Hello, week's side podcast listeners. I'm Jenny Brentis here with connor Or. We are back for this week's second episode, and we have a very special cover story to talk about. Connor Or had the cover for this month's issue of Sports Illustrated, hitting newsstands this week. It's the September issue. It features none other than Russell Wilson, QB. One of a kind, the art and science of making the impossible routine. So, Connor, you dove into a little bit of the magic that Wilson creates on the field. He broke down for you how he's able to create some of this magic, which is such a curiosity, right. I mean, he's this unusual quarterback who's kind of challenged the norms for what a quarterback's body type and size should be. And part of the reason he's so able to improvise and do these magical things is because his body works in unusual, special, unique ways. Um, what insight did you learn from him about kind of how he makes those I always think of it as like a wind up toy back there and he kind of zooms around the field and then with like this is the seeming quick flip or slight body movement can deliver the ball down field that she described so well. Yes, so I think oddly enough we we Russell Wilson and I got a chance to get together on on Zoom and watch these plays. But one of the most interesting things I think I learned was from Maggie kay Katlan, who is a physical therapist at the University of Washington, and um, we owe a huge debt of gratitude to her for this story. She watched a ton of Russell Wilson film for us, as well as a ton of Aaron Rodgers film and Tom Brady film in order to have sort of a comparable baseline of and and she works with football players on a regular basis too, So this was not, you know, something that was totally foreign to her. But you know, she said that Russell Wilson essentially changed, you know, somehow forced his body over the course of his life, to just alter the motor planning um that his brain and body and all those connections make. Whereas you know, let's say Aaron Rodgers is stepping up into the pocket and he's got to move a little bit and throw, like the brain and the body have to agree on two or three separate things in order to make that happen. And she's like, but if you watch Russell Wilson, it's one thing. You know, his body has somehow trained itself over the course of his life to essentially evolve at the position and to basically bundle all this stuff together into one fluid movement, which I think is like totally fascinating. Russell Wilson said he doesn't really get into the science of it, although if you talk to his trainers, if and you know, once you got him going a little bit, it's very clear that, you know, he tries to bake all this stuff into his routine, you know, all the little workouts that he does, all the little um you know, his trainers have to invent drills for him since he doesn't really play like any other quarterback, which I think is interesting. I thought it was also interesting that he had these moments from growing up. One of them was he was in a mall and kind of spinning off people in the sea of you know, shoppers coming to you know, Richmond mall. That was an interesting scene. Also, things he's done on the athletic fields in high school. He seemed to have an excellent recall of all of these things and how they might have informed his current abilities. Yeah, oddly spooky recall, like he remembered instantly the first time that he threw a fadeaway pass in a football game and who he threw it to in high school. So take that, Sean McVeigh. You're not the only guy that can remember things instantly. But um, you know the reality of this a lot of these stories, um is that you know a lot of quarterbacks, especially at Russell Wilson's level, Um, you know, do want to promote something, Right, if you're talking to Tom Brady, you're talking about the Tom Brady method, or you know, if you're talking to any of these people, you're kind of talking about a cause that's also near and dear to their heart, or business venture an opportunity. But I think what's interesting is that what Russell is promoting is multi sport athletes. That's kind of his big um stump speech right now, the big cause that he's advocating for. And you know, certainly it's something that he talks a lot about with regularity. But you can see how it helps. I mean, you know, we went back and we're watching some of these plays. You know, the playoff game when they almost came back and caught the Panthers that year that the Panthers made to the Super Bowl. Um. And on that one play where he throws this fade away touchdown, uh to Jerome curse. You know, he's he's saying, Okay, well, right here, I'm sliding. And that's a movement that I learned from baseball because you have to dive into the hole and you know right here, you know, this is a fade away pass or you know, this is I learned how to look at a broad panoramic of things from basketball because I was a point guard and you know, so it's interesting that, um. You know, some people can kind of carry those functional experiences with them. UM. And you know that's something that he he's very passionate about. And uh, I guess you know, I think you can see it. I think he does move unlike really any other quarterback that we do see in the NFL. And part of that is height, but I do think part of that is his history as well, and for all of the success he's had on the field, for you know, all of the early you know way in which he burst onto the scene, right, I mean he's never received an m v P boat. Is he the kind of forgotten quarterback when we discussed the pecking order? So I think this is what I found very interesting and UMU for two reasons. One, if you talk to people in his camp, um there was almost this eagerness to say that he's been doing these Patrick Mahomes things since two thousand thirteen. He's been throwing no look passes in practice and behind the back passes and you know, watched his old dude Perfect videos. He does all this stuff and nobody was paying attention back then. And you know, even footage that they provided to us from practice, they're almost like joking about. You know, his his trainer said, oh, the Pat Mahomes throw, and then Russell Wilson saying, well, the quote unquote Pat Mahomes throw. And you know there's this maybe slight eagerness to say, hey, you know I've been here this whole time. Um I was this theatrical mobile quarterback back when everybody said it wasn't important, and now that it's something that we're focusing on, have sharpened my pocket game. And you know, there's really there was really no time for credit, right it was we were saying goodbye to Peyton Manning and Eli Manning and all these guys when Wilson was coming up, and now we're saying hello to Patrick Mahomes and Deshaun Watson and Lamar Jackson. And it feels like, I don't know if he personally feels stuck in the middle, but it does seem like, you know, he's kind of waving his hand here and saying, hey, I've been doing some pretty special things here all along too. Yeah, that is definitely an interesting past ability to consider that he is kind of the cot in the middle kind of guy. And I think in his case, the improvisational ability, the you know, magic that he's able to create, to make things on the fly. In some ways that was positioned or cast as maybe making up for his lack of height, right, whereas Patrick Mahomes, they say, oh, he's got everything and he does this, he does everything right. And I think with Wilson and sometimes perhaps I don't know if you agree with me on that, but it did seem like there has been an effort to say, well, he does this to compensate for the fact that maybe his size isn't the typical prototype, and this is how he makes up for it. Yeah. No, I think that's a great point. And um, you know, his quarterbacks coach and offensive coordinator at North Carolina State, Dana Bible, said, you know, we we had plays that we would run, but we also had what was called the escape plan, and that's you know, that just worked better. And it was you know, Russell Wilson no knowing how the play was going to develop. His ability to turn his back to the field and still keep a head count of everyone around him. He's like that, that's not an adaptability thing. That's a god given thing. That's just a trait, that's a talent that you build around. It's not like, you know, somebody's trying to do this or that or the other thing. It's just that we understand what he does particularly well, and so we're gonna adapt and design around it. And I think what's interesting now is that it's the other way in Seattle, where Russell has gone to an offense that Pete Carroll wants to look a certain way and he's had to find his way around in that offense, whereas it's not really designed for him, and you wonder, you know where this is going to go in the future, does Seattle allow him, um, a little bit more freedom to do this or you know, you know, where