The Breakfast ClubINTERVIEW: LL COOL J Talks New Album, Ownership Vs Artistry, New School Hip Hop More
The Breakfast Club sits down with LL COOL J to talk about his new album, ownership vs artistry, new school hip hop. Listen for more!
Wake that ass up in the morning. The Breakfast Club Morning.
Everybody is the j Envy, Jess Hilarious, Charlamagne the Guy. We are the Breakfast Club. Lauren the Rosa filling in for just just As on maternity leave.
And we got a special guest in the building.
Yes, indeed, I kind of legend Queens gets the money.
LL cool J. What's going on baby? How you selling feeling great? Man?
Llll always got action hero superhero energy when he walk in the room.
Yeah, good fo yo.
I mean that's why I feel like one right now. I mean this is like a good energy, you know what I'm saying, Like the you know, year forty. You know what I'm saying that we having a you know, a conversation about my new album. You know that's a that's a really unique position, you know what I'm saying.
So it's like it's never been done before that.
Yeah, no, that's never been done. And it shows us that it's possible. Right.
Even more importantly, it just shows younger generation and new artists as they you know, are working on their careers and as they embarking, what's possible. You know what I'm saying, that we can continue to you know, you know, operated at a high level, you know what I'm saying, and do things that are important culturally, and I just I'm glad that I can set that example.
How other been being back on the road on these promo tours doing interviews? How does it feel just to be out here.
Because you run it like a new artist, like you're doing everything you run it. I'm like, you ain't tired.
Nah, nah, I've been tied for thirty years. You're kidding me. I work hard, but you know what it feels like.
It feels like, you know, in a lot of ways, I'm a new artist, you know, because there's there's a day one audience that grew up with me, and then there's an audience that knows me for all of the other things I've done, but don't really aren't as familiar with my music when it comes to me, like directly dropping records, so it's launching records. So it's it feels great, man, it feels fun. I'm just having a good time with it, you know what I'm saying. Like it's exciting to me, you know what I mean?
And I think you being back out here it shows people the reverence individuals have for you because everybody got an LL story like we had here love. It was like he wanted to be a rapper until he heard you. Yeah, yeah, yeah, put the microphone down.
That's funny.
That's funny now, ed Man, Ed I remember he was he was at my high school security.
But I would.
Say, what it does for me is it gives me reverence for the culture.
You know what I'm saying. It makes me revere hip hop.
It makes me more excited about what's in store for hip hop, you know, and what's possible for hip hop. You know, so many amazing artists out here doing so many great things, and it's wonderful to be able to show them what's possible, you know what I'm saying. Like that for me is like the really exciting part of it because we're just so used to we've grown so accustomed to like writing people off after a certain you know, amount of time. It's just it's beautiful to be able to say no, you could continue, doesn't mean and you don't have to pretend you're in year three when you're in year forty.
You can actually be go ahead.
Were you nervous about that? Because you know, in hip hop it seems like definitely hip hop. They try to put you in a box, right, Yeah, what they're saying even though you got music now, they'd be like, oh, well, you can't play on this station because he's more of an urban ac artist. But with you, I haven't seen that. I've seen you. You know, you're on every station. It's not just the older quote unquote oldest station.
Yeah.
Well you know what it is, man, is you know you have a responsibility as an artist sonically. You know, at the end of the day, it's about what they when they press play with her, they hear like, we could talk about Google, we could talk about Wikipedia, is we can talk about your resume and your plaques on the wall. All that's great, Awards, Hall of Fame sounds great, But when they press play, it's like when you're on the basketball court, can you deliver?
Right? It's you know, Lebron can still deliver and yeah he doesn't have.
To be in year five. He can be in year twenty one and deliver. So can ll sonically deliver? Like it's like the Lebron it's the idea of Lebron and sports, but it takes twice as long because it's art.
So instead of twenty one years, it's forty.
But the reality is it's the same idea of can you deliver on the court. So to answer that question, that's about the sonics. It's about making joints that you love and people can appreciate.
You know what I'm saying.
Everybody's not gonna love everything, but if you can create stuff that people appreciate, you know what I mean, I go get it.
This album is dropping on Deaf Jam, which is where everything started for you a few years ago. I don't know where you were mentally about like just making music, but music out. But could you have planned this any better? Like what's that feeling like? Kind of like the full circle moment?
Well, it's more than a full circle moment, right because I was the first artist on deaf Jam, right and we launched the label together, you know, Tila rock Head.
Yeah you are.
And that's what I mean is like, you can't predict stuff like.
That, No, you can't. You can't. Listen.
Listen, God is great, And it's that type of timing, you know, being on death Jam, seeing the excitement in the building, seeing the excitement and all of the people's eyes that work at the company, you know, and even the support from Version and Republic and the way they all are rallying behind this project to make sure that it's it's seen and heard and gets an opportunity to be listen into by people is amazing. It feels like it feels like winning, you know what I'm saying, in the best sense of the word.
You know, you know what I mean what losing.
Is like, because you said it feels like winning. But like, I don't even I can't even think of what is losing.
Yeah, well, I put you like this.
I don't pay a lot of attention to the idea of losing, right like I think about winning, and I just I focus on the win, you know. And my my thing is if you do have a misstep, it's an opportunity to get it right, you know.
What I'm saying.
So valleys are just opportunity to find another peak that you're gonna go aftert No, I haven't, but and I and I hopefully I like to.
I just want to to keep my floyd on for the record.
For the record, I'm not trying to talk tough because I want to go through a walk through some.
Real quick I don't want to be careful because then you go wrong.
For you to you know, you know, you might go viral, you know, like you know, to leave me alone. I ain't trying to play tough.
Guys.
