Oh, I listened to The Black Guy You Tips podcast because Rod and Caroing or hout Hey. Welcome to another episode of The Black Guy Who Tells podcast. I'm your host, Rod joined is always on my cost and we are live on a very special Tuesday. All right, this is a this is a big time moment right now. It is long time coming. Today we have a guest. It's been a while since he's been on the show, but he is a friend of the show. He's a podcaster. Though he does sports podcast. You wouldn't. You might not know that by some of his other proclivities that are blowing up right now, but I know he does the crazy cast. You know, I think this one hurts to have him on. I think I'm realizing now, you know, as a Duke fan, it's you know, it's been a while. He's like, it's been a while since you have me, and I'm like, why is that now? I'm thinking it's coming to me. But he also I bumped into him back in the day on message boards s O HH and whatnot, and he was doing the Long and Late Movie Show, which is a podcast. There was a movie review podcast and I used to listen to it all the time, I thought it was very good. I was on a couple of times very fun. They had games, So you know, I'm a day one. But now he's gone from reviewing movies, criticizing movies to writing movies. It's my man, Russell haynline. What's going on?

Oh, I listened to The Black Guy You Tips podcast because Rod and Caroing or hout Hey. Welcome to another episode of The Black Guy Who Tells podcast. I'm your host, Rod joined is always on my cost and we are live on a very special Tuesday. All right, this is a this is a big time moment right now. It is long time coming. Today we have a guest. It's been a while since he's been on the show, but he is a friend of the show. He's a podcaster. Though he does sports podcast. You wouldn't. You might not know that by some of his other proclivities that are blowing up right now, but I know he does the crazy cast. You know, I think this one hurts to have him on. I think I'm realizing now, you know, as a Duke fan, it's you know, it's been a while. He's like, it's been a while since you have me, and I'm like, why is that now? I'm thinking it's coming to me. But he also I bumped into him back in the day on message boards s O HH and whatnot, and he was doing the Long and Late Movie Show, which is a podcast. There was a movie review podcast and I used to listen to it all the time, I thought it was very good. I was on a couple of times very fun. They had games, So you know, I'm a day one. But now he's gone from reviewing movies, criticizing movies to writing movies. It's my man, Russell haynline. What's going on?

Bro? Rod Caarn so glad to be here. Thank you so much for having me.

Bro? Rod Caarn so glad to be here. Thank you so much for having me.

Man.

Man.

I'm glad you could make it, dude. I know you hella busy right now, Bro, I mean when do you when do you have time between writing Christmas movies to even hop on a podcast or watch duke games.

I'm glad you could make it, dude. I know you hella busy right now, Bro, I mean when do you when do you have time between writing Christmas movies to even hop on a podcast or watch duke games.

It's hard, It's really hard. You make time. It requires standing up late at night generally, you know, just working, working in an hour here, an hour there. I still try to see as many movies as I can, but that's really hard now too. I saw the other day somebody somebody said, you know, gainful employment kills cinephiles, you know, like, and I kind of feel that way. I'm so behind on the things I really want to watch. I'm I'm hopeful that when I finish working on the thing that I'm currently working on, that I'll just have a few days to just like lock down hatch up on all the movies, you know, get get back with it. And luckily Duke basketball has only got a couple of games between now in January, so you know, it's kind of it's final exam season for them, right, It's it's slowing down a little bit.

It's hard, It's really hard. You make time. It requires standing up late at night generally, you know, just working, working in an hour here, an hour there. I still try to see as many movies as I can, but that's really hard now too. I saw the other day somebody somebody said, you know, gainful employment kills cinephiles, you know, like, and I kind of feel that way. I'm so behind on the things I really want to watch. I'm I'm hopeful that when I finish working on the thing that I'm currently working on, that I'll just have a few days to just like lock down hatch up on all the movies, you know, get get back with it. And luckily Duke basketball has only got a couple of games between now in January, so you know, it's kind of it's final exam season for them, right, It's it's slowing down a little bit.

Yeah, I was gonna ask you about how much you are able to even keep up with movies now, because I do see, you know, we follow each other on social and I see like you'll do like a letterbox review whatnot every once in a while, and I'm like, Okay, he's still kind of watching stuff. But I just can't imagine writing this many movies and having time to really review. And you're like hardcore, Like you're not just like a, oh, I go to the movies every Thursday. You're like, I needed to watch the re release of Big Time in Little China at the Man's Theater because that, and like you're you're out there living the life in like the Hollywood world, So like, how how are you keeping up?

Yeah, I was gonna ask you about how much you are able to even keep up with movies now, because I do see, you know, we follow each other on social and I see like you'll do like a letterbox review whatnot every once in a while, and I'm like, Okay, he's still kind of watching stuff. But I just can't imagine writing this many movies and having time to really review. And you're like hardcore, Like you're not just like a, oh, I go to the movies every Thursday. You're like, I needed to watch the re release of Big Time in Little China at the Man's Theater because that, and like you're you're out there living the life in like the Hollywood world, So like, how how are you keeping up?

First of all, Big Trouble in Little China. That's a tank, you know, But how do I have time for it? Man? I genuinely have no idea. It's it really does take having a complete lack of friends and other hobbies. I luckily my friends out here all also really like movies. So you know, my buddy Colby, who's a great screenwriter as well. He did Spaceman with Adam Sandler earlier this year, and he's got one with Andrew Stanton next year, who directed Wally and John Harder and some really good stuff. We love going to the movies, man, It's so it's good to sort of double up some of the things that we can accomplish. He's definitely one of the guys who knows when the rep theater stuff when when like the re releases in seventy millimeter whatever come out. He usually has his finger on the pulse of stuff like that keeps me honest. And it's you know, if you live in LA and you're not going to see Lawrence of Arabia on like a huge screen, like why are you living in LA? Like move somewhere else. It'd be cheaper somewhere else. You know, Like I've got to justify being here by going out and doing stuff.

First of all, Big Trouble in Little China. That's a tank, you know, But how do I have time for it? Man? I genuinely have no idea. It's it really does take having a complete lack of friends and other hobbies. I luckily my friends out here all also really like movies. So you know, my buddy Colby, who's a great screenwriter as well. He did Spaceman with Adam Sandler earlier this year, and he's got one with Andrew Stanton next year, who directed Wally and John Harder and some really good stuff. We love going to the movies, man, It's so it's good to sort of double up some of the things that we can accomplish. He's definitely one of the guys who knows when the rep theater stuff when when like the re releases in seventy millimeter whatever come out. He usually has his finger on the pulse of stuff like that keeps me honest. And it's you know, if you live in LA and you're not going to see Lawrence of Arabia on like a huge screen, like why are you living in LA? Like move somewhere else. It'd be cheaper somewhere else. You know, Like I've got to justify being here by going out and doing stuff.

You know, Oh is it was? It a big requirement when you were dating, Like whoever I'm dating has to be into movies, like I'm in a movie or is it one of those things where it's like, actually, the less you're into this, no better. Maybe the better the less weird you'll think I am.

You know, Oh is it was? It a big requirement when you were dating, Like whoever I'm dating has to be into movies, like I'm in a movie or is it one of those things where it's like, actually, the less you're into this, no better. Maybe the better the less weird you'll think I am.

