Hello there, it's me Josh and for this week's s Y s K Selex, I've chosen our episode. Was there a real Atlantis? And it turns out they're very well may have been. At the very least there's a very exciting lost city. The archaeologists found that well, it may have been the model for the Atlantis legend. I don't want to ruin anything. I don't want to spoil anything, So just kick back and enjoy this adventure episode. Welcome to Stuff you Should Know from House Stuff Works dot com. Hey, and welcome to the podcast on Josh Clark Back in the Saddle again with Charles W. Chuck Bryant. We share a horse, we do. I have a horse side car. Actually it's a small mule. Yeah, that's attached to your horse. Yeah, and I have to lean into the corners. It's more of a hay car then a side car. Back in the Saddle, meaning we are back from Texas and back in the recording booth for the first time in two weeks. Yeah, it feels nice, dude, to be back in this smelly, little, dimly lit room. Yeah, it's strangely at least it's not like blood colored, you know. Yeah, man, that'd be weird. Um so chuck, Yes, I guess we should get started. Huh, you don't have an intro? Well, I mean I was gonna use the intro. Is the intro? Go ahead? Then? Have you have you ever heard of a place called Atlantis? I have? Are you? Are you read like the Triangle the vacation getaway? No, we're like Britney Spears stayed for free for like a month when they opened and try to generate buzz. I'm sure they were packing them in after that. I think they have been. I don't know. I can't. I can't discuss the financial a state of Atlantis, the resort and the hamas. But what I can discuss is Atlantis, the possibly fictitious place. Yeah, I'm gonna go ahead and go on record as fictitious. Are you well? After reading this? And by the way, this was awesome, I had no idea about the secret surprise that's coming. Which one, well, the the other place, the real place? Oh gotcha? Okay? Which I meant to ask you before how we pronounced that? But we'll just get to that and I'll let you say it first. But yeah, I'm gonna say it's fictitious and based on that. Okay, I think I kind of go with that too, mainly because one of the things about Plato is, uh, he was the only person ever mentioned Atlantis. Plenty of people have mentioned it after him, but it was based on what he said, which kind of makes you think like, okay, is this um, this is an allegory. Probably it's about wickedness. Yeah. What was his book in to Maus? Yeah, that was the book where he first mentioned it, and it was written in three sixty b C. And Tomaus is one of his dialogues, I believe. And Plato has a thing where he likes to take real places, real people, real events, and then just kinda use some literary license. He's a philosopher, Okay, yeah he was. He was not a documentarian of real things, right, Um. But along the way somewhere that idea got lost, right right. So for example, Sodom and Gomorrah. I I would wager that a lot of people think that Sodom and Gomorrah something really happened, and then um it was it was taken Eventually it was used as allegory that these people were punished by God. Um, but really, you know, something really bad happened to him, and somebody decided, Hey, this is a great, great chance to use this as a life lesson for everyone. So there's a really strong possibility that Plato did the same thing because as he describes Atlantis, um, they they had gotten kind of hubristic. I guess it does mimic other things in the Bible, that's for sure it does. And um, the great god Poseidon, who is the god of the sea and of earthquakes, decided that he was kind of tired of the people of Atlantis, which was the seat of a cult that worshiped him. Right, so he, using the techniques at hand, said he created He's he I guess created an earthquake that generated a tsunami that sunk Atlantis beneath the waves, lost forever. Yeah. I think the quote from the book was sank into the sea in a single day and night of misfortune. Yeah, that's putting it lightly so. And he placed it too, didn't he. Actually, Yeah, it's where off Spain, the Pillars of Hercules, which is now called the Strait of Gibraltar, And there's people looking in Spain now right, still think legitimate bona fide Archaeologists they're fun. Yeah, so um, so Plato, I guess part of the problem is he's he's saying, like, yes, this this was at the Strait of Gibraltar in his parlance at the time. He's saying, is that the Straight of Gibraltar. The problem is is Atlantis was this magnificent rings city, um, and it had like fantastic technology and architecture and it was just an amazingly advanced place. But he also says that this has happened nine thousand years ago, right, right, so nine thousand years before him. So they're aliens. Well that was that is thanks to a guy named Ignacious Donalding. So this guy, so Plato writes about Atlantis, goes about his business, right, and apparently nobody back then took it seriously. And that's like modern man were the first people to say, oh, maybe there wasn't Atlantis. Yeah, back to the day, everyone's like, nah, it's just Plato going off again. It was this one guy, Ignatious Donnelly can lay it all at his feet, jerk, because in eighty two he published a book called Atlantis The Antidiluvian World, and in it he's saying, Okay, the Azores, the Azores Man. I wish i'd like that one up, and I think that's right. Um, the islands in the middle of the Atlantic, that's actually the highest peaks of the highest mountaintops of Atlantis. And wait there's more. Uh, the incredibly advanced civilizations in Egypt and high up in the Andes of Peru, pre inca. Um, those were colonies set forth by Atlantis that survived because they weren't there for the sinking of Atlantis. So basically, um, we have civilization to thank We have Atlantis to thank for civilization. The problem is all of this is totally unfounded, but it just kicked off the um occultization of Atlantis. Yeah. That it's been placed everywhere from uh, South China, see the Caribbean, the Pacific, the Indian Ocean, the Canary Islands, Antarctica, supposedly Switzerland. Really Yeah, I didn't chase that one down, but I saw somewhere that somebody said, Switzerland, let's go ahead and say everywhere. Yeah, everywhere, Atlantis is everywhere. There's um Edgar Casey, who is known as the Sleeping Prophet of Virginia Beach, who's a psychic he Um, he said that Atlantis stretched from the Gulf of Mexico to Spain, and that the Bermuda Triangle. There are a lot of you know, if there is mystery in the Bermuda Triangle, it's due to Atlantis. Is energy crystals, I will say, though he said it would rise off Beminy. And then when they discovered the Beminy Road, everyone's like see there, yeah, and then it's two bad. Cherry's not here because she's like, I dove the Beminy Road. Yeah. Guest producer Maddie is in the house. Hey, Matt, we didn't mention that. Um So, once Donnelly comes along and kind of takes up the mantle of searching for Atlantis and making it as far out as possible, it just becomes more and more of the dope mean of like fringe dwellers. Right, sure, but that is not to say that there aren't legitimate archaeologists searching for something like Atlantis. That that doesn't mean that there isn't something that inspired