does that go? Because they're still the most run heavy, consistent offense in football. Um, I think that they had the in twenty nine eighteen the fewest number of percentage of passing plays, and they might had like second or third fewests. So it's interesting just to see, you know, kind of where this is all going, what Russell can do, what Seattle is going to allow him to do, and how that all affects our perception of him. Speaking of where it's going, he says, he's thirty one. I'm right at the beginning of my prime, at least ten plus years left. My goal is to play another fifteen years. So what do you think that those potential fifteen years could hold for Russell Wilson? Fifteen years is a long time, right, that's a long way to project out. You would say that, Um, maybe because of his body composition, you know, he's well positioned to take the rigors of of the game, you know, I mean, he can probably take hits better than some of the quarterbacks just because he is a little bit stockier, probably a little bit more well built. But UM, I think it's interesting. You know, he said that he's studied, um, the career lifespans of other quarterbacks. Um, you know, Steve Young was a big one that he said that Steve Young only really started hitting his I'm around this time, and so that's something that he's taken into account and so you know, we'll see where it goes. Um. You know, I think we were making fun of maybe five or ten years ago, all these quarterbacks coming out and it was like, you know, one after the other saying, oh, I want to play until I forty two, I want to play until forty three, and then Tom Brady saying you wanted to play until he's forty five. But the reality of the situation is this is happening. You know, these guys are living, um, their athletic careers longer, they're keeping themselves healthier, and uh, you know, we'll see where it goes. Does Russell's loss of mobility over that time affect him? Who knows. I think he's becoming a better pocket passer. But um, it is interesting to say that he wants to play fifteen more years, which would put him at forty six, which is one more year than Tom Brady plans to play. Uh is there a little bit to be read into there? Who knows? Or fifteens around number could be either way, but I like the I like the little spice there. Well, it was a great story, Connor, really interesting read. People should read it on our web side and also pick up the hard copy. Thanks for taking us behind the scenes a little bit, Connor, Well, thanks for thanks for asking. And I'm very excited because my local grocery store is very behind in their updating of the news stands, so there's going to be an exciting overlap period there where I'm gonna get Jenny's cover from the football preview issue, and then we'll do like a little weak side podcast picture that I'm gonna take right there in the supermarket. So I'm very excited about that. That's funny, it sounds good. Connor. Um, alright, Kelly, move into the news topics this week. Let's do it alright. Topic number one. Earl Thomas was released by the Ravens this week, fueling unfounded for now, speculation that he may finally get his wish to join the Cowboys. This has not been the smoothest transition from Seattle to life outside the legion of boom for Thomas. Might there be a reason the Ravens were willing to part ways? So there was a fight, right and and you know, everything kind of happened after that. But um, you know, it's not like Thomas has been outside of the news. And I don't want to speculate on anybody, you know, anything that anybody has going on right now. But usually when a player of this caliber gets dumped before the season, especially when you need veterans who understand the system as well as he did, something's got to be up there right and he doesn't get snapped up right away. I mean, I think that that's something that uh warrants paying attention to. Yeah, one season in Baltimore was certainly not what we expected. It was such a hyped signing a year ago, thought to be, uh, you know, a key piece for this Baltimore team that was looking to contend for a while, and certainly that was what his intention was. I mean I talked to him before their playoff loss in January, and he said that it was really important to him to go somewhere else and have success after Seattle, he said. I looked up these quotes because I was thinking about them this week. I never wanted anybody to question, like, oh, Pete Carroll made this guy, because I've been doing this all my life. No matter what scheme I'm in, I'm going to try to figure it out and I'm going to ball out. So that was one of my goals here and I think I've proved that. UM and he said, you know, winning a Super Bowl somewhere other than Seattle would mean a lot, because it's all about legacy at this point right now. To add that to my legacy and do it with another group of guys, that'd be great. I want to go to the Hall of Fame. That's the ultimate goal, so that would look really good. So it was interesting to go from that to where he's cut. And obviously, yeah, there's been a lot of things happening this offseason. There were some reports that the Leadership Council UM after the altercation at practice, UM wanted him gone and that was a factor in the Ravens decision making. There was also some reports last after last season that he didn't quite fit into the scheme and was kind of doing his own thing at times, So it does seem like there was a little bit more UM going on behind the scenes there in terms of fitting into a new team. But certainly he seems like someone who is very motivated. You have a post Seattle career with success, and so it will be interesting to see if and when he lands somewhere. Isn't it absolutely fascinating to you? Like you know, I remember and this goes back to our UM days with the Jets, but like I remember, UM when Mohammed Wilkerson, uh, you know, his first or second year um, you know, the defensive coaches saying he's he's he's not doing what he's supposed to do. He's just out there doing his own thing. And like it's unfathomable, Like you and I watch practice every day in all the effort that people put into it, and yet like during games that players just decide sometimes not to do like what's explained them and sometimes it is that it is not explained properly, that that is a UM not solely on the players. But it is fascinating. The idea of like standing out is this freelancer um in the NFL when there's so much regiment, structure and all this stuff built into asking you to do things a certain way. Yeah, and I think when he came to Baltimore, there is an expectation that, you know, he kind of was one of these He had a championship history in Seattle. He comes to Baltimore joined a defense that has a long legacy in that city. Obviously the safety position with Ed Reid, and I think there were pretty high expectations. Uh, and ultimately it might not have been that good have a fit. But this is now two teams that the ending has gone bitterly for with Earl Thomas. Obviously there was um difficult split with Seattle um, you know, as we saw him being carted off the field and the gesture that he gave to Pete Carroll. And now we have another um split that has a lot of speculation and discussion around it. So that certainly is a factor when other teams are looking at bringing him in. But it's try to imagine he will not get another opportunity. Connor, I mean, good lord, we're still talking about Antonio Brown signing somewhere something this season. So what's but um? Alright, new topic number two? UM. I thought this was a good um um by the Lions. Here. They stopped practice yesterday and address reporters in mass about um the police shooting of Jacob Blake, who is an African American man in Kanasha, Wisconsin. After so many years of avoiding any message with political implications, it seems like the NFL is more willing to dive in now. We've talked on this podcast a lot about the value of being first in doing something versus forced, you know, to do something. And I think that this was a good job by the Lions staff of reacting immediately to something, sensing that there was an issue that players are passionate about and giving them the platform to speak out about it. And this follows Roger Goodell who was on with UM Emmanuel Acco earlier this week and he said that, um, you know, he had wished that he had listened to Colin Kaepernick sooner, which, um, you know, as far as Goodell goes, that's going to be probably the most open and honest and I'm using air quotes here that you're going to hear from him about a subject like this. Yeah. I thought this was a powerful stand from the Lions. Were so used to these discussions. Football can't be moved and don't do anything that bothers football, and you know, keep your thoughts out of sports, right, and here was a day in which they decided to cancel practice. They recognize the fact that their players are human beings and that it would