Welcome to another week of tape Heads. This is the podcast where we take you behind the Xers and os and give you the nerd football because we are football nerds and we love to talk not just about the Xers and os, but how we arrived there by watching the tape from a personnel standpoint. Of course, we've got Scott Pioli, longtime general manager in the NFL, and nobody breaks it down in front of the touch screen on ESPN better than Dan or Lobsky. I am Bob was Schusan. We're gonna start with the game of the week that was Cowboys Patriots, and here's how it ended. Play fake boot to the right looking down the field, lamb ten five victory Cowboys when well, Scott, it ended in thrilling fashion. Did it have to get there for the Cowboys? I guess is the question? Right when you were watching this game, how many twists and turns and moments were there where you were saying to yourself, does it have to be this hard for the Cowboys to beat this rookie quarterback in the team they're just that much better than it didn't need to be bobbed? And that's you know, as I was watching this game. I watched it live, then of course went back and watched the tape. But watching it live, I was thinking to myself, why are they making this so difficult? And there were moments where I was saying to myself, you know, this is exactly what Bill has preyed upon p R. E y preyed upon opponents for years, just waiting for them to make the mistakes. You know, it did the first half loan, the missed opportunities by Dallas, you know, the fourth and one from there, you know, from the thirty four they go for it, don't get it, and they give the Patriots seven easy points that you know, would have been seven points that could have helped the Cowboys. Later. Then the red zone throw into the end zone that was tipped became a New England interception, the third and eleven at the plus twelve where the touchdown pass was dropped in the corner in the end zone or the side of the end zone, you know, and then fourth and a half a yard and there's a quarterback sneak fumble and the I'm watching some thinking, oh my gosh. And then the penalties. This is exactly the kind of football that Um that the Patriots and Bill Belichick again have preyed upon for years and years, and they it wasn't exciting finish. There was great things to watch in the game. But to me, you know, we talked about It's funny. I would have never ever been accused of being a nerd in anything if you would have saw my academic record in high school and college. The only thing that I get nerdy about is football and clean football and watching you know, just watching a well coached, well executed game, because it's not just coaching, it's how players execute. And seeing some of the execution mistakes was driving me crazy. But you know what, good for the NFL, good for ratings. The fact is, um it was a close game at the end, and and it made for exciting watching, exciting football. Yeah, I agree so much, Scott. I'd say, first of all, I think New England's a better team than we're probably giving their record respect so to speak. I mean, they're a handful of plays away from being from beating two of the best teams in football to the best team certainly in the NFC and being fourign to you are what your record says you are. I'm aware of that, but I think they're a good football team. Now to Dallas. I thought two things really stood out for me performance wise. Number one, Dak Prescott making plays outside of the pocket. Um I actually thought it was strategic by Dak. You know, everyone knows and Scott Bob, you guys noticed that the Patriots rush a certain way, right They're really not trying to get to the quarterback all the time. They're doing everything they can to not allow creativity outside of the pocket. And I think what Dak realized, because you saw it early on in the game, was that there was gonna be a seam early on because they weren't trying to get to them. They were just trying to build a wall. And there was a seam early on in three or four plays, specifically in the first quarter, he makes plays outside of the pockets, scrambling on second and longs to go make plays. I thought that was a really big step forward with his performance. And then if we go into overtime, um I there was there was a theme of plays that showed up that I loved from Kellen Moore because I thought there was two formations from the Cowboys that they majored in four strong, meaning they put four people to the offensive strength pre snap. Sometimes it was four receivers lined up to one side. That's abnormal, right, we know trips in the NFL, trips in college football four receivers that way, or three receivers in the back the same side. That was done to attack the man coverage, to create all those bodies to one side of the field and crossers. I loved that from Kellen Moore. But then you go into overtime and the first down, first and ten, they go twelve personnel, one back, two tight ends. They put two tight ends to the same side and a tight end wing. They go slot to the opposite side, and they go run action fake to the left where those slot receivers are, and they go bootleg back to the closed side those tight ends, and Dad gives a little dump off to Blake Jarwin, great eight yards on first down. Two plays later, on first down, they come back with that same formation, same personnel, group, action towards the slot receivers. This time they handed off to Tony Pollard seven eight yards on the run. Beautiful very next down, same formation, two tight ends to one side, tight end wing, slot to the other side. They go run action to that slot receiver bootleg with Dac. Now this time Dak gets his head around and sees Jarwin on that that down flat, little bit of a flat route after the fake block, and he's there somewhat, but you can see Ceedee Lamb on the deep cross put his hand up almost like remember Randy Moss going on a go route, puts his hand up like I got it, I'm open. And Dad just quickly peeks at him out of a corner of his eye and he he trusts Cede almost, Hey, I know you're putting your hand for a reason. You know there's space, and he just kind of backs off the defense for a second, you know, just for another yard and throws that deep cross and it's game over. And I just thought it was so beautiful to watch the Cowboys, same formation, same personnel, same set, and they ran that Scott. They ran that formation ten times in that game with that action ten times. The only time he threw it to Ceedee Lamb was the game winner. You know, that's awesome. I love listening to you breakdown specific formations and how they're running plays. I want to go back to one other thing here about Dak Prescott. You know, Week one we're on the podcast and we talked a little bit about Dak and we're wondering how it was going to be and how he was going to do. And part of the what we do from a personnel standpoint, from a general manager standpoint, is we pay attention to, you know, the evaluation. And part of the evaluation is not just the physical, it's the mental, it's the most the emotional. It's getting a feel for players. And you know, I remember being asked on Good Morning Football that two days before the opener with Dallas and Tampa Bay, and I had seen an interview with Dak Prescott and I watched him, and we all watched him work during preseason. There was a lot of attention being paid to him. He didn't play in the preseason games, but we could see him work. He wasn't saying a whole lot. He was working differently and interesting what I thought to be more purposefully. Then he did this interview with Michael Irvin, and I don't know if you all remember, but it was it was an important interview and got a lot of traction. There was a look in his eyes and the way that the words came out of his mouth. I was like, oh, it's on. He was a guy who had clearly seen sens and smelled his football mortality. That injury did something to him and made him mature. He's a guy who was all about fun before and numbers and but this dude is serious right now and he has been the and we've watched in the first two weeks, this entire team once they got Zack Martin. Back to watching the offense, this is a different Cowboys offense. They're running with physicality, they're playing with physicality, They're playing with like a real intent and purpose. And I think a lot of it comes with Dac. And when I saw Dac and listen to him again, a lot of players talk, you hear cliches in that interview. There was a lot of cliches. He was staring through Michael Irvin. He was