Taking a Walk. If you're looking to get more gratitude into your life to help you in some way, you're not going to find gratitude. It's almost the antithesis of gratitude. Helping one's self is self involved by nature, by design. Gratitude is being grateful to something or someone else. It's outwardly directed, and it necessitates not just a new habit, but an entire change of outlook.

Taking a Walk. If you're looking to get more gratitude into your life to help you in some way, you're not going to find gratitude. It's almost the antithesis of gratitude. Helping one's self is self involved by nature, by design. Gratitude is being grateful to something or someone else. It's outwardly directed, and it necessitates not just a new habit, but an entire change of outlook.

I'm buzz night and welcome to another Taking a Walk podcast. This is the podcast where I talk with musicians and insiders about their latest work, their reflections, their influences, their stories behind the music. If you like this episode or other episodes, please share with your friends and kindly spread the word on Taking a Walk, and please leave us a review on Apple Podcasts as well. We would really appreciate that on this episode. One of the nicest and most supremely talented artists of our generation, Peter Himmelman, has been creating and sharing his work for over three decades as a film composer, visual artist, writer and musician. This amazing singer songwriter. He was my first guest on the Taking a Walk podcast when we walked on his beautiful farm in Hudson Valley, New York, on November sixteenth, twenty twenty one. Peter's always demand pushing creative boundaries. He has a new book, Suspended by No String, a songwriter's reflection on faith, aliveness and wonder. Let's talk with Peter Himmelman now on taking a walk Peter Himmerman, great to be with you nowhere as joyous as being with you in person seeing the donkeys and watching the birds go by on your farm, but so great to be with you. Congrats on the book well, Suspended by No String, And you do talk in the book about the birds and the joy of their existence. The starlings get their place for sure. What do birds teach us about our faith, our aliveness and our wonder?

I'm buzz night and welcome to another Taking a Walk podcast. This is the podcast where I talk with musicians and insiders about their latest work, their reflections, their influences, their stories behind the music. If you like this episode or other episodes, please share with your friends and kindly spread the word on Taking a Walk, and please leave us a review on Apple Podcasts as well. We would really appreciate that on this episode. One of the nicest and most supremely talented artists of our generation, Peter Himmelman, has been creating and sharing his work for over three decades as a film composer, visual artist, writer and musician. This amazing singer songwriter. He was my first guest on the Taking a Walk podcast when we walked on his beautiful farm in Hudson Valley, New York, on November sixteenth, twenty twenty one. Peter's always demand pushing creative boundaries. He has a new book, Suspended by No String, a songwriter's reflection on faith, aliveness and wonder. Let's talk with Peter Himmelman now on taking a walk Peter Himmerman, great to be with you nowhere as joyous as being with you in person seeing the donkeys and watching the birds go by on your farm, but so great to be with you. Congrats on the book well, Suspended by No String, And you do talk in the book about the birds and the joy of their existence. The starlings get their place for sure. What do birds teach us about our faith, our aliveness and our wonder?

Well, that's you just throwing a big question at me this morning, and I'm just gonna have to roll with it. There's no backing out, there's no rehearsal, by the way, with this stuff, no pre canned thing. So look, if I had to just riff on that idea, I think that human beings must have an historic fascination with birds. Birds show us what acendency is like. They teach us about weightlessness, about lifting off from where we are. We are kind of as mortal beings tethered to the ground basically, and tether to our own prejudices and thoughts and reconceived notions about things. So maybe it's almost a harbinger in a sign for these times to sort of get to a place that's a little higher elevation spiritually, emotionally, intellectually than we've been before. That's my answer to your question. Make sure you're write that down. I'm use that thing one more time somewhere. That's good. I like it.

Well, that's you just throwing a big question at me this morning, and I'm just gonna have to roll with it. There's no backing out, there's no rehearsal, by the way, with this stuff, no pre canned thing. So look, if I had to just riff on that idea, I think that human beings must have an historic fascination with birds. Birds show us what acendency is like. They teach us about weightlessness, about lifting off from where we are. We are kind of as mortal beings tethered to the ground basically, and tether to our own prejudices and thoughts and reconceived notions about things. So maybe it's almost a harbinger in a sign for these times to sort of get to a place that's a little higher elevation spiritually, emotionally, intellectually than we've been before. That's my answer to your question. Make sure you're write that down. I'm use that thing one more time somewhere. That's good. I like it.

It's gonna go into a big muse session. I think for sure you're gonna bring that one with you. I love Paul Riser's comments about your book, and I'm gonna make you blush you a little bit, He says. The breadth of his knowledge, interests, and curiosity is a remarkable thing. He's tapped into it all to concoct this delicious, fun to read, inspiring spiritual soup. Grab a spoon and dive in. I promise you will love it. I absolutely love that. What's your favorite soup?

It's gonna go into a big muse session. I think for sure you're gonna bring that one with you. I love Paul Riser's comments about your book, and I'm gonna make you blush you a little bit, He says. The breadth of his knowledge, interests, and curiosity is a remarkable thing. He's tapped into it all to concoct this delicious, fun to read, inspiring spiritual soup. Grab a spoon and dive in. I promise you will love it. I absolutely love that. What's your favorite soup?

First of all, right off the bat, i'd have to say minnestrone, And then I like a good fish chowder, a Manhattan style fish chowder.

First of all, right off the bat, i'd have to say minnestrone, And then I like a good fish chowder, a Manhattan style fish chowder.

Because I am I consider myself the self proclaimed Sultan of soup. So that's why I had to focus on that. But more importantly, how does it make you feel when somebody liked Fall Riser and all these amazing other folks say these tremendous things about you and your work and the book I love Larry Klein's words, and so many others. How does this make you feel?

Because I am I consider myself the self proclaimed Sultan of soup. So that's why I had to focus on that. But more importantly, how does it make you feel when somebody liked Fall Riser and all these amazing other folks say these tremendous things about you and your work and the book I love Larry Klein's words, and so many others. How does this make you feel?

Well, I'll tell you what it's not. First of all, it's not a kick in the pants. I got to tell you that much. Some of the people that I shared the book with I suspected they might have something to say about it. It's very ennobling. It's very heartening, you know. I harken this back to like music. One of the it's not the greatest joys. The greatest joy of music is perhaps just making it and performing it. But another one is when musicians that I really respect have shown respect for my music. I mean, I think that maybe this is universal. No matter who you are as a creator, even the best people, they have many more periods of doubt about what they do than one might expect. Even some of the greatest musicians that I know, they sometimes are like, you know, maybe I'm not as good as I think I am. And what I can speak, you know, for myself personally from somebody that you really admire. It allows you to dig more freely into what it is that you do. I'm able to sort of shrug off some of these doubts and create more freely and more abundantly.

