Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve camera. It's ready. Are you welcome to Stuff you Should Know from House Stuff Works dot Com. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark. With me is Chuck Bryant. We are podcasting right in the midst of death season. Chuck. Wow, Yeah, what I don't I don't know big Man, Fara Fawcett, Michael Jackson, Billy Mays, some impressionist. I don't know that comedian guy. Yeah, people dropping like flies. Wow. Yeah, I feel lucky to be here. I do too. Actually, Chuck, I'm on vacation. I know you are. Chuck Bryant is such a world class employee that he actually came in while on vacation too. Podcasts. This is I'm Freshen from the airport yep. From wedding in Columbus, Ohio. How was it my first Catholic wedding? Dude? Those things are awesome? My first one elnty of wine? Uh yeah, the reception, sure, but no wine at the at the mass or you were looking around there there were flasks of wine and the fews. You believe me. It was long pretty cool though, I've never experienced that. When everyone started, uh reciting the things chanting is it called chanting that? I call it chanting? It freaked me out at first, Yeah, quite honestly because I grew up Baptist and there's people don't say anything out loud in Baptist churches. But it was interesting, definitely a cool experience to go through. That's you only really need to do it once. I would agree, you know, and I doubt if I'll go to a lot more weddings. So dude, when I was living in Toledo, I probably spent fifty to seventy hours a week in a Catholic wedding, series of Catholic weddings. Yeah, columb is pretty cool though. It's Yeah, Ohio state not bad, Bill Buckeyes. Alright, are we done? Yes? Okay, what are we talking about today? We are talking about gas mileage? Oh yes, and how it's calculated, right yep, kick us off, chuck. Well, Uh, something you folks might notice when you go to buy a car these days, Um, they'll advertise certain gas mileage and you may not get the gas mileage when you're driving the car that was on the sticker on the side of the car. Or on the TV commercial that was kicking us off. That's a very common thing to not get the gas mileage that's stated. Well why well, because well let's let's get into this, all right, let's do it, Chucks. So basically, as you stated, pretty much, God and everybody knows that whatever that says on the the sticker on the car for the whatever it's miles per gallon has been calculated at is vastly more than what you're actually going to get. And um, it's not because the e p A isn't putting cars that it tests through rigorous experiences, right, it's not because they don't care. No, as a matter of fact, they don't test almost any of the cars that come out. That's actually left to the auto manufacturers. That was kind of but there. They submit their findings to the e p A for review, and then the e p A, I guess, randomly tests about ten to fift of the new models that are released. Yeah, a little disappointed. I would have thought the would be a little more involved than that. You would think so, but no, not really. They're busy though, busy running around trying to figure out how to bring super fun sites back exactly Brown fields um, so chuck. The other I guess big weirdness that has to do with e p a UM fuel efficiency calculations is that cars actually don't ever see the road. True, They're put on what are they called. It's called a It sounds kind of fantastic. It's called dynamometer. Nice dynamometer. Dynamometer, dynamo, Yeah, something like along those lines. Let's call it a fun machine. Actually, it's like it's like a treadmill for a car, is what it is. Right, So the car is actually in a lab being tested. Uh, and it's kind of like Ferris Bueller's Day Off exactly, not in reverse, right. Um, And I guess they have the city They have a city test, which is what Well, both tests involved a professional driver, so this Yeah, I wonder if they get paid. Yeah, that's a good question. Go into the e p A test drive a car for a few minutes. I wonder what everybody gets paid, do you? Oh? Yeah, I'm one of those guys. So yeah, professional driver gets in, uh to simulate depending on which which tests city or or highway, which driving conditions. So the city program, what they do is, uh, they get in, start the engine cold, and then they simulate stop and go traffic idling, that kind of thing. I think. They say eleven miles is how how far they drive, and they make twenty three stops over the course of thirty one minutes. Right, drive an average speed of twenty miles an hour and the top speed of fifty six miles an hour, which is yeah, it seems smart. Yeah, okay, all right, and then the highway test, Uh, you start out with a warm engine, and they drive ten miles with an average speed of forty eight miles per hour and a top speed of sixty miles for about twelve and a half minutes. So let me go ahead and say sixty top speed of the same for me, pal bat out of hell. Uh, And I just drive as fast as I can. And if you are in front of me in the fast lane and you're not driving faster than me, I'm all upon you. You're like the German's pretty much or Winston Wolf. Yeah yeah, not quite as fast as that. But well that's because you don't have a both up that high. No. No, but um okay, So these two tests, this seem logical enough. Here's where things become really illogical and where the discrepancies come from right. The whole time the e p A is conducting these tests, or the auto manufacturers conducting the test. Uh, there is a little sensor jammed in the tail pipe, stuck in there, right, like when you go to do the emissions testing. Sure, and