staring through the camera. And I remember thinking to myself, Okay, it is game on with this cat, and can yeah throw something else at you guys about that? And Scott you'll remember this obviously, what what was the year I mean, this guy at least ten or twelve years ago where Brady through like that quick slot up the scene pass to Welker for like the yard touchdown in my end against the Dolphins. Correct. And I remember Brian Schottenheimer at the time was the the offensive coordinator of the Jets, and I was talking to him the following week about that play and he was like, he makes that look so easy. Do you have any ideal? Hard? That is? He is in the shotgun, like five yards deep in his own end zone. The entire stadium is coming down on top of him, and he's standing there at his own balls at the one yard line, and he says, you know what, there's my matchup, bing, I'm just gonna go there. And yards later, Westwalker's in the end zone and it's like, that's Tom Brady. I don't look, I'm not gonna try to put Dak Prescott on that level yet. But when I watched this game how many times with Ceedee Lamb running with Jala Mills on his hip, right, Like, is that Prescott getting to a point now as a quarterback where he sees, there's my matchup, right, and just cool, calm and collected in the cauldron of a road game. I've got a seventh round draft choice on my wide receiver, and you know what, today, my guy's gonna catch a hundred and fifty yards and two touchdowns because I just know that's my matchup and no matter what Bill tried to do to hide that, maybe you just couldn't flume Extec Prescott in the big spot. Is he there? I think first of all, Bob, Um, Yeah, I know exactly what it's like to be backed up in my own end zone in the shotgun on the one yard. Yes, I know you brought up record, you brought up a Cincinnati Dan exactly. I'm onto two. Um. Yeah, I I absolutely think I think there are parallels to that. You know, we've we've heard the weeks leading up to this that he is very much so in the huddle, pre snap at the line of scrimmage in a world of Drew Reason and Peyton Mannings. Absolutely he is into that pre snap, you know, kind of looking at the line of scrimmage and going where's the week, where's the weakness? Because I got a bunch of strengths, where's the weakness? I got him? And I think he's absolutely entered in. When those quarterbacks learned the importance of matchups, it's like the quarterbacks that prey upon the injured player, the injured player in the secondary. When we need to see though, is I think he's entering that space. But just like anything as an evaluator, what you want to see as a pattern of behavior. He did it this week, He's done in a couple of times. He needs to stack these together consistently, and then he will enter that space of being an elite quarterback again once he starts stacking those together game after game after games, season after season. Well, we talked about it the first week we did this podcast, right on the road Tampa Bay opening night, Cowboys lost, and what did we all say. If I were Nick Siani, if I were Joe Joe, I would have been sitting there going, oh no, they might be owing one, but they're real like that looks like a team that is going to win our division. That's how good they looked at a loss, and they have it lost since. So and another guy that keeps on stacking those performances is Lamar Jackson. We're gonna talk about Lamar Jackson when we come back here on TAP. It's not just Lamar Jackson, but the job his coach is doing as well. John Harball might be doing the best coaching job in the National Football League Ravens Chargers. That is our next topic when we come back after a quick time out on Tapits, We're back here on Tapitz Bobo Schusan with Scott Pioli and Dan Orlovsky. We thought it might be the game of the week, justin Herbert against Lamar Jackson at halftime. If it was a fight, they might have stopped it because that's how good that the Baltimore Ravens were. And here's what their head coach had to say after the game. You know, there's not too many things in football that our fatal flaws, and it's not too much its terminal, you know, but there's always gonna be there's always gonna things cropping up that you've got to address and deal with. And tackling has been one of the things on defense, and it's not just how clean things that lead into and you just keep working on you get him fixed and and you go onto the next thing that's gonna come up. And that's our guys are patient that way, and they did a good job with it. And what a job Lamar Jackson has done. But what a job that John Harbaugh has done as well, because this Ravens team has suffered injury after injury, and Scott, I guess maybe it's just a jumping off point where this team started the season who they thought they were going to have on the field, and if I would have told you what they've got on the field now and they're still performing the way that they're performing. Granted, we can give all of the credit in the world to Lamar Jackson, and he deserves it. He might win another m v P with the way he is performing this season. But the personnel culture inside that building, the marriage of general manager to head coach, how they build that team, and how they keep on finding ways to fill in the cracks in Baltimore. When another crack in the damn develops, it's just they just keep finding solutions. Yeah, this is a fascinating organization, you know it was. I want to go back to when we moved from Cleveland to Baltimore and I was with the team for that first the inaugural season, and Ozzie had just taken over the franchise. Again, he he didn't have a title, he wasn't the general manager, he wasn't a vice president. Was just kind of like this title, but there was a culture that was being set in place, and and as coach March brought it but then and became coach Billick and then John Harbaugh and Eric da Costa was hired as an intern in pro personnel with me in nineties six. And the thing is that there's a culture that exists with this franchise that has been fascinating to me. I feel like this organization has had a pulse and has a pulse on the players, their locker room, the chemistry as well as any franchise since there's been some ebbs and some you know, some ups and some downs, but it's interesting. John Harbaugh, again his background special teams coach and generally speaking, special teams coaches have a really good pulse on the team. They're the only assistant coach that has to speak weekly to the entire team in team meetings because it's not offense, it's not defense, it's everybody, so they're talking to more players as a leader. Hardball has always had a pulse for players, but part of that comes culturally from Ozzy, and I go back to where you know, Ozzie first started coaching under Bill Belichick in Cleveland, and one of the most important roles that Ozzie had for Bill was to let Bill know what the pulse of the locker room was. Are the guys tired? Are they full of energy? Is that you know what's going on? Not in the sense that Ozzi was never a n arc right, he wasn't ratting on the players. He knew for the greater good, what he had to do was talk about where the players were at. And I think that that's an element that really is a part of the cultural fabric of the Baltimore Ravens. Eric de Costa learned that he knows how important is that be on the pulse of the players. John Harbaugh knows that. And to me, when I watched this club season from season, with all the changes they keep having, they seem to have this ability to have a chemistry that is so darn consistent. And it's had so much change again Harbor, Billick, Marcha, Broda, but it's all been successful and Aussie to Eric da Costa, it's one of the things that I as I watched this franchise, it's it's part of the reason why they're having so much success right now. As silly as it sounds, but I want to go back to what you did say, Bob, Lamar Jackson is an elite quarterback in this league and he you know, what he's doing is incredible. But again, away from just the performance, I love to talk about and look at what's happening behind the scenes and Harbor and DaCosta and that entire organization. Just get it. Yeah, what are the twenty five years, thirty years of really good ever since they got there, really good organizational running, so to speak. Um, I think Lamar is the most unique football player in the world. He was called the tailbacker running back coming out of Oligen. He is. He's just ridiculously good at throwing the ball as