Ben and the Steelers' Short-Term Future, Chicago's QB Quandary, Top 200 Free Agents Preview | NFL Deep Dive

Published Mar 8, 2021, 9:00 AM

Ben Roethlisberger and the Steelers figured out a way to make it work financially, but can they make it work on the field? Conor and Gary take a look at how the Steelers got to this point, and the reasons to be optimistic—or pessimistic—as to whether it can work out for Pittsburgh in 2021, as they try to squeeze out another season of Super Bowl contention with an elite defense.

 We also take a look at the sad QB situation in Chicago, where the Bears don't have the ammo to do much of anything in the trade market. With Ryan Pace and Matt Nagy entering a must-win season, what's the solution going to be?

 Plus, the shrinking middle class in the NFL, the addition of J.J. Watt in Arizona, Conor absolutely berates Gary regarding Sports Illustrated’s upcoming Top-200 Free Agents list, and all the Baltimore Orioles talk you could possibly want from your favorite NFL podcast.

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Hello, and welcome to the mm QB Monday Morning NFL Podcast. I'm your host, Gary Cramling. I am joined by Connor Or of the week Side Podcast. And Connor, we have a little bit of a little bit of potpourri in this week's show. We're gonna touch on a couple of different topics. Uh, one of them being Ben Roethlisberger saying in Pittsburgh, we're gonna look at the Bears possibilities at quarterback Russell Wilson shruggy shoulder. I don't really know if that seems realistic. And uh, we're gonna talk about the shrinking middle class in the NFL. But we're also I think the best part of the show, and you're gonna have to wait until last for it is Uh Connor is going to berate me for some of my free agent rankings and our upcoming top two hundred list. That's what we call it tease. That's right. You gotta wait until the end or you have to press the plus fifteen second button about a million times and your phone's not gonna handle it, and because you have too many pictures on there and it's not gonna work out the way you wanted to, so just relax and listen to the whole thing on sular speed to not one point five speed, maybe even slow it down just so you really absorb everything that comes out here. Shildon Rankins, all right, that's ah, well, we'll get to that in a bit, in a little bit. We promise it'll be wonderful. But the whole show will be wonderful. And we're starting off with Ben Roethlisberger. And look, this was sort of in inevitability as long as he was coming back. It seemed like it was going to be pittsburgher nothing. And quite frankly, Connor, Steelers don't have a whole lot of options here at quarterback if it's not Ben Roethlisberger. Yeah, it made me rethink a little bit the Packers decision. And you know, I think the Packers are in a different spot because they have a generational talent like Aaron Rodgers, who's still a relatively healthy guy, whereas Ben roethlisbergers struggled with injuries. I mean, he even said up until recently, didn't really retool his diet or do any of the things that all these other quarterbacks are doing to um to help their longevity. And so you know, if you're Kevin Colbert, like, that's the kind of guy who should have done the Jordan Love thing and had a first round pick ready to stand by and come in when something like this went terribly wrong. But they're just making the same mistake that the Giants made with Eli Manning, which is, you know, trying to ride this thing until the wheels come off. And you know, I don't believe that they're a legitimate super Bowl contender based on the way that he played last year. Now, if that was just a year of getting over injuries and and he has one more healthy year left in the tank, I think that changes things. But is there anything that you saw last year that leads you to believe that this is a guy who can push a team to a super Bowl even if they are able to keep that generational defense together. I know, And that's kind of what it is to me. Uh, we look at some of these teams. I think the Team Bears who were I would have put them right there with Broncos as far as sort of the last decade of great, great carry you to a championship type of defenses. It is tough to keep that no open with these just super elite, stand on your head defenses because even if like you look at what happened with the Bear, since pretty much the same personnel there if Vic Fangio is gone Chuck Pogano in I didn't think there was a huge drop off with Pagano as far as sort of down to down play. I think the drop off came from the fact that they went from thirty five turnovers for thirty five takeaways to eighteen a year. And there is some luck baked into takeaway stuff. And you have a Steelers events that has had a lot of takeaways and gotten a lot of sacks, and uh, they are built for that. Teams that do create pressure do tend to take the ball away. But to take it away that rate where you're gonna lead the league, where're gonna get to a week, It's just not something you can really count on. Yeah, I mean, they're not a thirteen and three team again. Next year, you know, maybe they're a ten win team, But what does that look like in the a f C Northland. You know, maybe Cleveland wins ten games. What if Baltimore comes back, um, and you know, Baltimore was almost on the down curve of that luck factor that we're kind of talking about last year, and what if that flips again and starts the ball starts bouncing their way again. So I don't know. I just think it's a mistake now. You know. The argument that you could make for Kevin Colbert, and I did address that when I wrote about it this week, was