Welcome to Stuff you missed in History Class, A production of iHeartRadio, Hello and Happy Friday. I'm Tracy B. Wilson and I'm Holly Friday. We spent the whole week talking about mourning, though we sure did. This is someone I had not heard of when I found this book at the book Barn. I'm laughing at my own foolishnists, but I'll explain in a moment. Okay, So this was a lovely little trip several years ago, day trip that I and two friends took out to the book barn. And for whatever reason, one of the friends has moved away since then, but we like, we haven't made another book Barn trip, and I periodically will be like book Barn, that's the thing that we should do. I came home with two books from that trip, and one was a book that I bought at the book barn, and the other was a book that won one of my friends was going to sell at the book barn but instead said maybe you would like this book, and I brought it home with me, and I am pretty sure the Morning Dove Autobiography is the one that I bought. Like the receipt is tucked in there but you know, it's been sitting on my desk for so long, waiting, waiting to be an episode. One reason it took this long is that it was clear it was going to be challenging, and it turned out to be a lot more challenging than I expected. Oh isn't that always fun? Yeah? Yeah, it. There were many many sources for the episode besides just the autobiography, and one of the reasons that I wanted to do this episode was like having somebody's own thoughts about their own life, which is especially important when we are talking about indigenous people living in the Americas with the history that we have here, and so sort of finding out what the editing process had been like and that there are some criticisms of that editing process kind of like shed a whole different light on the autobiography itself. It is a fascinating book, though this topic unlocked too fuzzy. Are these real memories for me? Okay? The first is the book barn uh huh, because I don't know. I couldn't find anything rapidly on how long they have been in business, but many moons ago I worked in acquisitions at a college library, and I swear we used to order from them, and if not, it was another vendor called book Barn that's in the Northeast. But I just remember unloading packages from them and cataloging them for the library. Yeah, so if it was them, hooray. The other thing was that I went to grades one, two, a little bit of four in the Pacific Northwest, and I think that my third grade teacher read us stuff from Coyote Stories. Totally possible. Yeah. When I was doing research for this, I found some lesson plans around Coyote Stories. Yeah. I mean this would have been the seventies, so yeah, yeah, it would have been the older version of it, like not a newly edited edition of it or anything, but that added context. But I just was like, oh wait, oh wait, missus Kempton. Yeah, and there are so many complexities with that book right like it was. I mean, I didn't perceive any of that at the age of so, and I'm sure I would not either. Yeah. I feel like so much of her work has all of these nuances to it, things that are simultaneously groundbreaking and things that you know to some extent in today's context, like today's context has some differences to roughly a century ago when the US was like actively pursuing federal policies meant to eliminate Indigenous culture. So the idea of somebody recording these stories to share them has a little bit different tone than today, when I'm not saying everything's perfect, but there has been more of a focus on like self determination Indigenous nations stressing with their own protocols are and how they do or do not want work to be shared. And that is why, like we did not get into in depth descriptions of the figure of coyote or what is in these books, like that doesn't belong to you and me. So that's that's that's why that we you know, we talked about her work with that without going into detail about it. So yeah, totally possible that that was in the nineteen seventy eight seventy nine school year. Anywhere goes Yeah. So a thing that I'm curious about that I was not able to find the answer with is whether she had any involvement at all with the basketball team, the girls' basketball team at Fort Shaw Indian School. So we did a two part podcast about the Fort Shaw Indian School girls basketball team. So a while back, she was there at the same time that some of that was happening, and she was working as a teacher's aid, which I think is how she had a little bit more freedom to come and go out of the school than students who were like full time students might have. But I do not know if she had any involvement like with the team beyond potentially being a teacher's aid for some of the some of the players. And I am curious and I do not know the answer. I also, as I was trying to find the original article, that nineteen sixteen article that we talked about in part one that was done as promotion for her forthcoming book when the book was more than a decade away, which they did not know obviously when they were trying to promote it. I had seen people like mentioning this article, and I was trying to find the actual article, and I wound up on a page of a different a different paper, which was the Spokane Chronicle, different newspaper. It had come up in a search result was not actually relevant to Mourning Dove. The words mourning and dove were on the page. It was not about the Mourning Dove who these episodes were about. But I was fascinated by the other headlines that were on the page that was not ultimately relevant to the episode because they were just in all capital letters for all of them. Part of human body found in stomach of huge shark. Yeah, I'm sorry, that's terrible tragedy, bombay clothes to missus, Annie Bessant, and epidemic shows slight decrease. And those were three to me, dramatic headlines connected to things we have talked about on the show, or past hosts have talked about on the show. Because that part of the human body being found in the stomach of the huge shark was about the nineteen sixteen Jersey Shore shark Tacks, which is an episode about We've talked about