well, you know, and and that's why he is incredibly unique. UM. I actually think the game this past weekend against the Charges about the big boys upfront. I really do. Um, this has been this is the first game, in my opinion, that the Ravens one because of something outside of a ridiculous performance by Lamar. UM. I thought it was the much maligned offensive line absolutely dominating the line of scrimmage. And it was really the three guys inside. You saw it early on. Um they started to and Bob, you've heard me say this, saying all the time dent the defense. You know, they were denting the line of scrimmage, that is, changing the line of scrimmage in their run game, and it was a you know, it was kind of one of the things that we probably don't talk about enough in regards to the Ravens is the variants in their run game. They have so many different run plays. We often think, well, it's quarterback run or zone read, but they can go in run zone scheme with people outside of their tailback Devin DuVernay on jet sweep outside zone. Uh, they can go zone read your traditional they can go speed option to Davante Freeman for a touchdown. They can go quarterback counter bash where they're pulling people and he's zone reading off the end. So there's so many different plays that their offense can run, and they saw it. We saw it in this game, and I just thought they really started to push defensive tackles back into the linebackers. Two things in their past game that I liked Mark Andrews, and this is a little bit of a tape study guessing a little bit. I think that the Ravens have gotten to a point with Mark Andrews where they allow him to freelance some routes. Um. I think he's allowed to run a shallow cross, which is you know, you guys know, five or seven yards. He starts on one side of the field, goes across the other side about five or seven yards, or a deep cross, which starts on one side of field goes all the way to the other and that's about twelve the sixteen yards. I think he's allowed to do either of those, dependent upon coverage, because the stem and the route looks so similar times. And I think him in lamar See defenses so well in the same way that they're really building two plays into one so that the variance in their past game is step forward. And then Rashade Bateman was nice. It was nice to see Rashade Bateman. And this offense has got Mark Andrews in their past game, and they've got Hollywood and he can create some big place. But they really need a I can go get you six or I can go get you ten, and I can work the middle of the field in the short and kind of push the intermediate, so to speak, pass into second level. Past game. They need that guy, and Bateman brought that and I was super impressed by their offensive performance for the Chargers on the flip side, look Clark as a Swiss army knife. That's a really hard defense. Their physical when they're home there even that much better. So there was all of that stacked up against Justin Herbert. But was this a step back? Was this an eye opening? Like? Whoa, wait a minute, maybe we gotta pump the brakes a little bit on l A or do you guys stall the same level of confidence and Justin Herbert and the charges that you did going into that game picture, Yeah, I'm not. I'm not worried as a charges. You know. I remember um Brady gave me a great line. Remember when he thought it was he forgot what doubt it was. And I was talking to him after that one, and you know what he starts out. He goes, hey, babe, even Betty Crocker burns Browney every once in a while. Right, it was a great line. And when he did it made me step back. It's a you know, great line, Tommy, Can I use it's all? Yeah, it's all yours. But the point is, I think sometimes we love seeing very goodness and want to make it greatness, and even within greatness, we have to manage expectations. And the Charges are a very good football team. Justin Herbert is a fantastic quarterback. He burned the Brownies his past weekend, you know, And and and it's it's it's not um again. We love to jump on these wall they're the best ever there that they're a really good football team. They're gonna be in the mix, and there's gonna be up weeks. And this is the National Ball League right there. You played in it, Bob, You've been in it forever. This is the National Football League. Even the bad teams. And I'm doing little air quotes for those out in podcast land that can't see me. The bad teams have good players and are gonna have good weeks. And that's why that that old saying about any given Sunday, that is the truth. And any Sunday, any team is capable of beating another team. So I'm never much on the overreaction in either way. Yeah, yeah, I would say this about the Chargers, Bob. Two things. I'm completely in the same camp as Scott. They just played poorly. It was a one o'clock kick. It's a West Coast team. There's a lot of variables attached to that when you're gonna be ultra aggressive and go for it on a bunch of third and fourth downs. Obviously third down, but fourth downs, if you get them, it's called rhythm. You get a whole new set of downs. If you don't get them, it's called no rhythm. And it was a game where they didn't. They didn't convert those fourth downs. Um one, I do think something to pay attention to with this football team again as we move forward, how their front seven plays against the run. Now they were without two linebackers, so but how they're because they're gonna give you the run. That's their philosophy on defense. Brandon Stadi's gonna say, Okay, we're gonna give up the run. Um how they do though, because if you're gonna do that, you gotta go match on offense, because you're gonna get pushed around on defense, you gotta go matching on offense. Points wise, So how they do against the run is something to pay attention to. And then I did not like the timing between quarterback and receivers. That was something for the first time this year that they seemed off. To Herbert to Mike Williams, Herbert to Josh Palmer, I think those are two things worthy of paying attention to as the weeks go. And from a game management standpoint, Dan, I think something that's a right. If you loved Brandon Staley and Justin Herbert going for it all those times and getting it at Cleveland, you're not allowed to turn around now and criticize them for going forward and not giving it at Baltimore, Like you can't just play the result. So h I loved the aggressiveness that they showed in Cleveland. I had no proble thee with the aggressiveness. I agree that they showed in Baltimore and Lamar Jackson might win the m v P. But when we come back on tapeds, there's a guy playing in Arizona that might give him a run for his money because we will talk about the Cardinals and their start to the season and the game against Baker Mayfield. How worried are these guys about the Browns and Baker going forward? That and we come back in a moment on tapeds. We are back here on tapeds. They just keep rolling even without their coach. The Arizona Cardinals get a win over Baker Mayfield and the Browns. Uh got Cliff Kingsbury out in the COVID protocol. Kyler Murray after the win talked about the fact that was on the player's shoulders. I think we were excited, you know, Like I said, the odds kind of seems stacked against us. I mean, there's pretty much for us. It was just an opportunity to come out here and prove ourselves again. I guess a good team. You know, people try to make this more than what it was. But at the end of the day, we came out here um and handled what we need to handle. And Dan Kyler Murray, how high up the m v P conversation should he be when you watch him perform like this on the road? You know, obviously Lamar Jackson, we just talked about him in the last segment, how great he's been. There's probably two or three other names that are in that next wars. Kyler, he's right into the top of the conversation. I got a lot of ones in the m v P conversation. Talg Okay, there's there's a lot of guys that I can fill in at the top of the list. I think the most impressive. There's a lot about Kyler right now that is incredibly impressive. Um, I wish people truly understood how hard it is to go into a game without the guy that has been in your ear ever since you came into the NFL. He's had one voice in his ear the whole time, you know. And for for a guy who's still a young player to go do what he did this passing against the Browns was incredible. Now, I do think that I was very impressed Cliff wasn't there, and obviously the physical form