Hour 2 - Rep. Tom McClintock

Published Jan 13, 2025, 8:15 PM
CA Congressman Tom McClintock explains how bad policy served as kindling for the LA fires. When and why CA started to decline. Jack Smith news.

Welcome back in Clay Travis buck Sexton show.

Appreciate all of you hanging out with us.

We've been talking about what I think is just a scary situation, but also a sign of what can happen when you begin to reverse progress. When you go from as Congressman Tom McClintock points out, driving down in a massive way the amount of wildfire acres that are being consumed in California, and then you start to reverse all the policies that had helped to make that such a huge success. And we're joined now by the author of that Wall Street Journal editorial, Congressman Tom McClintock from the fifth Congressional District in California. Congressman Clintock, appreciate you coming on with us. Great peace this morning. How frustrating is it to you look at the data and do your deep dive on what's been going on with California wildfires? As you lay out, this is a historical reality, four and a half million, on average acres a year have burned since the fifteen hundreds in California. Due to smart policies, that number gets driven back down to two hundred and fifty thousand and then as you lay out, new decisions are made that reverse many of those successful policies. And here we are California can't put out a fire, and there are a lot more of them than there used to be.

Well, exactly right. Fire is how nature gardens, and nature's allows e gardener. If you doubt that for a second, just leave your own alone for a few years and tell me what it's going to look like. Nature removes excess growth by catastrophic fire. Beginning in the twentieth century, we adopted policies to do the gardening ourselves. We auctioned off excess timbered logging companies who actually paid us to remove the excess. We leased public lands to cattle and sheep ranchers to suppress brush growth through grazing. In the Santa Monica Mountains above Malibu, I remember as a kid back sheep herders used to graze tens of thousands of heads of sheep every year to keep the brush under control. We used herbicides to keep brush from residential areas. We put out fires before they could explode out of control. And as you pointed out, fire losses went from the historic average of about four and a half million acres in California to a fairly steady quarter of a million acres. But then we adopted these leftist environmental laws in the nineteen seventies that have made permitting for these practices endlessly time consuming, ultimately cost prohibitive, and so not a lot of it gets done. We still had fires in those days, but they were a fraction of the intensity that we see the day. And now what we're seeing is not a new normal, we're simply seeing the old normal return. In twenty twenty, we were back up to about four and a half million acres destroyed by fire. And that is a choice that we made when we adopted laws that have made it impossible to manage our lands.

How frustrating is that to not only you but other Californians who have lived through the process. Boy, we're making really good decisions when it comes to limiting these wildfires. And then this is often, as you know, much of this is circular.

You start to have that success and people say.

Well, maybe we don't need to do this anymore, and the environmentalists and the climate change people make these changes, and now they're arguing, and I'm sure you're already seeing this well, this is a natural consequence of climate change, as opposed to a natural consequence of many of the choices that they made in an effort to try to combat climate change.

Well, here's the problem with their argument is he referenced Cabrio dropped anchor in San Pedro Bay. It was the autumn of fifteen forty two. That's the height of the Santa Ana fire season. He promptly named it the Bay of Smoke. So fires fanned by these seasonal sant Ana winds are nothing new. And by the way, when Juan Cabrio observed those fires off the coast of California in fifteen forty two, it was the height of the Little Ice Age, when temperatures were at their lowest in ten thousand years. And it also doesn't explain this. You can literally go up in a helicopter and you can often tell the difference between the public lands they're subject to these environmental laws and the private lands that are not, just by the condition of the forests on each side of the line. So we have to ask ourselves how clever are the climate to know the exact boundary lines between the public and private lands and only decimate the public ones.

So what is the solution here in your mind? And how frustrating is.

It that, Well, let me go back to the solution, because I think you'll get to that. But how frustrating is it that basically the government of Los Angeles and certainly the state government of California we're talking about the fifth largest economy in the world, and that they not only have lost the ability to help prevent these fires based on public policy decisions, but also lost the ability to even put the fires out. I would argue, Congressman that maybe the number one goal and responsibility of any government on its most basic level is when people's homes are burning, we should be able to put them out. California can't even do that. Los Angeles area right now?

Yes, well, who hasn't, just said doctor Johnson said, when a man is to be hanged in the morning, it focuses attention remarkably. Well, you know, maybe this is something that will focus the attention of the people of California on the people they've been electing now for forty or fifty years. And by the way, it's not just California. Some of the worst of these environmental laws are federal that we're imposed in the nineteen seventies. But it comes down to a simple question that elections matter because they determined public policy, and public policy matters because that determines our fundamental safety and quality of life as human beings.

So what's the solution in your mind? Let's pretend that Californians actually made a good decision. And I loved your piece in the Wall Street Journal, and I think the Wall Street Journal for publishing it, you for writing it. What would you do looking forward? Okay, we have to try to limit the amount of wildfires. You're never going to completely eliminate them, because, as you mentioned, this is a natural condition of southern California from time immemorial, or at least since we've had recorded history of the La area. From a European perspective, what should happen from if you were given a magic wand and they said you're in charge of fixing this and trying to limit this going forward, what's the right solution?

This is not theoretical discussion, because we already know what works. We've practiced it for for much of the twentieth century. Every year we would send out foresters to the to the National Force. It would mark off excess timber, and then we would auction that timber off to logging companies to remove they would pay us to remove it. Of the same thing with leasing public lands of you know, the BLM right now leases of most of its public lands across the country for about a buck fifty ahead for cattle in California's twenty five dollars. So obviously nobody leases land for grazing. So you have this huge build up of brush. You know, all of that excess brush and all of that excess timber is going to come out one way or the other. It's going We're either going to carry it out or nature is going to burn it out. So you know, go back to the policies that work. Scientific management of the forests worked remove the excess before it can choke off the forest or before it can build up as brush when nature comes to burn it out. That's the fundamental issue in all of this is scientific management of the lands. We can signed our lands to a condition of benign neglect because the environmental left promise that would improve the forest and brush land environment. Well, I think we're entitled to ask, now, after fifty years of experience with these laws, how are they working, And the answer is damning is going up in smoke all around us. We've lost about a quarter of our national forests to catastrophic fire in the last ten years. That's the effect of these new environmental policies. And what we've found out is that benign neglect is not so benign.

How frustrating is it as a Californian. I don't know if you heard any of the first hour of the program, but I've spent a lot of time in California. I mean, there's a strong argument that California as America's Garden of Eden. You just laid out, we're not trying to do anything that hasn't worked before. It's not like you're coming out and saying, hey, we need to take some radical moves to try and adjust this. California made a lot of great decisions. It's why the state grew and flourished into the fifth largest economy in the world. It now feels to me, and I'm curious if you feel this on the ground, like all of that incredible wealth and all of those good decisions are now being left behind in favor of radical, anti growth and frankly destructive policies. For many of the people living there. For someone like you, how incredibly frustrating is that, Well, it's.

Not just frustrating, it's heartbreaking. You look at California. We have the most equitable climate in the entire Western hemisphere. We have the most bountiful natural resources anywhere in the continent of the United States. We're poised on the Pacific rim in a position to dominate a world trade for the next century. And yet if you look the census data, you will find that there is a unprecedented exodus of Californians leaving the state, and one of the two of the most popular destinations are Nevada and Arizona. Now think, I cannot imagine an act of God that could do so much damage to this beautiful state as to cause people to find a better place to live and work and raise their families out in the middle of the Nevada Nuclear test range. No active God can do that that I can think of. But active government can do that much damage, and they have. And so now people are voting with their feet and leaving this beautiful state. And the only thing that's changed in the state is public policy. And the good news is we can't control acts of God, but active government we can change the moment we summon the political will to do so. So far we haven't summoned that will. But maybe this is a catalyst to get people to start rethinking their whole world view about the people they've been electing in California for the past fifty years. And hopefully it's a wake up call to the federal government as well to begin changing some of these federal policies that have contributed to this disaster.

We're talking to Congressman Tom McClintock. Last question for you, Congressman. I get a lot of questions, and we had a caller just at the end of the last hour about California's failure to capture much of the rain that actually falls in California, particularly southern California. I've spent a lot of time there, anybody who has. When the rain comes, and it doesn't come in a consistent fashion, it often arrives all of a sudden. You can stand and watch all of this bounteous fresh water just roaring right out into the Pacific Ocean, never claimed. How does that get fixed and how's that been allowed to continue to occur?

Well, I assert on the Water and Power Subcommittee's chairman for several years, and what I learned in those years is droughts are nature's fault. They happen, but water shortages are our fault. Water shortages are a choice we made when we had up to the same environmental laws that have made the management of our public lands all but impossible. They've also made the construction of new dams and reservoirs all but impossible. California, of just precipitation alone produces about forty five hundred gallons of fresh water every day for every man or woman and child in the state. The problem is it's unevenly distributed over time and distance. We used to build dams to store water from wet years to move it to dry years. We used to build aqueducts to move water from wet regions to dry regions. That same environmental left movement destroyed our ability to do that. So we haven't constructed a major dam over a million acre feet in California since nineteen seventy nine. Well, the population's more than double. So it all comes back to a choice that we have made through the policies that we've enacted by the people.

We have elected Congressman. Fantastic editorial.

I appreciate you coming on and talking with all of our audience that has been so frustrated by so much of what you've laid out. We need to get you on again, but appreciate you fighting the right battle and hopefully public policy, as you said, can be corrected in California, because it wasn't very long ago when the state was making a lot of great decisions.

Yes, exactly right, as someday it will again.

I pray Congressman Tom McLintock from the fifth Congressional District in California. We appreciate the time I shared that editorial. Encourage all of you to go read it fantastic this morning in the Wall Street Journal. Look, you can switch your cell phone service to pure Talk right now from your current cell phone service and save as much as one thousand bucks a year, same quality, five G nationwide service because Puretalk is on the same towers and network as one of the big wireless companies. The only difference is you don't have to pay anywhere near as much. In fact, you don't have to spend anywhere near those one hundred plus dollar bills. You can spend thirty five dollars a month with pure Talk, get unlock limited talk, text fifteen gigs of data with a mobile hotspot. A family of four can save one thousand dollars a year with Puretalk, and you can do it at the end of the year. That's an extra thousand dollars in your pocket. It's easy to switch. All you have to do is dial Pound two five zero. Say the keywords Clay and Buck again from your cell phone. Dial pound two five zero say Clay and Buck. You'll save an additional fifty percent off your first month with Puretalk, America's wireless company.

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Welcome back in Clay, Travis Buck Sexton Show. Appreciate all of you hanging out with us. Ted in Oakdale, California. You say, the last damn built in California was all the way back in nineteen sixty nine.

Uh, and you worked on some of those Tell me about it.

I worked on an irrigation dam system above that lake. But in nineteen sixty nine, the new Maloney's Dam was built and had held about two point two million acre feet of water. But that was the last dam ever built in California, and at that time, the above ground reservoir storage was four hundred and two million acre feet of water for California. In the last forty five years, the population of California has almost tripled, but not one drop of storage has increased. It is still four hundred and two million acre feet of water.

That's crazy, that is crazy. I mean, so since nineteen sixty nine.

I guess that's what fifty five years, basically right to your point, the population of California has basically tripled and the ability of California to store water has not changed at all. And I'm assuming that's an environmentalist opposition to the idea of damning and what it might do to the natural world community.

I assume that past resolution voting resolution a few years back, and it created a government body, a water could Quality Control Board, which is appointed by the government. So you can imagine who he appoints for that thing. And I have gone to seminars or know about seminars that they have been at and actually said there will never be another dam built in California as long as they are in control.

Thank you for the call. Again, I think Congressman made a good point. These decisions have real consequences, and it's easy, and when I come back, I'll play it for you, because I do think it's important that you understand their talking points, which are we're not going to examine any of the decisions we made that have created this awful situation in Los Angeles. They're just going to blame climate change. They're just going to say throw up their hands and say, well, this is a result of temperature changing. No, it's not at all. In fact, it's a direct result of the policy choices they have made. And I'm not even talking about it's a great call. I'm not even talking about just the recent DEI policy choices. I'm talking about not storing the water that lands in California. I'm talking about reversing generations of policy that had driven down the number of acres of burning to two hundred and fifty thousand before we returned all the way back to the policy where we now have basically the same amount that.

We had before. It's crazy.

Look last month I was in Israel and it was an incredible trip, a chance to experience, unfortunately, everything that happened on October seventh, and also deal with the challenges that Israel has to face every single day. There's now growing optimism that we may see a ceasefire in Gaza. We've got one with Hezbola in the north, but man I saw all over that country the impact of the International Fellowship of Christians and Jews providing food, shelter, safety to Jews in Israel and around the world, including remaining Holocaust survivors who need help. Your donation today can help the IFCJ continue their important work, and through your gift, you can also show you stand with the Jewish people against anti Semitism and hatred. Go to SUPPORTIFCJ dot org and join me in donating to them. Support IFCJ dot org. Welcome back in Clay Travis buck Sexton show. Some breaking news by the way, that I think is probably not going to matter that much, but will get probably a decent amount of attention for the next twenty four hours or so. There's going to be a release of the jack Smith Report, and that Jack Smith Report is probably going to say, oh, Donald Trump is the most evil dictator who's ever lived in the history of mankind. Also, it's almost all going to have been publicly written before by the Wall Street Journal, sorry, by the New York Times and the Washington Post. So I don't think there's going to be anything of any compelling nature there. But this is a report that Jack Smith wrote. We should mention that Jack Smith has also announced his resignation and that that is underway, meaning that that probably he will be released. I don't know exactly what the timeframe is going to be, but in short order, relatively speaking, that is going to be released. By the way, Buck still on his way. I'm told South Florida is basically locked down in terms of traffic. He was texting me a little bit earlier that there are he lives in South Florida, and he's now he's back.

He has made it in.

He is pulling into the studio there, so we will be talking with him shortly. Let me play the audio that I tease that I was going to play I think a little bit ago. We're talking about the awful decision. I'll let Buck react as he buckles into his seat and gets everything up and running there. We're talking about the awfulness of the mayor and the governor in California. It's also worth noting that they lie, and they're actually getting called on some of the lies.

We discussed the fact that.

Karen Bass was in Ghana in Africa, and what in the world sense does that make for her to have been there when all of these fires were breaking out. But she pledged that she would not travel internationally if she were elected, and this is her being called out for that. This is cut ten. Even on Morning Joe, they are talking about Karen Bass saying she wouldn't travel internationally. In addition to Ghana, Buck she went to the Olympics four different times from LA four times.

But listen to this.

The New York Times this morning, reporting in their lead story mounting criticism of Bass threatens grip on leadership, talking about the mayor, and it writes the mayor told the Times that if she was elected mayor, not only would I of course live here, but I would also not travel internationally. The only places I would go DC, Sacramento, San Francisco, and New York.

In relation to LA and The.

Times rights, that pledge has been spectacularly broken.

The National Weather Service had warned that these winds did present a real fire danger that she knew that was overseas.

Anyway, so buck she claims she wouldn't travel to me like as bad as Ghana is going to the Olympics four times in Paris.

You couldn't have gone for just a few days.

I don't even know how that's possible that she would need to make four different trips to Paris. I mean, I can understand why somebody would want to go if they were going on the dime of the government, but this is just emblematic of failed leadership.

Well, I appreciate you holding down the fork by the way, Clay, that was the most heinous traffic situation. It took me four hours to go about sixty miles, so I've never they shut down ninety five going north entirely. It's a six lane highway. There was a fatal, a double accident, a fatal accident, everything shut down, and I just got stuck right in the middle of it. So anyway, a completed utter mess this morning. Thank you for holding everything down. As for Karen Bass, here's the thing. If you're doing a great job, you get leeway right when when you are somebody who's talent in leadership far out weighs your baggage or perhaps some of your you know, your your personal prerogatives that you are taking with travel. Then that's one thing. But Los Angeles has got a lot of problems that have predated Karen Bass and gotten worse under her tenure. So I think it's very understandable for people to say, hold on a second, why are we paying for you to travel internationally as a mayor? And there really is not a good, a good reason for this, right. I know that they come up with some reason, some rationale for it. The thing's kind of funny you think about Mayor Eric Adams being federally prosecuted for upgrades to his flights. Meanwhile, it's a standard operating procedure for a mayor of another large city to go on what are effectively boondoggles. And she got look also, to go all the way to Ghana. That's a very far flight. Right, It's one thing to go to Mexico or Canada. I think we can understand that, you know, near neighbors, you know, border a border with California obviously in Mexico. To go to West Africa, though, is too much, and given what's gone on here, I think people have every right to be incredibly frustrated with what they're seeing. And I think at some level, Clay, this is part of the of the reckoning that those who have the ability to see results and view them as such are deeply frustrated with the Democrat governance, the far left Democrat governance model that has played out in a number of places. I know you were talking. I got to listen to the whole show on my way in excellent Joba, by the way. I was like, this is a great radio show this guy is doing here.

But that's super frustrating when you're supposed I've had that happen a few times when you're supposed to be on your own show and you have to listen to it while you're driving because you or there's some sort of cluster that is not allowing you to be there. And yes, but so I'm glad that. I'm glad reception in your car.

Was good on the trap call in on the cell phone routine, by the way, something that every every true radio host at some point has had to do that one, you know, where your cell phone is the best thing you can get connectivity with so anyway, I think that the back to the the recognition that that people are having right now about California. It plays into the larger theme of people don't want incompetent governance when it affects them, you know. And I think in a lot of cases you've seen it took longer than anticipated. In San Francisco, they were willing to put up with even more deterioration than I would have guessed. Right, it really had to get to the point where, you know, Twitter headquarters has to move, people can't be in downtown without being harassed, and you know cars are broken, star football.

Players getting shot in Union Square, I mean in broad daylight in order.

To get a new mayor. And we'll see how the new mayor does, right, And so you've seen this trend happening. And look, you have to also remember this hasn't been happening in places that have a more conservative model of governance. Show me the equivalent of a place that has been more even just more down the center, never mind more right wing or more republican, where there's been a rapid deterioration that you can point to those policies as the basis for it. You know, we've been talking about the trends in crime for a long time and how things got so safe that people decided, you know what, let's just sort of see if we rip what happens. You know, what's going to be the reality of crime if we are not enforcing it with the same enforcing the law the way that we had been. This is also the case with red tape and bureaucracy. And you've noticed Gavin Newsom has come forward now and said, oh, I'm gonna get rid of I'm gonna get rid of so much of this red tape. You want to ask why is it there in the first place? Right, who put it there in the first place. The answer is Gavin Newsom and the Coastal Commission and these other entities. But also why can't they understand that they make everything worse with no attendant benefit. That's the thing about all the climate change legislation and you know regulations they have in California. It's not even like there's a trade off. It's just bad meaning it just makes things slower, more expensive, and more frustrating for people who live there. For the make believe benefit of lowering global temperature, which California has absolutely no prayer of affecting whatsoever, no matter you know, how big their economy is. So I think that people are seeing this now with fresh eyes, and there's been a red pilling effect that we shouldn't underestimate.

I talked years ago with a CEO of a successful media company, and he said things were going so well at this point in time that he said, even when I made good even when I made poor choices, the results still turned out well. And I think for a long time that's what's happened with California. They have lived for a couple of generations in this idea that there are consequence free policy choices that they make. A guy who just called in and said they haven't built a new dam since nineteen sixty nine. I mean, that's crazy, right, the congressman saying like, hey, we got the fires down to two hundred and fifty thousand acres, the consequences didn't show up for so long, Buck, that's your point.

They thought, hey, we can do whatever we want.

We can spend time on all these ribble as things that don't really matter, and the actual core infrastructure, which should be the focus of government, doesn't matter.

Well, this is this is a I would argue a hallmark historically of left wing ideology, including I know this is taking a bit far, but communist ideology it takes a while for them, or socialist ideology takes a while for them to ruin things. And in the meantime, and I saw this very clearly in New York City. Build a Blasio kept saying crime is so low, crime is at this all time low. You don't believe what you're hearing about, how it's getting more dangerous in the streets. And then COVID and then all of a sudden everyone realized, oh my gosh, the city trajectory has gone toward degeneracy, chaos, more crime, more more disorder, and just more dysfunction. You know, it's like bankruptcy. It hadn't happened slowly then suddenly, you know the old YUK Same thing with the Democrat takeover of the state of California overall. Remember Reagan was the governor of California. It's worth this. I know you did a bunch of the history history going back to the Spanish. The Spanish super fascinating, right.

I mean, people like to claim, oh it's climate change, causing these fires. Actually, they've existed there throughout before your peak, right, I mean.

It's stuck in my car. I'm like, this is a great history deep dive we got got here. I'm enjoying. It kept me sane when I was punching my steering wheel. But the truth is that California became America, America's paradise. While it was a at least center right, if not Republican state, it wasn't until the nineties. And by the way, mass illegal immigration was a huge part of this that it became a one party state, a Democrat one party state. And at that point it had two of the greatest wealth generation industries in the history of the plant well one probably the greatest other than maybe the oil industry, which is Silicon Valley. And between Silicon Valley and Hollywood you have these giant ATM machines that now the left has taken over and they can find a lot. Peter Thiel had a really good way of putting this, I think it was on the on the Rogan Joe Rogan's podcast. He said, it's a little bit like Saudi Arabia that they have a radical religion, but because they have so much money coming out of the ground, they can make a lot of stupid policies and stupid decisions and get away with things. Right. It's not a very nice way of talking with Saudi Arabia, but you know, that's the that's the basic idea. California is somewhat similar. California was so rich, so prosperous, so blessed as a state that it took democrats a long time to create the degree of dysfunction where you now have the outflow. But now you're there, right, it's it's they went bank not that it's bankrupt, but you know, they went bankrupt slowly, then suddenly now all of a sudden, everyone recognizes what's going on. I shouldn't say everybody. There's still people who you know, they're never going to go. They this is their place, and I understand that. But I'm telling you I have friends, you know. I was talking to a friend of mine who just used to live in la We had coffee over the weekend, Clay, and he was saying, so many of his friends who were kind of the way I was in New York, which is, no matter what happens, I'm never leaving. This has actually pushed them over the edge. This is now an event that has gone too far for them. And you know, while you're seeing these situations play out, you know, remember when my family, my in laws were hit by that hurricane, we were able to speak to them in real time during that disaster thanks to rapid radios rapid radios. When you need an emergency, real time push to talk method of communication between you and family that's secure, rapid radios is incredible. These are walkie talkies but with the latest tech, so you get all the benefit and convenience of a walkie talkie like system, but you can speak nationwide to somebody else on their rapid radio. So natural disasters, for example, you want to be able to talk in real time. Rapid radios are so helpful, super easy to use. Go online. Get some today. I've got them for my family. You should have them for yours. Go to rapid radios dot com. You'll get up to sixty percent off, free ups shipping from Michigan, plus a free protection bag. That's rapid radios dot Com. At Code Radio you get an extra five percent off. So go to rapid radios dot com for sixty percent off and at code radio get an extra five percent off two.

Guys walk up to a mic eight anything goes Clay, Travis and Fuck Sex to find them on the free iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcast.

All right, welcome back into Clay and Vock. And I got to tell you one thing that was keeping me saying and keep me company. I had a little cup of Crocketcoffee as I was inching along, ninety five inching along, watching watching the tumbleweeds blow past me faster than I was driving for a few hours there. Yes, Crocketcoffee dot com. Absolutely delicious. We've got the gear up now at Crocket Coffee dot com. Go check it out. The hoodies are so comfortable you will love them. The T shirt they've got women's cut as well. Crockett Gear fantastic. Plus if you use code Code Book when you go to subscribe, Clay will send you a signed copy of American Playbook. Highly highly recommend you go take advantage of that while you can. Company is growing thanks to all of you. It's been a tough day for the buckster. So let's run up some fantastic numbers on Krockett today. Shalli, that would be that would be to help me instead of like the worst start of the week on the highway imaginable. It would be nice to actually have some Crockett sales through the roof today everybody, so stepan Plus it's delicious and I was drinking it all morning, so Crockettcoffee dot com.

At what point did you realize how long should the drive take?

Oh? I left two hours for a drive that should take an hour, and it took me four. So at what point did you realize that you were screwed?

Like?

Did you when you left? Were you aware it was bad? Or or were you like on the way.

And then that's an awful feeling when your app updates or whatever, and it goes from like you'll be there in like twenty four minutes, you'll be there in two hours and forty minutes you're like, no, is exactly what happened.

I was looking at my phone, I'm on the highway, I see a slow down, and all of a sudden it says I was supposed to be in the radio studio by eleven am Eastern and uh and it says you're gonna arrive in like two and a half hours. I couldn't I couldn't believe. And then I you know, and then I'm getting like our friends here on WJ and O at the traffic and weather folks are reaching out to me like, oh man, do you know about this? I'm like, oh do I know? I am living it right now. So yeah. And then you whenever you see the choppers by the way up at like went out a good something aren't moving, you know that's that's bad, bad situation. So yeah, anyway, you.

Know, on some level, I don't know, I've thought about this a lot because I use and many of you who drive around in cities you use ways or you use your Google app or whatever else, because you know you don't know when traffic's going to emerge. It used to be that you just when you get a traffic jam, you had no idea how long it might last. Right. Yeah, Now you get the information, but it's like infuriating because you get it in real time, right, Like you're sitting there and you're like, I don't know. Back in the day, you might be like, oh, this might only last like fifteen minutes, and you really have no idea.

Now you're like, oh, this is gonna be two and a half. Is it better to or I don't know. I don't know.

It used to be frustrating. You know, they can give you different routes. The problem you have is your one route is the ocean, so like, there aren't that many ways you can go in depending on what part of the country you're in when there's traffic, and that is super frustrating.

I don't know. I used to want to know the info.

Now, when you know you're gonna be stuck in traffic for hours, it's just like such a defeating feeling to be hitting refresh on your phone and know there's nothing to say to you, but you're there now, and we're to get the third hour.

We'll have some fun here.

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