Yeah, Emily knew right away. I believe maybe I've told this story on this pot guess before, but since it's been a minute, you know, the night I met her, I knew I really really liked her. I wanted her to come out with me. The next night. I was like, let's let's go get a nice seafood dinner tomorrow, Like, let's go. I'm not being cool about this, and she said, oh, you know, great, I can. I can meet you at six if that works. And I was recording long and late movie show that night until six. There was no way I was gonna make it. And so I was faced with, you know, that decision that everybody faces in a relationship, and I was faced with it right away. Do I pretend to be cool or do I let her know exactly who I am right away so that then if she if she's not into that, then you know it's not gonna work out anyway, you know. So I said, I'm sorry, I can't. I've got to record a podcast to my internet friends until six, you know, can we go do a nice seafood dinner at seven? And she was completely unfazed. She was like, yeah, that sounds good. So I was like, okay, we might we have a live one here.

Yeah, Emily knew right away. I believe maybe I've told this story on this pot guess before, but since it's been a minute, you know, the night I met her, I knew I really really liked her. I wanted her to come out with me. The next night. I was like, let's let's go get a nice seafood dinner tomorrow, Like, let's go. I'm not being cool about this, and she said, oh, you know, great, I can. I can meet you at six if that works. And I was recording long and late movie show that night until six. There was no way I was gonna make it. And so I was faced with, you know, that decision that everybody faces in a relationship, and I was faced with it right away. Do I pretend to be cool or do I let her know exactly who I am right away so that then if she if she's not into that, then you know it's not gonna work out anyway, you know. So I said, I'm sorry, I can't. I've got to record a podcast to my internet friends until six, you know, can we go do a nice seafood dinner at seven? And she was completely unfazed. She was like, yeah, that sounds good. So I was like, okay, we might we have a live one here.

This is good.

This is good.

And that was somewhere that was still weird.

And that was somewhere that was still weird.

To say, like it was at Internet flow.

To say, like it was at Internet flow.

Now, like that everyone has a podcap online. Yeah, and everyone has a podcast, and everyone's constantly talking about relationships. Uh none of us wants to know, but like, yeah, now it's different. But back then, it was like, what the fuck do you mean Internet friends? Are you a serial killer?

Now, like that everyone has a podcap online. Yeah, and everyone has a podcast, and everyone's constantly talking about relationships. Uh none of us wants to know, but like, yeah, now it's different. But back then, it was like, what the fuck do you mean Internet friends? Are you a serial killer?

What is a podcast?

What is a podcast?

You know, we were around at the phase when you say podcast.

You know, we were around at the phase when you say podcast.

I was just like, it's like the radio.

I was just like, it's like the radio.

That's what I used to tell my family.

That's what I used to tell my family.

Some of them.

Some of them.

I still tell them that because I'm like, I'm not even going to explain to you it's the radio.

I still tell them that because I'm like, I'm not even going to explain to you it's the radio.

Yeah, yeah that. This was twenty ten, right, This was a while ago now, and so you know I had that, and then I also I think at that point I might have had two point one seconds to Madness with k Bad and uh with our boy Bob maybe who dropped off after like the first season. Because he's always too busy. But yeah, it was weird being a podcaster when podcasting was something that nobody really knew, but it did. Then ultimately it allowed me to meet a lot of cool people because the people who were podcasting and the people like it was a smaller community at the time. And then a lot of the people that I've met in college basketball circles, for instance, they told me they listened to two point one seconds some Madness because it was one of like we literally started it because there was not a college basketball podcast that we liked. There were like two, and we weren't crazy about either of them, So who are like, why don't we do our own thing? You know? And same kind of thing with doing the movie show. You know, we thought that that was something that would be fun and we were going to the movies anyway, and it would allow us to talk to some cool people and you know, give us again circling back to what we were already talking about, an excuse to see friends and to make new friends and to hang out with people, a great way to socialize. So I'm really really grateful, even though I don't do any event anymore except for the Crazy Cast, which We mostly just do live after Duke games, so I was already watching the dude game anyway. I don't have to schedule additional at that point.

Yeah, yeah that. This was twenty ten, right, This was a while ago now, and so you know I had that, and then I also I think at that point I might have had two point one seconds to Madness with k Bad and uh with our boy Bob maybe who dropped off after like the first season. Because he's always too busy. But yeah, it was weird being a podcaster when podcasting was something that nobody really knew, but it did. Then ultimately it allowed me to meet a lot of cool people because the people who were podcasting and the people like it was a smaller community at the time. And then a lot of the people that I've met in college basketball circles, for instance, they told me they listened to two point one seconds some Madness because it was one of like we literally started it because there was not a college basketball podcast that we liked. There were like two, and we weren't crazy about either of them, So who are like, why don't we do our own thing? You know? And same kind of thing with doing the movie show. You know, we thought that that was something that would be fun and we were going to the movies anyway, and it would allow us to talk to some cool people and you know, give us again circling back to what we were already talking about, an excuse to see friends and to make new friends and to hang out with people, a great way to socialize. So I'm really really grateful, even though I don't do any event anymore except for the Crazy Cast, which We mostly just do live after Duke games, so I was already watching the dude game anyway. I don't have to schedule additional at that point.

It's almost like therapy, you know, like win or lose, Like I just need someone to talk to this ship, like we are, like I'm not gonna do it, but we we're Hornets fans and so like literally, if it was easy, like if I could just get in my car and go live. I do a podcast every time I watch a game to be like, guys, what the fuck? You know what I mean?

It's almost like therapy, you know, like win or lose, Like I just need someone to talk to this ship, like we are, like I'm not gonna do it, but we we're Hornets fans and so like literally, if it was easy, like if I could just get in my car and go live. I do a podcast every time I watch a game to be like, guys, what the fuck? You know what I mean?

Ye?

Ye?

What that was trying to figure it out.

What that was trying to figure it out.

But there we go again.

But there we go again.

Guys, you're not even believe that someone got injured.

Guys, you're not even believe that someone got injured.

All right.

All right.

Yeah, it's funny too because bo is weirdly a grown ass man, you know, like I feel like on the sly. You know, it's just he's a grown man with grown man responsibility. Right in my head, we're still talking ship on message boards about movies and uh, video games and fucking pop culture and in sports, and and then like you said, it's like, yeah, well do this podcast thing. I don't have any kids, you know, it's just me and Karen. We're just figuring this shit out. And and then with Bo's like, oh yeah, that's right. You got a grown as your grown ass man. You got two kids, you got a job, you're married. What what am I doing with my life? I maybe I step it up. Let me ask you this though, like going from reviewing movies on Long and Late to writing movies because you've always you've always never made a secret you want to get in the movie writing you wanted to like like uh. And one of my favorite things about you is that we both share a love of the quasi bad movie, you know what I mean? Like, I like the Tornado fire. Tornado seven is like when those movies come out. I know Karen won't go see it with me, and I know none of my film critics fake friends want to watch it. But I'd be like, Russ, did you see this ship?

Yeah, it's funny too because bo is weirdly a grown ass man, you know, like I feel like on the sly. You know, it's just he's a grown man with grown man responsibility. Right in my head, we're still talking ship on message boards about movies and uh, video games and fucking pop culture and in sports, and and then like you said, it's like, yeah, well do this podcast thing. I don't have any kids, you know, it's just me and Karen. We're just figuring this shit out. And and then with Bo's like, oh yeah, that's right. You got a grown as your grown ass man. You got two kids, you got a job, you're married. What what am I doing with my life? I maybe I step it up. Let me ask you this though, like going from reviewing movies on Long and Late to writing movies because you've always you've always never made a secret you want to get in the movie writing you wanted to like like uh. And one of my favorite things about you is that we both share a love of the quasi bad movie, you know what I mean? Like, I like the Tornado fire. Tornado seven is like when those movies come out. I know Karen won't go see it with me, and I know none of my film critics fake friends want to watch it. But I'd be like, Russ, did you see this ship?

