Doug Gottlieb reacts to the Vikings losing to the Rams and gives his thoughts on what this means for the future of Sam Darnold. 3 & Out Podcast Host John Middlekauff joins Doug to give his thoughts on if Deion Sanders is a real candidate for the Cowboys job. Plus, is it time for the Steelers to move on from Mike Tomlin?
Thanks for listening to the best of the Doug Gottlieb Show podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday three to five Eastern twelve two Pacific on Box Sports Radio. Find your local station for the Doug Gottlieb Show at boxsports Radio dot com, or stream us live every day on the iHeartRadio app by searching FSR Booming Up America Doug Gottlieb Show, Bock Sports Radio coming to you from the Tirac dot Com studios tire rack dot Com. We'll have you get there. Unmatched selection, fast, free shipping, free road has protection over ten thousand recommended stallars ti rac dot com. So a tire buying should be Hey, welcome in. I need a little help and a little balance from my good friend Dan Byer. And here's really what it comes down to. Last night we watched the Rams just dismantle the Vikings offensive line, their offense in general. It was it was ugly. There's no other way around it. It was just absolutely positively an ugly, ugly thing. And we've gotten this place where, I mean, my goodness, people are going top rope on. Three quarterbacks have lost and not played particularly well. And those three quarterbacks now, I guess in the public's mind are awful. And I watched Sam Donald last night and then I talked to my good friend Dania Rolovsky via text, and I just asked him, I like, hey, what percentage of that was Donald? And he's like, well, what percentage that was offensive line? He's like ninety percent offensive line? And that's what I saw. I mean, look, no quarterbacks survives that type of onslaught. None. If you missed it, here's Paul Allen, voice of the Vikings on kfan of the Vikings Radio network.
Two receivers left rams flints.
Donald gets away from it, steps up in the pocket.
He's holding it too long.
Run just run.
Hold the twenty five yard line.
He's sacked for a fIF time.
All he's got to do is pull that thing down and run and get as much positive yardage as he can. There were five to seven yards easy there to be made.
He saw Buffalo do this.
To them all day long because they're not always disciplined in their lanes. But if he pulls this thing down right there, he has a good five seven yards, if not more.
Right, take what's there.
Well, he was under durest the entire game the entire game. And I know where lovesk He's a former quarterback and a long time backup sometimes starter, and he has tendency says to side with the quarterback. But if you ask anybody in football, they'll say it mirror their plan mirrored that of the Lions, and the Lions did the same thing to Donald. And I think we're somewhere in between how he was being seen and valued and some sort of hack backup that got exposed. Like, I get it, he wasn't particularly good. I get it he was seeing ghosts. But I just when do we get to this place where, I mean, you go back and you look at some of these quarterbacks that have lost. And we mentioned it yesterday with with Justin Herbert, Like Justin Herbert a great year, He's a good quarterback, didn't play particularly well. Offensive line also didn't protect all that well. But if you go to social media or go to media, oh my gosh, top rope in terms of negativity. Now there is a part of it. There is a part of it that needs to be discussed. Because I've brought this up and I haven't heard anywhere else. You know, people talk about the n and you know the Packers losing, the Vikings losing, and we'll see what the Lions do. It's important to point out that what place you finished the year before does determine the level of your schedule for the next year. But I think I'm the only one who said this on national radio and national TV. That division, the NFC North crossed over against the NFC West and the AFC South, the NFC West and the AFC South. So if you ask yourself, honestly, what's the weakest division in football, you would say the NFC North and the AFC South. And oh yeah, by the way, the Vikings lost to the Rams twice, so this shouldn't have been a surprise. They had a good beat on what the Vikings did, and the Vikings either Sam Darnold, Kevin O'Connell, their offensive line was unable to adjust. But again, I'm I get that we have this weird thing with losing playoff quarterbacks where somehow now they just suck because they didn't have a particularly good game under duress, and you could track it like it it. I remember Kyler Murray a couple of years ago when he lost to the Rams. Part of it is the Rams are really well coached, and the Rams defensive line is actually very very good, and part of it is Sam Donald hadn't played at that level and his offensive line hadn't played at that level, and they all got a little bit exposed. But we're in the everybody wants to throw the baby out with the bathwater thing and I'm not there byer, Where are you on the the supreme negativity we've seen in some of these losing quarterbacks.