Well, I'll tell you what it's not. First of all, it's not a kick in the pants. I got to tell you that much. Some of the people that I shared the book with I suspected they might have something to say about it. It's very ennobling. It's very heartening, you know. I harken this back to like music. One of the it's not the greatest joys. The greatest joy of music is perhaps just making it and performing it. But another one is when musicians that I really respect have shown respect for my music. I mean, I think that maybe this is universal. No matter who you are as a creator, even the best people, they have many more periods of doubt about what they do than one might expect. Even some of the greatest musicians that I know, they sometimes are like, you know, maybe I'm not as good as I think I am. And what I can speak, you know, for myself personally from somebody that you really admire. It allows you to dig more freely into what it is that you do. I'm able to sort of shrug off some of these doubts and create more freely and more abundantly.

Can you describe how this book became this passionate, beautiful project that you ultimately took to the finish line? Well, I had written a.

Can you describe how this book became this passionate, beautiful project that you ultimately took to the finish line? Well, I had written a.

Book and came out like in twenty seventeen. It was called let Me Out, Unlock your Creative Mind and Bring your Ideas to life, And that was the book had a very deliberate premise. It was sort of a study in some way, not a pedantic one, but just kind of an informal one which explored how is it that certain people I'll take you for example, are able to take an idea like the Taking a Walk podcast and actually make it manifest? Well, many others would have an idea is something like that, and the idea would just sort of fade away. How is it that people that are productive and sort of are creating things and putting them out in the world. What is the mindset that they have and what are the ways that they achieve those things? And the book had in it a very small trace of something that I would call, for lack of a better word, spiritual. There's something about creativity which I almost think is synonymous with spirituality, and discussing that with a lot of different artists and musicians and poets and friends of mine. People that do create are very able to say, yeah, I know what you mean. It's kind of it's just part of the thing. They often feel that inspirations have come to them, as though in a dream, that they're gifted with things. It's not a constant thing, but they are familiar with that having happened. So I set out to make another sort of sequel to let me out another book about creativity. And this was another way to sort of get more work from my company, Big Muse, which works to sort of teach creativity, however one defines it to different corporations like three M and Boeing and Gap and other places. And as I started working on that book, it was sort of frustrating. I worked on it for years, this sort of sequel, and it just wasn't right. It just didn't feel right. And I finally, through a couple people that I knew, got a hold of this wonderful editor. Her name is Barbara Clark, and she's like a real editor. She worked I don't know which, If it was random House, I don't know where. She worked for many years. She was a book agent as well, and I talked to her on the phone. I liked her. We had some rapport with one another, and she said, well, send me what you have, and you know, for a fee, I will send you back a fifteen page, single space treatise on what I'm seeing. And she did it. That was her deliverable, and you know, she liked my writerly voice. And she went on and about halfway through this little thing that she'd sent me, she said, look, I don't see this as a book about creativity so much as I see it trying to be a book about spirituality. And that was you know how sometimes one sentence can be such a liberating thing depending on who's saying it. It was such a freeing thing. So I worked another two years with that in mind, and I created a kind of a prescriptive nonfiction book about spirituality which is sort of a hump to me looking back, sort of an oxymoron. It's almost like a self help book about spirituality. Was nothing I really wanted to do. In the end, that also started to feel just stupid to me, just literally stupid. And then I sent as the book was about to go out to different publishers, I sent another piece, another little short essay. It was about a twelve hundred word piece. The title of the piece was suspended by no string. And I wrote to Barber and I said, you know, we're getting to the end of this process. What would you think about maybe shoehorning this one thing into this prescriptive nonfiction book about spirituality. Well, she took an inordinately long time to get back to me, and she wrote, this may sound very troubling to you, but I'm afraid you're paying me to give you my best advice. If you have more like what I just read, which I think is one of the most beautiful pieces I've read in decades, I think you should basically drop the entire book you've been working on and start again. Now. That was doubly liberating for me, one because I didn't really think that what I had done was good enough to put out there. And also these pieces that are now included in the book, some of which I had been writing since two thousand and eight in various forums or thinking about. They were so easy for me to write because they were almost like the way that I write songs. I wasn't trying to teach anyone anything. It wasn't a you know, pedantic kind of scholarly work on something or trying to sell something somebody. It wasn't to get more work in my corporate business. It was just reflections for myself that would almost serve as a legacy piece for my children that even they pretty much know where I stand on everything, so I don't even know if they'll read it, but it just felt like this is something that I can get behind, and I started to really enjoy that process and it went on for another couple of years, and that's kind of how I arrived at it, and it's you know, I hope I continue loving it as much as I have and not looking back and saying well I could change this, and that I just it is. It's finished, you know, and I'm proud of it in a way that I haven't been this proud of anything that I've done in a long time.

Book and came out like in twenty seventeen. It was called let Me Out, Unlock your Creative Mind and Bring your Ideas to life, And that was the book had a very deliberate premise. It was sort of a study in some way, not a pedantic one, but just kind of an informal one which explored how is it that certain people I'll take you for example, are able to take an idea like the Taking a Walk podcast and actually make it manifest? Well, many others would have an idea is something like that, and the idea would just sort of fade away. How is it that people that are productive and sort of are creating things and putting them out in the world. What is the mindset that they have and what are the ways that they achieve those things? And the book had in it a very small trace of something that I would call, for lack of a better word, spiritual. There's something about creativity which I almost think is synonymous with spirituality, and discussing that with a lot of different artists and musicians and poets and friends of mine. People that do create are very able to say, yeah, I know what you mean. It's kind of it's just part of the thing. They often feel that inspirations have come to them, as though in a dream, that they're gifted with things. It's not a constant thing, but they are familiar with that having happened. So I set out to make another sort of sequel to let me out another book about creativity. And this was another way to sort of get more work from my company, Big Muse, which works to sort of teach creativity, however one defines it to different corporations like three M and Boeing and Gap and other places. And as I started working on that book, it was sort of frustrating. I worked on it for years, this sort of sequel, and it just wasn't right. It just didn't feel right. And I finally, through a couple people that I knew, got a hold of this wonderful editor. Her name is Barbara Clark, and she's like a real editor. She worked I don't know which, If it was random House, I don't know where. She worked for many years. She was a book agent as well, and I talked to her on the phone. I liked her. We had some rapport with one another, and she said, well, send me what you have, and you know, for a fee, I will send you back a fifteen page, single space treatise on what I'm seeing. And she did it. That was her deliverable, and you know, she liked my writerly voice. And she went on and about halfway through this little thing that she'd sent me, she said, look, I don't see this as a book about creativity so much as I see it trying to be a book about spirituality. And that was you know how sometimes one sentence can be such a liberating thing depending on who's saying it. It was such a freeing thing. So I worked another two years with that in mind, and I created a kind of a prescriptive nonfiction book about spirituality which is sort of a hump to me looking back, sort of an oxymoron. It's almost like a self help book about spirituality. Was nothing I really wanted to do. In the end, that also started to feel just stupid to me, just literally stupid. And then I sent as the book was about to go out to different publishers, I sent another piece, another little short essay. It was about a twelve hundred word piece. The title of the piece was suspended by no string. And I wrote to Barber and I said, you know, we're getting to the end of this process. What would you think about maybe shoehorning this one thing into this prescriptive nonfiction book about spirituality. Well, she took an inordinately long time to get back to me, and she wrote, this may sound very troubling to you, but I'm afraid you're paying me to give you my best advice. If you have more like what I just read, which I think is one of the most beautiful pieces I've read in decades, I think you should basically drop the entire book you've been working on and start again. Now. That was doubly liberating for me, one because I didn't really think that what I had done was good enough to put out there. And also these pieces that are now included in the book, some of which I had been writing since two thousand and eight in various forums or thinking about. They were so easy for me to write because they were almost like the way that I write songs. I wasn't trying to teach anyone anything. It wasn't a you know, pedantic kind of scholarly work on something or trying to sell something somebody. It wasn't to get more work in my corporate business. It was just reflections for myself that would almost serve as a legacy piece for my children that even they pretty much know where I stand on everything, so I don't even know if they'll read it, but it just felt like this is something that I can get behind, and I started to really enjoy that process and it went on for another couple of years, and that's kind of how I arrived at it, and it's you know, I hope I continue loving it as much as I have and not looking back and saying well I could change this, and that I just it is. It's finished, you know, and I'm proud of it in a way that I haven't been this proud of anything that I've done in a long time.