And you equal? The last last time we did a show might have been when Into the Storm came out.

And you equal? The last last time we did a show might have been when Into the Storm came out.

It might have been.

It might have been.

Time I was here.

Time I was here.

That's when the special effects people are like, this is our time.

That's when the special effects people are like, this is our time.

That cracked their knuckles. They've been like, let's.

That cracked their knuckles. They've been like, let's.

Go Into the Storm, Hurricane Heist. Like these kind of movies that are just kind of like what most people would consider bullshit. I'm like, my man Rushwood watches with me and we're gonna have a good time. So what is it like going from movie reviewer critic to writer and then you know, having to deal with well, actually, before we even get to deal with criticism, having to see what it's like making the sausage from the inside and how it turns out versus like what you thought going in.

Go Into the Storm, Hurricane Heist. Like these kind of movies that are just kind of like what most people would consider bullshit. I'm like, my man Rushwood watches with me and we're gonna have a good time. So what is it like going from movie reviewer critic to writer and then you know, having to deal with well, actually, before we even get to deal with criticism, having to see what it's like making the sausage from the inside and how it turns out versus like what you thought going in.

Yeah, first of all, I'm so glad you brought up that and gave me an excuse to dropping Into the Storm reference. I was looking at some of my old like social media posts recently, and I saw a series of Donkin Reeves posts and they were like the two sort of like Hillbillies and Into the Storm that were so jazz, you know everything, and we're getting into trouble. Yeah, the like super like ignorant redneck like dudes who were chasing the storm.

Yeah, first of all, I'm so glad you brought up that and gave me an excuse to dropping Into the Storm reference. I was looking at some of my old like social media posts recently, and I saw a series of Donkin Reeves posts and they were like the two sort of like Hillbillies and Into the Storm that were so jazz, you know everything, and we're getting into trouble. Yeah, the like super like ignorant redneck like dudes who were chasing the storm.

Dude.

Dude.

So good, so good. You need that character in these movies.

So good, so good. You need that character in these movies.

Uh.

Uh.

In terms of seeing how the sausage gets made, it has. I don't know if it's just this or this in a combination of old age, but it softened to me for sure. Right. I feel a lot more inclined when I watch a movie to be mindful of what my response is especially given Like so here's I know, we'll talk about criticism in a minute, but when you know, a sum of the reviews came out, thank you. When some of the reviews came out for Hot Frosty, you know, there were lines that critics that really loved the movie cited that I didn't write right. And then there were also lines by the people who really really hated the movie that I didn't write. You know, So when you're writing, you're at the bottom of the totem pole. You know, the actors will do some improving. Some of that stuff will make it into the movie. Some of it is really good. Let's be clear, these are very talented people making these movies and they're so so good. So the actors add things. Directors add things, you know obviously in the cut. You know, producers will ask that some things get added later into the mix, you know, via some some you know, some dubbing later. So it's made me less inclined to go like the writing sucks, or the directing was bad, or the or the acting was bad. Right, the actors don't control what the editor and the director and the producers choose to include within you know the thing. They're just out there trying their best, and they might have some really good stuff that doesn't make it into the movie, and then there's a take in there and they're watching it going, what the hell, why didn't they use take three? I I killed it on take three, you know. So it's so so collaborative. So I think it has made me kinder in that respect. It also makes me far far more in tune with when something doesn't work in a movie. I can see the studio notes as I'm watching the movie, all right, I can see where, you know, one of the things that always drives me nuts and movies especially this takes place in like fantasies and sci fi's mostly where they do the opening narration where they're like, you know, long Borderlands just did this. When the Borderlands movie came out, they were like, long ago, there was a planet called the Global Glorp, and there was the Magic Cup of Sweater Town and you know whatever, and there's all this stuff, and then five minutes into the movie the character is going, well, I'm from the planet Global Glorp and there's the Magic Cup of Sweater to It's like whoa wait a minute. We just heard this five minutes ago, and you can tell that some suit was like, I don't think people are going to understand what's going on unless they hear it twice. Yes, right, which is the audience is smart. The audience does not need that. So I see notes all the time.

In terms of seeing how the sausage gets made, it has. I don't know if it's just this or this in a combination of old age, but it softened to me for sure. Right. I feel a lot more inclined when I watch a movie to be mindful of what my response is especially given Like so here's I know, we'll talk about criticism in a minute, but when you know, a sum of the reviews came out, thank you. When some of the reviews came out for Hot Frosty, you know, there were lines that critics that really loved the movie cited that I didn't write right. And then there were also lines by the people who really really hated the movie that I didn't write. You know, So when you're writing, you're at the bottom of the totem pole. You know, the actors will do some improving. Some of that stuff will make it into the movie. Some of it is really good. Let's be clear, these are very talented people making these movies and they're so so good. So the actors add things. Directors add things, you know obviously in the cut. You know, producers will ask that some things get added later into the mix, you know, via some some you know, some dubbing later. So it's made me less inclined to go like the writing sucks, or the directing was bad, or the or the acting was bad. Right, the actors don't control what the editor and the director and the producers choose to include within you know the thing. They're just out there trying their best, and they might have some really good stuff that doesn't make it into the movie, and then there's a take in there and they're watching it going, what the hell, why didn't they use take three? I I killed it on take three, you know. So it's so so collaborative. So I think it has made me kinder in that respect. It also makes me far far more in tune with when something doesn't work in a movie. I can see the studio notes as I'm watching the movie, all right, I can see where, you know, one of the things that always drives me nuts and movies especially this takes place in like fantasies and sci fi's mostly where they do the opening narration where they're like, you know, long Borderlands just did this. When the Borderlands movie came out, they were like, long ago, there was a planet called the Global Glorp, and there was the Magic Cup of Sweater Town and you know whatever, and there's all this stuff, and then five minutes into the movie the character is going, well, I'm from the planet Global Glorp and there's the Magic Cup of Sweater to It's like whoa wait a minute. We just heard this five minutes ago, and you can tell that some suit was like, I don't think people are going to understand what's going on unless they hear it twice. Yes, right, which is the audience is smart. The audience does not need that. So I see notes all the time.

Now.

Now.

I'm far more inclined. When I see a movie that I don't like and I write about it on letterbox or whatever, I'm like, I can I can see the interference here. Madam Webb was was a great example of this, like did it work? No, but does it very clearly reek of lots and lots of tinkering after the fact. Absolutely, So you know it has made me kinder in that respect.

I'm far more inclined. When I see a movie that I don't like and I write about it on letterbox or whatever, I'm like, I can I can see the interference here. Madam Webb was was a great example of this, like did it work? No, but does it very clearly reek of lots and lots of tinkering after the fact. Absolutely, So you know it has made me kinder in that respect.

I think absolutely. First of all, it's hell of funny that two message where guys we got IMDb pages ten years or whatever the fuck. That's crazy. But when I was writing for Game Theory, it really gave me a huge, a hugely different perspective on the process and what I'm critical of and what goes into making something. There's things I wrote that I thought were brilliant. Killed in the Room does all the stuff, and then like maybe the act out doesn't work. Maybe some suit just gets very uptight about at the last second. There's stuff that's funny as hell to me. But I also get why we can't do it right. Like I remember once we're writing about Tiger Woods and the Masters and uh, and I wrote a line that, uh, the Augusta Club has get.

