Hello, and welcome to the mm QB Monday Morning NFL Podcast. I'm your host, Gary Grambling. I will be joined by a special guest in just a moment. We're going to continue to run down our division previews in the ly up to what we what we figured will be the start of the season. We did the NFC South last week and we are just going kind of random, so we're gonna land on a f C West and and who better to discuss the a f C West than Andy noyt our special guest once again, Andy, how are you Gary? I'm well, how are you good? Mr? A f C West. That's that's your that's your nickname? Is it town? Town? In college? Upper classman when I was a freshman, he sat I was at a town I wasn't I was new to the school, and I was nervous and I was socially uncomfortable. I guess is really what I was. This upper classman came and sat down and without any introductions, just said to the table, here's what I know, and he listed off a sore did things and one of them was the USC Trojans are so good that they should be in the a f C West And then after he was done that that won him a nice little round of laughs. And then after he was done, he got up and departed and I never found out who he was or what is a point was, But I always remember that a f C West line and I've i've I've stolen at the times, not often, but a few times. Wait, you've stolen the line. USC would beat the FC. I've applied it to other places. It doesn't back then USC was the team. But yeah, yeah, yeah, anyway, that's why I guess that guy is more the authority on the a f C West than I am. I don't know why I shared this. Yeah, that's well, that's that's how we got around, and he got to the northeast. Uh. Just weeks ago people started calling you Mr a f C West, So very fitting that we're doing the that that's none of this, None of this makes any sense. So let's just jump into the into the breakdown. Here. We are going as we are with every division order of last year's standings. So these are not our predictions. However, we will give our predictions. Are are are what do you want to call him? Andy? Uh? Projections are projections. At the end of the show, here, But we are starting with the defending Super Bowl champion Kansas City Chiefs. They also in the a f C West year ago. Uh, let's start on the defensive side of the ball. Andy. Uh. You know, obviously the Chiefs that their psyched. They brought back Chris Jones, obviously, I mean they should be incredibly optimistic entering the year. Uh. A lot of a lot of change over in the secondary, maybe not a lot, but a key guy missing in Kendall Fuller. Now, I mean, it's just the weakness of this team, the defensive backfield, the relative weakness of this team. UM, I would say the linebacker positions probably the weakness of the team. They did address it by by drafting Willie Gay Jr. In the second round, and so he'll be behind, probably initially behind Damien Wilson and Anthony Hitchens the Chiefs. You know, Gary teams tell you how they feel about their players by the way they use them. We've we've said that before, haven't said that in a while. But Kansas City and almost every turn when possible, they played dime personnel and they put Nick Sorenson on the field. Excume Daniel Sorenson on the field. Um, as a third safety and he's become quite good in that role, and he plays linebacker in those three safety packages. They don't want their linebackers on the field, least they didn't want the guys they had before. It was dorrian O'Daniel and ten was a third round pick and he looked like he might be a really good cover linebacker. Didn't really play until late last season. Obviously, they take Willie Gate Jr. In the second round. They expect him to be a starter. Will he be ready with with no offseason. They're thin at the linebacker spot, not for lack of trying, but that's that's the weakness of this team. I actually think their secondary, they're gonna miss Kendall full and we can talk about that a little more here in a second, but their secondary I think pretty sound. And the guy that nobody talks about is probably the most underrated cornerback in the entire Nflo's Travarious Ward. Yeah. They just sort of threw him out there to seasons ago and and they was sort of trial by fire and he was he was lit ablaze quite a few times, but he made a he made a big leap last year. He did and when they threw him out there. He was I think he was undrafted if I recall, wasn't he I mean's it was undraftedeen he'd come over from Dallas. Um, it's it's unusual to see an undrafted corner. I mean that that position, more than any other, has high pedigreed athletes in first and second round picks. I think fill that position more than I want to say, any other position. And the reason why it's just because there's such a taxing physical demand on it. Ward obviously wasn't ready back then, but you know, he's got a great body type. They knew a lot more about him than we did on the outside. And I don't know how big a deal this is, but when he struggled in when they threw him out there, he played on the left side a lot of the time, and last year he became a right corner. And the Chiefs really, even when they play Manda Man coverage, they don't move their corners around. You play the right or you play the left in their system. Uh let's uh, well, well, let's talk about the Kendall Fuller factor just real quick. Uh No, Fuller, very flexible guy. He's back in