Well, I don't think it's. I think that, like the Justin Herbert situation is different from what it is with Sam Donald. And so the conversation that we had that you had yesterday about Justin Herbert, I think is completely different than the one we're having about Sam Donald. And we've had negative conversations about quarterbacks. In fact, I can almost bet that coming up on Monday, it was going to say a week for Monday, coming up on Monday, there will be a conversation either about Josh Allen or Lamar Jackson and whoever loses that game. Yes, and that is automatic book it. Lets let's put it down right now, because whoever doesn't win that game, we.
Just we just need to write negative quarterback conversation. Yes, in the a's of each hour of the show, and only thing we need to slide in is is it Lamar Jackson or is it Josh Allen.
Yeah, and that's not fair to either either player. I think that the Herbert conversation I thought was unfair. Now it doesn't matter in the world of social media. I think the Donald the conversation was just entirely in. The whole situation is entirely unique. And so I'm willing to give leeway to Justin Herbert because I felt like I've seen it more from Justin Herbert. But I don't think that Sam Donald, unfortunately is given the same leeway for a variety of reasons. And so that's why I think last night that the criticism almost in a way is or just at least the conversation Doug. I don't even want to say the criticism the conversation about Donald is different than everything and anything else because of what they did in the draft, because of what he has done and then what has transpired over the last couple of weeks.
I would agree they're very unique. It's a very unique story, and I just I think we're holding the last five years against him in one game and it's like you're waiting for You're waiting for something bad to happen. It honestly feels like what it's like to be a Charger fan in general, right, just waiting on something bad to happen, and in the second something bad happens or you gotta have bag.
Like ah ah.
I don't think I've ever and you tell me if I'm wrong, because you've been with me now for seven and a half years. I don't remember ever this year saying he's an elite top five quarterback. What I've said is he obviously was super talented. I've always loved the guy personally and how he plays, and if it's me, I would rather him be my starter at least I know his flaws. Then JJ McCarthy, who I have no idea what he looks like as an NFL quarterback.
Correct. I don't agree with your assessment, but I think that your assessment of the situation is fair. I look at it and say, I know Sam Darnold's ceiling, and so while I'm not taking the previous five years and holding before holding it against him, I feel that there is evidence enough to get an idea of who Sam Donald is and what Sam Donald is, even if these last eighteen games that he's played have been mostly very very good MVP sort of candidate. My takeaway just to tell you is that to your point about the schedule, it's correct, but it's that Sam Donald isn't good enough or special enough or will max out as a player that is enough to get you over the top in that situation. And that's why I think that you at least owe it to yourself. Whether JJ McCarthy is or isn't the answer, you at least owe it to yourself to see that through. Since he used the first round pick on him.
Well that's fair. I don't know if you have to do it next year. Again, it all depends on how much Sam Donald wants in order to stay. But again it's a fair thing to look at. And I obviously you're holding his past against him, but holding his past against him is just Hey, you feel like you have a better gauge because you have more games, you know you have you have more games to kind of go by, right, that's the we have way more tape on him. You know who Sam Donald is. That's that's kind of the overwhelming statement. And you feel like that got exposed last night. Yeah, yes, yes, Okay, I'm going to disagree, and I would if I'm the Vikings, I try and get him on the cheap, relatively cheap, and then I see if it organically becomes JJ McCarthy. But I know I have a guy who can carry us through the regular season. Okay, so let me help you with another argument.
Can I just say something on this? It's actually a question.
Yes.
Do you think that another NFL team will pay more to Sam Donald or offers Sam Donald more than what the Vikings will this offseason?
Depends what the Vikings offer.