Annie Bessant in some of our I think the London match Girls strike was the one where we talked about Annie Bessant. If I am conflating two different labor stories, I'm sorry. And then the epidemic being described, I thought until I read the article might have been encephalitis lethargica. I think it was actually polio, though this was a time when there could be big polio outbreaks. So anyway, three very dramatic headlines connected to things we've covered on the show on this one page of newspaper. I'm really fascinated by Morning Doves story, and a lot of the writing about her, both academically and non dates back to about the nineteen nineties, like when this autobiography is being published, new edition of Coyote Stories coming out, that kind of stuff. There were papers that pointed out that so much of the literary criticism slash slash research on her work has really been about McWorter and mcworter's influence on it and not about the work itself. But it doesn't seem I'm like, it doesn't seem like that ever, like spurred a lot more research into the work itself, and I don't know if that will ever happen. Sometimes it seems like there are people that we talk about on the show where there's a wave of interest in them and a particular window of time, and then they just sort of fade back into the background again. Yeah, I think the thing that I find myself most fascinated by in this is just this sounds very broad and weird, and like I am very sleepier under the influence of something. I'm like language man. But my thing is that the idea of different languages and how people perceive non native speakers always is really interesting to me, Like, h particularly because I mean, I know a lot of English speakers who have made presumptions about the intellect of someone else who does not speak English as a first language because they speak in a way that sounds odd to a native English speaker, like they don't grasp the language, and it's like, no, No, their syntax that they grew up with puts this all in a different order. It's not that they are speaking like a simpleton. This is the natural way for their brain to order words. Yeah, And that's like, I feel like that has so many times throughout history been this weird barrier for people to recognize other people as intellectual equals. And I'm like, how many languages do you speak? Right, you would do the same thing in the opposite way if you were trying to talk to them in their native language. It's always a really interesting one to me. And then when you later on the idea that her syntax has also become outdated and antiquated compared to the way speakers of her language would speak today, Like, there's just a whole cool interesting ven diagram of examination to be done on the evolution of language for any culture. Yeah. Yeah, I think I said in the episode that some of the papers that I read that quoted from her letters, some of them it felt like they had edited the letter into like standard English, and some of them had not. And the ones that were not edited, you could really see sort of patterns in the things that she seemed to struggle with in English, which one hundred percent, like you were saying, suggests that like this stems from how she understood things in her native language trying to communicate them in a completely different language, not even not. I mean we a lot of times we'll talk about people on the show that spoke multiple languages, but it's like they spoke multiple romance languages, right, So multiple languages that already have a lot in common, and like we're talking like Salish languages have some really big differences from English. One of the things that one of the papers that was talking about sort of the development of these stories, like figuring out how to record an indigenous oral tradition story into like a print book, was talking about context where the gender of the speaker meant they would use different language because there was like different context there, and like that's not that's not really something that we encounter in English that way, Like the word for father is father. This is I'm made up example that I make up for illustration. Like the word for father is father in English. There's not a different word based on that, like the gender of the person who's speaking the word father. Again, that is an example that I'm sort of paraphrasing based on my memory of a paper that I read, not necessarily when it's like strictly accurate to the language. So yeah, there are a lot of efforts, like really concerted, concrete efforts to teach people a number of different Salish languages because like as we said at the beginning, like there are still people that speak these languages. There are still elders who are fluent in these languages and may have even grown up speaking them as their first language. They are critically endangered languages though, and so like there are a number of organizations and people putting like really strong effort into trying to pursue these languages and get more people fluent in them. So yeah, yeah, I think that's what I have to say about this week's episodes. That I apologize if anyone got to the end of part one not realizing it was a two parter because I forgot to say that. The good news is it will say part one. It will your app when you open it to listen. I'm not going to name any names, but there is a podcast that I listened to that drops surprise two parters and it doesn't say in the title of the episode, and so I will be like, really into what's happening, and then it's like next time, and I'm like, I would have I would have waited until both of them were available to listen to them both. So yes, it will very clearly say part one in part two in the title of the episode. Now, when I build this show page, I'm not going to include it just to be a jerk. Oh no, I'd be Friday. Whatever is happening on your weekend? You know. I hope it's really good and we will be back with a Saturday Classic tomorrow. We will have brand new episodes on Monday. Hope things are going well for everybody. Stuff you missed in History Class is a production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows,