Washington now, do they I guess my question is is he just a luxury to have a guy like that or do they really need to find someone who can who can have that flexibility. I mean they do have time or in Matthew already who can who do a number of things they do the value of fullers that they he gave them essentially from a schematic standpoint, he gave they gave. He gave them a second tyro in Matthew. They had two guys now who could cover tight ends man to man as strong safeties. They could theoretically play linebacker. They're very rarely used like that, but they can play the slot, and they can play back deep and single high or too high coverage so and they can play outside corner at time. Both of those guys have had snaps at that position their career. So to two really good players who can line up anywhere in the secondary. And what that did for Kansas City was gave him a lot of disguise flexibility. Because the way offenses decide if you're in manner z own coverage away they read that is usually by the location of your safeties and the other position that they'll tend to look. And it's more for alignment than who's lined up over the spot. But they look at the nickel corner, safeties and nickel corners, the guys near the middle of the field. The that's who tells you what the coverage is. But what happens when the safeties and nickel corners are one and the same, it's hard to know what you're looking at. And the difference Gary I thought the biggest difference between Kansas City's defense in the second half of last season in the first half was how how much more diverse and dynamic they got with their coverage disguises, and Tyron Matthew is the biggest key to it. But having Fuller around is also what unlocked Matthew so much. So they can live without Kendall Fuller, but they're not going to be as multiple without him, at least not right away. They have to find a new Kendall Fuller, and that's that's gonna mean something. All right, Let's let's talk briefly about the offense side of the ball. I mean, we've talked about it plenty over the years. Patrick Holmes is is still very good. I do I want to zero in on, like two games early last season, the Chiefs were banged up on the offensive line. They lost back to back games at home to the Colts and uh to the Colts on Sunday night, and then the Texans the next week and kind of kind of a wild game. But uh Mahomes did not look very good in those games. No Tyreek Hill there either. So I mean, is it just a matter of the only way this offense can be slowed down is if they just have a rash of injuries like they like they had at that point, or I mean, you know, if just the offensive line goes down a little bit, are they eatting get into trouble? I do remember just In Houston just reached havoc in that Sunday night game in Week five. Well, and that's because Houston was often I believe if I re car I'd have to look this up. I think he was lighting up across from cam Irving most of the night. Um and cam Irving has become a serviceable backup utility player, former guard center who now plays backup tackle. But but he's a real liability out there as a left tackle. That was an issue last year. So Irving was in that game ahead of Eric Fisher, who was out you mentioned there's no Tyreek Hill. If I told you Patrick Mahomes and that Texans game Gary, he had seventeen passes outside the numbers that traveled ten plus yards down field, which, by the way, is an incredible number. How many of those do you think he completed in that game? How many times you have seventeen seventeen outside the seventeen outside the numbers alone would be a lot. I was gonna say, I I vaguely remember they didn't have the ball very much in that game that the Texans kind of played keep away with him. So, um man, that's that's incredible. And I'm even looking the stats that to make sure I don't have a type of I I struggled to believe that. I'll say, dropbacks in the game for him, So it's possible thirty six dropbacks seventeen I'll say he completed with that receiving core not many six zero zero in that game, really, which makes me. It makes me nervous that the stats so extreme. I question it. It's in there, okay, anyway, I don't think it's something to look for. They shouldn't have given on the contract now that we know that, Yeah, it's the one thing that did stand out with with the Colts and the Texans in those games, and Mahomes had an off day in the Texans game, and you're right, they were not on the field very much, and that was a big deal. Kansas City's defense could not get off the field, and when the Chiefs offense failed to surmount drives, all of a sudden, you just don't have very many snaps and now you have no rhythm at all. But the other thing that stood out was the Texans played a lot of Manda Man and the Colts in that game played a lot of Manda Man, even though the Colts are really a zone based defense. So if you're facing Kansas City, not just because those teams did well with it, but I do think you'd rather I think ideally you play them in Manda Man and not zone coverage for the reason being that Andy Reid is too good at designing plays that exploit predicted zone coverages and read I've heard has a lot of systems in place to figure out what your zone coverage is going to be. They do a very thorough job of scouting opponents. You don't zone coverage, you can get beat by the play design a