From Vision in Australia, this is talking vision. And now here's your host, Sam, calling.

From Vision in Australia, this is talking vision. And now here's your host, Sam, calling.

Hello, everyone. It's great to be here with you. And for the next half hour, we talk matters of blindness and low vision.

Hello, everyone. It's great to be here with you. And for the next half hour, we talk matters of blindness and low vision.

So I think in general, accessibility apps are great. People are trying to do, you know, amazing work there. And what I want to see is a future where these accessible apps are, you know, even more accessible.

So I think in general, accessibility apps are great. People are trying to do, you know, amazing work there. And what I want to see is a future where these accessible apps are, you know, even more accessible.

Welcome to the program. That voice you just heard was glib Zivkovic talking about the future of accessibility apps and his ideas for increased accessibility on apps and devices in coming years. Caleb is an app developer and co-founder with Katja Daniel over a Vox Might, an audio based accessibility app for Android phone aimed at users who are blind or have very low vision that are interested in an alternative to screenwriters audio described graphics. He tells the story of how the idea for the app came about and where he saw a gap in the accessibility app market that he and Carter wanted to fill. My interview with Glib takes up a large portion of the show this week. So let's hear from him now. And following the interview with Clip, we wrap up the show this week with some news and information. I hope you enjoy this week's episode of Talking Vision. I'm here today with Gleb Zivkovic, one of the co-founders of Vox Mate, an Android mobile app that seeks to enable people who are blind or have very low vision to use their Android devices in a more accessible way. Glib. Welcome to talking vision and good morning from Melbourne.

Welcome to the program. That voice you just heard was glib Zivkovic talking about the future of accessibility apps and his ideas for increased accessibility on apps and devices in coming years. Caleb is an app developer and co-founder with Katja Daniel over a Vox Might, an audio based accessibility app for Android phone aimed at users who are blind or have very low vision that are interested in an alternative to screenwriters audio described graphics. He tells the story of how the idea for the app came about and where he saw a gap in the accessibility app market that he and Carter wanted to fill. My interview with Glib takes up a large portion of the show this week. So let's hear from him now. And following the interview with Clip, we wrap up the show this week with some news and information. I hope you enjoy this week's episode of Talking Vision. I'm here today with Gleb Zivkovic, one of the co-founders of Vox Mate, an Android mobile app that seeks to enable people who are blind or have very low vision to use their Android devices in a more accessible way. Glib. Welcome to talking vision and good morning from Melbourne.

Oh, thanks so much for having me, Scott. Yeah, we're here in Estonia. It's it's just, you know, the Sun is rising over the horizon

Oh, thanks so much for having me, Scott. Yeah, we're here in Estonia. It's it's just, you know, the Sun is rising over the horizon

as it started snowing.

as it started snowing.

Yet we had some hail already and it was really scary. This year was quite quite dreadful. We had heat up the wazoo. We're not ready for this heat, you know? And and and just a week ago we had hail.

Yet we had some hail already and it was really scary. This year was quite quite dreadful. We had heat up the wazoo. We're not ready for this heat, you know? And and and just a week ago we had hail.

Oh my god. Well, hopefully it settles down over the coming weeks and months. So we'll get back to the the app now club. So in a nutshell, could you give an overview of how it works?

Oh my god. Well, hopefully it settles down over the coming weeks and months. So we'll get back to the the app now club. So in a nutshell, could you give an overview of how it works?

Writes of Booksmart, is this all in one app that we're trying to make for blind and visually impaired people? We are very happy with results so far. The app is already up in the Play Store and the idea behind box made is to make it like truly accessible what that means accessible for people who are struggling with accessibility today. So maybe people who are who've just lost vision or people who are, you know, uncomfortable using screen readers, we really think that with box made, we can make a difference for these people specifically.

Writes of Booksmart, is this all in one app that we're trying to make for blind and visually impaired people? We are very happy with results so far. The app is already up in the Play Store and the idea behind box made is to make it like truly accessible what that means accessible for people who are struggling with accessibility today. So maybe people who are who've just lost vision or people who are, you know, uncomfortable using screen readers, we really think that with box made, we can make a difference for these people specifically.

OK? And in terms of features that Vox has to offer, what are some things that people can expect if they do download the app?