And I think it doesn't even matter. I think they will. I think that Donald, to your point, Doug has shown enough that he is an option for another team out there, and the Viking, I don't think, because of that, will have any motivation to try to match because the price is probably just going to be higher than what they obviously just paid for him.
Yeah, I mean, I don't think he can hit the market. If he hits the market, then he's going to be gone and somebody will pay a little bit more. Okay, So can I here Here's what I like to do. Now, have we talked about this that I was on the debate in the debate club when I was in.
High school years ago.
Yes, okay, so I was in the debate club model United Nations, and I've done this for a lot of debates that if this is true, then this must be true as well. Correct. Okay, So again it's a debate style. So I do think that one thing that most people believe, and I do think it's mostly true, is what you are in the playoffs is who you really are as quarterback. Who you are in the playoffs is who you are as a quarterback. It's a lot like in life people say who you are as a drunk is who you are underneath all the surface exterior, right, which I believe. Steve Kerr says who you are as a basketball player, how you play as basketball players, how you live your life. I also think that's true, and I think a lot of people believe, including NFL people, in terms of your ceiling, how you play in the playoffs is a true determinant to how you are in life, how you are overall as a quarterback? Is that? Do you do you?
I don't go by that statement, I don't, but do people? Yes, playoffs are what matter okay, so.
And Lamar Jackson was good the other day, but it was against a foe that they should have dominated. Right, the question becomes, if we're going to have a fair conversation about Lamar Jackson and let's see what happens against Buffalo. Right to this point, he is far below that of the two time MVP status in the playoffs. And what I find to be really interesting is there's a lot of people who push back and say, like, we need to criticize these quarterbacks because people criticize Lamar Jackson. And I thought the criticism of Lamar Jackson was fair. That's fair because everybody said the same thing. He's really good, but man, he's got to throw the bell better from the pocket in the playoffs and that's what Kansas City forever had made him do, that's what other teams have made him do. So again, if you're going to use that argument, and I'm not saying you Dan, I'm saying if people are going to use the argument of who you are in the playoffs is who you really are? I think Lamar then falls way short of the MVP status, much like Darnold last night felt way short of this season's possible MVP status.
This has a lot of same energy vibes because I just I don't think it's fair to compare Sam Donald to Lamar Jackson. I don't think it's fair to Lamar Jackson.
It's not. They're not that. Lamar Jackson's far more accomplished and a far better quarterback. Right, yes, but but again again, if we're if we're comparing brass tacks.
It's the argument I know, yeah, yeah.
And I get it's a debate tactic that I was taught when I was at Tustin High School and I use it all the time, and it is a good argument, which is like, hey, if this is true, then this must be true. If it's the old transfer property, if equals being equalc, then a must equal.
See treat everybody fair, but you don't have to treat them the same. That's how I look at it, Like, in terms of how we're looking at it, I know what you're you're trying to get at, and to me, it just screams of I can read it on social media, it's not even on my screen. Have that same energy that you have for Sam Donald with Lamar Jackson if it happens. But I just don't think there. I think it's apples to oranges.
Well, I'm they're the same draft class. Lamar Jackson's been far better as a regular season quarterback. Now, He's also played for a far better organization, played for only one organization the whole time, and up until this last year, with a far better defense than he's ever played with so outside the Niners last year. So I think it's an interesting discussion. Even if I admit I was a bigger Sam Donald fan. Lamar Jackson's been the way better NFL quarterback, but there's some context that belongs to it.
Thanks for listening to The Doug Gotleb Show podcast.
Be sure to catch us live every weekday three to five Eastern twelve two Pacific on Fox Sports Radio. Find your local station for The Doug Gottlieb Show at Fox Sports Radio dot com, or stream us live every day on the iHeartRadio app by searching FSR. Let me get John millcoff on. He of course hosts Three and Out that's on the Volume podcast network. He joins us in The Doug Gottlieb Show on Fox Sports Radio. What percentage of blame for the Vikings offensive of implosion would you put on Sam Donald.
