Thought</a> and Board Chair of the <a href="https://urbancyclinginstitute.org/">Urban Cycling Institute</a>.
With approximately a million followers on social media across his personal and organisation accounts, Marco is one of the world's most prominent advocates for liveable cities and is a sought-after keynote speaker for events around the world.
Here are three of the many original ideas that Marco discusses during our conversation.
The Hill of Hysteria ramps up every time a new project is proposed that will involve change such as removing car parking, lowering speed limits or re-allocating a motor vehicle lane for a protected cycling path.
A small but vocal minority of resistance becomes amplified and reaches maximum volume just before the new measure is to be implemented.
Marco and his colleagues have researched this phenomenon and found it to be repeated around the world.
But if elected officials hold their nerve during this critical peak of pressure, they will find that it&rsquo;s just a hill. The noise quickly goes down once the measure is implemented and people discover that things are actually better.
The importance of language &ndash; rather than say, &ldquo;We need to implement paid parking&rdquo; say, &ldquo;We need to stop subsidising parking.&rdquo; Because all parking comes at a cost, so there&rsquo;s no such thing as free parking.
Marco also talks about &ldquo;More meaningful mobility&rdquo;. Engineers often look at journey time as a pure cost, with no intrinsic utility. But research found that most people who travelled by active modes (walking, cycling, public transport) missed their commute during covid lockdown.
Marco calls this &ldquo;friction&rdquo;. The journey has meaning.
These are just three of many highlights in this compelling conversation.
Marco is also the author of multiple books and many academic papers.
Two of his books that we discuss during the interview are:
&ldquo;<a href="https://www.amazon.com.au/Movement-take-streets-transform-lives-ebook/dp/B09JTW58M4/ref=sr_1_1?crid=2WCYZ18VD3U2R&amp;dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.nHmPYTQNwCsfI1JFNpE2eqduH0ujvdOyHUfh1g2QLN_78lUovjMfTk_h1h0--F-ZqNP9D_wNlbVjLd5YZ_mOZ-YBUhV-kd3W08yKpyhNfTd3KlGH8GglpaswDKzi3Skh.v3N567Fpdo39DhI6Dj42Mpjsn24GvRhMaQdOxYnM38w&amp;dib_tag=se&amp;keywords=Marco+Te+Brommelstroet&amp;qid=1788739236&amp;s=books&amp;sprefix=marco+te+brommelstroet%2Cstripbooks%2C203&amp;sr=1-1">Movement &ndash; how to take back our streets and transform our lives</a>&rdquo;
&ldquo;<a href="https://www.amazon.com.au/Mobility-Language-Matters-Marco-Br%C3%B6mmelstroet/dp/B0GX5BT47L/ref=sr_1_2?crid=2WCYZ18VD3U2R&amp;dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.nHmPYTQNwCsfI1JFNpE2eqduH0ujvdOyHUfh1g2QLN_78lUovjMfTk_h1h0--F-ZqNP9D_wNlbVjLd5YZ_mOZ-YBUhV-kd3W08yKpyhNfTd3KlGH8GglpaswDKzi3Skh.v3N567Fpdo39DhI6Dj42Mpjsn24GvRhMaQdOxYnM38w&amp;dib_tag=se&amp;keywords=Marco+Te+Brommelstroet&amp;qid=1788739236&amp;s=books&amp;sprefix=marco+te+brommelstroet%2Cstripbooks%2C203&amp;sr=1-2">Mobility Language Matters &ndash; how language shapes our cities and lives</a>&rdquo;
Marco recommended two books by other authors:
&ldquo;<a href="https://www.anxiousgeneration.com/">The Anxious Generation</a>&rdquo; by Johnathon Haidt, warning about the danger of social media for adolescents. The first part of the book addresses the loss of their freedom to roam.
&ldquo;<a href="https://www.amazon.com.au/Save-Everything-Click-Here-Technological/dp/1610393708">To Save Everything Click Here</a>&rdquo; by Evgeny Morozov, questioning that the digital age can fix everything.
&nbsp;
What&rsquo;s Up
Towards the end of each episode, Sara and Phil share news of the day and events they&rsquo;ve been taking part in.
Phil has just returned from a month in the UK and Ireland.
One highlight was cycling all over London and seeing scenes like these:
Phil observed a big jump in cycling activity and noticeably improved infrastructure in the two years since he previously rode around London. If only more other cities could take notice and follow London&rsquo;s lead!
By the time this episode goes live, Phil and Sara will have just returned from the National Transport Conference in Brisbane, Queensland, Australia &ndash; look out for a future episode with one of the keynote speakers!
Sara is currently in the middle or running three marathons in three months! Most recently the Gold Coast Marathon, followed by the Sydney Marathon and to be completed with the Berlin Marathon.
Sara had a great experience running the Sydney Marathon that she said was a great example of enjoying the journey. Plus, Sara and some fellow supporters of <a href="https://www.betterstreets.org.au/">Better Streets</a> successfully raised about $15,000 so far for the ongoing advocacy work of this national Australian-based organisation. Their donations page is still open <a href="https://www.betterstreets.org.au/whats-happening/sydney-marathon-2026-fundraiser">here</a>.
She&rsquo;s hoping to run a personal best in Berlin of under 3 hours 15 minutes and will report back in a future podcast, so stay tuned!

The Squeaky Wheel Podcast is here to inform and inspire through engaging conversations with changemakers shaping the future of active travel and urban mobility. Your hosts, Phil Latz and Irene McAleese, speak with leaders across business, government, academia, and advocacy, sharing insights and ideas that drive real-world impact.

Got something to squeak about? Get in touch with The Squeaky Wheel team via our website: squeakywheelpodcast.com

Follow The Squeaky Wheel on Facebook: facebook.com/squeakywheelpodcast

Follow The Squeaky Wheel on BlueSky: bsky.app/profile/squeaky-wheel.bsky.social

The Squeaky Wheel Podcast&nbsp;is here to inform and inspire through engaging conversations with changemakers shaping the future of&nbsp;active travel and urban mobility. Your hosts, Phil Latz and Irene McAleese, speak with leaders across business, government, academia, and advocacy, sharing insights and ideas that drive real-world impact.
Got something to squeak about? Get in touch with The Squeaky Wheel team via our website: <a href="https://squeakywheelpodcast.com/">squeakywheelpodcast.com</a>
Follow The Squeaky Wheel on Facebook: <a href="https://www.facebook.com/squeakywheelpodcast/">facebook.com/squeakywheelpodcast</a>
Follow The Squeaky Wheel on BlueSky: <a href="https://bsky.app/profile/squeaky-wheel.bsky.social">bsky.app/profile/squeaky-wheel.bsky.social</a>

The Squeaky Wheel Podcast hosts, Phil Latz and Irene McAleese, are here to inform and inspire through engaging conversations with changemakers shaping the future of active travel and urban mobility