It's wonderful, it really is. You know, you talk of situations. There's one in particular with a friend where he needed to get through this tough time in his marriage, this patch that was going on, and you talk about empathy and how you found empathy to help him with his challenges. Can you talk about how one should dig deep into their soul to help others as you did to your friend.

It's wonderful, it really is. You know, you talk of situations. There's one in particular with a friend where he needed to get through this tough time in his marriage, this patch that was going on, and you talk about empathy and how you found empathy to help him with his challenges. Can you talk about how one should dig deep into their soul to help others as you did to your friend.

Well, I think of empathy as a it's akin to a musical not a talent, but a predisposition to take sound waves and turn them into something. It's an innate quality. Maybe it's genetic, maybe it's experiential. What is it that makes one musician very I hate you, or we're talented? I'm not quite sure. I approve of that word very much. Somebody that has a native gift for music, people that are empathetic, that essentially have the ability to feel the feelings of others. It's also a sort of a dangerous thing because sometimes you can be overwhelmed by you're taking on the issues of other people. I do think that as a songwriter, it's a requisite quality to have this idea that you feel something deeply about someone. It doesn't mean that you love them necessarily or agree with them, but you're able to kind of put yourself in their shoes. And in the case of this person, it's a short little piece that I've written, it was sort of like, let me find some aspect of what he's going through in my cell, because we've all gone through rough patches in our relationships and so on. And only when I found a deep place within myself that seemed to echo with this person, this really great friend of mine who happens to be a fantastic musician, was I able to sort of help him. And I think, just to expand on this, the greatest help we can give is much different than simple advice. The best help that we can offer is to show a person that we're there for them and that we support them, and that we trust them, and we trust their abilities, their intellect, their emotional maturity to get through whatever it is they're getting through. Reflect back to them their strengths.

Well, I think of empathy as a it's akin to a musical not a talent, but a predisposition to take sound waves and turn them into something. It's an innate quality. Maybe it's genetic, maybe it's experiential. What is it that makes one musician very I hate you, or we're talented? I'm not quite sure. I approve of that word very much. Somebody that has a native gift for music, people that are empathetic, that essentially have the ability to feel the feelings of others. It's also a sort of a dangerous thing because sometimes you can be overwhelmed by you're taking on the issues of other people. I do think that as a songwriter, it's a requisite quality to have this idea that you feel something deeply about someone. It doesn't mean that you love them necessarily or agree with them, but you're able to kind of put yourself in their shoes. And in the case of this person, it's a short little piece that I've written, it was sort of like, let me find some aspect of what he's going through in my cell, because we've all gone through rough patches in our relationships and so on. And only when I found a deep place within myself that seemed to echo with this person, this really great friend of mine who happens to be a fantastic musician, was I able to sort of help him. And I think, just to expand on this, the greatest help we can give is much different than simple advice. The best help that we can offer is to show a person that we're there for them and that we support them, and that we trust them, and we trust their abilities, their intellect, their emotional maturity to get through whatever it is they're getting through. Reflect back to them their strengths.

You know, you are such a word smith and you understand the power of words, and words and descriptions come out so greatly in the book. What would your job description be if you were to lay it out there on the line.

You know, you are such a word smith and you understand the power of words, and words and descriptions come out so greatly in the book. What would your job description be if you were to lay it out there on the line.

Well, yeah, look only because I've thought about this a lot, and it's a question that I asked, you know, different leaders, whether it's from the military or different corporate leaders. I do think people, you know, not that they're I think of people beyond their job titles. So I can put an actuary in the sort of the same camp as an upright bass player. I'm looking at their humanity and I've asked them, how would you sum up through your life experiences. Let's say, take three of the most profound life experiences that you can think of, or very profound ones. For me, it's becoming a musician. You know, at age eleven, it was the death of my father, and it was getting married and raising children and now grandchildren. And then the question would be posed to me, so what kind of person did that make you? I request to people that are interested in going with this absurd idea, create a short, succinct sentence that starts with I am, I am and such a person. So it's not equivocating, it's not well, you know, sometimes it's like, I am this stand behind exactly what you think your purpose is. My purpose is to bring joy and hope to people. Now, do I fall short of that? Of course I do. I always do. To some people think, well, she's basically some kind of asshole. What is he thinking of joy and hope? I mean, but as a north star more times than not, that has guided me to that principle, And because I've publicly stated it, like on this show, and it's somewhat triauily, I get it and embarrassing to say that I am this person, but it's also revelatory and strengthening at the same time.

Well, yeah, look only because I've thought about this a lot, and it's a question that I asked, you know, different leaders, whether it's from the military or different corporate leaders. I do think people, you know, not that they're I think of people beyond their job titles. So I can put an actuary in the sort of the same camp as an upright bass player. I'm looking at their humanity and I've asked them, how would you sum up through your life experiences. Let's say, take three of the most profound life experiences that you can think of, or very profound ones. For me, it's becoming a musician. You know, at age eleven, it was the death of my father, and it was getting married and raising children and now grandchildren. And then the question would be posed to me, so what kind of person did that make you? I request to people that are interested in going with this absurd idea, create a short, succinct sentence that starts with I am, I am and such a person. So it's not equivocating, it's not well, you know, sometimes it's like, I am this stand behind exactly what you think your purpose is. My purpose is to bring joy and hope to people. Now, do I fall short of that? Of course I do. I always do. To some people think, well, she's basically some kind of asshole. What is he thinking of joy and hope? I mean, but as a north star more times than not, that has guided me to that principle, And because I've publicly stated it, like on this show, and it's somewhat triauily, I get it and embarrassing to say that I am this person, but it's also revelatory and strengthening at the same time.

You know, you talk how the best songs are part engineering, part benediction. What did you serve up on your amazing playlist today that fits this description?

You know, you talk how the best songs are part engineering, part benediction. What did you serve up on your amazing playlist today that fits this description?