Plato, right, and we probably know what that is. Actually, that's where my money is. And now you're gonna make me say it, even though I asked you to say it. Hilaki Haliki Hiliki Haliki Haliki, Yeah, okay, Haliki spelled he like, Yeah, Um, I saw some weird pronunciation things that I didn't understand when I looked it up, so I just figured i'd hear it preview. That was Greek to you, it was indeed, um, So yeah, the cats out of the bag. As far as I'm concerned, it is Hiliki. Well. It was a super interesting story though. Um. This was well documented by lots of people, not not like a single source like Plato, single made up source exactly. And it was a lost Greek city. It suffered a fate much like Atlantis supposedly did. Yeah. So Hliki was this um very powerful city in ancient Greece on the Gulf Corinthum, very nice in that area. Yeah yeah, I imagine have you been No, I want to go. Um. It was powerful enough to have its own colonies, so I mentioned if Atlanta had colonies in like Germany, this is very much the case for Hliki. And it was the seat of power for a twelve city league called the Achaian League, which is kind of like the Confederacy in the South, so that you like having a bar in a different city that's like your home bar like you know they have like it's usually football based. There's like a New York Jets bar at Pittsburgh Steelers bar in Atlanta. Maybe that the same thing. I thought it was more like the capital of like a number of states. Okay, but I don't think it's the same thing. But I like that analogy. I'm just being coy. Um, so the the key in league, now, I've just realized that I missed something. Now that's a joke. Yeah, So the the heliki is the city or the center of the key, and league get controlled like the shipping around there. And by the time Plato came about, it was hundreds of years old, already very active port they have their own coinage. Yeah yeah, and it looked very cool too. I looked up the coins like dolphins and Poseidon and yeah, pitch or not pitchforks, what do they call the tridents? Tridents? And it was they had Poseidon on the coin because this was like the seat of a cult of Poseidon. Yeah, just like Atlantis exactly. And um it was had a very prominent, well known statue of Poseidon, just like Atlantis. Right, that's right. So the similarities are starting to mount top they are, and uh, they really mount in a big way in December of three seventy three BC, when the townspeople started noticing, Wait a minute, all these small animals are scurring for the hills and that's never a good sign. Because we did talk about in another podcast how animals can sense underground tremmors. I had to have been in how earthquakes were. Yeah, I think that's what it was. And sure enough, earthquake came in the middle of the night on the fifth day, and that was followed by an enormous wave and just like that overnight, just like Atlantis, it was submerged to the bottom of the sea. Well not the bottom but no, and not necessarily the sea either. As we'll see, this is getting more mysterious. So, um, so this really happened. This is pretty Uh, it was a pretty well known event. Um. One of the there, I guess we should say there were no survivors, like people from the surrounding cities got together like um, a search party, a rescue party, um that set out at dawn just a few hours after this happened, and there was well I think they got they walked as far as they couldn't were like, oh yeah, well there's now like a sea where there used to be this this um city gone. There was no one there apparently. The only thing visible were the tops of um the trees in Poseidon's sacred grove. I would guess all of trees yea uh. And there were ten ships and this will come up later too from Sparta that were a docked there in the port and they were gone as well, just gone, and that will play an important part here coming up soon. Yeah. So um, imagine like there's a city, it's a very powerful, rich city, and you live out in the boondocks and you just know something happened there as an earthquake, so you go to check on the city and then the city's gone and it's just silence, and there's ten ships that aren't there anymore. Everything is just gone. Creepy. What was even creepier though, is you could look down into the city underwater and see it all there still, yeah, including the statue of Posidon, which apparently still stood erect and in place right and local fishermen and ferryman um reported having their nets get caught in poseidon statue all the time, which is kind of ironic. Yeah, but Um, so you could see Hliki for hundreds of years, which is one of the reasons why it's so well documented because there were it was kind of like have you heard of than of tourism, dark tourism or death tourism. So um, it was kind of like an early version of a dark tourism site, like come this massive terrea, Yeah exactly, um, and you could go check it out, and travelers and writers and scholars did, and they documented what they saw, um pretty pretty um specifically too, Like in Stadia, they said, well, here's the this is where the city is now, this is where it was in relation to you know this river, that river, so like, the sources are pretty pretty abundant, and they're pretty specific. Speaking of abundant and rivers and sources, look at you. Uh. That area was was unique in that it had these three rivers that met there, uh, bringing fresh water in. So you got some good fresh water, you got some good seawater with tons of good seafood, you got very rich land for crops. We've got irrigation because we've got the fresh water. The weather is gorgeous. So it's right here on on the lovely seaside, and that's what made it and on the ideal spot for people to say, hey, maybe we should settle down here. Yeah, let's hang out here for a while, get fat on shrimp. Unfortunately, it's also a bad spot because there are two fault lines that run parallel through the area, and uh, they haven't been known to call some major disruption over the years, like the earthquake that destroyed Hiliki and generated the tsunami. So it's it's kind of like this whole place is like made to produce a lost city, right yeah, because there's other places around the world, um, where there's violent tectonic activity and its coastal, so that means that it's in danger of a tsunamill California not with a tsunami, I don't think. Japan, yeah, um, the Malaysian tsunami two four. Um, Yeah, there's a lot of places. But to produce a so that's that will ruin a coastal city, right yes, But for it to become lost, it has to be covered up somehow, and Hiliki is in a really unique situation for this because of those three rivers that form the Hiliki Delta where Hiliki was situated, right, So you've got the earthquake, You've got the tsunami. So you have a ruined city now submerged. And then these three rivers bring a lot of silt to the area, and so eventually Hiliki was covered up over over the centuries. Yeah, you put it in the article about how if you bought a house or not bought a house, Let's say, built a house along the shore in eight ninety, it would be a thousand feet inland, which imagine is quite a rub for people that build that lovely house right on the water, because within a century or so it's gonna be a couple of streets back and there's like tin jerks in front of you that have built houses exactly. And it's kind of like what's that game where you like leap frog? Oh yeah, I think you can say Monopoly where you build bigger houses than the other guy. Oh yeah, that would have worked too. Um. So you've got the tsunamis, you've got the river, You've got the silt, the silt. You also have UM the delta itself. Because of this violent activity, UM is moving up their finding over time. It's it's rising. So you have a rising delta, which is low. It's like right at sea level, but it's it's getting bigger and silt is piling it up and making dry ground even further jut out into the coast. Well, what it made was a nice little surprise for archaeologists, and I imagine archaeologists just went berserk with this place. Yeah, they had no idea. They just thought Hliki itself was there. They knew it was there, and that they suspected it would be kind of like a Pompeii, but even more um they considered it even more vital to archaeology or the archaeological record than Pompeii. Even Well, what they found though is you know, Josh, but we're gonna spring it on you now, is six other distinct occupied horizons besides six other ones are seven total, six total, six total, five others besides Hilikia underneath one on top of the other that had been settled and civilized and wiped out and covered up and like just kind of captured in time. That is crazy, Yeah, which, what what were they? So there was one from the Byzantine period, which was pretty long. I think it ran from two d to the fifteenth century UM, and then beneath that there is a Roman ruin which is from the second to the fourth a d. And that one even features a Roman road which is the road that travelers and writers used to come look at Hiliki the ruins um and that one also chuck. This just blows in my mind. It's so captured in time that there's a human skeleton a top a like a cattle skull that like it was knocked on top of this beast and killed like by rock and rubble and just kept there. So there's skeletons are intertwined now and that nuts. So the Roman cities on top of Hiliki, then beneath h leaky uh, they found even more stuff. They found a settlement from the Bronze Age, and before that they kept digging and found uh, prehistoric Neolithic period civilization, possibly as old as twelve thousand years. I wonder if there's something beneath that even I don't know. This makes me think they should start digging in Los Angeles or other like seaside retreats to see what you could find. Well, there's a whole um. There's this whole idea, especially among Atlantis hunters, that it's extremely intuitive because of rising sea levels that anything that was established around the last Ice Age or even at about the end of it, the sea levels of ridges and like more than a hundred feet since then. So any coastal cities now underwater. That's like a big big thing that they hunt for an hour that archaeologists are kind of starting to try to get into is um looking for human habitation underwater. Like there's this whole area off of Whales, I think Northern Wales, Northern Ireland, maybe Um or Scotland anyways, called dogger Land and it's like just the submerged area that used to be above ground and they're they're they're finding like Neolithic settlements there and that cool. Well, and you know, the earth has changed so much over the course of its existence that what's here didn't used to be here, and what was there was something else, and so yeah, I think it's there's no telling what's down there, but that that idea and that the fact that you can find Neolithic settlements under water supports, ironically the notion that there could be something like a land that's lost somewhere like Hiliki. Right. So yeah, so these guys they found this this um area and once they found Hilliki. It all started to they just it was like jack pot, jackpot, jackpot. But finding Hiliki itself um proved a little more difficult than they thought, especially considering all the documentation they had. Yeah, they knew supposedly knew where it was, quote unquote like it's not like they were searching for a needle in a haystack. They were searching for like, uh, like a pool que in a haystack, you know. Uh. So in the late eighties a couple of cornell prest us or started looking for it for real z s and uh. They had a little bit of misinterpretation um for the word for the translation for body of water. And lucky enough, they had a Greek woman with them. Well she's one of the Cornellia professors. Oh she was. Yeah. Well then lucky that she was Greek, Well yeah, because she translates. She was like, wait a minute, She's like, it may not be in the gulf after all, It maybe inland. And they were like, yeah, everybody had been thinking that this was the gulf had swallowed him up, swallowed up the city, which makes sense, right. It turns out it was an inland lagoon that did so. I think it was very much akin to the you know, the Noah's Ark episode. We just did, um, what is it? The Dead Sea? I think where they think that the Dead Sea used to be freshwater right now it's salt water because that's evidence of the flood happening. And probably what they think is the Mediterranean overwhelmed the straight I can't remember what's straight it was, you're searching the reaches. Yeah, anyway, I think it was much the same way, like the city used to be around a lagoon, and then the lagoon got a lot bigger, thus swallowing the city. Right, So they looked under land, and all of a sudden they had to ditch their scuba gear for shovels, and they found the first Roman city, the first ruins. We're like, wait a minute, twelve feet just twelve feet below the land, which doesn't seem like that far at all. No, it's not, because the Roman rumors were like four or five ft. Yeah, I would think that someone would have accidentally found it before that, even you know, well that kicked it off. There was a German archaeologists who was traveling in the area and found a Hliky coin with Poseidon on. It was like, Holy cow, this is significant. So I think that's kind of how it started. Yeah, so they found have found a lot of stuff since then, um buildings, industrial buildings, kilns, looms, intersecting streets. Yeah, with buildings along these streets like a real city. Yeah. Uh what else? The coins, of course, UM, jugs, jugs with their original contents, and those are from the Bronze Age. They found a storehouse of like jugs of different sizes and types from the Bronze Age. So we're talking like five thousand years old. They don't have any idea about these civilizations, but this was contemporary to like ancient Troy, which itself was considered a legendary city until hiring Schleiman found it. Um. So they just finding this stuff is amazingly awesome because and there's more yea, there is supposedly, yes, So they think that they found the outskirts of Haliki and that they there's a lot more left, and that it's intact. Oh, they're not actually at Hliki yet. No, they're in Hiliki, but they're not in the city center, they don't you. Yeah, so they're just out in the outskirts. That's what they think. UM and when they were looking for Hiliki out in the gulf. They found something cool too, didn't they. I don't think I know this, you