The ol' Biden/Harris Switcheroo

Published Jul 26, 2024, 9:00 AM

On this episode of The Middle we're asking you: How does Biden's exit and Harris's entrance change your view of the Presidential race? We're joined by Democratic political strategist Yvette Simpson and USA Today Chief Political Correspondent Phillip Bailey. The Middle's house DJ Tolliver joins as well, plus callers from around the country. #election #Biden #Harris #Trump #DNC #VP 

The Middle is supported by Journalism Funding Partners, a nonprofit organization striving to increase the sustainability of local journalism by building connections between donors and news organizations. More information on how you can support The Middle at listen to Themiddle dot com.

Welcome to the Middle.

I'm Jeremy Hobson along with our house DJ Tolliver and Tolliver.

I was just looking.

Back to our episode from October twenty sixth of last year.

Do you remember what question we asked listeners?

Yeah, that was our Halloween episode. Man, don't you remember we're all dressed up?

We asked are our political leaders too old? Which seems like an interesting topic given what just happened. You can hear that episode anytime because The Middle is available as a podcast in partnership with iHeart Podcasts on the iHeart app or wherever you get your podcasts. But, as you know, Joe Biden decided that it was time to, in his words, past the torch to a younger generation. He dropped out of the race for president after mounting pressure from Democrats and endorse his vice president Kamala Harris, who very quickly rallied the party behind her nomination. So while she hasn't officially gotten the Democratic nomination yet, it almost certainly will be Harris versus Trump this year. And we want to know what you, our listeners think about that. And we're going to get to that in just a moment. But first, last week we asked you, following the assassination attempt on former President Trump, how we can turn the temperature down in our politics. Here are some of the voicemails we got.

My name is Mike Frontier, Rascine, Wisconsin. Our message is I think we get to the middle of politicians stopped fighting for things. What kind of model is that for our kids?

Hi?

This is Anna from Gallaton, Tennessee. And to tone down kind of just the aggressiveness. I tend to tell people, I'm just an independent and I feel like not aligning myself as a Republican or a Democrat tends to have more open and easygoing discussions on politics.

Hey, my name is Steves and Colorado. I think the most important thing that we need to do is for each side to police each other as extreme.

What we need is.

The Conservatives to criticize the far right and the Democrats to criticize the far left. It's much easier to criticize the other side than to police.

Your own party.

Well, thanks to everyone who called in.

So now to our question this hour, as I'm calling it, Tolliver, the old Biden Harris switcheroo.

Does it change your vote?

Are you happy with how fast the Democrats rallied behind Kamala Harris or do you think it was too much of a coronation? And who should Harris pick as her vice presidential nominee? That's what we want to hear from you, Tlliver. What is the number for people to call in?

It's eight four four four Middle. That's eight four four four six four three three five three All right to us that listen to the Middle dot com.

So let's meet our panel.

Democratic political strategist Yvette Simpson joins us from Cincinnati. She's the former executive director of Democracy for America and current host of the Power of Why podcast. Vett, Great to have you back on the Middle.

Glad to be here, especially this week, Jeremy.

Yeah, it's a big week.

I mean, there's been so many big weeks so far in this campaign, but this was definitely one of the top ones.

Philip. Great to have you back as well. That's USA Today.

Chief political correspondent Philip Bailey in Louisville, Kentucky High.

Philip, Jeremy House, Thanks, going going well.

So before we get to the phones and they're already lighting up, Philip, you were with us on that show when we asked last fall if our political leaders were too old. There was a lot of pressure on Joe Biden to do what he did. Now a lot of praise for him for doing it. How much do you think that this has changed the race?

Oh, this is reset the race altogether. This is a totally different race than we had anticipated. I think, other than maybe Nicki Haley, no one was really predicting that Vice President Kamala Harris was going to be the nominee. So this resets the race in a lot of ways. We now have a contest where there actually is a sort of forward thinking, page turning candidate issue that voters were having for years. Jeremy was they did not want to see this rematch between two men who were born before the United Nations were even founded. So now that we have a candidate who was born on the other side right of the Korean War, I think there is going to be a conversation about turning that page forward. Now Trump is the old candidate and we have an untested candidate though two on the Democratic side, Harris. As we all remember, she dropped out before the first vote was taken in twenty twenty. She's never lost a contest in her entire career. But this resets the race altogether, and I think it sets a new ground and a whole new set of rules for.

How we go forward.

What do you think, how has this changed the race?

Oh, it's changed everything. I think when the debate happened, and I think there were already people who were kind of wondering whether he would be able to handle the brunt of a campaign where he would have to move around and help support the entire ticket, whether he was going to be able to make it through that. And I think after the debate it was very clear we need energy, we need someone who can give us a fresh start, we need the next generation. And my question kept being one is he going to do it? And two how long is he going to wait? Because I didn't want to go into the convention in Chicago and have a question about that and let that be a ball in the air. You really don't want that. So the fact that he did it in the timing that he did took the wind out of the bullet in the year sales that Trump was having, and it shifted the conversation this week to our new exciting candidate. And the hope and the expectation is that by the time we get to Chicago as a party, we're singing kumbaya. It's about, hey, how are we going to get this done. Let's get her voted in, and let's keep it moving.