lot, and because of the speed on Kansas City and Mahomes's unique abilities to extend plays in and out of the pocket, um all designs are available and plays that would maybe go ten to fifteen yards or some teams the Chiefs can run at twenty to twenty five yards deep. So it's just too much stress on zone coverage. If you go man to man, you at least have a fighting chance, and you can disrupt the timing of the play if you jam Tyreek Hill, for example, and you'd have to be doubling him. If you're gonna get up and try to jam him, you don't run by if you miss. But if you jam Tyreek Hill and Hill's running a combination where out with Sammy walk In, so that combination route doesn't work the same way anymore. And now not only is Hill off course, but Walkins becomes off course. So it's such a timing offense and a schematic offense. Gary, I think your only chance is to play Manda Man. And then you got to get into the issue. What do you do about Mahomes because he can scramble, and the teams that have had the guts to play Manda Man against Kansas CEA. They usually spy Mahomes with somebody, not just because you don't want him to scramble, but it also keeps someone in his passing lane at all times, which is a big deal when you have a quarterback that can extend the play. Uh. Let's uh, let's go to Denver. Now, Uh what was uh? And and and I should say we've talked about Drew Lock a few times this this offseason. We will get to a little bit at the offense. But I want to ask you what was different about this defense in year one under Vic Fangio. That that was actually not that not that this unit was down, but that last year was the first time since sixteen they held opponents under twenty points per game. It looked like something a ReVibe unit. And that was even with Bradley Chubb being out. Yeah, that's a good point. Bradley shob and he's easy to forget about because he's so new to the league. They're gonna have him back opposite von Miller, and von Miller is going as strong as ever still at least he was last year or when you watched the film. Um, and this isn't the answer to your question. We'll get to that. But there's one of the guy that we need to mention in that front seven. There's to Actually I see they have Darrell Casey, you gotta remember that, that's a big deal. But Alexander Johnson, their linebacker who came into the league late. I believe he was undrafted twenty team. But he's twenty eight years old. He had some legal issues in college at Tennessee and then he came into the league late because of it. That guy looks like a first round talent though. I mean, I don't know. He came out of nowhere last year. Not nowhere, he just said where he came from. But when they inserted him into the lineup, I'd never heard of him or seeing anything about him. And he jumped off the film weekend and week out. So they might have a super high level linebacker between all these edge guys that they have now, Yeah, Johnson was Johnson was accused of sexual assault UH in twenty four team. He was actually uh suspended from the University of Tennessee because of that. Uh. It went to trial. He was acquitted in eighteen, which, uh, you know, I guess I was enough for the the Broncos to to make a move and add him to the team. But I mean, look at if you if you took away the obvious off field concerns he was he was probably a day to pick at least and I guess possible first round pick that would have been the draft at that point. Well, he's a really good talent. I mean he's he is a tremendous talent and I could see him being a breakout starting and linebackers happened to be an important position and Fan Gail system, So what that system is all about, Gary is matchup zone coverages with disguised safeties. And and Justin Simmons last year, I thought he and Tyrone Matthew probably far and away, It's certainly in the second half of the season, they were the most valuable safeties to their team in the NFL. Justin Simmons was a big time player for Denver and I in fact, I would I'd go so far as to say, with without hesitation, really that Simmons last year for the Broncos was more valuable than Eddie Jackson was for the Bears and Fan Jil's last year in Chicago when Jackson's first team All Pro uh and Jackson got a huge pay day from that. Um So Simmons and Kareem Jackson at their other safety slash nickel cornerback. Those guys are very good disguising their coverages. It's very subtle disguises the tech. The Broncos usually have two guys deep instead of one guy deep in their coverages, and you're never quite sure what you're looking at as a cornerback, and that's the essence of the scheme. When you have good pass rushers in that kind of equation, you're gonna get a lot of sacks just for the simple reason that the ball is not coming out very quickly. So it's I I. Of all the schemes in the NFL, vic Fanjiels to me, defensively is the very best, which, by the way, is why the Rams hired Brandon Staley, Fangiel's longtime assistant. Now the Rams are gonna try to want on what Fangio ran because Fangio gave the Rams so much trouble the last couple of years. It really baffles me that more teams don't do what Fangio does because it's it's not just the way he teaches it. He does things differently. It's stuff you can see on film and steal if you wanted to, and uh, other side of the ball there, So there there is a change. Obviously, Offense coordinator Ris