that really there wasn't a true chance to find value unless in twenty teeny drafted Lamar Jackson. That was the one opportunity you would have had to get a quarterback at a value spot and a guy that you didn't need above that. You know, Minca Fitzpatrick has been more than valuable for them at that spot. Um that they spent that first round pick on. You know, I don't know what else you would have wanted them to do. I mean, would you have rather than take a quarterback instead of Devon Bush? And if so, that quarterback would have been Dwayne Haskins And they have Dwayne Haskins anyway, um and signed him to a reserve futures deal. So on one hand, it's like, you know, is he probably doing the responsible thing? Is that GM? Yes? But does it look bad that you're this desperate to make things w and you're also complicating the salary cap for next year when you know, assuming he retires after this season, and if we can continue to mount an airtight defense for Kevin Colber here. He did take Mason Rudolph with the seventy six pick of the draft. Now, and and I've I've had this conversation in this argument with lots of people of the years. Day two quarterbacks usually don't work out. I don't know exactly what the rate is, but you know, you think back to you know, whether it's the Giants with Davis Webb or the Saints with Garrett Grayson. You take these Day two flyers on guys, Uh, they get to Day two for a reason, guys who are sort of you know, no one's quite a sure fire quarterback, but you know, essentially, if the if the league feels really good about you, you're coming off the board in the first round. Mason Rudolph was a guy who came in with with downfield accuracy questions. Uh, and you know you've kind of seen it. It just hasn't worked out for him. There's no reason and to think he's going to be uh, the next guy in Pittsburgh. And that's how it usually works out with these day two picks. Uh. So you know they did take a flyer on the guy. It didn't work out. And now you kind of you know, you shrug your shoulders. I'll say this about their offense last September and October when they sort of rolled out. You know, you think of the Ben Roethlisburger offenses over the years, it's those you know that that classic uh, you know of the auts and the and the two dozen tends, that classic you know, static formations, uh, no motion ISO routes. And then last year, all of a sudden they run out all this you know, pre stap motion and it's this quick strike, horizontal passing attack that you've never seen from the Steelers, certainly during the Roethlisberger era. Uh. And you know, by by like mid October, it's like, okay, this is this is neat. Now let's see you blend in the the old stuff. Okay, let's let's see it. Let's start now, now now, And it just never came. And and look, Roethlisberger in his prime was as good a thrower of the football as anyone in the league. I mean, it is some some of the things he was able to do with guys hanging off his body. You know, he's not going to be at that level again, but you did see flashes. I do think back to the game that they won in Baltimore earlier in the season where, uh, you know, that was sort of that back and forth battle. Uh Lamar end up throwing too much of a interceptions, had some turnovers in that game and ended up being the uh the Steelers win on that Mike of Fitzpatrick breakup. But that was a game where the Steelers did nothing in the first half. They came out in the second half and and Roethlisberger said after the game, you just kind of like, yeah, you know, I saw some things we could exploit, and so we just sort of started, you know, drawing up our own stuff and and sort of doing it that way. And it worked against a really good defense on the road. So I feel like maybe it's there on the other side of the coin. You think back to that Monday night game in Cincinnati late in the year where they did have to score points in somewhat quick fashion and they were completely unable to do so against the defense that wasn't very good at all. So I don't know where they fall. I don't know if it's kind of thing where I was wondering late in the year, is he worn down or you know, in combination with that, is he just sort of is he so used to not getting hit in this quick strike offense that when he gets put in a situation where he's going to have to hang in and get hit. It's just something he is, you know, whatever, you don't have the you know, have the taste of blood. Uh, you're just not ready to do it. Yeah, I don't know, it's a good question. I think the one thing that I would say works in Roethlisberger's favor is the elevation of someone like Matt Canada to offensive coordinator. You know, he is the guy that essentially, you know, if you talked about what McVeigh was running to get to the super Bowl that first year, I mean a lot of those ideas came from Matt Canada. I mean he was the kind of guy that inspired a lot of this. I don't know, you want to call it rethinking the Arena League motion, you know, getting guys at full momentum before the snap, all that stuff. I mean, he was one of the guys that was doing that at the beginning, um, and was in on the ground floor that does he have more of that left in him? Um? I think that's a valid question. But if he can do some of that stuff to sort of release the pressure on Roethlisberger, I think that that's something that again further legitimizes Colbert's decision, makes it worthwhile. But if not, I mean, you have a sitting duck back there. And I think that it's your earlier point about developmental quarterbacks. You know, most of them don't work out, but teams aren't really looking at them the right way. Like I would