do know it. They found a sea wall ancent sea Wolf of the City, and they also found what they think are the ten Spartan ship. Oh yeah, that's right. I thought you were going to say the Statue of Poseidon. That would be like, well, they'll find an event the motherload if they found that, things still standing upright under the earth. So they keep following. They started by following the Roman road, right, So they're basically they're unearthing, like imagine this student there unearthing like three lost cities at once. Isn't that insane? Do you know? What? Like an archaeological treasure trove that is. So they're unearthing them. And as long as they don't intersect, right, as long as like the Roman town isn't built directly over the Statue of Poseidon to where getting to Poseidon would undermine the Roman town um, then they should be able to get at all. And they're gonna be doing They will excavate this for decades. So this has been ongoing since the late eighties. Well, no, they really started uncovering stuff in like two thousand, but they started in so awesome. Yeah, very cool. So that's a Haliki. So of course, Chuck, this doesn't mean that anybody has stopped searching for Atlantis. Like the archaeologist in Spain. Yeah, he's looking inland though, which comes from this theory. So maybe he's honest. One, it's possible he's gonna start digging up in Barcelona and people are gonna say, what are you doing? Yeah, drink some wine. So, uh, you were saying that you think that Plato was inspired by Hliki. I think there's substantial evidence in what we've said. But also keep in mind Laki happened in three seventy three. Plato wrote his book in three sixty, thirteen years later, and he lived in the area. This is a pretty well known catastrophe. I think you're probably right, But with it, we would not have had the awesome TV show Man from Atlantis had it not been for Plato. No, I guess that's true. Did you watch that? No, that was a little before your time. And there's an awesome um HP Lovecraft short story about a German U boat that ends up in Atlantis. It's awesome. I tried to find YouTube stuff of Man from Atlantis and then there's plenty out there. You know he had the webbed hands when I was a kid up, Really, you had webbed hands and feet. It's not Prince Nemore, is it the submarter Prince of Nemore Nemo. No, Prince Nemore, He's a Marvel comic guy. No, no, no, it was Man. It was a schlocky It ran for like one year. Was like, yeah he was he had supero he had superhuman strength and uh could breathe underwater, had gills, and he had webbed feet in hands and um, I think like some government agency snapped him up to do like investigative undersea work for them. Oh, I know you're talking about Welcome Back Cotter. It was a dude from from Dallas. Uh Patrick? What's his face? Patrick Ewing? Patrick Guffy? You're thinking jr. You Patricking is the basketball player, right, Patrick Duffy? Yah? Yeah, h this was good stuff. I've never heard of that show. Yeah, it was only around for one year. I think. Boy, I was into it when I was like seven. Good stuff. You had webbed hands. Yeah, it got me into Plato. You hadn't been eating it for years. Funny guy. All right, so that's it. You got anything else? I got nothing. Thank you for doing this one with me. It was awesome. Thank you for opening my eyes to coolness. Anytime. If you want to know more about Juliki, you should search for was there a real Atlantis? By typing that into the search bar house to works dot com and I said that, which means it's time for a listener. Man. That's right, Josh. Remember when we did a little TV pilot recently. Um, we tried to get these book INDs onto the show. They arrived a little late. We weren't able to. But I want to tell everyone about this project because that sounds very cryptic. Uh, this from my Hey, guys, have been a big fan for a couple of years, UM, and I especially like that some of your causes you have taken on and considered and done podcast about them, Kiva and the Cooperative for Education in particular. So our Guatemala podcast gave him an idea for a Facebook fundraising idea to raise awareness for co op our buddies Cooperative for Education Cincinnati to do the awesome textbook programs and UH Computer Center Labs in Guatemala, and he proposed to them and they said, hey, y'all, let's do this. So his idea was to create quote unquote celebrity book INDs with just this basic idea. Take an ordinary set of book INDs, although they are pretty fancy looking, right, I gotta admit, uh in, make them super famous uh pop culture icons through social media, and then sell them for a million bucks and give it all to co ed. So that's the plan. It's a good plan. I don't know if we added anything to that. We added at least sevent Okay, good um, he says. I know it sounds crazy, but crazy is usually what it takes to get people to notice things. The rational thinking behind this is that to get famous, all you need to have are a ton of people believing that you're famous. You know, yeah, I mean, what else is celebrity exactly. Uh. So they're trying to drum up celebrity for these book ends to raise awareness. They have sent them around the world to meet people and to be on TV shows and in movies. Uh. They're documenting this on Facebook, the travels of these book ends, uh, in Twitter and blogs for people to follow. And our big audacious goal is to get as many Facebook fans as Kim Kardashian. She has nine million fans. Can you plead them? Yes? Wow? Uh So, what we're hoping for your listeners is that they will like the idea enough to want to help. All you have to do it can be as simple as going to the Facebook page. Uh, follow you on Twitter, the celebrity book ins that is, tweet about us, blog about us, tell your friends to like us, and hook us up with any celebrity friends that you might have. Um, they have been in the hands of Danny de Vito, uh, Matt burning your of the National. I didn't know how to pronounce that, but I do love the National, and I believe I saw Jeff Bridges holding these things, did you really Yeah? And then before us Yeah, So we actually got a little de Vito Bridges stank on our hands unless they clean these things. And they sent it to us originally to get it in our cubicles on the TV pilot, but they arrived a little late and we weren't able to. So we just did some pictures and maybe on down the road, if we do any more TV stuff, we can get them on television and do our part to help raise awareness man so uh Facebook dot com, im slash Celebrity Bookends or Twitter at Celebrity Bookends or send an email to Celebrity Bookends at Gmail, and that raises awareness to eventually sell these things to Danny de Vito to raise money for co ed for a million bucks. Well, I certainly don't have a million bucks. Well, we also have our own Twitter handle and you can get in touch with us too. While you're talking to Celebrity Bookends. You can tweet to us whatever you want. There's no rules, uh except that has to be a hundred forty characters or lest just that ru um. That's s Y s K podcast. We're also on Facebook at Facebook dot com slash stuff you Should Know, and you can send us an email as well at stuff podcast dot com dot for more on this and thousands of other topics. Does It How stuff Works dot com