be difficult to practice on a day after seeing that video, especially as a black man in America. And Matt Patricia listened to his players. They adjusted and instead of practicing, instead of forcing them to just go through the day as you would as if nothing happened, they not only did that, but they also used the opportunity to issue a powerful statement. So I thought that was really well handled. And I think it, um, I think it reflects the shift that hopefully we're seeing not the human side is considered a little bit more and we're not trying to box people in as well. You can be athletes in this uh in since and then save your social activism for some other time and place. Right. I think it was a recognition of your experiences and the impact that seeing a video like that would have on you. UM should be listened to and should be important. UM should be treated as important, and should be treated as more important than football. Yeah, UM surprised a little bit. I mean, you know, Matt Patricia did not get off to the on the best foot with his players. Over the first two years, there were lots of gripes about um, you know, his attitude, you know, um his you know, timeliness, whatever you like, all this stuff that um, you know was was kind of going on behind the scenes, and everyone kind of just accused him of being this sort of Belichicken clone. But this is a move that really steps out from underneath that. And whether that's informed of his past experiences, whether that this is him trying to change, I don't know what it is, but I do think it's a gesture that at least, you know, tries to you know, actively endear yourselves to the club after maybe spending the last two years doing the exact opposite of that. Yeah, exactly, Connor and notoriously inflexible coach, or at least that's his reputation from the outside, decided to listen to his players, to take their experiences and things they were feeling into account, um and he followed through on that. So I thought that was a really strong statement by the Lions. And I know we're hearing players across sports, you know, take a season off, right because there are more important things going on in the world or maybe um, you know, skipping NBA playoff game. You know, there's we we these conversations are UM have been so open and so honest. Finally this summer, I think, and I think we're hearing a lot of athletes say like, there are so many more important things than sports. Um, and I just thought it was nice to see those priorities being for one day, a day that was difficult for a lot of people in America, a lot of black people in America. And you know what, I think that there's gonna be some cynics on the outside saying that Matt Patricia only did this because, you know, uh, for whatever reason, you know, try to get his team back, to try to do whatever. But you know, sometimes you need to. You know, a good friend of mine gave me a good piece of advice the other day that sometimes you do need to fake it until you make it, you know, and sometimes you do need, you know to uh, you know, maybe Matt Patricia, who knows what reasons he's doing this for. But when something like this happens, regardless of the route that you took to get there, you're forced to pause and consider the situation. You know what I mean, You're forced to think, well, why are we doing this? Why are why are they upset? You know? Why are my teammates, you know, my players? My fellow coach is unhappy, you know. And I think that this is a good exercise. And I hope that, you know, all the other coaches around the league saw that and said, hey, you know what, the next time something like this happens, and let's pray that there is not a next time. UM, but if something like this happens again, you know, maybe we need to be quicker at stepping up and uh and standing up for for everybody else. Yeah, absolutely, all right. So transitioning into topic three, the Dolphins will have fans at games because Florida shouldn't spectator football be a reward and not a continued reason for our punishment? Why the hell are we having people at football games in Florida? This was all the states that don't deserve it, it's you. This was interesting on a lot of levels. There were some coaches, including Sean McDermott, who spoke up about this being a competitive disadvantage UM first advantage disadvantage depending on which team you are, UM. And that's one angle of it. The other angle is the fact at it doesn't really make a lot of sense with all of the effort that's going into regulating practices, regulating who's allowed in team facilities, you know, restricting media viewing and all of these things, to then be opening up your stadium. I saw Mike Florio from Pro Football Talk wrote a little bit about UM that in the c b A, the owners need to take every step that is necessary to maximize revenue UM, which I guess could be one part of this. But obviously there's a lot of usual factors at play this season, so I think that instead of going with the local laws, it would have made sense to have one uniform UH instruction across the league and have it be you know, the same that if there's one state where they're can't be fans, and there should be no states where there can be fans. UM. But yeah, I mean particularly Florida Connor. I did see a tweet from Kevin's side for of ESPN retweeted um in Minnesota, excuse me um. The Minnesota Department of Health said that there were two COVID cases traced to St. Paul's Saints games, and that is a professional baseball team in which there was limited capacity in the stadium, social distancing guidelines, and so I think it's just an example that you're creating an additional risk. I think that there have been a lot of steps taken by the NFL to have protocols that would work for there to be a season. It just feels that fans is an unnecessary additional risk factor. Um that certainly I don't see any scenario in which it's worth it. Remember back when, like we all used to get behind things, and like, imagine a world where, you know, even if the NFL doesn't have a uniform policy, they say, the states that clean this up are the ones that are going to have fans. And then the coaches get on TV and they do a public service announcement and they do have ends, and then they you know whatever, they record their voice and they do telecalls or whatever it is to say, hey, make sure you're wearing your mask. Don't be an idiot. And it's unbelievable that masks became so politicized that we're still in this place where the states that have the highest infection rates are just gonna slam fans into stands this this year instead of like we could have used football as an avenue to help disperse this and to say, hey, this is a big deal. This is a problem, and if you don't fix it, you're not going to be at the stadium on Sunday. Like it's just it's ridiculous that we're at this position right now, and it's so embarrassing that Florida just continues to just nakedly, uh ignore all these health risks, and you know, it is what it is at this point. I mean, you know, I saw that place off and let it just fall into the Atlantic Ocean. Sometimes I feel like, you know, it's just so dumb. And you know, if you're going to one of those games and you're a fan and you worked hard and you social distance, good for you. But you know, I I don't think anybody in a sane mind goes there thinking that something bad can happen. I've been to that stadium. I know you've been to that stadium. We were uh well, we were just there for the Super Bowl too. I mean, you know it's not going to be hard, you know, even if there's thirteen thousand people there. I was there for them the Toilet Bowl um earlier this year between Washington and the Dolphins back when both teams were winless, and uh, it was not well attended and I still was a shoulders shoulder and elbow to elbow with people that whole time. Um, it's it's idiotic. And uh, you know, good for you, Florida for setting a new bar for stupidity. But you know, whatever you've been, you've went up to yourself ten eleven times already this over the last six months. So yeah, I was just surprising to see the announcement because you're seeing st you know, other stadiums, other teams stay, they're playing without fans, and then all of a sudden, the Dolphins are going to play even limited capacity. Um, it's just the number thirteen thousand just really doesn't settle well during a pandemic. So to be clear, this is not us criticized. Sing Um. You know Brian Flores, you know, he's he's done, I think his job here in terms of trying to get these guys ready, and he's been outspoken about some of these events in recent weeks, and you know, I think he's done all he can. But this is like, this is state level. You know, this is just state level idiocy. So, um, you know, whatever enjol your football down there, you know, do whatever you want to do, since you've been doing that the whole time. Anyway, Alright, should