say, if you get a guy like you know, like the Ravens do this well, where I think you get someone like Trace McSorley where you can do five or six different things with him to legitimize his place on the roster, but you can also put him in and even if he just runs zone read, he's still winning the battle mathematically. You know, in Pittsburgh doesn't have that guy where they can at least gain two or three yards if they put somebody in that's maybe more of a runner or is more productive when he's on the move. You know, they don't have any of those options. So I think the only thing left is to bet on someone like Canada and see if he can get the best out of the rest of his career. Yeah, that's uh, I mean that that's like the age old debate. And I used to have this this argument with my former host on this podcast. Where do you want the backup quarterback to basically be another version of your starter or do you want your backup quarterback to be uh maybe something different, maybe something uh, even if it's not expansive, just something different, something where you can be creative with. And uh, you know, certainly the Steelers the way they're built right now, the guy they have is backup is is sort of a lesser version of their starter. And we'll see how they do going forward here. Even Dwayne Haskins, if you do think Dayne hasks is gonna work out, and I don't think there's any reason to really think get at this point, but uh, you know, Dwayne Haskins is stylistically, I mean, he's like Roethlisberger at this point. He is. I mean that that was the comp of him coming out of college anyway, you know, um, it was like a Roethlisberger light kind of player, and you know, I don't necessarily see the same accuracy. But then again, Roethlisberger looked really bad as rookie year, but he had an all star running game and a great defense and a great team around him, a great offensive coordinator and quarterbacks coach at the time who could help kind of move him along. Um, and so yeah, we'll see. I mean, maybe this is a flyer that works out. It's not like it's Haskins. I think is lower risk and higher reward than some of the other options they could have done. No. Absolutely, Uh, let's let's head out to Chicago, where we are going to touch on another sad quarterback situation. Uh, much much sadder than the one in pitchwork. Uh. Look, Russell Wilson's agent, Mark Rogers sort of floated this list of teams where Russell Wilson would be willing to be traded to. I'm still in the camp of I don't think Russell Wilson's going anywhere. I think he's stays in Seattle and think they work it out, uh, at least for the upcoming season, and we'll see how that plays out with Shane Waldron going out there as a new offensive coordinator. But uh, you know, the four teams are the Saints, the Bears, the Raiders. Help me out, who's the fourth on Connor? The Cowboys? The Cowboys, that's right. Uh So all teams that are sort of built to potentially win. Now, the Bears are the team that you circle is okay, Well, they don't have any answers at quarterback at this point. I mean they're they're the team that really, uh is a blank slate as far as that position goes. And I just don't know how they would possibly be able to put together a trade package that would please the Seahawks enough to actually make that deal, because you know, we talked about this with John Watson a little bit. If you are going to trade your franchise quarterback, you want to know who your next quarterback is going to be. And trading with the Bears to not give you that, whereas the other three teams at least might give you an option. Maybe not the Saints, but I don't know, do some sort of sign and tray with Jamis or something like that. Well, I laugh at the Bears is an option? And really, anybody tantalizing the Seahawks with a late first round pick lead trade package when the Seahawks haven't utilized any of their late first round picks in years, like they just it's not something that they really see value, and they've traded out of that spot time and time again, um or have just flipped it for for other assets. And so I think that anybody suggesting that, oh, they're gonna they're gonna desire these this Bears trade package, I think is is ludicrous. And I think the other thing too is the Bears are about to make a really bad decision, which is, you know, if you have a GM and a coach who know that they're not going to be there next year if they don't make the playoffs, you know, you have to make a gigantic swing in free agency and get a quarterback to come in and run your offense, or you have to draft somebody and start the clock all over her again and hope that you develop them enough to legitimize you know, you're being around for another year. And so I think that there's a lot of you know, messiness that could come of this um you know, and I don't really know what the right answer is for Chicago because they were always going to be that last team standing when the when the music stopped. I think in musical chairs, you know, Carson wentz to the Colts made a lot of sense, and once that happened, and that move happened. If you're the Bears, you're looking around now and saying, Okay, I mean, is it Jamis Winston? You know, can we go and get Derek Carr? I don't know, you know, I don't really know what the options are for them at this point. Yeah, I mean, look, I think realistically you're looking at the free agent class and for the Bears right now, and that would be that, like you said, it would be Jameis Winston, Cam Newton, Jacoby Brissette, Ryan Fitzpatrick, Andy Dalton. I know Trubisky is a free agent here. I just I wouldn't rule it out true Whisky working