Now we're doing this doing this project right. It's been eleven years. How did you attack it right? Because you got Eminem on it, you got Sweedy on it. How did you attack it and say, you know what, I want to stick to who ll is, but I still want to keep it young doping and feeling good as well.
You know, you know that what you just said, I didn't really think about young dope and feeling I've thought about feeling good. What I more thought about was what do I love and getting with Q Tip? Q Tip is brilliant and q tip is a is a genius and he's very creative.
And so the idea was just sonically.
Doing something that moved the world and just made us made me respond, you know what I'm saying.
And I didn't do like I didn't put.
Sweety on the song because she's younger, or put em on a song. I put them on it because sonically they I felt they would sound good, We felt they would sound good on the songs you know what I mean. So it was about the music. It wasn't about stunt cast. And then you know, like I said, man, like.
Yeah, you know what I'm saying. You know what I'm saying. Well, you know it's TV experience for sure.
Right, So it's like I just wanted to do something that people were just vibele for. Man. You know, like when you listen to the whole record front to back, you know as a body, and I know we're gonna cherry pick, and I know people pick songs and they go through their process. I can't tell people how to consume the music, but you know, when you listen to it, you realize, like we did everything purposely.
Well then any one song that I was like and I don't know how difficult it was, if it was able to do. Like you have a history of trying to pull together the toughest mcs and every MC going at it. Right, We've seen it with with Red Men, Met the Man with two one who shot you? Yeah, I shot you? You ever wanted to do that with this one and be like let me pull all the MC's that's lyrical and let me let's have a straight up andrald.
But see what I did was I didn't repeat myself. I did go get great guys, like I went and did a joint with him, and I did a joint with Nas and I did joints with people that really can bring it on the mic.
Right.
I love doing that, Like that's like my thing, Like I'm not out here, you know, I want to be with the best and work with the best. But in terms of the posse cut I did, I really wanted to get some kids who had never had an opportunity and opportunity, you know, I have so many stars on the album Snoop Is on the album and Buster and you know, and different people that we name, even Sona Jobetta who's huge, you know in London and Africa and just an amazing musician. But I wanted to give some kids that never had an opportunity. I made a vow. I said, Yo, I'm gonna take some kids. So I got this kid, Don Pablito from South Side Queens and shout out to him and uh uh Mad Squabbles from Philly and Jayson from Lafayette, Louisiana and put them on the song so that they could have an opportunity.
So but that being said, you know, you know, you never know.
They could be remixes, you know what I'm saying, Like, you know, I consider, I would consider rocking with people. You know what I'm saying. It depends on what it is you're working with. Are they just know No, I didn't sign them.
I didn't.
I didn't want nothing from him. I just wanted to give them an opportunity. I just want him to be on the same album with EM and Snoop and l and and then give my opportunity. And you know, you got to make the best of it.
You keep your ad that I remember one time, but further on on how you found nose guy. I remember one time here and you say your favorite rabbit at the moment, was like pee wee long will Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, he was funny. He was funny.
But I like a lot of different artists, like I listened to everything, you know, I was. I was listening to the Young Nudy today, the Dag going up. Then I was checking out, you know, I like the little dirt thing, but I like the core day and then you know, you could you know, flip it all away to you know, I like some of what glow Rilla.
Is doing and you know.
Some of them were hey all some of them records, you know, and I listened to all artists. I love hip hop, you know what I'm saying. I love hip hop culture. You know what I'm saying. People think that, you know, I'm like, you know, I go home and stand up in the corner and kind of melt into.
The water and like, don't you know what the hell is going on in the world. But I'm actually paying attention, you know what I'm saying one hundred percent.
So it's the song with Sweetie, right, because Sweety gets so much like people love to like throw shots at her because of like saying like she's not lyrical whatever. And we talk about you working on lyricists. How did you How did y'all link up? Is that somebody you had your ear on? What made you go for Sweetie?
I thought I thought that I liked her.
I'm best friend with the you know that record, and I just thought she was cool, you know what I'm saying. And I like the name, and I just thought it was cool. I was like, yo, let's put her on the joint. And that was it. And you know, at the end of the day, that's an opportunity for her to be better, and she took her time and worked on that project, and took her time and worked on that verse and made it right. You know what I'm saying. And you know, if somebody else you know, wants to be on it, then.
You know, shoot your shot.
I mean, good luck, you know what I mean.
Remixed it, Little Ball remixed it and called it unctivity. So he's rapping about doing grown stuff over the record.
Okay, well, good luck with that, Duvau. Good luck with that, bro, good luck with your unctivity. You know what I'm saying. Good luck. You know we love you, We love that for you. Do you like being called or do you? I don't care about you don't care. I mean, you know what you're gonna.
Do because you are you are, You're unto life.
I mean, you're rich, uncle.
But you know what, that ain't even about money.
It's about character, right because you know you you can you know a lot of dudes, like I said, a lot of dudes lead with their wallet, but there's nothing else there, you know what I'm saying, So you can't. Really it ain't always about the money. I know, we like to we're very bad centric in our culture, but in order for you to be successful, you know, like Todd made ll ll and make Todd.
You know what I'm saying.
So people kind of can get that confused, you know what I'm saying, Like I would have this energy regardless I would be just be doing you know, I might be coming through your window or something, but you would get the same entity, you know what I mean. So it's like, would be the biggest Margler ever. Man, we having a good time, crazy, right? Been Like, Yo, where exactly grammatically correct? You know what I meant to ask? I was watching I guess it came back up on social media. It was an interview with Jamie Fox. They were talking about you know, y'all in your situation when y'all we shooting that movie.
