A panel discussion hosted by Vision for Wellington on the future of the city and how tech and innovation can help reinvigorate the city's fortunes - featuring Rod Drury, Brooke Roberts, Serge van Dam, and Stephen Cummings.

A panel discussion hosted by Vision for Wellington on the future of the city and how tech and innovation can help reinvigorate the city's fortunes - featuring Rod Drury, Brooke Roberts, Serge van Dam, and Stephen Cummings.

The Business of Tech, hosted by leading tech journalist Peter Griffin. Every week they take a deep dive into emerging technology and news from the sector to help guide the important decisions all Business leaders make.

Issues such as cybersecurity, retaining trust after a cyberattack, business IT needs, purchasing SaaS tools and more.

New Episodes out every Thursday. Follow or subscribe to get it delivered straight to your favourite podcatcher.

@petergnz

@businessdesk_nz

Proudly sponsored by 2degrees Business!

 

The Business of Tech, hosted by leading tech journalist Peter Griffin. Every week they take a deep dive into emerging technology and news from the sector to help guide the important decisions all Business leaders make.
Issues such as cybersecurity, retaining trust after a cyberattack, business IT needs, purchasing SaaS tools and more.
New Episodes out every Thursday. Follow or subscribe to get it delivered straight to your favourite podcatcher.
@petergnz
@businessdesk_nz
Proudly sponsored by 2degrees Business!
&nbsp;

The Business of Tech

Vision for Wellington - tech and innovation panel May 2025

https://api.omny.fm/orgs/7784f840-c291-422a-924b-ad9000bbad71/clips/3341fbca-9182-4fd6-9d75-b2f1017b7d7b/transcript

OpenClaw is the moment AI stops feeling like a clever chatbot and starts behaving like something closer to a digital co-worker. In the latest episode of The Business of Tech, you’ll hear exactly why.

Veteran software developer and AI entrepreneurMike Hall joins me to break down what OpenClaw actually is in plain language. It’s not another prompt-and-response assistant, but a particularly smart type of AI agent that can wake itself up on a schedule, scan your data and tools, and decide for itself whether there’s work to be done. If it needs to write code to perform a task for you, it will do that too.

Mike explains how that simple “heartbeat” loop, asking “Should I do something?” every minute, is the key shift that turns AI from reactive to proactive, and why that’s such a big deal compared with the chatbots most people have used so far.

Skills and the hive mind

We dig into how OpenClaw goes far beyond the current crop of AI agents baked into office suites and CRM platforms. OpenClaw is designed to live on your own infrastructure, plug into email, files and SaaS tools, and then act autonomously rather than waiting to be told what to do. 

OpenClaw has sparked a surge of interest from developers, an explosion of “skills” that any OpenClaw instance can download. The hive mind model central to OpenClaw is unlike anything we’ve seen in commercial agent products. That’s probably why OpenAI has snapped up OpenClaw founder Peter Steinberger and will put him to work developing the next generation of AI agents for the creator of ChatGPT.

Sandboxes essential

We also cover the risks OpenClaw raises. Running OpenClaw on your personal machine can expose your entire digital life, which is why sandboxes and strict permissioning are essential. What happens when you let agents install community-built skills that might contain malware? 

Then there’s Moltbook, the social platform where OpenClaw-powered agents post and argue with each other, and what that experiment tells us about a near future flooded with AI personas.

If you’ve heard the noise about OpenClaw and “agentic AI” but still aren’t clear on what’s genuinely new here – and why it matters for your business, your data and your job – this conversation will get you there. 

Streaming on iHeartRadio or your favourite podcast platform. Thanks to our sponsor, 2degrees.