Hello there, it's me Josh and for this week's s Y s K Selex, I've chosen our episode. Was there a real Atlantis? And it turns out they're very well may have been. At the very least there's a very exciting lost city. The archaeologists found that well, it may have been the model for the Atlantis legend. I don't want to ruin anything. I don't want to spoil anything, So just kick back and enjoy this adventure episode. Welcome to Stuff you Should Know from House Stuff Works dot com. Hey, and welcome to the podcast on Josh Clark Back in the Saddle again with Charles W. Chuck Bryant. We share a horse, we do. I have a horse side car. Actually it's a small mule. Yeah, that's attached to your horse. Yeah, and I have to lean into the corners. It's more of a hay car then a side car. Back in the Saddle, meaning we are back from Texas and back in the recording booth for the first time in two weeks. Yeah, it feels nice, dude, to be back in this smelly, little, dimly lit room. Yeah, it's strangely at least it's not like blood colored, you know. Yeah, man, that'd be weird. Um so chuck, Yes, I guess we should get started. Huh, you don't have an intro? Well, I mean I was gonna use the intro. Is the intro? Go ahead? Then? Have you have you ever heard of a place called Atlantis? I have? Are you? Are you read like the Triangle the vacation getaway? No, we're like Britney Spears stayed for free for like a month when they opened and try to generate buzz. I'm sure they were packing them in after that. I think they have been. I don't know. I can't. I can't discuss the financial a state of Atlantis, the resort and the hamas. But what I can discuss is Atlantis, the possibly fictitious place. Yeah, I'm gonna go ahead and go on record as fictitious. Are you well? After reading this? And by the way, this was awesome, I had no idea about the secret surprise that's coming. Which one, well, the the other place, the real place? Oh gotcha? Okay? Which I meant to ask you before how we pronounced that? But we'll just get to that and I'll let you say it first. But yeah, I'm gonna say it's fictitious and based on that. Okay, I think I kind of go with that too, mainly because one of the things about Plato is, uh, he was the only person ever mentioned Atlantis. Plenty of people have mentioned it after him, but it was based on what he said, which kind of makes you think like, okay, is this um, this is an allegory. Probably it's about wickedness. Yeah. What was his book in to Maus? Yeah, that was the book where he first mentioned it, and it was written in three sixty b C. And Tomaus is one of his dialogues, I believe. And Plato has a thing where he likes to take real places, real people, real events, and then just kinda use some literary license. He's a philosopher, Okay, yeah he was. He was not a documentarian of real things, right, Um. But along the way somewhere that idea got lost, right right. So for example, Sodom and Gomorrah. I I would wager that a lot of people think that Sodom and Gomorrah something really happened, and then um it was it was taken Eventually it was used as allegory that these people were punished by God. Um, but really, you know, something really bad happened to him, and somebody decided, Hey, this is a great, great chance to use this as a life lesson for everyone. So there's a really strong possibility that Plato did the same thing because as he describes Atlantis, um, they they had gotten kind of hubristic. I guess it does mimic other things in the Bible, that's for sure it does. And um, the great god Poseidon, who is the god of the sea and of earthquakes, decided that he was kind of tired of the people of Atlantis, which was the seat of a cult that worshiped him. Right, so he, using the techniques at hand, said he created He's he I guess created an earthquake that generated a tsunami that sunk Atlantis beneath the waves, lost forever. Yeah. I think the quote from the book was sank into the sea in a single day and night of misfortune. Yeah, that's putting it lightly so. And he placed it too, didn't he. Actually, Yeah, it's where off Spain, the Pillars of Hercules, which is now called the Strait of Gibraltar, And there's people looking in Spain now right, still think legitimate bona fide Archaeologists they're fun. Yeah, so um, so Plato, I guess part of the problem is he's he's saying, like, yes, this this was at the Strait of Gibraltar in his parlance at the time. He's saying, is that the Straight of Gibraltar. The problem is is Atlantis was this magnificent rings city, um, and it had like fantastic technology and architecture and it was just an amazingly advanced place. But he also says that this has happened nine thousand years ago, right, right, so nine thousand years before him. So they're aliens. Well that was that is thanks to a guy named Ignacious Donalding. So this guy, so Plato writes about Atlantis, goes about his business, right, and apparently nobody back then took it seriously. And that's like modern man were the first people to say, oh, maybe there wasn't Atlantis. Yeah, back to the day, everyone's like, nah, it's just Plato going off again. It was this one guy, Ignatious Donnelly can lay it all at his feet, jerk, because in eighty two he published a book called Atlantis The Antidiluvian World, and in it he's saying, Okay, the Azores, the Azores Man. I wish i'd like that one up, and I think that's right. Um, the islands in the middle of the Atlantic, that's actually the highest peaks of the highest mountaintops of Atlantis. And wait there's more. Uh, the incredibly advanced civilizations in Egypt and high up in the Andes of Peru, pre inca. Um, those were colonies set forth by Atlantis that survived because they weren't there for the sinking of Atlantis. So basically, um, we have civilization to thank We have Atlantis to thank for civilization. The problem is all of this is totally unfounded, but it just kicked off the um occultization of Atlantis. Yeah. That it's been placed everywhere from uh, South China, see the Caribbean, the Pacific, the Indian Ocean, the Canary Islands, Antarctica, supposedly Switzerland. Really Yeah, I didn't chase that one down, but I saw somewhere that somebody said, Switzerland, let's go ahead and say everywhere. Yeah, everywhere, Atlantis is everywhere. There's um Edgar Casey, who is known as the Sleeping Prophet of Virginia Beach, who's a psychic he Um, he said that Atlantis stretched from the Gulf of Mexico to Spain, and that the Bermuda Triangle. There are a lot of you know, if there is mystery in the Bermuda Triangle, it's due to Atlantis. Is energy crystals, I will say, though he said it would rise off Beminy. And then when they discovered the Beminy Road, everyone's like see there, yeah, and then it's two bad. Cherry's not here because she's like, I dove the Beminy Road. Yeah. Guest producer Maddie is in the house. Hey, Matt, we didn't mention that. Um So, once Donnelly comes along and kind of takes up the mantle of searching for Atlantis and making it as far out as possible, it just becomes more and more of the dope mean of like fringe dwellers. Right, sure, but that is not to say that there aren't legitimate archaeologists searching for something like Atlantis. That that doesn't mean that there isn't something that inspired