Welcome to Stuff you missed in History Class, A production of iHeartRadio, Hello and Happy Friday. I'm Tracy B. Wilson and I'm Holly Friday. We spent the whole week talking about mourning, though we sure did. This is someone I had not heard of when I found this book at the book Barn. I'm laughing at my own foolishnists, but I'll explain in a moment. Okay, So this was a lovely little trip several years ago, day trip that I and two friends took out to the book barn. And for whatever reason, one of the friends has moved away since then, but we like, we haven't made another book Barn trip, and I periodically will be like book Barn, that's the thing that we should do. I came home with two books from that trip, and one was a book that I bought at the book barn, and the other was a book that won one of my friends was going to sell at the book barn but instead said maybe you would like this book, and I brought it home with me, and I am pretty sure the Morning Dove Autobiography is the one that I bought. Like the receipt is tucked in there but you know, it's been sitting on my desk for so long, waiting, waiting to be an episode. One reason it took this long is that it was clear it was going to be challenging, and it turned out to be a lot more challenging than I expected. Oh isn't that always fun? Yeah? Yeah, it. There were many many sources for the episode besides just the autobiography, and one of the reasons that I wanted to do this episode was like having somebody's own thoughts about their own life, which is especially important when we are talking about indigenous people living in the Americas with the history that we have here, and so sort of finding out what the editing process had been like and that there are some criticisms of that editing process kind of like shed a whole different light on the autobiography itself. It is a fascinating book, though this topic unlocked too fuzzy. Are these real memories for me? Okay? The first is the book barn uh huh, because I don't know. I couldn't find anything rapidly on how long they have been in business, but many moons ago I worked in acquisitions at a college library, and I swear we used to order from them, and if not, it was another vendor called book Barn that's in the Northeast. But I just remember unloading packages from them and cataloging them for the library. Yeah, so if it was them, hooray. The other thing was that I went to grades one, two, a little bit of four in the Pacific Northwest, and I think that my third grade teacher read us stuff from Coyote Stories. Totally possible. Yeah. When I was doing research for this, I found some lesson plans around Coyote Stories. Yeah. I mean this would have been the seventies, so yeah, yeah, it would have been the older version of it, like not a newly edited edition of it or anything, but that added context. But I just was like, oh wait, oh wait, missus Kempton. Yeah, and there are so many complexities with that book right like it was. I mean, I didn't perceive any of that at the age of so, and I'm sure I would not either. Yeah. I feel like so much of her work has all of these nuances to it, things that are simultaneously groundbreaking and things that you know to some extent in today's context, like today's context has some differences to roughly a century ago when the US was like actively pursuing federal policies meant to eliminate Indigenous culture. So the idea of somebody recording these stories to share them has a little bit different tone than today, when I'm not saying everything's perfect, but there has been more of a focus on like self determination Indigenous nations stressing with their own protocols are and how they do or do not want work to be shared. And that is why, like we did not get into in depth descriptions of the figure of coyote or what is in these books, like that doesn't belong to you and me. So that's that's that's why that we you know, we talked about her work with that without going into detail about it. So yeah, totally possible that that was in the nineteen seventy eight seventy nine school year. Anywhere goes Yeah. So a thing that I'm curious about that I was not able to find the answer with is whether she had any involvement at all with the basketball team, the girls' basketball team at Fort Shaw Indian School. So we did a two part podcast about the Fort Shaw Indian School girls basketball team. So a while back, she was there at the same time that some of that was happening, and she was working as a teacher's aid, which I think is how she had a little bit more freedom to come and go out of the school than students who were like full time students might have. But I do not know if she had any involvement like with the team beyond potentially being a teacher's aid for some of the some of the players. And I am curious and I do not know the answer. I also, as I was trying to find the original article, that nineteen sixteen article that we talked about in part one that was done as promotion for her forthcoming book when the book was more than a decade away, which they did not know obviously when they were trying to promote it. I had seen people like mentioning this article, and I was trying to find the actual article, and I wound up on a page of a different a different paper, which was the Spokane Chronicle, different newspaper. It had come up in a search result was not actually relevant to Mourning Dove. The words mourning and dove were on the page. It was not about the Mourning Dove who these episodes were about. But I was fascinated by the other headlines that were on the page that was not ultimately relevant to the episode because they were just in all capital letters for all of them. Part of human body found in stomach of huge shark. Yeah, I'm sorry, that's terrible tragedy, bombay clothes to missus, Annie Bessant, and epidemic shows slight decrease. And those were three to me, dramatic headlines connected to things we have talked about on the show, or past hosts have talked about on the show. Because that part of the human body being found in the stomach of the huge shark was about the nineteen sixteen Jersey Shore shark Tacks, which is an episode about We've talked