From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or learn the stuff they don't want you to know. M Hello, welcome back to the show. My name is Matt, my name is noted. They call me Ben. We are joined as always with our super producer Paul Mission controlled decade. Most importantly, you are you. You are here that makes this stuff they don't want you to know. And luckily for us, um this is a little bit of a more when we say lighthearted episode because after we recorded some fairly dark stuff recently, some murder investigations, cult expose's, we we decided that we would take a break. But answer still a a real question, what the is up with Florida? There you go, that's the question. Why does it seem like all at least most of the strangest things in the United States occur in Florida. It's strange. And this is not in any way a hit piece on Florida, on America's most famous peninsula and panhandle. But it's true that here in the US, some parts of this country are more famous, we're infamous than others. And we add originally what the is up with Florida as just a working title and in joke with us. But I think now we could just make it official, right, Yeah, but poor Paul's got to bleep it every time we say this is a family show. Well, we're only too deep so far, so hopefully we'll be all right. But you know, for another example, New York and California are probably the best known states on the international sphere, even if people only know them for a particular city like Los Angeles or New York City, or an industry like Hollywood or the Mob. And Florida, located in the far southeast of the US, occupies this very unique space in Zeitgeis. It's an international destination, home to Disney World, wealth of other amusement parks. I can say some of the best times in my life have actually been in Florida. Really do tell Yeah, Okay, My my grandparents lived in Clearwater, and I used to have just a heck of a time hanging out in their retirement community down there because they had a pool. It was wonderful. It was just grand times. Until I realized isn' there a scientology center there? Until I realized that Clearwater was under assault by scientology. They were literally buying up land. I think a quarter of a quarter of a billion dollars worth of land that they owned up. How did you experience this as a as a youth, Well, all I remember is that there was always construction on all of the highways every time I went down there, from a too little boy up until I was in my mid twenties. And you couldn't get into the pool until you did the e meter thing. You're carrying around too many thetan's, yeah, your thetans were wild man. It's it's true. There's a lot that's a good segue too. There's a lot of strange stuff that happens in Florida. It truly is an international destination. Millions of tourists flocked to Florida each year to maybe visit family, to see the attractions and the beaches. In seventeen, the most recent estimate available, we found an estimated one hundred and sixteen point five million people traveled just to Florida to hang out and last year. And that sounds like a just an abstract large number, but for comparison, we've got what over three hundred million people living in the US now, so that's more than a third of the US population, and just in terms of raw numbers, if yeah, if they're all from the United States, they're not. But you know, there's still a huge chunk of people in Florida. Yeah, but these people are just popping in for a Disney v K or a little universal studio situation, staying at the many palatial resorts and hotels that there are there. But what of the people that just are there all the time? Ah, Yes, you're talking about the residents and the many of whom have retired to Florida from some other another state, New Jersey being the popular stereotype, like Maddie's father in law. Yeah, and yes, kind of Jersey and Jersey and he's from me. It was from New Joys. He's from elsewhere than Florida, though Jersey height so here in the US. Residents of other states have some, let's just call them what they are, stereotypes about Florida. And it's not completely unfounded or unreasonable for people to have these stereotypes. Even those stereotypes are usually pretty destructive thing. Often when you hear about Florida in the national news, it's associated with a tense political struggle and natural disaster, or oddly enough, a strange story about an individual in Florida committing some sort of ridiculous crime. Here's our first list of examples. Florida man attacks a t M with hatchet after it refuses to take his check. Or Florida man denies drinking and driving, says he only swigged bourbon at stop signs. Or Florida man claims wife was kidnapped by holograms. Or Florida man steps tourists despite having no arms. Or drunk Florida man. That's a nice modifier because it's usually just implied drunk Florida man attempts to ride bike through Taco bell drive through Comma, fights with police, and his mug shot he's just making a big old frowny face and has like a bruise in the middle of his forehead and kind of like Joker asked green hair. He's wearing the orange jumpsuit. And just to reiterate, no Florida bashing here. This is a trope that is worth exploring, and we we have to give these examples too. Yeah, Florida man launches chair at mailman because he had no mail for him. It was a tense day. Uh, And you can read more and more of these examples. Spoiler alert will probably have some more to pop up. But this is the kind of news that people in other states see when they hear a story of the media about Florida. And since so many people living in other states here about these stories on a semi frequent basis, it's understandable and completely not commendable that many people would form this prejudiced opinion of the Sunshine State. And that brings us to today's question, Is there really more strange crime in Florida? How does it stack up to other states? What exactly gave this state such a weird reputation? Is there something going on in Florida that they don't want us to know? Uh? Yet? Oddly enough, it's it's complicated. We get to a question at the end there, But I guess we should start with the facts. Where did Florida come from? So? Homo sapiens have been occupying the land mass what is Florida for at least twelve thousand years, and written records of this area started as far back as fifteen thirteen, when the Spanish explore Juan Ponce de lay On namesake. We know very well here in Atlanta. It's actually the street that we're on. Um arrived and when he arrived, there were no other humans living there. That's not true. That's just when the like we said, that's when records begin. Ye, well, did pons to lay On consider the inhabitants of Florida to be human? I mean, he is a Spanish explorer at that time, he was a conquistador, right, it's correct. Uh. Fast forward to eighteen forty five, nice day, March three, Florida becomes the US state and during the Civil War, unlike a lot of states in the South, it didn't suffer this massive amount of catastrophic destruction. You know, it didn't burn the way Atlanta burned. There weren't a lot of huge pivotal battles, although there are some, of course they're historically significant, it's not They didn't have a Gettysburg moment. You know. The Union controlled coastal towns of forts. The interior was controlled by Confederates. Somehow, they all, you know, managed to avoid the complete devastation that happened in other states. So let's get into the geography of good old Florida. It's mostly known for its Peninsulava thing that juts out down there heading towards the Caribbean, but the state actually contains several different distinct ecosystems and also cultures. There was all there was a whole article that was put out about the different the five what is it five to ten states that exist within Florida, which is not real, but it's kind of just groupings of people who have moved to the state. But the land is divided into four main regions. You've got the Gulf Coast, that's where the Atlantic Ocean kind of goes up in there into the into the peninsula. You've got the coastal plains, the upland that's the hilly area towards the north and northwest, getting up towards our own Georgia. And then you've got the swampy Everglades that's in the far south and in the Florida Keys. That's where