I was just curious, he's laughing funny. Now you got to clear up what actually happened, because he said it didn't happen that way, that you didn't knock him out. But I wanted to know could that happened now? Because back then, if I feel like whatever Jamie says happened is.
What you really want to say? Because I saw your face, you digressed a bit, Yeah I did.
Yeah, I did.
Whatever Jamie says happened is what happened. I mean, I'm good with that because that's my man.
Like so you.
Know, I'll tell you what Jamie knocked me out?
How about that? Now you wanna make us laugh.
I'm just saying, I mean, you know, I mean, whatever ever, whatever JV said happened, that's what.
No disrespecting Jamie at all, I know, I'm just saying that, that's my dude. When somebody says, now he knocked me out, he beat the ship out of that means.
That whatever JMI said happened happened.
That was a long time ago.
Then you know, it just came back up. I wanted to know, could that happen on movie sets now? Or is it too protected? Because now it seems like if any little things human.
Resources by, you're going to human resources if you you know, if you if you get a hangnail and you express it wrong, I mean, he triggered me, you know, so iggering everything's triggered back in the day, triggering with the trigger.
Now the trigger is like you know, you.
Hail, you're being hanged out, triggering exactly exactly.
You got blue on this. I mean, you hate red.
You know, like, you know, how does that affect the industry outside of of course to me to movement?
But how does that affect be?
Bro?
You got mind your business?
You can't get your creative juices? Like, no, you get your creative juices. You better just keep make sure they don't get on nobody else. You got bees. Be easy with the projuices, you know, no doubt, no doubt.
We just have fun.
Man, Listen, man, I try to give the I give the respect I want to receive, and I keep it there, you know what I'm saying, and just have a ball with it.
And you know what I mean.
I saw you say songwriting is what's missing in today's hip hop climate.
Do you think it's because folks just want es?
I think I think it's because a lot of times, a lot of artists what they really want to say. They have an inspiration and then they make it. They say ah, but people don't want to hear that. They make that decision. So if I don't, if you don't write proclivities, then you don't get activity, you don't get the the you know what I'm saying. If you don't write to sincere inspired stuff, people don't respond the same way. So it's safer. It's really safe to talk about the bag and you know, ops and chicks like that's very safe, Like you don't have to worry about nothing. It's hard to you know, mess that up, you know what I'm saying. So that's the thing that kind of I think people whereas if you're gonna get into something like thirty Decembers on my album, or if you're gonna get into Black Cold Sweet, or if you're gonna get into the Spirit of Sirius. So if you're gonna get into some of these songs that I wrote on here, you have to be willing. You have to risk looking stupid in order to win. You know what I'm saying.
We talked about before.
You know what I'm saying, Like, you gotta risk, you know, you gotta be willing to be vulnerable.
The strength is in the vulnerability.
Vulnerability is where the strength comes from because you gotta put it on on the line. Jordan Lebron, Steph Curry, they take the last shot, right. There's vulnerability in that, you know what I'm saying, but exactly, but you can win. So that's that's kind of how music is and I think a lot of artists right now. I think it'll turn the corner though. I think that this album will inspire a lot of artists to do. You'll see more things happening. You'll see people taking chances creatively.
You see.
You know we had mc light here. She said she you're the reason. Yeah, you're the reason. She decided to put our new album.
Oh work, Well this really said when she was here, Huh.
You gotta put album.
Called one on one?
Yeah, why are you getting back into this crazy game l challenge? Yeah. We did a fireside chat with him, and in the midst of it, you know, he says, I'm putting out new music. I was like, oh, that's greazy, he said when you And I was like, well, I don't know. He's like, stop being scared. I was like, scared. True he said that, and I was like, Okay, I got to it.
I love that the nefut would still be inspiring on.
I love it man, I love it. Man.
Listen, can't be scary, man, Like, what do you being scary for? It's always gonna be great acts. Of course, there's gonna be new artists. Of course, times are gonna change. Of course, there's gonna be generational changes that comes with the territory, but that that's the opportunity.
For us to prove that we was born to do this. You know what I'm saying. You don't stop it because time's changed. You know what I'm saying. If you need your.
Shorts to be a little longer on the court or a little shorter, they change the rules and the touch fouls. You learn the rules of the game and the new rules and then play better than everybody else.
You know what I'm saying. It's simple.
You know, it's simple in the thought process, you know what I'm saying. Now, obviously executing it is not as easy, but it's simple when you make the decision.
When it comes to writing songs.
You know, when you got your pen, you got your pad, does that make you dig deeper? Because a lot of these guys that get high, they going to studio and just when you got the pin in the pad, you actually got to dig a little deeper, don't you.
Yeah.
So here's the thing, right, A lot of people, you know, rapping is not necessarily the thing it's about.
Are you Are you an artist? Are you creating art?
So you know a lot of people can put words together, like I can bounce a basketball, but you know, do I really want to be on the court with you know, Curry and Draymond and you know.
Like I can bounce a basketball, I can't.
I can make a shot, so you know, I could get lucky and make a shot, but that's not the same at the level. So hip hop is the same way when it comes to MC's like, yeah, you might can put a few words together, but you're not like ll Na's and eminem.
And you know, like there's a difference in skill lel. I'm just being honest.
So when I put pen to paper, I'm creating something. I'm going into a world. I'm disappearing into this thing I'm trying to create. I'm like looking at the marble and finding the statue inside of it.
You know what I'm saying. I'm not just putting any words together now. Mind you.
If I write something that's silly, I'm doing it intentionally.
See that's the.
Thing that people don't always get because when people judge hip hop, like the line I love to use as an example is my head Sprong record, because people there are a lot of people who think that this guy wrote that song trying to make the best rap that he could.
But that's not what that was.