this thing is measuring how much carbon is present in the exhaust. Right. So instead of looking at the tank meter or whatever, the tank meter, what country am I from the gas gage? Yeah, that would be the easy way to do it and just divide. But yeah, they say it is actually more accurate. It is more accurate. The thing is is, I mean, do you drive around with the sensor jamed in your tailpipe? I do not, sir, No, nor do I very clean person, um, and neither do most people, right, correct? Um? So this is why when you go buy a car the miles per gallont calculated are vastly different. That's not the only problem, right, because it's in a lab that automatically changes everything everything. Not only do we not drive around the sensors jammed up our tailpipes, we also don't drive in laboratories on dynamometers. And there are many, many differences between a dynamometer and a lab on the road. We're gonna lick that word before this podcast over uh weather. That's that's a big one. Wind resistance. Most laboratories are indoors, right, different having passengers in your car, having a roof rack with your stupid bike on the back. Weight aerodynamics and that that's that's really probably the biggest one as far as I'm concerned. I mean, think about it. The car is not moving, it's just the wheels, right, just the wheels, so there's no drag whatsoever. Like when I'm flying down seventy doing ninety miles per hour and it's hot out, Um, I've got all four of my windows rolled down, and that just devastates fuel efficiency. Yeah, it completely changes the aerodynamic characteristics of the car, which revolvers are kind of boxy to begin with. Um, but yeah, I've noticed my my gas case just go over like twenty miles. I used to I used to drive a Plymouth Valiant. Ever tell you about t my cart? Isn't that the one you drove back from l A. Well, I towed it to l A. It would have you bought it in l A. No, I bought it here and towed it out there. I've never heard of this car. Then, well, it's a great car, but it was one of those old gas guzzlers and this thing, literally, dude, if I was accelerating on the highway, if you looked hard enough, you could see the needle move. Yeah. It was bad. It was real bad. The other things they don't account for, Josh, since we're talking about this is uh what they call jack rabbit starts or lead foot acceleration because that that will burn up your gas quicker. And that's realistic city driving, you know, Oh, definitely. Most people don't just go they go right, you know, he does, He does do that. Chris Cox, our coworker, I see a slow patient driver. Yeah, and I hope you listen to this. You try, Chris, stay out of the fast Laton. Another problem with this test, and and I know it seems like we're saying that there's nothing but problems with this test, but that's because there isn't. Um is that it tends to favor or dramatically favor hybrids, right, because the belief city driving is where the hybrid really gets the most, almost all electric which is produced zero emission. And they this they I guess they haven't adjusted the formula to account for that. So you know, all of a sudden the um, you know, some hybrid cars just getting these incredible miles per gallon ratings when they don't really, Um, there are some some ways around this. Well, before we get to that kind of mention, one more thing. These are brands spanking new cars that they're driving. Oh yes, and not only that they've been broken in properly. There's actually a way, um, that you're supposed to break in a car when you first buy one. UM. And I think it does take place over the course of a couple of thousand miles. But you you want to drive I think no more than sixty and then stop it and it's staggered. There's this whole process to it. It could actually probably take up part of a podcast itself. And I don't know enough about it to go into it because I've never had a new car. No one does that, but that's the way you're supposed to do it. So apparently the e p A does it. So these are brand new cars that have been properly broken in, and so they get maximum fuel efficiency right, And I think the point, I guess my original point was if you I don't remember, you don't maintain your car, and a lot of people don't maintain their car like you probably should. You're gonna get worse gas mileage, right, Plus they don't have any of the electrical system running. No A C. Yeah, well, the tires are perfectly inflated. Basically, this is like what the e p A thinks everybody should be driving, and absolutely no one does. Well, they said they were gonna and we should follow up on this. They said they were gonna start doing more realistic tests in the future. And they said that the future. Yeah, I'm not sure if if that's an effect yet, but they did say they were going to try and start taking some of these more things into account. It's about time, it is, you know. And just look at the gas gates like everybody else, no one cares how much carbon is present in the exhalt save that for the emissions inspection. So, Chuck, as I was saying, yes, cheating the e p A. Yeah, there's some ways to to beat the e PA at their own game, right, well, beat your beat your car its own game or the oil companies. Are you talking about hyper miling? I am Chuck. You know what that is? Hyper miling? Yeah, yeah, sure, Okay, well do you know who coined it? Uh, some dude in Chicago. What's his name? Wayne Gerdis, the King of hyper miling. Yeah, I think. I'm not sure if he won the title or not, but I think he's the world's most fuel efficient driver. I think so too. Yeah, and he is dedicated to it, like I will never hyper mile