Let's see what I have served up thus far, a variety of wayne shorter compositions. I don't play jazz. I can sort of barely scratch the surface of being able to place something like that. But it's so above me and beyond me that I enjoy being objective about listening to music. If I'm listening to people that do a similar thing than I do, I'm very subjective and I'm kind of like, well, I see, oh, I see what they did in the bridge there. That's it creates oftentimes a less enjoyable listening experience where I'm sort of analyzing as opposed to listening. However, there are occasionally songs that come around that are so stirring to me that I become objective again. There's some artists that I really love that are just like, wow, this is beautiful. One of them is this guy named Christian Lee Hudson, and you should probably talk to him. He's this young guy. He's just a phenomenal writer and person and he's on Anti Records and I saw, you know, he used to send me his demo tapes over the phone. He was just like a prodigious, you know, deliberate songwriter who was just going to do it. And he's also a very funny and humble person. Yeah, so, Wayne Shorter, I love it. I feel like elevated when I hear it.

Let's see what I have served up thus far, a variety of wayne shorter compositions. I don't play jazz. I can sort of barely scratch the surface of being able to place something like that. But it's so above me and beyond me that I enjoy being objective about listening to music. If I'm listening to people that do a similar thing than I do, I'm very subjective and I'm kind of like, well, I see, oh, I see what they did in the bridge there. That's it creates oftentimes a less enjoyable listening experience where I'm sort of analyzing as opposed to listening. However, there are occasionally songs that come around that are so stirring to me that I become objective again. There's some artists that I really love that are just like, wow, this is beautiful. One of them is this guy named Christian Lee Hudson, and you should probably talk to him. He's this young guy. He's just a phenomenal writer and person and he's on Anti Records and I saw, you know, he used to send me his demo tapes over the phone. He was just like a prodigious, you know, deliberate songwriter who was just going to do it. And he's also a very funny and humble person. Yeah, so, Wayne Shorter, I love it. I feel like elevated when I hear it.

Oh, no doubt. You know, we were talking about faith, and faith is a critical theme here and in the book talk about how faith can be this driving force behind artistic and creative breakthroughs, whether it be a creator like yourself or someone who's creating in another setting, like a business setting.

Oh, no doubt. You know, we were talking about faith, and faith is a critical theme here and in the book talk about how faith can be this driving force behind artistic and creative breakthroughs, whether it be a creator like yourself or someone who's creating in another setting, like a business setting.

Yeah. I mean, look, every human being is a creative type. Everybody is creating converse sations. People are creating chaos and noise. People are creating love and joy. They're creating business strategies, as you said, they're creating relationships. So creating isn't you know, the province of people with a goatee and a guitar or something, you know, or a paintbrush in their hand. It's as native to humanity is breathing. We just, you know, sort of, we have a prejudice to say that the person with you know, the hit song must be the creative type. Well maybe he or she was in a creative zone when they were writing that particular song, but when they're making eggs in the morning, maybe they're not as creative. And the male carrier, who doesn't seem to be an artist, perhaps the way that he relates to his children is extremely creative. So I just lost the whole train of thought. What was the damn question? I'm just going off the rails how faith helps succeed. I'm glad you just threw me right back to it, buzz because you know, like I'm buzzing off like a bee. I mean, look, faith is a huge word, and it's so broad. There's faith in one's own ability. There's faith in one's government, there's faith in one's you know, spouse and friends. In some way in the book, I'm speaking about that, and I'm also speaking about faith in and even in the book I have a caveat at the beginning, like, perhaps you think I don't know exactly what I said. It's unusual to learn that I have deliberated in a book about faith to use the word God. And the reason is is because it's such a loaded term and people have I was going to say, people have misconceptions about God. I would say this, If anyone has a conception of God anthropomorphic or otherwise, they should know that it's all there's no way to conceptualize God. It's beyond beyond any conception. But faith in the idea that there is order in the world is maybe what I'm talking about, that there is a creative force, you might say with a capital F. When I was a kid, and I think it's almost natural for children to understand that the world is a magical place, let's say, and that it's full of wonder. And then I guess as we become educated, we learn things. We learn that water is well, what's water what is water? Buzz, how would you use define water?

Yeah. I mean, look, every human being is a creative type. Everybody is creating converse sations. People are creating chaos and noise. People are creating love and joy. They're creating business strategies, as you said, they're creating relationships. So creating isn't you know, the province of people with a goatee and a guitar or something, you know, or a paintbrush in their hand. It's as native to humanity is breathing. We just, you know, sort of, we have a prejudice to say that the person with you know, the hit song must be the creative type. Well maybe he or she was in a creative zone when they were writing that particular song, but when they're making eggs in the morning, maybe they're not as creative. And the male carrier, who doesn't seem to be an artist, perhaps the way that he relates to his children is extremely creative. So I just lost the whole train of thought. What was the damn question? I'm just going off the rails how faith helps succeed. I'm glad you just threw me right back to it, buzz because you know, like I'm buzzing off like a bee. I mean, look, faith is a huge word, and it's so broad. There's faith in one's own ability. There's faith in one's government, there's faith in one's you know, spouse and friends. In some way in the book, I'm speaking about that, and I'm also speaking about faith in and even in the book I have a caveat at the beginning, like, perhaps you think I don't know exactly what I said. It's unusual to learn that I have deliberated in a book about faith to use the word God. And the reason is is because it's such a loaded term and people have I was going to say, people have misconceptions about God. I would say this, If anyone has a conception of God anthropomorphic or otherwise, they should know that it's all there's no way to conceptualize God. It's beyond beyond any conception. But faith in the idea that there is order in the world is maybe what I'm talking about, that there is a creative force, you might say with a capital F. When I was a kid, and I think it's almost natural for children to understand that the world is a magical place, let's say, and that it's full of wonder. And then I guess as we become educated, we learn things. We learn that water is well, what's water what is water? Buzz, how would you use define water?

The essence of everything?

The essence of everything?

Yeah, ohthe that's a closer answer. Some people will say, look, it's H two zero and so you're talking about two parts hydrogen, and you know, they give you a name for it, but it doesn't really explain anything. And if you say the essence of everything, it can ask you as well, what is essence? What does that mean? The fundamentals, the core, but the core of what? In other words, if you delve more deeply into anything, you come to a very what I think is a lovely and humbling place that you don't really know much at all. It doesn't mean that you're not a scholar, or you're very skilled in a certain area or in many areas. It means that at the root of it all, you don't really understand anything. And it's it's a beautiful feeling that there's something beyond the kin of human intellect. It's not only at least for me, it's not only humbling. It's reassuring that there is order. I grew up in a milliu that you know, I grew up Jewish and we were very Jewishly identified. But if I would have discussed let's say God in a serious way in my home, or in my community at large, or with my friends, they would have thought that I was perhaps in need of psychiatric care. I grew up in a world of rationalists, and at the heart of it, I don't believe any human being is a rationalist. When God forbid, somebody dies or a child is born, all that rationality goes right out the window, because then they are face to face with this ineffable sense of wonder and mystery. I always had these thoughts as a kid, and I didn't have language to articulate it. I didn't have a community that, at least I didn't think that would listen to what I had to say about this stuff. It was very sort of closeted. My thinking always was how could the world be have come about through random forces? And I allow, because I get a lot of pushback from people. I have these discussions, which I enjoy. They said, well, the Big Bang, and you're not taking an account billions or perhaps trillions of years where all these different things can occur. And I'm saying, yeah, I'm going to grant you that, but I want you to grant me this in turn. Let's just say that my belief in God and then in God constantly creating the world. Let's say that it's completely absurd to you, and I get that. I don't know. There's no empirical proof of this. It's just the preponderance of my experience as a sixty four year old person has led me to that it's only a belief or an understanding. It's not provable. But I want you to admit that it's on the other side, this idea of randomness and just sort of disorder creation that happened to fall into order is equally as absurd. And then we can continue the discussion. And it's a wonderful discussion to have. I can go hours. It is the kind of thing I would talk about when as a kid, when I'd like get stoned or something. It was just you know, but I took it and ran with it.