it's very difficult to get buildings to stay into work right and not flood and it's a popular destination for hiding bodies and gators love it. In terms of human population density, at least Florida has a surface area of about one hundred seventy thousand li all over square kilometers almost sixty six thousand square miles. Based on the estimates, that works out to about three hundred and fifty three point four people per square mile or one thirty six point four per square kilometer, and this makes Florida the most densely populated state in the Union. It's also surprisingly this surprised me. It's also the third most populous state. The only bigger ones are California in Texas. That is very surprising in my opinion, especially because of all of that land that's out there, especially in the Everglades and some of those areas where you just look out if you're driving on I think it is you just see nothing for miles and miles and miles, and it gets to be fair, we would have to point out that that average could be misleading because a ton of people will live in the urban areas in the Miami Dade metropolis or in Orlando, you know. So our current estimate for the population in is twenty one point three one million people, and that is based off an estimate carried out in twenty fifteen by the Census Bureau, and the growth rate was one of the fastest in the country. It was number four out of all the other states. So if we think about this, that means most people outside of the American South picture Florida to be way less crowded than it is, and the opposite is the case. It is incredibly crowded, incredibly dense, and most importantly, incredibly diverse. That's right. Florida is a is a pretty unusual mix of cultures, of transplants, like we're talking about the top of the show from other states and other countries. So it's pretty hard to find a central, defining characteristic of the state's culture like as a whole. But that's kind of what makes it interesting too. I mean there's like, you know, there's an incredible art scene, like in Miami, for example, with like I think it's called art Basil. Does that you pronounced it or basal. That's what's going on right now. It's a big art conference where artists from all over the world convene in Miami, and there's that aspect of it. There's an incredible you know, Latin American population in Cuban population and different kinds of food and music and just about you know, anything you can imagine it's very, very, very diverse. Miami an entire metropolis built on cocaine. I read some uh, I read some really strange thing about Miami. When researching this, someone said the this neatest thing about Miami was how close it is to America. It took me a second. I couldn't figure out where they were going because I'm not myself too familiar with Miami. I haven't been there since I was a child. I would imagine you guys are more familiar with it. Yeah, I've been there numerous times with my in laws. They love it. I love it. I love hanging out there with them. And again, the food and the culture are definitely one of the biggest drawing points I think to that city. For some reason, when I was a child a long long time ago, I thought everybody in Miami was tall. And I think it's just because when I went there, I was, you know, maybe two and a half to three ft high, So I just thought it was a land of giants. I have no is that true or people taller in Miami? They are. Yeah, it's rough. It's anywhere between three to seven inches. You're gonna get as soon as you arrive to Miami um and that increases over time, like whether or not you actually are living in like certain counties within the city. That makes sense. It's like I always thought. I always thought when people say they're big in Japan, I thought it was some sort of like metaphor comparison. But you know, I uh, from what I hear, when you go, you do turn into a giant. It does. Okay, that's obviously completely false the thing we're joking about. But I do wonder if there's something to driving through that flat land that is Florida for so long then you finally arrive at this huge city that has giant, towering buildings. I wonder if there's some kind of perception thing that can occur there where things feel bigger. The Florida effect. Yeah, oh yeah, yeah, that's a thing I just made up. I think the Florida effect is an excellent name. What what do you think it describes? Well? Is it what Matt articulated? It could be part of it. It could be this whole ball of Florida wax that we're talking about today, and included in that ball of Florida wax is the kind of the elephant in the room or the mouse in the tower. Right, How does Florida's stack up when it comes to crime, especially since we read so much about crime in these news stories they constantly come out. We'll tell you after a word from our sponsor. Well, no matter what you've heard, this is important. Despite all those crazy news stories you heard, and even the one that you didn't hear me say about the guy who buried a dude in concrete to steal his magic the gathering collection, which was valued at over a hundred thousand dollars. By the way, Florida is by no means the most violent state within our great Union. Well, the beauty two of these stories, they're not violent. They're always kind of crazy. Yeah, yeah, yeah. The car thief, for instance, who stole a vehicle, saw there was a baby in it and then like turned around to safely drop the baby off with someone, and then stole the car. I feel like that's oddly and deary. Yeah, agreed. Or even the guy who was at McDonald's who was masturbating in the parking lot and he claimed that his privacy, his privacy was being invaded. Yeah, he also said he lived in his car. I believe despite all these stories here, Florida is, as you said, Matt, not the most violent state. Depending on the study read the most violent state will um often be cited as Louisiana, with Vermont being side as one of the safest. But there's still crime in Florida. Florida is usually depending on how it's measured, it usually ranks fifth in terms of crime, five forty one violent crimes reported per one hundred thousand people. That's a lot, right, And also it ranks number five in terms of robbery, aggravated assault, and property crime. But while it may not have the most crime out of any state, it genuinely does seem to have some of the weirdest crime. You know what, can we just stop and do some more examples? He's pretty yeah, all right, what do we got? I have a good one. Let's see. Florida man caught with stolen power polls strapped suv in wake of Hurricane Irma. That's weird, I don't understand. Florida man disguises himself in bull costume as he tries to burn down former lover's house with pasta sauce. Florida man attempts to smoke crack in an icy u almost burns down hospital. Florida man high on math climbs onto stranger's roof to howl. Florida man arrested in local park for practicing karate on swans. Florida man sets apartment complex on fire after manager told him to stop masturbating in front of windows. You are yours are very mass Yeah, I feel like I feel like you found a theme. Florida man rex liquor shop blames caterpillar from Alice in Wonderland. He said that a hookah smoking caterpillar told him to do it, So it's really more referencing movie the song White Rabbit by Jefferson Airplane. There, that's a good point he needed to work on. It was probably on acid, he might have been. There's one. There's one I found that I can't remember the circumstances behind, but we can just describe it in the headline. There was a guy who was found on the roof of some store and he was covered with tar, and people asked him what he was doing up there, and originally he said that he was lost and from out of town, and then he said he was an A C technician, and he noticed the A C was malfunctioning, so he decided to do the neighborly thing and fix it. I think he just did drugs and ended up on the roof of a building and got covered in tar somehow, and I hope he's okay. So these headlines are like solid gold. If you have a slow newsday, right, these will get your clicks for sure. So what gives you know? Is this unfair stereotype? Is there something in the water? Why do people seem to participate in so many crazy shenanigans in America's most infamous peninsula. It turns out we have an answer. Here's where