ever, it just takes too much patience and you're slow. You're the slowest driver on the road and you're hyper mileing, right, you hyper drive? Thanks, that's different, but um it, it definitely improves your your fuel efficiency for sure. Yeah. Let's hear um Edmonds, the car magazine Edmonds. They didn't experiment, and they found at hyper miling you can get an extra thirty more per gallon and that was in a land Rover. Yeah, which guzz And apparently if you hyper mile and like a Toyota Prius, you can bump it up to like a gallon. They say, Yeah, I saw a picture. There was a Mother Jones article on Wayne Gurtis, and they had two shots of these two different dashboards went from a Prius and I think went from an inside or something like that, and these things were clocking like a hundred and fifty miles per gallon. Man, that's nuts. Yeah, it is nuts. And I don't drive I probably, I don't even know. If I put fifty miles a week on my car, maybe seventy five miles a week, you could make a tank of gas last like a year. Like that, I could if I had a Prius, I should do that. Yeah, but I have my old Civic and gets decent gas mileage. But I don't drive enough to invest in a new car at this point. Well, the cool thing about um about hyper milings You don't need a new car. You can do it with any car. It's merely a series of techniques. You don't have to go buy anything. You don't have to do anything except dry. I've pretty conscientiously and be aware of what you're doing, like um, accelerating and breaking too quickly. You were saying, uh that that was the Edmonds test that was based on taking off at a red light or just driving up to your red light and slamming on your brakes. They're both waste of gas. Um, so too is driving on the highway without cruise control. Yeah, I didn't realize that they actually that same test by Edmonds actually vastly improved the fuel efficiency of the land Rover. And I think they tested a Mustang too, But they got the biggest bank for their buck um using cruise control at seventy on the land Rover, Because if you think about it, I mean, even if you're really paying attention to staying at seventy miles an hour, it's still based on your foot and your foot is flawed. It's kind of heavy, clumsy thing. I know you do. I wasn't gonna bring it up. Um, So, yeah, you want to rely on cruise control. Those two things alone will will really increase your fuel efficiency. Driving at lower speeds is a really important thing too. Yeah. Did it didn't say anywhere with what the ideal speed was. No, but I've always heard sixty. Really, I've always heard like thirty five to forty for like the ultimate gas mileage. I'm talking highway, Okay, sure, yeah, you'll get in trouble if you drive thirty. Now that makes sense then yeah, I think in the city though, it's thirty, is it? Yeah? Well, I know that they used to have much Well, I guess today's UM posted speed limits back in the early seventies or late sixties and then because of the oil embargo, that's when they were dropped down to fifty five, was to increase fuel efficiency in cars. And then they've kicked it back up because everybody's like, we want to drive fast again. We don't care about it. We're we're on the highway to hell anyway. Just let us drive as fast as we want. That can't drive fifty five crowd and uh A C apparently is kind of a big one, using it at max power, which is decisive, uncompromising and rude. Yeah, I I don't. My A C doesn't work. As I said, I drive down the highway with the windows open, and that apparently is way worse than driving with your A C on because of the drag. And this guy he also doesn't he coast and cut his engine early if he's approaching a parking space, so he'll he'll coast the last whatever, however far he can to to park his car. And gurtis actually on his site. I think it's clean MPG dot com. If that's not his site, he writes heavily for it. Um he answered an age old question for me. If you are going to be idling for longer than seven seconds, turn your car off because it takes about seven seconds worth of gas to turn a fuel injected car over. He always wondered, Yeah, I've never heard like an whoever told me? I didn't believe. I believe this guy. So if you're sitting like at a at a drive through or something, turn the car off. Yeah, you know that's a great idea. Yeah. And then there's some slightly more advanced techniques for people who are really into this patient people like what like ridge riding. I don't know that that was actually another term coined by Gurtis that. Um, I hope i'm saying his last name, right, I've never met the guy, so okay, um it's where you hug the far right line solid line of the far right lane on the highway. Uh. And one of the there's You do this for two reasons. One is to make yourself really obvious and noticeable the other drivers so they have an opportunity to pass you early because you're going Yeah, because I think he drives like fifty or um So then I was probably wrong about sixty because this guy is probably gonna drive at the optimal speed on the highway. Um. So number one, it makes you obvious because you're not positioned like everybody else. But secondly, in bad weather, especially rain, you're actually taking yourself out of those depressions that have worn into the asphalt with huddles are forming sure running through through water. Yeah I didn't realize that. Yeah, definitely, because your your wheels are moving, but you're not getting anywhere. Yeah, that makes sense. So you you've lost traction. You're a hyper miler, Josh, in a way, I just know a lot about it. Again, I'll never do it right. Uh. And then probably my favorite is distant anticipatory focus d a F. Yes. So Gerti's basically tries to drive like he doesn't have brakes. Oh yeah, okay, he maintains a very slow, steady pace. So he's looking several lights ahead right to uh to time his driving to that light. He's trying to accelerate slowly to to keep in time with these these lights because he wants nothing but green lights. That makes sense. He never has to use his brakes. That saves quite a bit too. Of course, this is the same guy who also turns off his ignition and coats into parking spaces. So yeah, but that's pretty much hyper miling. I mean there's actually a lot more to it, taking advantage of other cars, like using eighteen wheelers to draft off of Yeah, well that's a lot of the NASCAR guys hyper mile. They don't call it that. I don't know what they call it. Someone probably has that answer, but they Yeah, during um, the caution when they have like debris on the track and the pace cars there, Yeah, the little guy, I'll throw out the caution flag and that means everyone's got to slow down until they clean all the crowd off the track, and um, the A lot of the drivers will cut their engines and coast for a while and then cut them back on and then cut them again, and then while they're racing, they will draft. That's a very popular technique to save fuel because in NASCAR, if you the fewer stops the better. Sure, obviously, yeah you Nascar guy, No me neither. I watched it for a while. Remember, I really love the origin of NASCAR bootlegging. Other than that, I'm not really in the NASCAR. My sister in law, Sarah, who I was just with in Ohio, is big in the NASCAR, and we always give her hard time. Yeah, we call her a bead neck and stuff. Yeah, it's good. Well, um, anything about it? No, I mean really until until we come up with an alternative fuel source or you know standard hundred mile an hour or hundred miles per gallon uh cars. It's a good idea hyper mile yeah we should say, though, I think exercise some caution if you want to try this stuff out, because you know some cars, if you turn the key off, don't turn all the way off because you're steering. Roo whe will walk up. It's a good point. And I think sometimes the air brakes are activated when you start the car, right yeah, so I think you want to keep keep it set to ignition or start keep it set to the on position so you can still run your radio. No, so you still see lights on the dashboard, right yeah, So just just be careful if you want to try some experimentation here. You were really good at c O A buddy. Well, I could see somebody have any idea how many times we would have been suedere not for you? And just my mind's eye had just pictured someone saying Josh and Chuck said to cut my engine, and all of a sudden, like who is this Josh and Chuck, they go to pull into the car to the parking space and they're steering wheel lock sup and have a record six miles an hour. Well good, all right, that's hyper miling. And e p A. Well, we'll keep an eye out to see if the e p A actually does do any real world testing. Good idea. Let's se listener mail, I think so okay, nowhere to go, but up right, Josh, we are going to call this what was in my inbox before I came in listener mail. Awesome, that's a secret. Actually, I shouldn't ever revealed that the good way to get a listener mails to email me the day we record. It's not a secret anymore. This is about the Peter principal. Remember we did a podcast about the fact that many companies will not demote somebody, that will just fire somebody if they're incompetent. And this is from Jennifer and she says that she worked for the same company, has still working there for five or six years, and last November she was worked her way up to the top of sales support and she was kicked down to reception instead of fired. And she was told about her new job and said that she was getting the demotion because she was the weakest person on the team and a little harsh, I thought so. And she asked him during the meeting why didn't they just fire her? And they said because she was still a very important part of the teams. It's the worst part of the team. Exactly, very important part of our team, but the worst part. Don't forget that, uh. And she said that um, her pay didn't change, so she's actually a very high paid receptionist and um actually makes more than a lot of people on the sales team now at the reception desk, which I'll bet the sales team just loves. And we actually did have someone else emailed another company that said that they practiced this as well. Well, that's fantastic. Two out of several hundred thousand, Yeah, not too bad. And she also adds here at the end that we sometimes give shout outs to our men and women overseas for fighting and Iraq and Afghanistan and to support them. And she says that she's an Air Force wife and that we should mention families occasionally they're left behind because it's very hard on them, do it, Chuck. And my brother in law is in the Marine Corps and he has been deployed many times. My sister Michelle and her kids shall be in Reagan or often left at home for months at a time, and it is hard on the family. So when we say support the troops, we mean the whole family, the whole kid and can do it nicely, don't chuck, Thank you nicely. Good. That's it. Well, if you want to Mia Colpa out of chuck, you can email us at stuff podcast at how stuff works dot com for more on this and thousands of other topics. Is it how stuff works dot com. Want more how stuff works, check out our blogs on the house. Stuff works dot com home page. Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve Camray. It's ready, are you

Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve camera. It's ready. Are you welcome to Stuff you Should Know from House Stuff Works dot Com. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark. With me is Chuck Bryant. We are podcasting right in the midst of death season. Chuck. Wow, Yeah, what I don't I don't know big Man, Fara Fawcett, Michael Jackson, Billy Mays, some impressionist. I don't know that comedian guy. Yeah, people dropping like flies. Wow. Yeah, I feel lucky to be here. I do too. Actually, Chuck, I'm on vacation. I know you are. Chuck Bryant is such a world class employee that he actually came in while on vacation too. Podcasts. This is I'm Freshen from the airport yep. From wedding in Columbus, Ohio. How was it my first Catholic wedding? Dude? Those things are awesome? My first one elnty of wine? Uh yeah, the reception, sure, but no wine at the at the mass or you were looking around there there were flasks of wine and the fews. You believe me. It was long pretty cool though, I've never experienced that. When everyone started, uh reciting the things chanting is it called chanting that? I call it chanting? It freaked me out at first, Yeah, quite honestly because I grew up Baptist and there's people don't say anything out loud in Baptist churches. But it was interesting, definitely a cool experience to go through. That's you only really need to do it once. I would agree, you know, and I doubt if I'll go to a lot more weddings. So dude, when I was living in Toledo, I probably spent fifty to seventy hours a week in a Catholic wedding, series of Catholic weddings. Yeah, columb is pretty cool though. It's Yeah, Ohio state not bad, Bill Buckeyes. Alright, are we done? Yes? Okay, what are we talking about today? We are talking about gas mileage? Oh yes, and how it's calculated, right yep, kick us off, chuck. Well, Uh, something you folks might notice when you go to buy a car these days, Um, they'll advertise certain gas mileage and you may not get the gas mileage when you're driving the car that was on the sticker on the side of the car. Or on the TV commercial that was kicking us off. That's a very common thing to not get the gas mileage that's stated. Well why well, because well let's let's get into this, all right, let's do it, Chucks. So basically, as you stated, pretty much, God and everybody knows that whatever that says on the the sticker on the car for the whatever it's miles per gallon has been calculated at is vastly more than what you're actually going to get. And um, it's not because the e p A isn't putting cars that it tests through rigorous experiences, right, it's not because they don't care. No, as a matter of fact, they don't test almost any of the cars that come out. That's actually left to the auto manufacturers. That was kind of but there. They submit their findings to the e p A for review, and then the e p A, I guess, randomly tests about ten to fift of the new models that are released. Yeah, a little disappointed. I would have thought the would be a little more involved than that. You would think so, but no, not really. They're busy though, busy running around trying to figure out how to bring super fun sites back exactly Brown fields um, so chuck. The other I guess big weirdness that has to do with e p a UM fuel efficiency calculations is that cars actually don't ever see the road. True, They're put on what are they called. It's called a It sounds kind of fantastic. It's called dynamometer. Nice dynamometer. Dynamometer, dynamo, Yeah, something like along those lines. Let's call it a fun machine. Actually, it's like it's like a treadmill for a car, is what it is. Right, So the car is actually in a lab being tested. Uh, and it's kind of like Ferris Bueller's Day Off exactly, not in reverse, right. Um, And I guess they have the city They have a city test, which is what Well, both tests involved a professional driver, so this Yeah, I wonder if they get paid. Yeah, that's a good question. Go into the e p A test drive a car for a few minutes. I wonder what everybody gets paid, do you? Oh? Yeah, I'm one of those guys. So yeah, professional driver gets in, uh to simulate depending on which which tests city or or highway, which driving conditions. So the city program, what they do is, uh, they get in, start the engine cold, and then they simulate stop and go traffic idling, that kind of thing. I think. They say eleven miles is how how far they drive, and they make twenty three stops over the course of thirty one minutes. Right, drive an average speed of twenty miles an hour and the top speed of fifty six miles an hour, which is yeah, it seems smart. Yeah, okay, all right, and then the highway test, Uh, you start out with a warm engine, and they drive ten miles with an average speed of forty eight miles per hour and a top speed of sixty miles for about twelve and a half minutes. So let me go ahead and say sixty top speed of the same for me, pal bat out of hell. Uh, And I just drive as fast as I can. And if you are in front of me in the fast lane and you're not driving faster than me, I'm all upon you. You're like the German's pretty much or Winston Wolf. Yeah yeah, not quite as fast as that. But well that's because you don't have a both up that high. No. No, but um okay, So these two tests, this seem logical enough. Here's where things become really illogical and where the discrepancies come from right. The whole time the e p A is conducting these tests, or the auto manufacturers conducting the test. Uh, there is a little sensor jammed in the tail pipe, stuck in there, right, like when you go to do the emissions testing. Sure, and