Cliff was there. When it comes to watching plays get called and plays get run. Okay, first play the game, they go to take a shot downfield to Christian Kirk just because it's a seven yard touchdown if not for Miles Garrett pressure. I think there's a couple of plays that really stand out that give me the blueprint of Cliff Kingsbury. The third and twenty one touchdown to start the game. UM, I've seen that play philosophically run. So they get into like a three by one set, trips to the field, Hopkins is all the way by himself. There's a couple of things on this play that stand out. One, usually when Hopkins is out there as the the the outside receiver, and the trips you'll put him at like a what's called a minus two, which is minus two from the bottom of the numbers. That's two yards outside the numbers. He's minus six guys almost to the sidelines. I'm creating space as a as a play caller, play designer, I'm creating space. Okay, he's matched by a corner. Then he takes two receivers, Christian Kirk and Rondale Moore. And again we're in a trip set and usually that slot receiver that number two is in between DeAndre Hopkins in the number three receiver. Well, Cliff takes him and basically stands them right next to each other. Again, I am creating space now, and both these guys released down the field, and the Browns are playing a for a form of quarters coverage. They're gonna play in and out the safety in the corner. Whoever goes out the corner has, whoever goes in the safety has, and both the receivers Kirk and rondelm more push vertical, push vertical, and they're almost running on top of each other, one stacked on top of the other about fifteen yards downfield. And imagine the buying that that puts as the safety in the corner. I've got the guy that's coming out. I have no idea who was coming out. And what happens is both the receivers, the inside guys starts to lean in and the outside guards starts to lean out, and then both at the same time they criss crossed. They go opposite of their lean and it's so detailed that the coaching shows up and it ends up Kyler steps up in the pocket, peaks left to Hopkins and throws the touchdown to essentially the front pylon to Christian Kirk and I go, that's Cliff Kingsberry. And it's a ridiculous play by Harder. Don't get me wrong, but that is Cliff Kingsbury creating that throw. And then the touchdown to DeAndre Hopkins, which is his second one. It's not the third and goal from the thirteen. It's just a beautiful job by Kyler is stepping up in the pocket. He's got a back end line type of throw, and he turns his whole body and shoulders to a pivot route which is right on the goal line and kind of gives a open my body to the left. The Cleveland Browns defenders jump up and it's just a lob touchdown, And I just thought, uh, you could definitely tell that Cliff really put together a great plan in Kyler is the the player version of Cliff on the field, so to speak. I mean they talked the same way, see the same the way. So while he wasn't there, you can see the performance by the quarterback was in lockstep with the coach. Dan, I agree. You know, we just talked a little earlier about Dak Prescott and his evolution and his maturation is a quarterback and some of the things that he's doing where we say, wow, is he he might be making that next step right now? We might This might be the one of the games that we point back to where we see the maturation and the intelligence of Kyler Murray going to the next level because he did it without Cliff right there in his ear. And Dan, you brought up the point, you know, you can't emphasize enough how difficult that is to hear a new voice and to hear it and it's all of a sudden. You know, they didn't practice this the entire week knowing that it was going to happen this way, and you know, and an additional so Kyler Murray is Kyler Murray. We could go on all day about how good he is and how he's becoming. He's very good, that he's on the cusp of great and you know, you mentioned the coaching and and I'll give Cliff Kingsbury credit for this also. Um. One of the things about Cliff is he makes sure that he surrounds himself with smart people. You know, I think he learned that when he was in New England. We drafted him in New England, he you know, spent a year on I R and then you know, was really learning how to coach at that point in time and taking it to the next level. But he knows how important it is to surround himself with good people. And and the joke last week at the end of the week was Spencer Whipple, you know, Mr Whipple. It was all these Whipple jokes. And I think people don't necessarily know the background of Spencer Whipple. And I'm not saying this is a you know, he's gonna be a great offense corner, he's gonna be a great head coach. But Spencer Whipple is a football guy. He was a backup quarterback at the University of Miami of Florida, and and and Dan. I don't say this to pump your tires, but I will say this very good backup quarterbacks. The intelligence level that they have that you all here on this podcast every single week and you see when Dan is on TV is no joke. It's real. And a guy like Spencer Whipple paid attention because he was a backup quarterback. He's also the coach, the son of a coach, Mark Whipple. Mark Whipple, who's you know, he's currently the offensive corning or a pit but was the head coach at you Mass for two years. He's part of this very you know again, this is the stuff I like to get nerdy about. He's one did this New England and I say not the New England Pages, but the New England college coaching mafia. He was around in the eighties where he was the offensive coordinator at the at New Hampshire, the same one that brought brought along Chip Kelly, that brought along all of these really good quarterbacks. He became the head coach at the University of New Haven right after Chris Palmer was the head coach of the University New Haven and Chris Palmer had instituted the old school running shoot at New Haven. Mark Whipple came in took over the running shoot. After having taken the team to the playoffs a number of years Division two playoffs, he goes to brown and Browns off the charts in the Ivy League. So Spencer Whipple sat there and learned the running shoot when it was a thing when he was a young kid, when his dad was a coach. He knows the passing game just like Cliff Kingsbury knows the passing game. So Kyler Murray has some really smart passing game people in his head at you know, right in front of him. And it showed this past weekend. Yeah, it's it's an impressive offense. And I think the you know, some of the the trademarks of this offense right now, Scott Bob would be number one, They stress you fifty three and the third sideline to sideline. I mean they are going to use every blade of grass, so to speak. But they also then have the ability to be vertical because of their speed, because of their playmakers. Just imagine the stress that that puts on a defense every play. But then and this is something that we started to talk about a little bit. They are a finesse offense with the ability to be powerful the finesse offenses the sideline and sideline stretch. But they're big boys upfront. Can play smash mouthball as well. I mean they can. They can bullyball you at the line of scrimmage, and I think that that's They're probably the only team in the NFL right now that stresses you in that capacity like that. Such great stuff, And we did a lot of Lamar Jackson today. We did a lot of Dak Prescott today. We did a lot of Kyler Murray today. Those three guys right now have to be towards the top of the m v P conversation. We didn't even get a chance to talk about Baker Mayfield, and that is something we have to do when Tapeds comes back on Thursday, because Baker Mayfield right now, he was supposed to be in that conversation. Are their concerns that he is not going to be the quarterback to get this Browns team to that level. We're gonna talk to Scott Pioli and dan Orlovsky coming up on Thursday in our next episode about that. Also Carson Wentz, is he hitting his stride with the Colts. I think we all knew that Aaron Rodgers at some point might get a share, maybe a little sliver of ownership in Green Bay if he were to stay there, Maybe he'll go to the Bears just apparently already owns them. Those are topics we're gonna talk about when we come back. Our next episode drops join us tape Heeds on Thursday. Tape Heeds is a production of I Heart Media and the NFL. 