Gangarrello's out pat Shermer is in What kind of differences would you expect to see in a Schermer offense here? Uh, that's a hard question to answer for for two reasons. One is there's been different iterations of Schermer's offense, and I don't know if it has a mega defining trade like oh, I asked the foundation, probably eleven personnel, but everybody everybody plays eleven personnel. Um and then Denver last year they never had a great rhythm offensively. Their offensive line really was understaff. They just didn't have the talent there, and they weren't very deep and wide receiver. So they've addressed all that this year. They drafted Lloyd Cushionberry in the third round and then they took the receiver's Jerry Judy and kJ Hamdler this slot guy in rounds one and two. So it's a different offense than a year ago. And of course Drew lock is now the full time starter. I don't know exactly what they're going to do. It's not gonna be overly complex offensively, They're gonna put these guys in a position to where they just execute. And then that raises the question is at the right way to play with Drew Lock? Because it might seem like, oh yeah, just just you know, keep it simple, let him play by interestinct, But that's that's really more of a defensive thing. When you keep it simple offensively, you allow the defense room to be complex if they want to be. And I you know, well, that's that's gonna put a little more pressure on Lock. I'm not saying they'll play that way, but it wouldn't surprise me if they played that way. And I'm not saying that's the wrong way to play either. A lot of it just comes down to how well Drew Lock can handle things. He was encouraging in five games a year ago, but it's way too soon to know. We don't know if he can bread a defense at a high level weekend and week out yet he we opponents haven't seen enough of him. We haven't seen enough of him. But there's a lot to like in those first five games from last year. Of course, Okay, all right, let's uh, let's go out to Las Vegas Las Vegas Raiders. I mean, look, we are a couple of years out from the Khalil Mack trade, and this is when you kind of you know they're they're entering a phase where it's it's time to time to be competitive again. And and what they've done on the defensive line, I want to specifically talk about two young guys to second year guys. We're gonna talk about about a lot of second year guys here with the Raiders, but uh, to second year guys Cleland Farrell and Max Crosby on the defensive line. Uh, what's your what's your take on them? And is it is it too hot It's a little too hot for this time of year to say maybe Crosby is the better player than Farrell. I've been a lot of people say that, and I can see why, and and Crosby was certainly an overachiever last year. Is a fourth round pick a lot of high energy sacks, and I mean that in a good way in this case. Or some guys that that just rack up sacks that really aren't very good players, but they're the guy that gets the sacks. Sometimes that's not what Crosby is. But Crosby is also not quite a dynamic edge bender or super high level technician at this point. He's still a work in progress, but he is much further along than you would ever imagine. He's a quality starting defensive end for sure. Farrell, to mean, is a more interesting guy. Gary. I did raise an eyebrow when they took him as early as they did. I think everybody raised an eyebrow on that um and I actually, if you think about Mike Floral made this point at Pro Football Talk. If Mike Mayock had still been in the media, Farrell probably doesn't feel like a steel because Mayok is one of the two or three biggest draft voices, and he would have been saying, Farrell's a guy. You know, Farrell's a top ten guy, so it's you know, you gotta keep some perspective there. Mayok has a lot of power in that sense. But what made me raise the eyebrow about him is stylistically, I don't know if Farrell was a true bender himself either. I think there are people who would say he's a better defensive tackle than defensive end in obvious passing situations, and that usually if you're taking a guy top five He's got all the physical traits. He's supple, he's long, he's strong handed, all those things Farrell's not. Farrell has great hands and his length actually is he plays long enough, but he's not supple or explosive the way those other guys might be. Having settled that, I thought he got better over the course of last season, and I was really really surprised when they took him out of the Nickel package down the stretch. They replaced him with Dion Jordan, who actually another former top five pick, and Dion Jordan's played defensive tackle, he'd been a defensive end early in his career. I would have left Farrell on the field because I thought he was their best pass rusher. And what got better with him? What was his technique, his hand usage especially, I think there's a lot to like. And now he'll be next to Malik Collins on passing down this season. I don't think Dion Jordan's I'm not seeing him on the roster um, so it's gonna be. It's good. Maurice Hurst will be there as well. They do have pass rushers game, they don't have the one guy that makes you, oh my gosh. But that's they have some formidable depth there, or at least the formidable front four. Let's say, yeah, I mean they have they have a pass rush, is what it seems