we move on to topic for O'Connor. Yeah, I'm hot. We need some some football to uh, we need some football. What is it a palate cleanser? What is the minty thing that you get in between? You need one of those? Alright. Cardinals safety Buddha Baker was handsomely rewarded with a long term extension, making him the league's highest paid safety in terms of average per year salary. A good move for the Cardinals long term? What do you think? I mean? This is uh, you know, end of the time. Whenever a player gets a contract extension, my initial thought is just like, yeah, good for him. You know that's good. This is a physical game, and and you got for at least fourteen million dollars you can bank on, So I'm happy for you, you know. Yeah, And of course the conversation always comes up, how will this influence the next player that's looking for a contract at his position, which is Jamal Adams. Um, it's interesting that Buddha Baker, he's kind of had an interesting role, you know, he's moved around a little bit as we kind of see this amorphous positions on defense and uh, he didn't have he hasn't had any receptions, which kind of speaks to him playing a sort of different safety role than maybe we're used to. Yeah, and any of those players who, um, you know, any of those players who can fit that specific of a role and are too difficult to replace with one or two parts. I mean, anytime a coach can replace somebody instead of signing a player to contract, he's going to do it. But um, I think that it speaks to his versatility, the fact they did that instead of going out and uh and getting someone else. And I'm actually just thinking about this. I think the year that he was drafted, Um, when I was working for NFL dot com, I rated the Cardinals defense poorly and some sort of preseasonistical and someone said, you're an idiot for overlooking Buddha Baker and he was right, so good on you. Uh, Internet, Hey, sometimes it's sometimes we're accurately called idiots, But I don't think you're an idiot. Connor Well, I appreciate that that we're we're this is a safe space at the weak Side podcast absolutely always always all right, So what do we have for the Oracle today? No fans at any games. It's not gonna happen. I honestly think that, uh, these announcements, these starts and stops and fits and starts, like I do think that while goodness and science and smarts are not going to prevail, there's going to be some sort of um, legally is red tape that's going to shut this all down. I think that's my ultimate prevailing thought here. Um is that, Um, we've talked about this on the show before. No one does things out of the goodness of their own souls anymore. It's always lawyers coming in and saying, hey, this is a horrible idea, And having someone contract COVID at a football game and falling deathly ill is a very bad idea. And so I think that eventually this will all get stumped out, and I think we're gonna have a uniform fanless opening weekend. Um that's my hope. So yeah, I really hope so too. It just feels like we are not at a place where we can be taking these steps to enjoy a luxury of going to a football game. This is not where we're at in this pandemic, and we have a lot of problems that we still have to address. So it just feels like a foolish and risky step. And you know what, hard rock Stadium is great, but just wait, you know, I went there ahead a nice a nice you're in a nice Cuban sandwich during my uh I did like a fan in the stands story there earlier last year. Um, but just wait, you know it'll be It'll still be there when you go back, you know, and we're able to go back healthy and it'll probably even better, you know, because what it was absence makes the heart grow fonder. Yeah. Absolutely, Um, alright, So onto the rentist consensus. Just kind of touching back on what you referenced earlier Goodell's interview with Emmanuel a show about Kaepernick. Goodell said, the first thing I'd say is, I wish we had listened earlier to what you were kneeling about and what you're trying to bring attention to. We invited him several times to have the conversation, to have the dialogue. I wish we had the benefit of that. We never did. We would have benefited from that. Absolutely. I still think Goodell needs to go a step further in making up and repairing the damage that was done with the league's handling of Kaepernick. I don't think it's adequate to say I should we had listened earlier, because there was you were making a choice to not actively not listen. He was very clear in his message, and so Goodell's citing the fact that he didn't come into the league office for a conversation or whatever the case, maybe he shouldn't have to. You should be seeking out that conversation, go to him, or you know, learn things in another way. And I think it was frustrating to kind of hear this half hearted like we should have listened without acknowledging like why didn't you listen? What were the reasons that you didn't listen, um, And the fact that it's pretty absurd that you did not listen, Right, So I didn't feel like that went far enough UM. And that to me, yeah, it was. It was pretty unsatisfying, especially the way that the interview was build right that it was going to be this big revelation. He was going to really talk in depth about Kaepernick. Um, that's what he needs to do. He hasn't really done that yet. The amount of people like Roger Goodell who are smart enough to know what they're doing, um and just silently praying that one side of this culture war wins out so they don't go down in history as shittier human beings than they actually you know, Like it's astounding, you know what I mean, Like there are people who, um, you know, are screaming and hollering at Kaepernick and and you know all that stuff, and just and and don't possess the ability to understand what he's saying. And I'm not saying that that's an excuse, but there's just something that doesn't allow them to process this, whether it's years and years of what they were taught at home or an environment or whatever it is. You know, those aren't the people that I get most upset about. It's the people like Adele who are like, you know, if I just straddle this fence long enough and hope the wind doesn't blow me over one way, you know, And that's that's what stalling progress, you know, That's what's It's people like him, you know that are stalling progress. I mean, good on you for this, you know, kind of staged admission, you know, but it's just one step after the other, or of him like saying, okay, how far can I go while still keeping my other foot firmly planted in the other camp, because one of these sides is going to win out and I want to make sure that I'm okay on the other end. Yeah, what happened in the last four years there hasn't been like a new development, Like it's just more of the same examples that haven't stopped, right, and everyone is, uh, you know, it adds to the fere and it adds to the injustice and how unfair things are. But there was more than enough information four years ago to understand what was going on and to act in a way that would be helpful and not harmful, and the NFL chose not to do that, and they still have not acknowledged that. Yeah, no, it's a you know again, it's it's one of those things where it's like, you know, it's like it's like a child. It's like, well, okay, good for you for admitting that you know, you did a bad thing. Now don't do it again, you know, and it's like, you know, why why do we have to keep treating it this way? Plodding along, I don't know. It's it's it's going to be an era of history defined by great inaction from powerful people. So you know Roger is to be lumped in there. Yeah, yeah, so yeah. The consensus of the week is just that they should go farther and they should take more steps and uh yeah, I think that's ah, we'll put Jenny that was here was a weekend yet when, yet again there was another example of why players are kneeling, and so it was kind of striking that this was the four year anniversary of the first time that he took a knee. Well, thanks as always for everyone joining. Please go to your local newsstands pick up connor Or's cover story on Russell Wilson and um keep listening to the Week's Side podcasts. Also, you can drop us a line at week Side Pod at gmail dot com. Thanks as always for listening. The Week's Side Pod is me, Jenny Rerentis and Connor Or. We are produced by Shelby Royson. A sizzac get A producer of podcasts is Scott Rody. Ben Eagle is director of Editorial Projects and product Mark Mravik is Emeritus Executive director of the mm QB. Keep Up with our entire lineup of podcasts five days a week by subscribing to the mm qb NFL podcast for free on Apple Podcasts, and while you're there, please do a see favor and leave a rating and review. It really does help other people find the show, which is also available on Spotify, Radio dot com, Stitcher, s I dot com, and wherever else you listen to podcasts