this thing is measuring how much carbon is present in the exhaust. Right. So instead of looking at the tank meter or whatever, the tank meter, what country am I from the gas gage? Yeah, that would be the easy way to do it and just divide. But yeah, they say it is actually more accurate. It is more accurate. The thing is is, I mean, do you drive around with the sensor jamed in your tailpipe? I do not, sir, No, nor do I very clean person, um, and neither do most people, right, correct? Um? So this is why when you go buy a car the miles per gallont calculated are vastly different. That's not the only problem, right, because it's in a lab that automatically changes everything everything. Not only do we not drive around the sensors jammed up our tailpipes, we also don't drive in laboratories on dynamometers. And there are many, many differences between a dynamometer and a lab on the road. We're gonna lick that word before this podcast over uh weather. That's that's a big one. Wind resistance. Most laboratories are indoors, right, different having passengers in your car, having a roof rack with your stupid bike on the back. Weight aerodynamics and that that's that's really probably the biggest one as far as I'm concerned. I mean, think about it. The car is not moving, it's just the wheels, right, just the wheels, so there's no drag whatsoever. Like when I'm flying down seventy doing ninety miles per hour and it's hot out, Um, I've got all four of my windows rolled down, and that just devastates fuel efficiency. Yeah, it completely changes the aerodynamic characteristics of the car, which revolvers are kind of boxy to begin with. Um, but yeah, I've noticed my my gas case just go over like twenty miles. I used to I used to drive a Plymouth Valiant. Ever tell you about t my cart? Isn't that the one you drove back from l A. Well, I towed it to l A. It would have you bought it in l A. No, I bought it here and towed it out there. I've never heard of this car. Then, well, it's a great car, but it was one of those old gas guzzlers and this thing, literally, dude, if I was accelerating on the highway, if you looked hard enough, you could see the needle move. Yeah. It was bad. It was real bad. The other things they don't account for, Josh, since we're talking about this is uh what they call jack rabbit starts or lead foot acceleration because that that will burn up your gas quicker. And that's realistic city driving, you know, Oh, definitely. Most people don't just go they go right, you know, he does, He does do that. Chris Cox, our coworker, I see a slow patient driver. Yeah, and I hope you listen to this. You try, Chris, stay out of the fast Laton. Another problem with this test, and and I know it seems like we're saying that there's nothing but problems with this test, but that's because there isn't. Um is that it tends to favor or dramatically favor hybrids, right, because the belief city driving is where the hybrid really gets the most, almost all electric which is produced zero emission. And they this they I guess they haven't adjusted the formula to account for that. So you know, all of a sudden the um, you know, some hybrid cars just getting these incredible miles per gallon ratings when they don't really, Um, there are some some ways around this. Well, before we get to that kind of mention, one more thing. These are brands spanking new cars that they're driving. Oh yes, and not only that they've been broken in properly. There's actually a way, um, that you're supposed to break in a car when you first buy one. UM. And I think it does take place over the course of a couple of thousand miles. But you you want to drive I think no more than sixty and then stop it and it's staggered. There's this whole process to it. It could actually probably take up part of a podcast itself. And I don't know enough about it to go into it because I've never had a new car. No one does that, but that's the way you're supposed to do it. So apparently the e p A does it. So these are brand new cars that have been properly broken in, and so they get maximum fuel efficiency right, And I think the point, I guess my original point was if you I don't remember, you don't maintain your car, and a lot of people don't maintain their car like you probably should. You're gonna get worse gas mileage, right, Plus they don't have any of the electrical system running. No A C. Yeah, well, the tires are perfectly inflated. Basically, this is like what the e p A thinks everybody should be driving, and absolutely no one does. Well, they said they were gonna and we should follow up on this. They said they were gonna start doing more realistic tests in the future. And they said that the future. Yeah, I'm not sure if if that's an effect yet, but they did say they were going to try and start taking some of these more things into account. It's about time, it is, you know. And just look at the gas gates like everybody else, no one cares how much carbon is present in the exhalt save that for the emissions inspection. So, Chuck, as I was saying, yes, cheating the e p A. Yeah, there's some ways to to beat the e PA at their own game, right, well, beat your beat your car its own game or the oil companies. Are you talking about hyper miling? I am Chuck. You know what that is? Hyper miling? Yeah, yeah, sure, Okay, well do you know who coined it? Uh, some dude in Chicago. What's his name? Wayne Gerdis, the King of hyper miling. Yeah, I think. I'm not sure if he won the title or not, but I think he's the world's most fuel efficient driver. I think so too. Yeah, and he is dedicated to it, like I will never hyper mile