like, even though they don't it's not. Yeah, and it's not a great one, but it's in the past. They haven't had a competitive one. Yeah. Yeah. Uh. The other side of the ball, Josh Jacobs, is he a foundational back to you? Is the potential foundational back? And uh, I guess I would also say, you know, is he foundational if he hasn't expanded role in the passing game this year? Well sure, if he does, I don't think he will because he didn't last year. And it's the same people running the passing game. And now they have just more talent and wide receiver to feed the ball too. So it's and Darren Waller is going to be better in year two. And Waller is a top shelf receiving tight end. I don't and Jacobs I liked him when you told I know, I don't stay these guys coming out, but we were sold on the idea of Jacobs when he was coming out of Alabama that oh he you can flex them all over the formation and and you know, use them in every way, and I liked it in that sense that, Okay, if you're gonna do that, then I see why you took a guy overall or in the first round. But they don't do that with him, that he is really a very traditional back in their scheme. He is a really good back, though, and he can manufacture his own yardage quite a bit in fact, and his short area ladd agility is good both behind the line of scrimmage and I think especially when he gets past the line of scrimmage. Um, Josh Jacobs is a top ten running talent in the NFL. So foundational back or not that that's almost I think anymore, that's just a question of who else do you have on the roster. I don't believe they see him as a truly every down found Is that what you mean by foundational back and every down back? Yeah, A build your offense around this guy three down back. I think the offense is going to be built around Darren Waller and Henry Ruggs and some of the passing concepts that they can do out of that. Multi receiver designs, three level designs, which means it is coming off play actions. So yeah, you are building around your run back to some degree. But you know, Jalen Richard's a good scat back behind Jacob's on the roster. They got Davontae Booker, who they imagine they signed him after Jacobs because he was in Denver. Yeah, he's signed this past spring. Booker was a contributor in Denver, and then they drafted Lynnon Bowden in the third round. He's kind of a gadget guy, so maybe they don't see him as a pure running back, but they have other guys that can come out of the backfield. As to point, so, I don't know if they need Jacobs to play every down. Now, if Jacobs plays of the snaps, I don't know if I'd blink it that either. I think he is a really good all around player, but he's a better He's a more useful runner than receive worth this point. Alright, let's uh, let's go to the Chargers and and a couple of questions here. And we touched on this just just ever so slightly a couple of weeks ago when we were talking about, uh, some of the quarterback situations around the league, and I railed against the Chargers for not going and getting Cam Newton for their offense. And you kind of made the point that you know, yeah, you know Cam Newton gives you more in the passing game than you're gonna get from Tyrod Taylor. But you know, Cam, you want to run a lot of power, a lot of stuff inside and and maybe the Chargers don't really have that ability to do that with their offensive line. Uh they did, you know, They've added Trade Turner, Uh, they signed Brian Bulaga, but it's still sort of looking like a patchwork kind of unit. So my question you Andy is, uh, you know you have Tyrod Taylor, and we're going to sort of assume Tyrod Taylor might have a longer run to start the year, uh, considering everything was pushed back and sort of thrown into chaos by the pandemic. But Tyrod Taylor and then Austin Ekeler in the back field, it's kind of a unique set up they have, And I'm just curious if you have any feel for for what you think it might look like. Well, I do believe the Chargers think their offensive line is better suited for zone blocking than man to man blocking, which is the kind of blocking man blocking. That's what That's what Cam Newton's always played behind in their run game in Carolina. So stylistically, it's a different kind of mobility at QB um and and Taylor might be a purer fit for that, even though Newton's the better, certainly the better all around running QB, and I think Newton is a much better QB overall, But um what the offense will look like. So if they if they want to start with outside zone designs, then that's the stretch the field left and right, make one cut and go, you do bootlegs and play action off of that. You know, that's that's pretty standard stuff they I don't know what else they would be with that. Their receivers really are not perfectly fit for that kind of system. You tend to get crossing routes and option not option routes, but underneath routes. Think of what like like Robert Woods for the rams and kind of get in your minds Eyt what he looks like when he plays. Keenan Allen can certainly do that. Keenan Allen can be anything you want them to be. Mike Williams is not that style of receiver. In fact, he's if I had to make a comparison for Mike Williams and that kind of offense we're describing, that bootleg offense. I'd say he's closer to being a Darren Waller in a bootleg offense like how the Raiders use him than he