But have you heard of that from Democrats who wanted more of a contest and who are worried about Harris's ability to win.

I have not heard a lot of that. There have been very few de factors that I've heard from. And I think part of that is because she should have been the one. Right constitutionally, she succeeds the president. You can't serve she's the only other Democrat that was on the ballot. Legitimately in all primary states, she might have been in the second position, but she was on the ballot the entire time, and so it was important that it be her. My fear was that they were going to try to have an open convention and let it be anybody's game, which would have been very challenging. I think Black women would have had a lot of problem with that. I think Asian American women would have had a lot of problem with that, and there would have been some folks who are real party our based would have struggled with that a bit. So I think actually anyone who's concerned about it now, I just wonder why, especially since she's raised a ton of money, which she kind of does. She did that when she came in on the VP ticket, and she's also gotten a lot of momentum just since this happened earlier this week.

So I have to say that as we were getting ready for the show, I was so excited to hear what our callers have to say about this, because we've heard what the elected politicians think about this, and we've certainly heard what the pundits think.

But let's get to a caller.

Spencer is on the line from Pittsburgh, a swing state. Spencer, what do you think of this change?

Yeah, so, personally, first off, thanks for having me on. I'm actually quite glad about it. Beforehand, I didn't want to vote for either Trump nor Biden. I think Trump was too radically going to his side, trying to make people fired up for him. And I thought Biden was quite frankly a milk toast, just liberal and went with whatever came his way. But I think Kamla is a lot more of a centrist, a lot more willing to see both sides and frankly allowing the thoughts for both sides to kind of push her to wherever the American people are going to want her to be. And so I went from wanting to vote for RFK Junior an independent, I wanted to vote for Kamala.

Interesting, Spencer, thanks so much, Philip Bailey. That's interesting that he's talking about RFK Junior. I wonder how many people are like Spencer out there.

Well, thank you.

We saw a New York Times Siena pole released today and it shows that, you know, in a one on one race, Trump is still slightly ahead of Harris, but then when it's the multi candidate race with RFK, she actually takes the lead, and again this scrambles the race altogether. Every everything before Biden has to be discarded, right, all the polls.

All the middle shows that we did, we have to just throw out from every middle episode.

That's all gone.

Maybe, And I think what you're gonna see is another thing that we're gonna see is we're gonna see a group of young people who are fourteen, fifteen, sixteen, four years ago in the midst of the pandemic, who are now adults. Those young people are going to be inspired I think a lot more by a fifty nine year old Kamala Harris, who reminds them of their auntie, right, who reminds them of their professional auntie who's out here pursuing her career. They're gonna be inspired. We're already seeing a surge in young people registering to vote no surprise, duh, Democrats. Maybe an eighteen year old a little more inspired by a fifty nine year old running than an eighty one year old running. So I think we're going to see not only young people who are going to come in who are going to see this as their historic moment. Remember she's a historic candidate. We've only had jeremy four women in our history on the ballot at the vice presidential president level, jerremin Ferraro, Sarah Palin, Hillary Clinton, and now Kamala Harris. So for that whole entire generation, particularly of young professional women of color, Black, Asian, Hispanic, etc. This is very much to them the same thing that the Obama movement was sixteen years ago.

Let's go to Nishe, who's in Columbia, South Carolina. Nishe, tell us what you think about this change on the Democratic side.

I am very happy that Biden stepped down. I was not going to vote this election. I did look into Robert Kennedy and there were just some reservations there. But I'm sixty two years old and I was not going to vote this election, which that was the first time ever. And I wasn't particularly of of Harris. But I've got to tell you exactly what your guest said about how nobody wanted to see a rematch between Biden and Trump. And when Biden stepped down and Kamala Harris was put forward, she is your parents. The enthusiasm it has just been contagious, and I am all on board with Kamala Harris. At this point I even.

Said money already, wow, Anisha, thank you for that. Evette Simpson. That must be good to hear as a Democratic strategist.

I'm beaming yes and amen, yes and amen. You know, and I want to be respectful to bide him. He had an amazing career. We do have to give him its just due. But I do think we have been talking a lot about energy. We have been talking about setting the new stage, and I think Kamala presents that we'll call her Mamala since she called her Auntie Kamala. Mamla creates a whole new energy. And I think seeing folks who might have not shown up, or folks who would have voted for RFK Junior switch over is exactly why this decision had to be made, Because we had the folks who said, you know, those voters who didn't want either candidate. Now we're getting those guys over on Kalala's team.

By the way, Philip mentioned eighteen year olds, we often have eighteen year olds call into the show.

If you're out there eight four four four Middle Tolliver.

You know, history may not exactly repeat itself, but it sure does come up with some crazy coincidences sometimes.

Yeah, man, my hometown of Chicago is actually going to host the DNC convention once again. And back in sixty eight when the DNC was also in Chicago, President Lyndon Johnson similarly announced that he would not accept the nomination.

I do not believe that I should devote an hour or day of my time to any personal partisan causes, or to any duties other than the aweshome duties of this office, the presidency of your country. Accordingly, I shall not see and I will not accept the nomination of my party for another term, as you're a president.

