L&D has long been focused on behaviour change—but what if that’s the wrong goal? In this episode, Carl Binder challenges conventional wisdom and makes the case for shifting our focus from behaviours to work outputs—the measurable accomplishments that drive business results.

Carl explains why this approach is more effective, how L&D teams can correctly identify and measure accomplishments, and what it takes to implement this thinking at scale. He also shares practical strategies for redesigning onboarding, leveraging non-training interventions, and aligning managers to focus on performance outcomes rather than just competency models.

For L&D professionals looking to elevate their impact, this conversation offers a roadmap to making learning more business-critical, measurable, and effective.

Take your L&D to the next level

Take advantage of thousands of hours of analysis. Hundreds of conversations with industry innovators and 25+ years of hands-on global L&D leadership.

It's all distilled into one framework to help you level up L&D. Access the L&D Maturity Model here - https://360learning.com/maturity-model

KEY TAKEAWAYS
When you focus on results, L&D delivers.
There is no incompatibility with focusing on work outputs and changing behaviours, one leads to the other.
Competency models are too subjective.
The relationship between organizational results, outputs and behaviour is dynamic.
When managers focus on what needs to be produced, providing feedback to change behaviours is easier.
Each individual should have a performance map.
Ask yourself if this training were successful what is it that I expect the participants to be able to produce? Stop asking what skills they will learn. This simple change in language is powerful.
Fully map your processes.
Use the Six Boxes® model.

BEST MOMENTS

“Figure out the purpose before you define the behaviour.”

“Don´t just spray and pray.”

“Behaviour might change but accomplishments are typically more stable.”

“There is a “the emperor has no clothes” problem here.”

Carl Binder Bio

Carl Binder is a leading expert in performance improvement and the founder of The Performance Thinking Network. With a background in behavioural psychology and decades of experience in organisational learning, he has helped businesses worldwide shift their focus from behaviour change to measurable work accomplishments. Originally a student of B.F. Skinner, Carl has applied behavioural science to real-world business challenges, developing practical frameworks for performance mapping, onboarding, and enterprise-wide capability building. His work empowers L&D and business leaders to drive tangible results by focusing on what truly matters—performance outcomes.

https://www.linkedin.com/in/drcarlbinder/

http://www.performancethinking.com/

YouTube Channel (“Performance Improvement Insights”): www.PerformanceThinking.tv

Study Guides for YouTube webinars: https://bit.ly/CarlStudyGuides 

- Fluency Based instruction research and applications: www.Fluency.org

- Performance Consulting certification program (“Performance Thinking® Practitioner Program):  https://www.sixboxes.com/Virtual-Practitioner-Program.html

CONTACT DAVID
L&D Master Class Series: https://360learning.com/blog/l-and-d-masterclass-home
https://twitter.com/davidinlearning
https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidjameslinkedin
https://360learning.com/the-l-and-d-collective

This Podcast has been brought to you by Disruptive Media. https://disruptivemedia.co.uk/