ever, it just takes too much patience and you're slow. You're the slowest driver on the road and you're hyper mileing, right, you hyper drive? Thanks, that's different, but um it, it definitely improves your your fuel efficiency for sure. Yeah. Let's hear um Edmonds, the car magazine Edmonds. They didn't experiment, and they found at hyper miling you can get an extra thirty more per gallon and that was in a land Rover. Yeah, which guzz And apparently if you hyper mile and like a Toyota Prius, you can bump it up to like a gallon. They say, Yeah, I saw a picture. There was a Mother Jones article on Wayne Gurtis, and they had two shots of these two different dashboards went from a Prius and I think went from an inside or something like that, and these things were clocking like a hundred and fifty miles per gallon. Man, that's nuts. Yeah, it is nuts. And I don't drive I probably, I don't even know. If I put fifty miles a week on my car, maybe seventy five miles a week, you could make a tank of gas last like a year. Like that, I could if I had a Prius, I should do that. Yeah, but I have my old Civic and gets decent gas mileage. But I don't drive enough to invest in a new car at this point. Well, the cool thing about um about hyper milings You don't need a new car. You can do it with any car. It's merely a series of techniques. You don't have to go buy anything. You don't have to do anything except dry. I've pretty conscientiously and be aware of what you're doing, like um, accelerating and breaking too quickly. You were saying, uh that that was the Edmonds test that was based on taking off at a red light or just driving up to your red light and slamming on your brakes. They're both waste of gas. Um, so too is driving on the highway without cruise control. Yeah, I didn't realize that they actually that same test by Edmonds actually vastly improved the fuel efficiency of the land Rover. And I think they tested a Mustang too, But they got the biggest bank for their buck um using cruise control at seventy on the land Rover, Because if you think about it, I mean, even if you're really paying attention to staying at seventy miles an hour, it's still based on your foot and your foot is flawed. It's kind of heavy, clumsy thing. I know you do. I wasn't gonna bring it up. Um, So, yeah, you want to rely on cruise control. Those two things alone will will really increase your fuel efficiency. Driving at lower speeds is a really important thing too. Yeah. Did it didn't say anywhere with what the ideal speed was. No, but I've always heard sixty. Really, I've always heard like thirty five to forty for like the ultimate gas mileage. I'm talking highway, Okay, sure, yeah, you'll get in trouble if you drive thirty. Now that makes sense then yeah, I think in the city though, it's thirty, is it? Yeah? Well, I know that they used to have much Well, I guess today's UM posted speed limits back in the early seventies or late sixties and then because of the oil embargo, that's when they were dropped down to fifty five, was to increase fuel efficiency in cars. And then they've kicked it back up because everybody's like, we want to drive fast again. We don't care about it. We're we're on the highway to hell anyway. Just let us drive as fast as we want. That can't drive fifty five crowd and uh A C apparently is kind of a big one, using it at max power, which is decisive, uncompromising and rude. Yeah, I I don't. My A C doesn't work. As I said, I drive down the highway with the windows open, and that apparently is way worse than driving with your A C on because of the drag. And this guy he also doesn't he coast and cut his engine early if he's approaching a parking space, so he'll he'll coast the last whatever, however far he can to to park his car. And gurtis actually on his site. I think it's clean MPG dot com. If that's not his site, he writes heavily for it. Um he answered an age old question for me. If you are going to be idling for longer than seven seconds, turn your car off because it takes about seven seconds worth of gas to turn a fuel injected car over. He always wondered, Yeah, I've never heard like an whoever told me? I didn't believe. I believe this guy. So if you're sitting like at a at a drive through or something, turn the car off. Yeah, you know that's a great idea. Yeah. And then there's some slightly more advanced techniques for people who are really into this patient people like what like ridge riding. I don't know that that was actually another term coined by Gurtis that. Um, I hope i'm saying his last name, right, I've never met the guy, so okay, um it's where you hug the far right line solid line of the far right lane on the highway. Uh. And one of the there's You do this for two reasons. One is to make yourself really obvious and noticeable the other drivers so they have an opportunity to pass you early because you're going Yeah, because I think he drives like fifty or um So then I was probably wrong about sixty because this guy is probably gonna drive at the optimal speed on the highway. Um. So number one, it makes you obvious because you're not positioned like everybody else. But secondly, in bad weather, especially rain, you're actually taking yourself out of those depressions that have worn into the asphalt with huddles are forming sure running through through water. Yeah I didn't realize that. Yeah, definitely, because your your wheels are moving, but you're not getting anywhere. Yeah, that makes sense. So you you've lost traction. You're a hyper miler, Josh, in a way, I just know a lot about it. Again, I'll never do it right. Uh. And then probably my favorite is