So interesting to hear that in especially, Tolliver, after Biden gave a very similar speech from.

The Oval Office.

Stay right there, We've got more coming up on the Middle. This is the Middle. I'm Jeremy Hobson. If you're just tuning, in the Middle is a national call in show. We're focused on elevating voices from the middle geographically, politically, and philosophically, or maybe you just want to meet in the middle. This hour, we're asking you, how does Biden's exit from the race and Harris's entrance change your views or your vote? Tulliver, what's the number for people to call in?

It's eight four four four Middle. That's eight four four four sixty four three three five three. You can also write to us and listen to the Middle dot com or on social media.

I'm joined by USA Today Chief political correspondent for Philip Bailey and political strategist Yvette Simpson.

And before we get back to the.

Phones, Yvett, how do the issues at play in this election change because of the switch? Are there things that we're going to be hearing more about and things that we're going to be hearing less about than when it was Trump Biden.

I think the age question is flipped. We talked about that. I think women. So I just got a text message from somebody who's on the call that Shennon Watts is holding with Mom's demand one hundred and thirty six thousand women on a call right now. They just raised one point one million dollars and the call just started. So women are a new playground because of the abortion band things that were happening before, and we used to struggle to get suburban white women. I think that conversation changes significantly. I think we have a conversation about the future. If I'm Kamala, I'm like taking credit for all the good things that happened in the first four years. I'm also saying, hey, here's how we're going to do something different which will allow her to kind of shake a little bit. As GOP is trying to hold her to some of the policies that they think are damaging. So I think it's a great opportunity for her. I hope we talk about marijuana legalization and removing you know, the guys out of prison, the guys and ladies out of prison, on those things, because I know how she feels about that. She's supportive of that, So I want to see her.

And we didn't hear much about that for Biding either.

We didn't and we should have. We should have. Yeah, I say, Ohio as a twenty six to legalize and we're a red state, So I think we're ready to have that conversation for sure.

Philip, We've heard about some of the positives for Democrats about Kamala Harris.

She's certainly younger and more energetic.

She's more comfortable talking about abortion rights, which is something that has energized Democrats.

What are as you look at this as a.

Political reporter, what are the initial weaknesses of Kamala Harris as a candidate?

Well, I think I mean, you know, Vice President Harris is markedly to the left of President Biden on a lot of issues. She has given many interviews in the past where she's been caught flat footed on questions about to fund the police, abolishing ice, some of her larger, I think views on criminal justice and prosecutions. You're already seeing President Trump telegraphed at a rally this week.

Saying no more mister Niskay.

Not that necessarily ever was one, but his campaign is telegraphed that they are going to go hard to the paint against Vice President Harris in these sort of Willy Horton style ads.

I think you're going to.

See a lot of her prosecutorial record from San Francisco when she was the DA in San Francisco, as Attorney General in California. Wow, those issues are going to be brought back up. I think Harris may be better prepared this go round, but she historically has not always been best on her feet in some of these interviews and caught on some of these more controversial issues. So she's marketly to the left of Biden. I think that's our biggest weakness there.

Let's go to Andrew, who is in Greensboro, North Carolina. Andrew, welcome to the middle.

Go ahead, Hey, thanks for having me on. I just wanted to call in and say that I am actually very excited about her taking the reins for this election. I am a registered Republican and have been my whole life. I'm thirty years old, but I find myself on the probably the left wing of the Republican Party, and this election, I was feeling like I'm very much left behind by the current Republican Party that's become the Party of Trump. So, you know, I was kind of trying to balance whether I wanted to stay on election day or go vote for Joe Biden, who I didn't have a lot of confidence in. But you know, then I reflected on my privilege as a white man and how another Trump can might affect other people who are, you know, not the thanosition I am. And and now that now that Kamala Harris is going to likely be the nominee, I'm certainly going to the polls and I'll be casting my ballots for her, despite what my registration card says.

Okay, well, so just let me ask you a quick follow up. Because of your Republican registration card, do you want her to pick a Republican as her vice presidential running mate or would or do you care?

You know, to be honest, I don't really care. I mean, I don't think a lot of people in her own party would would really appreciate that. So for me, it's not super important as long as it's not someone who is I would say, you know, extremely car left.

But I'm going to be.

Voting for her regardless because of my concerns about Trump and Project twenty five and other things like that.

Right, Andrew, thank you if that you don't think it's likely.

I assume that she will that Kamala Harris will pick a Republican to be her VP.

No, I think that's like zero to zero point five. I think we know what the ticket looks like, you know, with the candidates potential candidates look like based on those governors who and leaders who are in those swing states. I actually like Josh Shapiro. I think he's got a lot of energy. I think he's he's Obama Esque in the way is Caden's in some of the ways that he talks. He's relatively new, so he'll have to be vetted. But what he reflects I think is what happens after her. She does two terms, he can be the next president. I like him. He's my favorite.

Right now, let's go to Amber, who is in Arvada, Colorado. Hi, Amber, Welcome to the middle go.