I think absolutely. First of all, it's hell of funny that two message where guys we got IMDb pages ten years or whatever the fuck. That's crazy. But when I was writing for Game Theory, it really gave me a huge, a hugely different perspective on the process and what I'm critical of and what goes into making something. There's things I wrote that I thought were brilliant. Killed in the Room does all the stuff, and then like maybe the act out doesn't work. Maybe some suit just gets very uptight about at the last second. There's stuff that's funny as hell to me. But I also get why we can't do it right. Like I remember once we're writing about Tiger Woods and the Masters and uh, and I wrote a line that, uh, the Augusta Club has get.

In trouble now, don't get in trouble, right.

In trouble now, don't get in trouble, right.

I mean it's not it's not game theory, so we can say it here. But I was like, Augusta, uh has a history of racism, it only has nine black members, and Condoleeza Rice and and everybody was like, we can't say that, you know, like just like the room like erupted and laughter and is immediately like you take that out.

I mean it's not it's not game theory, so we can say it here. But I was like, Augusta, uh has a history of racism, it only has nine black members, and Condoleeza Rice and and everybody was like, we can't say that, you know, like just like the room like erupted and laughter and is immediately like you take that out.

Which totally totally get.

Which totally totally get.

Like a lot of stuff people laugh and somebody go absolutely not.

Like a lot of stuff people laugh and somebody go absolutely not.

That was a joke I had about like a Wayne's Brother or something like one of the Wayne's Brother's movies. But the one of the Wayn's brothers is friends with one of the other people in the So it's like, that's funny. Take that out, you know what I mean. Like it's just so like stuff like that where you're like, man, maybe this would have been a ten out of ten funny film, but now it's eight out of ten in my head. And then also there's just just the other part of it, taking your ego out. Sometimes people actually just have funnier things. And one of the things I was able to do and I and I weren't, I'm gonna throw it back to you and ask if you were able to do it. Being on set when something's being made as a writer is so much more illuminating because as you get to see what people add to your work that actually makes it better than what you could have imagined. Because being a writer's a little bit being a control free It's like robot move a say here, do this, do this line, make this face in your head. That's because you have to be that way to write. But then when you get there and it's like Craig Robinson, who's who's fucking Craig Robinson pretty much knows what funny is. And you're like, well, I thought maybe this, And he's like, what if I pull out my keyboard and play a song right here? You're like, oh, fuck, yes, no, please do that. I fuck what I said. So did you ever have those experiences when you're on this. Did you get to be on set and did it, you know, broaden your horizons that way?

That was a joke I had about like a Wayne's Brother or something like one of the Wayne's Brother's movies. But the one of the Wayn's brothers is friends with one of the other people in the So it's like, that's funny. Take that out, you know what I mean. Like it's just so like stuff like that where you're like, man, maybe this would have been a ten out of ten funny film, but now it's eight out of ten in my head. And then also there's just just the other part of it, taking your ego out. Sometimes people actually just have funnier things. And one of the things I was able to do and I and I weren't, I'm gonna throw it back to you and ask if you were able to do it. Being on set when something's being made as a writer is so much more illuminating because as you get to see what people add to your work that actually makes it better than what you could have imagined. Because being a writer's a little bit being a control free It's like robot move a say here, do this, do this line, make this face in your head. That's because you have to be that way to write. But then when you get there and it's like Craig Robinson, who's who's fucking Craig Robinson pretty much knows what funny is. And you're like, well, I thought maybe this, And he's like, what if I pull out my keyboard and play a song right here? You're like, oh, fuck, yes, no, please do that. I fuck what I said. So did you ever have those experiences when you're on this. Did you get to be on set and did it, you know, broaden your horizons that way?

Yeah, I mean Craig. Getting Craig on was a real joy. Obviously. It was definitely the one thing that you know, when he was circling it, I had heard, you know, we would like to have a point in here where he sings in places his keyboard. I was like, all right, great, and so I think I literally put into the script character enters and Sheriff Hunter is playing on the keyboard and singing a song that he made up, you know, And I didn't bother doing anything. I'm not gonna write something funnier or catchier than Craig in that scenario. So it was just like, let me, you know, set the pins up, hand him the ball, and then you know he can go right.

Yeah, I mean Craig. Getting Craig on was a real joy. Obviously. It was definitely the one thing that you know, when he was circling it, I had heard, you know, we would like to have a point in here where he sings in places his keyboard. I was like, all right, great, and so I think I literally put into the script character enters and Sheriff Hunter is playing on the keyboard and singing a song that he made up, you know, And I didn't bother doing anything. I'm not gonna write something funnier or catchier than Craig in that scenario. So it was just like, let me, you know, set the pins up, hand him the ball, and then you know he can go right.

And I love that. I love that. Yea, sometimes people can be like uptight about that, but I love that he's a good sport and that it's like, yes, of course I'm Craig Robinson. I know how to play a keyboard and I know how to sing. I would love to make something up for this part of the movie that that's so dope, because you know, having been on set. I've experienced the opposite, where it's just like, hey man, you're a comedian and you always say this, and they're like, listen, unless you're gonna write the joke. It's like, oh fuck, never mind, never mind, let me go back to my fucking room and get on the get on the top of the script.

And I love that. I love that. Yea, sometimes people can be like uptight about that, but I love that he's a good sport and that it's like, yes, of course I'm Craig Robinson. I know how to play a keyboard and I know how to sing. I would love to make something up for this part of the movie that that's so dope, because you know, having been on set. I've experienced the opposite, where it's just like, hey man, you're a comedian and you always say this, and they're like, listen, unless you're gonna write the joke. It's like, oh fuck, never mind, never mind, let me go back to my fucking room and get on the get on the top of the script.

Yeah. It also when you're on set, you realize how much of it is like them putting their ass out there, like it's their face, it's their name. So often if the movie doesn't work, they're the face associated with the movie. Like people will talk shit about me online if they don't like it. They'll be like the writer sucks or whatever. And they always say the writer sucks if they don't like it. But more than anything, people will drag actors like it would be so so cruel to actors. Yeah, so I am very cognizant of that now, having been on a few sets at this point. But Craig and Joe and honestly everybody, more than anything else I got. I'm thinking of one scene in particular, where it's a line that I really liked, where they're outside the diner they see the snowman is inside and Craig sort of with his in his very CSI Miami kind of vibe, goes Hello stranger, and then Joe's character ed goes, hey, you're gonna need to speak up. I don't think they can hear you through the glass, right like reading it, reading it as earnest, you know, I just I love nothing more than a character who's kind of deluded and then having somebody who's a sidekick who is just so sweet natured and takes everything very literally. That's always a dynamic I think is really funny. And so I got to watch that scene and they did it maybe eight times with in one. You know, they didn't call cut or anything, and they just had Joe over and over and over again. Do it slightly different every time, you know, have Craig say Hello stranger, slightly different every time. And they figured, oh, we'll find the one that we like later. The joke is still the joke from the script. The wording might be a little different, The intention in terms of how I visualized it, visualized it being played might be a little different, but the spirit of the thing remains, and more than anything else, it's a best joke wins and it's a are is everybody on the same page and in the same movie and committed to sort of the tone that we wanted here. Were Yes, we're we're self aware a bit, but we're never self aware to the point where it keeps the emotion, uh and the you know, reality of the characters completely at arm's length. We didn't want to do a Sharknado thing here. We wanted to do something where we really cared about the characters. And Craig and Joe both obviously from Office Brooklyn nine nine and all the things they've done, they're so so good at telling something that getting to something truthful with a character that is very larger than life and very silly. That's so we were really blessed to get the tip of that. We're blessed to get everybody.