Hello, week's side podcast listeners. I'm Jenny Brentis here with connor Or. We are back for this week's second episode, and we have a very special cover story to talk about. Connor Or had the cover for this month's issue of Sports Illustrated, hitting newsstands this week. It's the September issue. It features none other than Russell Wilson, QB. One of a kind, the art and science of making the impossible routine. So, Connor, you dove into a little bit of the magic that Wilson creates on the field. He broke down for you how he's able to create some of this magic, which is such a curiosity, right. I mean, he's this unusual quarterback who's kind of challenged the norms for what a quarterback's body type and size should be. And part of the reason he's so able to improvise and do these magical things is because his body works in unusual, special, unique ways. Um, what insight did you learn from him about kind of how he makes those I always think of it as like a wind up toy back there and he kind of zooms around the field and then with like this is the seeming quick flip or slight body movement can deliver the ball down field that she described so well. Yes, so I think oddly enough we we Russell Wilson and I got a chance to get together on on Zoom and watch these plays. But one of the most interesting things I think I learned was from Maggie kay Katlan, who is a physical therapist at the University of Washington, and um, we owe a huge debt of gratitude to her for this story. She watched a ton of Russell Wilson film for us, as well as a ton of Aaron Rodgers film and Tom Brady film in order to have sort of a comparable baseline of and and she works with football players on a regular basis too, So this was not, you know, something that was totally foreign to her. But you know, she said that Russell Wilson essentially changed, you know, somehow forced his body over the course of his life, to just alter the motor planning um that his brain and body and all those connections make. Whereas you know, let's say Aaron Rodgers is stepping up into the pocket and he's got to move a little bit and throw, like the brain and the body have to agree on two or three separate things in order to make that happen. And she's like, but if you watch Russell Wilson, it's one thing. You know, his body has somehow trained itself over the course of his life to essentially evolve at the position and to basically bundle all this stuff together into one fluid movement, which I think is like totally fascinating. Russell Wilson said he doesn't really get into the science of it, although if you talk to his trainers, if and you know, once you got him going a little bit, it's very clear that, you know, he tries to bake all this stuff into his routine, you know, all the little workouts that he does, all the little um you know, his trainers have to invent drills for him since he doesn't really play like any other quarterback, which I think is interesting. I thought it was also interesting that he had these moments from growing up. One of them was he was in a mall and kind of spinning off people in the sea of you know, shoppers coming to you know, Richmond mall. That was an interesting scene. Also, things he's done on the athletic fields in high school. He seemed to have an excellent recall of all of these things and how they might have informed his current abilities. Yeah, oddly spooky recall, like he remembered instantly the first time that he threw a fadeaway pass in a football game and who he threw it to in high school. So take that, Sean McVeigh. You're not the only guy that can remember things instantly. But um, you know the reality of this a lot of these stories, um is that you know a lot of quarterbacks, especially at Russell Wilson's level, Um, you know, do want to promote something, Right, if you're talking to Tom Brady, you're talking about the Tom Brady method, or you know, if you're talking to any of these people, you're kind of talking about a cause that's also near and dear to their heart, or business venture an opportunity. But I think what's interesting is that what Russell is promoting is multi sport athletes. That's kind of his big um stump speech right now, the big cause that he's advocating for. And you know, certainly it's something that he talks a lot about with regularity. But you can see how it helps. I mean, you know, we went back and we're watching some of these plays. You know, the playoff game when they almost came back and caught the Panthers that year that the Panthers made to the Super Bowl. Um. And on that one play where he throws this fade away touchdown, uh to Jerome curse. You know, he's he's saying, Okay, well, right here, I'm sliding. And that's a movement that I learned from baseball because you have to dive into the hole and you know right here, you know, this is a fade away pass or you know, this is I learned how to look at a broad panoramic of things from basketball because I was a point guard and you know, so it's interesting that, um. You know, some people can kind of carry those functional experiences with them. UM. And you know that's something that he he's very passionate about. And uh, I guess you know, I think you can see it. I think he does move unlike really any other quarterback that we do see in the NFL. And part of that is height, but I do think part of that is his history as well, and for all of the success he's had on the field, for you know, all of the early you know way in which he burst onto the scene, right, I mean he's never received an m v P boat. Is he the kind of forgotten quarterback when we discussed the pecking order? So I think this is what I found very interesting and UMU for two reasons. One, if you talk to people in his camp, um there was almost this eagerness to say that he's been doing these Patrick Mahomes things since two thousand thirteen. He's been throwing no look passes in practice and behind the back passes and you know, watched his old dude Perfect videos. He does all this stuff and nobody was paying attention back then. And you know, even footage that they provided to us from practice, they're almost like joking about. You know, his his trainer said, oh, the Pat Mahomes throw, and then Russell Wilson saying, well, the quote unquote Pat Mahomes throw. And you know there's this maybe slight eagerness to say, hey, you know I've been here this whole time. Um I was this theatrical mobile quarterback back when everybody said it wasn't important, and now that it's something that we're focusing on, have sharpened my pocket game. And you know, there's really there was really no time for credit, right it was we were saying goodbye to Peyton Manning and Eli Manning and all these guys when Wilson was coming up, and now we're saying hello to Patrick Mahomes and Deshaun Watson and Lamar Jackson. And it feels like, I don't know if he personally feels stuck in the middle, but it does seem like, you know, he's kind of waving his hand here and saying, hey, I've been doing some pretty special things here all along too. Yeah, that is definitely an interesting past ability to consider that he is kind of the cot in the middle kind of guy. And I think in his case, the improvisational ability, the you know, magic that he's able to create, to make things on the fly. In some ways that was positioned or cast as maybe making up for his lack of height, right, whereas Patrick Mahomes, they say, oh, he's got everything and he does this, he does everything right. And I think with Wilson and sometimes perhaps I don't know if you agree with me on that, but it did seem like there has been an effort to say, well, he does this to compensate for the fact that maybe his size isn't the typical prototype, and this is how he makes up for it. Yeah. No, I think that's a great point. And um, you know, his quarterbacks coach and offensive coordinator at North Carolina State, Dana Bible, said, you know, we we had plays that we would run, but we also had what was called the escape plan, and that's you know, that just worked better. And it was you know, Russell Wilson no knowing how the play was going to develop. His ability to turn his back to the field and still keep a head count of everyone around him. He's like that, that's not an adaptability thing. That's a god given thing. That's just a trait, that's a talent that you build around. It's not like, you know, somebody's trying to do this or that or the other thing. It's just that we understand what he does particularly well, and so we're gonna adapt and design around it. And I think what's interesting now is that it's the other way in Seattle, where Russell has gone to an offense that Pete Carroll wants to look a certain way and he's had to find his way around in that offense, whereas it's not really designed for him, and you wonder, you know where this is going to go in the future, does Seattle allow him, um, a little bit more freedom to do this or you know, you know, where