Plato, right, and we probably know what that is. Actually, that's where my money is. And now you're gonna make me say it, even though I asked you to say it. Hilaki Haliki Hiliki Haliki Haliki, Yeah, okay, Haliki spelled he like, Yeah, Um, I saw some weird pronunciation things that I didn't understand when I looked it up, so I just figured i'd hear it preview. That was Greek to you, it was indeed, um, So yeah, the cats out of the bag. As far as I'm concerned, it is Hiliki. Well. It was a super interesting story though. Um. This was well documented by lots of people, not not like a single source like Plato, single made up source exactly. And it was a lost Greek city. It suffered a fate much like Atlantis supposedly did. Yeah. So Hliki was this um very powerful city in ancient Greece on the Gulf Corinthum, very nice in that area. Yeah yeah, I imagine have you been No, I want to go. Um. It was powerful enough to have its own colonies, so I mentioned if Atlanta had colonies in like Germany, this is very much the case for Hliki. And it was the seat of power for a twelve city league called the Achaian League, which is kind of like the Confederacy in the South, so that you like having a bar in a different city that's like your home bar like you know they have like it's usually football based. There's like a New York Jets bar at Pittsburgh Steelers bar in Atlanta. Maybe that the same thing. I thought it was more like the capital of like a number of states. Okay, but I don't think it's the same thing. But I like that analogy. I'm just being coy. Um, so the the key in league, now, I've just realized that I missed something. Now that's a joke. Yeah, So the the heliki is the city or the center of the key, and league get controlled like the shipping around there. And by the time Plato came about, it was hundreds of years old, already very active port they have their own coinage. Yeah yeah, and it looked very cool too. I looked up the coins like dolphins and Poseidon and yeah, pitch or not pitchforks, what do they call the tridents? Tridents? And it was they had Poseidon on the coin because this was like the seat of a cult of Poseidon. Yeah, just like Atlantis exactly. And um it was had a very prominent, well known statue of Poseidon, just like Atlantis. Right, that's right. So the similarities are starting to mount top they are, and uh, they really mount in a big way in December of three seventy three BC, when the townspeople started noticing, Wait a minute, all these small animals are scurring for the hills and that's never a good sign. Because we did talk about in another podcast how animals can sense underground tremmors. I had to have been in how earthquakes were. Yeah, I think that's what it was. And sure enough, earthquake came in the middle of the night on the fifth day, and that was followed by an enormous wave and just like that overnight, just like Atlantis, it was submerged to the bottom of the sea. Well not the bottom but no, and not necessarily the sea either. As we'll see, this is getting more mysterious. So, um, so this really happened. This is pretty Uh, it was a pretty well known event. Um. One of the there, I guess we should say there were no survivors, like people from the surrounding cities got together like um, a search party, a rescue party, um that set out at dawn just a few hours after this happened, and there was well I think they got they walked as far as they couldn't were like, oh yeah, well there's now like a sea where there used to be this this um city gone. There was no one there apparently. The only thing visible were the tops of um the trees in Poseidon's sacred grove. I would guess all of trees yea uh. And there were ten ships and this will come up later too from Sparta that were a docked there in the port and they were gone as well, just gone, and that will play an important part here coming up soon. Yeah. So um, imagine like there's a city, it's a very powerful, rich city, and you live out in the boondocks and you just know something happened there as an earthquake, so you go to check on the city and then the city's gone and it's just silence, and there's ten ships that aren't there anymore. Everything is just gone. Creepy. What was even creepier though, is you could look down into the city underwater and see it all there still, yeah, including the statue of Posidon, which apparently still stood erect and in place right and local fishermen and ferryman um reported having their nets get caught in poseidon statue all the time, which is kind of ironic. Yeah, but Um, so you could see Hliki for hundreds of years, which is one of the reasons why it's so well documented because there were it was kind of like have you heard of than of tourism, dark tourism or death tourism. So um, it was kind of like an early version of a dark tourism site, like come this massive terrea, Yeah exactly, um, and you could go check it out, and travelers and writers and scholars did, and they documented what they saw, um pretty pretty um specifically too, Like in Stadia, they said, well, here's the this is where the city is now, this is where it was in relation to you know this river, that river, so like, the sources are pretty pretty abundant, and they're pretty specific. Speaking of abundant and rivers and sources, look at you. Uh. That area was was unique in that it had these three rivers that met there, uh, bringing fresh water in. So you got some good fresh water, you got some good seawater with tons of good seafood, you got very rich land for crops. We've got irrigation because we've got the fresh water. The weather is gorgeous. So it's right here on on the lovely seaside, and that's what made it and on the ideal spot for people to say, hey, maybe we should settle down here. Yeah, let's hang out here for a while, get fat on shrimp. Unfortunately, it's also a bad spot because there are two fault lines that run parallel through the area, and uh, they haven't been known to call some major disruption over the years, like the earthquake that destroyed Hiliki and generated the tsunami. So it's it's kind of like this whole place is like made to produce a lost city, right yeah, because there's other places around the world, um, where there's violent tectonic activity and its coastal, so that means that it's in danger of a tsunamill California not with a tsunami, I don't think. Japan, yeah, um, the Malaysian tsunami two four. Um, Yeah, there's a lot of places. But to produce a so that's that will ruin a coastal city, right yes, But for it to become lost, it has to be covered up somehow, and Hiliki is in a really unique situation for this because of those three rivers that form the Hiliki Delta where Hiliki was situated, right, So you've got the earthquake, You've got the tsunami. So you have a ruined city now submerged. And then these three rivers bring a lot of silt to the area, and so eventually Hiliki was covered up over over the centuries. Yeah, you put it in the article about how if you bought a house or not bought a house, Let's say, built a house along the shore in eight ninety, it would be a thousand feet inland, which imagine is quite a rub for people that build that lovely house right on the water, because within a century or so it's gonna be a couple of streets back