Yeah. It also when you're on set, you realize how much of it is like them putting their ass out there, like it's their face, it's their name. So often if the movie doesn't work, they're the face associated with the movie. Like people will talk shit about me online if they don't like it. They'll be like the writer sucks or whatever. And they always say the writer sucks if they don't like it. But more than anything, people will drag actors like it would be so so cruel to actors. Yeah, so I am very cognizant of that now, having been on a few sets at this point. But Craig and Joe and honestly everybody, more than anything else I got. I'm thinking of one scene in particular, where it's a line that I really liked, where they're outside the diner they see the snowman is inside and Craig sort of with his in his very CSI Miami kind of vibe, goes Hello stranger, and then Joe's character ed goes, hey, you're gonna need to speak up. I don't think they can hear you through the glass, right like reading it, reading it as earnest, you know, I just I love nothing more than a character who's kind of deluded and then having somebody who's a sidekick who is just so sweet natured and takes everything very literally. That's always a dynamic I think is really funny. And so I got to watch that scene and they did it maybe eight times with in one. You know, they didn't call cut or anything, and they just had Joe over and over and over again. Do it slightly different every time, you know, have Craig say Hello stranger, slightly different every time. And they figured, oh, we'll find the one that we like later. The joke is still the joke from the script. The wording might be a little different, The intention in terms of how I visualized it, visualized it being played might be a little different, but the spirit of the thing remains, and more than anything else, it's a best joke wins and it's a are is everybody on the same page and in the same movie and committed to sort of the tone that we wanted here. Were Yes, we're we're self aware a bit, but we're never self aware to the point where it keeps the emotion, uh and the you know, reality of the characters completely at arm's length. We didn't want to do a Sharknado thing here. We wanted to do something where we really cared about the characters. And Craig and Joe both obviously from Office Brooklyn nine nine and all the things they've done, they're so so good at telling something that getting to something truthful with a character that is very larger than life and very silly. That's so we were really blessed to get the tip of that. We're blessed to get everybody.

That is so fun because I remember was too. We had remember when John Morant got into that bullshit and he had the gun and and he was at the strip club. I remember, I remember, uh that we were doing that on Game Theory. And so they have this they have what they call side but it's basically just video. So they play video and then when you come out of it, you come back to the host, right the host is now the person on screen, and every time you come out of video you need to have like a joke there. It's just that's just how it works. So we had pitched all these jokes and I had this joke that it just kept killing in the room in the writer's room. So this is me doing the act out, not both and so and we come out of the side and it's you know, if you remember the video, he's holding this little ass gun up and dancing the club. And I was like, if we come back from the side, come out of the side, come back to boat and Bowl's just going pew with the little gun. But Bow can't do that kind of silly.

That is so fun because I remember was too. We had remember when John Morant got into that bullshit and he had the gun and and he was at the strip club. I remember, I remember, uh that we were doing that on Game Theory. And so they have this they have what they call side but it's basically just video. So they play video and then when you come out of it, you come back to the host, right the host is now the person on screen, and every time you come out of video you need to have like a joke there. It's just that's just how it works. So we had pitched all these jokes and I had this joke that it just kept killing in the room in the writer's room. So this is me doing the act out, not both and so and we come out of the side and it's you know, if you remember the video, he's holding this little ass gun up and dancing the club. And I was like, if we come back from the side, come out of the side, come back to boat and Bowl's just going pew with the little gun. But Bow can't do that kind of silly.

Like that's so you have to commit.

Like that's so you have to commit.

Yeah, he has a basic voice, a serious demeanor and like while it like and like he killed it the first read, so it killed the and it was like that's the joke, like, don't even look at anything else. But then we get to like the second read to take it. Each time we got a little less and so it as Russid being on the same page, way more important than the ego of like it needs to be my joke, it needs to be something that works. There's a way where you get that joke in there and yeah, your ego say it, but then it doesn't land on the screen and it just becomes everyone's failure, Craig failure, your failure, the movie failure, the director's failure, as opposed to being like, let's just roll with what works. So like, kudos to you for even seeing that. Now, how many movies have you got to be on the set for it? Because I'm looking at your IMDb? Okay, you missed the Christmas over here. You got like, at least you have Web of Liized twenty eighteen. Then you have a Mary Measure, the Santa Summit, Hot Frosty, Three Wives of Men, and a Boy Christmas under the Lights, and you got another movie coming out, the Santa Class, which I believe comes out this weekend. So you're mister Christmas. Now have you got to be on the set for each of these?

Yeah, he has a basic voice, a serious demeanor and like while it like and like he killed it the first read, so it killed the and it was like that's the joke, like, don't even look at anything else. But then we get to like the second read to take it. Each time we got a little less and so it as Russid being on the same page, way more important than the ego of like it needs to be my joke, it needs to be something that works. There's a way where you get that joke in there and yeah, your ego say it, but then it doesn't land on the screen and it just becomes everyone's failure, Craig failure, your failure, the movie failure, the director's failure, as opposed to being like, let's just roll with what works. So like, kudos to you for even seeing that. Now, how many movies have you got to be on the set for it? Because I'm looking at your IMDb? Okay, you missed the Christmas over here. You got like, at least you have Web of Liized twenty eighteen. Then you have a Mary Measure, the Santa Summit, Hot Frosty, Three Wives of Men, and a Boy Christmas under the Lights, and you got another movie coming out, the Santa Class, which I believe comes out this weekend. So you're mister Christmas. Now have you got to be on the set for each of these?

Like?

Like?

What's that process?

What's that process?

Like some of them are? This was my third set, I think Hot Frosty. I was on set for Hot Frosty, I was on set for a Mary Measure, I was on set for Santa Class. Santa Summit shot in Winnipeg in February, and a Flying from LA to Winnipeg is expensive, and b it was zero degrees when they were shooting it. I thought it would be you know, maybe I had I'd have something else going on at that time, you know. And then three wivesman Christmas under the lights. It was just a busy year, so I wasn't able to get to everything, unfortunately, because I love nothing more than being on set. I absolutely love it. Learn you learn so much. I do think that it's useful in terms of getting to know the talent, getting to know the producers, the directors. Showing them that you're not overly precious, I think is a huge thing. Again, there are some writers that producers and directors will probably work with that might gum up the works or take too long, or really fight back over things that don't really require it. Sometimes things do need a conversation, but generally speaking, there are very few things where you have to be like, no, it is my way or the highway. You are wrong and I am right now. I've gone to bad a couple times like that, but very infrequently. And so the more that people will get to see me and get to know who I am and get to know, oh, he works efficiently he's not overly precious. He's got really good dialogue, he's got a great sense of structure, he loves coming up with jokes, you know, on the set, he's good with the talent. The talent knows him and trusts him. Then hopefully, the more I can do that, the more I can be included in the process, the more I can just sit in on meetings where decisions that end up in the final movie that maybe I don't think work, then I could at least say, hey, what if we tried it this way instead. Now they might still choose to do it that way, that's completely fine, but then at least I know, okay, well, you know it's different when you watch a movie and you're like, wait a minute, why exactly was this the decision that was made? And again, I've been incredibly unfortunate. I've been incredibly fortunate. Yeah, I've been incredibly fortunate that I have had very very few of those, are there? They tend to be very small and nitpicky things and not big things.