does that go? Because they're still the most run heavy, consistent offense in football. Um, I think that they had the in twenty nine eighteen the fewest number of percentage of passing plays, and they might had like second or third fewests. So it's interesting just to see, you know, kind of where this is all going, what Russell can do, what Seattle is going to allow him to do, and how that all affects our perception of him. Speaking of where it's going, he says, he's thirty one. I'm right at the beginning of my prime, at least ten plus years left. My goal is to play another fifteen years. So what do you think that those potential fifteen years could hold for Russell Wilson? Fifteen years is a long time, right, that's a long way to project out. You would say that, Um, maybe because of his body composition, you know, he's well positioned to take the rigors of of the game, you know, I mean, he can probably take hits better than some of the quarterbacks just because he is a little bit stockier, probably a little bit more well built. But UM, I think it's interesting. You know, he said that he's studied, um, the career lifespans of other quarterbacks. Um, you know, Steve Young was a big one that he said that Steve Young only really started hitting his I'm around this time, and so that's something that he's taken into account and so you know, we'll see where it goes. Um. You know, I think we were making fun of maybe five or ten years ago, all these quarterbacks coming out and it was like, you know, one after the other saying, oh, I want to play until I forty two, I want to play until forty three, and then Tom Brady saying you wanted to play until he's forty five. But the reality of the situation is this is happening. You know, these guys are living, um, their athletic careers longer, they're keeping themselves healthier, and uh, you know, we'll see where it goes. Does Russell's loss of mobility over that time affect him? Who knows. I think he's becoming a better pocket passer. But um, it is interesting to say that he wants to play fifteen more years, which would put him at forty six, which is one more year than Tom Brady plans to play. Uh is there a little bit to be read into there? Who knows? Or fifteens around number could be either way, but I like the I like the little spice there. Well, it was a great story, Connor, really interesting read. People should read it on our web side and also pick up the hard copy. Thanks for taking us behind the scenes a little bit, Connor, Well, thanks for thanks for asking. And I'm very excited because my local grocery store is very behind in their updating of the news stands, so there's going to be an exciting overlap period there where I'm gonna get Jenny's cover from the football preview issue, and then we'll do like a little weak side podcast picture that I'm gonna take right there in the supermarket. So I'm very excited about that. That's funny, it sounds good. Connor. Um, alright, Kelly, move into the news topics this week. Let's do it alright. Topic number one. Earl Thomas was released by the Ravens this week, fueling unfounded for now, speculation that he may finally get his wish to join the Cowboys. This has not been the smoothest transition from Seattle to life outside the legion of boom for Thomas. Might there be a reason the Ravens were willing to part ways? So there was a fight, right and and you know, everything kind of happened after that. But um, you know, it's not like Thomas has been outside of the news. And I don't want to speculate on anybody, you know, anything that anybody has going on right now. But usually when a player of this caliber gets dumped before the season, especially when you need veterans who understand the system as well as he did, something's got to be up there right and he doesn't get snapped up right away. I mean, I think that that's something that uh warrants paying attention to. Yeah, one season in Baltimore was certainly not what we expected. It was such a hyped signing a year ago, thought to be, uh, you know, a key piece for this Baltimore team that was looking to contend for a while, and certainly that was what his intention was. I mean I talked to him before their playoff loss in January, and he said that it was really important to him to go somewhere else and have success after Seattle, he said. I looked up these quotes because I was thinking about them this week. I never wanted anybody to question, like, oh, Pete Carroll made this guy, because I've been doing this all my life. No matter what scheme I'm in, I'm going to try to figure it out and I'm going to ball out. So that was one of my goals here and I think I've proved that. UM and he said, you know, winning a Super Bowl somewhere other than Seattle would mean a lot, because it's all about legacy at this point right now. To add that to my legacy and do it with another group of guys, that'd be great. I want to go to the Hall of Fame. That's the ultimate goal, so that would look really good. So it was interesting to go from that to where he's cut. And obviously, yeah, there's been a lot of things happening this offseason. There were some reports that the Leadership Council UM after the altercation at practice, UM wanted him gone and that was a factor in the Ravens decision making. There was also some reports last after last season that he didn't quite fit into the scheme and was kind of doing his own thing at times, So it does seem like there was a little bit more UM going on behind the scenes there in terms of fitting into a new team. But certainly he seems like someone who is very motivated. You have a post Seattle career with success, and so it will be interesting to see if and when he lands somewhere. Isn't it absolutely fascinating to you? Like you know, I remember and this goes back to our UM days with the Jets, but like I remember, UM when Mohammed Wilkerson, uh, you know, his first or second year um, you know, the defensive coaches saying he's he's he's not doing what he's supposed to do. He's just out there doing his own thing. And like it's unfathomable, Like you and I watch practice every day in all the effort that people put into it, and yet like during games that players just decide sometimes not to do like what's explained them and sometimes it is that it is not explained properly, that that is a UM not solely on the players. But it is fascinating. The idea of like standing out is this freelancer um in the NFL when there's so much regiment, structure and all this stuff built into asking you to do things a certain way. Yeah, and I think when he came to Baltimore, there is an expectation that, you know, he kind of was one of these He had a championship history in Seattle. He comes to Baltimore joined a defense that has a long legacy in that city. Obviously the safety position with Ed Reid, and I think there were pretty high expectations. Uh, and ultimately it might not have been that good have a fit. But this is now two teams that the ending has gone bitterly for with Earl Thomas. Obviously there was um difficult split with Seattle um, you know, as we saw him being carted off the field and the gesture that he gave to Pete Carroll. And now we have another um split that has a lot of speculation and discussion around it. So that certainly is a factor when other teams are looking at bringing him in. But it's try to imagine he will not get another opportunity. Connor, I mean, good lord, we're still talking about Antonio Brown signing somewhere something this season. So what's but um? Alright, new topic number two? UM. I thought this was a good um um by the Lions. Here. They stopped practice yesterday and address reporters in mass about um the police shooting of Jacob Blake, who is an African American man in Kanasha, Wisconsin. After so many years of avoiding any message with political implications, it seems like the NFL is more willing to dive in now. We've talked on this podcast a lot about the value of being first in doing something versus forced, you know, to do something. And I think that this was a good job by the Lions staff of reacting immediately to something, sensing that there was an issue that players are passionate about and giving them the platform to speak out about it. And this follows Roger Goodell who was on with UM Emmanuel Acco earlier this week and he said that, um, you know, he had wished that he had listened to Colin Kaepernick sooner, which, um, you know, as far as Goodell goes, that's going to be probably the most open and honest and I'm using air quotes here that you're going to hear from him about a subject like this. Yeah. I thought this was a powerful stand from the Lions. Were so used to these discussions. Football can't be moved and don't do anything that bothers football, and you know, keep your thoughts out of sports, right, and here was a day in which they decided to cancel practice. They recognize the fact that their players are human beings and that it