Show notes

Mike Hall, CEO Ab0t.com

OpenClaw: The AI Assistant That Actually Does Things - Turing College

OpenClaw, OpenAI and the future - Peter Steinberger

Meta and Other Tech Companies Ban OpenClaw Over Cybersecurity Concerns - Wired

OpenAI hires OpenClaw founder Peter Steinberger - FT

What OpenAI’s OpenClaw hire says about the future of AI agents - Fortune

Is OpenClaw Closed? - Hackster

OpenClaw threats: assessing the risks, and how to handle shadow AI - Kapersky

OpenClaw is the moment AI stops feeling like a clever chatbot and starts behaving like something closer to a digital co-worker. In the latest episode of The Business of Tech, you&rsquo;ll hear exactly why.
Veteran software developer and AI entrepreneurMike Hall joins me to break down what OpenClaw actually is in plain language. It&rsquo;s not another prompt-and-response assistant, but a particularly smart type of AI agent that can wake itself up on a schedule, scan your data and tools, and decide for itself whether there&rsquo;s work to be done. If it needs to write code to perform a task for you, it will do that too.
Mike explains how that simple &ldquo;heartbeat&rdquo; loop, asking &ldquo;Should I do something?&rdquo; every minute, is the key shift that turns AI from reactive to proactive, and why that&rsquo;s such a big deal compared with the chatbots most people have used so far.
Skills and the hive mind
We dig into how OpenClaw goes far beyond the current crop of AI agents baked into office suites and CRM platforms. OpenClaw is designed to live on your own infrastructure, plug into email, files and SaaS tools, and then act autonomously rather than waiting to be told what to do.&nbsp;
OpenClaw has sparked a surge of interest from developers, an explosion of &ldquo;skills&rdquo; that any OpenClaw instance can download. The hive mind model central to OpenClaw is unlike anything we&rsquo;ve seen in commercial agent products. That&rsquo;s probably why OpenAI has snapped up OpenClaw founder Peter Steinberger and will put him to work developing the next generation of AI agents for the creator of ChatGPT.
Sandboxes essential
We also cover the risks OpenClaw raises. Running OpenClaw on your personal machine can expose your entire digital life, which is why sandboxes and strict permissioning are essential. What happens when you let agents install community-built skills that might contain malware?&nbsp;
Then there&rsquo;s Moltbook, the social platform where OpenClaw-powered agents post and argue with each other, and what that experiment tells us about a near future flooded with AI personas.
If you&rsquo;ve heard the noise about OpenClaw and &ldquo;agentic AI&rdquo; but still aren&rsquo;t clear on what&rsquo;s genuinely new here &ndash; and why it matters for your business, your data and your job &ndash; this conversation will get you there.&nbsp;
Streaming on iHeartRadio or your favourite podcast platform. Thanks to our sponsor, 2degrees.
Show notes
<a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/mike-hall-02a2653a/?originalSubdomain=nz">Mike Hall, CEO Ab0t.com</a>
<a href="https://www.turingcollege.com/blog/openclaw">OpenClaw: The AI Assistant That Actually Does Things - Turing College</a>
<a href="https://steipete.me/posts/2026/openclaw">OpenClaw, OpenAI and the future</a> - Peter Steinberger
<a href="https://www.wired.com/story/openclaw-banned-by-tech-companies-as-security-concerns-mount/">Meta and Other Tech Companies Ban OpenClaw Over Cybersecurity Concerns</a> - Wired
<a href="https://www.ft.com/content/45b172e6-df8c-41a7-bba9-3e21e361d3aa">OpenAI hires OpenClaw founder Peter Steinberger</a> - FT
<a href="https://finance.yahoo.com/news/openai-openclaw-hire-says-future-174021852.html">What OpenAI&rsquo;s OpenClaw hire says about the future of AI agents</a> - Fortune
<a href="https://www.hackster.io/news/is-openclaw-closed-1e177637af9f">Is OpenClaw Closed?</a> - Hackster
<a href="https://www.kaspersky.com/blog/moltbot-enterprise-risk-management/55317/">OpenClaw threats: assessing the risks, and how to handle shadow AI</a> - Kapersky

The OpenClaw moment and what it means for AI

https://api.omny.fm/orgs/7784f840-c291-422a-924b-ad9000bbad71/clips/14635c4c-f65f-41f4-8b1d-b3f40161c6ea/transcript

New Zealand loves to boast about its clean, green energy story. With around 80 to 90% of grid electricity coming from renewable sources like hydro, wind and geothermal, we look like one of the world’s quiet success cases on decarbonisation.

But beneath that headline number lies a much more precarious reality. When lake levels fall and gas supplies tighten, our energy system starts to look very exposed.​

In the latest episode of The Business of Tech, I sit down with Melissa Reynolds‑Clarke and Daniel Gnoth from Ara Ake, the national centre for energy innovation, to explore how we can lean on innovation to navigate this emerging energy crunch.

