The Herd with Colin CowherdGreg Cosell from NFL Films joins the show to breakdown rookie CJ Stroud's impressive start to the season
Colin gives his NFL QB tier list
Thanks for listening to The Herd podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday on Fox Sports Radio in noon to three Eastern nine am to noon Pacific. Find your local station for The Herd at Fox Sports Radio dot com, or stream us live every day on the iHeartRadio app by searching Fox Sports Radio or FSR.
You're listening to Fox Sports Radio.
Here we go live in Las Angelus. It's The Herd wherever you may be and however you may be listening. Thanks for making us part of your day. Greg cosall in a couple of minutes, Jmac, what's up Bears tonight?
I'm actually excited for this game?
You are? You're the one? So uh now you.
Stealing my lines? And I'm when I said that was hey, by the way, on.
My podcast, I said it. I have some money on Bears money line tonight just for fun, well action.
Play well, I mean skin in the game.
When you play a very very big, physical team like Philadelphia and your Washington and you go to overtime a little extra football, you generally on a Thursday are a little worn down. Don't be shocked if Washington doesn't have legs late in the second half when you play San Francisco physical, Dallas physical. You know you teams. I often look at teams after they played San Francisco or Dallas or Philadelphia, teams that beat you up a little bit short week, especially not the same football team.
One note on the Bears. They have three guys in their secondary that look like they're going to start. They were on practice squads earlier this season around the league.
That's how bleak and beat up. Their secondary is not great.
Sam Howell could go off. I picked them up in fantasy football.
Oh you did, starting.
Him in my bad league?
Yeah right, all right, let's best not waste any time here. Greg Cosel forty four years NFL film, you bet football, fantasy football. I just want to learn more and get smarter at football, Greg Cosel. So there was an exhale by Bears fans. It's like, ah, justin fields. He looks competent, especially like that play when he kind of scrambled near the red zone. Waited waited, waited, waited, waited, and I think he got Cole Comet or somebody in the end zone for a touchdown. And I thought, well, that's what I caught, That's what I thought he would be as a pro, he'd buy time. So now they also played Denver and their defense has been a Swiss cheese. It's been horrid, inexplicably, I think. So, you tell me when you watch the tape, was it justin fields, was it the Denver defense? What did it say?
Well, you know, when I watched tape of a quarterback in an offense, Colin, I try to see what they're trying to get done, you know, because often what they try to do tells you what they think of the quarterback and how they think he can execute best. And what they did a lot in this game, which by the way, they did more of at the end of last season and not very much in the first three games this year was us a lot of boot play action boot get him out of the pocket. He's clearly comfortable doing that. Yeah, And that defines the reads. It cuts the field in half. They did a really nice job with backside crossers, so it's clean, the looks are clean, he can get rid of the football comfortably. They did that quite a bit. The other thing they did is they played a lot of base personnel, what we call twenty one personnel. They played with a fullback twelve personnel, two tight ends, and what often happens with that is you get base defense, meaning four defensive backs, and teams in their base defense are much more predictable from a tendency standpoint than they are when they're playing their nickel or sub any form of sub defense. So it really cleans up a lot of things for the quarterback based on film study. So I think the coaching staff in that particular game did a really nice job helping.
Fields a team in his division leading It is the Lions right now. It's interesting last couple of years. We've liked the offense, but the defense they have to win by track meet. I just look the other day at some of their PFF grades and their data, and I'm like, other defense, they've cleaned it up. I think they've drafted particularly well. I think the front office, the executive suite deserves a lot of credit for what they've done here. They've hit some home runs. What does the tape say on the Lions?
Yeah, I agree with what you just said, though you're one hundred percent right. But I love what Aaron Glenn is doing. You know, he's been there now. He started out he wanted to play a lot of man. He wanted a pressure of the quarterback. He wanted to be aggressive. Players love that, but it wasn't working. And I think over this offseason he probably did a lot of self scouting, probably talk to people. You know, he's obviously a former number one pick. He's been around the league a long time. And you're seeing a totally different Lions defense this year. Quite frankly, they're playing a lot more zone coverage, a lot more Cover three. They've got some really good players, though, Brian Branch I love getting out of Alabama, and I think he should have been a first round pick. He was a second round pick simply because he didn't test really well. But he's a really good slot corner. But just the evolution of Aaron Glenn and how he's structuring his defense has really been fun to watch. And this defense now they move people around. They have Aiden Hutchinson often being kind of a joker, standing up, moving around. They're using the rookie linebacker from Iowa, Jack Campbell, six ' five, two fifty. They're using him the same way. Now he's a rusher off the edge, he's standing up as a joker moving around. There's a lot of moving parts now but a lot less man coverage and a lot more zone coverage.