Ahead, Hi, thanks for having me. Yeah, so, I guess, you know, as far as the subject goes, one thing I'm worried about is Kamala Harris's electability and just how fast everybody kind of jumped on the train as far as yep, she's the nominee. And at this point, I mean, it's from everything I've been hearing in the news, it sounds like she's basically for all intents and purposes, that's it. And it just happened so fast. And I guess my concerns are that I feel like she is going to attract certain Democrat demographics of voters, particularly I think younger people, and historically, you know, it's older people that tend to vote. And unfortunately, I do think there is still a lot of misogyny and racism, and you know, I just I wonder how much that is going to affect this because I feel like there are probably people out there that just the sheer fact that she is black and that she is a woman, there.

Are just not going to vote for her no matter what.

And how does that how does how is that counterbalance?

I guess with the new voters that she will a tract.

And yeah, well, yt me, let me take that. Let me take that to Philip Bailey. The lot there.

One thing is that Joe Biden actually did do very well with older voters that was sort of his base and in some ways, and also what about the question of whether the fact that Kamala Harris is so many firsts, a black woman, an Indian American woman, a woman, is that How worried, Philip are Democrats about that?

Well, let's unpack this right over that three week period. I think we're going to look back at that period after the debate with astonishment. There was this conversation, and I think the Democratic Party, it's big weeks, it's mega donors, it's leaders got a very clear message, particularly from African American women, professional African American women who know a think of two about being passed over, that if you do this, there won't be anyone who will support number one number two. I think people are are right to have some squeamishness or some skittishness about Harris's viability.

Right, this is an.

Election in which, look, we're gonna have a lot of history. First, a lot of these things are at the forefront. I think the Harris campaign's response to that is, let's go, let's have let's have this conversation, let's.

Have this debate that she's building a new coalition.

Altogether, it's going to be LGBTQYA plus people, it's gonna be young people, it's gonna be middle class whites and working class whites. She's gonna have to put together a different type of coalition. She's gonna have to probably get Jeremy ninety five, ninety three, ninety five percent of the African American vote.

Let's remember the twenty twelve model for Barack Obama.

Barack Obama, who we all thought wasn't gonna be re elected in twenty twelve, only got thirty nine percent of the white vote.

And that's what many will point.

To as the sort of backlashing creation of not just the Tea Party movement, but the MAGA movement itself. So in many ways, I think you're going to see Harris model that same that same kind of coalition and who she picks as her vice president. Maybe that final point here, I guess would be Latasha Brown, a black voters matter made the point of maybe she needs to pick a non white male, but I think the Harris campaign is clearly telegraphed that that's going to be who they're looking for to balance that ticket. But we're not there yet, but I think this is going to be a big test for the country well.

And already one of the non white males that was being talked about, Wes Moore, the governor of Maryland, has come out and said he wouldn't.

Be interested, which I always find interesting.

That somebody would say they wouldn't be if somebody called you up and said you want to be the vice president, Like, now, this isn't really for me.

Let's go to.

Eliza, who is in Carrie, North Carolina. Eliza, welcome to the middle.

What do you think?

Hi, thank you so much for having me.

So.

I'm twenty two and I just graduated from college and this is my second presidential election that I'm voting in, and I can just say from the difference between this election and the last so far, it just feels incredible. Since Kamala has joined the race, and I think speaking from the perspective of me and my friends, there's just a lot more energy and excitement and enthusiasm to vote for her. Last time around, there was a lot of dread and a lot of this kind of feeling that it was our duty to vote for Joe Biden, but there was no excitement behind it, kind of just like get it out of the way. And now I think that feels very, very different. The last couple days, I mean, social media has been flooded with all sorts of videos and jokes and means about Kamala Harris and it's just it. You can't get away from it, and it feels really refreshing and exciting.

Eliza.

Let me just ask you one quick thing. You're in the state of North Carolina. The governor Roy Cooper has been talked about as a possible running mate for Kamala Harris. Would that make any difference to you at all? As somebody in North Carolina.

I mean, I will be voting for Calmlala either way, but I think I would just be over the moon if Roy Cooper was chosen. I'm really happy that I got to vote for Roy Cooper, you know, last term. And he's won two statewide elections in North Carolina, both times in twenty sixteen and twenty twenty. When the state went for Trump and he still won as a Democrat, so I mean, I think he's incredible. I think he's done an incredible job as a governor of our state.

Eliza, thank you so much for that call, Tolliver. I know that there's more coming in on social media and into our email box.

Absolutely. Albert writes, I'm happy with the turn of events. The Right have charted a dark course for this country, taking us back instead of forward.

My pick for.

VP would be Liz Cheney, although that is rather unlikely, Gene writes from Vermont. Kamala Harris says she is one hundred percent in alignment with Biden stands on Gaza, so I'm not sure I can support her either. I wish we had a real choice, but it appears all of DC blind about Israel's actions and that one I was really interested in because I know that on my side of the internet people are really waiting to hear something for soul about Gaza from Kamala Harris, So I don't know what you two have to see about.

And if ed Simpson she did talk about she had a little mini press availability and talked about the situation in Israel.

After meeting.