The conversation ranges from process heat in dairy factories and meat plants that still run on coal and gas, to the growing risk that international customers will turn away from products that are not backed by genuinely low‑emissions energy.​

Ara Ake sits in the “valley of death” for new technology – that tough space between promising lab results and commercial deployment. Daniel explains how the organisation supports everything from fusion “moonshots” and hydrogen‑electric aircraft trials, to more grounded projects like battery storage at Wellington’s CentrePort, rural microgrids, and ultra‑cheap hot water control that effectively turns our cylinders into a giant, flexible battery. Melissa, drawing on decades in the rural sector and on energy company boards, highlights the brutal realities facing farmers and manufacturers who need affordable, reliable energy today, even as they’re pushed to decarbonise for tomorrow’s markets.​

We dig into some of the most promising levers for fast impact – smarter use of flexibility on the grid, re‑using old oil and gas wells in Taranaki for deep geothermal heat, and new business models that make technologies like biodigesters and community batteries actually stack up in a country of small, dispersed farms and towns. We also talk frankly about the capital gap that still exists between startup and scale‑up, and why system‑wide thinking across regulation, networks, and markets, matters just as much as shiny new tech.​

If you want to understand what New Zealand’s energy transition really looks like on the ground, and where innovation can genuinely move the dial, this episode is for you. Streaming on iHeartRadio or wherever you get your podcasts. 

Show notes

Who builds NZ’s LNG terminal? The two names being floated - BusinessDesk

New liquefied natural gas terminal: 'Vital' or 'bonkers'? - RNZ

Why the new LNG terminal could raise, not lower, your power bill - Newsroom

Ryan Bridge: The Taranaki LNG terminal is a good idea, depending on who you ask - NewstalkZB

Second interim boss appointed at Ara Ake as work continues to find next CEO - The Post

Energy research centre Ara Ake secures $70 million in funding to support innovation - Stuff

Ara Ake Impact Report 2025 - Ara Ake

 

New Zealand loves to boast about its clean, green energy story. With around 80 to 90% of grid electricity coming from renewable sources like hydro, wind and geothermal, we look like one of the world&rsquo;s quiet success cases on decarbonisation.
But beneath that headline number lies a much more precarious reality. When lake levels fall and gas supplies tighten, our energy system starts to look very exposed.​
In the latest episode of&nbsp;The Business of Tech, I sit down with Melissa Reynolds‑Clarke and Daniel Gnoth from Ara Ake, the national centre for energy innovation, to explore how we can lean on&nbsp;innovation&nbsp;to navigate this emerging energy crunch.
The conversation ranges from process heat in dairy factories and meat plants that still run on coal and gas, to the growing risk that international customers will turn away from products that are not backed by genuinely low‑emissions energy.​
Ara Ake sits in the &ldquo;valley of death&rdquo; for new technology &ndash; that tough space between promising lab results and commercial deployment. Daniel explains how the organisation supports everything from fusion &ldquo;moonshots&rdquo; and hydrogen‑electric aircraft trials, to more grounded projects like battery storage at Wellington&rsquo;s CentrePort, rural microgrids, and ultra‑cheap hot water control that effectively turns our cylinders into a giant, flexible battery. Melissa, drawing on decades in the rural sector and on energy company boards, highlights the brutal realities facing farmers and manufacturers who need affordable, reliable energy today, even as they&rsquo;re pushed to decarbonise for tomorrow&rsquo;s markets.​
We dig into some of the most promising levers for fast impact &ndash; smarter use of flexibility on the grid, re‑using old oil and gas wells in Taranaki for deep geothermal heat, and new business models that make technologies like biodigesters and community batteries actually stack up in a country of small, dispersed farms and towns. We also talk frankly about the capital gap that still exists between startup and scale‑up, and why system‑wide thinking across regulation, networks, and markets, matters just as much as shiny new tech.​
If you want to understand what New Zealand&rsquo;s energy transition really looks like on the ground, and where innovation can genuinely move the dial, this episode is for you. Streaming on iHeartRadio or wherever you get your podcasts.&nbsp;
Show notes
<a href="https://businessdesk.co.nz/article/infrastructure/who-builds-nzs-lng-terminal-the-two-names-being-floated">Who builds NZ&rsquo;s LNG terminal? The two names being floated</a> - BusinessDesk
<a href="https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/586359/new-liquefied-natural-gas-terminal-vital-or-bonkers">New liquefied natural gas terminal: 'Vital' or 'bonkers'?</a> - RNZ
<a href="https://newsroom.co.nz/2026/02/10/why-the-new-lng-terminal-could-raise-not-lower-your-power-bill/">Why the new LNG terminal could raise, not lower, your power bill</a> - Newsroom
<a href="https://www.newstalkzb.co.nz/on-air/early-edition-with-ryan-bridge/opinion/ryan-bridge-the-taranaki-lng-terminal-is-a-good-idea-depending-on-who-you-ask/">Ryan Bridge: The Taranaki LNG terminal is a good idea, depending on who you ask</a> - NewstalkZB
<a href="https://www.thepost.co.nz/nz-news/360933552/second-interim-boss-appointed-ara-ake-work-continues-find-next-ceo">Second interim boss appointed at Ara Ake as work continues to find next CEO</a> - The Post
<a href="https://www.stuff.co.nz/taranaki-daily-news/news/300927445/energy-research-centre-ara-ake-secures-70-million-in-funding-to-support-innovation">Energy research centre Ara Ake secures $70 million in funding to support innovation</a> - Stuff
<a href="https://www.araake.co.nz/news/impact-report-showcases-the-latest-projects-and-pilots">Ara Ake Impact Report 2025</a> - Ara Ake
&nbsp;