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Welcome to another week of tape Heads. This is the podcast where we take you behind the Xers and os and give you the nerd football because we are football nerds and we love to talk not just about the Xers and os, but how we arrived there by watching the tape from a personnel standpoint. Of course, we've got Scott Pioli, longtime general manager in the NFL, and nobody breaks it down in front of the touch screen on ESPN better than Dan or Lobsky. I am Bob was Schusan. We're gonna start with the game of the week that was Cowboys Patriots, and here's how it ended. Play fake boot to the right looking down the field, lamb ten five victory Cowboys when well, Scott, it ended in thrilling fashion. Did it have to get there for the Cowboys? I guess is the question? Right when you were watching this game, how many twists and turns and moments were there where you were saying to yourself, does it have to be this hard for the Cowboys to beat this rookie quarterback in the team they're just that much better than it didn't need to be bobbed? And that's you know, as I was watching this game. I watched it live, then of course went back and watched the tape. But watching it live, I was thinking to myself, why are they making this so difficult? And there were moments where I was saying to myself, you know, this is exactly what Bill has preyed upon p R. E y preyed upon opponents for years, just waiting for them to make the mistakes. You know, it did the first half loan, the missed opportunities by Dallas, you know, the fourth and one from there, you know, from the thirty four they go for it, don't get it, and they give the Patriots seven easy points that you know, would have been seven points that could have helped the Cowboys. Later. Then the red zone throw into the end zone that was tipped became a New England interception, the third and eleven at the plus twelve where the touchdown pass was dropped in the corner in the end zone or the side of the end zone, you know, and then fourth and a half a yard and there's a quarterback sneak fumble and the I'm watching some thinking, oh my gosh. And then the penalties. This is exactly the kind of football that Um that the Patriots and Bill Belichick again have preyed upon for years and years, and they it wasn't exciting finish. There was great things to watch in the game. But to me, you know, we talked about It's funny. I would have never ever been accused of being a nerd in anything if you would have saw my academic record in high school and college. The only thing that I get nerdy about is football and clean football and watching you know, just watching a well coached, well executed game, because it's not just coaching, it's how players execute. And seeing some of the execution mistakes was driving me crazy. But you know what, good for the NFL, good for ratings. The fact is, um it was a close game at the end, and and it made for exciting watching, exciting football. Yeah, I agree so much, Scott. I'd say, first of all, I think New England's a better team than we're probably giving their record respect so to speak. I mean, they're a handful of plays away from being from beating two of the best teams in football to the best team certainly in the NFC and being fourign to you are what your record says you are. I'm aware of that, but I think they're a good football team. Now to Dallas. I thought two things really stood out for me performance wise. Number one, Dak Prescott making plays outside of the pocket. Um I actually thought it was strategic by Dak. You know, everyone knows and Scott Bob, you guys noticed that the Patriots rush a certain way, right They're really not trying to get to the quarterback all the time. They're doing everything they can to not allow creativity outside of the pocket. And I think what Dak realized, because you saw it early on in the game, was that there was gonna be a seam early on because they weren't trying to get to them. They were just trying to build a wall. And there was a seam early on in three or four plays, specifically in the first quarter, he makes plays outside of the pockets, scrambling on second and longs to go make plays. I thought that was a really big step forward with his performance. And then if we go into overtime, um I there was there was a theme of plays that showed up that I loved from Kellen Moore because I thought there was two formations from the Cowboys that they majored in four strong, meaning they put four people to the offensive strength pre snap. Sometimes it was four receivers lined up to one side. That's abnormal, right, we know trips in the NFL, trips in college football four receivers that way, or three receivers in the back the same side. That was done to attack the man coverage, to create all those bodies to one side of the field and crossers. I loved that from Kellen Moore. But then you go into overtime and the first down, first and ten, they go twelve personnel, one back, two tight ends. They put two tight ends to the same side and a tight end wing. They go slot to the opposite side, and they go run action fake to the left where those slot receivers are, and they go bootleg back to the closed side those tight ends, and Dad gives a little dump off to Blake Jarwin, great eight yards on first down. Two plays later, on first down, they come back with that same formation, same personnel, group, action towards the slot receivers. This time they handed off to Tony Pollard seven eight yards on the run. Beautiful very next down, same formation, two tight ends to one side, tight end wing, slot to the other side. They go run action to that slot receiver bootleg with Dac. Now this time Dak gets his head around and sees Jarwin on that that down flat, little bit of a flat route after the fake block, and he's there somewhat, but you can see Ceedee Lamb on the deep cross put his hand up almost like remember Randy Moss going on a go route, puts his hand up like I got it, I'm open. And Dad just quickly peeks at him out of a corner of his eye and he he trusts Cede almost, Hey, I know you're putting your hand for a reason. You know there's space, and he just kind of backs off the defense for a second, you know, just for another yard and throws that deep cross and it's game over. And I just thought it was so beautiful to watch the Cowboys, same formation, same personnel, same set, and they ran that Scott. They ran that formation ten times in that game with that action ten times. The only time he threw it to Ceedee Lamb was the game winner. You know, that's awesome. I love listening to you breakdown specific formations and how they're running plays. I want to go back to one other thing here about Dak Prescott. You know, Week one we're on the podcast and we talked a little bit about Dak and we're wondering how it was going to be and how he was going to do. And part of the what we do from a personnel standpoint, from a general manager standpoint, is we pay attention to, you know, the evaluation. And part of the evaluation is not just the physical, it's the mental, it's the most the emotional. It's getting a feel for players. And you know, I remember being asked on Good Morning Football that two days before the opener with Dallas and Tampa Bay, and I had seen an interview with Dak Prescott and I watched him, and we all watched him work during preseason. There was a lot of attention being paid to him. He didn't play in the preseason games, but we could see him work. He wasn't saying a whole lot. He was working differently and interesting what I thought to be more purposefully. Then he did this interview with Michael Irvin, and I don't know if you all remember, but it was it was an important interview and got a lot of traction. There was a look in his eyes and the way that the words came out of his mouth. I was like, oh, it's on. He was a guy who had clearly seen sens and smelled his football mortality. That injury did something to him and made him mature. He's a guy who was all about fun before and numbers and but this dude is serious right now and he has been the and we've watched in the first two weeks, this entire team once they got Zack Martin. Back to watching the offense, this is a different Cowboys offense. They're running with physicality, they're playing with physicality, They're playing with like a real intent and purpose. And I think a lot of it comes with Dac. And when I saw Dac and listen to him again, a lot of players talk, you hear cliches in that interview. There was a lot of cliches. He was staring through Michael Irvin. He was