Yeah, ohthe that's a closer answer. Some people will say, look, it's H two zero and so you're talking about two parts hydrogen, and you know, they give you a name for it, but it doesn't really explain anything. And if you say the essence of everything, it can ask you as well, what is essence? What does that mean? The fundamentals, the core, but the core of what? In other words, if you delve more deeply into anything, you come to a very what I think is a lovely and humbling place that you don't really know much at all. It doesn't mean that you're not a scholar, or you're very skilled in a certain area or in many areas. It means that at the root of it all, you don't really understand anything. And it's it's a beautiful feeling that there's something beyond the kin of human intellect. It's not only at least for me, it's not only humbling. It's reassuring that there is order. I grew up in a milliu that you know, I grew up Jewish and we were very Jewishly identified. But if I would have discussed let's say God in a serious way in my home, or in my community at large, or with my friends, they would have thought that I was perhaps in need of psychiatric care. I grew up in a world of rationalists, and at the heart of it, I don't believe any human being is a rationalist. When God forbid, somebody dies or a child is born, all that rationality goes right out the window, because then they are face to face with this ineffable sense of wonder and mystery. I always had these thoughts as a kid, and I didn't have language to articulate it. I didn't have a community that, at least I didn't think that would listen to what I had to say about this stuff. It was very sort of closeted. My thinking always was how could the world be have come about through random forces? And I allow, because I get a lot of pushback from people. I have these discussions, which I enjoy. They said, well, the Big Bang, and you're not taking an account billions or perhaps trillions of years where all these different things can occur. And I'm saying, yeah, I'm going to grant you that, but I want you to grant me this in turn. Let's just say that my belief in God and then in God constantly creating the world. Let's say that it's completely absurd to you, and I get that. I don't know. There's no empirical proof of this. It's just the preponderance of my experience as a sixty four year old person has led me to that it's only a belief or an understanding. It's not provable. But I want you to admit that it's on the other side, this idea of randomness and just sort of disorder creation that happened to fall into order is equally as absurd. And then we can continue the discussion. And it's a wonderful discussion to have. I can go hours. It is the kind of thing I would talk about when as a kid, when I'd like get stoned or something. It was just you know, but I took it and ran with it.

We'll be right back with the Taken a Walk Podcast. Welcome back to the Taking a Walk Podcast. You know you say in the book what compels me today and urge to slow things down, to cherish and to utilize every moment to its fullest. How can your book, suspended by no string help others so importantly to slow down.

We'll be right back with the Taken a Walk Podcast. Welcome back to the Taking a Walk Podcast. You know you say in the book what compels me today and urge to slow things down, to cherish and to utilize every moment to its fullest. How can your book, suspended by no string help others so importantly to slow down.

Well, I mean that's both a sort of an esoteric question and a practical one, I mean, the real practical one. And the answer is very obvious, and it's something that's not only obvious, it's really really difficult, if not impossible, to do. If you're asking the practical advice, I would say, on the iPhone, there is an off button, and most people don't ever use it. They you know, sort of put it on silent or something. But to turn the phone off is not only a tangible step, but it's also a kind of a symbolic step. I am disassociating myself from this device which is constantly coined for my attention, and I'm going to use it as a tool rather than it using me as a tool to gain you know, some algorithmic whatever it is that they buy you know that they trace you and track you. You become its tool making people money, you know, collecting data from you. That's a huge practical thing. I mean, I keep the Jewish sabbath called Shabis or Shabbat, so for thirty seven years, fifty two weeks a year, fifty two times a year, on every Friday night to Saturday night, and also including holidays, is probably about seventy days out of the year, which maybe seems not a lot. I always shut the phone off for twenty five hours. I'm not saying it made me happier or a better person or anything like that, but it in some way it must differentiate me from people that never shut it off. And when I do shut off the phone, I do it. I'm very cognizant of what it is that I'm turning off this thing that I'm on all the time the rest of the week, six days a week, I use it all the time. I'm like, I love technology, I love AI, but I'm shutting it off and I can somewhat it's almost palpable that I'm feeling myself both a little frightened that I'm disconnecting from the world and the news and everything, and in equal parts are even a greater part that I'm liberating myself from that, from this tether. So that's a practical thing. Anyone that wants to slow things down, shut off your phone, don't bring it with you on your walk. It's really difficult to do. The only reason that I do it is because I see it as an imperative from God. It sounds like funny. You know, I have come to an understanding, as a complicated route to that understanding, where God not an anthropomorphic guy in a cloud with a lightning bolt. It's not how I conceive of it. I conceive of it in a way I said it's inconceivable, which is no conception at all. The creator of the universe as a will, I've understood it not to use electronics as dictated in the Torah, which is thirty three hundred years old. My people have been doing this for three millennium. I liked the idea of being attached to something with that kind of continuity, and that gives me the impetus to shut off the phone. Otherwise I never would. If it was just a way to self help, I would never do it.

Well, I mean that's both a sort of an esoteric question and a practical one, I mean, the real practical one. And the answer is very obvious, and it's something that's not only obvious, it's really really difficult, if not impossible, to do. If you're asking the practical advice, I would say, on the iPhone, there is an off button, and most people don't ever use it. They you know, sort of put it on silent or something. But to turn the phone off is not only a tangible step, but it's also a kind of a symbolic step. I am disassociating myself from this device which is constantly coined for my attention, and I'm going to use it as a tool rather than it using me as a tool to gain you know, some algorithmic whatever it is that they buy you know that they trace you and track you. You become its tool making people money, you know, collecting data from you. That's a huge practical thing. I mean, I keep the Jewish sabbath called Shabis or Shabbat, so for thirty seven years, fifty two weeks a year, fifty two times a year, on every Friday night to Saturday night, and also including holidays, is probably about seventy days out of the year, which maybe seems not a lot. I always shut the phone off for twenty five hours. I'm not saying it made me happier or a better person or anything like that, but it in some way it must differentiate me from people that never shut it off. And when I do shut off the phone, I do it. I'm very cognizant of what it is that I'm turning off this thing that I'm on all the time the rest of the week, six days a week, I use it all the time. I'm like, I love technology, I love AI, but I'm shutting it off and I can somewhat it's almost palpable that I'm feeling myself both a little frightened that I'm disconnecting from the world and the news and everything, and in equal parts are even a greater part that I'm liberating myself from that, from this tether. So that's a practical thing. Anyone that wants to slow things down, shut off your phone, don't bring it with you on your walk. It's really difficult to do. The only reason that I do it is because I see it as an imperative from God. It sounds like funny. You know, I have come to an understanding, as a complicated route to that understanding, where God not an anthropomorphic guy in a cloud with a lightning bolt. It's not how I conceive of it. I conceive of it in a way I said it's inconceivable, which is no conception at all. The creator of the universe as a will, I've understood it not to use electronics as dictated in the Torah, which is thirty three hundred years old. My people have been doing this for three millennium. I liked the idea of being attached to something with that kind of continuity, and that gives me the impetus to shut off the phone. Otherwise I never would. If it was just a way to self help, I would never do it.