Obviously he'd bears some blame, But to me, in a playoff scenario where your coach is as highly regarded as Kevin O'Connell and he's the offensive play caller, I think he did an extremely poor job because last week he had the blueprint where his quarterback kind of got pretty rattled by pressure. And it was clear early on that the Vikings offensive line, and in fairness to them, their star left tackle Towars Knee has been out, so they got backups in there and they were getting overwhelmed. Well, the easiest way to help out a quarterback, and Donald looked again a little like the Lions game, it wasn't as much overthrown guys. So as the game went on he definitely did. It was like he was just holding onto the ball. The easiest way to help him out, like in your sport, get to the get to the basket, get some freebieus gets out run the ball and sometimes kept and O'Connell acts like, you know, he's played mad, and then he throws it all the time. And that's what they had done throughout the season and it works, but in this specific game, it was clear you're getting your guy's getting pressured. He doesn't look right, and akers busted a big run. What's his name, Kieren william or not Kieren Williams on the rams, but Aaron Jones, I think, had like a thirteen yard run. So they had a couple explosive runs. But the moment on my first down, he runs the ball and they gained one yard. He was locked to throw at the next two plays and mcveigh's guy, Chris Shula was just all over him. So I listen, everyone's gonna, you know, take a dump on Sam Narl and I get it, he's an easy one. But I bet Kevin O'Connell just refused to run the ball in the first half when the game was still closed. Now in the second half, but I think, you know, Lafleur's Kyle's you know, he's much more like McVeigh. But McVeigh has these moments where he's like, last night, I'll just be physical and we'll keep even in their past, the game was relatively simple around the line of scrimmage. Let's face, Kevin O'Connell's got like some Philadelphia Andy Reid. He wants to throw bombs and that got him in trouble last night because his offensive line was getting warped and his quarterback was kind of resorting back to and I think a lot of guys resort back to this. When you start getting hit, it really rattles you.
Yeah, nobody likes to get hit.
The other Here's the other thing, Doug one conversation is like, Okay, let's just let's Sam walk or whatever, go to JJ. Kevin O'Connell, like we just discussed, is a he loves to pass the ball. JJ McCarthy's college career was defined by a guy who did not depend on him passing the ball and running the ball and playing defense. That is not how Kevin O'Connell likes to coach. So you're going to bring this guy off an injury into an offense that let's face that he wants to throw at thirty five plus times a game and throw deep down the field. So I think it's a pretty bold move to just say, okay, we'll go to JJ, which I would say is definitely on the table now, and think that it's going to be a seamless transition.
Okay, what about what about Justin Herbert. There's a lot of criticism of Herbert after his playoff performance. How valid is that criticism?
Yeah, to me, that's one that you just go, Okay, he had a really bad game. Balls were flying on him. The one that he overthrew McConkie wasn't even that close. That's just a killer path in a moment where it just it just can't really happen. But you know, he didn't play well. But I thought Joe Allt was kind of getting worked and in sareness, like he's going up against Will Anderson, a high end top three pick, and Danelle Hunter, who they gave a two year contract to and literally guaranteed every penny at fifty million dollars total. So it's like that's that's a really really tough matchup. The other thing with the Texans, you know CJ. Stroud looked awful as well, and then that moment that that that snap, you know, he missed the snap and then he made that crazy play. He kind of turned back into last year's But it's not we acted. I bet on the Texans in that game because I was like, road playoff games are difficult, and the Chargers they do have to win a lot of games, you know, nineteen to seventeen to go on the road against the team that if the quarterback just plays, Okay, they do have a lot of high end out two pass rushers. Singley's a stud, Mixon's a really good player. Obviously, Nico Collins, well, he think of what the Chargers would do for Nico Collins. And the other thing is, and this is where coaching like this is the playoffs. Like McVeigh worked Kevin O'Connell, which isn't that big of a deal. Mcveagh's won eight playoff games. He's kind of good at what he's doing. He's probably gonna be a Hall of Famer one day. And Demiko Ryans, you know, like the younger version of Rabel. He's really good. So I think we act it looks he played that. I'm not trying to make an excuse here, but they lost to a team that the coaches viewed really highly. The quarterback went second overall. Like they lost to a team we didn't play well throughout the season but won a playoff game last year and one another playoff game this year. It's not like some random little engine that could No.