I want to break down Buffalo Miami, not just the game, but what it means going forward. So I surmise my takeaway on Josh Allen against the Dolphins is he's owned them for one reason. They don't have the personnel to stop him in the red zone. He's just too good of a player. You can slow him down, but Miami doesn't. They have their money on the offensive side, mostly Ramsey's not playing yet. So I mean when I watch Miami Buffalo, I always get the same thing. He's just better than everybody they have. I don't think Miami can stay now. I think there's ways to stop him. Kind of But what did you make of his performance?
Well, you know, I think going forward, I think that's the way to look at this. You know, we know that he's handled Miami. I mean, his record against Miami is phenomenal, his touchdowns phenomenal, all that. But I think as we look at Josh Allen in this offense going forward, what have they been doing and what will they continue to try to do. They're going to continue to try to run the ball. They didn't run it really well against Miami. But it's evident Colin, and I think you would agree that they're trying to run the ball with more frequency, yes, than in previous yeares. The other thing that really stands out to me is I think they're trying, and this may not be the right word, but I think they're trying to rain Josh Allen in a little with how they're playing offensively, because early in games, what you're seeing a lot more of quick rhythm throws, crows, get him comfortable, take the seven yard play, make it second in three, allow him to feel good, get comfortable, so you have fewer Superman Josh Allen plays because even though he can make those plays, you and I both know you just can't live on those plays every single week, and you can't ask your quarterback every week to put on the cape. You want him to play within the structure of the offense.
Okay, Miami's offense was slowed down a little by New England in the second half and slowed down by Buffalo completely in the second half. You know, so this fireworks show wet blanket on it. What did that tell you? What'd the film say?
Yeah?
I think what the film says is that Buffalo did not really have to change much about the way they play in order to play against Miami, because when you play Miami, you want to play with split safeties. You want to be able to take away a lot of to his initial reads, which they did a great job with with Milano and Bernard, who's becoming a really good player. You want to be able to do that, but you want to stay in split safety and you want to be able to rush the quarterback with four. So Buffalo did not really have to change a lot of what they do in order to play against Miami. They've had a few tweaks that were specific to take away some things. They had a great field, don't forget it's a division game college, so they had a great feel for the splits, the routes that come from the splits. But the good thing you know when you play is you don't want to have to really restructure your defense. You can't do that in three days. Buffalo didn't have to do that. They just had to make a few minor tweaks because this is the way they play. And of course number ninety two Dayquon Jones out of Penn State, ten year pro. He probably had the best game of his career as a.
Pass rusher Rams Colts is fascinating. I want to talk to Anthony Richardson. He is fun to watch, power thrower. I mean, look, I mean he is just a power athlete, and I think Shane Steiken's a brilliant offensive coach. So if you're a Colts fan or not, and a lot of fans we know the NFL can be kind of regionalized in terms of not not Sunday Night football maybe or Monday Night, but a lot of it's regionalized. So you may not be watching Colts game Anthony Richardson, even his mistakes, it's hard to take your eyes off and what are you right? What does the film say?
I think at this point in time, you're going to have to live with him being up and down, but the ups could be unbelievable. And the thing is, when you're a defense, you never know when one of those special plays are going to be made, either throwing the ball or running with the ball. I mean, he made a throw to Downs which we just looked at down the scene this week, which was a wow throw. You know, I called in all my guys on the Matchup show here and said you got to take a look at this throw. I mean, you know, he makes those kinds of plays and it can happen anytime now. He's also going to miss a few, and he's certainly he needs to develop a lot more touch and pace on routine throws. He needs to develop, you know, greater sense of nuance and detail about the position as a whole. But he's kind of settling in. You can see he plays with poison composure. It's not too big for him. He's not playing fast. He just has some things that need to get worked out. Don't forget he has not played a lot of football as a starting quarterback.
I said earlier this week to Jay Mac, I didn't know if he watched it. I said, Stafford made a couple throws against the Colts, and I'm not sure any maybe Herbert, maybe Mahomes. They were unbelievable, little tiny windows. What did you see? What do you see with Stafford? He got banged up, but what do you see with him?
I love watching their offense, Colin. I mean it's it's really tactical. And Stafford, as you say, and you're correct, is a great thrower. I mean it's reduced splits it's bunch, it's stacks. It's now a lot of motion. They're doing a great job with motion. And the whole point. One whole point of motion is free access off the ball. When you have one hundred and fifty pounds receiver and two two at well, you need to get him free access so we can get into his routes with speed. But Stafford is making tight window throws. He's making anticipation throws. I'm telling you, Colin, if you were sitting with me while I was watching tape, and as Stafford started certain throws, you know, as you see his arm and I froze it with my remote clicker, and I said to you, who's he's throwing the ball to? You turned to me and say, I don't know, because his anticipation is so good sometimes. So their offense is kind of fun to watch. I'm really looking forward to this matchup because I thought their O line held up well last week. Now, they didn't play the Eagles D line, obviously, but the Eagles D line also did not have a great game against the Commander's O line, so we'll see how that plays out. But their O line held up pretty well last week.