Like some of them are? This was my third set, I think Hot Frosty. I was on set for Hot Frosty, I was on set for a Mary Measure, I was on set for Santa Class. Santa Summit shot in Winnipeg in February, and a Flying from LA to Winnipeg is expensive, and b it was zero degrees when they were shooting it. I thought it would be you know, maybe I had I'd have something else going on at that time, you know. And then three wivesman Christmas under the lights. It was just a busy year, so I wasn't able to get to everything, unfortunately, because I love nothing more than being on set. I absolutely love it. Learn you learn so much. I do think that it's useful in terms of getting to know the talent, getting to know the producers, the directors. Showing them that you're not overly precious, I think is a huge thing. Again, there are some writers that producers and directors will probably work with that might gum up the works or take too long, or really fight back over things that don't really require it. Sometimes things do need a conversation, but generally speaking, there are very few things where you have to be like, no, it is my way or the highway. You are wrong and I am right now. I've gone to bad a couple times like that, but very infrequently. And so the more that people will get to see me and get to know who I am and get to know, oh, he works efficiently he's not overly precious. He's got really good dialogue, he's got a great sense of structure, he loves coming up with jokes, you know, on the set, he's good with the talent. The talent knows him and trusts him. Then hopefully, the more I can do that, the more I can be included in the process, the more I can just sit in on meetings where decisions that end up in the final movie that maybe I don't think work, then I could at least say, hey, what if we tried it this way instead. Now they might still choose to do it that way, that's completely fine, but then at least I know, okay, well, you know it's different when you watch a movie and you're like, wait a minute, why exactly was this the decision that was made? And again, I've been incredibly unfortunate. I've been incredibly fortunate. Yeah, I've been incredibly fortunate that I have had very very few of those, are there? They tend to be very small and nitpicky things and not big things.

And also with that stuff like one being on the set was a big part of the writers strike because they were telling writers at the time like, hey, we're filming all this stuff, especially streaming stuff. You don't need to be onset for this, like we'll figure it out. Well, hell, we'll get AI on the case. It's like one, it's not even just a quality at that point. I need to be there to fucking learn. Like what if I have aspirations of being a director? What if I want to know what a fucking producer does? It helps me to write, to know what the difference between a line producer, what the fucking camera people do, what the film producer does? You know, the muscle of coming up with new stuff on the fly in while you're film is a completely different muscle than sitting in a room typing some ship. So like, there's so much you can only learn on set, and it's very important to be there. I'm glad you've had good experiences. And it's also interesting too with the uh with with all that, because my favorite thing, and it's a secret favorite thing, Okay, Like I don't think I've ever told anybody this, but I think it's I think it's secretly every writer's favorite thing. It's when you're like, this is the funny thing or the good thing, and this is how it should be, and then you get like overruled, and then they do it the other way and it fucking isn't good, and you're like, may may we give it one shot of man way. You can't be gloating though, you can't be like touchdown Den, you gotta be like, okay, we try it. And the reason you gotta be humble is because you definitely are gonna have some unfunny and good ship too. It's like like no one's clean like you. You gonna have an idea. You're like, this is it and that shit is not gonna hit and it's gonna be like, well, that was my lesson for today. But it does feel good when you have because I'm I'm like you two and that I'm gonna go along to get along person in that I'm not trying to make everything a fight. I'm not in control. Free if you think you have a better idea or I did an add on to it, let's do that ship, you know what I mean? Like, I'm not here to look better.

And also with that stuff like one being on the set was a big part of the writers strike because they were telling writers at the time like, hey, we're filming all this stuff, especially streaming stuff. You don't need to be onset for this, like we'll figure it out. Well, hell, we'll get AI on the case. It's like one, it's not even just a quality at that point. I need to be there to fucking learn. Like what if I have aspirations of being a director? What if I want to know what a fucking producer does? It helps me to write, to know what the difference between a line producer, what the fucking camera people do, what the film producer does? You know, the muscle of coming up with new stuff on the fly in while you're film is a completely different muscle than sitting in a room typing some ship. So like, there's so much you can only learn on set, and it's very important to be there. I'm glad you've had good experiences. And it's also interesting too with the uh with with all that, because my favorite thing, and it's a secret favorite thing, Okay, Like I don't think I've ever told anybody this, but I think it's I think it's secretly every writer's favorite thing. It's when you're like, this is the funny thing or the good thing, and this is how it should be, and then you get like overruled, and then they do it the other way and it fucking isn't good, and you're like, may may we give it one shot of man way. You can't be gloating though, you can't be like touchdown Den, you gotta be like, okay, we try it. And the reason you gotta be humble is because you definitely are gonna have some unfunny and good ship too. It's like like no one's clean like you. You gonna have an idea. You're like, this is it and that shit is not gonna hit and it's gonna be like, well, that was my lesson for today. But it does feel good when you have because I'm I'm like you two and that I'm gonna go along to get along person in that I'm not trying to make everything a fight. I'm not in control. Free if you think you have a better idea or I did an add on to it, let's do that ship, you know what I mean? Like, I'm not here to look better.

We look better if somebody has a better idea, we look better.

We look better if somebody has a better idea, we look better.

No one, no one at home know so so whatever's best is best, but it is good whenever it's like honey, y'all thought that ship was better than mine. Anyway, y'all want to try the way it was written one time. Now. The other thing, too, is now that you've seen how it turns out, you getting reviews in comments, A lot of a lot of stuff with Hot Frosty is just kind of like either love it in spite of itself or like genuinely love it or the like. It's almost like I'm supposed to hate this, but I can't stop talking about this because I feel like the Christmas romance movie has a bad It's almost like the sci fi movie where it's like shark versus alligator or whatever, Like it's it's that it's sharknait or it's like you're not supposed to like these, right, We're not supposed Just like there's a certain type of person that this is their shit, yes, and they're gonna they're gonna watch them all every Christmas. But Dore's a this Hot Frosty I feel like has gone beyond just the like just the insular bubble of like these this is certain people's ship and it's all they watch. This is pop culture now. People, my friends who don't watch this shit are like like, hey, man, you heard this hot Frosty movie. I'm like my friend wrote that, like, I'm like, this is becoming a big deal. So now you're getting reviews, You're getting the likes dislikes. How is it affecting you? Does any of his stick? Does a good stick? Does a bad stick? Are you able to laugh at the bad?

No one, no one at home know so so whatever's best is best, but it is good whenever it's like honey, y'all thought that ship was better than mine. Anyway, y'all want to try the way it was written one time. Now. The other thing, too, is now that you've seen how it turns out, you getting reviews in comments, A lot of a lot of stuff with Hot Frosty is just kind of like either love it in spite of itself or like genuinely love it or the like. It's almost like I'm supposed to hate this, but I can't stop talking about this because I feel like the Christmas romance movie has a bad It's almost like the sci fi movie where it's like shark versus alligator or whatever, Like it's it's that it's sharknait or it's like you're not supposed to like these, right, We're not supposed Just like there's a certain type of person that this is their shit, yes, and they're gonna they're gonna watch them all every Christmas. But Dore's a this Hot Frosty I feel like has gone beyond just the like just the insular bubble of like these this is certain people's ship and it's all they watch. This is pop culture now. People, my friends who don't watch this shit are like like, hey, man, you heard this hot Frosty movie. I'm like my friend wrote that, like, I'm like, this is becoming a big deal. So now you're getting reviews, You're getting the likes dislikes. How is it affecting you? Does any of his stick? Does a good stick? Does a bad stick? Are you able to laugh at the bad?

Like?

Like?

What is what goes on with the review?

What is what goes on with the review?