is a white Out. And they don't have a lot of other options at wide receiver either, So it's Hunter. Henry is gonna be a big deal in their system. So I don't know what they'll bee Gary, it's it's and Taylor is a very conservative quarterback as well, and you have to take that into consideration. And that might be a problem too, because Alan and Williams are at their best on fifteen to twenty five yard in breaking routes, dig routes, post patterns, stuff where they use their body and that's what Philip Rivers always through. Really well, Tyrod Taylor is not gonna make many of those throws. He might not make in some games. That's just not the style of pastor that he is. All right, let's uh look at the Herbert though. Yeah, that's the I mean, look, Justin Herbert will have the job this year unless they you know, get out to like a nine in oh start or something, and then they don't want to make a change. But Herbert's most like, you're gonna have the job, just probably a little deeper in the season than than he would in a in a normal year. I didn't want to ask about the defense during James obviously, you know all world do everything safety. And now you add another sort of super athlete guy and Kenneth Murray, the uh the first round pick, their second first round pick. They traded back into round. Wanted to get him back in the draft, the linebacker out of Oklahoma. So I mean, are they are they gearing up to to look a little different defensively here or is this still going to be sort of the the old, you know, classic Seattle style type of approach. Well, statistically, by far, no defense last year had a higher Percengager there's snaps and just straight Seattle style Cover three than the Chargers. And it wasn't close. I mean it was, like I want to say, it's about eighty five percent the time they lined up and played that cover three, which I love. When I'm watching film. I save it for the end of the week on Friday nights when I'm really tired because I know it's it's it's I hate to say, it's not gonna be as hard to decipher though, and they understand that too. By the way, it's not like they like Gus Bradley. Their coordinator doesn't know other things about football. What he believes is that if you're gonna play in a straightforward we can play a straightforward scheme. You can call it predictable if you want, but it's also predictable on our side of things. We know what kind of plays you're gonna run offensively, because everybody runs about the same ten to twelve different route designs that beat Cover three. So we play Cover three understanding we're gonna get those Cover three beaters and we're going to have our guys tweaked the Cover three just enough to handle the beaters. That's the theory behind it, and I think it makes sense for some teams, and it's certainly the teams that have a lot of talent on defense, like those Seahawks did back in the day. Um, it makes a lot of sense. The problem with the Chargers is that style of defense doesn't work unless you're making big plays. You have to be getting sacks and forcing turnovers, and they just didn't do that. Last year they had they were minimal. Even though their pass rush is very talented with Ingram and both on the edges, they had a minimal impact pass rush in terms of actually making the plays and and they didn't force a lot of turnovers. And there wasn't a lot of in between either. It's just a pretty even vanilla defense that lined up and played. So you have to get more productivity out of your stars if you're going to play that way. Otherwise it doesn't make sense to play that way, especially given the corners you have Casey Hayward Chris Harris Jr. Those guys can both be fined in Amanda Man scheme Durwin James and could be at your every down, every do everything utility guy. But that's not what the scheme set up to do. Right now, alright, let's let's go into our projections for the ENTWENTI season. Uh. First, I mean, we're we're both. I I would guess picking the Chiefs by the way, I found my stat that Andy and I were talking before show. I was looking for a stat that I kept on sighting as last year's playoffs went on about the Chiefs. When the Chiefs had their offensive line and Mahomes and Tyree Hill in the lineup. Last year they were ten and oh and their average margin of victory was a little higher than fourteen points, and that included obviously the postseason run as well. So, uh, you know, there's there's no reason to think that they won't win this division. Uh my question, I I guess we'll set it this way. Who is most likely out of these three teams? And I think all are sort of worthy of being in the conversation of of grabbing a wild card spot. Most likely probably Las Vegas. So interesting, Okay, I guess there's too many questions with that Charger offense right now. It's and maybe if it were a different time, with a normal off season, where you could kind of some of these things answered, and maybe we'll feel different after a few weeks of training camp two. But there's a lot of questions on that offense. I think go ahead, No, I would just say I think the readers are sort of the uh, the the the the when I'm only more the the smallest range of outcomes belonged to the Raiders. I think I feel like they're the most reliable team to project at this point. But you probably sume is seven and nine and nine and seven correct, Whereas I think I can