it gets crazy. Yeah. So it turns out that this law really is somewhat to blame for this phenomenon. Every American state has some kind of sunshine law, and that's a term for legislation regulations or constitutional amendments that guarantee public access to government affairs, like sort of an open book policy, right, um? Or how open is your book? Exactly? How open is your book? Is it a reading rainbow or is it more of a I don't know, Ben, You're better at this than me. Ma. There you go, nice, very very well done, mat Um. Yeah. So, but while these laws require most government meetings to be open door and most documents to be open book, um allowing public scrutiny. Many of them are a little bit limited, right or redacted or have some kind of conditions on them to where not every single one is going to be fully available in all of its form. Yeah, So theoretically, in a given state you have you might have something similar to this Transparency Act or Freedom of Information Act kind of thing, so you can technically get access to police records, but actually getting them in practice can take a long time, or you can get shut down by red tape. But in Florida, on the other hand, there is a deep, deep, deep, centuries long dedication to hardcore transparency norms. It starts way back in nineteen o nine chapter of the Florida Statutes, the Public Records Law, and it kept being strengthened in following years. In nineteen sixty seven they passed the government in the Sunshine Law popularly known as as the Sunshine Law now, and then they continued to strengthen it after that. So this law has been kind of untouchable regardless of who is in office, and it's pretty extreme if you are a public official. Every meeting aside from a few exemptions, has to be an open meeting, which is why, like politicians will get married and they'll have to have a journalist at their wedding. That happened at least once and today. The Sunshine law regarding open government can be found in Chapter two eighty six of the Florida Statutes. If you're looking for some really juicy reading. Uh, they established this basic right of access to most meetings of boards, commissions, other governing bodies of state and local government agencies or authorities. And this means that it is incredibly easy to learn about the inner workings of this state's government, especially arrest records. Yeah, and that's a big deal because if you're a journalist and you're looking for a story just to include or to you know, have as a part of your paper or your podcast or whatever, having access or at least easier access to some of these arrest records and stories going through the courts or whoever is being charged with what right now actively that gives you this huge wealth of just stuff to write about. I mean, that's a big that's a big deal to me, at least like the Blotterer stories, you know. Yeah, no, it's true. And at the same time, like I've been to Florida, I've hung out in Florida, and Florida has a really interesting dichotomy where like we're talking about that diversity that it has that extends to like, you know, how there's certain parts of Georgia that kind of have reputation for like a certain type of individual that might be a little more prone to drunken behavior or unhinged things, you know, or myth or meth there you go, or you know, just too much drinking too. You know that Florida has that too, and it so has the big cities it has. It's very diverse in that way. Um, And I think that and the fact that you've got these open book policies where they have better access to it. It doesn't necessarily mean there are more crimes that are nuts, but it certainly has no shortage of bonkers crimes. But you know what, neither is Georgia. We just don't get access to the information as readily as they do in Florida, apparently, right. Yeah, and there's one of the dead giveaways you'll notice. So the same well intentioned laws that passed are the same reason that a Florida residents mug shot might appear online merely days after those arrests. Make it incredibly easy to write about these stories. And here's the red flag you'll see if you're reading a weird Florida or Florida man's story, it will almost always include the phrase according to the arrest report or something like that. And there's a journalist named Kyle Munsen reader who wrote a great look at this for the Miami Herald. He put it this way. As journalist, he said, all we have to do in most cases is called the police department and asked for the arrest report, and the cops are required to give it to us. Nowadays, a lot of cops just email the reports and some of them will post arrest records online of their own volition. Uh, some of the more dedicated Florida news reporters go through batches and batches of these reports at a time. And he said, you know, you, once you have the report, you pretty much have everything you need to write a story. You just have to be mindful that it's the police officers version of events. And Kyle had a good example about this, which I thought was hilarious. He says, say a journalist somewhere gets a tip that a man in a dog costume was caught making love to a Hello Kitty doll in a mall bathroom here in Florida. We would just call the police and say something like heard there was an arrest at the mall yesterday, Can we get the report? And I would put I would add a little wink wink in there right for journalists and a lot of their states, Again, it's not that easy. They might not be able to get the report at all, or they might have to wait for a certain amount of time before police release it. Georgia does have a thing called the jail report that you can get like a gas stations, and they're very, very picky. You're not allowed to pick them up or read them unless you buy them, because otherwise, you know, what's the point. So yeah, they typically only they'll have mug shots and um, the actual thing the person was arrested for, but not usually the juicy details like what would be in the arrest report. So that must be directly because of the differences in the sunshine laws. I think that's a good point, and there's there's something else here about the sunshine law that's pretty interesting. Florida, like some other unnamed U. S States, is home to a lot of corruption. And just have to look back at our earlier episode on the uh founding of Disney World to see the way that Disney essentially became its own local government. Right. Scientology famous for having its fingers in a lot of political pies. So maybe this open governance law is so extreme because they want to have some sort of oversight on those strange, murky connections between so called private entities and then governments that have been infiltrated or compromised, which I know sounds so very cold war, but again, just listen to the Disney episode because that's what happened. Yeah. Absolutely, I have to say it was weird going to Disney after doing that episode. Oh yeah, all I was thinking about how this land was acquired, what the town was actually like, where I truly was rather than just being near Kissing Me or something, the Ready Creek Improvement District. Yeah, but still Disney World's great man. I have fun memories of it, the whole thing. So, as you said earlier, Nold, a lot of states have something like this law, but most are nowhere near on the level of Florida's so be very careful. Now that we've walked through that, we can address this question. Is Florida any worse than other states? Or is it just easier for the public to know about crimes and bizarre events? Will answer that after a word from our sponsor, we're back. Well, I think we're gonna have to give this one the old patented partially true. Can we get a sound effect? Who patent did that? It's somewhat yes, snos. I think it was probably snokes. Yeah, they can't own the phrase partially true? Who knows partially on it? Perhaps what we have to go with something way less, way less sexy, like somewhat accurate. There you go, that's a glass half full situation. Oh yeah, it's true. Looks like we're gonna go with our patented somewhat accurate and one gun shot Yeah, like a like a racing start pistol. Yeah, that's good. That's not scary guns. That's a compromise. Yeah. Of Florida's open governance laws do make it very very easy to report the weirdest to rest on record. Uh. And the fact remains