staring through the camera. And I remember thinking to myself, Okay, it is game on with this cat, and can yeah throw something else at you guys about that? And Scott you'll remember this obviously, what what was the year I mean, this guy at least ten or twelve years ago where Brady through like that quick slot up the scene pass to Welker for like the yard touchdown in my end against the Dolphins. Correct. And I remember Brian Schottenheimer at the time was the the offensive coordinator of the Jets, and I was talking to him the following week about that play and he was like, he makes that look so easy. Do you have any ideal? Hard? That is? He is in the shotgun, like five yards deep in his own end zone. The entire stadium is coming down on top of him, and he's standing there at his own balls at the one yard line, and he says, you know what, there's my matchup, bing, I'm just gonna go there. And yards later, Westwalker's in the end zone and it's like, that's Tom Brady. I don't look, I'm not gonna try to put Dak Prescott on that level yet. But when I watched this game how many times with Ceedee Lamb running with Jala Mills on his hip, right, Like, is that Prescott getting to a point now as a quarterback where he sees, there's my matchup, right, and just cool, calm and collected in the cauldron of a road game. I've got a seventh round draft choice on my wide receiver, and you know what, today, my guy's gonna catch a hundred and fifty yards and two touchdowns because I just know that's my matchup and no matter what Bill tried to do to hide that, maybe you just couldn't flume Extec Prescott in the big spot. Is he there? I think first of all, Bob, Um, Yeah, I know exactly what it's like to be backed up in my own end zone in the shotgun on the one yard. Yes, I know you brought up record, you brought up a Cincinnati Dan exactly. I'm onto two. Um. Yeah, I I absolutely think I think there are parallels to that. You know, we've we've heard the weeks leading up to this that he is very much so in the huddle, pre snap at the line of scrimmage in a world of Drew Reason and Peyton Mannings. Absolutely he is into that pre snap, you know, kind of looking at the line of scrimmage and going where's the week, where's the weakness? Because I got a bunch of strengths, where's the weakness? I got him? And I think he's absolutely entered in. When those quarterbacks learned the importance of matchups, it's like the quarterbacks that prey upon the injured player, the injured player in the secondary. When we need to see though, is I think he's entering that space. But just like anything as an evaluator, what you want to see as a pattern of behavior. He did it this week, He's done in a couple of times. He needs to stack these together consistently, and then he will enter that space of being an elite quarterback again once he starts stacking those together game after game after games, season after season. Well, we talked about it the first week we did this podcast, right on the road Tampa Bay opening night, Cowboys lost, and what did we all say. If I were Nick Siani, if I were Joe Joe, I would have been sitting there going, oh no, they might be owing one, but they're real like that looks like a team that is going to win our division. That's how good they looked at a loss, and they have it lost since. So and another guy that keeps on stacking those performances is Lamar Jackson. We're gonna talk about Lamar Jackson when we come back here on TAP. It's not just Lamar Jackson, but the job his coach is doing as well. John Harball might be doing the best coaching job in the National Football League Ravens Chargers. That is our next topic when we come back after a quick time out on Tapits, We're back here on Tapitz Bobo Schusan with Scott Pioli and Dan Orlovsky. We thought it might be the game of the week, justin Herbert against Lamar Jackson at halftime. If it was a fight, they might have stopped it because that's how good that the Baltimore Ravens were. And here's what their head coach had to say after the game. You know, there's not too many things in football that our fatal flaws, and it's not too much its terminal, you know, but there's always gonna be there's always gonna things cropping up that you've got to address and deal with. And tackling has been one of the things on defense, and it's not just how clean things that lead into and you just keep working on you get him fixed and and you go onto the next thing that's gonna come up. And that's our guys are patient that way, and they did a good job with it. And what a job Lamar Jackson has done. But what a job that John Harbaugh has done as well, because this Ravens team has suffered injury after injury, and Scott, I guess maybe it's just a jumping off point where this team started the season who they thought they were going to have on the field, and if I would have told you what they've got on the field now and they're still performing the way that they're performing. Granted, we can give all of the credit in the world to Lamar Jackson, and he deserves it. He might win another m v P with the way he is performing this season. But the personnel culture inside that building, the marriage of general manager to head coach, how they build that team, and how they keep on finding ways to fill in the cracks in Baltimore. When another crack in the damn develops, it's just they just keep finding solutions. Yeah, this is a fascinating organization, you know it was. I want to go back to when we moved from Cleveland to Baltimore and I was with the team for that first the inaugural season, and Ozzie had just taken over the franchise. Again, he he didn't have a title, he wasn't the general manager, he wasn't a vice president. Was just kind of like this title, but there was a culture that was being set in place, and and as coach March brought it but then and became coach Billick and then John Harbaugh and Eric da Costa was hired as an intern in pro personnel with me in nineties six. And the thing is that there's a culture that exists with this franchise that has been fascinating to me. I feel like this organization has had a pulse and has a pulse on the players, their locker room, the chemistry as well as any franchise since there's been some ebbs and some you know, some ups and some downs, but it's interesting. John Harbaugh, again his background special teams coach and generally speaking, special teams coaches have a really good pulse on the team. They're the only assistant coach that has to speak weekly to the entire team in team meetings because it's not offense, it's not defense, it's everybody, so they're talking to more players as a leader. Hardball has always had a pulse for players, but part of that comes culturally from Ozzy, and I go back to where you know, Ozzie first started coaching under Bill Belichick in Cleveland, and one of the most important roles that Ozzie had for Bill was to let Bill know what the pulse of the locker room was. Are the guys tired? Are they full of energy? Is that you know what's going on? Not in the sense that Ozzi was never a n arc right, he wasn't ratting on the players. He knew for the greater good, what he had to do was talk about where the players were at. And I think that that's an element that really is a part of the cultural fabric of the Baltimore Ravens. Eric de Costa learned that he knows how important is that be on the pulse of the players. John Harbaugh knows that. And to me, when I watched this club season from season, with all the changes they keep having, they seem to have this ability to have a chemistry that is so darn consistent. And it's had so much change again Harbor, Billick, Marcha, Broda, but it's all been successful and Aussie to Eric da Costa, it's one of the things that I as I watched this franchise, it's it's part of the reason why they're having so much success right now. As silly as it sounds, but I want to go back to what you did say, Bob, Lamar Jackson is an elite quarterback in this league and he you know, what he's doing is incredible. But again, away from just the performance, I love to talk about and look at what's happening behind the scenes and Harbor and DaCosta and that entire organization. Just get it. Yeah, what are the twenty five years, thirty years of really good ever since they got there, really good organizational running, so to speak. Um, I think Lamar is the most unique football player in the world. He was called the tailbacker running back coming out of Oligen. He is. He's just ridiculously good at throwing the ball as