see the Chargers between six and eleven, and I think I see the Broncos in the same way. I probably would be in step with you on that. Denver, it just comes down to Drew lock and if Drew lock is is excellent. You know at Denver defense we outlined already. I mean, actually you know. So let's here's what you have with the Chargers in Broncos. You have two teams with questions on offense, a lot of questions on offense, and a lot of talent on defense. Which defense Let's start with this, Which defense is better between the Broncos and Chargers. I think I like the Broncos defense better. I think I like a Charger's roster better. But I think I like the Broncos defense better. I I do too, I liked I mean, we didn't talk about a J. Boullier and uh uh Bryce Callahan at corner our Callahan's gonna be there. Slot guy was unavailable last year. But they do have to get the number two corner spot figured out. The nice thing about their scheme THO always said they keep two safeties back deep, and it's a lot of disguises. You can hide your corners that way. In fact, I know somebody said to be someone who's has been close to Fangio over the years. One of the things that's made him such a great schemer is he's never had very good corners to play with. He's had good pass rushers in his career, but he's always had to hide his cornerbacks. And you get very creative when you have to do that. So you know, I'm not too worried about Denver's number two corner And that's really the only spot on defense that I would say is not above average talent wise. Maybe they're d line with it. Looks like I guess Derek, Well, where did Derek Wolf? And again he's gone, that's a big deal. That's uh, that's a really good question. He is, uh boy, of course, as everybody knows, he is with the Oh he's with the Ravens. Now, how do we not remember that? Yeah? I was sure and that I thought, well, oh, that's not fair because they can't get Wolf and clay As Campbell to that defense. But that it's a nice offseason for that front office. There um, they've drafted to replace Wolf. They've taken guys in the second or third round pretty much every year the last three or four years. So, but you know, it's it's not an overwhelming defensive line, but the rest of that defense is above average. It just about every spot. Chargers might be very good at the very top with botha and Ingram and Derwin James, but it's it's not above average at every single spot. Yeah, yeah, I I'm not I'm not crazy about Kenneth Murray in the short term. I think he's gonna have a tough transition to UH to the to the NFL here. But well we'll see how if it's a simple scheme for them though, Yeah, that's that's a good point, big time talent. I don't know. I I wonder about him. I worry about him. I stay up nights. I would say Denver's the safer bet the more I think that's through. And in fact, I'm debating my mind if it's between Denver or Las Vegas then as the second best team in the ANFC, because Las Vegas I like their offense more, but their defense being better than you were before, it doesn't mean you're better than everybody else. Still, and you know, I don't know. They've had so much turnover on defense. It's hard to know what these guys are because they have a new defensive tackle and Elite Collins. The we didn't talk about their linebackers that they signed a free agency Littleton and quit Koski, who I like the lot in Chicago and Litlton is a really good past defender and that's that means something in the NFL. And then they have a couple of new corners or at least one in Prince of Mukamara too, because they they're gonna play Damon Arnette their second or their their first round pick. And Nathan Abram's back at free safety only played one game because of the shoulder injury last year. And to Marris Randalls, it's a whole new defense. I mean, I just think I just went through the whole defense. So we don't know exactly what this defense is at this point. It is, yeah, uh, most likely to win m v P besides Patrick Mahomes. If you have to put ten bucks on someone in this division besides Mahomes to win m VP, who would it be? Um? Do you have? Well? Probably, I mean probably Drew Lock just because I was thinking about it in the way m VP voting works. So are you asking that, are you asking who is the second best player in this division? Give me both, because I'd probably say Kelsey for the ladder and uh and and Lock for the former. I hate ladder and formers. I always have to stop and then remember which one I don't even Yeah, ladders, Lock is my Lock is my number two MVP candidate. Kelsey is my second dist player in division. But obviously, if if you know where if Kelsey's gonna an MVP, it's it's Mahomes who's gonna win MVP. I think a person could argue, first, first of all, the Kelsey thing, is he more valuable than Tyreek killed of that offense? And it's you know, that's we're just now that's just a fun argument. But we're talking about a plus guys at each spot, so that's there's not a lot to that, except that's what defenses have to kind of figure out each week when they play these guys, is which one do we prioritize if we have to pick. But I think you could argue that the second most valuable player in the division, let's pretend Mahomes doesn't exist. In this this point, I think it's Chris Jones as the defensive tackle to the Chiefs as as valuable in terms of if you take him out of the