Yeah? It's complicated, right, you know, doing Hallmark movies primarily up to this point, the people who write about Hallmark movies or whatever are generally fans of Hallmark movies, right, you know, And I feel pretty confident that I can make a really good and distinctive and interesting Hallmark movie, Like I know Mary in the comments said, you know, I love a big city boss woman going home for the holidays and falling in love with the Christmas tree lot owner. You know. You know, I think I'm very fortunate that I came into Hallmark when they started really expanding what a Hallmark movie could be. So for the last like three years, the sandbox has gotten a lot bigger, or maybe the sandbox is the same, but I can stretch my leg like way outside of it, like this one that's coming up on Saturday. Santa Class. It's about a school for shopping mall Santa's. It's a very sort of when I was writing, and I was thinking a lot of like eighties camp movies, you know that sort of thing where it's the misfit Santa Crue versus the you know, the sort of rich kid, super perfect Santa Cruz in a competition, and our misfits happen upon the real Santa who has amnesia and doesn't remember who he is. So how do you remind Santa who he is? He can't just tell somebody they're Santa, then they won't believe you, right, So how do you jog the memory? How can this Santa be used to win this competition? How Like? This is the sort of thing that three years ago in Hallmark, probably more like five years ago just simply would not fly. Ye right, It would definitely have needed. Yeah, they would have needed the big city boss woman going home for the holidays and falling in love with the Christmas tree owner. Absolutely right. So now that they're looking to really expand what that is, they're a little more aware, they're a little more cognizant of the tropes and trying to avoid them when possible. So they'll just tell me, you know, it's got to have a lot of Christmas. They got a kiss at the end, but you know, beyond that, go with God and have a good time, right, Like, let's just it's got to be TVG you know, but like let's have as much fun with it as we can. So to answer your question about the criticism for Hallmark writers, I do think that my movies work really well. I've been very fortunate with the talent that's been attached and the producers, the execs, they've all understood on going for they agree, they've progressed it, and it's all worked really nice. This Netflix thing, I knew was going to be the first one that was going to reach further just because it's Netflix, and Netflix is so much bigger. It is so much bigger, so much more reach, And I was scared. I was definitely scared. I knew how to handle negative reviews from Hallmark. Like, you know, my movies are definitely different than some of the old school Hallmark things. Maybe it's just not your bread and butter. I think it's very easy when you see a negative review where clearly it's just not what that person's into great say no more right, You're totally entitled to that. And generally speaking, Hallmark writers aren't very mean and vindictive when writing about the movies. People when writing about Netflix movies, will be mean and vindictive. They will definitely go there, which is very interesting. So I wasn't sure how to handle it. I was very fortunate that many of the reviews from the critics were very, very nice. They got it, they understood what we were going for. We were going for something that was a little more I love like movies from the thirties and forties. You know, screwball comedies, old school romance. You know you're Frank Kapri, your Preston Sturge, is your Ernst Lubitsch. I mean, like, these are people that I look to all the time. We were definitely going for that degree of sweetness and sincerity in it, and I knew there would be people who who wanted like just the one where he's super hot and has sex with everybody or whatever, Like we just we weren't gonna do that. We were gonna make him super hot, but we didn't know. We didn't want to go like the romance novel porno version of the thing didn't We didn't want to do something where we're winking at the camera the whole time, being like, how dumb is this premise? Isn't this so stupid? You know, we're trying to use a very silly premise because my taste also runs very silly as it comes to comedy. We're trying to use that to then get to something earnest. I think one of the reviews, the review from The Guardian, I don't remember who said this, but they said it's sincerely stupid, but it goes about it sincerely yes, And I was like, yes, that's what That's exactly what I'm going for. That's a perfect description of what I love. You know.

Yeah? It's complicated, right, you know, doing Hallmark movies primarily up to this point, the people who write about Hallmark movies or whatever are generally fans of Hallmark movies, right, you know, And I feel pretty confident that I can make a really good and distinctive and interesting Hallmark movie, Like I know Mary in the comments said, you know, I love a big city boss woman going home for the holidays and falling in love with the Christmas tree lot owner. You know. You know, I think I'm very fortunate that I came into Hallmark when they started really expanding what a Hallmark movie could be. So for the last like three years, the sandbox has gotten a lot bigger, or maybe the sandbox is the same, but I can stretch my leg like way outside of it, like this one that's coming up on Saturday. Santa Class. It's about a school for shopping mall Santa's. It's a very sort of when I was writing, and I was thinking a lot of like eighties camp movies, you know that sort of thing where it's the misfit Santa Crue versus the you know, the sort of rich kid, super perfect Santa Cruz in a competition, and our misfits happen upon the real Santa who has amnesia and doesn't remember who he is. So how do you remind Santa who he is? He can't just tell somebody they're Santa, then they won't believe you, right, So how do you jog the memory? How can this Santa be used to win this competition? How Like? This is the sort of thing that three years ago in Hallmark, probably more like five years ago just simply would not fly. Ye right, It would definitely have needed. Yeah, they would have needed the big city boss woman going home for the holidays and falling in love with the Christmas tree owner. Absolutely right. So now that they're looking to really expand what that is, they're a little more aware, they're a little more cognizant of the tropes and trying to avoid them when possible. So they'll just tell me, you know, it's got to have a lot of Christmas. They got a kiss at the end, but you know, beyond that, go with God and have a good time, right, Like, let's just it's got to be TVG you know, but like let's have as much fun with it as we can. So to answer your question about the criticism for Hallmark writers, I do think that my movies work really well. I've been very fortunate with the talent that's been attached and the producers, the execs, they've all understood on going for they agree, they've progressed it, and it's all worked really nice. This Netflix thing, I knew was going to be the first one that was going to reach further just because it's Netflix, and Netflix is so much bigger. It is so much bigger, so much more reach, And I was scared. I was definitely scared. I knew how to handle negative reviews from Hallmark. Like, you know, my movies are definitely different than some of the old school Hallmark things. Maybe it's just not your bread and butter. I think it's very easy when you see a negative review where clearly it's just not what that person's into great say no more right, You're totally entitled to that. And generally speaking, Hallmark writers aren't very mean and vindictive when writing about the movies. People when writing about Netflix movies, will be mean and vindictive. They will definitely go there, which is very interesting. So I wasn't sure how to handle it. I was very fortunate that many of the reviews from the critics were very, very nice. They got it, they understood what we were going for. We were going for something that was a little more I love like movies from the thirties and forties. You know, screwball comedies, old school romance. You know you're Frank Kapri, your Preston Sturge, is your Ernst Lubitsch. I mean, like, these are people that I look to all the time. We were definitely going for that degree of sweetness and sincerity in it, and I knew there would be people who who wanted like just the one where he's super hot and has sex with everybody or whatever, Like we just we weren't gonna do that. We were gonna make him super hot, but we didn't know. We didn't want to go like the romance novel porno version of the thing didn't We didn't want to do something where we're winking at the camera the whole time, being like, how dumb is this premise? Isn't this so stupid? You know, we're trying to use a very silly premise because my taste also runs very silly as it comes to comedy. We're trying to use that to then get to something earnest. I think one of the reviews, the review from The Guardian, I don't remember who said this, but they said it's sincerely stupid, but it goes about it sincerely yes, And I was like, yes, that's what That's exactly what I'm going for. That's a perfect description of what I love. You know.

I was talking with a friend who watched the movie, and he's a comedian, so he's like roasting the movie but also, you know, like get you is that thing where like you can tell that he enjoyed watching it and he but he also is roasting the shit out of it, right and and so I'm listening to him and I'm like, all right, well, this is gonna blow your mind. That's my buddy who wrote that. And he's like, what, I have so many questions to ask him and stuff. I was like, but you know what I said, knowing knowing Russ, the mirth in your voice, the smile on your face even as you're roasting and you're asking these you know, he's asking these questions like why does he have underwear on? If you just discover what clothes are whatever, I was like, that ship would make that would make Russ laugh, Like I don't think I don't think Russ would take it to this, like my art how daddy, Like I think Russ's like, it's kind of goofy, but like I wanted, I want you to feel kind of goofy. What it reminded me of. I don't even know if you watch this show, but it's like probably my favorite show. It kind of reminds me of American Dad. And I mean that in the best way, because I have a lot of reverence for American Dad and that it can be silly, but there's like a core and a smartness to the silliness of it, Like the Pretty Woman montage, like I was fucking dying because like it was I don't know, Like it's it's at Craig Robinson's who's in American Dad and plays like a detective that's based off of far As Whitaker's Detective on the Shield, so like it. Yeah, it was given like a type of synergy that made me be like, noah, man, I'm into this silly shit, and this is not my genre of movie, Like, this is not something I necessarily would like watch. So it was it was like nah, and it wasn't even that you wrote it. It was literally like everybody's talking about it. I think I gotta watch it. Everybody been talking about it, like bird Box, like I don't want to be out the fucking look was like you.

I was talking with a friend who watched the movie, and he's a comedian, so he's like roasting the movie but also, you know, like get you is that thing where like you can tell that he enjoyed watching it and he but he also is roasting the shit out of it, right and and so I'm listening to him and I'm like, all right, well, this is gonna blow your mind. That's my buddy who wrote that. And he's like, what, I have so many questions to ask him and stuff. I was like, but you know what I said, knowing knowing Russ, the mirth in your voice, the smile on your face even as you're roasting and you're asking these you know, he's asking these questions like why does he have underwear on? If you just discover what clothes are whatever, I was like, that ship would make that would make Russ laugh, Like I don't think I don't think Russ would take it to this, like my art how daddy, Like I think Russ's like, it's kind of goofy, but like I wanted, I want you to feel kind of goofy. What it reminded me of. I don't even know if you watch this show, but it's like probably my favorite show. It kind of reminds me of American Dad. And I mean that in the best way, because I have a lot of reverence for American Dad and that it can be silly, but there's like a core and a smartness to the silliness of it, Like the Pretty Woman montage, like I was fucking dying because like it was I don't know, Like it's it's at Craig Robinson's who's in American Dad and plays like a detective that's based off of far As Whitaker's Detective on the Shield, so like it. Yeah, it was given like a type of synergy that made me be like, noah, man, I'm into this silly shit, and this is not my genre of movie, Like, this is not something I necessarily would like watch. So it was it was like nah, and it wasn't even that you wrote it. It was literally like everybody's talking about it. I think I gotta watch it. Everybody been talking about it, like bird Box, like I don't want to be out the fucking look was like you.

See hot Crossty. I'm like, hell was a hot Crowsty?

See hot Crossty. I'm like, hell was a hot Crowsty?

When you send out the memes, I need to know what the fuck the memes mean, you know. Yeah, I was calling the CEO shooter dude hot shooty because I was like, you know this, like appearently.

When you send out the memes, I need to know what the fuck the memes mean, you know. Yeah, I was calling the CEO shooter dude hot shooty because I was like, you know this, like appearently.

I know, I know, dude, that was crazy. I've seen all sorts of comments about that. Dude, that is wild.

I know, I know, dude, that was crazy. I've seen all sorts of comments about that. Dude, that is wild.

That's wild.

That's wild.

I had. I had nothing to do with that.

I had. I had nothing to do with that.

Let the record show you didn't write that.

Let the record show you didn't write that.

That is not that's not viral marketing for a Hot Frosty sequel. That's not nothing to do with me.

That is not that's not viral marketing for a Hot Frosty sequel. That's not nothing to do with me.

Yeah, that's wow. That must like that, like, thank god we didn't have the Internet when Ted Buddy Bundy was out here. I didn't like seeing real time less for a killer is kind of weird. It's like, oh, whoa, this is live. Do you guys know that we can see this? But no, man, it's been fun.

Yeah, that's wow. That must like that, like, thank god we didn't have the Internet when Ted Buddy Bundy was out here. I didn't like seeing real time less for a killer is kind of weird. It's like, oh, whoa, this is live. Do you guys know that we can see this? But no, man, it's been fun.

Nobody care. This is this is what kills me. And this is what I think. This ties really nicely into what I think is important about the movie. Uh, not important important in trying to make a movie, right. Uh. So much of discourse today online or even in real life is so like legled with like thick steaming piles of irony, and every single thing is like removed emotionally from what the gag is or what the thing is. Certainly that those videos on like Cinema sins or like you know, honest trailers or whatever, where when they would watch the movie trailers and be like, let's not watch it to like get lost in a story. Let's instead try to find things that we can like crack on, you know, instead of like just giving your heart over to a thing. I think that when when trying to make Hot Frosty, I really wanted it to be the sort of thing where, yes, the title is evocative and it'll get you to and it'll get you to watch it. But I wanted people right away to realize, oh, this is the sort of thing where if you emotionally invest or, if you're open to emotional investment, rather than just being like, well, I'm just gonna snark on it the whole time. If you want to snark on it, there's space for that.

Nobody care. This is this is what kills me. And this is what I think. This ties really nicely into what I think is important about the movie. Uh, not important important in trying to make a movie, right. Uh. So much of discourse today online or even in real life is so like legled with like thick steaming piles of irony, and every single thing is like removed emotionally from what the gag is or what the thing is. Certainly that those videos on like Cinema sins or like you know, honest trailers or whatever, where when they would watch the movie trailers and be like, let's not watch it to like get lost in a story. Let's instead try to find things that we can like crack on, you know, instead of like just giving your heart over to a thing. I think that when when trying to make Hot Frosty, I really wanted it to be the sort of thing where, yes, the title is evocative and it'll get you to and it'll get you to watch it. But I wanted people right away to realize, oh, this is the sort of thing where if you emotionally invest or, if you're open to emotional investment, rather than just being like, well, I'm just gonna snark on it the whole time. If you want to snark on it, there's space for that.

Yeah.

Yeah.

But like, I really appreciated how many people watched the movie and the review, the review that you may mentioned at the beginning, people said, you know, I went into this not expecting to like it, and why was it actually good? It had no business being this good. A hot frosty movie should not be this good, right, Like that kind of reviewed always tickles me. I love that because that's that that shows that they went into it ready to irony watch and instead ended up having a sincere reaction to the movie, and that that means the world to me. So yeah, absolutely, Yeah.

But like, I really appreciated how many people watched the movie and the review, the review that you may mentioned at the beginning, people said, you know, I went into this not expecting to like it, and why was it actually good? It had no business being this good. A hot frosty movie should not be this good, right, Like that kind of reviewed always tickles me. I love that because that's that that shows that they went into it ready to irony watch and instead ended up having a sincere reaction to the movie, and that that means the world to me. So yeah, absolutely, Yeah.

It is funny too, because like on his face man, as a concept, it feels like a pitch for like an S and L sketch that's gonna be three minutes, you know, like like on his like if you're like, what if Frosty Snowman was like hot, It's like what.

It is funny too, because like on his face man, as a concept, it feels like a pitch for like an S and L sketch that's gonna be three minutes, you know, like like on his like if you're like, what if Frosty Snowman was like hot, It's like what.

But genuinely, whenever I would tell people about it, I would do my best norm voice. I'd be like, he's Frosty a snowman, but then he's a super hot dude.