You discuss the importance of change in the book. You say change is the perfect window cleaner. It scours the filth from your perceptions of the world. I absolutely love that. Who are artists or musicians that inspired you to change at any point in your life?

You discuss the importance of change in the book. You say change is the perfect window cleaner. It scours the filth from your perceptions of the world. I absolutely love that. Who are artists or musicians that inspired you to change at any point in your life?

Well, I mean very recently, because of a new record coming out, which we'll have to do another talking podcast about. I was all set to go into the studio and record a certain number of songs. This is now back like four years it would before COVID. And then I watched Chasing Train, which I advise everybody to watch John Coltrane, whether you like jazz or not, anyone that wants to be inspired by a person who's constantly testing himself and reaching higher and higher, at least in terms of his creativity. I think he was doing the same thing in his spiritual outlook as well. After seeing that film, I decided that the songs that I was about to record, and I had a bunch of musicians already ready, and it was a couple months in advance, so I wasn't like cannon On On the night before. But I did cancel the whole recording session and I wrote new songs. I dug deeper. I changed the way that I was writing. I changed some of the subject matter. I never go into a song either way thinking I'm gonna write about this or that. I just start writing and whatever comes comes. But that one short documentary was it was a significant change from a strange place of just watching a film about John Coltrane. And there are many more profound changes that I would think of when I you referred me back to that piece the glass cleaner. Some of the changes are extremely painful when somebody says, well, you know, I really went through this change, and you know I came up with the side this new thing. Or they went through a significant change and then they popped up in another place, their business change or something. What you don't know about the change, which most people don't talk about, is when they were crying in the shower that something was so moving to them that they literally had a life changing moment and not just a change of album, but a significant change in their life and their outlook. They were in a fetal ball, crying to themselves. Else everybody does it at some point, nobody wants to talk about it, that there was something so substantial going on that it rested them from where they were and took them to another place. And sometimes, you know, we pray that the changes will be the birth of a baby or a grandchild, or a marriage or something beautiful that'll do the same thing for you.

Well, I mean very recently, because of a new record coming out, which we'll have to do another talking podcast about. I was all set to go into the studio and record a certain number of songs. This is now back like four years it would before COVID. And then I watched Chasing Train, which I advise everybody to watch John Coltrane, whether you like jazz or not, anyone that wants to be inspired by a person who's constantly testing himself and reaching higher and higher, at least in terms of his creativity. I think he was doing the same thing in his spiritual outlook as well. After seeing that film, I decided that the songs that I was about to record, and I had a bunch of musicians already ready, and it was a couple months in advance, so I wasn't like cannon On On the night before. But I did cancel the whole recording session and I wrote new songs. I dug deeper. I changed the way that I was writing. I changed some of the subject matter. I never go into a song either way thinking I'm gonna write about this or that. I just start writing and whatever comes comes. But that one short documentary was it was a significant change from a strange place of just watching a film about John Coltrane. And there are many more profound changes that I would think of when I you referred me back to that piece the glass cleaner. Some of the changes are extremely painful when somebody says, well, you know, I really went through this change, and you know I came up with the side this new thing. Or they went through a significant change and then they popped up in another place, their business change or something. What you don't know about the change, which most people don't talk about, is when they were crying in the shower that something was so moving to them that they literally had a life changing moment and not just a change of album, but a significant change in their life and their outlook. They were in a fetal ball, crying to themselves. Else everybody does it at some point, nobody wants to talk about it, that there was something so substantial going on that it rested them from where they were and took them to another place. And sometimes, you know, we pray that the changes will be the birth of a baby or a grandchild, or a marriage or something beautiful that'll do the same thing for you.

You know, Gratitude is the centerpiece of the book Your Life. Talk to those listening who might be you know, in some aspect of a business world on how leading with gratitude can benefit them.

You know, Gratitude is the centerpiece of the book Your Life. Talk to those listening who might be you know, in some aspect of a business world on how leading with gratitude can benefit them.

Well, I always like to like, I don't know, this is just my nature to like subvert everything I'm hearing and the question. But I do have the rub against this a little bit. That's okay, okay, So if one is searching for gratitude and this is just this is the first time I've ever said this, so I haven't tested it. By the way, nothing I say is like data driven, nothing is factual. It's just my thoughts, my thought. My answer to your question is if you're looking to get more gratitude into your life to help you in some way, you're not going to find gratitude. It's almost the antithesis of gratitude. Helping one's self is self involved by nature, by design. Gratitude is being grateful to something or someone else. It's outwardly directed, and it necessitates not just a new habit, but an entire change of outlook, which one who is serious about it will be working on, mostly failing on, all their life. The nature of a human being, as temporal beings, is to serve oneself. That's how we're wired. This is the animal part of us. There's nothing wrong with it, but to sort of have that piece of us sussumed within a higher part of us. It takes a lifetime of the most rigorous intellectual action. I have not succeeded on that level at all. I'm not like an expert, and especially the book is not talking about my expertise in any of this. It's talking about my sloppy wrestling with these ideas, and at least the transparency of the difficulties that I've had maintaining a sense of faith or gratitude. Not that I disparage those things are really important, but they're not achievable by brain hacks or something, or putting it on your calendar, setting aside ten minutes for gratitude, no offense. If that's what you do, and maybe it works, it doesn't seem right to me. True gratitude means that you gain a new awareness, and then you can be grateful for everything. That I can speak to you right now, and that you and I Buzz have forged a friendship and a trust for one another with only meeting a few times. That's a beautiful, wondrous thing, and I'm grateful to you. I'm grateful to the human mind which created these technologies. I'm grateful to God that created the space that we exist in and human minds and continues to create. It becomes another window through which you see the world. It's not transitory, beautiful.