I think with the Prime Minister NETANYAHUO from Israel, who's visiting Washington.

Is there.

How how does this change the calculation from the Democrats, many of whom called into this show and said, I can't vote for Biden because of Gaza.

Yeah. Well, one, he's promised he's going to finish that up before January, which we all know is gonna happen. Right, He's going to wrap that little thing up. Joe Biden says, We're gonna have that little war thing wrapped up before I leave, but probably not before the election. I think Kamala has been you know, she's supported by progressives, she's supported by the middle of the party. I think she's gonna have to walk the line. A lot has changed. We talked about this when we did the Middle East show since that war started, and so I think a lot more people are calling for ceasefire now, a lot more people want the destiny and a lot more people want to find resolution. So I think she has the benefit of time. And as we continue to have conversations about that, we have to remember her husband is Jewish, so it's really important to remember that Doug has a voice on this too, also a progressive for what it sends to be kind of progressive like her, but her husband's perspective is important too. I remember hearing just yes or today they were saying, well, Kamala wouldn't take a meeting with net and Yahoo. She doesn't care about Jewish people. And somebody says her husband is actually Jewish, so it's not like she does not care. So it'll be interesting to see how she threads that needle going forward. If I'm her, though, I would let Joe Biden take this one. Let him take it for now, and then I think what we've got is the benefit of time because more people are calling for fewer deaths and the end to this war.

Let's go to Claude, who is in Overland Park, Kansas. Claude, welcome to the middle. What do you think about this change?

Thank you very much.

I think Kamala Harris can win the election by differentiating herself from both Biden and Trump and moving more toward the middle and side quick ways. One is by taking the shackles off Zelensky and Ukraine so that he can bomb Russian supply lines, et cetera, and that's just his own country. Secondly, a broader position and energy so that we're not telling our allies the world countries that they have to depend upon oil from Iran and Russia. Thirdly, more targeted tariffs to help reduce inflation. And then fit for the border, a more balanced position on the border, steal the border, and then you can have the amnesty that will focus the discussion on Trump's terrible deportation idea. And then fifth a little more positive on schools. Positive supporting charity schools, not necessarily full choice, but supporting the charity schools. Those will really help her win the election.

Thank you, Claude, thank you, Yeah, thank you.

And Philip Bailey about the issue of whether she will go to the base or go to the middle. Now, what do you expect from Kamala Harris? What is she going to do as she launches this campaign.

Well, I think that the Vice president is going to try tow the line on some of these issues, but on others, I think she can't deny that she is again marketly to the left of Joe Biden on a lot of these things. Right, she was a sendative from California, right, not Texas, not Florida, not Ohio. She was a senator from the state of California. So look, I think, for example, on the Gaza issue, it was her. She was the first to sort of distinguish herself, speaking at the Edmund Pettis Bridge in some Alabama, casting.

This as a moral issue.

She Diday I think made another example of that, saying while she denounced the burning of the American flag and the defacing of certain federal properties, she said that she was very clear with net in Yahoo that he needs to wrap this up with the death toll in Gaza, which is I think an atrocious sort of human rights violation, an issue for a lot.

Of people who, even if they still see what.

Happened on October seventh as a violation as well, they sort of balance those things out and say, hey, look there's a moral issue here.

She spoke to that. I think one thing that she's going.

To absolutely speak to is childcare and cast that in very much the same way that healthcare was cast by former President Obama, talking about the rise of that cost, which affects.

Men and women alike.

And again, the reproductive rights changes the ballgame. A Republican women get abortions too. She has leaned into that issue. She was the first major candidate of major official to visit a planned parenthood clinic. So I don't think she's going to necessarily go to the middle as much as she's going to talk about issues that invigorate progressives that they feel like Joe Biden really there's some left on the table and said, oh, it's my obligation.

To vote for you.

Okay, before we go to a break, I asked for an eighteen year old and I got one. Joshua is with us from Charleston, South Carolina. Joshua quickly tell us what you think?

So how I feel as a new eighteen year old voter who's going to be, you know, as you guys mentioned earlier in the show, someone who's lived through the pandemic and is getting their first chance to really have their voice heard in the voting scheme of the country.

I feel that.

Possible President Harris running against former President Trump will be a really interesting battle because she is somebody who we haven't really seen before really have a chance against Trump. Inside of the race. Trump betting on Trump versus Biden definitely had a lot of younger voters kind of if he not really wanting someone who's the age of your grandfather versus the age of another grandfather, but now someone who, as y'all mentioned, the age of an anti someone who's younger and has that different stance not only on economic policy and just ideals within the parties, but now differences in age and energy and how long they can last. Actually living completely through a presidency is something that really swayed me from being more in between. Oh, I don't know which one I really like more. I've was raised more Democratic, but I was kind of iffy. I found issues with both which I didn't necessarily.

We got to leave it there, Joshua, because we're running out of time, But thank you so much for that call, Tolliver. You know, one of the things that we have been seeing this week talking abou Kamala Harris is Joe Biden basically ending his long career right in front of us.

Yeah, and this man is so experienced. This is even the first time he stepped away from running for president. Listen to this from nineteen eighty seven.

There will be other presidential campaigns, and I'll be there, Oliphant, I'll be there. There will be other opportunities, there will be other battles in other places other times, and I'll be there. This country's going to be lifted up, and I'm gonna play a big part in doing it.

Of course, I guess one big difference there, Tolliver, is that Biden when he made that announcement was not the president, which he is now. Pretty extraordinary to see a president decide to not run.

For re election.

We'll be right back with more of the middle. This is the Middle. I'm Jeremy Hobson. This hour, we're asking you, does the Biden exit and Harris entrance into the race change your views or your vote? Call us at eight four four four Middle. That's eight four four four six four three three five three. You can also reach out to us at Listen to the Middle dot com. Before we get to the funds, Philip, we've talked about a couple of vice presidential possibilities. One is in your state, Andy Basheer, the governor. Do you think that that's likely or do you think it's going to be somebody like a Mark Kelly or as if that wants a Josh Shapiro.

Well, I think that governor Andy Basheer my home state governor, and checked my Bluegrass bias on here, Jeremy, he's absolutely in the top five talking to different sources in and out of the Harris campaign. He has certainly someone that the Harris people are kicking the tires on. It's been confirmed today by The Courier Journal of the paper I used to work at, that he is being vetted.

I think that, you.

Know, the issue for Bashir will obviously be that he can talk the talk. He can talk to Appalachia folks, he can talk to working class whites. He's won three state wide elections in a state you know that Donald Trump won.

One important factor.

Take a county like Breathett County right in eastern Kentucky County. Donald Trump won that county by about fifty something points against Biden.

Andy Basheer won by about twenty something points. However, the problems.

For Andy but Sheer is that, you know, Kentucky is not a swing state by any measure, It's going to be lockstep with Donald Trump. So if Harris is looking for someone who can make her more competitive in those swing states than the Joshapiro A Mark Kelly Senter Mark Kelly of Arizona, I think it's rise to the top of that list someone of like Roy Cooper. But I think certainly my Bluegrass Boy Andy Basheer is in the runnings like any good horse race from horse race from Kentucky.

Let's go to Tom, who's in the Twin Cities in Minnesota.

Tom, Welcome to the middle, go ahead.

Hi, thank you very much for inviting me in and anyone who's willing to listen to me. I guess every party needs a pooper, right, So here's my message. I'm really really disappointed in the Democratic Party for taking this approach of just going with the so predictable handing of the reins over to the boringly predictable heir apparent vice president, who I, in my experience, is a very divisive character. I hang around with a lot of liberal Republicans and they just really don't like as a person. You know, we can always get into facts, but that's one of the facts. And I think it's a huge loss or a whiff or a myth on the opportunity for the Democratic Party to truly energize their base and potential people that might join the base via really just a simple kind of a debate tournament at the DNC next month.

Who would you have liked to have seen the Democrats put in there instead?

I don't want any single name to be named. I want anyone who wants to be in the game to join the game. Harris can come in and she might be the greatest president ever. I'm so excited about a woman and a black woman as the president.

It could be great.

But just to just hand it over, I just think it's a tragic lost opportunity to energize. That's the thing. There was other callers and your participants of there's energy behind this, and yes there is. But for someone like me who just would say, come on, let's make it an open playing field for other candidates, whoever they may be. I don't have other I would love for them to get up in front of me at the DC night after night after night and debate each other and allow me to make up my mind. Don't hand me, don't spoon feed me the next Democratic presidential candidate.

Yeah, thank you very much, Tom, thank you, uh and Yvette.

There were people, there were high up Democrats who wanted Biden to get out of the race, people like James Carville who were suggesting exactly what Tom is saying there that there should be you know, debates and town halls and a real contest and it would just captivate the nation.

That is scary. I would not have wanted that. This is a democracy, it's not a WWE. And the challenge with that is we would have had real challenges from the Republican Party about how the money could be used, which they're still challenging the constitutionality of that. These people have to be vetted. She's been in the White House for four years. She's been watching every move that Biden's been making. We know she knows what she's doing. Because of that, I think it's tough to then say we're gonna have these debates and whoever shows up the best, we're just gonna That's really not how politics works. She is their apparent. She was chosen by him to be her vice president if for some reason he could not serve after he was re elected, she would have been the one makes sense, and to jump over the vice president would have created a lot of drama that our party would not have been able to recover fromm WWE.

But yeah, well, Philip, you were at the RNC and or American Idol.

Sorry.

I think your caller, though, does make a point that is aggravating to Democrats.

But the only reason I think that got smothered out is because Donald Trump was on the other side.

If Donald Trump wasn't the opponent here, I think that that line of thinking within the Democratic Party, that all these party bosses, the Nancy Pelosis, the George Clooney's, the donors, the Barack Obamas, they're sort of meddling and moving things behind the scenes, I think would have become more prominent. However, I do believe President Trump has changed not just Republican politics. I saw first row at the RNC. He's absolutely revolutionizing change the Republican Party. He's also though, changed the Democratic Party. One quick thing this week on an IPSOS poll that came out, it showed the post assassination the President Trump did see his favorable ratings bump up about forty percent, right after almost being killed by that young man. What's interesting, though, Jeremy, is that fifty one percent of the country still has an unfavorable view of the president.

Now.

When Ronald Reagan got shot in nineteen eighty one, his aproof of ratings went through the roof. Tell me another time in our American history where a former president or a current president is shot at and fifty one percent of the country still doesn't like the guy.

Something has changed here with Donald Trump.

And I think the reason why you didn't have that big, giant debate on the Democratic side is because most Democrats were so petrified if Trump returning to office, they wanted to simply rush through this process and get someone in there, and Harris was the heir apparent.

Just naturally.

Let's go to a voter who is in a state that the Trump campaign before this switch, was starting to think was more of a swing state, and that would be Virginia. We've got Lisa, who's in Virginia Beach. Lisa, what do you think?

Hi, thank you for having me, and I'm really wow.

I am an independent by history. I've voted for both all kinds of candidates and those in between, but I am I have to tell you. What's happening with Vice President Harris is more of a movement that I see, and I think it definitely took. And I'm proud of the Democrats because they're normally reactionary as versus being proactive about things. And I think even though this was a reactionary decision by President Biden, I think he didn't want to step down as we all know, but it was necessary. There's and as you can see, the momentum is not only on her side, but it is a movement. And I've had my concerns about President Obama's electibility, and I certainly have those concerns about VP Harris. Now it's a President Obama. When he when he ran, I had very real issues about his electability, and then by the same token, I have those same kind of issues about Vice President Harris. The difference is I do see more of a momentum happening, particularly amongst women, that is contagious.

And I think it really moves the needle. I think we as women are are charged, and we are passionate, and we're tired of sitting on the sidelines and see her as an opportunity here and so as a woman, that's just how.

Ill let me have money?

Let me take that to me, that Simpson, if I could, if a movement, says Lisa, it is a movement.

She's got the money, she's hopefully got the message, the manpower, women power, and the movement. It is a movement, and I think it's the movement that our party needed. You know, we have been talking a long time about you know, do we really want to switch shift the generation of the party?

Right?

Is this a generational shift the party? Or are we going to continue to do the same old thing? And I think I think this movement shows that we can and we should. And I love her reflection about Biden because I had to tell people that this week when they say she can't win, people said that about Biden. Biden about Barack Obama too, and so then they were wrong because Barack Obama got elected twice and it's probably one of those popular presidents in the history of our presidency. I think this is a different time. I think women after the abortion rights Issue Project twenty twenty five are coming out. Trump has shown his whole face, he has shown on his whole rear end, and people want somebody that can take him to task. And I think the movement is growing, and I think we're going to see that big pie of the Democratic Party that doesn't always show up really start to show up. And when we show up, we win.

Philip, what are you hearing, by the way, about how the Trump campaign feels about this, how Trump feels about it. There's been reporting that, you know that they're kind of upset that they picked jd vance now because it's not so good in this matchup as it might have been against Biden.

Well, I can bring a bit of news for you here, Jeremy. The Trump campaign, in the course of this program alone, President former President Trump has announced that he's pulling out of the debates. He is saying essentially that he that he feels like, hey, they're not really sure who the nominee is gonna be, So for now, I'm just gonna step back and see.

And maybe we'll reorganize this later.

Look, they weren't prepared for Kamala Harris as they were prepared for Joe Biden. I do think that you know your callers are right though, there is a hesitancy about the vice president because look, I'm not worried about African American women. I'm not worried about Asian American women. I'm not worried about women of color in general. Right, Like one of my sources said to me, they're casting this cycle as it's gonna be either gonna be with the aka's or the kkks, Right. But the question I think is going to come down to the white women, suburban white women in particular, is look, we saw in twenty sixteen, fifty three percent of white women voted for Donald Trump. So when we say, oh, this is gonna be a woman's issue, woman, it could be very energized. What women are we talking about here. My sister's in Atlanta, Georgia, my sister's in Detroit. Absolutely, I think there's gonna be some energy there in the suburbs. I'm not so particularly sure of.

Where.

Was a focus group on MSNBC with a number of white females of Trump supporters and right of center voters, and they said, legitimately, they are afraid of Kamala Harris because she has so many people of color and.

Young people behind her. So this may not go right now. We're in the middle of the Harris honeymoon.

I'm waiting to see how this dies down in the next few weeks and what the basement and the ceiling for Harris will be.

Let's go to Nancy, who is in Chicago. Nancy, go ahead, welcome to the middle, Hey.

White suburban woman, senior citizen.

We are all in.

We are all in for Kamala. We have a Democrat group that started meeting after Trump was elected, and we had twice as many people there yesterday, most of them women, and the excitement in the room, it was so exciting. And this is my happy thought. The thought of a smart, hip black Asian woman defeating this man that bragged about grabbing women. You know, that is joy. The thought of Kamala beating Trump give me joy. And I think she's the right person. I agree that the I feel the Dems did the right thing because we don't have time to debate with a bunch of people. We got to get on the road. We got to get the show on the road. And that's exactly what Kamala is doing. And I can't wait till she is Madam President.

Well, Nancy, thank you.