As you know, Greg Cosel forty four years doing this, so good to watch on TV as well as listening on radio, but TV you get even more contextualization. So let's talk the Rams go to LA. It'll be kind of semi home game. Jalen Hurts and the offense looked better. So listen. When you win, you win, a lot of things work. Hey, yeah, but the key is the schedule is gonna Steffen, here, did you see things with Philly and Hurts that you said, okay, check they checked that box? Okay, Then now they've checked that box. What did what did the film say?
Yeah? I thought Hurts was more decisive in this game because the week prior, I thought against Tampa he played one of his worst games even going back to last year. But you know, they were very good teams, so they still win. But I thought this past week he was much more decisive. And again we saw what he did a year ago, which was be very very accurate on the deep balls as you're seeing right now. I mean he can He's become a very good deep ball thrower. And they saw a matchup last week that they loved the rookie corner. Emmanuel Forbes from Mississippi state was the boundary corner. He only plays in the nickel, but he's the corner, so you know where he is. And they put aj Brown out there and they caught Fords a couple of times for big plays, including a touchdown, and so they knew what they wanted to do. They knew what they had and Hurtz was delivering the football. But overall he played a much better game last week.
Listen, I think when you have an offensive coach, my rule is, if I was a general manager, get them weapons. They will be able to use that weapon better than a defensive coach or a defensive culture. So when the Niners and Kyle shanahan went and got Christian McCaffrey, people push back on the draft picks, and my thing is, you just got Picasso, the best paint on the market. Get him in the room. He'll make him great. Well, now it looks like almost a steal. He's an MVP candidate. What does he do that makes it so effective?
Well, I mean again, you're talking about a great player, you know. So he's a very let's put it this way. I'm not sure people think of him this way. He is a very physical inside runner. I mean when you watch him. We know he's got the speed, we know he can get through the line of scrimmage with burst. We know all that, but he's also a phenomenal seven and eight yard runner. And to me, in the NFL, you have to be able to get hard yards. You have to be able to work in confined space. And also their run game is so multiple and so diverse with how they block basic concepts, zone concepts, gap scheme concept the way they get to those runs and how they block him is often different from other teams. And of course you have to talk about Purty. You know, we know about Shanahan. We know that it's a really well defined passing game that presents clean reads and throws. But you know, when you're completing passes the way Purty is, you're executing the passing game at a high level. He is a mentally aware quarterback. He sees it. He plays with instructure exceedingly well. I mean, they do a lot of really really good things to present clean reads, but you still have to execute it. I mean, you don't see twenty for twenty one very often in the NFL.
No, you don't. So one of the stories that c. J. Stroud's comp was Jared Goff, and I had said, I think Goff's always been underrated, So I'm good, great, and I think the comp of Jared Goff with a little more mobility, that's a hell of a player. And so now did I think C. J. Stroud would be this alert and productive and confident this early? Absolutely not. What does the film say?
Yeah, he's been a fun watch, Colin, I'm telling you, I mean, this kid he sees it. You know, a lot of people weren't sure about that because obviously at Ohio State he didn't work in very many money pockets. Everything was so clean, you know, and a lot of people just said, oh, he's just a typical Ohio State quarterback. They're great there, but it's too easy. But he sees it. Well, Boy does he have a compact delivery and the ball comes out. He continues to show the ability to throw with pace and touch, and perhaps most importantly, his ball placement is so precise. I mean, he's the kind of kid that could roll out of bed and he can throw it, you know, so accurately, and that cannot be overlooked because that's a natural trait with him. He doesn't have to work at that. He's just a naturally precise ball location thrower, and therefore he can do that even when there are people around him, even when it doesn't look clean, he can make really good throws. But I think the thing that may be surprised a lot of people given what he did at Ohio State, is he's seeing things very cleanly in the NFL. And then that's also obviously really important. You know, obviously we always use the word processing, but I mean that's all part of it. He sees it cleanly.
Yeah, let's go to the play of the week with him and Nico Collins, who had a big Sunday against the Stash.
Yeah, let's go to that play right now, because it's a good transition for what we were just talking about. This was the touchdown late in the game to Nico Collins, And I want to look at this from just the perspective of the quarterback, because that's you know, people get caught up in coverage and the whole deal. But here Stroud, he's in the shotgun. Okay, Now, what he wants to do here is he'd like to hit Nico Collins, who's his boundary ex receiver on the deep corner out. That's what he'd like to do. So right now, what's he looking at. He's kind of seeing his split safety log, but it could be a little muddy. You're just not sure how that's going to play out when the ball snapped. But when the ball snapped, the safety to the side of Collins turns his body inside. Now at this point, he doesn't care about the coverage. He knows that safety is not a factor at all in the corner out by Collins. It doesn't matter, man, it doesn't matter. He's now got Collins with a corner on him, running a corner out and there's no safety to help. So he's throwing it to Collins, and it's a beautiful throw. You're gonna see it again from this hang on and you can just see beautiful, beautiful throw this is. And he's just a naturally accurate thrower. So it's hard not to be impressed when you put on the tape and watch Stroud through four games of his NFL career.
Greg co selazowas on Thursdays, our NFL meat sandwich, my friend. Good talking again. We'll see in a.
Week, all right, thanks can appreciate it.
I was thinking about this the other day, Like if you just said what does this quarterback do and you said, he sees the field and he delivers the ball accurately and nothing else. He's not fast, he's not big, he's not strong. Like you can really boil most complex jobs, and being a quarterback's a complex job. Justin fields does not see the field particularly well at this point. Neither does Zach Wilson, and their accuracy is hit and miss. C. J. Stroud you can see the way he looked in his head. He sees the field, So that's a gift. He sees the field and he just delivers it accurately. That was Brady. Brady didn't move, Braddy didn't have a gun. Brady saw the field really well and then delivered it. And Brady worked on his mechanics. So anything that sounds complex, like you know, Elon Musk buys Twitter, you know, like in the end, it's like there's too much bigotry and vile, toxic stuff. Get rid of that as they do. Advertisers come back. It's a big company, but they're simple themes, trends and habits. You want to deliver right to have a good company, just literally if you can see the field, forget about all the physical stuff, and deliver the ball accurate because most throws are eighteen to twenty yards an inn. It's that and that's what this with kid does. As Greg points out, he sees the field. That's hard to choose the year three, but God, that ball comes out. It's right there, Zach Wilson. It's not justin fields. It's not they're bigger, they got better arms. It's like I remember having this conversation maybe I was a round guys talking about it. Troy Aitk been talking about accuracy, and he's like everybody wants to talk about everything goes, none of it matters if you can't put the ball right there.
Well, the only pushback would be, okay, you know, Zach Wilson, field, we get it. We've got to sample size that they don't see the field can as well accurate. Mac Jones was a rookie, was accurate, saw the field well, got the team to the playoffs.
This year and four games.
You know what, I don't think Mac Jones sees the field very well.
But we were We would have said that during his rookie year.
Okay, right, But I first of all, C J. Stroud is a bigger quarterback with a better arm and more accurate. He's a bigger athlete, which always he wants somebody a bigger I mean, think about it.
I'm reluctant. I like Stroud more than young coming into this process. I'm just a little reluctant. I know Texans fan thing.
I'm a hater. I'm just it's still too early on trash.
By the way, you want to go watch his debut against the Ravens. He looked totally lost.
It's his rookie debut, the best defense he's faced, right.
And against the Colts it was all comeback stuff and they were trailing big and.
I mean Pittsburgh's defense. Niners shredded it. Houston did not ShredIt it.
Let's be real.
They did not show up. It was a complete no show. Stroud did look good. I'm not taking anything away. It sounds like you're talking to yourself into a Texans play this week against a Falcon.
No, I'm not, by the way, I just I just took that one off my car.
Oh okay, I'm submitting my card right now for headlines, and this game is in it and you can tell it's the way I'm leaning.
Wolf and yes I can Wolf and Shepherd made in what good luck with Atlanta. I'll just tell you his hey, hey, hey, he never lost more money on any sporting team in my life than the Atlanta Falcons. If you want to bet Atlanta, bet the Braves. I've got a great parlay for you this weekend thanks to Draftking Sportsbook. New users use the code heard at r D when you download the app. Let's have some fun. My parlay picks of the week via Draftking sports Book. I'm gonna take the Eagles minus four at the Rams. The crowd will be sixty to forty Eagles anyway, a semi home game. They're undefeated for a reason. I don't know how the Rams offensive front matches up with the Eagles defensive. I'll take the Eagles minus four. I'll take the Jets plus two at Denver. The Broncos last week had some offensive success because they played the Bears, step up in class best defense they faced. Zach Wilson righted the ship a little even though they lost. I'll take the Jets plus two, Cowboys plus three and a half of the Niners. I'll take Dallas listen defensively, opposing quarterbacks have a fifty five passer rating. Niners are better, especially in the red zone, offensively, but the Cowboys have the better quarterback, offensive line, special teams, and a little revenge. I'll take Dallas. If you want to take the Herd parlay. Check out DraftKings Sportsbook. New users use the code AGRD Herd when you download the app.
Twenty one plus in most eligible states, but age varies by jurisdiction. Eligibility restrictions apply. Gambling problem called one eight hundred gambler in New York call eight seven seven eight hope and wire text hope and y four six seven three six y nine. See show notes for full details.
So great to have you in, Colt McCoy, NFL quarterback for a long time, joining us last hour, checking in on Matt All good stuff. J Mack with the news, Turn.
On the news. This is the Herd Line News.
So we touched on this game at the outset this Chiefs Minnesota. Buddy told me stay far far away from this game, but I took the over, Colin.
I just think it's gonna be points on points.
The Chiefs three and one, top of the AFC West, but the offense not really that crisp. They had two hundred yards in the first quarter against the Jets, and then you know, played with their food for the final three quarters and walked away with a victory. The receiving group has taken a lot of the criticism, but Patrick Mahomes, he puts it on himself.
You just have to go out there and keep keep shooting it down the field. I mean, that's that's how I've always been wired. You just come in every single day and work and try to continue to get better. I just haven't played very, very good to start the season, so I think if I started playing better, everybody will start playing better.
I don't think that's it. I think he's taken. He's taken the heat. It's not a very good receiving goal.
I ask a question. I guarantee you no other shows asking this place, all right. Is this Taylor Swift stuff a distraction?
No.
I think their lack of receivers that separate is a distraction. I think the Tyreek Hill because they were able to bring in a Juju Smith Schuster is a couple of kids developed last year delivered. I think in the end, Brett Beach knows we probably it would be great the trading deadline to go get a Chris Godwinner. That's too expensive for their taste right now. But the reason this defense is Chris Jones and they're paying nobody else is they're gonna keep doing this with Mahomes, reworking his contract, finding him new pieces every year. Travis Kelsey's the guy, you know they need a left tackle or a great center. But in the end, this is what they're gonna do, and this is what New England did. They keep renegotiating Tom's deal, get a team friendly deal and having to just find bits and pieces that Tom can work with. Be loyal to very few. Ronk Edelman, You're loyal to Brady, You're loyal to you know, even Logan Mankin's a great old line and they let go. So when you have a star quarterback and he's top of the market, a very expensive you're gonna have to keep tweaking, tweaking, And I think in their tweaks they're a receiver shy.
So you I don't know if you saw that screen, but it just hit me. I looked at look at the screen for the radio audience. Mahomes is having the worst season of his career.
Yeah, by far.
Look at the stats, completion percentage, everything is the worst he's ever had.
Yeah, well, what do we do?
You know, we're sharks out here buying low. You see Patrick Mahomes having bad numbers. Now he's facing a Vikings defense that all they do is blitz. They can't stop anybody. The secondary stinks. All their high draft picks are not playing from the last couple of years. Is this a Mahomes five touchdown game? And afterward everybody's whoa?
Whoa?
Have we've forgotten Patrick Mahomes could be the MVP? And then you look at the schedule. What put my guys? They gotta face the Raiders still twice. I either a Mahomes MVP.
Take Sean Sean Payton showed me a trick. When you're a good team and play like crap and win. Who did last week Philadel in Kansas City? Yeah those teams. The following week, Kausehan Peyton Oas said, I love when my good team plays poorly and wins. I can coach them hard. You can't coach a team as hard when they win and look great because they all think they're great. You can't coach them too hard. When they lose and look like crap because they need to be lifted up. But when they win and look bad, athletes will listen. You're like, guys, come on, you're and shaan Ohas said, when you win and play poorly, a coaching staff can really dial in. Don't be surprised if the Eagles and the Chiefs I'm not saying they will, but this is an opportunity. You're getting the w and playing poorly and he can really go hard this week.
Interesting.
I know that's what Peyton used to tell them.
So you know, if you're a horse and you're expected to win the Belmont Stakes and you fall behind.
Early, which is what my Homes and the Chiefs have done, you know, to.
Races out to that big league. MVP Josh Allen races out to the MVP league. Patrick Mahomes just waiting in the I'm talking about him.
This is this is not an MVP year for him. It's not really.
It's like you say that I all of a sudden, Okay, let me let me jump in. Nobody's talking about Mahomes VP. Look at the schedule, Colin and just look at it.
Well, they played Denver twice, so there he's gonna eat and the Raiders.
They start to play the Raiders twice. Raiders are one of the worst teams of football. Just you know, listen up, folks, all.
Right, next story Two what tongue oiloa awesome? Start this season?
