Oscar-nominated documentarian Rory Kennedy joins the Chuck Toddcast to discuss Freefall: A Reckoning for Boeing, her Netflix follow-up to 2022's Downfall premiering August 19th — a film built around the death of whistleblower John Barnett and the current and former employees who came forward after it. Kennedy's central finding is damning in its simplicity: at the end of Downfall, Boeing swore it had learned its lesson and changed its ways. It hadn't. More incidents followed, whistleblowers reached out to tell her conditions had actually gotten worse, and she says she believes Boeing bears responsibility for Barnett's death. Kennedy walks Chuck through the structural rot she sees behind the headlines — a near-total lack of competition, a revolving door between the FAA and the company it's supposed to regulate, a McDonnell Douglas merger that reoriented the entire culture around quarterly earnings instead of engineering excellence, and the decision to leave Seattle in search of a non-union workforce — which matters enormously, she notes, because unions are what give workers real whistleblower protection. Boeing is simultaneously one of the most heavily subsidized companies in American history and, right now, one that isn't being held accountable in any meaningful way.

Kennedy is unusually direct about the practical takeaway: she won't fly on a 737 MAX and actively chooses flights on other aircraft, pointing out the counterintuitive reality that older model planes are often the safer bet — a consumer shift that has hit budget airlines hardest. She and Chuck get into the incidents that never made national news, including oxygen masks that failed to work, and she's blunt that the Trump administration hasn't provided anything resembling adequate regulatory oversight while families of the 346 crash victims are still fighting to hold the company responsible. Kennedy sees this fall's elections as a genuine chance to put people in place who care about the flying public, and reflects candidly on how she's feeling about American politics generally — that this administration is making choices that are hurting a lot of people. There's also a lovely detour into Ethel, her documentary about her mother, which she says holds a special place in her heart, plus a look at what she's working on next.

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Timeline:

00:00 Rory Kennedy (Freefall) joins the Chuck ToddCast

01:30 Documentary “Ethel” about her mother holds special place in her heart

02:30 It became evident that Boeing knew about faulty systems on 737 MAX

03:15 Boeing swore they’d change, then more incidents happened

04:15 Believe Boeing is responsible for whistleblower John Barnett’s death

06:15 Lack of competition is one of the reasons Boeing has been sloppy

07:15 There’s a revolving door between the FAA and Boeing

09:00 Are Boeing’s problems coming from a single source, or multiple?

10:45 Boeing has long been a foundational American company

11:30 Parts for Boeing planes come from all over the world

13:00 Whistleblowers reached out to say problems had gotten worse

14:00 Right now, Boeing isn’t being held accountable

14:30 Haven’t seen Boeing make significant changes

16:15 Focus on profits and quarterly earnings outweighed safety

17:00 Boeing is one of the most subsidized companies in US history

18:00 McDonell-Douglas merger has contributed to Boeing’s downfall

20:30 Wouldn’t fly on a 737 Max and choose flights on other planes

23:00 Consumers choosing not to fly on the 737 Max hurt budget airlines

24:00 Older model planes are actually safer

25:30 Decision to leave Seattle was to find a non-union workforce

26:45 Unions protect workers, give them whistleblower protection

28:00 Airbus is a better run company than Boeing

29:30 Boeing and Airbus are the only two options 

31:45 The Trump administration hasn’t provided proper regulation for Boeing

32:15 Families of crash victims are still trying to hold Boeing responsible

35:15 Elections this fall could put people in place who care about the public

36:45 Incidents where the oxygen masks weren’t working

38:30 How are you feeling about politics these days?

39:00 Administration is making choices that are hurting a lot of people

40:30 What projects do you have coming up next?

43:00 Had a screening at Boeing with top executives