and there's like tin jerks in front of you that have built houses exactly. And it's kind of like what's that game where you like leap frog? Oh yeah, I think you can say Monopoly where you build bigger houses than the other guy. Oh yeah, that would have worked too. Um. So you've got the tsunamis, you've got the river, You've got the silt, the silt. You also have UM the delta itself. Because of this violent activity, UM is moving up their finding over time. It's it's rising. So you have a rising delta, which is low. It's like right at sea level, but it's it's getting bigger and silt is piling it up and making dry ground even further jut out into the coast. Well, what it made was a nice little surprise for archaeologists, and I imagine archaeologists just went berserk with this place. Yeah, they had no idea. They just thought Hliki itself was there. They knew it was there, and that they suspected it would be kind of like a Pompeii, but even more um they considered it even more vital to archaeology or the archaeological record than Pompeii. Even Well, what they found though is you know, Josh, but we're gonna spring it on you now, is six other distinct occupied horizons besides six other ones are seven total, six total, six total, five others besides Hilikia underneath one on top of the other that had been settled and civilized and wiped out and covered up and like just kind of captured in time. That is crazy, Yeah, which, what what were they? So there was one from the Byzantine period, which was pretty long. I think it ran from two d to the fifteenth century UM, and then beneath that there is a Roman ruin which is from the second to the fourth a d. And that one even features a Roman road which is the road that travelers and writers used to come look at Hiliki the ruins um and that one also chuck. This just blows in my mind. It's so captured in time that there's a human skeleton a top a like a cattle skull that like it was knocked on top of this beast and killed like by rock and rubble and just kept there. So there's skeletons are intertwined now and that nuts. So the Roman cities on top of Hiliki, then beneath h leaky uh, they found even more stuff. They found a settlement from the Bronze Age, and before that they kept digging and found uh, prehistoric Neolithic period civilization, possibly as old as twelve thousand years. I wonder if there's something beneath that even I don't know. This makes me think they should start digging in Los Angeles or other like seaside retreats to see what you could find. Well, there's a whole um. There's this whole idea, especially among Atlantis hunters, that it's extremely intuitive because of rising sea levels that anything that was established around the last Ice Age or even at about the end of it, the sea levels of ridges and like more than a hundred feet since then. So any coastal cities now underwater. That's like a big big thing that they hunt for an hour that archaeologists are kind of starting to try to get into is um looking for human habitation underwater. Like there's this whole area off of Whales, I think Northern Wales, Northern Ireland, maybe Um or Scotland anyways, called dogger Land and it's like just the submerged area that used to be above ground and they're they're they're finding like Neolithic settlements there and that cool. Well, and you know, the earth has changed so much over the course of its existence that what's here didn't used to be here, and what was there was something else, and so yeah, I think it's there's no telling what's down there, but that that idea and that the fact that you can find Neolithic settlements under water supports, ironically the notion that there could be something like a land that's lost somewhere like Hiliki. Right. So yeah, so these guys they found this this um area and once they found Hilliki. It all started to they just it was like jack pot, jackpot, jackpot. But finding Hiliki itself um proved a little more difficult than they thought, especially considering all the documentation they had. Yeah, they knew supposedly knew where it was, quote unquote like it's not like they were searching for a needle in a haystack. They were searching for like, uh, like a pool que in a haystack, you know. Uh. So in the late eighties a couple of cornell prest us or started looking for it for real z s and uh. They had a little bit of misinterpretation um for the word for the translation for body of water. And lucky enough, they had a Greek woman with them. Well she's one of the Cornellia professors. Oh she was. Yeah. Well then lucky that she was Greek, Well yeah, because she translates. She was like, wait a minute, She's like, it may not be in the gulf after all, It maybe inland. And they were like, yeah, everybody had been thinking that this was the gulf had swallowed him up, swallowed up the city, which makes sense, right. It turns out it was an inland lagoon that did so. I think it was very much akin to the you know, the Noah's Ark episode. We just did, um, what is it? The Dead Sea? I think where they think that the Dead Sea used to be freshwater right now it's salt water because that's evidence of the flood happening. And probably what they think is the Mediterranean overwhelmed the straight I can't remember what's straight it was, you're searching the reaches. Yeah, anyway, I think it was much the same way, like the city used to be around a lagoon, and then the lagoon got a lot bigger, thus swallowing the city. Right, So they looked under land, and all of a sudden they had to ditch their scuba gear for shovels, and they found the first Roman city, the first ruins. We're like, wait a minute, twelve feet just twelve feet below the land, which doesn't seem like that far at all. No, it's not, because the Roman rumors were like four or five ft. Yeah, I would think that someone would have accidentally found it before that, even you know, well that kicked it off. There was a German archaeologists who was traveling in the area and found a Hliky coin with Poseidon on. It was like, Holy cow, this is significant. So I think that's kind of how it started. Yeah, so they found have found a lot of stuff since then, um buildings, industrial buildings, kilns, looms, intersecting streets. Yeah, with buildings along these streets like a real city. Yeah. Uh what else? The coins, of course, UM, jugs, jugs with their original contents, and those are from the Bronze Age. They found a storehouse of like jugs of different sizes and types from the Bronze Age. So we're talking like five thousand years old. They don't have any idea about these civilizations, but this was contemporary to like ancient Troy, which itself was considered a legendary city until hiring Schleiman found it. Um. So they just finding this stuff is amazingly awesome because and there's more yea, there is supposedly, yes, So they think that they found the outskirts of Haliki and that they there's a lot more left, and that it's intact. Oh, they're not actually at Hliki yet. No, they're in Hiliki, but they're not in the city center, they don't you. Yeah, so they're just out in the outskirts. That's what they think. UM and when they were looking for Hiliki out in the gulf. They found something cool too, didn't they. I don't think I know this, you