New Zealand’s energy crunch: Can innovation keep the lights on?

https://api.omny.fm/orgs/7784f840-c291-422a-924b-ad9000bbad71/clips/b56a3e37-5549-4b3f-9260-b3ed015fbf2d/transcript

In the latest episode of The Business of Tech, we look at the rise and fall of MethaneSAT, the $30 million national space project that was supposed to cement New Zealand as a serious spacefaring nation. 

Instead, it became a case study in governance failure, misaligned incentives and lost opportunity. 

Launched in March 2024 and lost in June 2025 after persistent spacecraft glitches, MethaneSAT’s methane-sniffing science payload worked but the rest of the system carrying it in space failed.

Working in space is risky, and satellites do fail. But as this week’s guest on The Business of Tech, University of Auckland physics professor Richard Easther points out, New Zealand’s involvement in the international MethaneSAT project raised questions from the start.

 “What happened… is that we found this opportunity and then we found reasons to do the opportunity,” he told me. 

“If someone had come to us in 2018 and said, here’s $30 million, I want you to develop things that will lead to startups, things that will provide the workforce… we could have come up with a plan and it would have been much, much better than MethaneSAT.”

Picking winners: "A terrible job"

Easther is careful not to scapegoat individual scientists or engineers. His critique is aimed squarely at how New Zealand chooses its science priorities and partners. 

“We do a terrible job of choosing science priorities in New Zealand,” Easther said. 

“And the people who pushed MethaneSAT were not scientists and do not have visible track records of testing proposals for excellence and competence.” 

From governance issues to the gap between what officials were told privately and what the public heard, Easther argues MethaneSAT exposed deep problems in how we govern high‑risk, high‑cost science.

But this isn’t just a post‑mortem of a failed satellite. Easther draws a direct line from MethaneSAT to today’s multi‑million‑dollar bets on AI and quantum, warning that without transparent, contestable processes – of the kind used in US “decadal reviews” – New Zealand risks repeating the same mistakes at even larger scale. 

The Government yesterday announced another significant science investment, committing $35 million from the Regional Infrastructure Fund to help start-up OpenStar Technologies develop a new, specialised facility for its new fusion machine.

Easther says major science investments shouldn’t come at the cost of long‑term, curiosity‑driven funding, pointing to world‑leading local strengths in high‑temperature superconductors and quantum devices that were quietly underwritten by the Marsden Fund decades ago.

Tune in to The Business of Tech to hear Professor Richard Easther on what MethaneSAT got wrong, and what we should learn from it. Streaming on iHeartRadio or wherever you get your podcasts. Thanks to our sponsor 2degrees.