about Annie Bessant in some of our I think the London match Girls strike was the one where we talked about Annie Bessant. If I am conflating two different labor stories, I'm sorry. And then the epidemic being described, I thought until I read the article might have been encephalitis lethargica. I think it was actually polio, though this was a time when there could be big polio outbreaks. So anyway, three very dramatic headlines connected to things we've covered on the show on this one page of newspaper. I'm really fascinated by Morning Doves story, and a lot of the writing about her, both academically and non dates back to about the nineteen nineties, like when this autobiography is being published, new edition of Coyote Stories coming out, that kind of stuff. There were papers that pointed out that so much of the literary criticism slash slash research on her work has really been about McWorter and mcworter's influence on it and not about the work itself. But it doesn't seem I'm like, it doesn't seem like that ever, like spurred a lot more research into the work itself, and I don't know if that will ever happen. Sometimes it seems like there are people that we talk about on the show where there's a wave of interest in them and a particular window of time, and then they just sort of fade back into the background again. Yeah, I think the thing that I find myself most fascinated by in this is just this sounds very broad and weird, and like I am very sleepier under the influence of something. I'm like language man. But my thing is that the idea of different languages and how people perceive non native speakers always is really interesting to me, Like, h particularly because I mean, I know a lot of English speakers who have made presumptions about the intellect of someone else who does not speak English as a first language because they speak in a way that sounds odd to a native English speaker, like they don't grasp the language, and it's like, no, No, their syntax that they grew up with puts this all in a different order. It's not that they are speaking like a simpleton. This is the natural way for their brain to order words. Yeah, And that's like, I feel like that has so many times throughout history been this weird barrier for people to recognize other people as intellectual equals. And I'm like, how many languages do you speak? Right, you would do the same thing in the opposite way if you were trying to talk to them in their native language. It's always a really interesting one to me. And then when you later on the idea that her syntax has also become outdated and antiquated compared to the way speakers of her language would speak today, Like, there's just a whole cool interesting ven diagram of examination to be done on the evolution of language for any culture. Yeah. Yeah, I think I said in the episode that some of the papers that I read that quoted from her letters, some of them it felt like they had edited the letter into like standard English, and some of them had not. And the ones that were not edited, you could really see sort of patterns in the things that she seemed to struggle with in English, which one hundred percent, like you were saying, suggests that like this stems from how she understood things in her native language trying to communicate them in a completely different language, not even not. I mean we a lot of times we'll talk about people on the show that spoke multiple languages, but it's like they spoke multiple romance languages, right, So multiple languages that already have a lot in common, and like we're talking like Salish languages have some really big differences from English. One of the things that one of the papers that was talking about sort of the development of these stories, like figuring out how to record an indigenous oral tradition story into like a print book, was talking about context where the gender of the speaker meant they would use different language because there was like different context there, and like that's not that's not really something that we encounter in English that way, Like the word for father is father. This is I'm made up example that I make up for illustration. Like the word for father is father in English. There's not a different word based on that, like the gender of the person who's speaking the word father. Again, that is an example that I'm sort of paraphrasing based on my memory of a paper that I read, not necessarily when it's like strictly accurate to the language. So yeah, there are a lot of efforts, like really concerted, concrete efforts to teach people a number of different Salish languages because like as we said at the beginning, like there are still people that speak these languages. There are still elders who are fluent in these languages and may have even grown up speaking them as their first language. They are critically endangered languages though, and so like there are a number of organizations and people putting like really strong effort into trying to pursue these languages and get more people fluent in them. So yeah, yeah, I think that's what I have to say about this week's episodes. That I apologize if anyone got to the end of part one not realizing it was a two parter because I forgot to say that. The good news is it will say part one. It will your app when you open it to listen. I'm not going to name any names, but there is a podcast that I listened to that drops surprise two parters and it doesn't say in the title of the episode, and so I will be like, really into what's happening, and then it's like next time, and I'm like, I would have I would have waited until both of them were available to listen to them both. So yes, it will very clearly say part one in part two in the title of the episode. Now, when I build this show page, I'm not going to include it just to be a jerk. Oh no, I'd be Friday. Whatever is happening on your weekend? You know. I hope it's really good and we will be back with a Saturday Classic tomorrow. We will have brand new episodes on Monday. Hope things are going well for everybody. Stuff you missed in History Class is a production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows,