Thanks for listening to the Best of Herd podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday from twelve to three eastern nine to noon Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and FS one. Find your local station for the Herd at Fox Sports Radio dot com, or stream us live every day on the iHeartRadio app by searching Herd. This is the Best of the Herd with Colin cowhern on Fox Sports Radio Live in well Glendale. It's the Herd wherever you may be, however you may be listening iHeartRadio, Fox Sports Radio FS one. We are officially at the super Bowl. It is great to be here today. I don't lose my phone ever, I have twice in my life, both times in Phoenix, both times on the first day I cover the Super Bowl. I finally found it. I went to bed last night and Kevin's career was in the toilet. I woke up this morning and Kevin Durant's gonna win a title. What in the world is happening? He is now a member of the Phoenix Suns JAMAC alongside Azowa's That's a wild move. Yeah, Late night fire drill for you. Last night after a binge drinking night for Colin Cowherd, and now we pivot to football in the NBA. Okay, Sons make a blockbuster move. This is a really good franchise that doesn't have a championship. They're tired of waiting. They now have Kevin Durant. So just say it out loud. That's one of my rules in life. That's one of my rules in life. You ever get in trouble at like three in the morning, say it out loud. Three in the morning, convenience store, drinking too much doesn't sound like you should have been out. Say it out loud. Kevin Durant, Devin Booker, really good coach, veteran Hall of Fame point guard and a big that can run the floor. I think Phoenix this morning argument best team in the West. Now, I don't know about the chemistry, but hey, listen, Brooklyn got a lot of picks, so we'll talk about them in six years. Right now, we're going to talk about Kevin Durant and the Suns. I am genuinely happy for Kevin Durant. Way too much talent to be in a franchise that's up and down. Chaotic. New coach Ben Simmons, you're getting nothing there. James Harden came in out of shape. Whatever you believe about the vaccine, if you're part of a team, probably should get it. In the end, Kevin Durant made a really bad decision, and that's okay. We all make him, but don't double down on him. Just say let made a mistake. Kevin Durant now has made three moves in his career. One ended up being brilliant Golden State, one Brooklyn not great. The other one feels like to me, it's fantastic. And what I like about this move For Kevin Durant it's the first move without huge drama or expectation. So he joins the Warriors. They just won without him. You don't win the championship. They won without you if you don't win with the Warriors. Steve Kerr, Draymond Greene, Clay Thompson, Steph Curry, Dude, it's on you. And he goes didn't love it. He goes to Brooklyn with Kaye. Reeds can prove everybody wrong. A lot of expectations. Boston good, Milwaukee good. They have great cultures. This move. Warriors still the dynasty in the West. Everybody's fallen in love with John Moranton, Memphis, and oh, keep your eye on Denver. Don't trust him. Phoenix never won a championship. People have been banging on Chris Paul. I don't know why for years. He's too old. Devin Booker is good, but he's not that DeAndre Ayden. Everybody was selling the farm in him a year ago. Even his coach was mad at him. There's no pressure here. Love the move. Kevin's gonna come in. I mean, this team is exactly what championship teams are. Rookie head coaches, We've seen them implode. Veteran head coach. Everybody likes a communicator, really smart, veteran point guard who doesn't need to score but can two wings, won a guard, one a big. Both can score, but they're both kind of chill, like Kevin. Durant's not going to demand the final shot. Devin Booker's not going to demand the final shot. They're not as ball centric as like a Luca who I like but needs the ball. Harden needs the ball. Devin Booker and Durant. You can give him a ball late in the shot clock. They can hit it. And then I got a guy in DeAndre Ayton. Maybe he's not what people project. But he's big. He can give you seventeen points, he can run the floor. You need to have some rim protection. I like it is their bench thin. Yeah, soo's Golden States. I mean Golden States playing like seven guys. I mean that's all they play. I don't love Phoenix's bench, but we all know this. In the playoffs, we all know this. The bench shrinks you play seven to eight guys. I mean, I got news for you. Celtics aren't going to ten eleven guys Milwaukee. They want Middleton, Ingalls, Jannis. They want their guys back on the floor. So I love this, And again, so much of life and happiness is expectations if Phoenix gets better, because we all kind of look at Phoenix now as yeah, it didn't work. Let's say they get to the Western Conference finals, and I think with this roster they will, and you lose to the Warriors in six. Nobody's blaming Katie made it significantly better. I don't know how this looks in Phoenix in three years. Katie's getting older, Chris Paul's getting older. Those Brooklyn picks could be really tasty in about three years. But today the story is KD resurrecting his career, and I like it a lot. All right, now, this is a story I knew about before I lost my phone. The Lakers. I've been banging on the Lakers. The Lakers don't like me, which is hard to believe because I'm very likable. The Lakers don't like me. I've been banging on this franchise for years, and I live in Los Angeles and they look at me weird of him in the arena. I can't believe they pulled this off. I can't believe they got this much. They gave up an awful contract and one pick, and they got two shooters and Malik Beasley and Delane low Russell, two guys that can shoot. They also got rid of the worst