OK? And in terms of features that Vox has to offer, what are some things that people can expect if they do download the app?

Well, Laxmi is, as I mentioned, is this all in one? So we have features that, you know, span categories like entertainment features, for example, allow you to read the news, listen to podcasts, listen to YouTube videos, audio books, radio, things like that. There's some utility like OCR. You can take notes and there's games as well. So we're kind of trying to be a little bit all over the place in the sense that we want to show the breadth of the product. And we see a lot of people right now are using books made for entertainment purposes. So we're going to be doubling down on that. And we also see people wanting to use more utility. So I'm going to be adding features like navigation features and features like that over time.

Well, Laxmi is, as I mentioned, is this all in one? So we have features that, you know, span categories like entertainment features, for example, allow you to read the news, listen to podcasts, listen to YouTube videos, audio books, radio, things like that. There's some utility like OCR. You can take notes and there's games as well. So we're kind of trying to be a little bit all over the place in the sense that we want to show the breadth of the product. And we see a lot of people right now are using books made for entertainment purposes. So we're going to be doubling down on that. And we also see people wanting to use more utility. So I'm going to be adding features like navigation features and features like that over time.

Now what was the motivation behind Vox might help the idea come about?

Now what was the motivation behind Vox might help the idea come about?

Well, it all started with my co-founder, Katya's father losing vision. He lost vision quite rapidly. Initially, it was only one eye, and then the doctor said, Oh, is this freak accident? It's not. It's not going to do anything, you know, we don't even know what it is. And then some time passed, and then he started losing vision as rapidly in the second eye, and then he was completely alone there for a while at the hospital. They do some kind of treatment. So they induced blindness. Initially, before he actually got blind, they induced blindness or to try to save the eye for whatever procedure they needed to do. Yeah. And so he found himself in the hospital with absolutely nothing to do and losing his mind, you know, just he was unable to read. He was unable to listen to anything. And then we started trying to figure out how we could, you know, give him a hand. We put in radio. We tried putting audio books on little MP, three players that we bought, but the cheap MP, three players with just one play button. And we thought, you know, so it would be easy to kind of figure it out for him. And well, long story short, he these things helped, but we started looking for a more permanent solution and we started to, you know, look around what exists. And we found very few things that could help him at the time, and we decided to make something. We decided to make something that he wanted initially. So he wanted to read the news. And that was his number one thing to do because he was a news junkie before. And then he lost his vision completely and able to, you know, just do it in his own way. And so that's what we started with news. Then came audio books, and then came the idea that we should probably make an app out of this that would help more people. So we kind of left him hanging a little bit. We left him with his news and the audio books, and then we started making the app and we started making app in in English so that, you know, we could help as many people as possible. Right.

Well, it all started with my co-founder, Katya's father losing vision. He lost vision quite rapidly. Initially, it was only one eye, and then the doctor said, Oh, is this freak accident? It's not. It's not going to do anything, you know, we don't even know what it is. And then some time passed, and then he started losing vision as rapidly in the second eye, and then he was completely alone there for a while at the hospital. They do some kind of treatment. So they induced blindness. Initially, before he actually got blind, they induced blindness or to try to save the eye for whatever procedure they needed to do. Yeah. And so he found himself in the hospital with absolutely nothing to do and losing his mind, you know, just he was unable to read. He was unable to listen to anything. And then we started trying to figure out how we could, you know, give him a hand. We put in radio. We tried putting audio books on little MP, three players that we bought, but the cheap MP, three players with just one play button. And we thought, you know, so it would be easy to kind of figure it out for him. And well, long story short, he these things helped, but we started looking for a more permanent solution and we started to, you know, look around what exists. And we found very few things that could help him at the time, and we decided to make something. We decided to make something that he wanted initially. So he wanted to read the news. And that was his number one thing to do because he was a news junkie before. And then he lost his vision completely and able to, you know, just do it in his own way. And so that's what we started with news. Then came audio books, and then came the idea that we should probably make an app out of this that would help more people. So we kind of left him hanging a little bit. We left him with his news and the audio books, and then we started making the app and we started making app in in English so that, you know, we could help as many people as possible. Right.