L&amp;D has long been focused on behaviour change&mdash;but what if that&rsquo;s the wrong goal? In this episode, Carl Binder challenges conventional wisdom and makes the case for shifting our focus from behaviours to&nbsp;work outputs&mdash;the measurable accomplishments that drive business results.
Carl explains why this approach is more effective, how L&amp;D teams can correctly identify and measure accomplishments, and what it takes to implement this thinking at scale. He also shares practical strategies for redesigning onboarding, leveraging non-training interventions, and aligning managers to focus on performance outcomes rather than just competency models.
For L&amp;D professionals looking to elevate their impact, this conversation offers a roadmap to making learning more business-critical, measurable, and effective.
Take your L&amp;D to the next level
Take advantage of thousands of hours of analysis. Hundreds of conversations with industry innovators and 25+ years of hands-on global L&amp;D leadership.
It's all distilled into one framework to help you level up L&amp;D. Access the L&amp;D Maturity Model here - <a href="https://360learning.com/maturity-model">https://360learning.com/maturity-model</a>
KEY TAKEAWAYS
<ul>
<li aria-level="1">When you focus on results, L&amp;D delivers.</li>
<li aria-level="1">There is no incompatibility with focusing on work outputs and changing behaviours, one leads to the other.</li>
<li aria-level="1">Competency models are too subjective.</li>
<li aria-level="1">The relationship between organizational results, outputs and behaviour is dynamic.</li>
<li aria-level="1">When managers focus on what needs to be produced, providing feedback to change behaviours is easier.</li>
<li aria-level="1">Each individual should have a performance map.</li>
<li aria-level="1">Ask yourself if this training were successful what is it that I expect the participants to be able to produce? Stop asking what skills they will learn. This simple change in language is powerful.</li>
<li aria-level="1">Fully map your processes.</li>
<li aria-level="1">Use the Six Boxes&reg; model.</li>
</ul>
BEST MOMENTS
&ldquo;Figure out the purpose before you define the behaviour.&rdquo;
&ldquo;Don&acute;t just spray and pray.&rdquo;
&ldquo;Behaviour might change but accomplishments are typically more stable.&rdquo;
&ldquo;There is a &ldquo;the emperor has no clothes&rdquo; problem here.&rdquo;
Carl Binder Bio
Carl Binder is a leading expert in performance improvement and the founder of The Performance Thinking Network. With a background in behavioural psychology and decades of experience in organisational learning, he has helped businesses worldwide shift their focus from behaviour change to measurable work accomplishments. Originally a student of B.F. Skinner, Carl has applied behavioural science to real-world business challenges, developing practical frameworks for performance mapping, onboarding, and enterprise-wide capability building. His work empowers L&amp;D and business leaders to drive tangible results by focusing on what truly matters&mdash;performance outcomes.
<a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/drcarlbinder/">https://www.linkedin.com/in/drcarlbinder/</a>
<a href="http://www.performancethinking.com/">http://www.performancethinking.com/</a>
YouTube Channel (&ldquo;Performance Improvement Insights&rdquo;): <a href="http://www.performancethinking.tv/">www.PerformanceThinking.tv</a>
Study Guides for YouTube webinars: <a href="https://bit.ly/CarlStudyGuides">https://bit.ly/CarlStudyGuides</a>&nbsp;
- Fluency Based instruction research and applications: <a href="http://www.fluency.org/">www.Fluency.org</a>
- Performance Consulting certification program (&ldquo;Performance Thinking&reg; Practitioner Program):&nbsp; <a href="https://www.sixboxes.com/Virtual-Practitioner-Program.html">https://www.sixboxes.com/Virtual-Practitioner-Program.html</a>
CONTACT DAVID
<ul>
<li aria-level="1">L&amp;D Master Class Series: <a href="https://360learning.com/blog/l-and-d-masterclass-home">https://360learning.com/blog/l-and-d-masterclass-home</a></li>
<li aria-level="1"><a href="https://twitter.com/davidinlearning">https://twitter.com/davidinlearning</a></li>
<li aria-level="1"><a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidjameslinkedin">https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidjameslinkedin</a></li>
<li aria-level="1"><a href="https://360learning.com/the-l-and-d-collective">https://360learning.com/the-l-and-d-collective</a></li>
</ul>
This Podcast has been brought to you by Disruptive Media. <a href="https://disruptivemedia.co.uk/">https://disruptivemedia.co.uk/</a>

The Learning & Development Podcast is a fortnightly topical podcast show for L&D professionals hosted by David James and presented by 360Learning.

In each episode David James discusses and debates topics affecting the profession alongside expert guests.  David is the Chief Learning Officer at 360Learning and a highly respected voice in the Learning & Development industry. With a focus on harnessing technology to drive impactful learning strategies, David is recognised as one of the top 10 global influencers in the L&D space. His expertise lies in helping organisations modernise their approach to workplace learning, ensuring measurable results and business alignment.

The Learning & Development Podcast has amassed over 500,000 downloads and ranks in the top 1% of podcasts globally. With nearly 30,000 LinkedIn followers, David continues to shape the conversation around L&D innovation and best practices, drawing on his deep experience, including his time as Director of Learning, Talent & Organisational Development at The Walt Disney Company.

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidjameslinkedin/ Website: https://www.360learning.com/

The Learning &amp; Development Podcast is a fortnightly topical podcast show for L&amp;D professionals hosted by David James and presented by <a href="https://360learning.com/">360Learning</a>.
In each episode David James discusses and debates topics affecting the profession alongside expert guests.&nbsp; David is the Chief Learning Officer at 360Learning and a highly respected voice in the Learning &amp; Development industry. With a focus on harnessing technology to drive impactful learning strategies, David is recognised as one of the top 10 global influencers in the L&amp;D space. His expertise lies in helping organisations modernise their approach to workplace learning, ensuring measurable results and business alignment.
The Learning &amp; Development Podcast has amassed over 500,000 downloads and ranks in the top 1% of podcasts globally. With nearly 30,000 LinkedIn followers, David continues to shape the conversation around L&amp;D innovation and best practices, drawing on his deep experience, including his time as Director of Learning, Talent &amp; Organisational Development at The Walt Disney Company.
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidjameslinkedin/ Website: https://www.360learning.com/

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