well, you know, and and that's why he is incredibly unique. UM. I actually think the game this past weekend against the Charges about the big boys upfront. I really do. Um, this has been this is the first game, in my opinion, that the Ravens one because of something outside of a ridiculous performance by Lamar. UM. I thought it was the much maligned offensive line absolutely dominating the line of scrimmage. And it was really the three guys inside. You saw it early on. Um they started to and Bob, you've heard me say this, saying all the time dent the defense. You know, they were denting the line of scrimmage, that is, changing the line of scrimmage in their run game, and it was a you know, it was kind of one of the things that we probably don't talk about enough in regards to the Ravens is the variants in their run game. They have so many different run plays. We often think, well, it's quarterback run or zone read, but they can go in run zone scheme with people outside of their tailback Devin DuVernay on jet sweep outside zone. Uh, they can go zone read your traditional they can go speed option to Davante Freeman for a touchdown. They can go quarterback counter bash where they're pulling people and he's zone reading off the end. So there's so many different plays that their offense can run, and they saw it. We saw it in this game, and I just thought they really started to push defensive tackles back into the linebackers. Two things in their past game that I liked Mark Andrews, and this is a little bit of a tape study guessing a little bit. I think that the Ravens have gotten to a point with Mark Andrews where they allow him to freelance some routes. Um. I think he's allowed to run a shallow cross, which is you know, you guys know, five or seven yards. He starts on one side of the field, goes across the other side about five or seven yards, or a deep cross, which starts on one side of field goes all the way to the other and that's about twelve the sixteen yards. I think he's allowed to do either of those, dependent upon coverage, because the stem and the route looks so similar times. And I think him in lamar See defenses so well in the same way that they're really building two plays into one so that the variance in their past game is step forward. And then Rashade Bateman was nice. It was nice to see Rashade Bateman. And this offense has got Mark Andrews in their past game, and they've got Hollywood and he can create some big place. But they really need a I can go get you six or I can go get you ten, and I can work the middle of the field in the short and kind of push the intermediate, so to speak, pass into second level. Past game. They need that guy, and Bateman brought that and I was super impressed by their offensive performance for the Chargers on the flip side, look Clark as a Swiss army knife. That's a really hard defense. Their physical when they're home there even that much better. So there was all of that stacked up against Justin Herbert. But was this a step back? Was this an eye opening? Like? Whoa, wait a minute, maybe we gotta pump the brakes a little bit on l A or do you guys stall the same level of confidence and Justin Herbert and the charges that you did going into that game picture, Yeah, I'm not. I'm not worried as a charges. You know. I remember um Brady gave me a great line. Remember when he thought it was he forgot what doubt it was. And I was talking to him after that one, and you know what he starts out. He goes, hey, babe, even Betty Crocker burns Browney every once in a while. Right, it was a great line. And when he did it made me step back. It's a you know, great line, Tommy, Can I use it's all? Yeah, it's all yours. But the point is, I think sometimes we love seeing very goodness and want to make it greatness, and even within greatness, we have to manage expectations. And the Charges are a very good football team. Justin Herbert is a fantastic quarterback. He burned the Brownies his past weekend, you know, And and and it's it's it's not um again. We love to jump on these wall they're the best ever there that they're a really good football team. They're gonna be in the mix, and there's gonna be up weeks. And this is the National Ball League right there. You played in it, Bob, You've been in it forever. This is the National Football League. Even the bad teams. And I'm doing little air quotes for those out in podcast land that can't see me. The bad teams have good players and are gonna have good weeks. And that's why that that old saying about any given Sunday, that is the truth. And any Sunday, any team is capable of beating another team. So I'm never much on the overreaction in either way. Yeah, yeah, I would say this about the Chargers, Bob. Two things. I'm completely in the same camp as Scott. They just played poorly. It was a one o'clock kick. It's a West Coast team. There's a lot of variables attached to that when you're gonna be ultra aggressive and go for it on a bunch of third and fourth downs. Obviously third down, but fourth downs, if you get them, it's called rhythm. You get a whole new set of downs. If you don't get them, it's called no rhythm. And it was a game where they didn't. They didn't convert those fourth downs. Um one, I do think something to pay attention to with this football team again as we move forward, how their front seven plays against the run. Now they were without two linebackers, so but how they're because they're gonna give you the run. That's their philosophy on defense. Brandon Stadi's gonna say, Okay, we're gonna give up the run. Um how they do though, because if you're gonna do that, you gotta go match on offense, because you're gonna get pushed around on defense, you gotta go matching on offense. Points wise, So how they do against the run is something to pay attention to. And then I did not like the timing between quarterback and receivers. That was something for the first time this year that they seemed off. To Herbert to Mike Williams, Herbert to Josh Palmer, I think those are two things worthy of paying attention to as the weeks go. And from a game management standpoint, Dan, I think something that's a right. If you loved Brandon Staley and Justin Herbert going for it all those times and getting it at Cleveland, you're not allowed to turn around now and criticize them for going forward and not giving it at Baltimore, Like you can't just play the result. So h I loved the aggressiveness that they showed in Cleveland. I had no proble thee with the aggressiveness. I agree that they showed in Baltimore and Lamar Jackson might win the m v P. But when we come back on tapeds, there's a guy playing in Arizona that might give him a run for his money because we will talk about the Cardinals and their start to the season and the game against Baker Mayfield. How worried are these guys about the Browns and Baker going forward? That and we come back in a moment on tapeds. We are back here on tapeds. They just keep rolling even without their coach. The Arizona Cardinals get a win over Baker Mayfield and the Browns. Uh got Cliff Kingsbury out in the COVID protocol. Kyler Murray after the win talked about the fact that was on the player's shoulders. I think we were excited, you know, Like I said, the odds kind of seems stacked against us. I mean, there's pretty much for us. It was just an opportunity to come out here and prove ourselves again. I guess a good team. You know, people try to make this more than what it was. But at the end of the day, we came out here um and handled what we need to handle. And Dan Kyler Murray, how high up the m v P conversation should he be when you watch him perform like this on the road? You know, obviously Lamar Jackson, we just talked about him in the last segment, how great he's been. There's probably two or three other names that are in that next wars. Kyler, he's right into the top of the conversation. I got a lot of ones in the m v P conversation. Talg Okay, there's there's a lot of guys that I can fill in at the top of the list. I think the most impressive. There's a lot about Kyler right now that is incredibly impressive. Um, I wish people truly understood how hard it is to go into a game without the guy that has been in your ear ever since you came into the NFL. He's had one voice in his ear the whole time, you know. And for for a guy who's still a young player to go do what he did this passing against the Browns was incredible. Now, I do think that I was very impressed Cliff wasn't there, and obviously the physical form