Uh?
They're three and one One.
NFL exec thinks the team should wait until the year is over to have as much information as possible before making a decision on his contract extension. Yes, I'm already putting this at the top of my list as most fascinating off season discussions.
Yeah, what do you do with too as lunch?
By the way, the Cowboys did it with Dak, they waited as long as they could. I think two is a better natural thrower than Dak, but because of his injury and concussion story, you wait as long as you can. Now, Like Brock Purty, if he has another great year, I'd rather sign him early and say not to a huge deal. Say listen, we'll pay a year early, but you got to take a team friendly deal because I think Brock Perty if he beats Dallas this year and we get seventeen eighteen games in with Purty and we're like, yeah, you.
Don't have to pay him. He's still got a couple of times.
Oh, I'm sill.
You got to make a decision soon.
Yes, and I think with two I would wait to the very end. I think he's put on some weight, he's thick, he's practiced falling, He's done everything he can to protect himself.
It's the off season.
What was a jiu jitsu that that's really well, who knows it's McDaniel.
Well he's very good too.
Yeah, he's good, no doubt. If they pay Tua in that fifty range, well, they give him Herbert or contract.
But what's telling you it's over?
Forget it.
You can't keep Jalen Waddle.
You can't keep anybody.
Well, you can probably gonna have to be caught. Well, you can keep one, you know, you can pay a Travis Kelcey or a Tyreek Hill. You get one great way deal.
They're keeping him Kyriek Kills.
They got to watch.
But I'm saying that rookie deal expires here pretty quick. Play a couple of years, right, you can't keep him. Yeah, so that's when you pay the quarterback right now. The Cowboys C. D. Lamb had to let Dalton Schultz go, had to let Mary Cooper go yep. So once you get a weapon, you don't get two and three. So that's that you pay Matt Stafford to get Cooper Cup. If Pooka na Kouwa had not shocked the world, who would they throw to Because you're paying Cooper Cup, you're boy.
Two two out well.
So mean by the way that Herbert they didn't pay him. They could keep Mike Williams and Keenan, but now Mike's hurt again, so they would love to get out of that contract.
On like Penn Quintin Johnson, Well, you know, we hear stuff.
Because we hear stuff, we don't have to report him.
Like Quintin Johnson, I'm rooting for him all that and nothing bad, but just.
You know what I mean, Listen, we don't have to report everything we get immediately.
He's not there yet.
Now he's not there yet, be polite, Yeah, he might.
Be final stories. NBA.
Drew Holliday obviously was shipped out of Milwaukee. Now that is in Boston. Drew Holiday one of the good guys in the NBA, and not that there's not a lot of good guys, just.
A great dude.
He's introduced in Boston and spoke about how he feels to be a part of this organization.
I feel like coming here is definitely my best chance of winning and being able to help the guys here that have made big moves and done great things in this league. So I'm here to really just help step up that game and become a champion. So it has been a whirlwind. The fans are literally insane, and I'm proud to be I'm proud to be a part of that. Coming in this year.
You know, it's really everybody loves Drew Holiday, everybody. And yet he's moved. Is this his third team? May fourth? And so I always think this is under reported by all of us in the media. He's very good. He's either the world's best bench player, your fourth starter on a championship level team, third fourth starter, very good player. He's not as good as Jason Tatum, probably good in.
The Sun's final when they beat the Suns in the finals, he was no better than Middleton.
No, no, no, he's He's a very good player. He's one of.
Everybody loves all NBA.
I think a couple of times, oh, defensively five times, I think, yeah, maybe more so. But my takeaway is he's had to move his family, and I know he makes a lot of money, but that's the one thing about pro sports. He is a great locker room guy. Agree. He does everything you would ask, great in the community, great locker room, great defense, and he keeps bouncing around and I always think to myself, he's probably thinking, what do I got to do to be loved? Like like, he's a very unique player. Like in the NFL, Travis Kelsey is not getting out of Kansas City, but he's not Mahomes like I feel for. This guy is one of these players that is so good. You could put him on every single team in the NBA and the team he would fit with all of them, and I feel like he doesn't quite get the love he deserves.
It's weird the NBA's It's not like the NFL. Guy's changed team.
Every star, almost every star has changed team multiple times. You know, Lebron's been.
Around the block.
That was Lebron's choice.
Okay, even the second tier guys have been around the block, right. I mean, Dwayne Wade played for like the Chicago Bulls at the end, didn't he did he go to the Calves for a minute at ye that he went to Chicago.
That was his choice, and then he regretted it fifteen minutes later and went back to Miami.
Oh so you're saying, like teams just BA.
Drew Holiday literally is And I said this once about Bradley Beal. I've said it about Clay Thompson. There are guy catch and shoot. Guy like Klay Thompson would work with any team in the world. In his prime, he defended, he catches, He doesn't take the ball. He's not a ball hog. He just throw him the ball. He was shooting and hit. I think Drew Holliday literally is one of the few players in the NBA. Literally you could put him with a champion. You could put him with Denver Tomorrow, they're better. You can go with the Boston Boston's already got two stars. You put Drew with him. It's like, oh yeah, he's a perfect fit. That guy is a perfect fit in every room in the NBA.
Doesn't it go back to the statement everybody's replaceable everybody, Well, that's not true.
Lebron was not replaceable in his prime. Mahomes is not replaceable. Justin her is holding the franchise up. He's not replaceable. There are very few of those guys. But Josh Allen is not replaceable. There's no other Lamar Jackson on the planet. Pay him, damn it. I hate to believe you're right some people, you know, you can learn a lot just listening to me.
Well, you know what I was thinking. I'm selfish, I'm a replaceable show.
Get very close. You're my Gabe Davis. Just a couple more guys show.
I told somebody in the elevator today, I was the Christian McCaffrey of the show.
You're the shad ahead.
I'm Chris c mac But let's let's not talk about us.
Okay, find us.
Let's j Mack with a new Well, that's the news. Jave Davis is off to a hearty start. What do you mean now, you're not going to sleep tonight. I'm gonna get four texts of that.
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays and noon Easter not a em Pacific.
Hey, this is Tom Berducci from Fox Sports, MLB Network and Sports Illustrated.
And I'm Joe Madden, and we're going to be around to talk a little bit about managerial decisions and what may have occurred to that Doug got maybe in the nineteen eighties.
It's the Book of Joe podcasts.
I can't wait for this, Joe.
We're going to dive into what goes on in the dugout and behind the scenes in Major.
League Baseball, cars, wind, whatever else we want to talk about.
Yeah, well, there are no boundaries, right. Listen to the Book of Joe podcast on the iHeartRadio app, on Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Start Saturday Strong with Big Noon Saturday on Fox. Quarterback Kyle McCord and Marvin Erison Junior laid the undefeated Buckeyes against Tuat Doungabado and the Terrapins, and all starts at ten am Eastern with Big New Kickoff Live from Columbus. Then it's Maryland, Ohio State Saturday at noon Eastern on Fox.
This fall, busy routines, house more vulnerable. Go to simply Savecolin dot Com twenty percent off your new system. There's no safe like simply safe. So I saw a quote, so I like Mac Jones. I didn't love him out of college. I liked him and I thought his rookie year was very, very encouraging. That's why I'm kind of pumping the brakes on Anthony Richards and C. J. Stroud. I don't know yet. I see encouraging things. But there's a story here in Boston today, did Belichick wiff On mac Jones could have an NFL execut executive says on mac Jones, they're expecting a miracle from somebody who needs good things around him. You can win with him, but he won't be the reason you win. And to that, I would say that explains eighty percent of the NFL maybe, and so you can win games, but they need a lot around him, if you want to simplify. And I'm only going to count quarterbacks that I would pay some more than others. But I found this morning I would be willing to pay about half the quarterbacks in the league pretty big money. And they come in two tiers. Now, I'm not going to count the rookies. I'm not going to count Brock Purty. I haven't seen a full season, and I don't know what to do with Deshaun Watson. But I think it's there's two tiers of quarterbacks that I would be willing to pay and here they are. These are guys that can pull you to wins. They can have a bad old line and Joe Burrow gets you to a super Bowl, can have coaching dysfunction Justin Herbert and get you to the playoffs. You can be in a rebuild and Trevor Lawrence wins a playoff game. There's seven in the world Josh Allen, Joe Burrow, Herbert Lamar, Trevor Lawrence, Mahomes. I think Jalen Hurts. I'll put him in there, although I've never seen him play with a bad unit. Because the Eagles have drafted so well, They've had such great players around him, I think I think he's in that, So I'll put him in in the world seven. I mean, Lamar Jackson's won seventy five percent of his games. His team's never healthy, right, So those seven and then there's ten other guys I would pay that need more help around him. Now you say Matt Stafford, Matt Stafford's the most talented in the second group. He never won a playoff game without McVeigh old, Aaron Rodgers. How did he look last year with the young receivers? Jared Goff got to a super Bowl. The Tier two is guys I would be willing to pay and they can get you to a conference championship, maybe even more like in Stafford win a Super Bowl, but they need people, or they need the coach, or they can overcomes some stuff, but they're not pulling you into the playoffs in the middle of a rebuild. Like Trevor Lawrence won a playoff game in a rebuild. Matt Stafford never won a playoff game in Detroit, never won a playoff game without McVeigh, not one in all those years. Lawrence is in year two, wins a playoff game over a more talented team than Chargers. So Tier two is Kirk Cousins, Jimmy g Goff, Kyler dak Aaron, Matt Stafford to Ryan Tannehill, Russell Wilson, I'd pay him. I'm not gonna pay them as much as Tier one, but I would pay him and that to everybody else. I'm not counting rookies, I'm not counting brock Perty yet, and I'm not Deshaun Watson was a healthy scratch last week. I don't know what the hell's going on in Cleveland, but that's kind of those are These are the guys I would pay now. The Tier one guys big money long term Tier two guys, I'll pay two. But I think the Rams already tried to rework Matt Stafford's contract in the offseason, which we reported was doubted, but then we were validated because Matt Stafford admitted old Aaron Rodgers he's forty off an Achilles surgery. I'm sorry, he's not justin Herbert, He's not. He's not there anymore physically. Uh tua. I like him, but I'm not. I'm waiting until this year is over. J mcinn. He pushed, But seventeen guys, I would be willing to pay some more than others, some longer than others. Everybody else I'm not paying.