contract arguably in the league, and somebody that couldn't play with Lebron and Westbrook no reason to pick on him, but he doesn't work with Lebron. And then they also need like versatile wing defenders. They just don't have him, and they got two of those two. And I'm like, how it is hard to make these trades. I mean, I mean nothing against the Jazz, because all the Jazz want right now is picks and nothing against the t Wolves, who, by the way, got better because Mike Conley is one of the smartest guys in the league. He works great with Rudy Gobert. D'Angelo Russell didn't, and let's slow down on the D'Angelo Russell love. Lakers had him once they let him go. He's bounced around the league. Here's what we know about him. He's skilled, but he's really inconsistent. He's not a leader, and he wore Steve kerr out. Virtually everybody works for the Warriors. D'Angelo Russell didn't. My takeaway is he's good for the rest of the season. He won't end his career as a Laker. That is okay, you got out of the Westbrook contract. Ask yourself this, if you were a Laker fan, if this morning you just got out of the Westbrook contract and got like a bench shooter, you'd be like, we're a better team. The Lakers are absolutely a playoff team today. Now where are they? I don't know. But Lebron always makes always makes his shooters better. He did it with Battier and Mike Miller. He did it with Ray Allen, he did it Kyrie, even his bigs, Kevin Love and Chris Bosh have to sacrifice their game a little, but he gets the great looks. Outside of magic Johnson Lebron does as good a job is any guy with size I've ever seen getting teammates great shots. So Malik Beasley's an excellent shooter. He'll get the best shots of his life. D'Angelo Russell's a bit more streaky, He'll get the best shots of his life. Listen, Westbrook got shots. He just couldn't hit him. He just couldn't hit the shots. So and also, everything is relative. So compared to the Kevin Durant move, it feels like, yeah, a bunch of disparate parts, but it's not. The Lakers had two huge flaws, not enough versatile wing defenders and players they got two, and not enough shooters. They got two. Who cares they give up a draft pick. I've said this before. In Los Angeles you can sell draft picks to smaller markets Memphis, Milwaukee, or Salt Lake City. You can sell draft picks in the future. Those almost feel like college towns, very hopeful, very optimistic. La is gonna beach, It's got mountains. It's got two of this, two of that, two of this, two of that things to do you can't sell twenty twenty nine. Nobody cares. The Dodgers are too good, the Clippers are viable. Lincoln Riley now at usc like the teams are too good. You gotta be good now. And the Lakers got young and versatile, they're better shooters, complimentary pieces at the trade deadline, and all they really had was a bad Westbrook contract. How I mean, I gotta I have been. And by the way, it's substance over flashy. And you know, one of the things like when you don't have money to waste, you don't waste money. Right, Kardashians probably waste more money a week than I make a year. Right, they have money. When you have big city flash like Los Angeles, it's easy to get flashy players, and so the Lakers often go flash over substance. It's like the Yankees often pay for a player who really doesn't fit John Carlos Stanton, we already had Aaron Judge. What's the point. But when you have all that money, it's seductive. You're not gonna make that move if you're the Brewers, you're not gonna make that move if you're a small market. But in Los Angeles. It's seductive. It's a town of celebrities, stars, good god, Lebron setting the record. There's a thousand stars, and so the Lakers get seduced and often go the star route, over the substance route. Not this time, substance versatility, youth shooters. You give a draft, pick one who cares. I So there were two big trades yesterday, and let's let's be clear about this. One was a pre lost phone, one was after. The one after probably makes the sun significantly better, but the one before absolutely makes the Lakers a playoff team. Lebron a d versatility, Beasley hitting a three. That's pretty interesting team if you ask me. All right, so we are we are just outside the stadium. You will notice as you as our cameras show you, this is a very strong set steel beams, very powerful set. A lot of whimpy sets from other networks, not this set, very powerful. Will show it off for the next two days. It is great to have you in around the corner today. I don't even know who's on the show. A bunch of people who want to be under these steel beams. That who's on the show today. Great to have you in be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays in noon Easter nine am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio FS one and the iHeartRadio app. All Right, he's gonna be a Hall of Famer. Twelve years in the NFL, all with the Saints, eight times in all prol he led the Saints and sacks again this year. The great Cam Jordan is joining us on the set, an Arizona kid who made the drive. How are you you look? You know what? It's amazing. You play in a sport where guys bench five hundred and bang into each other and you're aging. Well, how do you do it? And God is good? You know. You wake up in the morning, you have a glass of water, you look at your life. You say, we've done well. So I want to ask you. So Sean Payton left you. He came to work with us Cam for a year. I've never learned more football, the metaphors, the analogies. Now you're a defensive guy, and so I was just probing on the air, texting. I was like a nuisance. So now you're talking more with your hands. That's what Sean does. Um, what is it's like this? Um? Obviously it's a tough year for the Saints, even though he's an offensive coach. When he left the building, what did you