lineup versus someone else on these other teams, which defense or which unit regresses the most, and aside from taken maybe I don't know. If you save Drew Lock out of Denver, I'd say Jones. If you take Jones off, the Chief's defense regresses more than any of the other seven units major units in the A S C. West who even more than Derek Carr to Mariota the Raider in Las Vegas. Um, that's a good question. That's a good question. That's why I asked it. Yeah, Um, I don't know. So, I mean it's apples and oranges now, because we're talking to defense first offense, probably not out of respect for the demands of the quarterback position and out of respect for Derek Carr, I guess I would say no, so Chris Jones and would be behind Derek Carr in that conversation and uh, most likely to win Defensive Player of the Year. I mean, you gotta I'm guessing you're going Chris Jones. I think I was gonna go Chris Jones to Uh. Last year, I actually picked Frank Clark because I thought if he took off the Chiefs defense would improve so much and he would notice and everyone vote for him. But uh, a lot of I mean, look Joey Bosa, Melman, Ingram Derwin, James, Uh, you know Von Miller. I mean, there are a lot of candidates in this division. There aren't Bradley Chubb had big numbers two as a rookie. If I recall um, yeah, most likely to win because I don't think defensive Player of the Year. If Mahomes wins, probably here's the problem with Chris Jones. I mean, I think the answer is Tyrone Matthew will, so I'm gonna undermine my own argument. But everybody likes Everyone likes Tyron Matthew so much. That's and I'm not saying he doesn't deserve it still either, But he's such a high profile guy. Chris Jones a defensive tackle unless you're Aaron Donald, where it's just impossible to not see him. And I don't know if every voter will get to him, but it seems like voters would have a tough time voting Mahomes. M V p which I think is the far and away that still the most likely option here. Especially, I don't think that he didn't win a VP last year, so voters won't feel like they have my Homes fatigue there. I don't think you can vote my Homes MVP and Jones defensive player. I think that it will go against human instinct for a lot of voters. It. I mean, I don't want to pick a guy on another team as defensive player. Yeah, I think that's the case. I do think of the Chiefs win fourteen or fifteen games, which is within the realm of possibility, I do think that becomes a possible scenario there. Well. Yeah, I remember in the NFC after the twenties seventeen season, pretty much every major award went to the Saints players or the Rams players and so girly Donald, they didn't eat into each other's awards at here. So maybe maybe I'm just spewing nonsense. Yeah, what's your answer to the too defensive player? Well it was it was Chris Jones. But you're picking Chris Jones, right am? I every I have said everything and nothing about Chris Jones so far. Yeah, Well, you said he he was giving me the most valuable guy in the division. Besides I have to go You're right, I have to go with Jones on that. But that gets into partly like the nature of the scheme and what you're asking from everybody, Like if von Miller goes down in Denver, you know who's more who's a better player, essentially, Von Miller or Chris Jones. It's that's a hard one, and probably lean towards Miller a little bit. That's a really hard discussion. But Denver scheme is set up to accommodate the departure of von Miller better than Kansas City scheme is set up to accommodate the departure Chris Jones. Just based on the small little details about how they play, the Chiefs are very They're They're not a vanilla defense at all, but they are vanilla in the way they align their defensive lineman. It's pretty much just say it's a four down overfront on almost every snap, and they're just counting on their defensive lineman to win. If Jones is not in there, I don't know if the Chiefs have a good enough defensive line to be consistent on defense. Mm hmm. I'm I just don't want to also pick Chris Jones, so I'll I'll really pick Chris Jones, but I'll be a coward and I'll say Von Miller is my alternate. And then Joey Bosa is third, three way tie, three way tie for Defensive Player of the Year. Hearady here first? All right, Andy, with that bit of nonsense, I think that's a that's a rap for this one. We'll be back next week with another mystery division. Who will it be? It won't be the uh A f C West for the NFC South, It'll be someone else, because we've already done those. But Andy, once again, we thank you for joining us. Uh and we'll call this just goodbye for now. All right, thank you. The mm QB Monday Morning NFL Podcast is me Gary Graantling Special thanks once again to Andy Benoit for joining me this week. We are produced by Shelby Royston, Sis, Executive producer of podcasts at Scott Brody, Ben Eagles, Director of editorial Projects and product Mark Ravick is Emeritus editor of the MQB. Andy Benoit is the founder of the MMQB NFL podcast. Keep up with our entire lineup of podcast five days a week by subscribing to the MMQB NFL podcast for free on Apple podcasts Now Why Are There? Please do us a favor and leave a raving M review. It really does help other people find the show, which is also available on Spotify Radio dot com, Stitcher, Si dot com, and wherever else you listen to podcasts. Se