distant anticipatory focus d a F. Yes. So Gerti's basically tries to drive like he doesn't have brakes. Oh yeah, okay, he maintains a very slow, steady pace. So he's looking several lights ahead right to uh to time his driving to that light. He's trying to accelerate slowly to to keep in time with these these lights because he wants nothing but green lights. That makes sense. He never has to use his brakes. That saves quite a bit too. Of course, this is the same guy who also turns off his ignition and coats into parking spaces. So yeah, but that's pretty much hyper miling. I mean there's actually a lot more to it, taking advantage of other cars, like using eighteen wheelers to draft off of Yeah, well that's a lot of the NASCAR guys hyper mile. They don't call it that. I don't know what they call it. Someone probably has that answer, but they Yeah, during um, the caution when they have like debris on the track and the pace cars there, Yeah, the little guy, I'll throw out the caution flag and that means everyone's got to slow down until they clean all the crowd off the track, and um, the A lot of the drivers will cut their engines and coast for a while and then cut them back on and then cut them again, and then while they're racing, they will draft. That's a very popular technique to save fuel because in NASCAR, if you the fewer stops the better. Sure, obviously, yeah you Nascar guy, No me neither. I watched it for a while. Remember, I really love the origin of NASCAR bootlegging. Other than that, I'm not really in the NASCAR. My sister in law, Sarah, who I was just with in Ohio, is big in the NASCAR, and we always give her hard time. Yeah, we call her a bead neck and stuff. Yeah, it's good. Well, um, anything about it? No, I mean really until until we come up with an alternative fuel source or you know standard hundred mile an hour or hundred miles per gallon uh cars. It's a good idea hyper mile yeah we should say, though, I think exercise some caution if you want to try this stuff out, because you know some cars, if you turn the key off, don't turn all the way off because you're steering. Roo whe will walk up. It's a good point. And I think sometimes the air brakes are activated when you start the car, right yeah, so I think you want to keep keep it set to ignition or start keep it set to the on position so you can still run your radio. No, so you still see lights on the dashboard, right yeah, So just just be careful if you want to try some experimentation here. You were really good at c O A buddy. Well, I could see somebody have any idea how many times we would have been suedere not for you? And just my mind's eye had just pictured someone saying Josh and Chuck said to cut my engine, and all of a sudden, like who is this Josh and Chuck, they go to pull into the car to the parking space and they're steering wheel lock sup and have a record six miles an hour. Well good, all right, that's hyper miling. And e p A. Well, we'll keep an eye out to see if the e p A actually does do any real world testing. Good idea. Let's se listener mail, I think so okay, nowhere to go, but up right, Josh, we are going to call this what was in my inbox before I came in listener mail. Awesome, that's a secret. Actually, I shouldn't ever revealed that the good way to get a listener mails to email me the day we record. It's not a secret anymore. This is about the Peter principal. Remember we did a podcast about the fact that many companies will not demote somebody, that will just fire somebody if they're incompetent. And this is from Jennifer and she says that she worked for the same company, has still working there for five or six years, and last November she was worked her way up to the top of sales support and she was kicked down to reception instead of fired. And she was told about her new job and said that she was getting the demotion because she was the weakest person on the team and a little harsh, I thought so. And she asked him during the meeting why didn't they just fire her? And they said because she was still a very important part of the teams. It's the worst part of the team. Exactly, very important part of our team, but the worst part. Don't forget that, uh. And she said that um, her pay didn't change, so she's actually a very high paid receptionist and um actually makes more than a lot of people on the sales team now at the reception desk, which I'll bet the sales team just loves. And we actually did have someone else emailed another company that said that they practiced this as well. Well, that's fantastic. Two out of several hundred thousand, Yeah, not too bad. And she also adds here at the end that we sometimes give shout outs to our men and women overseas for fighting and Iraq and Afghanistan and to support them. And she says that she's an Air Force wife and that we should mention families occasionally they're left behind because it's very hard on them, do it, Chuck. And my brother in law is in the Marine Corps and he has been deployed many times. My sister Michelle and her kids shall be in Reagan or often left at home for months at a time, and it is hard on the family. So when we say support the troops, we mean the whole family, the whole kid and can do it nicely, don't chuck, Thank you nicely. Good. That's it. Well, if you want to Mia Colpa out of chuck, you can email us at stuff podcast at how stuff works dot com for more on this and thousands of other topics. Is it how stuff works dot com. Want more how stuff works, check out our blogs on the house. Stuff works dot com home page. Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve Camray. It's ready, are you