somewhere, but not in Chicago. I mean, there is zero ust in him, and you see it every time they get into a big game where they just completely uh just dial down the offense and run the most limited stuff they possibly can. Alex Smith, you know, is a guy who knows Mattneggie's offense. You know, I don't know. It's it's really like, you know, and are you are you counting on him to get you through half of a season. I don't know. I think this is a really complex situation. They like the Jaguars wrote it too long with the rookie quarterback and kept trying to talk themselves into it, and then this is the situation you find yourself in. Yeah, it's uh, it's a head scratcher, because, like I said, with that defense, if you lose, you know, let's say there's a scenario where you have to you know, you want Russell Wilson, so you have to part with Khalil Mack well not. Your defense just went from potentially a A minus to probably a BB minus hubby unit, And now do you have enough to to win with that? If you're Russell Wilson, you probably just landed with the same type of roster you just left in Seattle, maybe a little bit worse at that point. Uh. But yeah, it's a uh, it's not a great situation. I mean, yeah, I don't know. I just keep looking at these names Brissette and pray that you can you can unlock a little bit more out of him. But if it didn't work out with Whisky, I I don't know, not good. If your Bears ownership too. Here's the other thing that you have to look at. Do you want? And this is the same question that the Jets could have asked themselves a few years ago. This is the same thing that a lot of owners could have asked themselves a year ago. When you're essentially giving your coach and your GM one more year to prove themselves. Is what am I going to allow them to do? Am I going to allow them to sign Cam Newton to a ridiculous contract? Am I going to allow them to go trade the farm for someone like Derek Carr? Or Am I going to say no, this is the bed that you guys made, It's time to lie in it. And worst case scenario if I'm me, if I'm the Bears, you bottom out and you get a top five pick next year with my new coach in my new GM. But I'm not letting you guys mortgage the future just so you can stay around for another few years. You know it so rarely works out. And I think that people are pointing to Jason Light and Tampa Bay, where you know, you go all in to sort of save yourself from that in battled stage and you end up winning the super Bowl and now you never have to worry about work again, which is great for you, Um, but I don't think it works out that well for a lot of other people. I mean, you know, less Needs been making a living off this now for almost a decade, and good for him, and he made a super Bowl and a similar sort of calculated maneuver. But uh, if if it doesn't work out, you're really just sinking the franchise. And the Bears do need such a hard reset. I mean they really just do need a hard offensive reset that's not coming, um just by way of free agency this offseason. Yeah, it's uh, Jason Light sort of the strangest sort Jason like missed with the number one overall pick of the draft, which is usually just absolute death for a general manager, and rafted yep, drafted kicker second round. Uh, and he kept his job, landed Tom Brady and won a super Bowl. And I don't know what the lesson is in that, but it's something that happened. The lesson is to just do insane stuff and if it doesn't work out, you know, who gives a ship signed Tom Brady? You know, I think that's really the lesson for in that For all of us, let's, uh, let's take a quick look, or I should say it's more a quick conversation of what's going to happen this upcoming week. The new league gear starts on March seventeenth, St. Patrick's Day. Uh, that's obviously going to be sort of the the you know, a week from now will be the opening of free agency, whereas this week is going to be sort of the blood bath, if we could put it as uh distastefully as possible, uh, the league right now, with the shrinking salary cap, these middle class guys, if you are not a superstar and you are not on a rookie contract, so many of these middle class guys are about to get cut and end up out on the uh, out on the open market, where they're then gonna have to settle for less than what they thought they were going to be making in one here. And look, with some of these guys, it is it's expected. It happens every year. Guys who end up on contracts that look bad a year after they sign it get let go hoehever it might be, but it's going to be to the extreme this year, and it's sort of the the continuing just aggressive shrinking of the middle class in the NFL. I know it's gonna be it's gonna be weird, and I think it's gonna alter you know, all this work that you put in on this top two D free agent lists, Gary, that we're going to talk about here in a minute, it's just going to be completely scrambled when when we get into the situation where you know, all these guys start flying on the market, like what about you know, Jalen Smith being out there and available all of a sudden or something like that. You know, that certainly changes the calculus on a lot of people. Are zach Ertz? What does he do on the open market assuming that he's healthy? So I don't know. I think it's gonna be really interesting. And uh, you know, the NFL is at the end of the day, no different than any monolith corporation that any of our lovely listeners listened to, where they're going to use this as an excuse to cut guys that they just didn't really want around anyway and say it was the pandemic and it was a loss of revenue, when in reality they could keep them. So if you're a fan, remember that, if you're an Eagles fan and zach Ertz catches eleven touchdowns for the Packers next year. Um, you know, just just keep that in mind. Don't blame anybody else but but your owner. Well, how about how about J J. Watt? Now? J J. Watt signed after we taped the episode last week, which was it was even sadder because we did tape it on Monday, and then he he rudely waited until Monday evening to do his uh little social media announcement of where it was going. Very rude of J J. Watt. But this is kind of this is a couple of things. And by the way, if you were wondering, and I know you were, uh, we had uh, we had J. J. Watt ranked ninth on the free agent list, assuming he was going to be on the open market. He is not, uh this Cardinal team though there's a lot of talk. Now, okay, is it's you know, is it super Bowl ready? Is this going to be a contender in the NFC? Uh? The big hole on the roster if you're looking at it that you're going to sort of worry about, is at cornerback. They don't have great defensive backs outside of sort of Buddha Baker, Byron Murphy. Uh, not in Baker's class, but maybe a guy you can be confident in. Uh. And they just don't really have the outside guys at this point. Patrick Peterson hitting the hitting the open market this this offseason. But the upgraded pass rush and J J. Watt, I think, as a guy who's gonna play forty to fifty snaps a game and maybe have Chandler Jones and and who knows, maybe they bring back Hassan Reddick, all of a sudden, you have a really good pass rush that makes up for that, that makes your mediocre secondary look better than it is. So I think you're gonna see what was already over achieving overachieving defense in Arizona is going to be even better. You have a good defensive coordinator um, and you have some guys like I say, Ah Simmons who can diversify your coverage a little bit um and you know, make things at least momentarily hard enough for a quarterback so that your pass rush has a better chance of getting home. And now your pass rushes top five and so I think that that all that taken into consideration is worth thinking about. I think the Cardinals are super Bowl team. No, Uh, do I think it's a super Bowl offensive line? Probably not either. You know. I think that there's some some issues there that they need to get after, but that's it. I mean, I think that they put themselves in a position to compete. And if you're Steve Kim or your Cliff Kingsbury, you can't like sit around and wait for that division to come back to you. It's always gonna be hard. It's always going to be competitive. And uh, you know, maybe the Rams. You look at them as a front runner for this year, but I don't see them as that far behind. I mean, I think that they're a team that can win ten or eleven games next year. For sure. I would like to see a reinvention of this offense. I don't like what they do offensively. I love Kyler Murray. I think Kyler Murray has solved a lot of their problems just by doing stuff with his legs. And I mean there there are just when you watch a Cardinals games, there are just no easy throws for Kyler Murray on the field, and that's gotta that's gotta change. Though, Like this air raid stuff they're running, you know, it's it's it's obviously it's a lot of quick strike. Uh, it's a lot of ISO routes stuff. Uh. They either have to come up with a new plan or they really have to upgrade that receiver depth chart beyond DeAndre Hopkins and they already invested in DeAndre Hopkins here. Yeah, it's so weird because they run for wide sets more than any team in the NFL, and they just I don't feel like they're getting the the r o I on it, you know what I mean. It's it's and if you're gonna be that team, you're gonna be the four wide team, then let's throw the ball sixty times a game and let's let's make this a real deal air raid offense. But it just seems so, you know, stuck in neutral. And I think that that's going to be the challenge for Cliff Kingsbury this offseason. If Kyler Murray has really been running this system for his entire life, then it's time to take the reins off and let him operate as such. M We'll see here Myocondria. Man. I I really I I really, I really want to see um something new there in Arizona. But to uh, let's uh, let's do O'Connor. Let's talk about the top two hundred free agent lists. This is coming out right now. The plane is for it to come out on Tuesday on SI dot com, so you can look for it there. Uh, it'll just be uh, it'll be quite the event. But uh, just go just yell at me and I'll feebly try to defend myself. I'm gonna just I'm gonna start by reading all the names really slowly in an English accent, so it'll be like if if you want this to double is like as like a hypnosis app you know, then then we can do it that way for trying to fall asleep. Then I'll just justin Simmons safety broncos. Uh, this is uh and and and before we start, So are you gonna throw at me? You're gonna throw guys who you were surprised at how high they were or how low they were both. Yeah. So the original plan was for Gary to do a top a hundred and the me to do a top a hundred, and then um, you know, we were going to kind of meet in the middle and find a way to average them. But then Gary did a lot of hard work and Connor is super lazy. So instead of me doing my own top two hundred, I just decided to wait for Gary to do it and then complain about it, which is what you do. This is the millennial way and uh, you know, so, so this is what we're gonna do. Um. I you know, I think that there are a lot of good things about this list. You and I have talked about the Vic Fangio effect and in in in conjunction, probably the