No, I think it's a great point.
Like c J.
Stroud didn't have a particularly good year right for a myriad of reasons, didn't have a particular year. Justin Herbert I thought had an outstanding year all things considered, But when they played a head to head, Justin Herbert didn't play well. CJ. Stroud played okay, and all the criticism on Justin Herbert is like, okay, but the seventeen games, what do they buy? Okay? So where are you? Dan? Byron and I had this discussion to start to show how much do we value how you play in the in the playoffs in a one game scenario versus how you play in the regular season.
Well, I think it gets the overreaction. And I'm guilty of this too, because you know, I was thinking about this state while our weekend was kind of boring. And you can't escape a boring game because it's the only game on television where when we turn on games on Sunday morning, there are anywhere from what five to eight games going at one time. So if you're having a bad game or just playing in kind of a sleepy game, people will change the channel and watch other games or have the four blocks on and not focus on you, where you kind of just get exposed in the sense of and you know, the Chargers aren't the Chiefs or the you know, the forty nine Ers or even the Jets where it feels like they're on national television all the time, at least this year. They will be next year. So I think people just he's a polarizing player because he's considered part of the Big five and the reality is he's the fifth guy and he's not on the level of the top four. And like, I will defend him that if he was available, relatives, do all the other quarterbacks not named Burrow, Allen, Mahomes and Lamar, Like, I promise you these gms and these coaches would would drive quarterback to Los Angeles to make that trade.
Stett Gottlief show here on Fox Sports Radio. If you were the Dallas Cowboys, who would you hire?
Yeah, good question. Uh, I think your options are kind of limited. I mean that's why I think Dion like it's not fake, like he's going I know, he puts out the statement yesterday, but he's gonna be tucked like it's this isn't gonna die. Mike Zimmers this guy too. I know, I thought headline Today's Demmer might retire but that's like one of his like close friends, you know, coached him in the nineties for the Cowboys, so pretty easily transition to keep him a defensive coordinator. I'm not the biggest Pat Schirmer guy, but he has an NFL coordinator as Zoc. The boom you bring him down, I would imagine Kellen Moore will be very much in the mix. I mean, that was a big time Jerry guy, and it's kind of a double whammy. If, especially the Eagles win again this week, you kind of steal him back from your division rival. But I think when you look at the names, it's hard to think. I'm like, yeah, I don't know Jerry's gonna do that. He's probably more likely, based on his history, to just hire Kellen Moore than he would be Deon Sanders or even Belichick. And listen, people can poo poo, you know the reports, and I see Lombardy going back with pro football talk, But I would say non game day with Bill, his the fighting attribute as like a as a coach was how ruthless and cutthroat he is. So this notion that he's going to have this crazy, crazy loyalty to North Carolina if he was like, damn un coach cowboys. I mean, have you guys watched the last twenty five years of his career. I mean he got rid of Tom Brady, let alone other pro bowler, star players and you know, like his best friends in the coaching business. He just cut off if he starts hating you. So I would say everything is on the table with Bill, even though I still have a hard time seeing Jerry do that. But at a two years old, I don't know if you saw the report. One thing that father Jerry was kind of the cowboy fans become an apathetic with Mike McCarthy. So that's where I think Dion might might have some juice. And Belichick obviously would too. Just give you a big, a big headline that right or wrong, We know Jerry likes that.
Yep, he definitely does like that. Joining you the best man, Thanks for joining us. Look forward to talking to you as the playoffs roll on. Remember three and ounce the podcast. It's on the Volume podcast Network. Thanks for our guest John. Thanks for listening to the Doug Gottleeb Show podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday three to five Eastern twelve two Pacific on Fox Sports Radio. Find your local station for the Doug Gottlieb Show at Fox Sports Radio dot com, or stream us live every day on the iHeartRadio app by searching FSR. Well, but you Dog Gotleep Show Fox Sports Radio. I hope you're having a great day. The Doug Gotleep Show broadcast live from the tyrech dot Com studios tyrt dot com. Woull we get there on match selection, fast free shipping, free road as protection, over ten thousand recommended stallars, tyright dot com sway tire buying should be welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome in. It feels like this is like a yearly debate that we've had for the past couple of years. The Pittsburgh Steelers have had three coaches in the modern era, right three coaches Chuck Nole, Bill Kower, Mike Tomlin, and Mike Tomlin continued his streak of not having a losing season. But they collapsed down the stretch and they played good teams down the stretch and were summarily dusted out of the playoffs by the Baltimore Ravens. We'll leading some to go. Hey, time for a change. You know, sometimes messages just go stale. There was a certain lifeless nature to the Steelers, and some of it. Some people will blame it on Tomlin on his act getting stale. I have a different perspective on it. I'll share with you one second. Here's Mike Tomlin earlier today Exit Interviews talking about the criticism of his job.
But I understand the nature of what it is that we do, the attention and criticism that comes with it. As a matter of fact, I embrace it, to be quite honest with you, I enjoy the urgency that comes with what I do and what we do.
I don't make.
Excuses for failure.
I own it.
But I also feel like I'm capable, and so as long as I'm afforded an opportunity to do that, I will continue. But I certainly understand their frustrations, and probably more importantly than that, I share.
It stug Gotlieb show here on Fox Sports Radio. Okay, So I'll just give you my perspective. I don't think the lifelessness of the Pittsburgh Steelers is based upon a lack of quality messaging or reception to the messaging of Mike Tomlin. They don't have a quarterback good enough to win them games, and we discussed this at length. Their quarterback play wasn't good enough in the regular season, why would anybody think it'd be good enough in the postseason. I mean, really, Ben Roethlisberger's last year, they haven't had good enough quarterback play. And it's nothing short of a miracle and the best most really the most competitive division in football. And I know the Browns weren't good this year, but the Steelers were good, the Bengals were talented, especially offensively, and the Ravens are always very good. To consistently find a way to be out an above five hundred, especially with how very average for the last half decade, maybe below average the quarterback play has been. I think that's a sign of great coaching. I get it. I understand everybody has. It comes to a run, comes to an end. But considering they had Justin Fields, who nobody really wanted in the NFL to be a starter, and Russell Wilson, who nobody wanted an NFL to be a starter, and those are his two starters this year, and he found a way to win, you know, double digit games. I just have a hard time finding fault with Mike Tomlin. His coaching staff and his messaging, get a better quarterback, and let's really see what he can do. I feel like George Pickens is a malcontent because of his act. I actually understand some of it because he hasn't played with a good quarterback. But George Pickens is a mal content. I don't know. I'm just I'm not a move on from Tomlin guy. And I do understand the idea of, hey, well maybe if he goes somewhere else Raiders Cowboys, he gets a fresh start. I don't think that's the Steeler way. I think find problem, fixed problem. That's the Steeler way, and I think they keep him as I think they should. You can't judge Mike Tomlin on his aptitude as a coach when he has a starting, starting quarterback in the last four years that are below the level of everybody else in the playoffs, and that's what he's had, that's what he's dealt with. You can tell me that Russell Wilson's been to two Super Bowls, won a Super Bowl before it for the Denver thing, was a Hall of famer. I don't know if he's a Hall of Famer now, but the fact is nobody wanted Russell Wilson, Nobody got bought out and working for peanuts. The Broncos are paying that, paying for him to play for the Steelers, and they're all sitting there nodding their head as they drafted bow Nicks, who's really good and Russell Wilson just doesn't have it anymore. Bayer, do you believe that it's time to move on for my comma?