that there is a higher than average crime rate in Florida. It's a combination of wildly different cultures, so stranger things are bound to occur, things that might not occur in a place that is less crowded or has different reporting rules. It feels like there is a little bit more of possibly a free spirit and like kind of a stick it to the man kind of attitude, possibly when people live by the water. Uh and and they're not absurdly bougie rich people. I see what you're saying. Yeah, more self reliance, self reliant, the kind of beach bum life's for me kind of attitude, you know, and then maybe that applies inland with sort of a country can survive vibe. All so true. Again, I think it all goes back to the diversity we're talking about, and that is a diversity of culture and of socio economic stratum. Yeah. Yeah, there's a lot of inequality in the state as well. And this situation, all these factors combined to create a feedback loop because once journalists from around the country learned how easy it was to fill a void in the news cycle with a charming, hilarious, often schadenfreud rife anecdote about Florida, it became an easy go to move. That doesn't mean that insane things don't happen in Idaho. That doesn't mean that parts of Atlanta are entirely bonkers and and you know, weakly weekly escapades of pandemonium don't occur. It just means that it's way easier to tell the Florida versions of those stories. What do you call that, like an echo chamber situation? Right? Yeah, here's a question, then, Ben, what does it take in a state with tighter sunshine laws to nerate a headline like that, Like it has to be just like out in the public eye where it's witnessed by a lot of people, and then you know, it's not exclusively reported on based on arrest reports. It was such a giant debacle that people saw it and journalists actually have to interview people at the scene. Yeah, I was gonna say, as you as you find more details with any of these that we late that we ran off earlier, there's probably even more context to a lot of this, and it might even make a little more sense than it seems just with the headline and with the basic description. After more, you know, a better picture of it emerges. Yeah, and these people haven't had their day in court. Yet either when a lot of stuff is reported, it's just the arrest, Like as reported by a local news station, a Florida man was rescued from a vending machine. Authorities would not comment on the circumstances of how the man became stuck in the vending machine or how they rescued him. There was no word on the extent of his injuries. Action News called the business where the incident happened. A person Alpha Packaging, picked up the phone and hung up without providing additional information. So there's a lot of context missing, and that one, you know, And that's that's a really good point you make, Matt. There's a wealth of very important context which usually cut out because we just want to read these i'll say, amazing headlines. I was about to say, before you accuse us of only doing this episode because we wanted to rattle off some of these headlines, I'm here to tell you that's probably exactly why we did it. I I love it. Yeah, I went in this hoping for headlines, and we want to hear some of your favorite Florida headlines. Also, if you were from Florida, we want to hear your opinion on the sunshine law. Is it overall a good thing? With this one unintended consequence? You know, we have solved the mystery. Florida does get an unfair wrap, and it gets it largely due to this legislation. What about people who don't live in Florida? Do you want your state, local community, or your country to enact a similar law? Why? Or why not? I mean a lot of a lot of countries have the draconian opposite of this, like in Belarus and a lot of Eurasian countries. You're not really allowed to even talk about the government. M I don't want that. So is there a Goldilocks zone? Is this too far? There must be I don't know. I kind of like this full transparency thing. I mean, how honestly, if we didn't have it, how what I ever learned about the Florida man that stole thirty six thousand pounds of Crisco? And what's he gonna do with all that Crisco? I think I know that sex stuff. You're not connected to the Crisco underground anymore. I thought it was a food product, like you cook with it. Well, yeah, but I mean it's also you know, pure Greece maybe though I know no, no alligator wrestling. Ah yeah, I don't know. I love those sorts of heist because remember that story in Canada about the huge maple syrup heist that happened a while. I still wonder, how do you fence that who has a Crisco guy who only moves weight, who has a maple syrup connection, who doesn't mess with anything under a hundred gallons of syrup? You know what I'm saying. You you fence it directly to the underground alligator wrestling community and they then no one else ever sees it. Doesn't have to enter into circulation. They just keep it and they use it until they run out. So this guy is like the Kaiser associate of Crisco. I am officially I am officially banning myself from comparing people to Kaiser. So say, I've been doing it for the past several episodes because like that, they're gone. Yes exactly, it's a great comparison to anyone. Uh well, I figured it out, guys. He was taking the Crisco. He was gonna go fence it at his buddy. He was his buddy. Unfortunately, though, was caught with a meth and active meth lab in his pants. The guy the and they called it a one pot meth lab. That's true, that's true. Yes, like you can cook yourself one rock of meth. I don't know the I don't know the output of Chris Guild, but they have. Yeah, this guy had apparently some baggy pants and a mcgever like traveling meth lab from Springs. And this, I mean, we can laugh at this. We're not making fun of these people's lives. We are trying to point out the important, uh and little known mechanism that's responsible for this uh frankly unfair stereotype. We also, you know, as we said at the top, after our last few episodes, we wanted to do something a little more lighthearted. But there is one last crucial note we have to make here as we record this, some parts of Florida are still devastated by Hurricane Michael. And you might not hear about this, uh in between all this the funny stories of someone you know dressing up in a weird costume or someone getting stuck in a vending machine. But there are still tensities in areas of Florida where hundreds of people are currently living and they are. Many of them are due to be disbanded, leaving the hurricane survivors with nowhere to go. So if you would like to donate to help Florida rebuild, or for that matter, help any number of communities that have been suffering from the short and long term effects of these kinds of natural disasters, such as California with the fires, Puerto Rico. UM, you can visit charity navigator dot org and search for your cause of choice. Yeah, it's pretty neat. You'll see the various charities and nonprofit organizations divided up by their areas of expertise, along with more information about each one, so check it out. As we may have said on the show before, it's always important to remember that these sorts of stories don't stop just because the reporters stop report doing it. They continue on. I couldn't agree more guys, all right, So if you want to write to us with anything crazy floor of stories, we'll read them. We've been, you know, as tragic as the things are that we just discussed, we've been cracking up this whole episode just reading the headlines and exploring the strangeness that humanity has to offer. And if you have any strangeness of humanity or otherwise send it our way. You can find us on Twitter or Facebook where where we're Conspiracy Stuff. Instagram we are Conspiracy Stuff Show. If you don't want to do any of that stuff, check out our Facebook group which is Here's where it gets crazy. You can get on there and discuss all of these things and all the other topics that we've ever covered and things we haven't covered, with all of our fellow conspiracy realists over there, wonderful human beings. And if you don't want to do any of that, you can call us. We are one eight three three st d w y t K. Leave a message you might get on the air. 