would be difficult to practice on a day after seeing that video, especially as a black man in America. And Matt Patricia listened to his players. They adjusted and instead of practicing, instead of forcing them to just go through the day as you would as if nothing happened, they not only did that, but they also used the opportunity to issue a powerful statement. So I thought that was really well handled. And I think it, um, I think it reflects the shift that hopefully we're seeing not the human side is considered a little bit more and we're not trying to box people in as well. You can be athletes in this uh in since and then save your social activism for some other time and place. Right. I think it was a recognition of your experiences and the impact that seeing a video like that would have on you. UM should be listened to and should be important. UM should be treated as important, and should be treated as more important than football. Yeah, UM surprised a little bit. I mean, you know, Matt Patricia did not get off to the on the best foot with his players. Over the first two years, there were lots of gripes about um, you know, his attitude, you know, um his you know, timeliness, whatever you like, all this stuff that um, you know was was kind of going on behind the scenes, and everyone kind of just accused him of being this sort of Belichicken clone. But this is a move that really steps out from underneath that. And whether that's informed of his past experiences, whether that this is him trying to change, I don't know what it is, but I do think it's a gesture that at least, you know, tries to you know, actively endear yourselves to the club after maybe spending the last two years doing the exact opposite of that. Yeah, exactly, Connor and notoriously inflexible coach, or at least that's his reputation from the outside, decided to listen to his players, to take their experiences and things they were feeling into account, um and he followed through on that. So I thought that was a really strong statement by the Lions. And I know we're hearing players across sports, you know, take a season off, right because there are more important things going on in the world or maybe um, you know, skipping NBA playoff game. You know, there's we we these conversations are UM have been so open and so honest. Finally this summer, I think, and I think we're hearing a lot of athletes say like, there are so many more important things than sports. Um, and I just thought it was nice to see those priorities being for one day, a day that was difficult for a lot of people in America, a lot of black people in America. And you know what, I think that there's gonna be some cynics on the outside saying that Matt Patricia only did this because, you know, uh, for whatever reason, you know, try to get his team back, to try to do whatever. But you know, sometimes you need to. You know, a good friend of mine gave me a good piece of advice the other day that sometimes you do need to fake it until you make it, you know, and sometimes you do need, you know to uh, you know, maybe Matt Patricia, who knows what reasons he's doing this for. But when something like this happens, regardless of the route that you took to get there, you're forced to pause and consider the situation. You know what I mean, You're forced to think, well, why are we doing this? Why are why are they upset? You know? Why are my teammates, you know, my players? My fellow coach is unhappy, you know. And I think that this is a good exercise. And I hope that, you know, all the other coaches around the league saw that and said, hey, you know what, the next time something like this happens, and let's pray that there is not a next time. UM, but if something like this happens again, you know, maybe we need to be quicker at stepping up and uh and standing up for for everybody else. Yeah, absolutely, all right. So transitioning into topic three, the Dolphins will have fans at games because Florida shouldn't spectator football be a reward and not a continued reason for our punishment? Why the hell are we having people at football games in Florida? This was all the states that don't deserve it, it's you. This was interesting on a lot of levels. There were some coaches, including Sean McDermott, who spoke up about this being a competitive disadvantage UM first advantage disadvantage depending on which team you are, UM. And that's one angle of it. The other angle is the fact at it doesn't really make a lot of sense with all of the effort that's going into regulating practices, regulating who's allowed in team facilities, you know, restricting media viewing and all of these things, to then be opening up your stadium. I saw Mike Florio from Pro Football Talk wrote a little bit about UM that in the c b A, the owners need to take every step that is necessary to maximize revenue UM, which I guess could be one part of this. But obviously there's a lot of usual factors at play this season, so I think that instead of going with the local laws, it would have made sense to have one uniform UH instruction across the league and have it be you know, the same that if there's one state where they're can't be fans, and there should be no states where there can be fans. UM. But yeah, I mean particularly Florida Connor. I did see a tweet from Kevin's side for of ESPN retweeted um in Minnesota, excuse me um. The Minnesota Department of Health said that there were two COVID cases traced to St. Paul's Saints games, and that is a professional baseball team in which there was limited capacity in the stadium, social distancing guidelines, and so I think it's just an example that you're creating an additional risk. I think that there have been a lot of steps taken by the NFL to have protocols that would work for there to be a season. It just feels that fans is an unnecessary additional risk factor. Um that certainly I don't see any scenario in which it's worth it. Remember back when, like we all used to get behind things, and like, imagine a world where, you know, even if the NFL doesn't have a uniform policy, they say, the states that clean this up are the ones that are going to have fans. And then the coaches get on TV and they do a public service announcement and they do have ends, and then they you know whatever, they record their voice and they do telecalls or whatever it is to say, hey, make sure you're wearing your mask. Don't be an idiot. And it's unbelievable that masks became so politicized that we're still in this place where the states that have the highest infection rates are just gonna slam fans into stands this this year instead of like we could have used football as an avenue to help disperse this and to say, hey, this is a big deal. This is a problem, and if you don't fix it, you're not going to be at the stadium on Sunday. Like it's just it's ridiculous that we're at this position right now, and it's so embarrassing that Florida just continues to just nakedly, uh ignore all these health risks, and you know, it is what it is at this point. I mean, you know, I saw that place off and let it just fall into the Atlantic Ocean. Sometimes I feel like, you know, it's just so dumb. And you know, if you're going to one of those games and you're a fan and you worked hard and you social distance, good for you. But you know, I I don't think anybody in a sane mind goes there thinking that something bad can happen. I've been to that stadium. I know you've been to that stadium. We were uh well, we were just there for the Super Bowl too. I mean, you know it's not going to be hard, you know, even if there's thirteen thousand people there. I was there for them the Toilet Bowl um earlier this year between Washington and the Dolphins back when both teams were winless, and uh, it was not well attended and I still was a shoulders shoulder and elbow to elbow with people that whole time. Um, it's it's idiotic. And uh, you know, good for you, Florida for setting a new bar for stupidity. But you know, whatever you've been, you've went up to yourself ten eleven times already this over the last six months. So yeah, I was just surprising to see the announcement because you're seeing st you know, other stadiums, other teams stay, they're playing without fans, and then all of a sudden, the Dolphins are going to play even limited capacity. Um, it's just the number thirteen thousand just really doesn't settle well during a pandemic. So to be clear, this is not us criticized. Sing Um. You know Brian Flores, you know, he's he's done, I think his job here in terms of trying to get these guys ready, and he's been outspoken about some of these events in recent weeks, and you know, I think he's done all he can. But this is like, this is state level. You know, this is just state level idiocy. So, um, you know, whatever enjol your football down there, you know, do whatever you want to do, since you've been doing that the whole time. Anyway, Alright, should we move on to topic for O'Connor. Yeah, I'm hot. We need some some football to uh, we need some football. What is it a palate cleanser? What is the minty thing that you get in between? You need one of those? Alright. Cardinals safety Buddha Baker was handsomely rewarded with a long term extension, making him the league's highest paid safety in terms of average per year salary. A good move for the Cardinals long term? What do you think? I mean? This is uh, you know, end of the time. Whenever a player gets a contract extension, my initial thought is just like, yeah, good for him. You know that's good. This is a physical game, and and you got for at least fourteen million dollars you can bank on, So I'm happy for you, you know. Yeah, And of course the conversation always comes up, how will this influence the next player that's looking for a contract at his position, which is Jamal Adams. Um, it's interesting that Buddha Baker, he's kind of had an interesting role, you know, he's moved around a little bit as we kind of see this amorphous positions on defense and uh, he didn't have he hasn't had any receptions, which kind of speaks to him playing a sort of different safety role than maybe we're used to. Yeah, and any of those players who, um, you know, any of those players who can fit that specific of a role and are too difficult to replace with one or two parts. I mean, anytime a coach can replace somebody instead of signing a player to contract, he's going to do it. But um, I think that it speaks to his versatility, the fact they did that instead of going out and uh and getting someone else. And I'm actually just thinking about this. I think the year that he was drafted, Um, when I was working for NFL dot com, I rated the Cardinals defense poorly and some sort of preseasonistical and someone said, you're an idiot for overlooking Buddha Baker and he was right, so good on you. Uh, Internet, Hey, sometimes it's sometimes we're accurately called idiots, But I don't think you're an idiot. Connor Well, I appreciate that that we're we're this is a safe space at the weak Side podcast absolutely always always all right, So what do we have for the Oracle today? No fans at any games. It's not gonna happen. I honestly think that, uh, these announcements, these starts and stops and fits and starts, like I do think that while goodness and science and smarts are not going to prevail, there's going to be some sort of um, legally is red tape that's going to shut this all down. I think that's my ultimate prevailing thought here. Um is that, Um, we've talked about this on the show before. No one does things out of the goodness of their own souls anymore. It's always lawyers coming in and saying, hey, this is a horrible idea, And having someone contract COVID at a football game and falling deathly ill is a very bad idea. And so I think that eventually this will all get stumped out, and I think we're gonna have a uniform fanless opening weekend. Um that's my hope. So yeah, I really hope so too. It just feels like we are not at a place where we can be taking these steps to enjoy a luxury of going to a football game. This is not where we're at in this pandemic, and we have a lot of problems that we still have to address. So it just feels like a foolish and risky step. And you know what, hard rock Stadium is great, but just wait, you know, I went there ahead a nice a nice you're in a nice Cuban sandwich during my uh I did like a fan in the stands story there earlier last year. Um, but just wait, you know it'll be It'll still be there when you go back, you know, and we're able to go back healthy and it'll probably even better, you know, because what it was absence makes the heart grow fonder. Yeah. Absolutely, Um, alright, So onto the rentist consensus. Just kind of touching back on what you referenced earlier Goodell's interview with Emmanuel a show about Kaepernick. Goodell said, the first thing I'd say is, I wish we had listened earlier to what you were kneeling about and what you're trying to bring attention to. We invited him several times to have the conversation, to have the dialogue. I wish we had the benefit of that. We never did. We would have benefited from that. Absolutely. I still think Goodell needs to go a step further in making up and repairing the damage that was done with the league's handling of Kaepernick. I don't think it's adequate to say I should we had listened earlier, because there was you were making a choice to not actively not listen. He was very clear in his message, and so Goodell's citing the fact that he didn't come into the league office for a conversation or whatever the case, maybe he shouldn't have to. You should be seeking out that conversation, go to him, or you know, learn things in another way. And I think it was frustrating to kind of hear this half hearted like we should have listened without acknowledging like why didn't you listen? What were the reasons that you didn't listen, um, And the fact that it's pretty absurd that you did not listen, Right, So I didn't feel like that went far enough UM. And that to me, yeah, it was. It was pretty unsatisfying, especially the way that the interview was build right that it was going to be this big revelation. He was going to really talk in depth about Kaepernick. Um, that's what he needs to do. He hasn't really done that yet. The amount of people like Roger Goodell who are smart enough to know what they're doing, um and just silently praying that one side of this culture war wins out so they don't go down in history as shittier human beings than they actually you know, Like it's astounding, you know what I mean, Like there are people who, um, you know, are screaming and hollering at Kaepernick and and you know all that stuff, and just and and don't possess the ability to understand what he's saying. And I'm not saying that that's an excuse, but there's just something that doesn't allow them to process this, whether it's years and years of what they were taught at home or an environment or whatever it is. You know, those aren't the people that I get most upset about. It's the people like Adele who are like, you know, if I just straddle this fence long enough and hope the wind doesn't blow me over one way, you know, And that's that's what stalling progress, you know, That's what's It's people like him, you know that are stalling progress. I mean, good on you for this, you know, kind of staged admission, you know, but it's just one step after the other, or of him like saying, okay, how far can I go while still keeping my other foot firmly planted in the other camp, because one of these sides is going to win out and I want to make sure that I'm okay on the other end. Yeah, what happened in the last four years there hasn't been like a new development, Like it's just more of the same examples that haven't stopped, right, and everyone is, uh, you know, it adds to the fere and it adds to the injustice and how unfair things are. But there was more than enough information four years ago to understand what was going on and to act in a way that would be helpful and not harmful, and the NFL chose not to do that, and they still have not acknowledged that. Yeah, no, it's a you know again, it's it's one of those things where it's like, you know, it's like it's like a child. It's like, well, okay, good for you for admitting that you know, you did a bad thing. Now don't do it again, you know, and it's like, you know, why why do we have to keep treating it this way? Plodding along, I don't know. It's it's it's going to be an era of history defined by great inaction from powerful people. So you know Roger is to be lumped in there. Yeah, yeah, so yeah. The consensus of the week is just that they should go farther and they should take more steps and uh yeah, I think that's ah, we'll put Jenny that was here was a weekend yet when, yet again there was another example of why players are kneeling, and so it was kind of striking that this was the four year anniversary of the first time that he took a knee. Well, thanks as always for everyone joining. Please go to your local newsstands pick up connor Or's cover story on Russell Wilson and um keep listening to the Week's Side podcasts. Also, you can drop us a line at week Side Pod at gmail dot com. Thanks as always for listening. The Week's Side Pod is me, Jenny Rerentis and Connor Or. We are produced by Shelby Royson. A sizzac get A producer of podcasts is Scott Rody. Ben Eagle is director of Editorial Projects and product Mark Mravik is Emeritus Executive director of the mm QB. Keep Up with our entire lineup of podcasts five days a week by subscribing to the mm qb NFL podcast for free on Apple Podcasts, and while you're there, please do a see favor and leave a rating and review. It really does help other people find the show, which is also available on Spotify, Radio dot com, Stitcher, s I dot com, and wherever else you listen to podcasts