Well, Doug, I am happy to tell you that on December fifteenth of twenty twenty four, I proclaim Mike Tomlin to be the NFL Coach of the Year. They lost to the Eagles that day and they didn't win a game the rest of the season, so maybe I didn't have the greatest timing in the world with that proclamation. I find it very I find the situation obviously unique, but also very difficult. I am on the side now that I do think a change needs to be made. I feel that your arguments are completely one hundred percent fair, and I think any knee jerk organization would have fired Tomlin three years ago. If that was the case, that's not who the Steelers are. You mentioned the loyalty with Chuck Noll and Bill Kauer. They're just not going to do that. And I think that they recognize that they haven't served Mike Tomlin in the best way at the quarterback position. So I understand all of that, but I look at it as a fan, as a fan of the Pittsburgh Steelers, and for as great as their glory days were, and let's be honest, a lot of the fans today were enjoying those glory days when they were a kid. I know what it was like with the Seahawks, and when the Seahawks through the interception at the one yard line to lose Super Bowl forty nine to the New England Patriots. It was year after year after year of just mediocre miss they were good enough to make the playoffs. There was maybe one year where I thought maybe they had a chance, but they were never like a top team in the National Football League despite what their record said. They had a twelve and four season during the COVID year, but they lost in the wild card round to the Rams. It was Dougie was so stale, and so when Pete Carroll was let go last year. I don't know if this past year rivaled any of those other seasons, but it was a fresh start. And I think that if you're a Steelers fan, as much as you love Mike Tomlin and love everything with it as a fan, you probably just want a fresh start.
The question is if you're gonna let Mike Tomlin go, who replaces him? Sure, because it is very much like a new pope, because it's not an organization that if you make the wrong call, they're going to make a change in a year or two.
It'd be the most coveted job in the NFL.
Yes, absolutely, absolutely, And I guess the real question is, you know, if you're going to do that, you better have a real plan for who that's going to be.
But I think if let's just say Ben Johnson is the top guy, because if that stealer's job opens up, absolutely I'm looking at that job for just every reason that there is. Even though there isn't a quarterback there, Maybe there's a way where you work and figure it out how to deal with it. The other problem with it, Doug is you said everything was accurate. The tough part about it that I see is it looks like they're addressing their quarterback problem by taking Kenny Pickett in the first round like they did a few years ago. It's just not I think that realistic to think that taking a quarterback like at twenty is going to help or is going to be a game changer. I'm not saying that every quarterback in the National FOOTBA League has to be a top one, two three pick. You move on from him more quickly. There's it's honestly more of a crap shoot. I think what you would see in the National Football League. They may be a team that just needs to pick in the top five once.
No, yeah, they have that. They have the problem that the Packers had, and that's why the Packers moved up to draft Jordan love right because they felt like they will never be in the top five. So there's a guy who we felt like slipped and we can sit for a couple of years and develop. And that's what the Packers did, and Steet has never been able to do that. I completely agree with you. And now it feels like they're on the retread thing, which they were on the retread thing before with Tommy Maddox right at the Tommy maximum before they got Ben Roethlisberger. But they're in that quarterback a basins. I do understand, like you don't want this to be the that Don Shula era was ended much like this as well. Right like Don Shula, that thing was definitely a whimper at the end, and many people considered Don Shula the greatest coach of all time before you know, the last couple of years. And for Tomlin, it's not crazy to think, hey, maybe he needs a fresh starter, or maybe do TV for a year and then pick it out, or maybe go to the Cowboys. But I don't know. Again, I know, you can't keep a guy in a job just because you fear trying to replace that guy. But this is a place where they don't just replace coaches. And I think you know, you have a new, a fairly new gentle manager who his signature moment is picking a quarterback who's no longer on the roster now plays for the Eagles as their backup. And I'm sure there's a little gun shyness in that. Do we really want to make that change? Since, yeah, we got to pick a new coach and this way, you know, if nothing else, we had the loyalty and we know we're gonna win ten games.
Here's my other thing with Tom and I'm not saying that dismissing him as fair or treating him well or right. But I'm gonna have Sam play with Kirk kerb Street again said on the broadcast on Saturday. Jason Stewart played it yesterday in Our Love and Hate. But for those that missed it, I think this is pretty intriguing. This was Kirk kerb Street's analysis on the Amazon broadcast.
A game like this a chess match.
It's a cliche, but this is a chess matcher two grand masters.
If I were a Steelers fan, I think that we're concerned. Me just watching this first half, you're in the post Cason, You're getting dominated. I don't see any fight. I don't see any any pushback. It's one thing that lose XO is against a really talented of offense. But where the hell is the fight? This is the Pittsburgh Steelers. Yeah, there's nothing.
And that is that was most concerning because I think that's reflective of Tomlin. He's your head coach. It's Arthur Smith's offense. It's Treel Austin's defense, even though Tomlin's the defensive guy. If you will, it was Dick Lebo's defense for all those years. Tomlin is the guy bringing the emotion. Tomlin is the guy sparking a fire. And if you can't to the to the point of get up for a division rival in a wild card game and come out flat, I just wonder on how much is Tomlin's voice falling flat in the locker room.
I think it's fair.
You know.
My thing is I just I think Russell Wilson has that effect on teams. I really do. I really do. And I could be blaming Russell Wilson for something he has nothing to do with. But that was what it felt like at the end of the Seahawks era. That's what it felt like in the two years in Denver where guys are just over it and when your quarterback just doesn't he actually drives people to roll their eyes. It's really hard for any coach, any coach, to do anything about it. Now, think back to that last year with the Seahawks brom when he came back from the thumb injury. How lifeless the Seahawks were. He went very good, and they weren't. They were lifeless, you know. And I mean, I don't hate this ever say I told you so, but I did tell you so that their quarterback was on their roster, and I thought that was ultimately their undoing. And you know, it's like, look at the Broncos. Had they made some other changes, sure, but everybody believed Sean Payton can coach, and what to do. He moved in a rookie and moved out Russell Wilson and they're in the playoffs.
It's funny because when we talk about drafting quarterbacks, so when they drafted Ben Roethlisberger in two thousand and four, he was eleven overall, so not a top five, but eleven overall. I can remember if he was ten or eleven that year, and it was eleventh. The only time since then that they have picked lower was in twenty nineteen when they picked tenth, so one spot lower. Otherwise, it's been a bunch of twenty two, twenty five, seventeen, fifteen. One year they took Kenny Pickett at twenty, they had twenty this past year. It's just a bunch of that. And you know, we saw six quarterbacks go in the in the draft in the first twelve picks last year, and Steelers said no chance at any of them.
You know, it's interesting, what if I told you that, like the Ben Roethlisberger story will probably never happen again. Remember, like he started only one year in high school. He was a tight end before that, but three years at my Ohio and then he went pro his third year. But now after the first year, but definitely after the second year, he hits a transfer portal when he goes to a major school and he probably stays in school a couple ext of years. Yeah, and then the idea that a guy that big and that strong goes at eleventh in the draft like he did in two thousand and three. Yeah, they just they don't. They don't last that long in the draft. It's really really interesting. I mean that said brock Purty, Mister irrelevant was around the draft a couple of years ago, and here he is, but again before the transfer portal. It's gonna be interesting to see how many quarterbacks are built because anybody who's borderline, anybody who's a fifth to undrafted guy is staying in school and making way more money as a college quarterback. So yeah, again, I'm just out of fire. Tomlin guy. I have lots of friends who are Steelers people, and they're like, over it. I just think it's the Russell Wilson effect.
I think it's just too much to just put on Russ's shoulders for this, like there's it's been too long. Yeah, I felt it under the Peak Carroll era and listen, this year, Doug was ten and seven, no different than really any of the other Peak Carroll seasons from that Super Bowl, but it felt different. It was new, it was new people. You know, there are still mistakes. Seahawks fired their offensive coordinator, are looking for a new one. So it's not that everything was perfect, but it was different and that wasn't necessarily a bad thing. And I think as a Steelers fan, everything that has lined up coaching wise and what has done will point to Tomlin keeping his job. And as a fan, I think it's probably gotten pretty stale in Pittsburgh