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From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or learn the stuff they don't want you to know. M Hello, welcome back to the show. My name is Matt, my name is noted. They call me Ben. We are joined as always with our super producer Paul Mission controlled decade. Most importantly, you are you. You are here that makes this stuff they don't want you to know. And luckily for us, um this is a little bit of a more when we say lighthearted episode because after we recorded some fairly dark stuff recently, some murder investigations, cult expose's, we we decided that we would take a break. But answer still a a real question, what the is up with Florida? There you go, that's the question. Why does it seem like all at least most of the strangest things in the United States occur in Florida. It's strange. And this is not in any way a hit piece on Florida, on America's most famous peninsula and panhandle. But it's true that here in the US, some parts of this country are more famous, we're infamous than others. And we add originally what the is up with Florida as just a working title and in joke with us. But I think now we could just make it official, right, Yeah, but poor Paul's got to bleep it every time we say this is a family show. Well, we're only too deep so far, so hopefully we'll be all right. But you know, for another example, New York and California are probably the best known states on the international sphere, even if people only know them for a particular city like Los Angeles or New York City, or an industry like Hollywood or the Mob. And Florida, located in the far southeast of the US, occupies this very unique space in Zeitgeis. It's an international destination, home to Disney World, wealth of other amusement parks. I can say some of the best times in my life have actually been in Florida. Really do tell Yeah, Okay, My my grandparents lived in Clearwater, and I used to have just a heck of a time hanging out in their retirement community down there because they had a pool. It was wonderful. It was just grand times. Until I realized isn' there a scientology center there? Until I realized that Clearwater was under assault by scientology. They were literally buying up land. I think a quarter of a quarter of a billion dollars worth of land that they owned up. How did you experience this as a as a youth, Well, all I remember is that there was always construction on all of the highways every time I went down there, from a too little boy up until I was in my mid twenties. And you couldn't get into the pool until you did the e meter thing. You're carrying around too many thetan's, yeah, your thetans were wild man. It's it's true. There's a lot that's a good segue too. There's a lot of strange stuff that happens in Florida. It truly is an international destination. Millions of tourists flocked to Florida each year to maybe visit family, to see the attractions and the beaches. In seventeen, the most recent estimate available, we found an estimated one hundred and sixteen point five million people traveled just to Florida to hang out and last year. And that sounds like a just an abstract large number, but for comparison, we've got what over three hundred million people living in the US now, so that's more than a third of the US population, and just in terms of raw numbers, if yeah, if they're all from the United States, they're not. But you know, there's still a huge chunk of people in Florida. Yeah, but these people are just popping in for a Disney v K or a little universal studio situation, staying at the many palatial resorts and hotels that there are there. But what of the people that just are there all the time? Ah, Yes, you're talking about the residents and the many of whom have retired to Florida from some other another state, New Jersey being the popular stereotype, like Maddie's father in law. Yeah, and yes, kind of Jersey and Jersey and he's from me. It was from New Joys. He's from elsewhere than Florida, though Jersey height so here in the US. Residents of other states have some, let's just call them what they are, stereotypes about Florida. And it's not completely unfounded or unreasonable for people to have these stereotypes. Even those stereotypes are usually pretty destructive thing. Often when you hear about Florida in the national news, it's associated with a tense political struggle and natural disaster, or oddly enough, a strange story about an individual in Florida committing some sort of ridiculous crime. Here's our first list of examples. Florida man attacks a t M with hatchet after it refuses to take his check. Or Florida man denies drinking and driving, says he only swigged bourbon at stop signs. Or Florida man claims wife was kidnapped by holograms. Or Florida man steps tourists despite having no arms. Or drunk Florida man. That's a nice modifier because it's usually just implied drunk Florida man attempts to ride bike through Taco bell drive through Comma, fights with police, and his mug shot he's just making a big old frowny face and has like a bruise in the middle of his forehead and kind of like Joker asked green hair. He's wearing the orange jumpsuit. And just to reiterate, no Florida bashing here. This is a trope that is worth exploring, and we we have to give these examples too. Yeah, Florida man launches chair at mailman because he had no mail for him. It was a tense day. Uh, And you can read more and more of these examples. Spoiler alert will probably have some more to pop up. But this is the kind of news that people in other states see when they hear a story of the media about Florida. And since so many people living in other states here about these stories on a semi frequent basis, it's understandable and completely not commendable that many people would form this prejudiced opinion of the Sunshine State. And that brings us to today's question, Is there really more strange crime in Florida? How does it stack up to other states? What exactly gave this state such a weird reputation? Is there something going on in Florida that they don't want us to know? Uh? Yet? Oddly enough, it's it's complicated. We get to a question at the end there, But I guess we should start with the facts. Where did Florida come from? So? Homo sapiens have been occupying the land mass what is Florida for at least twelve thousand years, and written records of this area started as far back as fifteen thirteen, when the Spanish explore Juan Ponce de lay On namesake. We know very well here in Atlanta. It's actually the street that we're on. Um arrived and when he arrived, there were no other humans living there. That's not true. That's just when the like we said, that's when records begin. Ye, well, did pons to lay On consider the inhabitants of Florida to be human? I mean, he is a Spanish explorer at that time, he was a conquistador, right, it's correct. Uh. Fast forward to eighteen forty five, nice day, March three, Florida becomes the US state and during the Civil War, unlike a lot of states in the South, it didn't suffer this massive amount of catastrophic destruction. You know, it didn't burn the way Atlanta burned. There weren't a lot of huge pivotal battles, although there are some, of course they're historically significant, it's not They didn't have a Gettysburg moment. You know. The Union controlled coastal towns of forts. The interior was controlled by Confederates. Somehow, they all, you know, managed to avoid the complete devastation that happened in other states. So let's get into the geography of good old Florida. It's mostly known for its Peninsulava thing that juts out down there heading towards the Caribbean, but the state actually contains several different distinct ecosystems and also cultures. There was all there was a whole article that was put out about the different the five what is it five to ten states that exist within Florida, which is not real, but it's kind of just groupings of people who have moved to the state. But the land is divided into four main regions. You've got the Gulf Coast, that's where the Atlantic Ocean kind of goes up in there into the into the peninsula. You've got the coastal plains, the upland that's the hilly area towards the north and northwest, getting up towards our own Georgia. And then you've got the swampy Everglades that's in the far south and in the Florida Keys. That's where it's very difficult to get buildings to stay into work right and not flood and it's a popular destination for hiding bodies and gators love it. In terms of human population density, at least Florida has a surface area of about one hundred seventy thousand li all over square kilometers almost sixty six thousand square miles. Based on the estimates, that works out to about three hundred and fifty three point four people per square mile or one thirty six point four per square kilometer, and this makes Florida the most densely populated state in the Union. It's also surprisingly this surprised me. It's also the third most populous state. The only bigger ones are California in Texas. That is very surprising in my opinion, especially because of all of that land that's out there, especially in the Everglades and some of those areas where you just look out if you're driving on I think it is you just see nothing for miles and miles and miles, and it gets to be fair, we would have to point out that that average could be misleading because a ton of people will live in the urban areas in the Miami Dade metropolis or in Orlando, you know. So our current estimate for the population in is twenty one point three one million people, and that is based off an estimate carried out in twenty fifteen by the Census Bureau, and the growth rate was one of the fastest in the country. It was number four out of all the other states. So if we think about this, that means most people outside of the American South picture Florida to be way less crowded than it is, and the opposite is the case. It is incredibly crowded, incredibly dense, and most importantly, incredibly diverse. That's right. Florida is a is a pretty unusual mix of cultures, of transplants, like we're talking about the top of the show from other states and other countries. So it's pretty hard to find a central, defining characteristic of the state's culture like as a whole. But that's kind of what makes it interesting too. I mean there's like, you know, there's an incredible art scene, like in Miami, for example, with like I think it's called art Basil. Does that you pronounced it or basal. That's what's going on right now. It's a big art conference where artists from all over the world convene in Miami, and there's that aspect of it. There's an incredible you know, Latin American population in Cuban population and different kinds of food and music and just about you know, anything you can imagine it's very, very, very diverse. Miami an entire metropolis built on cocaine. I read some uh, I read some really strange thing about Miami. When researching this, someone said the this neatest thing about Miami was how close it is to America. It took me a second. I couldn't figure out where they were going because I'm not myself too familiar with Miami. I haven't been there since I was a child. I would imagine you guys are more familiar with it. Yeah, I've been there numerous times with my in laws. They love it. I love it. I love hanging out there with them. And again, the food and the culture are definitely one of the biggest drawing points I think to that city. For some reason, when I was a child a long long time ago, I thought everybody in Miami was tall. And I think it's just because when I went there, I was, you know, maybe two and a half to three ft high, So I just thought it was a land of giants. I have no is that true or people taller in Miami? They are. Yeah, it's rough. It's anywhere between three to seven inches. You're gonna get as soon as you arrive to Miami um and that increases over time, like whether or not you actually are living in like certain counties within the city. That makes sense. It's like I always thought. I always thought when people say they're big in Japan, I thought it was some sort of like metaphor comparison. But you know, I uh, from what I hear, when you go, you do turn into a giant. It does. Okay, that's obviously completely false the thing we're joking about. But I do wonder if there's something to driving through that flat land that is Florida for so long then you finally arrive at this huge city that has giant, towering buildings. I wonder if there's some kind of perception thing that can occur there where things feel bigger. The Florida effect. Yeah, oh yeah, yeah, that's a thing I just made up. I think the Florida effect is an excellent name. What what do you think it describes? Well? Is it what Matt articulated? It could be part of it. It could be this whole ball of Florida wax that we're talking about today, and included in that ball of Florida wax is the kind of the elephant in the room or the mouse in the tower. Right, How does Florida's stack up when it comes to crime, especially since we read so much about crime in these news stories they constantly come out. We'll tell you after a word from our sponsor. Well, no matter what you've heard, this is important. Despite all those crazy news stories you heard, and even the one that you didn't hear me say about the guy who buried a dude in concrete to steal his magic the gathering collection, which was valued at over a hundred thousand dollars. By the way, Florida is by no means the most violent state within our great Union. Well, the beauty two of these stories, they're not violent. They're always kind of crazy. Yeah, yeah, yeah. The car thief, for instance, who stole a vehicle, saw there was a baby in it and then like turned around to safely drop the baby off with someone, and then stole the car. I feel like that's oddly and deary. Yeah, agreed. Or even the guy who was at McDonald's who was masturbating in the parking lot and he claimed that his privacy, his privacy was being invaded. Yeah, he also said he lived in his car. I believe despite all these stories here, Florida is, as you said, Matt, not the most violent state. Depending on the study read the most violent state will um often be cited as Louisiana, with Vermont being side as one of the safest. But there's still crime in Florida. Florida is usually depending on how it's measured, it usually ranks fifth in terms of crime, five forty one violent crimes reported per one hundred thousand people. That's a lot, right, And also it ranks number five in terms of robbery, aggravated assault, and property crime. But while it may not have the most crime out of any state, it genuinely does seem to have some of the weirdest crime. You know what, can we just stop and do some more examples? He's pretty yeah, all right, what do we got? I have a good one. Let's see. Florida man caught with stolen power polls strapped suv in wake of Hurricane Irma. That's weird, I don't understand. Florida man disguises himself in bull costume as he tries to burn down former lover's house with pasta sauce. Florida man attempts to smoke crack in an icy u almost burns down hospital. Florida man high on math climbs onto stranger's roof to howl. Florida man arrested in local park for practicing karate on swans. Florida man sets apartment complex on fire after manager told him to stop masturbating in front of windows. You are yours are very mass Yeah, I feel like I feel like you found a theme. Florida man rex liquor shop blames caterpillar from Alice in Wonderland. He said that a hookah smoking caterpillar told him to do it, So it's really more referencing movie the song White Rabbit by Jefferson Airplane. There, that's a good point he needed to work on. It was probably on acid, he might have been. There's one. There's one I found that I can't remember the circumstances behind, but we can just describe it in the headline. There was a guy who was found on the roof of some store and he was covered with tar, and people asked him what he was doing up there, and originally he said that he was lost and from out of town, and then he said he was an A C technician, and he noticed the A C was malfunctioning, so he decided to do the neighborly thing and fix it. I think he just did drugs and ended up on the roof of a building and got covered in tar somehow, and I hope he's okay. So these headlines are like solid gold. If you have a slow newsday, right, these will get your clicks for sure. So what gives you know? Is this unfair stereotype? Is there something in the water? Why do people seem to participate in so many crazy shenanigans in America's most infamous peninsula. It turns out we have an answer. Here's where