Cliff was there. When it comes to watching plays get called and plays get run. Okay, first play the game, they go to take a shot downfield to Christian Kirk just because it's a seven yard touchdown if not for Miles Garrett pressure. I think there's a couple of plays that really stand out that give me the blueprint of Cliff Kingsbury. The third and twenty one touchdown to start the game. UM, I've seen that play philosophically run. So they get into like a three by one set, trips to the field, Hopkins is all the way by himself. There's a couple of things on this play that stand out. One, usually when Hopkins is out there as the the the outside receiver, and the trips you'll put him at like a what's called a minus two, which is minus two from the bottom of the numbers. That's two yards outside the numbers. He's minus six guys almost to the sidelines. I'm creating space as a as a play caller, play designer, I'm creating space. Okay, he's matched by a corner. Then he takes two receivers, Christian Kirk and Rondale Moore. And again we're in a trip set and usually that slot receiver that number two is in between DeAndre Hopkins in the number three receiver. Well, Cliff takes him and basically stands them right next to each other. Again, I am creating space now, and both these guys released down the field, and the Browns are playing a for a form of quarters coverage. They're gonna play in and out the safety in the corner. Whoever goes out the corner has, whoever goes in the safety has, and both the receivers Kirk and rondelm more push vertical, push vertical, and they're almost running on top of each other, one stacked on top of the other about fifteen yards downfield. And imagine the buying that that puts as the safety in the corner. I've got the guy that's coming out. I have no idea who was coming out. And what happens is both the receivers, the inside guys starts to lean in and the outside guards starts to lean out, and then both at the same time they criss crossed. They go opposite of their lean and it's so detailed that the coaching shows up and it ends up Kyler steps up in the pocket, peaks left to Hopkins and throws the touchdown to essentially the front pylon to Christian Kirk and I go, that's Cliff Kingsberry. And it's a ridiculous play by Harder. Don't get me wrong, but that is Cliff Kingsbury creating that throw. And then the touchdown to DeAndre Hopkins, which is his second one. It's not the third and goal from the thirteen. It's just a beautiful job by Kyler is stepping up in the pocket. He's got a back end line type of throw, and he turns his whole body and shoulders to a pivot route which is right on the goal line and kind of gives a open my body to the left. The Cleveland Browns defenders jump up and it's just a lob touchdown, And I just thought, uh, you could definitely tell that Cliff really put together a great plan in Kyler is the the player version of Cliff on the field, so to speak. I mean they talked the same way, see the same the way. So while he wasn't there, you can see the performance by the quarterback was in lockstep with the coach. Dan, I agree. You know, we just talked a little earlier about Dak Prescott and his evolution and his maturation is a quarterback and some of the things that he's doing where we say, wow, is he he might be making that next step right now? We might This might be the one of the games that we point back to where we see the maturation and the intelligence of Kyler Murray going to the next level because he did it without Cliff right there in his ear. And Dan, you brought up the point, you know, you can't emphasize enough how difficult that is to hear a new voice and to hear it and it's all of a sudden. You know, they didn't practice this the entire week knowing that it was going to happen this way, and you know, and an additional so Kyler Murray is Kyler Murray. We could go on all day about how good he is and how he's becoming. He's very good, that he's on the cusp of great and you know, you mentioned the coaching and and I'll give Cliff Kingsbury credit for this also. Um. One of the things about Cliff is he makes sure that he surrounds himself with smart people. You know, I think he learned that when he was in New England. We drafted him in New England, he you know, spent a year on I R and then you know, was really learning how to coach at that point in time and taking it to the next level. But he knows how important it is to surround himself with good people. And and the joke last week at the end of the week was Spencer Whipple, you know, Mr Whipple. It was all these Whipple jokes. And I think people don't necessarily know the background of Spencer Whipple. And I'm not saying this is a you know, he's gonna be a great offense corner, he's gonna be a great head coach. But Spencer Whipple is a football guy. He was a backup quarterback at the University of Miami of Florida, and and and Dan. I don't say this to pump your tires, but I will say this very good backup quarterbacks. The intelligence level that they have that you all here on this podcast every single week and you see when Dan is on TV is no joke. It's real. And a guy like Spencer Whipple paid attention because he was a backup quarterback. He's also the coach, the son of a coach, Mark Whipple. Mark Whipple, who's you know, he's currently the offensive corning or a pit but was the head coach at you Mass for two years. He's part of this very you know again, this is the stuff I like to get nerdy about. He's one did this New England and I say not the New England Pages, but the New England college coaching mafia. He was around in the eighties where he was the offensive coordinator at the at New Hampshire, the same one that brought brought along Chip Kelly, that brought along all of these really good quarterbacks. He became the head coach at the University of New Haven right after Chris Palmer was the head coach of the University New Haven and Chris Palmer had instituted the old school running shoot at New Haven. Mark Whipple came in took over the running shoot. After having taken the team to the playoffs a number of years Division two playoffs, he goes to brown and Browns off the charts in the Ivy League. So Spencer Whipple sat there and learned the running shoot when it was a thing when he was a young kid, when his dad was a coach. He knows the passing game just like Cliff Kingsbury knows the passing game. So Kyler Murray has some really smart passing game people in his head at you know, right in front of him. And it showed this past weekend. Yeah, it's it's an impressive offense. And I think the you know, some of the the trademarks of this offense right now, Scott Bob would be number one, They stress you fifty three and the third sideline to sideline. I mean they are going to use every blade of grass, so to speak. But they also then have the ability to be vertical because of their speed, because of their playmakers. Just imagine the stress that that puts on a defense every play. But then and this is something that we started to talk about a little bit. They are a finesse offense with the ability to be powerful the finesse offenses the sideline and sideline stretch. But they're big boys upfront. Can play smash mouthball as well. I mean they can. They can bullyball you at the line of scrimmage, and I think that that's They're probably the only team in the NFL right now that stresses you in that capacity like that. Such great stuff, And we did a lot of Lamar Jackson today. We did a lot of Dak Prescott today. We did a lot of Kyler Murray today. Those three guys right now have to be towards the top of the m v P conversation. We didn't even get a chance to talk about Baker Mayfield, and that is something we have to do when Tapeds comes back on Thursday, because Baker Mayfield right now, he was supposed to be in that conversation. Are their concerns that he is not going to be the quarterback to get this Browns team to that level. We're gonna talk to Scott Pioli and dan Orlovsky coming up on Thursday in our next episode about that. Also Carson Wentz, is he hitting his stride with the Colts. I think we all knew that Aaron Rodgers at some point might get a share, maybe a little sliver of ownership in Green Bay if he were to stay there, Maybe he'll go to the Bears just apparently already owns them. Those are topics we're gonna talk about when we come back. Our next episode drops join us tape Heeds on Thursday. Tape Heeds is a production of I Heart Media and the NFL. 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