Brandon Staley effect. And so John Johnson is a guy that you know in Justin Simmons for that manner that I'm afraid of if I'm not either of the teams that already know how to use him use them. Um. And so I think that that would affect a little bit of my thought process. There. You love Curtis Samuel. You love Curtis Samuel. Um, and I think he's quite high on this list. What do you have him at twenty uh one? Right? And yeah, and and we should mention this is subject to change in the next uh I guess twenty four hours or so? Yeah, right, yeah, right now he's twenty one and ahead of you know, I would put Will Fuller. You have Will Fuller at thirty, which I you know, I would almost flip them. And then Taylor Moten, how how is he? Like you've kind of banged a lot of the offensive tackles, like Taylor Moten is at twenty six, Um, Darryl Williams is at thirty two, And then I think, Um, where's Cam Robinson because I remember just looking at that one. Um, is he even in the top fifty or is he a little bit deeper than that? He might be a deeper And I think that all of these guys are adequate offensive tackles to the point where, you know, I would venture to argue that if the Chiefs had any of those three guys, that they might a vote the Super Bowl, you know. And so I think that we saw um and and maybe our focus is just attended to that because of the magnitude of the Super Bowl. But at the same time, it's like, man, even like adequate, like Cam Robinson gave up five sacks last year. That's good enough to be, you know, in my mind, like a top thirty free agent. I think you're gonna get paid like a lot more than some of the guys that are on this list, just by virtue of the position. But I think positional value um offensive line adequate offensive line play has never been more important in the NFL. That's uh, that's fair. I might be too low on Molten, and I don't think I'm terribly low on I mean, he is twenty six, you know. Uh. There are the guy I'm really not crazy about, and and we've talked about this off the era, Alejandro Villaneueva. I would I think there are just just read flags waving all over the place when you're coming out of an offense that just did nothing but quick strike and you struggled the way you did. I think vill in a way that had a great career in Pittsburgh. I just I would not trust him to be my left tackle if I was shopping for one on the open market year. I just don't think it's going to translate somewhere else. Uh. Cam Robinson is is a little bit strange. Uh. I always get nervous about teams who don't lock up their own draft picks, and the Jaguards are probably not a team that you should look at and as as a as a model franchise, I mean, the reason they have all this cap room going to this offseason is because they drafted so incredibly poorly and now they don't have anyone to resign, or the few guys who they did draft well with they alienated and and push them out. So the fact they didn't lock up Cam Robinson just that in and of itself is kind of a red flag to me. They know him better than anyone, uh and if they weren't going to make the move to keep him there with all the cap room they have, maybe there's something up, Maybe they know something that that we don't know, or maybe this is just what the Jaguars do and they just don't manage the roster very well at all. That might be the more likely scenario. No, you make a good point. I think when Dave Caldwell was there, especially, there was a push to sign homegrown talent, and I think he did do well enough. I mean, he did get some good offensive lineman there, especially when you know they first were had Leonard four Nett and they and they made it to the to the a f C Championship Game. There was some talent on that roster. So I agree that there you know, there was that you know, and maybe Robinson just didn't flash in that window. And then by the time Tom Coughlin got there and everything got complicated, some of their typical processes just got thrown out the window. I don't know what it was, but you know, if you're Urban Meyer, I think you can't in good conscience start over at that position. Like I think you at least have to find a one year stop gap solution. Maybe you franchise him because you have the money anyway, and who cares, you know, and you let him play that one year, see if he can p tech Trevor Lawrence, and then you hope that the coaching staff that you brought in can develop somebody to take over at some point, or if you hit on some of these other guys. I just think the tackle market in general is gonna be bananas. It's gonna it's gonna be such a high cost thing. I mean, if you can land Trent Williams or something like that, that's great, that's good for you. But um, he's only going to go to one place, and he's probably not gonna pick Jacksonville. You know, he's not gonna want to destroy his statistics. Um, you know, but with a rookie quarterback, who's gonna hold onto the ball for too long, and so I think it's gonna be interesting to see what they do there. I would assume that they're going to keep him just by virtue of you know, how far are you going to improve yourself? Um in any other way? Um, But I'm not done yelling at you yet. So UM, let's see what else we got here? Should ob a Woozier, um isn't like the sixties, and this is a guy with elite speed. And his worst season in the NFL was a sixty percent opposing quarterback completion rating, Like that's you know, most season, most the last first two years before that it was in the fifties. Um. And last year he had some injury issues, hamstring issues, and then uh I spent some time on the COVID list so and was in a bad defense. So I don't think that even last