it gets crazy. Yeah. So it turns out that this law really is somewhat to blame for this phenomenon. Every American state has some kind of sunshine law, and that's a term for legislation regulations or constitutional amendments that guarantee public access to government affairs, like sort of an open book policy, right, um? Or how open is your book? Exactly? How open is your book? Is it a reading rainbow or is it more of a I don't know, Ben, You're better at this than me. Ma. There you go, nice, very very well done, mat Um. Yeah. So, but while these laws require most government meetings to be open door and most documents to be open book, um allowing public scrutiny. Many of them are a little bit limited, right or redacted or have some kind of conditions on them to where not every single one is going to be fully available in all of its form. Yeah, So theoretically, in a given state you have you might have something similar to this Transparency Act or Freedom of Information Act kind of thing, so you can technically get access to police records, but actually getting them in practice can take a long time, or you can get shut down by red tape. But in Florida, on the other hand, there is a deep, deep, deep, centuries long dedication to hardcore transparency norms. It starts way back in nineteen o nine chapter of the Florida Statutes, the Public Records Law, and it kept being strengthened in following years. In nineteen sixty seven they passed the government in the Sunshine Law popularly known as as the Sunshine Law now, and then they continued to strengthen it after that. So this law has been kind of untouchable regardless of who is in office, and it's pretty extreme if you are a public official. Every meeting aside from a few exemptions, has to be an open meeting, which is why, like politicians will get married and they'll have to have a journalist at their wedding. That happened at least once and today. The Sunshine law regarding open government can be found in Chapter two eighty six of the Florida Statutes. If you're looking for some really juicy reading. Uh, they established this basic right of access to most meetings of boards, commissions, other governing bodies of state and local government agencies or authorities. And this means that it is incredibly easy to learn about the inner workings of this state's government, especially arrest records. Yeah, and that's a big deal because if you're a journalist and you're looking for a story just to include or to you know, have as a part of your paper or your podcast or whatever, having access or at least easier access to some of these arrest records and stories going through the courts or whoever is being charged with what right now actively that gives you this huge wealth of just stuff to write about. I mean, that's a big that's a big deal to me, at least like the Blotterer stories, you know. Yeah, no, it's true. And at the same time, like I've been to Florida, I've hung out in Florida, and Florida has a really interesting dichotomy where like we're talking about that diversity that it has that extends to like, you know, how there's certain parts of Georgia that kind of have reputation for like a certain type of individual that might be a little more prone to drunken behavior or unhinged things, you know, or myth or meth there you go, or you know, just too much drinking too. You know that Florida has that too, and it so has the big cities it has. It's very diverse in that way. Um, And I think that and the fact that you've got these open book policies where they have better access to it. It doesn't necessarily mean there are more crimes that are nuts, but it certainly has no shortage of bonkers crimes. But you know what, neither is Georgia. We just don't get access to the information as readily as they do in Florida, apparently, right. Yeah, and there's one of the dead giveaways you'll notice. So the same well intentioned laws that passed are the same reason that a Florida residents mug shot might appear online merely days after those arrests. Make it incredibly easy to write about these stories. And here's the red flag you'll see if you're reading a weird Florida or Florida man's story, it will almost always include the phrase according to the arrest report or something like that. And there's a journalist named Kyle Munsen reader who wrote a great look at this for the Miami Herald. He put it this way. As journalist, he said, all we have to do in most cases is called the police department and asked for the arrest report, and the cops are required to give it to us. Nowadays, a lot of cops just email the reports and some of them will post arrest records online of their own volition. Uh, some of the more dedicated Florida news reporters go through batches and batches of these reports at a time. And he said, you know, you, once you have the report, you pretty much have everything you need to write a story. You just have to be mindful that it's the police officers version of events. And Kyle had a good example about this, which I thought was hilarious. He says, say a journalist somewhere gets a tip that a man in a dog costume was caught making love to a Hello Kitty doll in a mall bathroom here in Florida. We would just call the police and say something like heard there was an arrest at the mall yesterday, Can we get the report? And I would put I would add a little wink wink in there right for journalists and a lot of their states, Again, it's not that easy. They might not be able to get the report at all, or they might have to wait for a certain amount of time before police release it. Georgia does have a thing called the jail report that you can get like a gas stations, and they're very, very picky. You're not allowed to pick them up or read them unless you buy them, because otherwise, you know, what's the point. So yeah, they typically only they'll have mug shots and um, the actual thing the person was arrested for, but not usually the juicy details like what would be in the arrest report. So that must be directly because of the differences in the sunshine laws. I think that's a good point, and there's there's something else here about the sunshine law that's pretty interesting. Florida, like some other unnamed U. S States, is home to a lot of corruption. And just have to look back at our earlier episode on the uh founding of Disney World to see the way that Disney essentially became its own local government. Right. Scientology famous for having its fingers in a lot of political pies. So maybe this open governance law is so extreme because they want to have some sort of oversight on those strange, murky connections between so called private entities and then governments that have been infiltrated or compromised, which I know sounds so very cold war, but again, just listen to the Disney episode because that's what happened. Yeah. Absolutely, I have to say it was weird going to Disney after doing that episode. Oh yeah, all I was thinking about how this land was acquired, what the town was actually like, where I truly was rather than just being near Kissing Me or something, the Ready Creek Improvement District. Yeah, but still Disney World's great man. I have fun memories of it, the whole thing. So, as you said earlier, Nold, a lot of states have something like this law, but most are nowhere near on the level of Florida's so be very careful. Now that we've walked through that, we can address this question. Is Florida any worse than other states? Or is it just easier for the public to know about crimes and bizarre events? Will answer that after a word from our sponsor, we're back. Well, I think we're gonna have to give this one the old patented partially true. Can we get a sound effect? Who patent did that? It's somewhat yes, snos. I think it was probably snokes. Yeah, they can't own the phrase partially true? Who knows partially on it? Perhaps what we have to go with something way less, way less sexy, like somewhat accurate. There you go, that's a glass half full situation. Oh yeah, it's true. Looks like we're gonna go with our patented somewhat accurate and one gun shot Yeah, like a like a racing start pistol. Yeah, that's good. That's not scary guns. That's a compromise. Yeah. Of Florida's open governance laws do make it very very easy to report the weirdest to rest on record. Uh. And the fact remains that there is a higher than average crime rate in Florida. It's a combination of wildly different cultures, so stranger things are bound to occur, things that might not occur in a place that is less crowded or has different reporting rules. It feels like there is a little bit more of possibly a free spirit and like kind of a stick it to the man kind of attitude, possibly when people live by the water. Uh and and they're not absurdly bougie rich people. I see what you're saying. Yeah, more self reliance, self reliant, the kind of beach bum life's for me kind of attitude, you know, and then maybe that applies inland with sort of a country can survive vibe. All so true. Again, I think it all goes back to the diversity we're talking about, and that is a diversity of culture and of socio economic stratum. Yeah. Yeah, there's a lot of inequality in the state as well. And this situation, all these factors combined to create a feedback loop because once journalists from around the country learned how easy it was to fill a void in the news cycle with a charming, hilarious, often schadenfreud rife anecdote about Florida, it became an easy go to move. That doesn't mean that insane things don't happen in Idaho. That doesn't mean that parts of Atlanta are entirely bonkers and and you know, weakly weekly escapades of pandemonium don't occur. It just means that it's way easier to tell the Florida versions of those stories. What do you call that, like an echo chamber situation? Right? Yeah, here's a question, then, Ben, what does it take in a state with tighter sunshine laws to nerate a headline like that, Like it has to be just like out in the public eye where it's witnessed by a lot of people, and then you know, it's not exclusively reported on based on arrest reports. It was such a giant debacle that people saw it and journalists actually have to interview people at the scene. Yeah, I was gonna say, as you as you find more details with any of these that we late that we ran off earlier, there's probably even more context to a lot of this, and it might even make a little more sense than it seems just with the headline and with the basic description. After more, you know, a better picture of it emerges. Yeah, and these people haven't had their day in court. Yet either when a lot of stuff is reported, it's just the arrest, Like as reported by a local news station, a Florida man was rescued from a vending machine. Authorities would not comment on the circumstances of how the man became stuck in the vending machine or how they rescued him. There was no word on the extent of his injuries. Action News called the business where the incident happened. A person Alpha Packaging, picked up the phone and hung up without providing additional information. So there's a lot of context missing, and that one, you know, And that's that's a really good point you make, Matt. There's a wealth of very important context which usually cut out because we just want to read these i'll say, amazing headlines. I was about to say, before you accuse us of only doing this episode because we wanted to rattle off some of these headlines, I'm here to tell you that's probably exactly why we did it. I I love it. Yeah, I went in this hoping for headlines, and we want to hear some of your favorite Florida headlines. Also, if you were from Florida, we want to hear your opinion on the sunshine law. Is it overall a good thing? With this one unintended consequence? You know, we have solved the mystery. Florida does get an unfair wrap, and it gets it largely due to this legislation. What about people who don't live in Florida? Do you want your state, local community, or your country to enact a similar law? Why? Or why not? I mean a lot of a lot of countries have the draconian opposite of this, like in Belarus and a lot of Eurasian countries. You're not really allowed to even talk about the government. M I don't want that. So is there a Goldilocks zone? Is this too far? There must be I don't know. I kind of like this full transparency thing. I mean, how honestly, if we didn't have it, how what I ever learned about the Florida man that stole thirty six thousand pounds of Crisco? And what's he gonna do with all that Crisco? I think I know that sex stuff. You're not connected to the Crisco underground anymore. I thought it was a food product, like you cook with it. Well, yeah, but I mean it's also you know, pure Greece maybe though I know no, no alligator wrestling. Ah yeah, I don't know. I love those sorts of heist because remember that story in Canada about the huge maple syrup heist that happened a while. I still wonder, how do you fence that who has a Crisco guy who only moves weight, who has a maple syrup connection, who doesn't mess with anything under a hundred gallons of syrup? You know what I'm saying. You you fence it directly to the underground alligator wrestling community and they then no one else ever sees it. Doesn't have to enter into circulation. They just keep it and they use it until they run out. So this guy is like the Kaiser associate of Crisco. I am officially I am officially banning myself from comparing people to Kaiser. So say, I've been doing it for the past several episodes because like that, they're gone. Yes exactly, it's a great comparison to anyone. Uh well, I figured it out, guys. He was taking the Crisco. He was gonna go fence it at his buddy. He was his buddy. Unfortunately, though, was caught with a meth and active meth lab in his pants. The guy the and they called it a one pot meth lab. That's true, that's true. Yes, like you can cook yourself one rock of meth. I don't know the I don't know the output of Chris Guild, but they have. Yeah, this guy had apparently some baggy pants and a mcgever like traveling meth lab from Springs. And this, I mean, we can laugh at this. We're not making fun of these people's lives. We are trying to point out the important, uh and little known mechanism that's responsible for this uh frankly unfair stereotype. We also, you know, as we said at the top, after our last few episodes, we wanted to do something a little more lighthearted. But there is one last crucial note we have to make here as we record this, some parts of Florida are still devastated by Hurricane Michael. And you might not hear about this, uh in between all this the funny stories of someone you know dressing up in a weird costume or someone getting stuck in a vending machine. But there are still tensities in areas of Florida where hundreds of people are currently living and they are. Many of them are due to be disbanded, leaving the hurricane survivors with nowhere to go. So if you would like to donate to help Florida rebuild, or for that matter, help any number of communities that have been suffering from the short and long term effects of these kinds of natural disasters, such as California with the fires, Puerto Rico. UM, you can visit charity navigator dot org and search for your cause of choice. Yeah, it's pretty neat. You'll see the various charities and nonprofit organizations divided up by their areas of expertise, along with more information about each one, so check it out. As we may have said on the show before, it's always important to remember that these sorts of stories don't stop just because the reporters stop report doing it. They continue on. I couldn't agree more guys, all right, So if you want to write to us with anything crazy floor of stories, we'll read them. We've been, you know, as tragic as the things are that we just discussed, we've been cracking up this whole episode just reading the headlines and exploring the strangeness that humanity has to offer. And if you have any strangeness of humanity or otherwise send it our way. You can find us on Twitter or Facebook where where we're Conspiracy Stuff. Instagram we are Conspiracy Stuff Show. If you don't want to do any of that stuff, check out our Facebook group which is Here's where it gets crazy. You can get on there and discuss all of these things and all the other topics that we've ever covered and things we haven't covered, with all of our fellow conspiracy realists over there, wonderful human beings. And if you don't want to do any of that, you can call us. We are one eight three three st d w y t K. Leave a message you might get on the air. 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