I need some clarity when you're saying pay like right now, I'm saying.
I'm Everything's like Aaron Rodgers is now a forty year old in a very briefing, very quickly off an Achille surgery. He's a Tier two quarterback.
Oh got it? Okay, So let me just defend Matt Stafford here for a moment.
Okay.
He's thought. By the way, he was the single hardest one this morning in our meeting was Matt Stafford. Because I think he throws a beautiful ball, but he's banged up again. They tried to rework his deal. You and I have talked about through the years he's been he's been beat up a lot physically.
But he had around him in Detroit, which was nothing.
And don't tell me, oh, Calvin Johnson, what did Trevor Lawrence have around him last year? No, Calvin Ris.
Trevor Lawrence was in the worst division in football. That division has been played.
The Chargers down twenty seven to nothing at half and won a playoff.
Matt Stafford's in the same division with Brett Favre and then Aaron Rodgers.
Okay, like, come on, I think Stafford's getting a short drift here.
He should be the last one we moved out because of he. Joe Burrow got to a super Bowl with an Iran sid offensive line and a coach you don't like. Stafford never won a playoff game without McVeigh, didn't win a single.
I think division doesn't matter. Okay, division don't.
Doesn't because you get to the playoffs and play somebody out of your division.
The Lions have been inept in that division forever. They've been total garbage to franchise Jackson, I think it was like Bill Clinton, take.
Out, take out, Blake Bortle's year, the one year the Jags were a tire fire when Lawrence got there, and they were a tire fire the first year when he was there.
I like Trevor Lawrence on off the field. I roof for him. I think he's getting a evated a.
Bit much because he was the next Andrew Luck and like, by the way, tier one, hold on, holda what happened is rookie year with Urban Meyer. How were they and then last year they were like three and seven? And then this year could they be the number one season? They looked like garbage.
They didn't point. I didn't say it was mahomes Alan Lamar.
You put him in that top tier.
Well, yeah, there's a lot of tiers, a lot of people at the country club. Not everybody's the richest guy and runs a bank. There's a lot of people that get into that.
Stafford needs access to the country club. So I'm trying to see if there's a lot of.
Different levels of yachts. There's Jerry Jones yacht and then there's a forty nine footer. There's a lot of different levels too. They're all yachts right, I'm gonna you're gonna have never been on one myself.
But they're the yacht I'm not a yacht guy. I'm a paddleboat kind of guy. R kirk Cousins, could.
He be one b No, he shrinks in big games. Get out of here. By the way, we know Stafford is much better than kirk Cousins. So they're both in tier two. But we I said, Stafford's the first one I'd put in tier two. He's at the very top.
Is there some recency bias on Russell Wilson? The guy was unbelievable?
You don't think Russell Wilson is a dynamic as Lamar and Justin and No, I mean now you can put Russell Wilson right after. But Jared Goff, by the way, are we going to acknowledge Jared Goff got to a super Bowl?
Wait a minute, I love this got to a super Bowl? Who got there to the Super Bowl? McVeigh or Goff?
Both?
I mean, McVeigh is unbelievable. Hey, Stafford, come in here.
You've never won anything, will win a super Bowl like I like Goff? Ben Johnson's kind of saving him. There's a lot of layers this is a nuanced discussion. It's really tough because.
I don't think it's nuanced. Saying Josh Allen's a Tier one and Tannehill's a Tier two. That doesn't feel nuanced.
That's odd, that's a layup come on.
I said Stafford was the one we argued, the staff argued tier one. I said, it's if I had a third tier, I'd put Stafford in it. He'd be right between one and two.