year you kind of throw out the window. And before that I would have put him um as as a fairly elite cornerback. The same thing with Shaq Griffin, I thought was a little low on your list, although not as low as a Woozier. And then the other one that I kind of threw up my hands, that was like Sheldon rankings barely cracking the top hundred. That's a guy that I think, if I'm any other team, I look at and say, Okay, you know he doesn't have the pressure stats, but you're playing with Cam Jordan, Trey Hendrickson, Um, you know all these pass rushers. You know, someone's got to make this happen and in the interior, and I think rankings was a big part of that. In their defense, I probably banged rankings a little bit because I didn't want to, you know, I didn't want to be the guy who, uh can't let go of the uh the draft slot he was. He was actually a twelve overall picks. So it's like if it, you know, if he I don't want to go too far the other way either. I'm open to Sheldon rankings. But like you said, I mean, that's a that's a defense that creates a lot of advantageous matchups for their defensive lineman. Uh. The fact that he wasn't terribly productive the last two seasons and look injuries, probably you had a lot to do with it, and uh we could see something much better going forward here. But he's uh, he'll be twenty seven in April, so uh, there's plenty to go here for rankings, but uh um, as far as the corners go, Man, I hate shopping for corners if you don't have in my mind, and I do this all the time in my mind, if you're not sort of a clear cut number one like Byron Jones a year ago. Even though Byron Jones maybe didn't have his best season his first year in Miami, I think he was solid. I think he is a true number one corner These guys who are sort of on the fringe, I just think there's such Uh. If I could make a baseball metaphor, which you know we will understand because it's a football podcast, you know how year to year short relievers they're just they're always guys who just emerge as like, oh wow, this guy, you know, he had a one point six e r A and he came out of nowhere and did this. I feel like that's what these sort of number two cornerbacks are in the NFL. They're so volatile year to year. Uh. And I always hold up Ronald Darby as the example of being like, there are years where you could looked at Ronald Darby and been like, man, this guy, this guy's really good. This is a guy, you know, pay this guy, I mean, get him in there. He's he's a fringe number one. And then there's other years where it's just like, boy, this guy can't play. You gotta get him off the field. Got an upgrade here. I think so many guys fall into that category, and it's just sort of trying to to parse the difference here. I will say in defense of Shaquille Griffin, and I can't remember if you or I wrote him up. I wrote up Dunbar and maybe you wrote up Griffin. But uh, playing in Seattle has been incredibly stressful on the defensive backs because they've had no pass rush there since sins like Cliff Avril left. I mean, it's it's just really difficult to cover when there's no pass rush in front of you. So I am open to Griffin sort of being that breakout guy and being a true number one. I just I haven't seen it and just makes me so nervous, uh going forward with a guy like that. I like your middle reliever analogy. Um, and it's especially painful for you and I it was Orioles fans because the only team that seems to develop any talented middle relievers that have staying power is the Orioles. But they can't hold onto any of them. So Zack Briton, Uh, Darren O'Day um who Pedro Strop? Uh? You know all these guys were like dominant for like three or four years, but only one year for us and then uh, you know, good for everybody else there's and then there's no one else who can play on that team. So yeah, they just gave gave it all the way. Uh. You know Ellen Bundy, is he still around? That's that that's only the Angels last year. You know, of course he did. This is a this is a good segment. Connor Garry wonder about former Orioles. Oh man, Uh, we're just roping you in, but no, I agree, but I do so. I think it's gonna be interesting though, because here's how the calculus changes. If you are a team that's expecting the NFL to stay as the current NFL for like another two years, where you know, you run first offenses aren't going to take over for another you know, maybe year or two, and you're still going to have to worry about the Chiefs and the Cardinals and these teams who are going to throw the ball more often. You know, this is gonna be a nice offseason to pick up a defensive back for seven or eight million dollars for one year and then hopefully, you know, these guys spring board into longer term deals for them. Like, I don't think any of these players are going to kill it on the free agent market, but at the same time, it'll be a nice deal for for somebody out there. Yeah, it's uh boy, the cornerbacks maybe nervous. The receivers don't though. Uh, it's just that there's so many receivers and the draft class coming in is so good. I probably sort of deflated some of these rankings here anyway, but I will. I do want to address Curtis Samuel and my love for Curtis Samuel at this point. I think he was used incorrectly the first couple of seasons of his career. I think they found the right usage for him. I think Joe Brady found the right usage and making him more of a catch and run threat last season, And had they not had an opportunity to add Robby Anderson on a really team friendly deal and had d J. Moore in there, I think Curtis Samuel could have been a guy who had you know, ninety catches and yards or whatever it might be. I think he's sort of in that mold of you know, I'm not gonna say he's he's like a J Brown or something that he's done that that kind of size, but I think he's in that mold of that sort of uh, you know, running back with the ball in his hands type of guy. And I think he is expanding his game as receiver a little bit. I think I think his floor is sort of high end number two receiver, and I think he's absolutely potential number one in the you know, in the right spot here. Yeah, I agree. And I think that the counter to that is going to be you're gonna have to have an offensive coordinator that's as good as Joe Brady. And I don't think that there's like, you know, I don't think there's five or six offensive coordinators that are better than him in the NFL right now. And so is there going to be a guy that's out there that can you know, kind of develop Curtis Samuel and use him like that, or is he gonna end up on the Jets, you know, and and kind of fade away. I don't know. I don't know what the right answer is there, but it's a fair point. Um. Everything else about the list, I like. I think that you've did a good job of putting it together. I'm very very curious to see, um, where some of these guys end up in terms of you know, there's a lot of older players. Um, you know, a lot of guys who can probably be that final piece of the puzzle. Although last year it kind of instructed thoughts on that, Like we thought Klais Campbell was the guy that would push the Ravens over the edge, and I think that they're gonna be those guys this year, Um, that sign and make us think that this team is going to be completely ready to to push to the next level. But I don't know. It's interesting list a lot of old guys, a lot of bad times for old guys to be free agents. Um. But you know, as always like one or two or three potential really dominant value signings out there. So I chut, I think it's gonna be a year where where a lot of guys are bummed out with the kind of contract they end up settling for. We'll see, We'll have plenty of free agency stuff next week, uh as we sort of I don't know, by by the time this podcast comes out, we'll probably be ramping up pretty well as far as the uh free agency hot stove season goes in the NFL. And that, uh, that's what this podcast is all about. That in Orioles baseball at this point. Oh, I just can't wait for Orioles. A little more Orioles baseball this year. Um pictures and catchers. But yeah, no, I think it's a you know, it's gonna be super tiresome though, is um Uh, what's gonna be super tiresome is the idea that so many more of these guys, since it's a down year, right and uh and and there's not a lot of money being handed out, might go to the Buccaneers, you know what I mean. And and then it's just further is that narrative of oh, the super team, you know, and and here it goes and and I don't know, I think that that might be a storyline and free agency. I think that, uh, it's gonna further perpetuate the idea that you know, I think there's gonna be three or four teams that really attract the hive. You know, Cleveland might be another one since they're already Sun is so far down that road of star studded talent that that it makes it makes sense to just continue loading up there. But I don't know, you know, I think it's Uh, it's one of those situations where we'll see what happens. But you know, if if the metrics bear out and people want more Orioles talk on this podcast like I could watch some Madly Rutchman all day, baby, and uh you we can. We can talk about the future of the catcher position because we finally got somebody in there. So just like when we add Matt Weiters, it's gonna it's gonna now he's gonna be he's gonna be better. But uh, I couldn't name five players on their roster. I'm sure it's just brutal, and that's what that's I'm gonna try real quick. I'm gonna pull it up, just just just give it a go. Okay, So they traded Alex Cobb, correct, so he's not there, and they traded Michael Gibbons. Um, there's one trade man, Sini, Yep, there's there's one you gotta get because he can't. You can't get rid of him. I can't get rid of him. Uh oh, Chris Davis. Yeah that's too yep. Uh, boy, that might be it. Yeah, I mean I would say, you know, Hunter Harvey was the other one that I knew. But other than that, this seems to be a largely anonymous roster, devoid of star power. They've Freddy Galvis. Boy, that's that's the most excitement. His name as h ever warranted. Uh they got that? Um? Uh? Rio Ruiz is he still on the team? Is that a name I just made up? Rio Ruiz is still on the team. Yeah, there we go. So I got three nice so you go. Yeah, you know we're in good shape. World series or bust. Yeah, world series. Let's do it all right, Connor, lots of free agency stuff come up this week. I'm sure you and Jenny on the Week's Side podcast will have a plenty to discuss as far as that goes. And uh, thanks for being on. Talk to you next week. Thanks for having me. Gary. The mm QB Monday Morning NFL podcast is Connor Or and me Gary Grammling. We are produced by Shelving Royson. S E is executive producer of podcasts is Scott Brody, Mark Rabick is emeritus editor of the mm QB, and Andy Benoit is the founder of the mm QB NFL podcast. Be sure to subscribe to this feed, as well as the feeds for The weak Side Podcast and The Albert Brier Show. They're all for free on Apple Podcasts, and once you do subscribe, please leave a rating and review for all of them. It really does help other people find the shows, which are also available on Spotify, Radio dot com, Stitcher, s i dot com, and wherever else you listen to podcasts.

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