Well, I always like to like, I don't know, this is just my nature to like subvert everything I'm hearing and the question. But I do have the rub against this a little bit. That's okay, okay, So if one is searching for gratitude and this is just this is the first time I've ever said this, so I haven't tested it. By the way, nothing I say is like data driven, nothing is factual. It's just my thoughts, my thought. My answer to your question is if you're looking to get more gratitude into your life to help you in some way, you're not going to find gratitude. It's almost the antithesis of gratitude. Helping one's self is self involved by nature, by design. Gratitude is being grateful to something or someone else. It's outwardly directed, and it necessitates not just a new habit, but an entire change of outlook, which one who is serious about it will be working on, mostly failing on, all their life. The nature of a human being, as temporal beings, is to serve oneself. That's how we're wired. This is the animal part of us. There's nothing wrong with it, but to sort of have that piece of us sussumed within a higher part of us. It takes a lifetime of the most rigorous intellectual action. I have not succeeded on that level at all. I'm not like an expert, and especially the book is not talking about my expertise in any of this. It's talking about my sloppy wrestling with these ideas, and at least the transparency of the difficulties that I've had maintaining a sense of faith or gratitude. Not that I disparage those things are really important, but they're not achievable by brain hacks or something, or putting it on your calendar, setting aside ten minutes for gratitude, no offense. If that's what you do, and maybe it works, it doesn't seem right to me. True gratitude means that you gain a new awareness, and then you can be grateful for everything. That I can speak to you right now, and that you and I Buzz have forged a friendship and a trust for one another with only meeting a few times. That's a beautiful, wondrous thing, and I'm grateful to you. I'm grateful to the human mind which created these technologies. I'm grateful to God that created the space that we exist in and human minds and continues to create. It becomes another window through which you see the world. It's not transitory, beautiful.

You take us into the intricacies of songwriting right at the outset of the shadows section, and you say, when you're writing a song, don't worry about knowing exactly what it is. You're saying, can you collaborate on the mystery of songwriting and what folks and other creative ventures can learn from it?

You take us into the intricacies of songwriting right at the outset of the shadows section, and you say, when you're writing a song, don't worry about knowing exactly what it is. You're saying, can you collaborate on the mystery of songwriting and what folks and other creative ventures can learn from it?

Yeah? I mean, I was speaking to a really great songwriter yesterday who seems to be stuck in a rout a bit in terms of output and so on. He's very desirous of writing more. He's a very very talented, gifted person. What's difficult, and it could be cultural, is that in order to write songs and in order to conceive of new things, the intellectual and analytical mind isn't as helpful as you think it will be. The analytical, technical, rational mind comes into edit and to correct sort of your initial inspiration. There's a Jewish mystical idea I think that talks about this a lot. There's three facts. It's Ohma, it means it denotes this initial flash of an idea, and we've all had those. Just this flash. It doesn't really have any components to it yet, but it somehow contains something of a whole. It's like it's this idea, I haven't thought it through. The next piece is bena, where you start to then use your intellect to construct something. And I'll relate this in a minute to like songwriting. You can use that as an example. And the final one is dot, which means knowledge that you've completed this thing and you understand it in a way that it changes you fundamentally. That's how you know that you know somebody. In Biblical language, it was like you know Adam nu Eve. They use that expression to have this intimacy that something fundamental is going to grow from this. It's the deepest kind of awareness that we can have to really know something. And back to where we said, what do we really know? Well, then you know that you don't know. It's another kind of knowledge. But in talking to this songwriter, I said, you have only one thing that you need to do, and it's so easy, and yet it's so difficult because it's so fraught with fear. And what is the fear if I write something and it's no good. On some level, you're afraid that someone won't love you. It goes deep like that. And the thing that I think is the most important, let's say for a songwriter. And you can universalize this any way you want, just like your podcast, it was a flash of an idea. The first thing that you need to do is sit down and start writing. Playing. Start start. You don't need an idea. Your ideas, the ones that aren't you in your conscious mind are not necessarily better than the ones that you sit down and just sort of cull from a dream sort of place. You sit down and you write. At least I do this. I have no idea what I'm going to write about. In the first few sentences. I just write and I look at them and I say, wow, where do those sentences go? Where do they lead? And then, in some sense, if I've sort of pushed away this constant nagging threat of Peter, who do you think you are? You're like not a rock star, you never achieved what you thought you would, You're not Springsteen. So who are you to write? Who are you to do anything? And I've said to this little voice in my head, you know consciously or subconsciously. Yes, yes, I am not Bruce Springsteen. But I'm Peter Himmelman, and I only have what I have, and I'm going to make the best of what I am and I'm going to write something, and I'm going to finish it. And if it's no good, I can throw it away. And if it needs to be changed and fixed, I'll change and fix it. But I will sit and I will write something no matter what.

Yeah? I mean, I was speaking to a really great songwriter yesterday who seems to be stuck in a rout a bit in terms of output and so on. He's very desirous of writing more. He's a very very talented, gifted person. What's difficult, and it could be cultural, is that in order to write songs and in order to conceive of new things, the intellectual and analytical mind isn't as helpful as you think it will be. The analytical, technical, rational mind comes into edit and to correct sort of your initial inspiration. There's a Jewish mystical idea I think that talks about this a lot. There's three facts. It's Ohma, it means it denotes this initial flash of an idea, and we've all had those. Just this flash. It doesn't really have any components to it yet, but it somehow contains something of a whole. It's like it's this idea, I haven't thought it through. The next piece is bena, where you start to then use your intellect to construct something. And I'll relate this in a minute to like songwriting. You can use that as an example. And the final one is dot, which means knowledge that you've completed this thing and you understand it in a way that it changes you fundamentally. That's how you know that you know somebody. In Biblical language, it was like you know Adam nu Eve. They use that expression to have this intimacy that something fundamental is going to grow from this. It's the deepest kind of awareness that we can have to really know something. And back to where we said, what do we really know? Well, then you know that you don't know. It's another kind of knowledge. But in talking to this songwriter, I said, you have only one thing that you need to do, and it's so easy, and yet it's so difficult because it's so fraught with fear. And what is the fear if I write something and it's no good. On some level, you're afraid that someone won't love you. It goes deep like that. And the thing that I think is the most important, let's say for a songwriter. And you can universalize this any way you want, just like your podcast, it was a flash of an idea. The first thing that you need to do is sit down and start writing. Playing. Start start. You don't need an idea. Your ideas, the ones that aren't you in your conscious mind are not necessarily better than the ones that you sit down and just sort of cull from a dream sort of place. You sit down and you write. At least I do this. I have no idea what I'm going to write about. In the first few sentences. I just write and I look at them and I say, wow, where do those sentences go? Where do they lead? And then, in some sense, if I've sort of pushed away this constant nagging threat of Peter, who do you think you are? You're like not a rock star, you never achieved what you thought you would, You're not Springsteen. So who are you to write? Who are you to do anything? And I've said to this little voice in my head, you know consciously or subconsciously. Yes, yes, I am not Bruce Springsteen. But I'm Peter Himmelman, and I only have what I have, and I'm going to make the best of what I am and I'm going to write something, and I'm going to finish it. And if it's no good, I can throw it away. And if it needs to be changed and fixed, I'll change and fix it. But I will sit and I will write something no matter what.

Peter, in closing, can you gush about some of the people that, during the process of writing Suspended by No String, really gave you that push at various moments to help you cross the finish line.

Peter, in closing, can you gush about some of the people that, during the process of writing Suspended by No String, really gave you that push at various moments to help you cross the finish line.