Show notes

An eye in the sky to detect methane emissions - RNZ

Taxpayer-funded climate satellite MethaneSAT finally reveals what's behind delays - RNZ

Taxpayer-funded satellite had 'deep-seated problems' from launch - RNZ

MethaneSAT Report: Advancing space capability and climate science - MBIE

Government pulls back from full membership of Square Kilometre Array - RNZNew Zealand pulls out of the Square Kilometre Array after benefits questioned - Physics Today

 

In the latest episode of The Business of Tech, we look at the rise and fall of MethaneSAT, the $30 million national space project that was supposed to cement New Zealand as a serious spacefaring nation.&nbsp;
Instead, it became a case study in governance failure, misaligned incentives and lost opportunity.&nbsp;
Launched in March 2024 and lost in June 2025 after persistent spacecraft glitches, MethaneSAT&rsquo;s methane-sniffing science payload worked but the rest of the system carrying it in space failed.
Working in space is risky, and satellites do fail. But as this week&rsquo;s guest on The Business of Tech, University of Auckland physics professor Richard Easther points out, New Zealand&rsquo;s involvement in the international MethaneSAT project raised questions from the start.
&nbsp;&ldquo;What happened&hellip; is that we found this opportunity and then we found reasons to do the opportunity,&rdquo; he told me.&nbsp;
&ldquo;If someone had come to us in 2018 and said, here&rsquo;s $30 million, I want you to develop things that will lead to startups, things that will provide the workforce&hellip; we could have come up with a plan and it would have been much, much better than MethaneSAT.&rdquo;
Picking winners: "A terrible job"
Easther is careful not to scapegoat individual scientists or engineers. His critique is aimed squarely at how New Zealand chooses its science priorities and partners.&nbsp;
&ldquo;We do a terrible job of choosing science priorities in New Zealand,&rdquo; Easther said.&nbsp;
&ldquo;And the people who pushed MethaneSAT were not scientists and do not have visible track records of testing proposals for excellence and competence.&rdquo;&nbsp;
From governance issues to the gap between what officials were told privately and what the public heard, Easther argues MethaneSAT exposed deep problems in how we govern high‑risk, high‑cost science.
But this isn&rsquo;t just a post‑mortem of a failed satellite. Easther draws a direct line from MethaneSAT to today&rsquo;s multi‑million‑dollar bets on AI and quantum, warning that without transparent, contestable processes &ndash; of the kind used in US &ldquo;decadal reviews&rdquo; &ndash; New Zealand risks repeating the same mistakes at even larger scale.&nbsp;
The Government yesterday announced another significant science investment, committing $35 million from the Regional Infrastructure Fund to help start-up OpenStar Technologies develop a new, specialised facility for its new fusion machine.
Easther says major science investments shouldn&rsquo;t come at the cost of long‑term, curiosity‑driven funding, pointing to world‑leading local strengths in high‑temperature superconductors and quantum devices that were quietly underwritten by the Marsden Fund decades ago.
Tune in to The Business of Tech to hear Professor Richard Easther on what MethaneSAT got wrong, and what we should learn from it. Streaming on iHeartRadio or wherever you get your podcasts. Thanks to our sponsor 2degrees.
Show notes
<a href="https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/ourchangingworld/audio/2018870892/an-eye-in-the-sky-to-detect-methane-emissions">An eye in the sky to detect methane emissions</a> - RNZ
<a href="https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/561623/taxpayer-funded-climate-satellite-methanesat-finally-reveals-what-s-behind-delays">Taxpayer-funded climate satellite MethaneSAT finally reveals what's behind delays</a> - RNZ
<a href="https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/565815/taxpayer-funded-satellite-had-deep-seated-problems-from-launch">Taxpayer-funded satellite had 'deep-seated problems' from launch</a> - RNZ
<a href="https://www.mbie.govt.nz/about/news/methanesat-report-advancing-space-capability-and-climate-science">MethaneSAT Report: Advancing space capability and climate science</a> - MBIE
<a href="https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/361140/government-pulls-back-from-full-membership-of-square-kilometre-array">Government pulls back from full membership of Square Kilometre Array</a> - RNZ<a href="https://physicsworld.com/a/new-zealand-pulls-out-of-the-square-kilometre-array-after-benefits-questioned/">New Zealand pulls out of the Square Kilometre Array after benefits questioned</a> - Physics Today
&nbsp;

MethaneSAT: Unpacking New Zealand’s $30 Million space gamble

https://api.omny.fm/orgs/7784f840-c291-422a-924b-ad9000bbad71/clips/ce4839c3-5502-4714-92b5-b3e6014e6433/transcript

Vision for Wellington - tech and innovation panel May 2025

The Business of Tech

Social links

Follow podcast

Recent clips