lose with Sean Payton? Like, explain that to the audience. I mean a huge level of energy. I mean, you know his energy is so offensive minded. It's hey, you know, I see why receiver split at the at the hash, but it's not exactly at the hash. I want you to be inside the hash if you look, if you know Sean pay Sean's gonna hit you with this even like what does that mean? You see a receiver literally shift over and be like yeah, now as you're going, when you have that step, you have a little bit more wiggle room to get open. Ear you. You love to see it happened from the defense society, like dang, I wouldn't even think you know this commatter or whatever it is. He's like, oh, you got covered two, you got one high. This is where it's coming down. We're gonna expose this. It's gonna be a touchdown. And in Sean's mind, it's gonna be a touchdown. And when it happens, that's when you see Sean come down to a defensive side. He'll come down, Hey, I got forty more plays just like this're all striking. I want to fi You see that on the defenside the ball, You're like, he's gone for fifty you know. Um. And it's easy. It's easy to buy in and you love to see it. And he brings us a level of consistency Monday through Saturday usually going to get exactly the same. Hey, this is where we're dude. It was improve on today. This is what we're focused on. Now, how will he work? I like Russell Wilson. You see how I left Sunday opened though I did. I like Russell Wilson. Um, you know, I was a lot of Seahawks took shots, and then when he left it made me go, whoa. The Denver thing was not just bad, it was a disaster U the first here. There's still time. So do you think Sean's capable of being confrontational and saying, hey, this thing, this thing, this thing. Absolutely he is absol I mean the greatest thing that I saw about you know him going to Denver is Sean is overly confident in his ability. Oh, no question. He believes that what his system is is going to work, and it is a winning system. If you know Russell. You've met Russell plenty of times, Russell West, Russell Wilson's mentality is so confident and positive. He's gonna win in all aspects of life. You put both those mentalities together, you can't tell me he's not gonna be a positive influence on each other. So, um, I want to talk you guys. Did not play Kansas City. You did play Philadelphia. Now Gardner Minshew was the quarterback. But I think for sacks one thirteen and a half, fourteen and a half, and fifteen and a half. Yeah, say yeah, I mean just to pass up Ricky Jackson, just a three sack night, don't worry about it. We walked into twenty twenty three in an all right position because of Philadelphi Eagles so well. So people love their offensive line. You had some success. Yeah, so you So this is something we've talked about a lot, is that I think Kansas City's old line is being told all week that the Eagles have the best line in football. And I think Tuney's great, Creed Humphreys great, I love. I think I think Casey's old line is hearing all week how great the old line is for the Eagles, but you had success against it. You tell me, is are the Eagles? Is the Eagles old line a little overrated? It's look a little old in spots, look all it um. I have never changed. I don't know if officsive linemen. In my mind, I'm just indifferent about them. You could say this one was great, this one's amazing, this one was bad, this one was terrible. Offensive linemen are cool to have because you need them. There needs to be an officive line, right, you know, you can't replace a guy like Toront Armstead, that Lane Johnson's you're you know, you're Trent Williams. But other than that, officive linemen are just people who get in the way. Right. In my mind, I don't hate them. I don't love them. They're just people that get in the way. They don't decide games. So you you dropped off names. I have never looked at you know, I think that guys like Pat mahonemes that's what you're rushing. You're not rushing. Oh, I gotta beat whoever your tackle is, right, I'm trying to get to where Pat Mahomes is going to be. I'm looking at Jalen Hurts Jalen hurts in the game. I've played him twice now and not including this last time. Because you know Gardner's there. You're rushing the quarterback. You're not rushing the office in linement. It doesn't matter how good Big is over on the Eagles or how great of a phenomenal athlete Nane Johnson is. You're you're going against Jalen. Jalen's gonna step up, He's gonna make play, He's gonna roll out. It's like, you know, seeing Russell in his prime. It's seeing Mike Vick when he when he's doing his thing Lamar when he was in an MVP season. You don't know where the quarterback is going to be, and that makes it the part hard to rush. So I can say this now and all tread delicately. You told me years ago. Yeah, you said, Colin, you're a little hot on Kyler Murray. Yeah, you did. Absolutely, settle down. Absolutely. I don't think it's gonna last. You told me this. Absolutely, he was he was young, and he's a runner, and you know, like you see Andrew luck who what happened to his career, Like as a runner who takes a lot of hits, a lot of bread like it's not. Eventually, your body does break down eventually. Okay, Your quarterbacks live a good life. They only get hit on Sundays. Their body's not used to getting hit. So now on Sundays you get smacked, and as much as the rules protect quarterbacks, you're still taking those hits. Okay. So Jalen Hurts averages eleven rushes a game. Yeah, only Lamar in the history of the league is averaged that. He's not a big man. You faced him twice. Do you feel the same way about Jalen as you did about Kyler. I put Jalen in sort of like that Cam Newton. I don't. I don't compare him to Lamar. I compare him to like the Cam Newton type. He can throw, run, but he's bigger than you think he is. You know, like Lamar, Lamar is a phenomenal athlete, phenomenal quarterback. The Ravens should pay that man yesterday. You know, Jalen Hurts is heavier, He's he's built different. You know, when he's not at I wouldn't say he's as elusive, but he's making those electric plays because he's just as fat and he's bigger than you think. Absolutely, He's like he's sort of built like Dak Prescott and runs like Cam Newton. Okay, that's interesting. It was funny because I saw I said, I think I told you this the other day on the air. Terry Bradshaw's a pretty big dude, and he was on stage with Jalen Hurts, and my takeaway was Jon's way bigger than I thought. He is. Now, Kyler, as you told me earlier, you're like, you're on the field right, that's small. I hit him one year. I hit him and I hit the ground so hard, like I didn't realize, like, you know, the size of him. So I hit him and I try to smack him. I'm trying to like I'm from Arizona, so anytime I played the Cardinals, I'm trying to I'm trying to like stories to talk all my stuff to my uncle's. So I smat Kyler. I hit the ground so hard. I got up. I was like, oh, I know that hurt, you know, like it hurts me. I know it hurt him. But Kyler is a hell of a baller, you know what I'm saying, Like what he does with his feet, what he's able to do on the field is spectacular. But because he does take those hits, that's you know, like I was like, I don't know if he can play at this rate that he's going crazy. Now that that being said, he can be the next you know, Joe Montage. You're gonna say that, a smaller guy who's going to make it, make it work. But I'd love to see him pan out. I just like the hits he takes isn't sustainable, you know, So how do you view? I love Mahomes, but not just because he's great. I think he's coachable. I think he had good pairenting. Uh, he's so good at the podium, always given teammates credit. He's never you know, you can't ever um. You can ask him a question and he's always too smart and mature to bite on it. Like he's one of those guys and a lot of guys bite up Baker Mayfield bit on everything. I mean everything, so um. But when Mahomes goes side arm and clever and lateral and left arm and underhand it when he does the defensive guys everything, bro, don't showboat. Don't don't be showboating on me. Uh. If I'm on his team or if I'm against him, against him, Oh yeah, I guess no, no, no no, no, you just gotta be You're at this point, you're unfaced, like you know, he's gonna like it's just something one of the one of those tricks that he has. It's like Aaron Rodgers, can you know, make every throw in the book off of his back foot, right, He's some things you just attribute to who they are. Pat Mahomes, you're gonna find you're gonna get an electric play. Relax, there's still a game to play. And that's how coaches coach, like, oh he's gonna do something crazy and it may or may not work. Take it with shride. You know what I'm saying, Let's let's bottle it up. Play next play because you know you have you have all he has all the weapons you talk about. You know when we played him, it was it was Tyreek Hill, it was Travis Kelsey was you know all these guys, Mkole Harman was just like I entered the league. Now this year, Tyreek's gone, but there's pacheco Um, you know he's again, there's still Travis the you know, if the premier tight end, if if he's one A. George could one B but you'd say he's the top, top tight end. And then of course you have mcole Harman. You've got again, You've got these top tier guys that he's out here too, that can make electric plays, and so you know what he can do. He's a wizard, so sometimes a little magic happens. Okay, I'm gonna ask you to be honest on this, not that you're ever dishonest, but CAL is one of the great public university, the number one public university in the nation of Virginia. No, no, no, because the latest rating I saw had Cal second. But I don't, I mean, unless there's twenty twenty three. I saw it in December and it was the Universe of California birthday. So that said, all the cow guys that come on my show are smart guys. There are certain universities like Duke basketball players, Cal football players. They're always smart, and so I think Aaron Rodgers is very smart. It's never about that. I do think, though, I do think is that as you age and rosters get younger. As a quarterback, M Brady did this. You gotta you gotta kind of listen to the music let's you know, I mean, you gotta connect young receivers, young tight ends. So when Aaron doesn't go all in on the off season, does the retreats my takeaways? Did they just got a wide receiver from Reno and an FSC FCS school. You got to show up Tota for three days. These these guys are totally intimidated by Aaron Rodgers and he didn't and it bothered me. It wouldn't bother me if you're a mic linebacker or a corner quarterback. Young receivers, it's a timing thing. So now I hear he's gonna go on a four day trip darkness, isolation. I'm for meditation. I'm not judging. I'm all good. I lived near Hollywood. I'm not judging. But you know, you're a cow guy. You cow guys are global. You see the world differently. A lot of young guys are looking at that thing and they're thinking, my quarterback. I don't know, But do you think there are guys in that room? Absolutely not that think Aaron's a little out there, absolutely ably, But being out there doesn't mean that it's not a good team mesh. At the end of the day, you've got how many MVPs as he would I know three it's three because he won two back to back and he won one younger, so at least three, right. I mean, you have a quarterback that's an unparalleled tier. You know, you know what he can bring to the table. And even when you start off on a bat season, You've seen Aaron Rodgers go what zo and four in the world put their pressure on him and he's like, relax and they end up in the playoffs. You've seen Aaron Rodgers like, you know, this is what we need to prove on and it happens at the end of the day. You know he wants to win. I could care less what you do between your time and your time, but when we get between the lines of field between September and January, we're aiming to get to February. What, um, what do you do in the offseason? Typically I'm in here training, I take about a month off, I start training back up and like march ish do you travel to glaws? What do you do? That's why I say typically because this year I'm gone, where are you going? I'm going. I'm going. I'm going to Spain. I'm gonna be there. I don't know. I'm taking. I'm taking the wife, the kids, if we had a dog, the dog, I'm taking everything like we're going. I'm trying to get bilingual, and until I see some sort of cognitive understanding of the comprehension of the language, not come back. That's good. I assume it's mad. Yeah, yeah, I need to get out there. The kids are young enough where they like before we start taking off in the sports. The timing is just right. I've put twelve years in this league and I and I say in my mind the right way of never not being available, never not being there. I got nothing but love for my team. My team knows exactly where I stand. They got my number. You can call me anytime, but I'm going to Spain. I got a question. You've made enough money, you're obviously really, really smart. You could call it a day years ago. So it could have Brady ten years ago, right, Um, but there was something about Brady drafted, late, overlooked. Whatever it is, genetics, I know what it is. Um. Do you have that in you? Or do you want the next life? Pretty soon? Next life? What is next life? Is on your terms? I don't know if there's afterlife and next life. I'm I'm so focused on football that that it hurts to lose. The fact that I'm not in the playoffs this last two years hurts. The fact that we at some point in this season, I looked up and we were three and seven. I'd never been there before. You know, there there's times where you look at it you like, we have the talent. I hate when we look good on paper because when when when you have so much potential and you don't live up to potential, it hurts here, not so much here. You here, you're rationalizing things. You know, you're Hey, We've got you know, at the beginning of season, we had Jarvis Langry, Mike Thomas, we just drafted Cristal Lave. You know, Jamis is out here. The can't wait to see his potential. You had, you know, we back up in Andy Dalton. And then on defense side is me Demario Uh, Marcus Davenport just came off of nine sacks. You've got David Anyimada, who's probably the most underrated defensive tackle in the league. Um, We've got uh. We got a young kid in Pete Verna from a house state, you know, that can tackle anything and everything. Um, and you're like, yeah, we got so much potential we can live up to and when that doesn't happen, you're disappointed. And that's more disappointed. You're like, I gotta take a breath. So that's what I'm doing. I'm taking a breath. I'm taking I'm taking a quick But in terms of football, ain't no way. That's all I see. I love I love hitting people. Now if the refs will get out out of my way and turn throwing flags every time when I do hit somebody, it could be a better game, maybe just for me. Because the fans work more. Fans want more touchdowns. That's right. NFL Arrivals, you're working with them. What do they do? Oh, we talk about NFL arrivals launching this game, you know, uh, NFL rivals where you can be your own like coach your own GM. You can assemble your team, assemble the Avengers if you will. You know you're nine v nine going against whoever and whatever with whoever you decide to drafting these cars going in. I think that Mythical Games have done a great job of putting this together and bringing back a nostalgic sense of like sort of what football was when we when we were growing up. When you're playing NFL blitz, when you know when you were taking NFL streats, when you were when you were like really smacking cats. You know, I think like I don't even think like when when when ray Lewis was playing. I think about like when Reggie White was playing. You know what I'm saying, Those those those rattling hits that gets you excited. Maybe because I'm I'm different. You know, I've always I always loved the defensive side, you know, I grew up postles are tight end, and he's like, hey, I want you to catch this catch. I'm trying to hit somebody who was who was to score touchdown? When you can sack a quarterback, you know, Deacon Jones coined the phrase sack because it felt like you were sacking a city you scored touchdown. So many people can do that. How many people can actually get sacks? How many people can actually get over one hundred sacks? There's twenty five of us. How many people can get it, you know, five six thousand yards a lot of them. What does it take to catch somebody a quarterback to throw it to you? Wasn't take create a sack, a lot of speedheart, ingenuity, and a little bit of luck. And I have a hundred and fifteen and a half sacks. That's what it brings to. So now you talk about NFL rivals, you're gonna have them them good, them good hits that you want to see. You're giving you everything you need. I'm like I said, I'm going back to the arcade games, back when you used to get on NFL blitz, putting the quarters and it start smacking people. That's what I'm here for. Like we talked about football, we talk about where am I at. I'm at trying to catch this next sack of a quarterback. Cam Jordan. Great to seeing you, man, I appreciate having you on as always. Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd Weekday said noon Easter nine am PACIFICIC. Hey, what's up everybody. It's me three time pro bowler Levarrington and I couldn't be more excited to announce a podcast called Up on Game? What is up on Game? You asked, along with my fellow pro bowler t J. Hushman, Zada and Super Bowl champion. Yep, that's right, Plexico Burris. You can only name a show with that type of talent on it. Up on Game We're going to be sharing our real life experiences loaded with teachable moments. Listen to Up on Game with me, lebar Arrington, T J. Hutchman's Out of and Plexico Birds on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast or wherever you get your podcast from. Well, well, well he is um. He's the older brother of Tim Hasselbeck, who used to be in a constant annoyance for me. Matt is the mature brother, the super Bowl brother, and he is joining us in the herd from Arizona Sunday NFL Countdown. Thank you very We'll get into these in a second. You and Brian Billick I love you both all right. First of all, it's great to see you. Your family's great. Yeah, we're doing well. Um, so you're super Bowl. I'm not gonna say it quietly. It was the worst. What was the worst officiated Super Bowl? In fact, the Petsburgh Post Gazette after you lost to the Steelers did a pole and half of Steeler fans acknowledged you guys got hosed in Seattle. Was it You're flying home? What was your feeling after that game? Because you went toe to toe with the Steelers. Man, I don't know if I'm coming back on this show where we're talking about Super Bowl forty already, get in the green room, and who's the first person I see in the green room. I'm probably giving away your next guest. Jerome bettis the bus who had the home coming back in Detroit, all the terrible towels. Listen. It was a thrill to play in the Super Bowl, and I've kind of thought about it and reflected upon it a little bit this week as we get ready here for Super Bowl fifty seven, and so much of it is the journey. And you know, as you know, I work over at ESPN year old network on you know Sunday NFL Countdown with Teddy Bruskie who has wonted a Super Bowl or two, has lost to Super Bowl and talking about losing a super Bowl, talking a lot about that lately. And I lost. I lost this, you know, I lost my only super Bowl that I had a chance to start start in. And I had a chance to sit down with both Patrick Mahomes and Jalen Hurts this year, Jalen Hurts just last week. And you know, one of the questions I wanted to ask him, and I didn't, but it was gonna be about, like, what's it gonna be like if you don't get to be the guy that hoists the Lombardi? What's gonna be like if you're the guy that goes home sort of the loser the other teams confetti? Because I know what that feels like. And man, it's like you almost have this feeling in your head like would it be better to have never been here? And I don't think the answer is yes, but that you do think that you do think that way, and you certainly contemplate that, and uh, you know, I joke, but you know, part of losing Super Bowl forty certainly was very very difficult. You know, I said this, I think it was last week. Tom Brady is the greatest quarterback ever. I think Mahomes is the most talented. And I say that as somebody old enough to watch Elway and Marino and all these guys, and what You're a very smart guy from a smart family. What Patrick does to me that jumps off the TV screen is the ability to see something and process it so quickly and release the ball. It all happens within a second, and some of it is delivery. There's quarterbacks I like, but the delivery is slower. We saw that with Tebow and Sam Darnold just took too long. There's a cognitive ability. I don't know if it's innate. I don't know what it is. I know he's a great quarterback, but that's what I see when I watch him site to release. So as somebody who's been in Super Bowls, what do you see with Mahomes beyond the obvious? Well, so my first year in the NFL, I got drafted to the Green Bay Packers in nineteen ninety eight. The quarterback room that year was Brett Farve, Doug Peterson, Rick Meyer, and then me on the practice squad. Our quarterback coach was Andy Reid. Mike Holmgren was the head coach. I've known Andy Reid a long time. I sat down with Andy Reid this year and I said to him, I said, Okay, basically what you just said, I said, but tell me the one thing, like, what is the absolute best thing that Patrick Mahomes does. What's his best ability? Like, what is the one thing? And really, without hesitation, he said, he's smart. He's smart smart, And I really believe that half of what you do as a quarterback, maybe more, happens before you even snapped the football. And that's where he is exceptional. I said this to somebody that I worked with recently. I said, you know, I could just listen to Patrick Mahomes play a game. You know, they mike up one of the offensive linemen. Now, so you get this like gnat sound, this natural sound of what it sounds at the loans. You hear him up there, whe Gold Gold White eighties said, I like you hear him with all his verbal communication with the offensive line, with the wide receivers, with Kelsey. The way he communicates with Kelsey is like you communicated with your best friend at recess. No no, no, no, go over there and break out. Like that's how he talks to him. And I just think it's it's it's next level. It's it's almost undefendable sometimes because whatever you do defensively, he's got an answer for it. And then, oh, by the way, he's one of the most talented throwers that the game's ever seen. You know, we we've gotten into this ideology, this theory that there's two ways to get to a super Bowl. Now, let's not talk winning, but getting there is really hard. The margin. This isn't college football. The margins are tight. So a lot of it's attrition luck. Guys get hurt yours don't. And the two things that appear to be clear, Either you've got somebody that's brilliant at quarterback. There's about six on the planet. You can go back to any era there's about five or six. Or you draft a guy that's good and you stack the roster. Philadelphia, San Francisco. So if philadel and I like Jalen Hurts, it's not Mahome. I don't think he's Herbert or or Lamar or whatever we know Burrow. So if if I mean Brock Purdy gets to the NSC championship game, if Philadelphia role Kansas City, do you believe it does sending the message in a copycat league, just draft a quarterback every year, keep the position reasonably inexpensive. Well, I think the draft to quarterback every year thing is a real philosophy that some people have. It started with Ron Wolf and Green Bay, Mike Holmgren, Andy Reid. I think you still see remnants of that in Philly. You know, whether it was Andy Reid or Doug Peterson or now it's Howie Roseman. They're like, you know, the mindset is just draft a guy every year. I mean even when they had Carson Wentz, I believe they payed Sam brad They're paying Sam Bradford a bunch of money that year, and they're playing Chase Daniel a bunch of money out here. Yeah, when they drafted Jalen Hurts, everyone's like, what you have Carson Wentz, Like that's I believe that's this organization's philosophy a little bit. But now I think Jalen Hurts is a better quarterback than people realize. I really do. I think he's a better passer than people realize. And there's an opportunity here for him and players who play his style of play. If the Phildelphia Eagles are able to win the Super Bowl, it's going to open the door for players who play a little bit more physical brand, Like there may be more of a dual threat, not just like getting you out of a jam dual threat, but like, no, you can be a big part of the running game dual threat and it doesn't take just that body type. Like Josh Allen would be an example of a guy Daniel Jones surprised a lot of people, including myself. I did not know Daniel Jones could be a designed run kind of quarterback the way that he was this year. He was unbelievable and stayed healthy. So yeah, I'm interested to see what happens in this game. You know, in part because of that, Matt Hasselbeck for our radio audience is joining us. You know, I had Brady on the other day. We got lucky calls that he'd do the show. Tom's the classic example overlooked. You were often overlooked and six round Pride, sixth round. You know, he was picked one ninety nine. I was one eighty seven. It's a it's a weird thing. But when you're drafted in the sixth round, you I don't think you forget the number. Just I totally get it. So there are similarities. Is that you're about the same size. But to last and be as good as Tom, he had to have been better physically. There's the old combine picture shirt off when you watched Tom. Like, let's say you didn't know Tom and you just watched his video and somebody said that you you were scout. What do you make of this kid? What was his secret sauce that he never quite got credit for. Well, listen that that's the way you should watch film anyway. Nameless faces is how you say it in a quarterback room. Like in a quarterback room when you're going and getting ready to play an opponent, you literally write this on the board, nameless faces, like I don't care what this player used to be. I don't care what he's done in the past. We're going at number twenty four today. Hey, every deep ball, we're going at number twenty four. Well, twenty four might be a Hall of Famer. So just wouldn't even feel right, Like he just wouldn't even That's kind of how you do it. And so like you'd pick a dB later in the stages of his career where it's like, hey, we're gonna double move that guy. So I think that's how weird players are sort of trained to look at players evaluate players anyway. For Tom Brady, to me, his arm got better the older that he got. His physical skills got better. I would argue, he got faster. I bet you he's faster now in his forties than he was when he left Michigan. Like, what is that some of that's training, some of that's diet, some of that's science. We've learned some things that we didn't know. Like when I was in college, he was in college, we were all just eating like Joe Weeder protein, you know what I mean, like chocolate. We didn't know we what we now know. And I think that's what they'll say about us twenty years from now. I remember even like when I was growing up, there was a time when water breaks were seen as a sign of weakness. Oh, I remember it well. And training camp in Cheeny, Washington, the Seahawk exactly and so and now now we know that sleep and hydration and all this other stuff like technology has been invited to the party for football finally, it was like the last sport to really embrace technology and equipment and how we learn all of it. And even like I would say a good part of my early part of my career, we were installing plays on overhead transparencies with like dry erase markers. And I remember the day it went to power Point and everyone was like, oh, fancy, young coaches putting power Point in the playbook. And now these guys are you know, they're they're learning with virtual reality or on iPads like all this kind of stuff. Hey, I'm just gonna like quickly upload a doc that's all the new install for tomorrow. And so like COVID happened, all these guys were having zoom meetings and filming them. And then a new player comes from another team. He can just go back and watch the installs. Didn't matter that he wasn't there. So the game is definitely changing, and I'm sort of here for it. Finally. Not everybody's the same. Tall quarterback, fast quarterback, pocket quarterback. Most quarterbacks in my life don't go on isolation trips ayahuasca. That's fine. I'm in a meditation, I always have been. I've supported Aaron that way. You're a different cat, not me. I get it. Kyler Murray's got his own way to study. Aeron's got his own personality. You know. Tom's a repetitive nature guy. Aeron's an artist. He's a jash musician. But I do think sometimes, and I would say this about Kevin Durant when you're a bit of a wanderer. Structure generally equals wealth and business or wealth in sports. Lebron's got structure, Tom had structure, Jeter had structure. When you're a wanderer, it's not bad to you, it can be bad organizations. You're kind of waiting for the move. Is it a fair criticism to say that sometimes Aaron puts pressure on others waiting for him to commit. Verbalize that he's not always as a quarterback. Despite brilliant talent he can, he can be sometimes difficult for an organ For an organization, you know, I really don't think it's that different than what what he probably experienced when he got to the Green Bay Packers with Brett Farve not being sure if he was going to keep playing or whatnot. I think that's kind of what you're getting at. And I can just say, like I was there, you know Brett when it come to the offseason stuff. That was a huge benefit for me. Like I was the guy getting the reps with the starters, I was the guy going with the ones like that helped me so in a weird way, like it's sort of helping the organization when you're away because the young guys are you know, in this case, Jordan Love would be having the opportunity to sort of develop and that kind of thing. But just in terms of like the getaway thing. Yeah, when you're like a super like ultra celebrity, there's just something I think about having downtime. And I remember, even like when I was in Green Bay, you know, once upon a time, you know, the starting quarterback was Brett Farves, two consecutive Super Bowls, three MVPs in a row, like he just needed to get away. He'd go hunting sometimes, and I think I swear he never did. He didn't take a gun. He just wanted to just be away. Sure, And I remember at the time one of our one year our other quarterback was Danny Werfol, And Danny Werfol was kind of like Tim Tebo before Tim Tebow. Yeah, he wildly popular in college, huge Florida Gator Heisman Trophy. I mean, he was the guy I was looking up to. I was in college also, and I just remember him telling a story one time. He said, you know, one of my favorite things to do when there was all this pressure about the national championship and the Heisman Trophy, like one of my favorite thing to do was go scuba diving and just to like just be able alone, just get away, you know. And it just like it really struck me because I was a sixth round pick. You know, I wasn't like this big celebrity or anything like that. I'm like, you know what, like really is that a thing? Like why would that be important? And then like you know, then I'm the starting quarterback for the Seattle Seahawks for ten years and that's a way smaller scale than kind of what these other guys are dealing with. But I sort of got it. Yeah, like there's nothing wrong with maybe just like taking some time away kind of recharging, as long as you're communicating it, like properly to the people that need to be commu take. But I don't know that that that was just it struck me, Like I remember when Danny Worfel said it. I was like huh because at the time I was sort of like, man, what's it like to be Danny Werfel and got to do it in Green Bay. Can't go to the grocery store. We probably probably can't go anywhere, but ex tech pads, Billick and you are those the guys. It's funny that you say Brian Billick though, because I would say about eighty percent of the league is wearing the shoulder bad this shoulder pad. I know about this shoulder bad. You know why because I wear them. No, because I didn't wear them because they weren't around when I was choosing what to wear. But they've been around a long time and there's a new design this year. But my son is a high school quarterback and this is what he's in. And so know in this game, more than half the players in this Super Bowl be wearing this. Davante Smith A J. Brown. They're lighter, they're stronger. Like I won't do it, but I could put these on you and swing a baseball bat and you really want to feel it? Yeah, you know you can believe there's been players who want to do that. Really is that a thing? But but also like for a quarterback, and like we did this on our show this year because Justin Herbert had fractured some rib cartilage in his ribs or whatever, and um, I had had that injury and it's a terrible injury, right, Like you gotta go play a football game with like sort of like essentially broken ribs. And so you can attach rib pads to it, you know, like to the shoulder pads, which that technology has been around, but you want the rib pads to be strong enough to to you know, take a big hit or something like that. So yeah, So anyway, extechpads dot com for high school athletes. These are huge in college with big time college programs and then big time players from Josh Allen to Daniel Jones to you know sort of you name it at the at the quarterback position. But um, and there's sleek and they make you feel fast, which is fast like DeVante Smith. So great seeing you. What do you think you like like a color scheme? No, I like it. Okay, the game's evolving. I'm all for it not staying stuck at well and even like the helmet games changing as well too, you know, and I think like we're gonna look back years from now and be like I do that with my dad. So like my dad played nine years in the NFL. I have his shoulder pads and helmets from when he played. I'm like, did you really play with this equipment? It's like I really did? Like Okay, well now, so like now I feel like the game's safer than it's ever been. So there you go. Good to see you, Matt. Good to see you too, Matt Hasselbeck. One more Herd The Herd streams twenty four hours a day, seven days a week. 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