Well, I mean I would say that much of the inspiration goes to this my friend now, Barbara Clark, this editor. And well, let me say one quick thing. It's very difficult to write in a vacuum, in a sort of an emotional vacuum. If you don't have anyone to listen to your song, a friend, of spouse, a child, the song will have very little chance of being written. If you don't have somebody that's going to read what you write, there's no one to connect with. It's very difficult to finish anything. So just knowing that Barbara was going to read my stuff, and you know, I paid her. It was a professional relationship, which made it even better. She's on the hook for reading it. I know she's going to give me her honest feedback. But there were people along the line along the way. You mentioned Larry Klein and you know, the great bass player and multi Grammy winning producer, and we became friendly years ago, and I would sort of talk over some of these ideas. There's a keyboard player named Jeff Babco. I don't know if you know who he is, just an amazing keyboard player. You should get him on your show too, and maybe Larry as well. That I would just run these ideas across. I think the most significant contributor to the book had been my cousin Jeff Victor, who was you know, among my very best friends, a literal genius musician. And during parts of when I was writing the book, Jeff had had this very serious injury that like his leg was like had multiple surgeries on and he was in the most grievous pain. And in the mornings I would write things to send him just for him, and I would send them to him and to cheer him up, or to empathize with him, or to begin a conversation, And a lot of those pieces were up in the book. So I mean, you don't need a lot of people, You just need one or two, you know, to kind of be there with you. For example, who did you talk to about this podcast? Who gave you the impetus?

Well, I mean I would say that much of the inspiration goes to this my friend now, Barbara Clark, this editor. And well, let me say one quick thing. It's very difficult to write in a vacuum, in a sort of an emotional vacuum. If you don't have anyone to listen to your song, a friend, of spouse, a child, the song will have very little chance of being written. If you don't have somebody that's going to read what you write, there's no one to connect with. It's very difficult to finish anything. So just knowing that Barbara was going to read my stuff, and you know, I paid her. It was a professional relationship, which made it even better. She's on the hook for reading it. I know she's going to give me her honest feedback. But there were people along the line along the way. You mentioned Larry Klein and you know, the great bass player and multi Grammy winning producer, and we became friendly years ago, and I would sort of talk over some of these ideas. There's a keyboard player named Jeff Babco. I don't know if you know who he is, just an amazing keyboard player. You should get him on your show too, and maybe Larry as well. That I would just run these ideas across. I think the most significant contributor to the book had been my cousin Jeff Victor, who was you know, among my very best friends, a literal genius musician. And during parts of when I was writing the book, Jeff had had this very serious injury that like his leg was like had multiple surgeries on and he was in the most grievous pain. And in the mornings I would write things to send him just for him, and I would send them to him and to cheer him up, or to empathize with him, or to begin a conversation, And a lot of those pieces were up in the book. So I mean, you don't need a lot of people, You just need one or two, you know, to kind of be there with you. For example, who did you talk to about this podcast? Who gave you the impetus?

Well, I'm going to say a couple of people. At the outset. There was a man by the name of Rashad Tobakawala who I sort of call him a business buddha, and he lives in the Chicago area. Came out of the marketing CMO world, and I remember being in Chicago and running the idea by him and sort of getting his take on it, because that's where I came up with it on that particular trip. But I really want to thank you as well from the bottom of my heart, because you were the first musician that I had on it. And it was shaped at the beginning to be a very broader based podcast. I eventually centered it more around more around music and the power of music, and as somebody who reads you from your sub stack and follows what you're up to and watches and admires and marvels at your invention and your reinvention and your ability to push through the resistance creatively. That's very inspiring and has been and continues to be very inspiring for me. So I don't go through many days without marketing back and thinking about your piece of this. That's why I was so excited to sync back up with you, because you continue to have an important piece of this for what I'm doing and continuing to do for the Taking a Walk podcast. So I'm very grateful.

Well, I'm going to say a couple of people. At the outset. There was a man by the name of Rashad Tobakawala who I sort of call him a business buddha, and he lives in the Chicago area. Came out of the marketing CMO world, and I remember being in Chicago and running the idea by him and sort of getting his take on it, because that's where I came up with it on that particular trip. But I really want to thank you as well from the bottom of my heart, because you were the first musician that I had on it. And it was shaped at the beginning to be a very broader based podcast. I eventually centered it more around more around music and the power of music, and as somebody who reads you from your sub stack and follows what you're up to and watches and admires and marvels at your invention and your reinvention and your ability to push through the resistance creatively. That's very inspiring and has been and continues to be very inspiring for me. So I don't go through many days without marketing back and thinking about your piece of this. That's why I was so excited to sync back up with you, because you continue to have an important piece of this for what I'm doing and continuing to do for the Taking a Walk podcast. So I'm very grateful.

I'm honored to be a little tiny piece of it. You know. The point I guess is nobody ever does anything by themselves. A solo album is never a solo album. You have your name on it, but so many other people. I do want to put a shout out to Gretchen Young, who is the publisher of the book, and I sent her an early draft and she liked it. She said, this is is beautiful and it really gave me so much confidence, and she's so smart. We met in New York was so cold. We met outside, it was like COVID time, and we met in winter coats and just like had so much commonality, and I felt that she really understood what I was trying to do, and I'm like, let's do it. Let's just go, not going to shop this around. I like where you come.

I'm honored to be a little tiny piece of it. You know. The point I guess is nobody ever does anything by themselves. A solo album is never a solo album. You have your name on it, but so many other people. I do want to put a shout out to Gretchen Young, who is the publisher of the book, and I sent her an early draft and she liked it. She said, this is is beautiful and it really gave me so much confidence, and she's so smart. We met in New York was so cold. We met outside, it was like COVID time, and we met in winter coats and just like had so much commonality, and I felt that she really understood what I was trying to do, and I'm like, let's do it. Let's just go, not going to shop this around. I like where you come.

I mean from the book's great, suspended by no string. It's calming, it's something that alerts your senses as well, and it's beautifully done. And I'm grateful for your work and certainly our friendship, Peter, and I really appreciate you being on Taking a Walk.

I mean from the book's great, suspended by no string. It's calming, it's something that alerts your senses as well, and it's beautifully done. And I'm grateful for your work and certainly our friendship, Peter, and I really appreciate you being on Taking a Walk.

Buzz. I'll see you soon in the flesh. We get to the donkeys soon enough. Amen, all right, take care man, I'll talk to you soon. Bye bye, Thanks Peter, bye bye. Thank you.

Buzz. I'll see you soon in the flesh. We get to the donkeys soon enough. Amen, all right, take care man, I'll talk to you soon. Bye bye, Thanks Peter, bye bye. Thank you.

Thanks for listening to this episode of Taking a Walk with Peter him ohman. He is fantastic. Great to catch up with him again, and thanks for supporting Taking a Walk. You can find us on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Thanks for listening to this episode of Taking a Walk with Peter him ohman. He is fantastic. Great to catch up with him again, and thanks for supporting Taking a Walk. You can find us on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts.