Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve camera. It's ready. Are you welcome to Stuff you Should Know from House Stuff Works dot Com. Hey, welcome to the podcast. That's Chuck. I'm Josh. This is the Stuff you should Know, coming to you live from Studio one, a deep within the bowels of How Stuff Works corporate headquarters in Atlanta, Georgia's gross. Yeah, I like to do that once in a right, Nice, Chuck. My father spent the better part of the late nineties is kind of um well. He took a lot of pills. Okay, they were all herbal. They were all herbal supplements, mind you. But he would take like um uppers in the morning, like herbal uppers. Interesting. And then he'd take like herbal downers like two oh twos or four or four as I can't remember what they're called um in the evening, you know, to relax. And I call him the herbal Elvis and uh and I kid you not. He did this like he up and down and up and down, and finally he kick the habit. I guess, I don't know if he takes I know he takes a lot of vitamins and stuff but I think it's it's healthier. Um. And plus now he's retired, he has less reason to wake up in the morning as long as he didn't pass away on the toilet, you know, he hasn't. He hasn't, and thank god. But the thing is that it kind of points out like herbs can really pack a punch, you know. UM. Like take mahuiang for example, um mahuang, better known in this country as a fedra or a phedron, which is actually the alkaloid, the isolated alkaloid of mahuang, which actually in Chinese means bitter yellow, mahuyang bitter yellow at points. It's to the the color of this little evergreen shrub in the horrible taste of its leaves. Um mahwang has a terrible taste, bitter yellow taste. UM. So you know, the Chinese have been using the shrub for like five thousand years, right, and they're not really having a lot of trouble with it. Um. It comes to the United States and the nineties, and all of a sudden, between like the early nineties and two thousand three, there's like sixteen thousand cases of death and injury reported to the Federal government. Right, you've got truckers and college students popping white crosses. It's uh. They're also a key ingredient in so I mean, what happens what happened, right? I mean the Chinese will happen to stuff for five thousand years, it comes to the US and within a decade, sixteen thousand people dropped like flies. I'll tell you what happens. Americans love to get high. It's as simple as that. Abuse exactly. It's abuse. It's a lack of understands, the lack of respect um to the Chinese. What what we consider herbs they consider drugs, and what we consider herbs we don't really fear. We find them all natural, we don't. You know, it's not regulated by the FDA, so how could it be harmful? That's one of the interesting things that I think you pointed out was if something is the more heavily something is regulated, the more people will fear less something is regulated, the more they think it's just fine. Exactly. Like think about how you perceive tile and all, and then how you perceive taile and all three. That's stuff with codeine, which is pretty much like eight milligrams of taile and all think something like that, really not that big of a difference. If you've ever taken them, the difference isn't significant. But yet ones like under lock and key behind you know, the pharmacists counter, and the other ones is right out where God and everybody can shoplift it exactly. So, I mean you perceive them as different because they're regulated, because the government's like whoa, whoa, whoa pal. You just need to kind of back off that. With herbs, there's no regulation whatsoever. They don't even sell them in the same place as the taile and all, so they seem even less significant as far as the health risks go. But that's not true. There's plenty of herbs out there that are just crazy potent um like detera. You know, you know what an angel's trumpet is? Uh No, I don't. It's not an article. Don't boither looking for it. You can find an angeal angels trumpet plant in um just about any southern backyard. They have like these long trumpet shaped flowers, hence the name um. And if you eat one of those flowers within an hour, you will be baying at the moon and beating up the cops who come to arrescue. It will drive you nuts. And this is just an ornamental plant in US, no one has any clue about it. Sounds like, yeah, I've never I've never had the gall to actually eat one because I don't like eating grass, which is apparently another side effect. I think you might have licked a toad or two in your data. Well. Actually, I've seen warnings to gardeners saying if you have an Angel's trumpet plant and you're messing with it, especially the flowers, like do not rub your eyes, wash your hand, it will send you on a wild ride. It's interesting. That's just one of many um monkshood. It's one of the most potent chemical compounds, naturally occurring compounds known to man. Can kill you, oh very easily, stop your stop your heart and lung function, just from handling it. Yeah. So, I mean there's a lot of potent herbs out there because they grow from the ground. Right. Because we have been wean we've been at the forefront of modern medicine, we kind of disregard herbs. That's another one that was an interesting one, wasn't Yeah, that's the hallucinogenic uh. And I think you mentioned Jamestown in your article. Yeah, detachment of the Jamestown Colony militia ate a bunch of that, and it's salad. Uh, and we just went crazy. We're just basically tripping for several days. I think the guy who described it said they turned to natural fools upon it for several days. So all but that was quite a shock to them. Yeah, but yeah, they didn't get a lot of work done those days. But Okay, so I think we've established the argument that herbs are potent very much. And the problem is as Americans don't have a an ingrained respect for their potency as do some of the older cultures. Right and beyond that Americans, Uh, in the in the nineteen nineties and uh into the two thousands, uh, traditional Chinese medicine became more and more popular. So not only are these herbs packing a punch and not regulated, but people really started getting into it. Yeah, and and uh, what's the one St. John's wort? You know, people think that these are just cure alls. Well, and and it's not that they're not. It's not that they don't have properties. This isn't like snake oil that we're talking about. Um, it's that since they're not regulated since they're not really looked into. Uh, you have to effectively self medicate or listen to some jerk at the health food store who may or may not have any idea what he or she's talking about. Right, Um, so it can be kind of dangerous. The problem is is because of you know, the the arrogance of Western medicine that it's the only true, viable and effective medicine. UM. People pick up on that. So when people started taking herbs, just average Joe's patients will call them um when they started taking herbs. A two thousand three survey found that seventy of people who take herbs don't tell their doctors about them, right, because they're afraid they're going to be told to not take them anymore. Right, which is a which is a good fear, because you know, doctors don't understand herbs anymore than the guy at the health food store doesn't probably last. Um. So you've got that problem and as a result, this thing called complimentary and alternative medicine came about. It was basically saying, look, people are running around taking herbs. We need to incorporate these other medicines into western modern medicine. And see what we can do. It's probably a good idea. It was a great idea because traditional medicines generally are best at curing chronic diseases, are handling chronic diseases, whereas western modern medicine is best at acute diseases or acute you know, uh, conditions. So my rule of thumb has always been rheumatoid arthreadis traditional medicine, right, shot in the leg? You want to go with the western medicine? Yeah, so gunshot wounded, Western medicine a good rule. Rheumatoid arth threats, Yeah, do you want to go with the traditional mission. So there was a movement to incorporate these two. Uh. And the problem is is again, doctors don't know any more about herbs than you or I, and doctors can get sued a lot more easily if they say take this herb and the person dies. If we say that, we're just like, oh man, sorry I didn't do that. Doctors like, okay, well there goes my practice. Um So, of course doctors aren't going to recommend the stuff. So c am cam never took off at all. And um so, why why wouldn't the FDA regulate herbs? Well? Uh, I think the research you found or you posited was that urban ingredients, UM and supplements don't have to be classified as drugs their dietary supplements. No, that's exactly right, and this came about through the Dietary Supplement Health and Education Act, which was issued in which is right. When this stuff is really gearing up, there are a lot of questions like should the FDA get involved in the government said no, not only that, we're gonna put herbs squarely out of the FDA's jurisdiction. See with UM any kind of pharmaceutical, even even in over over the counter drug Are we talking about approval here? Yeah, where you and I would have to basically test these compounds testimon rats and then you know, possibly other primates and then moved human trials. It costs millions of dollars, and not necessarily to the pharmaceutical companies. They get a lot of their research done for free by universities. But it does somebody's putting in millions. If not, you know, tens of millions of dollars and an average of eight and a half years to get it to the FDA for approval. And the FDA either says no or they say yes, and then they decreate as a controlled substance like a pharmaceutical, prescribed pharmacy or over the counter. Right right. I thought it was interesting that you you the fact that only point one percent of compounds first tested received FDA approval. That is way way low. Yeah, and I mean completely I have to go back to the drawing board. But you have to prove step by step that this is not harmful to humans before the FDA approves it. What the Dietary Dietary Supplement Health and Education Act, the d s h g A basically says, is not anymore, not with herbal, not with herbal supplements. Yeah, these shoes. On the other foot, the FDA has to prove that these herbs are harmful before they can get them taken off the shelves. And basically they have to prove that the herb poses a a significant health risk or an imminent public health risk, public safety risk. Yeah. And I bet that FDA only gets involved if there are you know a bunch of cases where this happens. Yeah, yeah, I mean, like think about right exactly. Um So, and it's a really long process. It's a really involved process, and the FDA like most other federal agencies, is perennially understaffed and underfunded, so it can be very difficult to get something taken off the market, even if it is, you know, hurting people in the meantime, it stays on the market until they can you know, draw that line exactly. So, um, there there are some limitations to it to what a dietary supplement. Herbal manufacturers can say. One thing they can't do is they can't say that their, um, their products treat, cure, or mitigate a disease right now. This is how they market themselves. Correct. Yes, yeah, So for example, uh, somebody who who manufactures an herbal supplement with passion flower, Uh, they can't say that the product treats anxiety. Instead, they can say something like it quiets an anxious mind, right, which to me sounds a lot like the old nineteenth century tonic commercials Tonic every times like Heroin. It quiets the anxious mind kind of thing. You know. It sounds a lot like that, and it gets the same point across as well. You're basically saying anxious anxiety, same thing quiets, cures whatever. Um. There's also one other thing that that you you can't use ingredients that are already banned. UM. In April two thousand and seven, a Chinese product called sang Jong Zoo tong Tan I believe that's what it's called. Probably just butchered it um. It was taken off the market in the US because it contained human placenta. So the FDA does have some teeth her there. But for the most part, if you and I want to go somewhere and you know, manufacture it, we can sell them to our hearts content, kill a bunch of people, make a lot of money, and then get out before the FDA can ever say, bood kick back on the beach somewhere. Let's go do it with life. Yeah. So, if you want to find out more about herbal supplements, the FDA, all sorts of other stuff, just go check it all out. Use our handy search bar at how stuff works dot com. It's a cornu copia of information pharmacopia for more on this and thousands of other topics. Because it how stuff works dot com, let us know what should be Send an email to podcast at how stuff works dot com. Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve camera. It's ready are you

Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve camera. It's ready. Are you welcome to Stuff you Should Know from House Stuff Works dot Com. Hey, welcome to the podcast. That's Chuck. I'm Josh. This is the Stuff you should Know, coming to you live from Studio one, a deep within the bowels of How Stuff Works corporate headquarters in Atlanta, Georgia's gross. Yeah, I like to do that once in a right, Nice, Chuck. My father spent the better part of the late nineties is kind of um well. He took a lot of pills. Okay, they were all herbal. They were all herbal supplements, mind you. But he would take like um uppers in the morning, like herbal uppers. Interesting. And then he'd take like herbal downers like two oh twos or four or four as I can't remember what they're called um in the evening, you know, to relax. And I call him the herbal Elvis and uh and I kid you not. He did this like he up and down and up and down, and finally he kick the habit. I guess, I don't know if he takes I know he takes a lot of vitamins and stuff but I think it's it's healthier. Um. And plus now he's retired, he has less reason to wake up in the morning as long as he didn't pass away on the toilet, you know, he hasn't. He hasn't, and thank god. But the thing is that it kind of points out like herbs can really pack a punch, you know. UM. Like take mahuiang for example, um mahuang, better known in this country as a fedra or a phedron, which is actually the alkaloid, the isolated alkaloid of mahuang, which actually in Chinese means bitter yellow, mahuyang bitter yellow at points. It's to the the color of this little evergreen shrub in the horrible taste of its leaves. Um mahwang has a terrible taste, bitter yellow taste. UM. So you know, the Chinese have been using the shrub for like five thousand years, right, and they're not really having a lot of trouble with it. Um. It comes to the United States and the nineties, and all of a sudden, between like the early nineties and two thousand three, there's like sixteen thousand cases of death and injury reported to the Federal government. Right, you've got truckers and college students popping white crosses. It's uh. They're also a key ingredient in so I mean, what happens what happened, right? I mean the Chinese will happen to stuff for five thousand years, it comes to the US and within a decade, sixteen thousand people dropped like flies. I'll tell you what happens. Americans love to get high. It's as simple as that. Abuse exactly. It's abuse. It's a lack of understands, the lack of respect um to the Chinese. What what we consider herbs they consider drugs, and what we consider herbs we don't really fear. We find them all natural, we don't. You know, it's not regulated by the FDA, so how could it be harmful? That's one of the interesting things that I think you pointed out was if something is the more heavily something is regulated, the more people will fear less something is regulated, the more they think it's just fine. Exactly. Like think about how you perceive tile and all, and then how you perceive taile and all three. That's stuff with codeine, which is pretty much like eight milligrams of taile and all think something like that, really not that big of a difference. If you've ever taken them, the difference isn't significant. But yet ones like under lock and key behind you know, the pharmacists counter, and the other ones is right out where God and everybody can shoplift it exactly. So, I mean you perceive them as different because they're regulated, because the government's like whoa, whoa, whoa pal. You just need to kind of back off that. With herbs, there's no regulation whatsoever. They don't even sell them in the same place as the taile and all, so they seem even less significant as far as the health risks go. But that's not true. There's plenty of herbs out there that are just crazy potent um like detera. You know, you know what an angel's trumpet is? Uh No, I don't. It's not an article. Don't boither looking for it. You can find an angeal angels trumpet plant in um just about any southern backyard. They have like these long trumpet shaped flowers, hence the name um. And if you eat one of those flowers within an hour, you will be baying at the moon and beating up the cops who come to arrescue. It will drive you nuts. And this is just an ornamental plant in US, no one has any clue about it. Sounds like, yeah, I've never I've never had the gall to actually eat one because I don't like eating grass, which is apparently another side effect. I think you might have licked a toad or two in your data. Well. Actually, I've seen warnings to gardeners saying if you have an Angel's trumpet plant and you're messing with it, especially the flowers, like do not rub your eyes, wash your hand, it will send you on a wild ride. It's interesting. That's just one of many um monkshood. It's one of the most potent chemical compounds, naturally occurring compounds known to man. Can kill you, oh very easily, stop your stop your heart and lung function, just from handling it. Yeah. So, I mean there's a lot of potent herbs out there because they grow from the ground. Right. Because we have been wean we've been at the forefront of modern medicine, we kind of disregard herbs. That's another one that was an interesting one, wasn't Yeah, that's the hallucinogenic uh. And I think you mentioned Jamestown in your article. Yeah, detachment of the Jamestown Colony militia ate a bunch of that, and it's salad. Uh, and we just went crazy. We're just basically tripping for several days. I think the guy who described it said they turned to natural fools upon it for several days. So all but that was quite a shock to them. Yeah, but yeah, they didn't get a lot of work done those days. But Okay, so I think we've established the argument that herbs are potent very much. And the problem is as Americans don't have a an ingrained respect for their potency as do some of the older cultures. Right and beyond that Americans, Uh, in the in the nineteen nineties and uh into the two thousands, uh, traditional Chinese medicine became more and more popular. So not only are these herbs packing a punch and not regulated, but people really started getting into it. Yeah, and and uh, what's the one St. John's wort? You know, people think that these are just cure alls. Well, and and it's not that they're not. It's not that they don't have properties. This isn't like snake oil that we're talking about. Um, it's that since they're not regulated since they're not really looked into. Uh, you have to effectively self medicate or listen to some jerk at the health food store who may or may not have any idea what he or she's talking about. Right, Um, so it can be kind of dangerous. The problem is is because of you know, the the arrogance of Western medicine that it's the only true, viable and effective medicine. UM. People pick up on that. So when people started taking herbs, just average Joe's patients will call them um when they started taking herbs. A two thousand three survey found that seventy of people who take herbs don't tell their doctors about them, right, because they're afraid they're going to be told to not take them anymore. Right, which is a which is a good fear, because you know, doctors don't understand herbs anymore than the guy at the health food store doesn't probably last. Um. So you've got that problem and as a result, this thing called complimentary and alternative medicine came about. It was basically saying, look, people are running around taking herbs. We need to incorporate these other medicines into western modern medicine. And see what we can do. It's probably a good idea. It was a great idea because traditional medicines generally are best at curing chronic diseases, are handling chronic diseases, whereas western modern medicine is best at acute diseases or acute you know, uh, conditions. So my rule of thumb has always been rheumatoid arthreadis traditional medicine, right, shot in the leg? You want to go with the western medicine? Yeah, so gunshot wounded, Western medicine a good rule. Rheumatoid arth threats, Yeah, do you want to go with the traditional mission. So there was a movement to incorporate these two. Uh. And the problem is is again, doctors don't know any more about herbs than you or I, and doctors can get sued a lot more easily if they say take this herb and the person dies. If we say that, we're just like, oh man, sorry I didn't do that. Doctors like, okay, well there goes my practice. Um So, of course doctors aren't going to recommend the stuff. So c am cam never took off at all. And um so, why why wouldn't the FDA regulate herbs? Well? Uh, I think the research you found or you posited was that urban ingredients, UM and supplements don't have to be classified as drugs their dietary supplements. No, that's exactly right, and this came about through the Dietary Supplement Health and Education Act, which was issued in which is right. When this stuff is really gearing up, there are a lot of questions like should the FDA get involved in the government said no, not only that, we're gonna put herbs squarely out of the FDA's jurisdiction. See with UM any kind of pharmaceutical, even even in over over the counter drug Are we talking about approval here? Yeah, where you and I would have to basically test these compounds testimon rats and then you know, possibly other primates and then moved human trials. It costs millions of dollars, and not necessarily to the pharmaceutical companies. They get a lot of their research done for free by universities. But it does somebody's putting in millions. If not, you know, tens of millions of dollars and an average of eight and a half years to get it to the FDA for approval. And the FDA either says no or they say yes, and then they decreate as a controlled substance like a pharmaceutical, prescribed pharmacy or over the counter. Right right. I thought it was interesting that you you the fact that only point one percent of compounds first tested received FDA approval. That is way way low. Yeah, and I mean completely I have to go back to the drawing board. But you have to prove step by step that this is not harmful to humans before the FDA approves it. What the Dietary Dietary Supplement Health and Education Act, the d s h g A basically says, is not anymore, not with herbal, not with herbal supplements. Yeah, these shoes. On the other foot, the FDA has to prove that these herbs are harmful before they can get them taken off the shelves. And basically they have to prove that the herb poses a a significant health risk or an imminent public health risk, public safety risk. Yeah. And I bet that FDA only gets involved if there are you know a bunch of cases where this happens. Yeah, yeah, I mean, like think about right exactly. Um So, and it's a really long process. It's a really involved process, and the FDA like most other federal agencies, is perennially understaffed and underfunded, so it can be very difficult to get something taken off the market, even if it is, you know, hurting people in the meantime, it stays on the market until they can you know, draw that line exactly. So, um, there there are some limitations to it to what a dietary supplement. Herbal manufacturers can say. One thing they can't do is they can't say that their, um, their products treat, cure, or mitigate a disease right now. This is how they market themselves. Correct. Yes, yeah, So for example, uh, somebody who who manufactures an herbal supplement with passion flower, Uh, they can't say that the product treats anxiety. Instead, they can say something like it quiets an anxious mind, right, which to me sounds a lot like the old nineteenth century tonic commercials Tonic every times like Heroin. It quiets the anxious mind kind of thing. You know. It sounds a lot like that, and it gets the same point across as well. You're basically saying anxious anxiety, same thing quiets, cures whatever. Um. There's also one other thing that that you you can't use ingredients that are already banned. UM. In April two thousand and seven, a Chinese product called sang Jong Zoo tong Tan I believe that's what it's called. Probably just butchered it um. It was taken off the market in the US because it contained human placenta. So the FDA does have some teeth her there. But for the most part, if you and I want to go somewhere and you know, manufacture it, we can sell them to our hearts content, kill a bunch of people, make a lot of money, and then get out before the FDA can ever say, bood kick back on the beach somewhere. Let's go do it with life. Yeah. So, if you want to find out more about herbal supplements, the FDA, all sorts of other stuff, just go check it all out. Use our handy search bar at how stuff works dot com. It's a cornu copia of information pharmacopia for more on this and thousands of other topics. Because it how stuff works dot com, let us know what should be Send an email to podcast at how stuff works dot com. Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve camera. It's ready are you