The intent was to make it and funny and entertaining, and so people like So it's like writing comedy, it's like writing drama, it's like writing romance. It's like understanding what the intention is of what you're writing. So what happens is in hip hop, a lot of things get judged by the same metric.
You know what I'm saying, You can't judge you know.
Somebody's got to die, you know what I mean, by the same standard as I don't know. You know, juicy, you see what I'm saying something like exactly, so you can't picking boogets is picking boogets, you know what I mean. And and hypnotize is hypnotize and they're different. And so when when artists understand that, I think that it'll help them with when they craft these albums, when they craft these songs.
You understand what I'm saying. You never got.
Nervous because you were probably one of the first artists that say, you know what, I'm gonna be very emotional on the record, right, I'm gonna say I need love, I want to round the way girl, at the time when hip hop was so focused on I'm the best and what made you say? You know what, Now, I'm gonna go f with the chick over here.
I'm gonna let youall do this.
I'll be back, but I'm gonna ahead put the chicks right.
Well, I'll put it to you like this. It's like a guy, you know, showing up to the projects to see a girl. What does that say about him? Like the girl and he could fight or he's he's willing to risk it regardless or whatever.
He's willing to risk it right.
So me doing I need love on me doing these romance records. That's because I wasn't scared, not because I was soft. I wasn't scared. That's why I could do that.
You under saying.
I'm saying so like you gotta like sometimes people they misconstrue. It's like the guys that I meet, the guy like I you know, they will be the nicest guys in the world. The toughest guys I know, and the toughest guys I've known growing up have been like some of the nicest guys. The most dangerous guys I've known have been some of the nicest guys. So it's like with with the with the with the music. It was it wasn't about trying to have an image. It was about what I want to do as an artist.
Period.
What do you want to say as an artist? What do you want to do as an artist? That's what I'm going to do. And and you know, peer pressure makes me laugh. He's like, really, you know, I remember being fourteen standing in the garage.
You know what I'm saying.
We're playing hooky and all the dudes are standing around, and they was in they were sitting in chairs and if the garage is dark, the windows are taped over in Queen's right and I and I remember watching them and they were smoking weed in this particular day.
I'm like, I'm not smoking.
So I stood over in the corner and I remember just sitting in the standing in the corner, watching them and watching everybody's brain change and the conversation change. I was saying to myself, it's gotta be something more to life than this. But the point I'm making is not that I was too cool or too good, because that's not what I'm saying. The point was that I made it. I said, I'm not smoking and I didn't care who cared and who had a problem with it. That's my point. So when you comes to the music, it's the same idea. It's like, yo, you do what you want to do. Man, Like I do what I want to do creatively. I do what i want to do creatively, not what people say I'm supposed to do, right because what you know, a lot of times what people want, like right now, they're like, oh, you're supposed to sit down like you have people like there on the internet. Oh, how could he have the whips and chains and the and the this and that in the video?
Because people are freaks and that really goes on.
And I know you what, I know, you want to pretend that everybody's like having.
You know, missionary with a sheep. But I got I got news for you.
There's some freaky stuff going on out there, and I'm rapping about it.
You know. Oh, I can't believe it. You're at my age.
What when did I sign up to not get yo? I never signed that piece of paper. I don't remember signing that contract. You know, you got to stop liking freaking off And I don't know when that happens.
Those people that are new though, because I remember you pouring the chocolate syrup on the girl's caps all.
Make average make avenue.
He was a joke, absolutely bro absolutely wilding, now completely out of control.
Sounds like, Yo, we need to sit right here.
You got you? Okay?
I heard you cross your leg.
Yeah you like that, don't you? Yeah?
Gotcha? All right?
Directors?
Oh no, no, it.
Ain't even the wildest one. One of the wildest, one of the most subtle. One was in the doing It video the way you bite the accle when.
You we want that video? Yeah, yeah, yeah, I've heard yo. But I love that.
Yo.
You know what, man, I gotta tell you, man, I love like I love doing funny stuff like that and ridiculous, like I really like like I had jeans on in the Paradise video in the water, I know that that's right, like like, but what's funny is that. What's funny is people will point it out to you like I didn't know idea, like you do know how film that right?
Like you do know that I know what how many takes in the what genes do you have to do?
Because it's a little rough.
Many as it takes as many as it takes you know what I mean, how many takes we need?
You know what I mean, Let's have it.
Stuff became fashion like the one leg up man.
I got that from the bike messagers in New York. Yeah, because the bike messengers be riding around. Think about it, they be in the city. They have their pants leg up because they don't want it to get in the chain. Excuse me, stewing getting in the chain or the bike. I saw that one day. I pulled my joint up. I'm like, Yo, this is a vibe. I start wearing my joint like.
Joint like that.
You know what I'm saying, Like, I love the idea of just having fun, not taking it too serious. There's a time to be serious. The time to be serious is when you're going after your goals. The time to be serious is when you have dreams. The time to be serious is when you dealing with frustration but you want to take it to the next level and fight through it. But the other side of it is when I'm making music, I want to be silly and I want to do stuff that's ridiculous, and I want to do stuff that where we could laugh about it.
You know what I'm saying, Like, let's have some fun with it.
Because grab the woman's leg and started playing the guitar.
Absolutely bro absolutely, all me, all me, all me, and you know you know it's it's it's you know yo. I'm telling you b a while out. How much did you have to how much did you lose to do this album? Because you had to put a lot of focus. I'm sure you put acting stuff to the back. I'm sure you put a lot of the other stuff to the back. How much did you lose to action?
I only gained.
I only gained because I gained fulfillment. I gained inspiration. I was able to take up take time out of my life to focus on the thing that I love the most. And when you put your energy into what you love like and you truly believe you was born to do it, you never lose. There's no way to lose. I already won, like you see what I'm saying, because I love it. Dog See it's not see okay, I'll give you an example. May he rest in power someone like fat Man's school. The joy that you bring to people through your music is incalculable. See we really people, people are really and look I got money. I'm a wealthy guy. People really put a lot of and I understand it. Put a lot of emphasis on money, money, money, money, money and status, status, status, status, status, And I get it. Image is important people, I get it. But what people don't put enough value on is the joy of life and living well and having a good time and enjoying what you're doing. And that means something that's a different type of wealth. You know what I'm saying. That's like, that's really really important. Like I giving it example, if you have a great relationship with your mother, it's not a it's not transactional, but.
You still love her and it's still the most important you.
You know, when you see that smile, when you see that that joy, when you see the warmth of your mom when you walk in that door, you know what I'm saying. Or maybe it's your dad, or maybe it's your big sister, or it's unc or it's Auntie, whoever it is like those that matters too. So if you can find that joy in your life and your career, and you can find that joy in other areas of.
Your life, that's a true beautiful thing.
So I didn't lose nothing, nothing, I gained everything. So you know what I'm saying, Like all of the money comes, all of the fame and for all that stuff comes, but you still got to enjoy the moment for the moment's sake, you know what i mean.
Going back to the fashion stuff, so the one leg up but the hat, the Foobu hat in the gap commercial, Yeah, what was your thought process behind that?
That even intentional?
Like what was the okay, so because all the guitar, the chocolate on the girl, now we're talking about the hat, So talk us through that decision to do that in that day.
I felt like they we needed that exposure. They needed that exposure and you're a huge company and it's not gonna hurt you. And I'm gonna give you what you need, but you're gonna give me what I need and it's win win and nobody gets hurt. And you know, it ended up at that time taking Fooboo to four hundred million a.
Year and increased the audience by three.
I mean, and that's what I'm supposed to do. You know, when you roll with somebody, you roll with people.
There was no pushback on the set from the.
Yeah there was there was. They was like, oh, you know the hat and this I said, no, I'm my owner.
Oh so I can clear it.
Nobody gets hurt. And everybody's like, okay.
Absolutely, yeah, yeah yeah, and I'm an owner and this is it in boom and now we you know what I'm saying.
You, of course, I.
Thought you just did it because you rocked with them. I mean, of course, but I didn't know when you even just said that. I thought that was just you, like.
Because he was from Queeny, I was, and they was holding me that because I was from Queeny.
We was holding each other up.
Let's talk do that. So at what point did you become an owner in football? And why why haven't we heard more?
I didn't.
I never heard because.
Well, what's funny is that I just didn't really talk about that. Why because it wasn't important. Why is the job done? Why was it important? See, Like everybody like, I'm a rapper, I'm an MC. I'm okay, let's stop right there. Yeah, I act I do other things, but I don't like I don't like have to be other things in order to feel like I'm kind of impressing the world in some other way.
I'm good with being an MC.
I'm okay with that because I know what I do. You understand what I'm trying to say, Like like, so we're kind of in this space where like like you hear guys talking like as if they're like I heard a guy say the other day he was like, oh, you know, I don't want to just be an artist. I want to have an artist and I'm gonna be a CEO, as if being an artistst some sort of lower level thing. Yo, Stevie Want is an artist, Michael Jackson's an artist, Miles Davis is an artist. Bob Marley was an artist, Marvin Gaye was an artist. Prince was an artist. Oh cool, Ja is an artist, Like, I don't know what this idea Like ceo CEOs want to hang with artists. You know, Pablo Conso was an artist. Salvador Dolly was an artist. You know, Alex Hayley was an artist. Like art is art, This is art.
So I don't need to.
Tell you about my business life in order to impress you. I do have a business life. I have lots of investments. I got all kinds of stuff I could just rattle off and could inflate my network and give you a different valuation. Now I could show up a lot. Trust me, I'm a rapper, That's what I am. I'm an MC. I love the art. I love making hip hop. I don't need to pretend to be nothing else. So for those little kids out there, because see some kids, some people are using hip hop as a stepping stone. Okay, you got that opportunity. I can't begrudge that. I can't knock the hustle.
Right.
The flip side of that is for those little kids out there who want to paint, who want to do hair, who want to do botany, who want to grow plants, who want to build things, like be what you are. You're an engineer, being an engineer, you know what I mean? Like if you you know, now with AI you don't have to write code, but if back in the days, if you were going to write code, you write code.
Like you understand, what I'm saying is that everything you say is interesting because there was a time, I don't know if it was probably in the mid nineties, maybe early two thousands, where everybody started ranking their artists their mcs based on what else they were doing outside of rap. And so when I think about the fact that not only did you make death Jam, what it is clearly made fool. What if you were if all of that we knew all of that, I think they would be ranking you away different.
Part of death jam, part of fool.
People have no idea about you, Like God.
Did they approach you or did you go to them?
They came to me, Damon and them came to me.
They stood outside my house for two weeks or something, and I, you know, love them and appreciate them and respect them, and said, let's do it.
You know what I'm saying. They know it. They'll come on here and confirm it. You know what I'm saying. It's what it is.
I believe it. It's just now I want to hear the story like I just want to.
It's like my thing is that you know, look, you do some things, you've you succeed, Some things don't work.
Some things work. I mean even Rock the Bells is look Rock the Bells.
You know, I know people people like to p ten that they don't know that Rock the Bells brought timeless hip hop back.
It did. This is just the reality.
The Rock the Bellts Festival, the Rock the Bell's cruise, me doing that channel, me bringing all these artists out me putting all of that energy into it is the reason why there's more of an even playing field for artists that have been around a lot longer.
I bought it up at the meeting. I literally bought that up yesterday. Use that as an example, you know what I'm saying.
So, but at the same time, it's like, okay, cool, but I don't need to beat people in the head with that, Like I think that. You know, sometimes you gotta let your game speak for itself.
You know what I mean.
And if there are certain artists who are entrepreneurs and who are crafting their business image, and if that's what you're interested in doing, great, there's nothing wrong with that.
I don't. I think that's very cool me.
I just, yes, I invest, Yes, I have different things I've done, but I like making music, you know what I'm saying, Like, I'm good with that.
I wanted to ask you about something you said on club Station because you got I don't know why, but you got so much flak for your def jam Mount Rushmore.
Yeah.
Yeah, And I feel like nobody can debate you on that, except for Russell, except for Rick ru except for Chuck d and maybe the other people on that you named. Yeah, I just wanted to know why slick Rick. I love slick Rick, but I just wanted to know from you, why did you put them on there?
Because because on lot they just mad the whole list.
Well, they were mad because they don't they don't understand. They want me to talk about skin and lips and hair, but they want me to ignore the bones. You know what I'm saying. I gave them the bones of the label. They want to talk to me about cosmetics. But guess what, I don't care how you look. You can get fourteen bbl's thirty five lip injections, but if you don't have no bones, you're gonna be a pile of flesh over there on the floor.
So that's the way I made That's how I built my mount Rushmore.
So, when I said Beastie Boys and myself in public enemies slick Rick, that's because that is the foundation and the bones of the company. I didn't say that they were the more was famous. I didn't say they sold the most records. I didn't say any of that. But you wouldn't have any of that if you didn't have these these people.
That was my point.
So and then you have people respectfully. You know, I'm not even gonna be condescending about it there. Oh, why didn't he put Run Deem say? That's what they were? Never on Death Jam, Homie, you don't know what you're talking about. Run Deem se was on Profile records, they weren't on Death Jam. And they're my favorite group. I loved them. Of course I would have put them on there, but they weren't on Death Jam. Oh, I didn't know that. I know you didn't know that. That's why you shouldn't write on the internet so much. You know, you know what I'm saying.
You know what I mean?
So like that that was what the what the thought was.
It's not that I know that other people came later and made huge strides.
I know.
Look, I put DMX on. I know DMX did huge numbers in those years, you know when he came out. I understand when I say put them on, I meant I didn't mean put them on period. I meant put them on my song and introduce them to the world. You know what I'm saying. I want to be clear about that, like Foxy putting on my So I know that all of these artists that came It's obvious what death Jim became. It's I mean, that's self evident. But if you want to know how it was able to be there, you got to look at those founding fathers. This is what you gotta look at.
Absolutely.
Since you always you know, you're in the movies and doing that, would you do your own movie from the start, from growing up in queens and farmers and starting to rap and the battles and the beefs and everything to where you're at now?
Would you do that? I mean I would.
I need to be told I would, you know, I think about it sometimes people ask me that, you know, I just get a hard I have a hard time getting my mind around being that interested in me. I'm too excited about the future and too I get really excited about doing new stuff. I mean, it's probably a flaw of mine because so much history not.
Too man, that's so crazy to hear, because I feel like the music, like especially music for us, for like the Ladies, it gives that you wouldn't you be the opposite, that you would be really invested in you.
Yeah, but that see, like there's a difference between confidence and arrogance. You know what I'm saying, and you know, yeah, I'm confident, but the I just I just feel like I'm more interested in other people, you know.
What I'm saying.
But that doesn't mean I wouldn't do the movie, like I get it, like I'm open to it. I'm open to the idea of it. But what I put my energy into doing walking down that Now, maybe a documentary, you know, maybe we could, you know, but I just I don't know, man, Like.
Only you could tell your story and my story to story.
Street stuff in there? Would you put?
Oh? Man?
Oh yeah, I put a lot of you know, I mean, I couldn't put some stuff in it, but I put what I could, you know what I mean.
It's interesting record all of the all of the people that you hear about that's really tough.
Don't usally don't make.
That kind of music, like and they say that about you, They say that about Nellie, they say that about it hammer are oh gz like little Sean Like they never made that kind of street music. It was always because you got sense enough to notice to get away from it.
Let me tell you something, man.
I never met you know, every now and then you meet like a purely evil gangster. But there's not many. But I've never met a you know, somebody who was in the street life who didn't want to get away from it, who wouldn't much rather have nineteen laundromats and a dagon, the McDonald's and something else, you know what I mean. Like, so it's like you learn early on that it's about having manners and it's about not talking about that stuff. It's about staying away from that stuff. It's not about like trying to be a tough guy and you know, he thinks who he is and all that, and you know what I mean, trying to like you want to stay away from like talking about that stuff. So when I was hanging out with the dudes that was like running the city.
I was I need love, you know.
What I'm saying, Like, Yeah, I'm like, you know what I mean, like the complete opposite, because.
We do we do that. Like I'm around that for real.
I don't need to you know, it just feels different when you're around it for real. You know, it really feels different, you know what I mean. It's like it's like Vietnam vets or war vets. A lot of people that really were in the military that went that were on.
You know that was sore battle. They don't talk about it.
Now.
My apostles have to tell me nothing about.
If you really notice it.
If you ask, he'll your answer. But he not could come in things even be like I remember that time.
Just don't and you know why, because it's not cute. It's only the cu It's only cute to the people. I think Colin Powell said only people who enjoy war, those who don't understand its horrors. I'm paraphrasing, you know what I'm saying, But it's it's so it's something like that. It's like the idea of if you really seen some things, it's nothing.
To talk about. Let's have some fun. Headsprung had Sprung?
What is your biggest record to perform it? Is it head Sprung? Or is it Around the Way Girl? Is it doing it?
It depends on the audience, depends on what country I'm in, what city with state?
And what was the mind frame Around the Way Girl? Because thats probably one of my favorite. That's why aways that it just feels like a New York love story.
I tell you, it's about the girl next door. It's like, as much as everybody wants it to be about the celebrity female and or the female with the money, or the female who is the.
Most well known in the world.
There's something I think every guy knows that there's something about the girl next door, the around the way girl that's very special. And I always had a certain reverence for that, you know what I'm saying. I ain't told my chasing with my tail between my legs. I'm just saying I had a reverence for that, Like, you know, that appealed to me. Like I didn't really, I wasn't really as interested in like the famous girl or the superstar girl, lord of the girl, even with the most nowadays, like the most followers. It was the person, a normal person, Like I just thought that was I found it more interesting, you know what I'm saying, and quite frankly, like more attainable.
You know what I'm saying. Like it's just.
Like like I see you, you know what I'm saying, Like when I make songs like proclivity, even proclivities, even though proclivities is a much deeper layered song.
And over the years people will.
Realize that because I'm dipping into the shadow world of people's thoughts, It's like.
I see you, you under saying.
I'm saying like I see you like I'm not looking at the image of a woman. I'm not looking at the trappings. I'm looking at her soul on a round the way girl, I'm looking at her soul on proclivities. When I talk about you know, like love to see I love to see you make the old face, you know, like like that's a real thing, Like like I'm looking at a face like you know, Morphel Like I'm like, I like to see you make that face.
You know what I mean? You know what I mean, Like it's crazy, you know.
So I got a few more questions. You wrote empty lights verse on self destruction?
Yeah, wow, Yeah, yeah, Scott's tape with a raisor of blade tape to a collar.
I did.
How much of that did you used to do back in the day?
A little bit, A little bit.
I did it more than people know, you know what I'm saying, more than people know. But I wouldn't go around like talking about all the different things.
But I did some of that. Yeah, I did some ghost writing for people.
And when we talk about writing, I wanted to ask how much how much do you think Biggie and Jay contributed to people not taking writing it series because both of them said they didn't write.
And I saw you having a conversation on Sway about Big.
Well look, look well big.
Look, Biggie's my man and I love Big you know sometimes and look, everybody's different.
Everybody's process is different.
Right, Like some people they just you know, got a bunch of rhymes that they wrote at home and they just remember them and then they just.
Got something for the beat.
So you don't have to see me necessarily me, right, that doesn't mean I didn't write. I'm not gonna What I'm not gonna do is say anything that would go against with somebody how someone wanted their career to be laid out. But I'll say this, ultimately, it's about the song period, whether you write it in your mind, whether you memorize it, because see, you gotta remember the skill is not in how you get there. The skill is in how the song affects the world. So whether you write it on paper, a phone, in your head, that it doesn't matter what the how does it affect people?
Did the ball go in the basket.
Whether I called it chucked it, whether I you know, fade away, whether.
I finger slammed it, reverse slammed it.
You know what I'm saying. But like I've seen dudes write, and I've seen dudes.
You know, come off the top. I mean whatever, you know what I'm saying. I don't.
What I would say is that, Like I would say, like like these guys are legitimately talented enough, some of them to do that. That doesn't mean you necessarily need to be doing that. You might need a penny pad, you might want a Pennan pad and do some editing.
Ernest Hemingway editing, It's all right, Like, don't be embarrassed, you know what I mean? Who wrote for who? The bell told?
Huh no no no, not the song metallic No no, the Raven? Who wrote the Raven? Huh noed So it's like you got Ernest Hemingway, you got Edgar Allan Poe. They wrote, hm, they edited. So there's no shame in writing. But if you are able to do it without it, fine me. I like to write. I want to be able to look at what I wrote and change it and edit it until I like it.
Period.
Can I come up with something like? Could I come up with something in my head right now? Of course I could. Of course, you know what I mean.
And you was on the shop and you you was talk about Andre dree Dowland saying he didn't want to rap again because he said he didn't have anything to rap about. Yeah, and so Andre responded to that and said, if you can, you should rap until you die.
Of course he has things to say, but if he.
Can't say it in a fresh innovative way, then it's not enough of him to do it.
And I respect that. I respect that, I respect that, and you know that in that sense, I would agree. That's but that's what I look to do on my new record, right like on the Force, like say it in a fresh, innovative way. He's talking about, not repeating flow. Look, he's one of the greats. He's unbelievable. Like I'm thoroughly impressed with Andre. And the only reason I even said anything is because I like him so much as an artist.
I love to hear him again. I just mishearing the guy, you know what I'm.
Saying, Like, I want to hear Outcasts, Like personally, I would love to hear an Outcasts album. I don't know about the world, but I would want to hear that, but I do respect his feelings and I cannot speak to his artistry.
You know what I'm saying has lyrics, I don't.
I don't know if his lyricism has lyricism peaked, Like I don't know if there is any more flows?
Are there any more deliveries? Like how many more ways can you deliver?
There's always a way.
That's like, you know, just when you thought every single patient was done, I mean, Miles came and changed the game. Charlie Parker came and changed the game. You know, we can go half notes, quarter notes, eighth notes. I mean, there's always a way to change and approach it differently, you.
Know what I'm saying. There's always a way too, you know, it's up to you. Though. It's combinations.
It's like, uh, it's like flavors, right, there's only bit of sugar, salt, blah blah blah blah blah. But you got at the end of the day, there's always a different way to make a good meal, you know what I mean, You can always get another great meal.
So yeah, yeah, one hundred percent.
I mean, like some of the stuff EM's doing on my new song, some of the tripling that's new kind of newish stuff on Murder Graham Do.
I mean a lot of it.
Even the flow I did on Murder Graham Do is like, you know, there's some new moments in it.
You know what I'm saying?
She said earlier, Yeah, I was like where because I was like, how do you play this in the car?
Like where do you listen?
When she's young? So what she said was what she said, he goes he don't sound old because.
Because one of them in the room said that it sounds old. And when I heard it, I said, this doesn't sound old. It sounds like what I know him to sound like. But then I said, but where do you play this? Because like I don't know if I would play this in the car? Well yeah, but like but music, like songs go places with you. I can't describe it, like I know where I'm gonna put on like around the Way girl, like I know what my outfit is? I with that song, I couldn't figure it out.
Yeah, good, that's good. That good because it's new.
I remember the first time I heard Planet Rock by Africa band Bady in the Zulu Nation. I didn't understand it. I told my man, my man, was that he played planning around, Like, I don't like that. He said, why, it's because it's different.
You catch up it not like it I didn't know. But you're not saying a bad thing. You're not saying a bad thing at all.
It's like it's it's actually and truly that's not It's really not a car record. That's not what it is. It's a live performance record. It's a record that shows the display of MC's showing lyrical skill. It's a record that shows you the art form of rapping. That's really what the song is about. Now, Proclivity's I could play in a car. I could play Proclivities in a car. I could play Black Cold Sweet at a cookout. I could play you know, some of those records, some of them are car rights because I love car wrecks. Like I made a song called Booming System a long time ago. It was a car record. I'm very familiar with the difference, but that particular song, You're right, it's not for the car it's for those who really are fans of hip hop and fans of the art of hip hop.
It's like it's like watching and one.
It's like watching basketball players get busy with the ball and do things that you didn't even know they were capable of doing with a basketball.
That's what that song, and that's kind of lost on like the artists that I love, because I feel like when I hear a new song, what makes it go for me? Like when you mentioning Glorella, first thing I think of is like putting it on in a car, on in the club, and it I don't yet. I don't get the sportsmanship, yes.
Exactly, and that's my and that's okay too, right. It's like that's the beauty of it. It's like we need both, we need the vibru. That's why I made like heads wrong, Heads Wrong. At that time was that kind of thing you're describing. It was just silly, a vibe. We're just getting it me and Timbo to win the studio. We're making a wild out. I get it. But there's a time for that and then there's a time for the other thing. So on this album, it's like a combination. There's some songs that are like that, but then there are other songs where it is really more about lyrics, rapping the sportsmanship that you say you couldn't relate to as much and that kind of stuff like that.
That's kind of like the whole idea. The whole idea is.
For you to make unique things, you know what I'm saying, unique stuff, and then we get the vibes and we dance the glow really and we dance is sexy red like I love the record.
Hey, yeah, Hey, what's your favorite record out of all your catalog?
Heads? Clearly? Yeah, I like Heads Broke. I use.
Like it's a few songs. I think Doing It is one of my favorite classics. I think doing It, you know what I'm saying, You can you can.
Relate that that song song that works in the car, that works anywhere.
Oh I know, yeah, yeah I know that. Yeah, I know, I know.
Yeah.
Doing You a Scratched did to oh Ilbomb?
Yeah?
I like Ilbomb. I like Ilbomb. I'll tell you this one I got with Nas is crazy. The praise the joint is wild. It's hip hop, you know what I'm saying. But it's it's It's right. There's a lot of joints. Thirty Decembers. I like thirty December, like black hold a lot, black Hole, black Hole, sweet as you know, look at Mama she in the kitchen chicken dipping the chicken, the flower you got, the music is bumping well, two steps in the shower, well balanced, potato salad, the hot soul collar green.
Yeah, that joint is high. Yeah yeah, yeah, that black coach.
Joe.
I got one last question, sir, and I would ask Lebron this too. Is it easier or harder to do what you do in this case music when you have nothing to prove or do you feel like or do you feel like you have something to prove?
I definitely feel like I have something to prove. Wow, definitely, because the proof to what I'm looking to prove is that you could keep going. And you know, you gotta to keep going. You gotta come from the heart, you gotta come from the soul, and.
You can't.
You can't swag your way into forty years of success. It's gonna take more than that, right, you know what I'm saying. And so, yeah, I definitely got something to prove. I definitely look at this as a as a as a fun challenge. It's a fun challenge, you know what I'm saying. It's like, Yo, can you do it? You know what I'm saying? You know, well, I ever have another song where she's like, oh, this is my joint. I'm turned up in the car, like can I do that? Is that possible?
Right?
Those are the questions that you know you look to answer. You know what I'm saying, Like, that's the part that makes this thing like.
Worth doing? You know what I'm saying. You know what I mean.
Well, let's get into a joint off the album. The album is out today.
It's called Force.
What you want to hear?
Well, you know I need to look at them. I need to see the track listen. Okay, yeah, let me see the track listen.
Hmmm hmmm.
Murder grads just because of her.
Yeah, let's play murder grad. Let's play murder. I'm playing murder graph Murder feature. We appreciate you for joining us.
Appreciate and how used to work out every day?
I do well four times a week minimum.
Yeah, you tell me one day you get on the gym with love.
No, I'm good, And I work out with him. I trained with him his.
Work out one day. Just I did it one day and I almost threw up.
I think I threw up. You might have. I don't know.
I threw up. He does some weird ish man like.
Like you don't. He does what he does. You should have did what you do?
You know what Jim ever saw you come in? When did that.
Say this with me? Murder ground, murder ground. There you go. Breakfast, wake that ass up in the morning. Breakfast Club.