And what brings me joy is that you didn't complete the thought of what Trump said about grabbing women.

By the blank on a live radio program.

So I really appreciate you say, yeah, absolutely, Why don't we go to Todd, who's in Houston.

Todd, welcome to the Middle, Go.

Ahead, Hey, great to be here, first time listening to your show.

I like it.

I think there's you know, I think we tried this in twenty sixteen. We all want a woman to be president, but it's the way this nomination is happening. I feel like it's being done. I feel like it's Honestly, in twenty sixteen, I felt like the DNC under Wesserman Schultz kind of rigged it a little bit in Hillary's favor, Clinton's favor over Sanders as far as scheduling the debates on Saturdays where there's low viewership and some crazy made up scandal in Nevada during that primary about Sanders and something about you know, speaking in Spanish or something. I just feel like this is an anointment of Vice President Harris. I feel like she needs to go through the convention process. And if there's other people, if there's Tim Ryan in Ohio, who I think would be a great VP for her if she gets the nomination. But I just feel like it's too much behind the scenes for the Democratic Party, which is supposed to be you know, from the people, or sister lies up from the people to choose our nominees, and it's just kind of like that, you know, the smoke filled rooms, the back rooms, you know, the power bookers, the super delegates, the celebrities.

You know, Yeah, Todd, we've got it. I think that's a that's a great point.

I'm glad you. I'm glad you brought it up. And Yvette, what do you think about that? That's not the first call that said that on this program. What do you think about Democrats who are worried about that?

I think I think, first of all, we've been through all the primaries. I think if we were talking about people who still had the chance to vote, I think that would be a different thing. Kamala was on every ballot, whether she was in the first and the second position, I think would have felt more like an anointment, anointing, anointing someone if they replaced her, she was already in line, she had already been on the ballot, she had been in she's been in the White House for the last four years. My fear was that the powers that be were going to come into a room and say it should be somebody who's not the vice president. Typically in our country, the vice president is the next person. So I prefer that she was ready, that she moved. And as somebody who's been a delegate on the DNS to the DNC super delegate more than once, you know, I hate those rooms. It would have been complete chaos and we would have been that much closer to the first ballots being cast. So I actually think the fact that they were able to say she's the heir apparent, she was on the ballot with Biden, She's been in the White House for four years, she's the next natural choice makes sense. To replace her would have probably looked like the Democrats were saying, she's too black, she's to female, she's too Asian, and we don't think she should win. She can win that electability argument. So somebody had to make a decision because of the timing, and I think that decision was probably the right one. The fact that she's been able to coalesce donors and get all of her votes in line verbally shows that she is the person that could get it done. And you got to bet these people, which takes a long long time. As well.

Let me just get one more call in here. I know all the lines are full, and thanks for everybody who called in. You can leave a message if you don't get through. But Terry is in Saint Louis. Terry, just briefly tell us what you think.

I was really struggling.

I do not like Trump.

I voted against him in the past election, and I would have been voting against him in this current election, but well as Kamala Harris, I just feel energized, very very similar to the way I fell with Baracoba. And I just I'm so proud of Joe Biden for stepping aside. I think that says he has the country's interest in his best a country's best interest in his heart.

I think that.

It maybe took a little bit, but this is not an easy position to step to help from. But the way he's embraced his vice president, it's just yeah, I feel energized again, and I'm and I'm ready. I truly feel like when Barack was there.

Yeah, yeah, Terry, thank you very much for that. And I am going to have to say goodbye to our wonderful guest. But Philip Bailey, just in a few seconds, We've had an assassination attempt, We've had a candidate dropout.

Do you think it gets any crazier than this between now and the election?

Look, this is the West Wing come to life. I mean, these things from couldn't write in fiction and believe so. I would implore all Americans to keep it calm, keep it cool. But something else unprecedent has been an abused word in this campaign, more unprecedent moments are coming.

That's Philip Bailey, chief political correspondent for USA Today, and Hevet Simpson, former executive director of Democracy for America and current host of the Power of Why podcast.

Thanks so much to both of you.

Thanks for having us.

Jeremy, Thanks Jeremy and Tolliver.

Next week we're going to be talking about healthcare, why it's so expensive, and what you want our next president to do about it.

That's right, and we have an all star lineup. Billionaire entrepreneur and businessman Mark Cuban will be here. He's an owner of the Dallas Mavericks and appears on Shark Tank, but he also owns a low cost online pharmacy. Also joining US former Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Saveelias, who helped launch Obamacare.

It's going to be a great show, and of course we're taking your calls at eight four to for Middle. The Middle is brought to you by Longnook Media, distributed by Illinois Public Media and or Banat Illinois and produced by Joanne Jennings, Harrison Patino, Danny Alexander, and John barth Our. Intern Azonica Deshler or Technical director is Jason Croft. Thanks so much to the four hundred and ten public radio stations around the country making it possible for people to listen to the Middle. I'm Jeremy Hobson and I will talk to you next week.

The Middle with Jeremy Hobson

The Middle with Jeremy Hobson is a national call-in talk show focused on bringing the voices of Amer 
Social links
Follow podcast
Recent clips
Browse 87 clip(s)