And you and Katja are both app developers by trade. I understand it's not sort of just a one off thing that you have been doing for Kutcher's dad. You've both been in the app game for quite a while. Is this the first foray into accessibility that you've both gone into or had you done things with accessibility apps in the past?

And you and Katja are both app developers by trade. I understand it's not sort of just a one off thing that you have been doing for Kutcher's dad. You've both been in the app game for quite a while. Is this the first foray into accessibility that you've both gone into or had you done things with accessibility apps in the past?

Me and coach, you were both in it. Yes, we used to work as a business analyst and I used to work as a developer. I co-founded some other companies before, but we were, you know, accessibility was a completely different world for us. Like, we had honestly no idea that this world even existed before before this happened. And then we found out and it was like a cold shower because the it looked like the tech stack hasn't been, you know, modernized, hasn't been rethought and. Quite a while. I mean, screen readers like voiceover and talkback and great like they they they can do and give people so much. But you have to be able to use them. And this barrier of difficulty, we went to this event in Solihull, UK and just kind of asked high school Typekit if we kind of asked people around how comfortable we are with with screen readers. And they're really not especially people who are getting, you know, who getting a little older. Learning all of these gestures is difficult, learning, you know, how to use apps, which we have to kind of sense that the button should be somewhere over there and you try to explore, you know, find out where it is. It's very difficult for people. Mm-Hmm. And so we had no idea. I mean, there's as a developer as any developer knows, there's these AirTags accessibility tags on Ishmael Fields and so on. And you know, honestly, as a developer, you kind of feel these tags are just an a nuisance because you don't understand if nobody tells you, you know what suffering, you know, is behind all that and you feel that, oh, it's just this stupid thing, this image. So it's just it's just the picture. It's not it's not doesn't mean anything. And you don't tag your images with all its text and you don't, you know, put all the IRA tags in the ocean and becomes complete. Unusable mess. And yeah, so so you know, you see accessibility quite a lot. You know, you touched with it here and there, but ultimately you have no idea what's going on.

Me and coach, you were both in it. Yes, we used to work as a business analyst and I used to work as a developer. I co-founded some other companies before, but we were, you know, accessibility was a completely different world for us. Like, we had honestly no idea that this world even existed before before this happened. And then we found out and it was like a cold shower because the it looked like the tech stack hasn't been, you know, modernized, hasn't been rethought and. Quite a while. I mean, screen readers like voiceover and talkback and great like they they they can do and give people so much. But you have to be able to use them. And this barrier of difficulty, we went to this event in Solihull, UK and just kind of asked high school Typekit if we kind of asked people around how comfortable we are with with screen readers. And they're really not especially people who are getting, you know, who getting a little older. Learning all of these gestures is difficult, learning, you know, how to use apps, which we have to kind of sense that the button should be somewhere over there and you try to explore, you know, find out where it is. It's very difficult for people. Mm-Hmm. And so we had no idea. I mean, there's as a developer as any developer knows, there's these AirTags accessibility tags on Ishmael Fields and so on. And you know, honestly, as a developer, you kind of feel these tags are just an a nuisance because you don't understand if nobody tells you, you know what suffering, you know, is behind all that and you feel that, oh, it's just this stupid thing, this image. So it's just it's just the picture. It's not it's not doesn't mean anything. And you don't tag your images with all its text and you don't, you know, put all the IRA tags in the ocean and becomes complete. Unusable mess. And yeah, so so you know, you see accessibility quite a lot. You know, you touched with it here and there, but ultimately you have no idea what's going on.

Hmm. Okay. So could you tell us a bit more about something? Some other things you observed that other accessibility apps were maybe lacking for users who are blind or have low vision? And you touched on that quite a bit there. But how did this shape your ideas for Vox? What was your sort of number one kind of thing that you had in mind you and Katia when you were creating the app?

Hmm. Okay. So could you tell us a bit more about something? Some other things you observed that other accessibility apps were maybe lacking for users who are blind or have low vision? And you touched on that quite a bit there. But how did this shape your ideas for Vox? What was your sort of number one kind of thing that you had in mind you and Katia when you were creating the app?

And so I think in general, accessibility apps are great. People are trying to do, you know, amazing work there and what I want to see is a future where these accessible apps are, you know, even more accessible and and live on platforms on top, maybe like a vox made as well and are more accessible in the sense that they can be actually used by people. So what I mean by that is, suppose you have an app and it's great and does some navigation stuff for you, but you have to, you know, be able to turn it on. You have to be able to get to it. You have to be able to use and learn to use it its own interface. And I think that's a big thing that's needed going forward next 10 years. Something like that is some kind of unity unification in terms of, you know, the gestures that we use and the metaphors that we use so that these apps feel cohesive. And so this is what we kind of set out to do with Vox. Might we want to make a cohesive user interface that one app should not feel too much different from another app? You kind of get that they do different things. But if one is a list of songs, for example, another is a list of users that you want a message, you want to navigate those lists the same way you want to have, you know, the same information available.

And so I think in general, accessibility apps are great. People are trying to do, you know, amazing work there and what I want to see is a future where these accessible apps are, you know, even more accessible and and live on platforms on top, maybe like a vox made as well and are more accessible in the sense that they can be actually used by people. So what I mean by that is, suppose you have an app and it's great and does some navigation stuff for you, but you have to, you know, be able to turn it on. You have to be able to get to it. You have to be able to use and learn to use it its own interface. And I think that's a big thing that's needed going forward next 10 years. Something like that is some kind of unity unification in terms of, you know, the gestures that we use and the metaphors that we use so that these apps feel cohesive. And so this is what we kind of set out to do with Vox. Might we want to make a cohesive user interface that one app should not feel too much different from another app? You kind of get that they do different things. But if one is a list of songs, for example, another is a list of users that you want a message, you want to navigate those lists the same way you want to have, you know, the same information available.

So it's all sort of a similar interface. There's no sort of jumping around and feeling all. This is why different signals just using.

So it's all sort of a similar interface. There's no sort of jumping around and feeling all. This is why different signals just using.

Right? So one way to think about box makers is as an ultimate glue. It's a platform as well. On top of, you know, books with functionality is this kind of platform mentality. And we're trying trying to bring that to other applications as well. So we're not we are all in one today, but tomorrow we want to be an open platform. So that's one of the bigger, although abstract in nature, it's one of the bigger issues that we're trying to solve. Another big issue is other solutions can be quite pricey. We want to aspire to be, you know, accessible in in many ways, and one way is also that it should be affordable. And finally, there doesn't appear to me to be any apps with true audio first metaphor, apart from some games which have done admittedly a fantastic job. And what we mean with true audio first metaphor is that by design, the application should not put any graphics on the screen and it should be quite comfortable to use. And if and if you get that right and if you nailed that experience, maybe you can add back some graphics, but you know, then then there's then it's audio first. It's it's not graphics first, and then we add audio where we feel there should be audio. And this approach allows us to create a much nicer feeling experiences as well. So oftentimes we create some application and rocks mate and then we try to use it and it feels off, you know, and we kind of try to polish it so that the right information comes at the right time. When you're using graphics, you can use, you know, many tricks to hide information that you don't need. Often you can use smaller fonts. You can kind of put it aside, you can dim it down a little bit, but with audio, you only have this one channel and you have to prioritize what what is said when for that end, for example, use different voices as well. So you can intuitively differentiate between data that's coming in and information about the data that's coming in. So we were trying to make a great audio first experience without too much verbosity as well. So, you know, without labels, it needs to feel good without labels as well. So, so all of these all of these ideas kind of come together with box me.

Right? So one way to think about box makers is as an ultimate glue. It's a platform as well. On top of, you know, books with functionality is this kind of platform mentality. And we're trying trying to bring that to other applications as well. So we're not we are all in one today, but tomorrow we want to be an open platform. So that's one of the bigger, although abstract in nature, it's one of the bigger issues that we're trying to solve. Another big issue is other solutions can be quite pricey. We want to aspire to be, you know, accessible in in many ways, and one way is also that it should be affordable. And finally, there doesn't appear to me to be any apps with true audio first metaphor, apart from some games which have done admittedly a fantastic job. And what we mean with true audio first metaphor is that by design, the application should not put any graphics on the screen and it should be quite comfortable to use. And if and if you get that right and if you nailed that experience, maybe you can add back some graphics, but you know, then then there's then it's audio first. It's it's not graphics first, and then we add audio where we feel there should be audio. And this approach allows us to create a much nicer feeling experiences as well. So oftentimes we create some application and rocks mate and then we try to use it and it feels off, you know, and we kind of try to polish it so that the right information comes at the right time. When you're using graphics, you can use, you know, many tricks to hide information that you don't need. Often you can use smaller fonts. You can kind of put it aside, you can dim it down a little bit, but with audio, you only have this one channel and you have to prioritize what what is said when for that end, for example, use different voices as well. So you can intuitively differentiate between data that's coming in and information about the data that's coming in. So we were trying to make a great audio first experience without too much verbosity as well. So, you know, without labels, it needs to feel good without labels as well. So, so all of these all of these ideas kind of come together with box me.

That concludes the first half of my interview with Glip Zivkovic from Booksmart. I'm Sam Cully and you're listening to Talking Vision on Vision Australia, radio associate at stations of age and the community radio network. If you'd like to find out more about the program, like where to find your local radio frequency or listen to past programs, you can find all this info and more on the Talking Vision web page. Just stop talking vision into your search engine, or you can find the program on the podcast app of your choice or through the Vision Australia Library. And now, please enjoy the second half of my interview with Glib. Now this next question you've touched on people who are sort of new to their sort of apps. Maybe they've just lost their vision, or maybe they're getting a phone for the first time and they're a bit, you know, they're quite new to all those sorts of things. But this is this is more for the the more experienced users. There might be listeners out there who are, you know, totally blind or have very low vision who maybe they've got a particular way of doing things already that works for them. Maybe they might be thinking, Oh, I'm already familiar with, you know, swiping around to get to new screens on my phone or all this, you know, sounds similar to what my Android phone does already with talkback. But what would you say to people listening who might be a bit reluctant to jump over to a new way of doing things on their phone? Or maybe they are listening and thinking armed, sick of the features that my phone has already? How can this help me out?

That concludes the first half of my interview with Glip Zivkovic from Booksmart. I'm Sam Cully and you're listening to Talking Vision on Vision Australia, radio associate at stations of age and the community radio network. If you'd like to find out more about the program, like where to find your local radio frequency or listen to past programs, you can find all this info and more on the Talking Vision web page. Just stop talking vision into your search engine, or you can find the program on the podcast app of your choice or through the Vision Australia Library. And now, please enjoy the second half of my interview with Glib. Now this next question you've touched on people who are sort of new to their sort of apps. Maybe they've just lost their vision, or maybe they're getting a phone for the first time and they're a bit, you know, they're quite new to all those sorts of things. But this is this is more for the the more experienced users. There might be listeners out there who are, you know, totally blind or have very low vision who maybe they've got a particular way of doing things already that works for them. Maybe they might be thinking, Oh, I'm already familiar with, you know, swiping around to get to new screens on my phone or all this, you know, sounds similar to what my Android phone does already with talkback. But what would you say to people listening who might be a bit reluctant to jump over to a new way of doing things on their phone? Or maybe they are listening and thinking armed, sick of the features that my phone has already? How can this help me out?

Well, for people who are already comfortable with screen readers, we offer a lot of apps that are just clean and nice to use. Like, for example, a lot of people use our podcast player to listen to podcasts. You know, it sits in the background. You can use books made as any other app. You can minimize it if you like, you can hide it away. For people who need to have books, meet on all the time when you know you turn on your phone. We have this feature as well, but for people who don't, they can just minimise what's make use it as any other application and enjoy a clean interface to some content that they like. So, for example, podcasts or radio, or what have you and more advanced users, I would. So I think we have a little bit of a gap here. We try to offer advanced users cool features like Telegram Client, for example, and YouTube Client, and they're all, you know, nice to use, clean to use, and that's a selling point so far. But we do have a little bit of a gap, though, so if you're an advanced user, you might, you know, you might look at it and say, Well, I don't actually need anything from this all in one application, but we are going to offer more stuff to the advanced users as we go along. And importantly, we are going to introduce what we call the SDK. So a way for people to create their own applications on Vox, my platform downstream. And if you want to be ahead of that curve, then you know, learning the vox metaphor right away might be a good jumpstart for that endeavour as well. And we see a lot of more advanced blind people try to learn programming. And maybe Vox made can be that, you know, a way to get into that as well. Oh, cool.

Well, for people who are already comfortable with screen readers, we offer a lot of apps that are just clean and nice to use. Like, for example, a lot of people use our podcast player to listen to podcasts. You know, it sits in the background. You can use books made as any other app. You can minimize it if you like, you can hide it away. For people who need to have books, meet on all the time when you know you turn on your phone. We have this feature as well, but for people who don't, they can just minimise what's make use it as any other application and enjoy a clean interface to some content that they like. So, for example, podcasts or radio, or what have you and more advanced users, I would. So I think we have a little bit of a gap here. We try to offer advanced users cool features like Telegram Client, for example, and YouTube Client, and they're all, you know, nice to use, clean to use, and that's a selling point so far. But we do have a little bit of a gap, though, so if you're an advanced user, you might, you know, you might look at it and say, Well, I don't actually need anything from this all in one application, but we are going to offer more stuff to the advanced users as we go along. And importantly, we are going to introduce what we call the SDK. So a way for people to create their own applications on Vox, my platform downstream. And if you want to be ahead of that curve, then you know, learning the vox metaphor right away might be a good jumpstart for that endeavour as well. And we see a lot of more advanced blind people try to learn programming. And maybe Vox made can be that, you know, a way to get into that as well. Oh, cool.

OK. That's very exciting. And you did mention the some, you know, things that are in the pipeline. I understand Fox might is quite a new app and in comparison to maybe some of the other things out there, how long has Vox been on the market now for what you say?

OK. That's very exciting. And you did mention the some, you know, things that are in the pipeline. I understand Fox might is quite a new app and in comparison to maybe some of the other things out there, how long has Vox been on the market now for what you say?

I think it's just two, two months, two and a half months, I think. Well, there you go.

I think it's just two, two months, two and a half months, I think. Well, there you go.

So and it's already got all the stuff that you have to offer, so that's really exciting. Okay. No, that's really cool. So what sort of feedback have you received from users who are blind or have low vision already? And how can people leave feedback to improve Vox mate, or maybe ask questions about the app to find out more?

So and it's already got all the stuff that you have to offer, so that's really exciting. Okay. No, that's really cool. So what sort of feedback have you received from users who are blind or have low vision already? And how can people leave feedback to improve Vox mate, or maybe ask questions about the app to find out more?

Well, we've been receiving some amazing feedback from the community. People are amazed with, you know, some of the stuff that we've done and especially get excited when they understand how easy it is to use. We get a lot of feature requests and I understand, you know, from from the point of view of the people you get, you know, there's something that you want to be able to do. And we. We want to be able to provide that. It's just going to give us. We just going to take a little bit of time getting there. And so those are the main two points of feedback. Some people don't like, you know, some labels here and there. That's another source of feedback that we get. But a lot of people are extremely positive and they like what we like, what we are doing, and we're very excited to be able to, you know, help them out. Now, when you download box made, there's a special feedback section where you can send feedback directly to us and you can record an audio message and we'll listen to it. So it's, you know, no, it's not a hard thing to to get to to get to. I would try to make it as easy as possible and they will. We can even reply directly to your feedback and send you a message with with your with reply. So for us, it's very important to build a two way communications channel. And so so we've built it into rocks made from from the get go and feedback is number one way for us to learn how people are using and what people are missing. OK, so so feedback is great.

Well, we've been receiving some amazing feedback from the community. People are amazed with, you know, some of the stuff that we've done and especially get excited when they understand how easy it is to use. We get a lot of feature requests and I understand, you know, from from the point of view of the people you get, you know, there's something that you want to be able to do. And we. We want to be able to provide that. It's just going to give us. We just going to take a little bit of time getting there. And so those are the main two points of feedback. Some people don't like, you know, some labels here and there. That's another source of feedback that we get. But a lot of people are extremely positive and they like what we like, what we are doing, and we're very excited to be able to, you know, help them out. Now, when you download box made, there's a special feedback section where you can send feedback directly to us and you can record an audio message and we'll listen to it. So it's, you know, no, it's not a hard thing to to get to to get to. I would try to make it as easy as possible and they will. We can even reply directly to your feedback and send you a message with with your with reply. So for us, it's very important to build a two way communications channel. And so so we've built it into rocks made from from the get go and feedback is number one way for us to learn how people are using and what people are missing. OK, so so feedback is great.

Yeah, that's really important. That's that's great to hear. And so understand the Play Store is the best way for listeners to download Vox Mate for their devices and understand that some currently available only on Android phones, but other plans in the pipeline for maybe other devices and operating systems. A.J. Apple down the track.

Yeah, that's really important. That's that's great to hear. And so understand the Play Store is the best way for listeners to download Vox Mate for their devices and understand that some currently available only on Android phones, but other plans in the pipeline for maybe other devices and operating systems. A.J. Apple down the track.

Yeah, we got get a lot of questions about iOS. Yeah, we are a small development team facilities to people working on this and we are trying to get some funding to get iOS across the line. And it's going well. I didn't want to. I don't want to jinx it, but it's going well. So hopefully we'll see iOS sometime 2022 and we'll we're already, you know, doing preliminary study on how everything's going to fit out there and we're very optimistic. So the reason we started with Android is, you know, for obvious reasons. You know, on Android, you're so much freer to do

Yeah, we got get a lot of questions about iOS. Yeah, we are a small development team facilities to people working on this and we are trying to get some funding to get iOS across the line. And it's going well. I didn't want to. I don't want to jinx it, but it's going well. So hopefully we'll see iOS sometime 2022 and we'll we're already, you know, doing preliminary study on how everything's going to fit out there and we're very optimistic. So the reason we started with Android is, you know, for obvious reasons. You know, on Android, you're so much freer to do

things open source like

things open source like

like you can take over the phone. So with box made, you can place calls you can take over, you know, the launch screen, meaning that when you unlock your phone, you could go, you can you can go straight to vaccinate if you so choose. And other things like that make Android a more natural platform, you know, to start on. But we do understand, especially with hindsight, that so many people with visual impairment are relying on the Apple devices today, and we are definitely going to try to, you know, bridge that gap as soon as possible.

like you can take over the phone. So with box made, you can place calls you can take over, you know, the launch screen, meaning that when you unlock your phone, you could go, you can you can go straight to vaccinate if you so choose. And other things like that make Android a more natural platform, you know, to start on. But we do understand, especially with hindsight, that so many people with visual impairment are relying on the Apple devices today, and we are definitely going to try to, you know, bridge that gap as soon as possible.

Absolutely. Okay. And is there a website, ghaleb that listeners can go to to find out more if they're listening to this and they think it's perfect for either them or someone they know?

Absolutely. Okay. And is there a website, ghaleb that listeners can go to to find out more if they're listening to this and they think it's perfect for either them or someone they know?

Right. So we have Vox, Mid-Con and all the information is there all the, you know, use cases. All the apps are listed there, so you can see if it fits your your need even before you try to install it for yourself or for someone else. And as you mentioned, Play Store has everything but some Google Play. I keep forgetting. So they used to be Play Store and now they Google Play and on Google Play, you can get vaccinated and get started quite quick.

Right. So we have Vox, Mid-Con and all the information is there all the, you know, use cases. All the apps are listed there, so you can see if it fits your your need even before you try to install it for yourself or for someone else. And as you mentioned, Play Store has everything but some Google Play. I keep forgetting. So they used to be Play Store and now they Google Play and on Google Play, you can get vaccinated and get started quite quick.

Oh yeah, it's fantastic. Okay, that was Gleb Zivkovic, one of the co-founders with Carter, a lover of the Vox My app on Android phones. Thank you so much, Globe for your time today and joining me all the way from Tallinn. It's an absolute pleasure chatting with you today. All about Vox. And all the best for the future.

Oh yeah, it's fantastic. Okay, that was Gleb Zivkovic, one of the co-founders with Carter, a lover of the Vox My app on Android phones. Thank you so much, Globe for your time today and joining me all the way from Tallinn. It's an absolute pleasure chatting with you today. All about Vox. And all the best for the future.

Thank you so much for having me, Sen.

Thank you so much for having me, Sen.

And that was glib, Zivkovic from Booksmart. Now, before we go, just a bit of news and information to wrap up the show. This week, Vision Australia's Digital Access Team was involved in developing a digital statutory declaration, or static form that went live last week. They worked with the Attorney-General's Department in 2020 and noticed that a lot of the legal forms the department had were paints inaccessible for people who are blind or have low vision, which were intended to be printed and handwritten to be filled out. Since the department can't update the original pair if says they're permanently locked, they discuss the possibility of making an accessible web form that would then generate the static PDF with what was typed in the PTF. That's generated looks exactly the same as a real static form, except it's just typed out instead of handwritten. STAT Decs already exist in this format, so it's okay and shouldn't throw off or surprise a justice of the peace. If you'd like to access the new static form, head to the Attorney General Department's website at W W W Dot H Dot gov AEW. That's W W W Dot AJ Dot Gov Dot A. And then top down to statutory declarations on the sidebar. And in some other news, Assistive Technology Suppliers Australia is seeking expressions of interest for the position of board member or non-executive director. Some applicants who have experience and skills in the areas of disability, assistive technologies or human services. For more details, head to the HSA website at WW Dot at AACI dot org dot ayear. That's w w w dot eight. Talk to AEW where you'll find an article about the position under the news and press releases dropdown of the Resources and News tab and titled HSA is seeking a board member. And there you'll find out all about the organization and the position, as well as where and how to apply. And finally, this week, Vision Australia Radio is holding a listener survey where you can go into the running to win one of 10 Amazon Echo Dots if you'd like to leave your thoughts or feedback. Head to the front page of the Vision Australia radio website via radio dot org that's via radio dot org and that's all we have time for today. You've been listening to Talking Bison Talking Vision is a production of Vision Australia radio. Thanks to all involved with putting the program together. And remember, we love your feedback and comments. You can contact us at Talking Vision at Vision Australia dot org that's talking Vision at Vision Australia dot org. But until next week, it's bye for now.

And that was glib, Zivkovic from Booksmart. Now, before we go, just a bit of news and information to wrap up the show. This week, Vision Australia's Digital Access Team was involved in developing a digital statutory declaration, or static form that went live last week. They worked with the Attorney-General's Department in 2020 and noticed that a lot of the legal forms the department had were paints inaccessible for people who are blind or have low vision, which were intended to be printed and handwritten to be filled out. Since the department can't update the original pair if says they're permanently locked, they discuss the possibility of making an accessible web form that would then generate the static PDF with what was typed in the PTF. That's generated looks exactly the same as a real static form, except it's just typed out instead of handwritten. STAT Decs already exist in this format, so it's okay and shouldn't throw off or surprise a justice of the peace. If you'd like to access the new static form, head to the Attorney General Department's website at W W W Dot H Dot gov AEW. That's W W W Dot AJ Dot Gov Dot A. And then top down to statutory declarations on the sidebar. And in some other news, Assistive Technology Suppliers Australia is seeking expressions of interest for the position of board member or non-executive director. Some applicants who have experience and skills in the areas of disability, assistive technologies or human services. For more details, head to the HSA website at WW Dot at AACI dot org dot ayear. That's w w w dot eight. Talk to AEW where you'll find an article about the position under the news and press releases dropdown of the Resources and News tab and titled HSA is seeking a board member. And there you'll find out all about the organization and the position, as well as where and how to apply. And finally, this week, Vision Australia Radio is holding a listener survey where you can go into the running to win one of 10 Amazon Echo Dots if you'd like to leave your thoughts or feedback. Head to the front page of the Vision Australia radio website via radio dot org that's via radio dot org and that's all we have time for today. You've been listening to Talking Bison Talking Vision is a production of Vision Australia radio. Thanks to all involved with putting the program together. And remember, we love your feedback and comments. You can contact us at Talking Vision at Vision Australia dot org that's talking Vision at Vision Australia dot org. But until next week, it's bye for now.

You can contact Vision Australia by phoning us anytime during business hours on one 300 eight four seven four six, that's one 300 eight four seven four double six or by visiting Vision Australia dot org. That's Vision Australia dot all.

You can contact Vision Australia by phoning us anytime during business hours on one 300 eight four seven four six, that's one 300 eight four seven four double six or by visiting Vision Australia dot org. That's Vision Australia dot all.