do know it. They found a sea wall ancent sea Wolf of the City, and they also found what they think are the ten Spartan ship. Oh yeah, that's right. I thought you were going to say the Statue of Poseidon. That would be like, well, they'll find an event the motherload if they found that, things still standing upright under the earth. So they keep following. They started by following the Roman road, right, So they're basically they're unearthing, like imagine this student there unearthing like three lost cities at once. Isn't that insane? Do you know? What? Like an archaeological treasure trove that is. So they're unearthing them. And as long as they don't intersect, right, as long as like the Roman town isn't built directly over the Statue of Poseidon to where getting to Poseidon would undermine the Roman town um, then they should be able to get at all. And they're gonna be doing They will excavate this for decades. So this has been ongoing since the late eighties. Well, no, they really started uncovering stuff in like two thousand, but they started in so awesome. Yeah, very cool. So that's a Haliki. So of course, Chuck, this doesn't mean that anybody has stopped searching for Atlantis. Like the archaeologist in Spain. Yeah, he's looking inland though, which comes from this theory. So maybe he's honest. One, it's possible he's gonna start digging up in Barcelona and people are gonna say, what are you doing? Yeah, drink some wine. So, uh, you were saying that you think that Plato was inspired by Hliki. I think there's substantial evidence in what we've said. But also keep in mind Laki happened in three seventy three. Plato wrote his book in three sixty, thirteen years later, and he lived in the area. This is a pretty well known catastrophe. I think you're probably right, But with it, we would not have had the awesome TV show Man from Atlantis had it not been for Plato. No, I guess that's true. Did you watch that? No, that was a little before your time. And there's an awesome um HP Lovecraft short story about a German U boat that ends up in Atlantis. It's awesome. I tried to find YouTube stuff of Man from Atlantis and then there's plenty out there. You know he had the webbed hands when I was a kid up, Really, you had webbed hands and feet. It's not Prince Nemore, is it the submarter Prince of Nemore Nemo. No, Prince Nemore, He's a Marvel comic guy. No, no, no, it was Man. It was a schlocky It ran for like one year. Was like, yeah he was he had supero he had superhuman strength and uh could breathe underwater, had gills, and he had webbed feet in hands and um, I think like some government agency snapped him up to do like investigative undersea work for them. Oh, I know you're talking about Welcome Back Cotter. It was a dude from from Dallas. Uh Patrick? What's his face? Patrick Ewing? Patrick Guffy? You're thinking jr. You Patricking is the basketball player, right, Patrick Duffy? Yah? Yeah, h this was good stuff. I've never heard of that show. Yeah, it was only around for one year. I think. Boy, I was into it when I was like seven. Good stuff. You had webbed hands. Yeah, it got me into Plato. You hadn't been eating it for years. Funny guy. All right, so that's it. You got anything else? I got nothing. Thank you for doing this one with me. It was awesome. Thank you for opening my eyes to coolness. Anytime. If you want to know more about Juliki, you should search for was there a real Atlantis? By typing that into the search bar house to works dot com and I said that, which means it's time for a listener. Man. That's right, Josh. Remember when we did a little TV pilot recently. Um, we tried to get these book INDs onto the show. They arrived a little late. We weren't able to. But I want to tell everyone about this project because that sounds very cryptic. Uh, this from my Hey, guys, have been a big fan for a couple of years, UM, and I especially like that some of your causes you have taken on and considered and done podcast about them, Kiva and the Cooperative for Education in particular. So our Guatemala podcast gave him an idea for a Facebook fundraising idea to raise awareness for co op our buddies Cooperative for Education Cincinnati to do the awesome textbook programs and UH Computer Center Labs in Guatemala, and he proposed to them and they said, hey, y'all, let's do this. So his idea was to create quote unquote celebrity book INDs with just this basic idea. Take an ordinary set of book INDs, although they are pretty fancy looking, right, I gotta admit, uh in, make them super famous uh pop culture icons through social media, and then sell them for a million bucks and give it all to co ed. So that's the plan. It's a good plan. I don't know if we added anything to that. We added at least sevent Okay, good um, he says. I know it sounds crazy, but crazy is usually what it takes to get people to notice things. The rational thinking behind this is that to get famous, all you need to have are a ton of people believing that you're famous. You know, yeah, I mean, what else is celebrity exactly. Uh. So they're trying to drum up celebrity for these book ends to raise awareness. They have sent them around the world to meet people and to be on TV shows and in movies. Uh. They're documenting this on Facebook, the travels of these book ends, uh, in Twitter and blogs for people to follow. And our big audacious goal is to get as many Facebook fans as Kim Kardashian. She has nine million fans. Can you plead them? Yes? Wow? Uh So, what we're hoping for your listeners is that they will like the idea enough to want to help. All you have to do it can be as simple as going to the Facebook page. Uh, follow you on Twitter, the celebrity book ins that is, tweet about us, blog about us, tell your friends to like us, and hook us up with any celebrity friends that you might have. Um, they have been in the hands of Danny de Vito, uh, Matt burning your of the National. I didn't know how to pronounce that, but I do love the National, and I believe I saw Jeff Bridges holding these things, did you really Yeah? And then before us Yeah, So we actually got a little de Vito Bridges stank on our hands unless they clean these things. And they sent it to us originally to get it in our cubicles on the TV pilot, but they arrived a little late and we weren't able to. So we just did some pictures and maybe on down the road, if we do any more TV stuff, we can get them on television and do our part to help raise awareness man so uh Facebook dot com, im slash Celebrity Bookends or Twitter at Celebrity Bookends or send an email to Celebrity Bookends at Gmail, and that raises awareness to eventually sell these things to Danny de Vito to raise money for co ed for a million bucks. Well, I certainly don't have a million bucks. Well, we also have our own Twitter handle and you can get in touch with us too. While you're talking to Celebrity Bookends. You can tweet to us whatever you want. There's no rules, uh except that has to be a hundred forty characters or lest just that ru um. That's s Y s K podcast. We're also on Facebook at Facebook dot com slash stuff you Should Know, and you can send us an email as well at stuff podcast dot com dot for more on this and thousands of other topics. Does It How stuff Works dot com